▶ 0:08:26Well, good morning uh and uh Madam Secretary, welcome to the subcommittee on Labor, Health, and Human Services and Education. We're honored to have you here today and u as you know it's a busy day today on Capitol Hill but we look very forward to your testimony and talking about the Department of Education and um and as we hear more about the Department of Education's budget request for FY26.
▶ 0:08:51Um Secretary McMahon has wasted no time implementing President Trump's bold agenda to restore education to the states and I want to commend her for her efforts on hitting the ground running. Uh first I need I think we need to acknowledge the situation that the Trump administration had to face on day one and that was plummeting test scores for K through 12 students and millions of bars who had never paid $1 on their student loans.
▶ 0:09:20This subcommittee examined a number of these problems earlier this year. Despite increasing federal spending on education, our students are not getting ahead academically. In fact, despite record spending, they have lost ground compared to other nations around the world. The the latest National Assessment of Education Progress course shows that onethird of eighth graders nationwide are reading below the basic level.
▶ 0:09:49Student test scores overall are below the 2019 levels and evidence that students have not recovered from the pandemic despite 200 billion in federal COVID education spending. This was on top of annual federal spending for education, including almost 19 billion for title one schools. Most alarming the score the scores reveal a widening achievement gap in reading.
▶ 0:10:19For example, lower performing students in the fourth and the eighth grade scored lower than students back in 1992, more than 30 years ago. Students deserve better. But ever increasing federal spending has not proven to be the solution.
▶ 0:10:37Just earlier this year, one expert told the subcommittee that education spending per pupil has more than tripled in real terms since Lyndon Johnson's war on poverty began back in 1965. More spending yet worse results. Students need reading, writing, math, and critical thinking for everyday activities to succeed in their jobs and to make life's big decisions.
▶ 0:11:03Too many schools encouraged and fac and facilitated by federal funding have let things like social justice advocacy, divisive issues crowd out the focus on teaching students and the core subjects. Thankfully, some states have pursued choice options for students whose traditional public schools have not served them well, including through charter schools.
▶ 0:11:28Department data shows that as of 2021, public charter schools enrollment had more than doubled from a decade before, growing by about two million students, while enrollment at traditional public schools declined by 4%. I look forward uh hearing from you, Madam Secretary, about increased support for charter schools.
▶ 0:11:52However, this administration sees value in reassessing our approach so we can do better for all students around the country. It is also rec it's also recognized a limited role for education. After all, only about one in 10 education dollars come from the US federal government. Education fundamentally remains within the purview of the states and the local communities.
▶ 0:12:20At the same time, I should note that we can still make priority key areas such as support for schools that are near federal military installations and underresourced schools in rural areas while limiting the overall federal role. In higher education, there are bright spots with bipartisan support such as PEL grants which help lower income students pay for college.
▶ 0:12:46The prior administration some some way made a broken financial aid system worse, injecting more politics into the student loan program. The the disastrous federal loan program is the direct results of of the partisan affordable care act which included a Washington takeover of student loans. As we all know, a Washington takeover of anything is rarely a good idea.
▶ 0:13:14The ACA converted the guaranteed loan program into a federallyun program. At the same time, members of Congress were told that it would save $60 billion over 10 years. However, in projections released last year, the CBO reported that it expects the government will lose 18 cents on every dollar it lends in 2025. Not a dollar of savings to be had.
▶ 0:13:42Thankfully, the Republicanled con uh reconciliation efforts this year seeks to address some of these shortcomings. Against this backdrop, the prior administration put untold amounts of taxpayer resources into executive actions, waiverss, and programs it created without congressional authority to try to cancel loans and make loan payments more uh generous.
▶ 0:14:07It told bars that forgiveness was always on the while also going through the motions to restart repayment. The results, massive uh confusion for 43 million borrowers who were supposed to begin monthly payments after more than three years. Pause. The confusion and loan and the loan servicing system.
▶ 0:14:29Because of the mass confusion that was created under the previous administration, the department estimates nearly that one in four of these borrowers, more than 10 million people are in default or laid on their payments, putting them at risk of future default. Just 38% or 16 million borrowers are in repayment on their current loans.
▶ 0:14:53Secretary McMahon, you have inherited um an absolute mess in the department, but I hope you can correct the course. Uh you have taken swift action to restore common sense to our college campuses. The department has made clear that all students should be able to assess access their campuses without fear of their safety while still allowing peaceful exercise of free speech.
▶ 0:15:17Too many students in recent memory have been subjected to severe campus disruption, including at some of our nation's most elite universities. The department has also taken steps to return to the original purpose of Title N, ensuring that women and girls have equal opportunity to compete in sports. I would also like to thank you and President Trump for your actions to protect women and girls in sports.
