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▶ 0:04:59good after afternoon the committee will come to order without objection the chair is authorized to declare recess at any time today the rules committee is convening to consider three separate measures HJ res 42 HJ res 61 s SJ res 11 before I discuss these three measures let me make one thing abundantly Clear G A gone are the days of the government knows best mentality that Americans suffered
▶ 0:05:29under of the Biden Administration for four straight years the Biden Administration worked hard to deny freedom of consumer choice in all aspects of our lives like the American people the private sector also found itself under the thumb of an Administration held B on mandating subservience and control companies found themselves Twisted in regulatory knots because the Biden Administration issued misguided Mand
▶ 0:05:59mate after misguided mandate the onslaught was never ending but it's a new day we have a republican control Congress and President Trump is back at the White House we're determined to give American Consumer Choice again and allow the business Community to flourish and create unbridled value without the threat of government encroachment now on to our first measure HJ res 42 I congrat
▶ 0:06:29review act resolution that would nullify a department of energy rule that pushes arbitrary product mandates that drive up cost for consumers and hamstrings consumer choice I said this during our last meeting and I'll say it again consumer choice is not something to be trifled with this rule is devoid of any reasonable solution to increase the efficiency of consumer products ordinary consumers standing gain
▶ 0:07:00absolutely nothing from it our next measure is hjr 61 a congressional review act resolution that will nullify a midnight rule issued by the Environmental Protection Agency that slaps dubious emission standards on the manufacturing of rubber tires what's particularly risible about the epa's rule is that the agency's own risk review found found
▶ 0:07:30that the rule was not necessary to protect public health and in fact may even increase carbon emissions that same risk review could not quantify any public health benefits from the rule the sheer level of incompetence that went into formulating this rule in the first place is mindboggling our last measure is SJ resz 11 a congressional review act resolution that would nullify
▶ 0:08:00another midnight rule issued by the Bureau of ocean Energy Management that specifically targets American Energy producers with a barrage of unnecessary regulations the justification for the Bureau of ocean energy Management's rule is to quote better protect shipwrecks and other cultural resources on the seabed from potential harm due to offshore oil and gas activities end
▶ 0:08:30quote the Mandate is completely misguided and it will force American Energy producers to spend Untold resources on scouring ocean sea floors for potential sea shipwrecks without having a single indication of whether they exist in the area we're returning to American Energy dominance again in our country and this rule acts as another regulatory Cog that will do more harm than good it's time that we
▶ 0:09:00put these three Biden Administration rules through the shredder and move forward Common Sense has returned with that I look forward to today's discussion and I now yield to the ranking member Mr McGovern for any comments he wishes to make well thank you madam chair and and before I begin I I want to I want to take a moment uh to acknowledge the passing of our former uh of former Congressman Lincoln Diaz Bart um Lincoln served on the rules committee
▶ 0:09:31and uh while we didn't always agree uh I respected him because he believed in the power of good governance and fair debate uh he understood that our role as lawmakers is about working for the American people uh and it was an honor uh to serve with with him and my prayers go out to his family at this uh at this difficult time thank you Mr maving I appreciate you doing that and now on to the business of the day um Madam chair last week Republicans passed a budget resolution
▶ 0:10:01that paves the way for their betrayal of the middle class stealing from hardworking people so they can give tax breaks to billionaires this week they're doubling down dismantling protections that keep people healthy and safe even worse while Republicans complain about home appliances and car tires issues that don't even crack the top 100 concerns that I hear from my constituents the GOP is quietly pushing Trump's broader aend agenda of Destruction now just
▶ 0:10:32look at what is happening Doge sacked hundreds of workers who keep our nuclear weapon safe then scrambled to rehire those workers when they realized they screwed up they fired critical staff from VA hospitals including disabled veterans they decimated the NIH office responsible for groundbreaking research on Alzheimer and and dementia they dismantled Ebola prevention teams along with other critical disease surveillance programs despite there being
▶ 0:11:02a nationwide measles outbreak for the first time in decades they cut experts working on the bird flu response you know the the thing that is making eggs so expensive and causing shortages and now uh they are working to try to hire them back I mean talk about efficiency we have wildfires raging in South Carolina as Elon guts FEMA Trump golfs in Florida and JD Vance hits the slopes in Vermont can you imagine if Joe Biden went golfing
▶ 0:11:32during the California fires you guys would have a meltdown but when it's the dear leader Donald Trump Suddenly It's all fine and I'd be remiss if I didn't mention the disgraceful spectacle in the overall office last week you know I I I just got home from meeting with my constituents in a town hall and I I call coffee with your Congressman in lemonster Massachusetts it isn't exactly a democratic stronghold normally I I get about 30 or 40 people show up this week we had well over 300
▶ 0:12:02people show up and the people who showed up were overwhelmingly disgusted embarrassed and angry over what transpired at the White House on Friday between President Trump and president zalinski I watched the entire video not once did Trump or JD van say a single negative thing about Vladimir Putin not a single bad word for the bloodthirsty dictator who invaded Ukraine not a single word of support for our allies in Ukraine were Ukraine who are just fighting against Russian
▶ 0:12:33aggression and it seems like people need a little bit of a history lesson you know when the Soviet Union fell in the in the late 90s Ukraine was left with the world's third largest stockpile of nuclear weapons on the planet in turn they signed an agreement with us the United Kingdom and Russia in which they agreed to give up all those weapons if we the other three signers agreed to uphold Ukraine's sovereignty and Independence so Ukraine and Russia already had a peace agreement
▶ 0:13:03Russia violated it Russia invaded Ukraine and the fastest way for this war to end is for Russia to stop The Invasion we the United States we also signed that agreement we promis to help protect Ukraine's Freedom um and Trump is not living up to that agreement so long so long as Trump backtracks no one is going to trust our word and that's exactly what Russia wants just after meeting um just after the meeting the Kremlin spokesman said and I quote
▶ 0:13:34the new US Administration is rapidly changing all foreign policy configurations this largely coincides with our vision end quote do you do you know what that sounds like it sounds like our national leaders are in the pockets of the Russian government it sounds like Trump and Vance are playing right into Putin's hands undermining our allies and aligning with our adversaries in fact just for the sake of arguing let's say we had a president who was doing Putin's bidding who was secretly
▶ 0:14:04trying to undermine the United States and that President wanted to destroy us from within you know what they would probably do well they would dismantle our professional Civil Service they would withdraw from the world um and threaten to leave NATO uh they would shut down foreign aid uh they would turn their backs on our allies and embrace our ad adversaries and oh they they might uh they might uh weaken our ability to fight off Russian cyber operations
▶ 0:14:35against us critical infrastructure do those things sound familiar because I think they do and let's be clear everything I have mentioned dismantling regulations destroying institutions abandoning our Global commitments makes Americans less safe not more and let me make one more thing clear Republicans own this you control the house you control the the Senate and you control the White House we do not live in a dictatorship you could stand up to this stuff but you don't
▶ 0:15:06you could provide oversight on the very real very massive scandals happening right now but you won't you could pass real policies to bring down the cost of food stop the egg shortage help middle class families and protect this country but you're not instead you're stealing from the middle class to enrich billionaires trying to overturn Biden era rules no one has ever even even heard of and offering the Western World on a platter to dictators so well we're not going to stand by
▶ 0:15:36while extremist dismantle our government and hurt everyday Americans the Republican agenda comes at the expense of the people we were all elected to serve enough is enough and I yield back my time thank you Mr McGovern with that objection any prepared statements that our Witnesses have will be included in the record I welcome our first panel chairman Guthrie and ranking member palone from the house committee on Energy and Commerce I
▶ 0:16:07remind our witnesses that your full statement may be submitted for the record and we ask that you summarize your statement in five minutes chairman Guth I welcome your testimony thank you chairwoman fox and thank you ranking member McGovern and members of The Rules Committee for the opportunity to testify before you today I'm pleased to speak in support of two resolutions of disapproval introduced under the Congressional review act to repeal some of President Biden's overreaching regulations hjr
▶ 0:16:3742 introduced by Congressman Andrew Clyde seeks to repeal another biteen erit rule that increases red tape and cost for manufacturers and ultimately American consumers this final rule amended or created new certification labeling and enforcement Provisions for 20 different products including dishwasher central air conditioning heat pumps Clos water users and many other appliances that American families and businesses rely upon several appliances subject to these new requirements are products with Energy Efficiency
▶ 0:17:08standards recently amended by the Biden doe in an unworkable manner over the last four years nearly 30 Energy Efficiency regulations have been issued toing over 60 billion in costs the Biden administration's doe proposed and finalized new standards to regulate virtually every Appliance American consumers rely on in their homes forcing families to spend more for Less reliable options implementing these layers of requirements will F further further
▶ 0:17:38solidify the disaster standard prated under the last Administration today homeowners spend about 34% more in appliances than they did 15 years ago from 1995 to 2005 the average homeowner replace their appliances every 12 to 13 years now that timeline has shrunk to every 8 to n unreasonable certification labeling and Reporting in requirements will further increase costs and slow the development of reliable products in fact doe itself estimates these requirements will increase
▶ 0:18:08annual costs by 213,000 for manufacturers and result in nearly 3,000 hours of additional paperwork for companies to compete complete and while my colleagues on the other side of the aisle will argue this rule will not impact consumer choice these additional costs placed on manufacturers will be passed down to American families household businesses while some wealthy homeowners may be able to afford the increased burden millions of hardworking Americans can't last November Americans clearly demanded a return to Common
▶ 0:18:38Sense policies where homeowners homeowners Drive decisions not Washington bureaucrats pushing an agenda and unfortunately the ultimate harm falls on the American Consumer we need to end this failed approach I'm also here to speak on HJ RZ 61 led by my good friend environmental subcommittee chairman Mr Griffith member of this committee madam chairwoman there is a misconception coming from our friends on the other side of the aisle that we heard several times last week here in this committee and on the house floor
▶ 0:19:08that Republicans do not care about the environment and do not want to reduce emissions and those statements are simply not true we do not support policies that unnecessary put unnecessarily burdens on businesses and an attempt to appease the climate Lobby and this is why EPA room must be repealed Tire manufacturing companies already comply with existing EPA standards to reduce emissions or hazardous air pollutants from rubber mixers this Biden rule put forth in the waning days of his administration will add
▶ 0:19:38emissions limits for total hydrocarbons to the existing national standards for hazarded air pollutants or nup standards Madame chairwoman there is not a correlation between these two pollutants and yet EPA wants to impose serious Financial burdens that would drive facilities out of business and Destroy domestic Manufacturing this rule by the Biden EPA amounts our arbitrary virtue signaling by the last Administration ultimately fails even to identify how implementation of the will reduce
▶ 0:20:09hap emissions to meet these limits facilities will need to install regenerative thermal oxidizers or RTO which require significant amounts of natural gas to combust pollutants in 2020 the EPA even released a risk assessment that stated that the tire manufacturing industry's haps we're under an acceptable threshold as such this rule must be repealed urge my colleagues to join me in supporting these important resolutions and I Y
▶ 0:20:40back thank you very much ranking member palone thank you chairwoman I um and thank you ranking member mgov and the other members of the rules committee I'm here to testify on HR hjr 61 and hjr 42 I strongly oppose both of these resolutions now Mr McGovern talked about town meetings in his opening and chairwoman fox talked about the business Community but I will say that when I um go back home uh including
▶ 0:21:10this weekend um I don't hear about any of this stuff that we're dealing with today I mean what I hear because you said what do you hear I hear uh that people are very concerned about the economy right in other words you know I hear you know with all the federal workers being laid off with all the uh freezes on money particularly for infrastructure uh in New Jersey and um with the tariffs that the President says he's going to imposed tomorrow in Canada and Mexico people are really worried about the economy they
▶ 0:21:40think that these policies are leading to a recession and that's what the business Community is concerned about and the public so um you know the president made a lot of promises to the American people promised to lower costs promise to make America healthy again promise to put America first but I don't see any of those things happening uh anything being done really to promote the well-being of Americans and and I also worry that Elon Musk is you know trying to gut our federal government to the harm of the American
▶ 0:22:11people so I don't think the resolutions before us today do absolutely nothing to help the American people Mr McGovern in answer to your sort of question and then the case of HJ res61 the first one with regard to rubber it would act actively harm Americans health so hjr 61 would hamstrung epa's ability to protect the public from the most harmful air pollutants literally cancer causing air toxics at a time when Republicans are also on the cusp of taking away
▶ 0:22:41health care because of the potential Cuts in Medicaid it's not going to do anything to uh to repeal this rule um I mean because the rule is essentially Common Sense cost effective uh way to ensure that rubber tire manufacturer stay competitive and the rule promotes Innovation by recognizing top performers in the industry and promotes current technologies that reduce emissions and make these facilities better and safer what I see today with both of these rules and what I saw
▶ 0:23:12uh last week when we were dealing with the efficiency standards and other things is that these standards um actually protect the good actors the good manufacturers the one that want to do the right thing right and it's the Bad actors the foreign manufacturers want to sell cheap stuff that's not safe or not healthy uh they're the ones that benefit right so nobody benefits here America's not put first America's put last in my opinion um and if Republicans want to make America healthy
▶ 0:23:42again then they should start by insisting on clean air and not free passes for corporate polluters and epa's Rule doesn't apply to the entire Rubber and Manufacturing industry just a handful of facilities that process Rubber and they have years to comply um but I also want to say because we have the chairman of the committee here today you know it's not even clear what these resolutions are doing we've had no regular order in our committee in energy commerce you know you have a hearing in the subcommittee
▶ 0:24:12you have a markup in the subcommittee you have a markup in the full committee and that's an opportunity to actually see what is going on here and particularly with the second one which I'm going to get get to now um I I mean I I have abs abolutely no idea what you're trying to accomplish I you know this is the one with doesn't even apply to the Appliance efficiency it targets how manufacturers certify that they are compliant with the efficiency standards and I have a uh document
▶ 0:24:42here I can submit it for the record Madam chair if that's right uh without objection from the uh American Appliance uh Business Association and it I'm not going to read the whole thing but there's one paragraph because it talks about these the certifications because again we're not talking about the standards but the uh compliance with the standards and the certification of those compliance it says that in comments on September 2023 proposed rule for certification
▶ 0:25:13requirements the association of Home Appliance manufacturers said and I quote that consistent clear transparent certification criteria are a critical part of the program and that we appreciate Doe's proposals that are aimed at ensuring consistency between test testing to support certification and testing do doe does to support its enforcement efforts I think that's what you're talking about here um and they have no problem with it uh I I don't know if the manufacturers have no problem with it I don't understand why we're even
▶ 0:25:43doing doing this because I said the resolution doesn't Target efficiency standards like last week with the water heaters but instead targets how manufacturers certify that they are compliant with the standards so what does that mean in my opinion it means you have nothing El to do here I mean did you just like open the Federal Register and search for what fell under the Congressional review act window and then find some you know non-controversial rule that's supported by the manufacturers I I have no idea who gains from the passage
▶ 0:26:13of this resolution the as I said the answer is very similar to last week's resolution attacking water heers water heaters only foreign manufacturers you create regulatory uncertainty Bill creates an opportunity for cheap Foreign imports to flood the market and misle American consumers because the American manufacturers don't support the resolution uh it doesn't help American consumers it doesn't help lower cost it doesn't help American manufacturers I don't even think it helps Republicans polluter friends to be honest I don't even I don't know