▶ 0:15:44Madam Secretary, thank you for your department's bold initiative as you carry out President's um the president's America's first agenda. We must consider new approaches to long-standing problems, both for the sake of our students and to be good stewards of the taxpayer dollars. Uh I look forward to working with you and I look forward to your testimony this morning. And with that, now I'd like to recognize the ranking member Rosa Deloro uh for her opening statement.
▶ 0:16:15Thank you very much uh Mr. Chairman and to you and to our uh the secretary. My apologies for being late. Um but I want to thank you Chairman Aberholt for uh holding this critically important hearing on the Trump administration's budget request for the Department of Education. Secretary McMahon, uh good morning. I welcome you to the House Appropriations Committee for your first budget hearing as Secretary of Education. Public education is deeply important to me.
▶ 0:16:43When I was a kid, uh my mother took me to work with her. She worked in the old sweat shops in the city of New Haven and I know you know Connecticut. Um and the conditions there were horrific, dangerously hot, unsanitary. Um mostly immigrant women bent over sewing machines trying to pump out the dresses as fast as they could because they're on peace work.
▶ 0:17:04If you know anything about the uh needle trades, you get your finger caught in those high-powered machines, you just pull back, you wrap your hand up because if you get a drop of blood on the garment, you uh you don't get paid for it. Um and uh recognized her madness, the method to her madness when she uh asked me to be there every day after school. Uh and what she said to me is get an education so that you don't have to do this.
▶ 0:17:32My dad came as an immigrant from Italy in 1913, was put in the seventh grade. He couldn't read or write the language. They laughed at him, his teachers and his classmates. He left school in the seventh grade and went never went back to formal education. He served in the United States military, served on the city council in New Haven uh and uh always um uh was invested in his community.
▶ 0:17:57And again, he said to me, "Get an education." and he said, "If you get an education, you can make $10,000 a year." So, the whole issue of public education was critical to me and to my parents as they sacrificed to get me the finest of educations and to allow me to realize my dreams and my aspirations. And that's true of the uh nine out of 10 students in our country who attend public schools.
▶ 0:18:22And it's true the stories of of pretty much the entire population of the understanding that what public education means to their lives uh and how it is the key uh to success. And I might just say that this budget in my view should be described as leaving every child behind. And that is why I strongly oppose your proposal to cut investments in education of our nation's children by 12 billion dollars or 15%.
▶ 0:18:52It is clear that your mission is to dismantle our federal investments in the nation's public education. You and President Trump explicitly seek to eliminate the Department of Education, which Republicans have proposed for decades. But let me be clear with you. You will not have the partnership of Congress in your efforts to destroy the pub the department of education and eliminate public education in this nation. Not on our watch.
▶ 0:19:22We will go over your plans to suffocate your own department and slash our investments in the education of our children and in students hoping to obtain a college degree. But before we discuss next year, I want to talk about what you're doing right now. The American people demand help with the cost of living, but President Trump is not laser focused on the cost of living. He is actually making it worse.
▶ 0:19:48He promised to fight for the middle class and working families, but instead put Elon Musk and wealthy billionaires like yourself in charge of the government that is meant to be of and by and for the American people. Madam Secretary, the administration is recklessly and unlawfully freezing and stealing congressionally appropriated funds from agencies, programs, and services across the government that serve the American people.
▶ 0:20:15You, President Trump, and Elon Musk are attacking public education to pay for tax cuts you stand directly to benefit from. Congress alone holds the power of the purse. It is right there in the constitution. Article one, section 9, clause 7. Congress, not the president, determines how the taxpayers dollars are spent. The law of the land is the 2024 budget.
▶ 0:20:45We are living in 2025 under a continuing resolution that carries forward the 2024 budget. And that is the law that you are bound to follow. Furthermore, the Department of Education was created by the Congress and it can only be undone by the Congress. Under your leadership, the Department of the Department, hundreds of millions of dollars have been frozen and entire programs have been terminated.
▶ 0:21:15Funding for vital research, protection of students, civil rights, and programs that support the recruitment and professional development of effective educators have been terminated. Madam Secretary of Congress agreed with your determinations that these programs do not deserve funding. We would have decreased the funding for these accounts accordingly. We did not. Nor did we remove funding for the department staff. But you took it upon yourself to eliminate half of the Department of Education's workforce.
▶ 0:21:46By recklessly incapacitating the department you lead, you are usurping Congress's authority and infringing on Congress's power of the purse. and you will continue to lose these battles in the courts.
▶ 0:22:00You have been blocked from letting Doge access student loan borrowers private information, from interfering with local school curricula, from punishing school districts for curricula you disagree with, and from stealing COVID release relief aid from states and school districts, and there are many more. For as long as you continue to deliberately and flagrantly defy the law, you will continue to lose in court.
▶ 0:22:24But let us be clear about who is losing most of all and that's the children and the families of this country. The consequences will be felt by students losing access to school psychologists, counselors and social workers due to your shameful decision to cancel hundreds of grants for mental health services in public schools.