▶ 0:26:43who it helps I just think that um you know you guys are out of touch frankly the government funding runs out and list in two weeks and rather than uh talking about what needs to be done there you're talking about certifying the standards um and again uh this is not what the American people are interested in it's certainly not what you talked about and we really need to go back to the committee Mr chairman and have a hearing on these things before they come before rules
▶ 0:27:13uh but with that Madame chair I'll yield back thank you and I will pass and I will yield to Mr Griffith thank you very much Madam chair I appreciate it um thank you uh chairman Guthrie for being here I really appreciate you here to talk about my bill you know it's interesting heard my good friend saying Mr bone saying that this isn't what people are talking about back home I can assure you that's what they'll be talking about in my hometown of Salem Virginia and in Rono
▶ 0:27:43County when Mohawk excuse me formerly Mohawk now Yokohama tire has been that way for about 20 years who makes tires in my hometown and employs a lot of people in the Ninth District starts having to uh maybe lay off people because many of our to plants in the United States won't be able to meet these standards and some of them will cut back production or go out of business so yeah you're right they may not be talking about it today they may not have talked about it on Saturday but when
▶ 0:28:13the layoff notices go out they're going to be talking about it and that's why we're doing this is we're trying to prevent those layoff notices from going out in in my home region I'm proud to use those tires on a regular basis because I know that when I buy those tires one they're good quality tires they're going to last a long time and I'm providing even if it's a small measure my little four tires on my vehicle aren't going to keep the plant open or keep it from having uh layoffs but it goes a little bit of the way of helping there and unfortunately I'm afraid what the
▶ 0:28:44EPA has done for many years many years Madam chair is it has not looked at the job consequences in the community has not looked at what the economic impacts are it's okay if we send these plans to other parts of the world where they will outrageously instead of doing it here more reasonably now Mr chairman is that kind of your understanding of why I put this bill in absolutely I don't think I can approve on what you just said I agree and
▶ 0:29:14and I would ask you was the EPA able to quantify whether their hazardous air pollutants would be reduced by this rule they were not they weren't even a they they didn't even try this was just something they thought oh it looks it looks like we ought to be doing something so we're going to do something without making a a detailed quantification on whether the Hazardous air pollutants that they're trying to control would even be reduced by this rule that's that's what makes this so hard you know my folks could be negatively impacted
▶ 0:29:44but the EPA didn't take the time to make sure of what they were doing now if we repeal this rule would would uh other EPA neshaps apply to rubber tire plants that's other other uh regulations that they have yes they would and would the repeal of this rule prevent the EPA from issuing a modified uh rules or modified rules for rubber Tower plants not exactly like this one but on other categories of air pollution my understanding it wouldn't yeah it's my
▶ 0:30:14understanding too um you know this is the problem with the EPA that come out with these rules and it won't be the first time that my District's lost jobs uh towns I mean had a town that that basically gave up its Charter this year why because a number of years ago EPA came out with rules the the local industry shut down because of those rules a week excuse me
▶ 0:30:44a month after they shut down might have been three and a half weeks but roughly a month after they shut down the rule of the EPA was strick stricken by the Supreme Court they hadn't done it right and they took took it down but the plant didn't reopen and the jobs were lost and local businesses closed and as a result this year the town turned in its Charter and is just a one of those census areas now as opposed to be a town that's kind of bad stuff that happens when we don't go in
▶ 0:31:14to check what we're really doing and make sure that the impact of the regulation is actually quantifiable to make air better we just go forward because it sounds good isn't that right that's correct and also to to comply with the rule you have to use more energy so estimate it'll it'll actually increase uh carbon dioxide wow wow and in the meantime many of the facilities making tires in the United States will have to either shutter or reduce their production as a result of which
▶ 0:31:45there will be more and more foreign tires coming in and frankly I'd rather buy American Madam chair than you thank you uh ranking member MC uh Mr plone do you want to respond to any of that again you know part of my concern here that I express is that with both of these rules no Hearing in subcommittee no markup in subcommittee no markup in full
▶ 0:32:15committee which is regular order and I think you know Mr Griffith you mentioned you know don't uh don't we don't really check what we're doing I think that that's the problem here in other words look my understanding is that Yokohama how I pronounce it doesn't isn't even covered by the CPA rule or by this resolution because the EPA rule as I said doesn't apply to the entire rubber tire manufacturing industry just a handful of facilities that process rubber
▶ 0:32:46as I said who have years to comply and that is the case with Yokohama they're not actually covered by the rule and I don't even know if Yokohama is part of this group but as I mentioned the association of Home Appliance manufacturers has said that they have no problem uh with this EPA rule maybe Yokohama is not part of that group I have no idea but I just feel that you know it's kind of like the same thing a gentleman from Georgia last week on the uh home uh water heaters
▶ 0:33:17you know talked about his company this Japanese company that was manufacturing these things in his district and it turned out they were the only group that oppose this and what we found out was that all they had to do was spend I don't know how much I think it was about $10 million and they were making so much money uh in order to do what the American manufacturers were doing and they refused to do it and so they were the ones that were saying well we should get rid of this rule
▶ 0:33:47so again I I I don't know what to say I think if we had an opportunity to look at this we' to find out who isn't who isn't impacted Yokohama is not impacted based on what I been able to find out and the American manufacturers I me I know Yokohama makes them here but they're still a Japanese company and I love Japan so I'm not trying to say you know Japan's no good but thank thankfully at least they're manufacturing here but the bottom line is we we the
▶ 0:34:17these resolutions come before rules without having any input from Energy and Commerce examples of being brought up which I don't think the uh the rule applies to and and with the exception maybe no exceptions the American manufacturers have no problem with it I know to say you just made the case why hearings are important um and uh hopefully in the future my Republican colleagues will actually take the time and do hearings and bring these bills to the floor
▶ 0:34:47under regular order chairman Guthrie as you heard in my opening statement um I I just find it really hard to believe that these are the most pressing items on your agenda as the chairman of the committee with broad jurisdiction over this country's uh Health Care system and I'm I read that you guys have been told not to do Town Halls anymore but as I mentioned in my opening um I've been doing a lot of town halls and several hundred of my constituents uh showed up just on Saturday to tell me it was
▶ 0:35:18on their mind and none of them brought up tires or appliances um but they did bring up how disgusted they are with uh with Doge cuts and they objected to the awful budget that you guys jam through which goes after Medicaid so I just want to ask you some questions about some things that actually matter to a lot of Americans chairman Guthrie last month Rape Crisis centers that support domestic violence survivors had to stop taking on new clients because the administration froze funding for C cdc's
▶ 0:35:48rape prevention and education program did do you have a a date when your committee might do an oversight hearing on that matter matter we don't have a date except for that all right uh what about uh when the administration slash funding for NIH uh clinical trials um I convened a round table um in my district at uh UMass Medical School um I not listen to researchers but to parents of Six Sick Children
▶ 0:36:18who are counting on these trials and are very scared and upset I I just met today some of you may have as well with uh individuals who have type one diabetes uh and they're in town again really deeply concerned about Cuts in NIH as well as Cuts in in U in Medicaid but um do we have a a date U uh for a hearing to address the cutting of medical programs for we don't we don't have a day for a hearing on that but in the last hearing that we had we discussed this our
▶ 0:36:48last markup we discussed this and we're going to do oversight to make sure that we have the right research in NIH and FDA you're also referring to as well yeah about the fact that on/ tenth of the workers have been let go at nih's Center for Alzheimer's and related dementias uh including uh leading Alzheimer's researchers who have uh again I mean it would seem to me that that's urgent enough when there should be hearing scheduled on that at a at at at the very least um you know and and let me
▶ 0:37:19let me ask you about what's on everybody's Minds uh and that is the cuts that U are proposed to Medicaid uh which uh would would threaten 80 million children and adults who receive Health Care through Medicaid and chip um I mean will your Port portion of of the reconciliation Bill cut Medicaid my uh assessment we haven't sit down and had our markup yet but you won't have children that are you won't what we will offer will not affect
▶ 0:37:49children disabled people in the traditional medic program who who will able-bodied working adults so you got cut I mean we won't cut we we'll ask them to work yeah I mean and and Mr PA how how much is the budget proposed to cut Medicade well 880 billion well we have broad jurisdiction
▶ 0:38:20so it's not all so but but but this would this is actually good news if you're going to tell me that you're going to find all those savings and nobody is going to lose their Healthcare no the work they elim people already right it's just that the paperwork prevented
▶ 0:38:50people from actually filing the paperwork and they lost their insurance but even if even if you did that and you had said that across the board and every in every state and everyone lost their insurance because they didn't file the paper um you're talking less than a hundred billion dollar so where's this trillion coming from but but put me down as skeptical um uh that somehow you're going to make these cuts and there's going to be no adverse impacts but as we speak
▶ 0:39:21and the reason one the reason why I am skeptical is because as we speak people are beginning to feel uh the actions this Administration um I I just met with a group of veterans who are deeply concerned about the firing of veterans from the VA Health System uh the suicide preventions hotline was shut down because of some of the layoffs in the New England region and so I know you've only been chairman for two months so you know but I I I I think I'm stating what you already know but part of your job here is to provide oversight
▶ 0:39:52not just of the previous administration but more importantly of this Administration right now uh and it's to make sure the American people are protected by preserving programs like Medicaid that in some cases you know keep them alive uh and I don't think it's the job of of the committee to um you know to to turn a blind eye when programs that impact Alzheimer's research are being cut and I don't and again I certainly
▶ 0:40:22don't think that you know the American people want to see these deep Cuts in Medicaid and um I I think most Americans think that uh you know uh victims of domestic violence um you know should should not be adversely impacted by what Elon Musk is doing uh and there ought to be an investigation into that um uh and I think that's where I wish your committee were focused on right now not on these these CRA that again with all this happening
▶ 0:40:52I mean there's an urgency here uh and um so I I would hope that the next time we see you that we'll be talking about something more substantive and something quite frankly that responds to what most of my constituents and and countless people all across the country are really concerned about at this moment and with that I yield back thank you and I I just wanted to remind the members that what we are here for today is hjr 42 energy conservation
▶ 0:41:22program for appliance standards and hjr 61 which is natural uh National emission standards for hazardous air pollutants uh rubber tire manufacturing and um I'm sure that um what the ranking member was going off on and it will be dealt with in committee for the hearings that you were asking about earlier there'll be hearings and I'm sure that there will be sufficient discussion in uh the Committees uh soon but we are here for hjr
▶ 0:41:5242 and HJ res 61 and with that I would yield to Mr Jack of Georgia uh thank you madam chairwoman and uh first I want to uh thank the ranking member for your comments on Mr DS Bard and likewise I want to commend uh the chairman uh for passage of HJ res2 last week and to the ranking member I've got at least rebut uh on behalf of my constituents as it relates to that uh very specifically you know that the issue last week that we found
▶ 0:42:22was that a a company within my congressional district that manufactures water heaters non-condensing tankless water heaters um was the victim of this Rule and regulation I think you find that a lot of its competitors wanted this rule to go forward because it limited competition in the American workplace it would have put these folks out of business um so I'm proud that we passed that I want to commend uh chairman uh Guthrie for your leadership on that issue specifically and look forward to seeing what happens in the Senate but I did encourage and I did welcome our debate last week on the floor um on this specific resolution
▶ 0:42:53that the chairwoman just uh noted I want to thank Mr Griffith for his leadership you know I too have tire manufacturers in my district I've got Bridgestone an American company um that um that is imperiled by this I've got Bridgestone works in the same county as the the water heaters so it's very um a good County for American manufacturing but if I could ask the chairman just for the record and for everyone uh that may be watching just to walk through just what tire manufacturers would do would what cost they would incur if this rule were to go
▶ 0:43:24well they would have to do the it's a regenerative I said RTO regenerative I have to get that actual term in front of me as we they would they would have to expend money putting RTO that's regenerative I've got the one in front of me let me find the exactly what that stands for so I'll make sure I get it right for the record but they'll have to expend money to uh bring for the hydrocarbons out of the air that the I don't have the exact number I give you the number
▶ 0:43:55but hydrocarbon out of the air that has that really didn't have a finding through EPA but they would also have to expend energy to do that so the AR argument is that they would have to use more CO2 than is normally required so instead of getting getting a minimal or no benefit from one pollutant would allow the other what some others would call a pollutant as well with increase in the others and we found uh this rule was issued just after Thanksgiving which you know seems consistent with uh the last administration's
▶ 0:44:25policy of issuing rules right after holidays when not a lot of folks are watching and I just was curious if for the record you could walk through uh to the extent you you're familiar with the history of it how did this come to be at the time that it that it came what what data did EPA collect to put us in this perspective so the the word for rtl's regenerative thermal oxid I'm not familiar with the data that they brought forward sure um and then as it relates to um as it relates to the other resolution that we're debating here today curious was
▶ 0:44:55with respect to some of the um Appliance industry some of the requirements and regulations that were fored on them through this most recent rule could you walk us through for you manufacturers of those appliances what these labels would you know additional challenges that would come from some of the labeling process well the a lot of them are duplicative and uh into ongoing reporting requirements they have to submit DPA and they already submit DPA in the energy star program and it requires the collection of unnecessary data in order to meet the collection
▶ 0:45:25provisions and the unnecessary and duplicative nature of this final rule will increase work for manufacturers while doing nothing to lower cost for consumers well I want to commend your committee again on passage last week that was very important to my district very important to my constituents and likewise Mr Griffith appreciate your leadership on this specific resolution and with that I yield back thank you um Miss ganet thank you um I have to share the concerns raised by the ranking member and by my constituents that you know we're kind
▶ 0:45:55of wasting time rolling through these CRA when uh there's certainly more pressing issues including a uh budget Cliff coming at us Full Steam um but we're considering more cras today uh and once again it does appear that our Republican colleagues are putting company profits Over clean air and family budgets um like all of the cras we've considered here they have the same goal they help companies make more profit by Shifting the costs of their
▶ 0:46:26businesses onto the American people we just had a question about the cost that tire manufacturers would in incur in order to compel comply with a rule rather than poisoning their neighbors so I've spoken repeatedly about the benefits of Energy Efficiency standards for American consumers both in reducing energy costs and protecting the environment so I won't repeat those points today other than to say that I remain opposed to efforts such as hjr 42 to gut those standards
▶ 0:46:56but I have to address the second CRA before us hjr 61 which would roll back protections to the public from hazardous air pollutants generated by rubber tire manufacturing and particularly the dangerous and carcinogenic chemicals and waste products produced in that process uh over the years my district has seen up close the health hazards caused by tires and tire fires when they release toxic smoking carcinogens we know firsthand both the immediate impact of such Emissions on those who have have
▶ 0:47:27asthma and children on our region have the highest asthma rate in the country and the long-term impact of carcinogens on those who come in contact with these processes the EPA rule under attack here would ensure that companies that make tires emit fewer hazardous air pollutants in other words this rule ensures that tire manufacturers don't inflict Health burdens on the people who live downwind from their companies tire manufacturers emit 171 tons
▶ 0:47:57of carcinogenic emissions every year and evidence shows that there's a significant health impact on those who live nearby but apparently our Republican colleagues think that tire manufacturers profits are more important than Americans Health this the tradeoff um that this CRA represents is not a one-off but a Hallmark of the policy priorities we're seeing from congressional Republicans in the Trump Administration to put their billionaire friends and corporate profits ahead of the health and well-being