▶ 0:22:44These grants were created and funded by a bipartisan basis of this subcommittee and the bipartisan safer communities, including a mental health program that I created after hearing how desperately it was needed in schools Connecticut. We are not talking about hypotheticals of whatifs or worst case scenario. This lawless and cruel destruction has happened and is happening under your watch today.
▶ 0:23:13Turning to your budget request for 2026, I want to note that the administration has provided sparse detail about your proposal to cut the Department of Education by $12 billion. We have no idea where that 12 billion is coming from.
▶ 0:23:32A central component of your plan for elementary and secondary education is to eliminate 18 unspecified competitive and formula grant programs, replace them with a $2 billion Brock grant to states. Yet at the same time, you propose that we provide $4.5 billion less to educate our nation's children overall. A block grant is a cut. All of my colleagues here know that the states cannot afford to pick up the slack.
▶ 0:24:02Your visions for students aspiring to access and pay for college is particularly grim. You take away need-based financial aid for 1.7 million students and you eliminate the federal work study program opportunities for more than 500,000 students who need it to help finance their education.
▶ 0:24:25They are from working families, middleclass families, vulnerable families, and they work in order to be able to pay for their education. These are students from working-class families. They're working their way through college. You know, some families do not need financial assistance to go to college, but that's not true for the rest.
▶ 0:24:50Madam Secretary, in the middle of a cost of living crisis, you are pulling up the ladder for everyone who has not found their way to extraordinary wealth or even enough to simply make ends meet. What will happen if you get your way? What will happen if your department is dismantled and our investments in education vanish?
▶ 0:25:12Secretary, your grandchildren, my grandchildren, Elon Musk's grandchildren, President Trump's grandchildren will be just fine. But it's the children of the grandchildren of hardworking Americans will suffer and they will fall further behind those whose families enjoy enormous wealth and privilege. I do not believe the American people want larger classes, fewer teachers, but that is exactly what you are aiming to deliver.
▶ 0:25:41I do not believe students and families want you to turn a blind eye to predatory for-profit charter schools and colleges, but you appear prepared to continue to let scammers steal the money and the educational dreams of hardworking families and aspiring graduates. I understand the administration is eager to find a way to give yourselves a tax cut, but by doing so and dismantling public education is indefensible. Your actions are lawless.
▶ 0:26:11They of disdain for public education and they are hurting the most vulnerable in our nation. Education is not a handout. Education is not waste, fraud, or abuse. As a leading Democrat on the appropriations committee, I assure you that I will never stop fighting against this dangerous dismantling of public education which is undermining and jeopardizing the futures of millions of children in this country.
▶ 0:26:40I look forward to your testimony and I yield back. Uh thank you uh ranking member and u I now would like to turn to our witness secretary McMahon and u you'll have five minutes to deliver your opening remarks. Uh you've submitted written testimony. It will be included in the full record. Uh but uh we do recognize you and look forward to your comments. Thank you very much Chairman Adhold Ranking Member Deloro and distinguished members of the subcommittee.
▶ 0:27:10Thank you for having me today to represent a department on a mission. Its final mission to wind down the Department of Education responsibly, cut waste, and give education back to the states, parents, and educators, all in a lawful fashion. With your partnership, the fiscical year 26 budget will take a significant step toward that goal.
▶ 0:27:32We seek to shrink federal bureaucracy, save taxpayer money, and empower states who best know their local needs to manage education in this country. We have reviewed our programs and identified spending that does not fulfill the mandate of trust the American people have placed in President Trump.
▶ 0:27:51We've reduced a department that was overstaffed by thousands of positions, cut old contracts that were enriching private parties at taxpayer expense, suspended grants for illegal programs, and now are putting forward a budget request that reduces department funding by more than 15%. At the same time, we're working to make American education great again.
▶ 0:28:16In our conversations with governors, teachers, and parents across the country, we hear calls for accountability and more local control. That's our goal. To give parents access to the quality education their kids deserve, to fix the broken higher education industry that has misled students into degrees that don't pay off, and to create safe learning environments for our students.
▶ 0:28:41We're holding institutions to account when they facilitate discriminatory or hostile environments on campus. A level playing field with limitless opportunity is a vision I think we all can share. Our budget reflects this vision. It cuts its cuts reflect a bureaucracy that is getting out of the way.
▶ 0:29:03and its continuations and increases represent smart spending that will help improve student achievement, not serve bureaucratic interests. Our goal is clear. Make education better, fairer, and more accountable by ending federal overreach and empowering families, schools, and states who best know the needs of their students. I'm eager to partner with you to make this vision of the future a reality and to ensure every child is part of it.
▶ 0:29:33Thank you and I look forward to your questions. Thank you, Madam Secretary. And again, we appreciate your attendance here today before the subcommittee. Um the uh latest u national assessment of education progress uh report um our uh results are quite honestly pretty unacceptable.