▶ 0:48:28of the American people they're rolling back regulations that protect our health and environment they're slashing programs that support Americans Health whether it's teeing up drastic cuts to Medicaid in their budget bills firing thousands of workers at the VA NIH and Social Security Administration stopping development of next year's flu vacine I had a number of constituents concerned about that this weekend at home and mishandling the spreading out of measles across the country
▶ 0:48:59so I I think our colleagues have made themselves clear they're willing to sacrifice the health of Americans to justify giving more tax cuts and profits to their corporate buddies but of course none of this addresses underlying issues of the cost of eggs or um mortgage rates um so before we move on uh Mr palone there was a suggestion that the EPA hadn't weighed either the monetary or health costs um that are implicated in div revising this rule about toxic
▶ 0:49:29uh let's see hazardous air pollutants from rubber tire manufacturing can you tell us about that process well I appreciate you're bringing up you know I I spent a lot of time talking about the fact that you know it wasn't even clear what these um um resolutions did because didn't go through through the committee or that actually you know the good manufacturers or actually don't have any problem with these rules because it's only the Bad actors that do right or the foreign
▶ 0:49:59manufacturers or foreign companies but I think the more fundamental thing which you brought up Miss scanland is that I mean this is being done uh because we want to protect American consumers right so what happens with the Clean Air Act or the Clean Water Act whatever is that the EPA has a obligation under the law to periodically review what's going on and see whether it's harmful and they have determined that with regard to these uh rubber rubber tires that their manufacturing
▶ 0:50:29is increasing air pollution and toxics and therefore affecting American Health they don't make this stuff up they have an obligation to do it under the law they then go out and you know do the testing and they meet with the manufacturers and generally speaking what happens is they come up with an agreement with the at least a good manufacturers good actors that say okay if we if we do this we'll reduce the amount of air pollution into the atmosphere at the same time
▶ 0:50:59we won't harm your business and and so for the most part everything we're discussing today and last week as well on the floor are things that um are in you know that the most manufacturers particularly the American ones agree with I don't really have a problem with so that's the process they're required to do it under the law they meet with the manufacturers and the and the good guys come up with a way of doing this that is articulated in the rule yeah I it was interesting just reading the limited information that we have
▶ 0:51:29here because of course there was no markup to actually dig into this um that this goes back to 2002 um when the standards were initially set up but additional information the science has advanced over time to disclose additional dangers to the American people so if there was no markup and it's bad actors who involved who were involved it kind of makes you wonder why this bill is before us who pushed for it how much did they contribute to the inaugural Fund in order to get this bill on the floor um
▶ 0:52:00well I I thank you for the information the attention you paid to this and I would yield back thank you Mr Norman I want thank both Mr blone and Mr Guth for being here um let me just before and we are here to to discuss the hres 61 and SJ res 11 but and for those who are viewing this at home for the ranking member to say he went to town halls and heard all these
▶ 0:52:30complaints let me tell you the things that I'm hearing uh from the public um I'm hearing about 7784 million uh for the new Embassy that Elon mus discovered in South Sudan I'm hearing about the 45 million that was spent on Dei in Burma I'm hearing about the 36 contracts across six agencies that spent 165 million taxpayers money for climate surveys I'm hearing about
▶ 0:53:01500,000 in Politico which is a partisan um magazine or paper I'm hearing about 182 million in HHS and of that 168,000 went to the fouchy exhibit so I'm hearing about the great things that have been discovered and if the ranking member has a problem with that there's more to come this is just one um I hadn't heard the exact amount that Stacy Abrams got but I hear it's a pretty good
▶ 0:53:31sum of money that had been funneled to her all that to say that uh the what we saw on TV with zalinski it's it's such a relief to have a president who is in charge who's not letting these foreign actors come in here and basically have their way with our tax money so um it's it's a welcome relief to American people on understand it and um it's it's we've got a president now
▶ 0:54:01that's not asleep he can uh just make decisions and the American people saw the last four years of what this administration had done to housing costs what they've done to inflation what they've done to um to basically destroy try to destroy their American life and way of life which thank God is under a new leadership now but on these two uh Brett the Mr PL I take issue with you on manufacturers agree with regulations
▶ 0:54:32being put on by EPA I sat in one on the on the manufactured housing um it wasn't either one of these but the regulations they were the B Administration was trying was going to put on them they violently agreed with on this particular one I've heard from makers who uh in my district who make dishwashers uh who their livelihood comes from uh from the sale of dishwashers which by the way is in a competitive market they have to compete with
▶ 0:55:02other other manufacturers and to say that uh the I don't think they make up this 213,000 cost I mean that comes from those who are in the business and who know the 2,95 hours of paperwork companies are sick and tired of this been imposed on um and con McGuffy why did Biden do this at the level hour why do you think he put this on leaving office know why I did it at at the 11th hour
▶ 0:55:32but uh you know we as we said as as u i I don't know why he added these at the 11th hour but they're right these regulations have getting Tighter and Tighter over time you know from 1995 to 2005 the homeowner replace their appliances every 12 to 13 years now with the new trends and standards it's every 8 to nine on average and the price keeps increasing um and heard s is anecdotal but me being one my family that we had to buy one because it was always available and it takes a
▶ 0:56:03doesn't do as good a job as the Owen did um and on the tire uh on the regulations on the tires that directly affected South Carolina we've got melin we've got Continental uh and I think it's 11 major source facilities in nine states South Carolina was one of them um I guess this is the same issue I don't did did any of your major manufacturers say they went along with these regulations did they
▶ 0:56:33say we would like to because I didn't hear from I I didn't hear I didn't hear any specific but I would also like if I could enter into the record a statement Administration policy for Haj R 61 and one for ha res 42 that's possible without objection well thanks for putting these up uh thank you for and I think it's the businesses will that have to compete on a daily basis basis are sick and tired of unelected bureaucrats putting putting regulations on them which make no sense
▶ 0:57:03just add the cost to add to the cost of the final product so with that chairman I you back thank you Miss leder Fernandez thank you madam chair uh I'm going to yield some time to my ranking member no I find it interesting that I get admonish for going off topic but uh uh Mr Norman doesn't but anyway um I was respond I I I would I would like to uh um um have inserted into the record a letter that um
▶ 0:57:34that LE wesa uh who is the man who collapsed communism in Poland with the help of Ronald Reagan and Pope John Paul II and 38 other former political prisoners uh have uh just put out um in which they strongly condemn the way U president zinsky was treated uh at that White House meeting um and um you know I this this this this re this new view that somehow Vladimir Putin is a
▶ 0:58:04is a is a good guy uh that he's somebody we should hold up that we criticize I I never ever thought that I would hear any members of of of of an Administration or members of Congress uh shower Putin with praise um and go after someone like zilinsky who's fighting for his life because of Russian aggress agression I thank the general Eddie for yielding and I yield back excuse me just one did you ask for a letter yeah yeah you kep going well yeah
▶ 0:58:34I want the letter in the records without objection it is entered thank you madam chair for being so thorough and thank you so much ranking member for raising that because we are in a moment now where it is important to say who you stand with and Republicans used to be the party that was so adamant against the USSR against Russia against Putin who recognized him for the danger he was to the world
▶ 0:59:05and it is really sad that we are not hearing more Republicans stand up for those ideals that they expressed but tonight you know we're on these rules uh and tonight you know we're watching Republicans protect home appliances rather than home Healthcare they're going to protect rubber tires rather than firefighters they'll raise Americans utility bills and health risks rather than raise
▶ 0:59:35concerns about Trump's or his love of Putin or the pardons of violent January 6th attackers and tomorrow tomorrow Trump will impose tariffs on Canada and Mexico and since we're talking about tires let's look at the impact of those tariffs on cars and driving auto manufacturers have said they would pass the Tariff costs on to Consumers Republicans have been quiet
▶ 1:00:06about how Trump's tariffs wrecking ball will increase inflation chairman Guthrie do you know how much the tariffs are expected to raise the cost of buying a car I don't have that in front of me I I didn't prepare for that but I I would hope that what happens is that the threat of tariffs will bring the tariffs down for other countries so we can have lower tariffs for everybody I think that's the objective well that's really not the objective and that's not what he said he said it's about something completely unrelated and