▶ 0:29:55Uh too many students have fallen behind in basic uh subjects and they have not realigned learning the loss during the time of the pandemic. for the sake of students and their parents. Um, I appreciate your call for bold change.
▶ 0:30:10As we re-examine our approach to education, I think it's important to recognize that we can appropriately limit the federal role in education while continuing support in key areas as I mentioned earlier, schools near military installations and underresourced rural schools. Uh could you talk to us a little bit about the department's plan to refocus on the core educational achievement while reducing the bure bureaucracy overall? Sure.
▶ 0:30:40Well, I have uh thank you. Thank you very much. And I have uh I have really three priorities uh as the secretary of education and that is to uh increase school choice but I really want to focus everything we're doing our competitive grants on literacy. I think that is the absolute basis of what we need to do. We want to we want to increase school choice for students so that we don't have children trapped in our failing schools.
▶ 0:31:10And we want to return education to the states. And that's really our priority. So it's three-fold and very simple. Let's focus on literacy. What we're seeing in those scores that you're talking about, Congressman Adhalt, is a failing of our students to learn to read. From first through third grade or preK into third grade, you're learning to read. And after that, you are reading to learn. And if you cannot read, you cannot learn.
▶ 0:31:37And that is one of the reasons I believe sincerely that we have seen such decreases or failing in our schools because we are not teaching our children to read. We've lost the fundamental basics. And I want to see our schools return to the science of reading, which focuses on phonics, which focuses on understanding and fluency in reading.
▶ 0:31:59Because if we can get that right, I think we're going to see a great deal of improvement in our schools across our country, but we're not doing it. And I think there have been programs that have been tried with the best of intentions, but they've not succeeded. Here we are today uh with a department of education that was really stood up in 1980 by President Carter. We've spent over $3 trillion during that time and every year we have seen our scores continue to either stagnate or fall.
▶ 0:32:29It is clear that we are not doing something right. We need a change. We need a shakeup. We need to do things differently than what we're doing. And let's get back and focus on what was successful. Let's focus on our public schools as well as charter schools uh as well as other schools that can deliver homeschooling.
▶ 0:32:52Uh the president is uh focused on making sure that children have the right to an education that is best for them and that parents should be deciding where their children can go to school and get the best education. They should have those opportunities whether they're private schools, charter schools, public schools, homeschooling. They need to have the choice so that they can succeed. I believe that parents know what's best for their children.
▶ 0:33:21I think that parents working with local educators, local superintendents can develop those programs for schools which will deliver the best results. The president and I certainly agreed that the best education is that that is closest to the child. Who better to know and understand what a child's needs are than that teacher working in the classroom than that parent in cooperation with the teachers in that classroom to help understand what that child needs.
▶ 0:33:48So clearly u my focus is definitely going to continue on bringing education closest to the states and I like you um ranking member Delaro and a pro am a product of public school systems. My parents had dreams for me as well. I was an only child and uh they really wanted to make sure that I went to college and had the opportunity for the American dream. So I appreciate very much that background and uh where you were coming from as well. Thank you very much.
▶ 0:34:17Um I noted earlier in my comments about one quarter of the federal student loan uh portfolio portfolio is in default or late stage of delinquency. uh borrowers who are uh very behind on their repayments u would be in this category. Only about four and 10 borrowers are um actually in repayment or current on their loans.
▶ 0:34:39Um and I think we need to be clear the impact of this situation sets in motion by that was set in motion by the previous administration u is both individual and corporate. individuals across the country are at risk of damaging their own credit ratings and going into default.
▶ 0:34:57Uh this kind of financial damage can be devastating to countless constituents across the country and our country is at risk of losing billions of dollars because of the previous administration's disastrous messaging about loan forgiveness and repayment.
▶ 0:35:11Uh just at my time is uh uh fading away, but if you could just briefly tell us how the department is facilitating an orderly return to repayment, including directing struggling bars to available resources to help them get back on track. Well, thank you. And I think that is one of the keys. We are directing them through our website, studentaid.gov. they can go and look at the different payment option plans that they can be uh part of to repay their loan.
▶ 0:35:41You're absolutely correct that we have lost uh hundreds of millions of dollars. I understand that COVID uh was part of some of those programs. Uh it was right I think to take a step back during COVID but once CO ended ended we should have resumed collection on those payments and voluntary payments. And I do believe that the past administration with confusing messages that they were sending about loans being forgiven, etc. I'm not too sure why anybody would have stepped up and paid if they thought it was going to be forgiven.
▶ 0:36:09But we've put a program back on track now. We sent letters on May 5th. We're working through Treasury through their collection efforts to make sure that we uh have programs to collect that money. And I can report that today since uh May 5th and those letters going out, we have now collected almost hundred million dollars uh in in back loans. Some on a voluntary basis and then some is restructuring the way those folks are going to repaying their loans. So we're on the right track to get that.