▶ 1:00:36what you're hearing from the Auto industry from the industry that you have sat before as today and said you're concerned about is they are alarmed they are against it they are very worried uh and the number that you don't have right before you and I can understand why is that it would raise the cost of buying a car $33,000 and $10,000 for a truck U Madam chair I'd like to introduce uh the article US Auto
▶ 1:01:06industry could be collateral damage in Trump's trade Wars without objection uh and there you know it's pointed out that it would pose an existential threat to the $300 billion doll in trade just affecting the auto market uh and I think that that's really key because if we're going to going to sit here and talk about the importance of manufacturing because we're integrated Canada is our Ally they're not our enemy
▶ 1:01:36Mexico is an ally they are not our enemy or the plants that exist you know in my colleague states depend on the trade that happens with Canada and Mexico and this is going to increase the cost and make it even harder for families D for not just a new car but even an old car because once you raise the prices for something you raise it for everything else uh and let's talk let's
▶ 1:02:06talk about okay you can't afford a car you've got your old car doesn't have great gas mileage maybe but you got to go fill it up at the pump right so under President Biden America set records for oil and gas production but we still import Canadian Oil because you know it serves in the middle part of the country uh it's useful some gas refineries use it uh and this is what has been said about the Trump Tas tariffs and this is from the K Institute you
▶ 1:02:36know I'm always introducing material from the KO Institute because nobody can say that's you know Democratic or liberal that's a right-wing Institute but they're very honest about certain things he said on the tariffs how the heck does that shake out my guess is that shakes out just through higher gas gas prices particularly in the midwest so chairman Guthrie have you spoken out against the terrorist you haven't because you just told me you think it's going to lead to good is that why
▶ 1:03:07well I I just heard that President Trump is said of course this is something that he has the authority to do that Congress has granted the authority to do but I've heard him say I've heard him say we're going to put tffs on people that have tffs on us and I've heard him say that hopefully we could go they won't terriff us and we won't terriff them but I think it but he does feel in kind of his whole being is America's always been the the one that's been taken advantage of and he wants to equate that moving forward so I was with talking with some people in in Europe just a couple of weeks ago during
▶ 1:03:37the presidential weekend and they were talking about well they don't terf us as much as the other and then I brought up whether your value added tax that adds about you know can depend on the country could add 26% to the price of an American product and so I what I hope that President Trump does is uses this uh process to get where we have all lower taxes on everybody with their allies as you mentioned they are allies they are our friends and hopefully they'll treat us the way we'll treat them well I mean what's interesting is terrorists are kind of a complicated thing they can be used surgically
▶ 1:04:07they can be used wisely but what he's doing is just blanket terorist right like everything else he's doing it's just chaos and confusion just imposed on everything rather than carefully thinking through what do you want with your policy objective and the idea that it's not going to get C passed on Americans know that everybody is saying it's going to get passed on you know everybody knows it's going to be passed on so for people who are saying it's not I mean that is just not the way tariffs work they get passed on uh but you
▶ 1:04:37know I want to move to the issue of the utility uh costs um so you know ranking member palone um efficiency standards help American households save money right uh and I've seen some numbers of Ross the board about the different efficiency standards because this is not the first time you know we seem to have these Home Appliance bills uh we saw them a lot last year right they had all those catchy names you know
▶ 1:05:08uh hands off or refrigerators you know they were just because we used to say hands off our bodies and so they were like okay let's use their catchy phrases for for women it meant it it means our lives and our life our health but can you elaborate on why these Energy Efficiency standards including this one which is about certification why is it important for Americans and what they pay in their utility bills
▶ 1:05:38well first of all you've pointed out as I have that this resolution is not about the actual efficiency standards but the certification that they're complying with the standards which again I just don't know what you know I guess they've been doing the efficiency standards for so many weeks now that they have to move on to something else that seems totally redundant but whatever um again it's like my response to miss scanland uh in this case the department of energy and in the case of the rubber
▶ 1:06:09tires the EPA they have an obligation under the law that you know passed many years ago that periodically they have to look and see whether the appliances uh are efficient uh because consumers want effici appliances right they don't have to use all as much energy they they want better stuff to cost less and so that's what they did the DOE looked at these standards and said look we can do this uh with less uh
▶ 1:06:39energy costs it'll cost you significantly less for this Appliance over the over a certain period of time and then they meet with the manufacturers and they say uh you know what is your opinion on this and in almost every one of these cases that we've talked about now for several weeks whether whatever the appliances the refrigerator the washing machine whatever these standards have been put together with the consensus of I'll call them the good actors the good manufacturers
▶ 1:07:09who said yeah we can do that and then we can save money to the consumer it's not there's no uh there's nothing uh obscure here or surprising here and these things for years were done on a biant basis and nobody had a problem with it I just think that the Republicans are running out of things to do here and so they uh you know they keep going they look at the Federal Register what can we do this week I mean this isn't even the the standards this is now the certification so we're going to have one for certification
▶ 1:07:39of Standards this week and next certification some other standards and then where do we go from there it's just yeah but the other thing that strikes me that with all of these Energy Efficiency stands with these things it's like none of this brings down the cost for American families just the opposite the opposite right right because when they when they review this they have to look at the costs and they only put these standards in effect if the cost uh is reduced now my colleagues will say
▶ 1:08:09oh well they have to pay for The Upfront costs well that may be but over a period of time whether it's 5 10 20 years whatever it is you actually the consumer saves money I hate to interrupt but we are at the 11 minute Mark okay great uh so uh so what we're seeing is there's a I think that there is a pattern so Trump gutted you know they they gutted the Consumer Financial protections Bureau uh no Republican raised a concern uh there's talks about taken away the ability
▶ 1:08:40to negotiate with big farmer standing with big corporations standing with industry and not standing with our consumers not standing with working families and you know in contrast Democrats pass laws that would would actually reduce the cost to Consumers uh of I I I saw a number of like a trillion and so these kinds of things where we have been working we've been working on bringing down the cost and Trump has been
▶ 1:09:10doing the opposite everything he's doing is Raising cost no wonder Trump is heading into tomorrow's address with the lowest favorability rating of any incoming president in history rate actually the lowest was last time Trump was an incoming president because everything he's doing is not serving the American public and consumers and with that I back thank you Mr
▶ 1:09:40Roy I thank the chair um I'll just be quick and I assume U Mr Guth you might have a few things you might want to respond to and all that um I'll just open by saying that number one uh while I am happy to work with organizations like KO they're hard a farri organization they're a Libertarian organization which means I agree with them at times I disagree with them at times um which is true on both sides of the aisle by by by virtue of their being a Libertarian organization um that being said uh Mr cth ask this simple question
▶ 1:10:11uh do the regulations that we're trying to address here increase the cost of appliances for Americans they do increase the cost of appliances for americ do they make it uh more complex and more difficult and more timec consuming for manufacturers to produce the product products and deliver them to Consumers that that's correct uh so is the objective to minimize that so that consumers can have more costeffective products and manufacturers can produce them more easily and more readily well that is our hope because because
▶ 1:10:41as we as my my colleague here had mentioned he said well there's a we talk about The Upfront cost versus the payback period Well the payback period can be years years so even if you do achieve lower energy bills with an appliance but if you The Upfront costs it's far more than what I've seen it can be up to 10 or 20 years far more than typically people invest on a fiveyear payback period And so it's not economical for for people to do this as well it's not benefiting them in