▶ 0:36:39My time's expired and uh like I said, we'll we'll uh every member will be recognized five minutes. I I'm one to uh understand that there are uh sometimes u the secretary can be in a finishing a question and we uh so I won't gabble down exactly five minutes but I would ask you to be respectful of of of the chairman as I do this to not go over too much. So when I start tapping if you could start winding up I would uh sincerely appreciate it with that ranking member Delaro.
▶ 0:37:10Thank you very much um Mr. Chairman, I I just might um quickly make this comment. Madam Secretary, the state and local taxes today overwhelmingly pay for education in this country. Um Madam Secretary, you testify that we should not quote spend money without correcting underlying problems. That's what I love about serving on the appropriations committee. We delivering appropriations to correct underlying problems. We have a nationwide psychologist, counselor, social worker shortage in our schools.
▶ 0:37:40Which is why this subcommittee worked with Secretary DVOS to create new school-based mental health grants, bipartisan grants funded by Congress for years, the very grants that you canled on the eve of the National Mental Health Awareness Month. What is the quote underlying problem you thought we were not correcting when you canceled $1 billion in grants to train and increase school-based mental health uh professionals nationwide? Well, thanks very much for that question.
▶ 0:38:09Um I think when we look at mental health nationwide, uh it undertakes many particular facets. We have to understand in the communities I do realize that there are shortages of teachers, there are shortages of uh of healthcare workers. Um, but I think what we need to focus on is what are the needs of the community? Uh, how can how can they best be served? And uh, and so we want to make sure that we have health care professionals in place.
▶ 0:38:36But um, what we were finding was there were a lot of instances where the money was not being used really for health care programs. But I think we if we are looking at health care, we would look more I think at funding locally so that people can be brought in.
▶ 0:38:52Excuse me for interrupting because the chairman has talked about time, but it would then be very happy if you could provide to us one of the things we can't seem to get any information on is why the programs were canceled, what criteria was used in order to for you to say yay or nay to a program. So, that information would be enormously helpful.
▶ 0:39:14Um, I I would just thank um I I I I I don't I don't know, but I know the state of Wisconsin here had multiple grants canceled that have reduced the ratio of mental health professionals to students by more than 10%. We you've not answered the question about uh the the issue of mental health and that we've got a a nationwide problem in mental health and we've let all these people go.
▶ 0:39:36Guilford County, North Carolina, used their grant to help provide mental health services to a thousand additional students, reducing rates of chronic absenteeism. Did you consider the success of these programs before you cancelled them? Well, they've not been cancelled. Uh they are continuing at this point, but uh but they might not be continued as we go forward. And I will get back to you on that. Well, please do because these grants, as I understand it, were cancelled, as I said, on the eve of the National Mental Health Awareness.
▶ 0:40:07So, and in Wisconsin, the grants were cancelled. North Carolina, there are many, many other examples of grants that were canceled, and we too will look into the uh of that that effort. In 2024 2025, Congress appropriated more than $200 million for school-based mental health services grants and the mental health service professional demonstration grants. Are you freezing or withholding funding that Congress appropriated in 2025 for mental health services for students?
▶ 0:40:37Do you commit to us to following the law, fully obligating the funding that Congress appropriated for mental health services for students and to obligate those funds by September 30th of this year? Or are you planning to break the law by impounding congressionally appropriated funds? Well, I can I can certainly report to you um ranking member that we are evaluating every single program. We're looking at it very carefully.
▶ 0:41:03We are uh we are continuing or not continuing some funds as we look at them and as we go forward in the budget. I am happy to get back to you but the point is careful evaluation of the programs that are going forward. With all due respect this is money that was appropriated appropriated it is in the uh uh budget which is what we are now dealing with.
▶ 0:41:28And so my I have to understand from your your your answer that in fact you are not going to abide maybe you're not going to abide by the 2024 number. So that means that you plan to break the law by impounding congressionary congressionally appropriated funds. Um I I yes or no we are going to abide by the law.
▶ 0:41:52you're go then that means I just want to just say that means that you are going to spend the dollars appropriated by this subcommittee to carry out those programs as directed in the 2024 budget that we are living under for 2025. So that means by September 30th that that money will be expended for all of the programs that are listed. We will abide by the law. Okay.
▶ 0:42:23Thank you. I'm happy to do that. Will we have a second round, Mr. Chairman? We're going to try. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Milanar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Madam Secretary, appreciate you being with us today. Uh I along with Senator Tim Scott, co-chair the school choice caucus. And I was really pleased to hear your priorities, your focus on accountability, local control, empowering parents and students.
▶ 0:42:52And um one of the things that become clear, very clear to me is this need for families to have options and and you've spelled out a number of different options that are available. Can you tell me what you plan to do and any initiatives you might take that would expand options for parents and students? Well, certainly we are going to support and I you look at the uh the numbers are in the president's budget.
▶ 0:43:19He's also uh including an increase of $60 million for charter schools. The president absolutely believes, as do I, that the more choice that parents have, the better off the students are. And we've seen that repeatedly in different states. Um Governor Reynolds in Iowa has talked about how in introducing school choice programs uh in her state that public schools have improved. There's competition among the schools.
▶ 0:43:46Uh scores are better when they have the opportunity, you know, to compete and and schools can do what they need. And parents can put they can put students where they know they will thrive uh in different whatever whatever that school program is. I mean, we've looked at different schools. I was talking to Governor Stit from Oklahoma yesterday, and he was telling me about um one of the special schools that they've set up in Oklahoma is relative to uh I'll forget the exact title, but it was uh it was mechanics for for airplanes.
▶ 0:44:16And he said, "Look, in my community, this is very very strong." And so part of the schooling that we are developing for those is to having these students in secondary education already looking at these kind of programs so that when they graduate they're ready to move right into the economy. So I think I think we have to reimagine education totally because look when I was coming along when my kids were coming along everything I said to them was you need to go to college.
▶ 0:44:43you have to have a four-year college degree in order to get a foot in the door to start your, you know, to start your life, to make a good wage. And while I still believe in secondary educ and higher education for many, many students, I think that's not the right pathway for every single student. And I think we need to focus on their programs in those communities, in those schools, and give local communities the opportunity to develop their curriculum.
▶ 0:45:10as I mentioned with Governor Stit around what is necessary needs for their community. We'll have more success. We'll have higher graduation rates. We'll have students stay in school when they can focus on subjects that are of interest to them. And I just think that that's going to be incredibly important as we move forward and how we look at our education Thank you very much.
▶ 0:45:33Uh I want to turn to uh the influence of the Chinese Communist Party and our educational system. Two years ago I asked your predecessor uh Secretary Kardona if he was aware of efforts by the Chinese Communist Party to influence the US education system and I was surprised he told me he wasn't really aware of that. Are you familiar with the efforts uh by the CCP to influence American education?
▶ 0:46:02by things I've have heard. Yes. And one of the things that we are stressing very very much under section 117 is to make sure that these colleges and universities are complying with the law and reporting to us uh when they have received donations over the $250,000 minimum. We found that there are many that are not doing that.
▶ 0:46:23One of the things that uh that we've put in place uh is to make sure that as you're as universities are looking at their hiring practices, what kind of vetting are they doing uh with those particular professors that are they're bringing in or students that might be coming in on campus? What can be that effect and that influence? But it is very important I think for us to know uh how much money is coming in from foreign countries. Thank you.
▶ 0:46:50Last year, our select committee on the Chinese Communist Party released a report uh CCP on the quad and it detailed how federally funded research at universities has advanced the CCP's military goals. We also highlighted concerns about how many American universities have joint institutes in China where they partner with Chinese universities.
▶ 0:47:14As a result of this scrutiny from our committee, uh, UC Berkeley, uh, University of Michigan, Georgia Tech, and Oakland University have all ended these joint institutes, and there are a number more that could be ended.
▶ 0:47:30Um, I'm asking if you would consider leading an effort across the administration to work with those remaining universities with joint institutes to close them so we don't have continued uh, efforts by our in many cases taxpayer dollars helping with the Chinese military industrial uh, complex funding.
▶ 0:47:53Well, we certainly are investigating a lot of those universities who do still have those ties and I do I would like to work with you to make sure that we are operating our universities in the best interest of the people of the United States and our government. Thank you. And and uh I'm sure the Confucious Institutes uh uh are on your radar screen. Uh sometimes their efforts morph into something uh very similar uh called the Confucious Classroom.
▶ 0:48:22Uh, is that something that we can work with you on to prevent that malign influence into our K12 system? Sure. I'd like to and enjoy working with you on that. Thank you very much. I yield back, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much. And again, uh, as I promised, I came back.
▶ 0:48:46The president instructed you to take all necessary steps to facilitate the closure of the Department of Education. Uh did you check with your council or legal adviserss as to whether or not you had authority to accomplish that request? The president's uh executive order and his direction to me was to take those steps to lawfully uh shut down the Department of Education and to work with Congress to do that.
▶ 0:49:14I understand what you said, but his quote was, "Take all necessary steps to facilitate the closure of the Department of Education." It was not, as you suggest from the reading of his quote and his executive order, um, inclusive of consistent with the law. But that's your interpretation of what he said? I I would like to look at it again and get back to you.
▶ 0:49:40But I do believe he said to lawfully close down the Department of Education, at least let me rephrase and say that is clearly his direction to me. We both know and understand that the Department of Education cannot be closed unless Congress votes to do that. So my goal when I came on board and he asked me how I thought we might could do that and I said my goal would be to work with Congress so that we could have transparent programs.