▶ 1:11:11terms of when you throw in The Upfront costs which you can't dismiss do you have anything else you want to add in response to I think I've covered you back thank you and thank you both for being here today uh the Witnesses are excused thank you thank you thank you all right and I would now like to welcome our second panel chairman Westerman and representative alth from the committee on natural resources
▶ 1:12:08and I would like to remind the witnesses that your full statement may be submitted for the record and we ask that you summarize your statement in five minutes chairman Westerman I welcome testimony thank you madam chair and thank you for the opportunity to testify today first I want to thank my colleague Senator Kennedy and representative AEL for championing this effort and collaborating with my team to advance this bipartisan resolution sjr 11 nullifies a rule submitted by the Bureau of ocean
▶ 1:12:38Energy Management relating to the protection of marine archaeological resources the rule mandates costly time-intensive archaeological reports for all oil and gas exploration or development plans burdening operators with unnecessary red tape the Biden Administration replaced a flexible risk-based approach where archaeological reports were only required in highrisk zones with a sweeping mandate requiring energy producers to develop reports for all offshore
▶ 1:13:09oil and gas activity the National Historic preservation act section 106 already provides a robust framework for a thorough review of offshore archaeological resources engaging The Advisory Council on historic preservation stakeholders and the public before final decisions are made ensuring both energy development and historic preservation are addressed effectively due to this rule rule making operators must now conduct extensive surveys using highresolution
▶ 1:13:39geophysical tools to develop reports for every oil and gas exploration or development plan even if archaeological findings have already been documented or if there is no archaeological risk at all bom's analysis estimates an additional 500 annual burden hours for the agency due to this rule plus equipment and contractor cost while framed as a safeguard for marine Heritage the rule imposed excessive regulatory burdens on domestic energy producers
▶ 1:14:09increasing compliance cost and driving up Energy prices for Americans still struggling to make ends meet after four years of inflation offshore oil and gas production in US Waters puts America First supports l domestic energy cost and creates good paying jobs this rule was part of a broad pattern of Biden Administration policies that hindered offshore energy development and placed red tape on America's energy producers passing this resolution will support American
▶ 1:14:40Energy security and further American Energy dominance allowing for the protection of historic sites without burdening energy producers with unnecessary regulation urge the committee to report an appropriate rule so this resolution may be considered in the house thank you and I back thank you Mr Westerman representative alth you're
▶ 1:15:15recognized roll thank you should I start over Madam chair okay material and cultural exchange The History of Science and Technology the history of ship building history of War prehistoric civilizations and natural changes to the Earth when the seabed is Disturbed without careful archaeological surveys these Priceless pieces of History can be damaged or destroyed like they were in the Micah shipwreck uh which was bisected by the Exxon Mobile pipeline in 2001 which very importantly cost that $250,000 in
▶ 1:15:45fees to survey the damage and gather data on the vessel that would have been prevented um had they done this survey in advance that is why the Bureau of ocean energy ocean Energy Management established these guidelines in 1982 over 40 years ago to ensure that artifacts are found and preserved prior to drilling thus protecting the history and again importantly protecting oil and gas companies from the liability of unknowingly destroying Irreplaceable pieces of history in 2006 and 2011 this rule was
▶ 1:16:15updated to ensure good faith compliance with the National Historic preservation Act and the National Environmental Policy Act but boam recognized that the language required updating in order to provide oil and gas companies with more clarity and consistency and to ensure the best available science is utilized in these pre-drilling surveys Senate joint resolution 11 seeks not only to undo that rule and the Decades of modernization benefiting both again the archaeological Discovery and in this case the oil and gas industry it intends to prevent such a rule from ever being enacted
▶ 1:16:45again just a few key points this 2024 rule is not burdensome in fact companies are already doing these surveys the rule simply codifies industry standard practices for these surveys to ensure consistency very important to the business Community it also allows archaeologists to compare apples to apples when evaluating the archeological archaeological reports oil and gas companies have already been submitting for years number two this rule will not cause a substantial financial burden to operators boam reported that the final the total annual Financial impact
▶ 1:17:15to the entire oil industry is less than $400,000 a year for an industry with a reported pre-tax profit of 83.9 billion in the US last year alone I don't believe 400,000 is more than a fair is a fair amount to contribute to ensure preservation this rule does not negatively impact America's energy dominance and Independence again as sure this committee knows the United States is already the number one producer of oil and gas in the world we are producing so much oil more oil than any other country in fact so much that we are exporting
▶ 1:17:46that energy which is actually leading to increased prices uh for our constituents this rule did not even meet the threshold to require a statement for energy effects report as it has such a negligible possibility of impacting energy supply distribution or use this rule helps to protect oil and gas companies it protects it brings the agency and these companies into compliance with the National Historic preservation Act without these surveys operators can discover uh could discover these archaeological resources as they go to drill forcing the costly delays
▶ 1:18:16which is what we're trying to prevent companies still have to adhere to laws protecting shipwrecks and mitigate impacts to sites that were once above water and home to indigenous peoples these sites with or without this rule are protected by the nhpa and in some cases by International treaties protecting historic shipwrecks lastly this rule actually promotes efficiency providing consistency to the business community and protects oil and gas companies from wasted time and money by mitigating the extraction and preservation of these artifacts we are saving time and money in the long run
▶ 1:18:46and is much more damaging to the company's bottom line to have to stop operations if they are actually going to uh impact a sensitive area uh and suddenly handle that than if they had just surveyed up front rolling back this rule not only damages our ability to recover pieces of history that teach us about our predecessors and ancient civilizations it also can hurt productivity and profits for oil and gas companies good policy of course we know means collaboration and compromise among stakeholders it means that you may not get everything you want but everything will everyone will get something they need this final rule
▶ 1:19:17is just good policy and benefits all stakeholders involved it would set a dangerous precedent and prohibit this kind of solutions oriented policym and roll back Decades of bipon effort to preserve history I urge the members of this committee to consider the cost of this action and we will continue uh will we continue to be leaders in Discovery or instead lead to destroying of our own history and I yield back my time thank you madam chair thank you Miss alred I'm understand this is your first time at the rules committee yes so we um particularly welcome you to the rules committee
▶ 1:19:47chairman Westerman this joint resolution already passed the Senate with bipartisan support why do you believe it's gain report across the aisle given the remarks of Miss alth yeah um Madam chair the the bill I think gained bipartisan support because if you look at the the Senators that supported it are from western states where they're already seeing U burdensome red tape in mining and energy production and I think they even
▶ 1:20:17even though they're not producers in the Gulf uh they see how the the red tape's getting out of control and I think they're saying enough is enough and to be clear as Miss alred said there's already a regulatory process in place to ensure that archaeological resources are preserved when the Bureau of ocean Energy Management has a reason to believe they are present doesn't the current standard make sense yeah section 106
▶ 1:20:48of the National Historic preservation act already protects um uh these archaeological areas and it requires bom um and it applies to Bone and energy production offshore and you know what we're talking about most of the time are shipwrecks and there's there's already been a lot of extensive mapping in the Gulf there's a process there to um to account for artifacts
▶ 1:21:18uh and this is just another duplicative rule that I think is being put in place to uh create extra burden on um on our offshore producers and the rule really didn't even or the agencies didn't consider the impact on small businesses a lot of these operators in the western Gulf are small operators and these costs can be substantial to them lastly this mandate is sure to be inflationary imposing compliance
▶ 1:21:48cost on energy development is that not correct yeah it's just another rule uh requiring uh and costly surveys that um are unnecessary there's already a process and a rule in place to account for this thank you Miss kin you're recognized thank you um am I correct there hasn't been a markup in the house is that right that is correct okay and the rule did go through a cost benefit analysis at