▶ 0:50:04I would like to at the end of this program that I'm working on as we try to bring up our test scores and work with our local states uh to bring education back to the states to make sure that states have best practices and the tools to deliver those best practices. And so by sharing them with Congress, I would hope that Congress would look at them and say, you know, eventually I believe that this is going to be in the best interest of our students. This is not taking away funding.
▶ 0:50:32This is having funding go to the states for you know for title 1A for idea that is continuing it may flow through in a different trunch. Okay we as you know we have time constraints. Okay I hear you. Um, having said that, does the budget that is submitted to the Congress of the United States for fiscal year 26 include full funding for those programs that the Congress has authorized and directed be established and carried
▶ 0:51:02out? Well, as you know, um, uh, Congressman, we are dealing with the skinny budget at this point. Not all of the programs have been put into the full budget of the president, but I can tell you that the title one a funding and IDA funding is fully funded uh under the Let me ask you about that.
▶ 0:51:21I have a table that shows me about $4.3 billion were established for those programs and are going to be those 18 programs to which I think you refer are going to be uh put down into a single grant of $2 billion. Uh can you tell me now that's a 2.3 billion that's about a 55 60% Uh what will not be done?
▶ 0:51:52Excuse me. Is a accurate that we've taken 4.3 down to 2.8 or two two two billion. Is that accurate? Well, let's be clear about one thing though. The title one a funding and IDA funding is in full. Correct. So they're not part of the 18 that is being compressed. So the the 18 programs that you mentioned Yes.
▶ 0:52:16are really they will will be compressed into two billion dollars which will operate like a block grant to the states where I think they can best be utilized by understanding what is needed in the states and the communities.
▶ 0:52:29So when you say we're not I understand title one uh but comp almost always when we talk about block granting programs we make very very substantial substantive cuts in the availability of resources for the programs that are covered. That is my reading of uh 18 programs going into which we are now spending 4.3 billion on down to2 billion dollars.
▶ 0:52:58It seems to me that is uh eliminating very substantially without authority from the Congress programs that the Congress has enabled and directed be undertaken for the American people. Well, let's look at it this way if we could.
▶ 0:53:16We are eliminating regulations and red tape that a lot of these different grants had with them and therefore they're going to require less compliance with regulations in order to fulfill the mission of those grants. Madam if I could just finish this one thing. Sure. Uh one stat that I think was uh impressive to me was that 47 cents of every dollar that goes in for these kinds of programs is spent on regulatory compliance. We want to get rid of that.
▶ 0:53:46Let the money flow to the states. And I think we're going to see more money available in the states with less red tape. Um, my time has expired, but I came here in 81. President Reagan talked about getting rid of fraud, waste, and abuse. Uh, the deficit was increased by 189% under President Reagan. Fraud, waste, and abuse.
▶ 0:54:14Nobody on this panel on this side or that side wants to have fraud, waste, and abuse. We all agree on that. That is not what you're cutting out when you take 55% or 60% reduction in 18 programs. I you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Secretary, for being here this morning with us.
▶ 0:54:41So, let me start by saying it's amazing to me that our colleagues on the other side of the aisle want to defend an agency that I believe has become an abject failure. If you look at the stats of students across the United States, the reading scores have plummeted, the math scores have plummeted, we are not doing well in science, and we have to do something different.
▶ 0:55:07you mentioned um Oklahoma and Governor and in Oklahoma we've we have certainly adopted charter school uh programs and have expanded school choice and I think it's important to talk about why school choice is so important.
▶ 0:55:25you have students attending Good Shepard, which is a school in Oklahoma that is focused on making sure that our um students with developmental disabilities, particularly with autism, have the opportunity to attend a school that meets their needs. You have Mission Academy, which is a school that uh helps children who are battling substance abuse.
▶ 0:55:49It's a very unique environment for them to be able to leave a public school in many cases they've been in and be able to get a specialized education but also address the issues of substance abuse um with these young people. So, I applaud what you're trying to do. I think it's important that we look at the results. That's what we're looking for here. as a as a mother myself who decided to send my children to a private Catholic school because I wanted them to get a uh faith-based education, that was my choice.
▶ 0:56:20Uh and I appreciate that. And it is frustrating to me to hear my um you know talk about how great education is when we know the numbers say something very different. So I want to start with that. Um, I applaud your efforts to return education to the states and reduce the bloated DC bureaucracy. In 2023, the average US Department of Ed employee $112,000.
▶ 0:56:49And the average teacher in my home state of Oklahoma made 61,000. As you know, under President Trump, the department was the smallest cabinet level agency, but controlled the sixth largest budget. I would like you to maybe in more detail describe some of the reforms you're implementing to cut waste, fraud, and abuse at the department and return education to the states.