▶ 1:22:19um at the relevant agency and got feedback again from what I I am understand this would current rule only cost the industry $400,000 a year again an industry that is 89 83.9 billion in profits alone and again it's our contention that this would could actually save money and importantly time um if uh a project were to run into one of these uh protected sites they would have to stop uh delay pay more in fines and if they just surveyed
▶ 1:22:49to begin with so it's essentially a tweak to an ongoing process that has the potential for cost savings that's our contention thank you thank you I yield back thank you very much um Mr Griffith recognize thank you madam chairman Mr chairman you want to respond to any of these uh things they've been saying about this good little resolution well it's it's Lo um you got a belt now
▶ 1:23:19let's put some suspenders on and add a few hundred th000 here a few hundred th000 there nobody's going to miss that yeah so what you're saying is is that uh our colleagues on the other side of the island people who come up with these regulations don't always look at the long-term economic impacts is that what you're saying right and it it appears these regulations a lot of times aren't necessarily about um protecting something or saving something but to throw another obstacle out there to prevent more energy
▶ 1:23:50production that's always been my feeling too I yell back Madam chair thank you uh Mr Jack you're recognized uh thank you very much Madam chairwoman I I question to the chairman um trying to understand the impetus of this rule I know we've touched on it during your testimony but um was there a a surge of of damaged to archaeological sides in the past few years I'm trying to understand the impetus of this and would would welcome thoughts for you as to why you believe the Biden Administration rushed this rule after
▶ 1:24:20he lost the election why did that happen uh not to be cliche but it's another one of those uh Solutions in search of a problem wonderful um and as it relates to the the cost analysis just curious I know the the Industry Group notes that this rule is very ambiguous um so it's hard for me to understand how they could you know uh specify a specific cost or whoever the proponents of this rule may be say 400,000 as I understand it it's very ambiguous and it actually could you know
▶ 1:24:50uh be far adjusted much much higher any comments on that Mr chairman yeah and I I'm not familiar with the the costs that have been put out there but I do know that the agency didn't include small businesses in their analysis and um you know again the small businesses are the ones that are going to get hurt the most by the the regulations that they have to follow just like the the big producers do sure well I appreciate your leadership on this um appreciate the the committee's time and attention
▶ 1:25:21to it um very passionate about cras because it's you've no doubt heard me uh over and over speak about the CRA last week HJ res 20 on tankless water heaters very specifically impacted my congressional district so um I applaud your efference as it relates to um this issue and I will be in support of this rule thank you madam chair Mr Norman recognized thank you uh Mr Westman for bringing this up has been through the Senate this is I think as you mentioned
▶ 1:25:51just another regulation on top of none of the manufacturer none of the oil producers thought this was didn't didn't Express an interest in passing something that like this that would add I think 5.9 million in compliance cost I know nobody's been beating our door down asking us to increase the regulations that they already have to have to go through to produce energy in the and uh Miss Alon
▶ 1:26:21thank you for coming this is your first time did I hear you right to say the Americans America is is now producing oil from our reserves because didn't the Biden Administration pretty well shut it down including the Keystone Pipeline well sir I was not here in Congress during the Biden Administration so I can't speak to that but currently we are producing more oil than we ever have before and our contention that we are in fact energy independent so much to the fact that we are exporting excess oil we are now under Trump
▶ 1:26:51or will be but what's happened in the past we're buying it from OPEC uh a lot of those countries don't like us and now we you finally going back and using our reserves and we'll be exporting and we'll be be helping the economy that way because we're producing it we got a 100-year supply of oil and natural gas uh thank you for bringing this up and uh I'll y back thank you Mr Norman Mr mg no no remarks Mr Roy you
▶ 1:27:22recognize i y Mr Scott you're recognized thank you I I do want to make one quick comment you miss alre you said this only cost some kind of millions I couldn't catch the number but you know people in my district think millions are a lot and we had a famous Senator many years ago said a million here and a million there and pretty soon you're talking about
▶ 1:27:52real money uh now we're doing that in billions but I think if you if you spend a million here and a million there again you really are talking about real money so when somebody says it only costs so much and you're talking Millions I I think that's significant but thank you both very much I just I I think I don't think she said millions I think I thank you Mr rank member 400,000 is our estimation and again
▶ 1:28:22to do these these pre surveys uh and and again in order theoretically and arguably to save money in the long run so these projects without this survey could be affecting or impacting sensitive areas and at that point it would cause a stop work order it would cause hundreds of thousand more in fines per violation and so this is actually preemptively saving money and how much these companies make 83.9 billion thank you thank you
▶ 1:28:53do you have any questions okay we appreciate our Witnesses being here you're excused without objection the committee stands in recess subject to the call the chair or five
▶ 1:29:23minutes
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▶ 1:33:52the committee will reconvene the chair will be in receipt of a motion from the gentleman uh from Virginia Mr Griffith thank you madam chair I move the committee Grant HJ resz 42 providing for Congressional disapproval under chapter eight of Title 5 United States code of the rule submitted by the department of energy relating to energy conservation program for applying standard certification requirements labeling requirements and enforcement Provisions for certain consumer products and commercial equipment a closed rule the rule waves All Points of order
▶ 1:34:22against consideration of the joint resolution the rule provides that the joint resolution shall be considered as read the the rule waves All Points of order against Provisions in the joint resolution the rule provides one hour of General debate equally divided and controll by the chair and ranking minority member of the committee on Energy and Commerce or their respective design the rule provides one motion to recommit the rule further provides for consideration of hjr 61 providing for Congressional disapproval under chapter 8 of Title 5 United States code of the rule submitted by the Environmental Protection Agency
▶ 1:34:53relating to National emission standards for hazardous air pollutants rubber Tower manufacturing under a closed rule the rule waves All Points of order against consideration of the joint resolution the rule provides that the joint resolution shall be considered as read the rule waves All Points of order against Provisions in the joint resolution the rule provides one hour of General debate equally divided and control by the chair and ranking minority member of the committee on Energy and Commerce or their respective designes the rule provides one motion to recommit the rule further provides for consideration of Senate joint
▶ 1:35:23resolution 11 providing for Congressional disapproval under chapter 8 of Title 5 United States code of the rule submitted by the Bureau of ocean Energy Management relating to protection of marine archaeological resources under a closed rule the rule waves All Points of order against consideration of the joint resolution the rule provides that the joint resolution shall be considered as read the rule waves All Points of order against Provisions in the joint resolution the rule provides one hour of General debate equally divided and control by the chair and ranking minority member member
▶ 1:35:53of the committee on natural resources or their respective designes finally the rule provides one motion to commit thank you very much you now heard the motion is there any discussion Madam chair just to just I want to make sure I'm clear um all three measures that are uh that we discussed today are being brought to the floor under closed rules am I
▶ 1:36:24correct I I just I just want to again say that's unfortunate given the fact that there were no hearings on any of these matters or no markups in the committee of jurisdiction but uh thank you for that clarification thank you Mr McGovern um hearing no further discussion the question is on the motion from the gentleman from Virginia all those in favor sign signify by saying I I those opposed say no no no in the
▶ 1:36:54opinion chair the eyes have it the motion is agreed to roll call a recorded vote has been requested the clerk will call the rooll Mrs fishbach yes Mrs fishbach I Mr Norman hi Mr Norman I Mr Roy hi Mr Roy I Mrs hin hi Mrs hon I Mr Langworthy Mr Scott Mr Griffith Mr Scott I Mr Griffith I Mr Griffith I Mr Jack I Mr Jack I Mr McGovern no Mr McGovern no Miss ganin no Miss ganin no Mr nigus
▶ 1:37:25Miss lger Fernandez no Miss lger Fernandez no Madam chair I Madam chair I the clerk will report the total eight Ys three Nays the eyes have at the motion to report is agreed to accordingly Mr Langworthy will be managing this rule for the majority and Mr ngus will be man managing it for the minority thank you very much without objection the committee is adjourned
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