▶ 0:57:11And particularly, I want to make it very clear, you said something in a previous response that I think is worth noting, and that is you are not eliminating title 1A funding and you are not eliminating IDA funding, which is important to to students um and families in my state. But can you elaborate a little bit on what you're looking at restructuring for the Department of Ed? Certainly.
▶ 0:57:31Well, well, first of all, um we did look at numbers of employees we had at the department of education and and based on the fact that we are looking to wind down the department. Uh we started looking at was there overlap uh in the number of people that we had. So we did we did reduce the department by about half and we but we brought some back when we really evaluated all of our programs. I think we we've looked at them very carefully.
▶ 0:58:00We wanted to make sure we had the right number of people doing the right number of jobs. We are doing that. We are delivering uh on all of our statutoily required uh programs. We haven't missed a beat on those. Um and so I'm happy to report that. And um so I think that was but that that was a big thing. But but when you also look at rent, when you look at utilities, when you look at building space, we've decreased that footprint. So we're having savings there. But other ways we're looking at savings.
▶ 0:58:30We have examined some of the contracts. One of the one of the things we've talked about here are the NAPE scores, the nation's report card. And I want to assure everyone the NAPE scores are going to continue. The contracts are in place to take us through the next four or five years. It is important to have a national report card.
▶ 0:58:46But what we find what we found out in looking at all of the IEES contracts was that we were spending about a billion dollars a year on programs and contracts and surveys and research that stayed on the shelves in schools. Teachers didn't use them. Other other superintendents didn't use them. So, we've taken a good close look at that. And as we enter into the new contracts, we've cut that by over 40% already.
▶ 0:59:13So that's that is one big cost savings and those are the kinds of things we're doing. We're taking a look at what has just been kind of status quo. We can no longer have status quo. Thank you for that. And one quick um other point I want to bring up and I don't think we have time for a full response but um under the Biden administration there were 2500 anti-semitic incidents on college campuses and K through2 schools.
▶ 0:59:39Um, I have a uh friend who lives here in the Washington DC metro area. His daughters were attending a public school. Uh, they are Jewish. They were targeted by other students. The public school did nothing. Uh, and they they were forced to remove their children from that public school and put them in a private school. So, I hope you will continue to fight um to stand up for our friends uh so that they don't continue to see this anti-semitic rhetoric across the country in schools. So, with that, Mr. Mr.
▶ 1:00:07Chairman, I Mr. Pokean. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you, Madam Secretary. No, I think it's my question time if I can. They'll start the clock. I just don't want to lose my clock. And if we could do short-term answers rather than long-term ones, too. That'd be helpful just because I got a lot of like to talk about. Um, let's talk about waste fraud abuse a little more about Doge. Uh, so you fired 1300 people. Another 600 people took Elon Musk's deferred resignation offer.
▶ 1:00:38Um, did you fire the people or did Doge fire the people? I'm not completely clear on that. Most, excuse me, most of uh that restructuring happened under the uh acting short-term. Did you fire or did fire? Well, I'm going to tell you who I fired. I know. That's why I'm trying to get shortterm questions. One or the other, right? You're using our time. So, uh we um most of that was done before I came on board. However, the decisions in the department I run I run the department. Doge does not run the department. Okay. So, you didn't answer the question.
▶ 1:01:07Did you fire them or did Doge? That's real simple. Some a good majority of that happened before I came on board. Okay. A good majority. Twothirds, threequarters. Yes, I'd say. Okay. Fair. Okay. Um, and how many times did you meet with Elon Musk? I met with Mr. Musk probably three to four times now. Okay. uh not including when I was on the transition committee and had several opportunities to speak with him. Sure.
▶ 1:01:30And then if I understand it right on your um Department of Education employee roster, you have right now at least is about 16 Doge employees. Is that correct? Right now working with you. I can get back to you to the exact number. I don't think it's that high, but we do have they are employees. Those that we have are employees of the federal. And when you did their background checks to see how they're qualified about education, how many had undergraduate degrees and how many had graduate degrees in education? I can get back to you on that. Okay. So, you don't know off hand? No. Did you ask that question? No. No. Okay.
▶ 1:01:59Um, did you ask if any of them were teachers previously? Uh, I did not interview those people that are part of the Doge group. And did did you ask if any of them worked in schools? Did you know for their I had a conversation with one of them yesterday who did have a background in education, technology education, and had worked across several different aspects and was really schooling me a little bit on some of the AI things that we could bring in. So, one of them had a good background. Good. Um, any of them work in universities that you know of prior? Uh, I don't know. Okay.
▶ 1:02:30Um, fair enough. Uh, so part of my concern is I know yesterday there's this big splash. Elon Musk is stepping back. Um, we call that horse hockey, uh, where I come from, right? We know it's not real. Uh, he's in the back closet. I understand you guys don't want his, you know, front and center, but he's still in the room and he's still making a lot of these decisions. And and that's the real problem that I have is, you know, you've got a bunch of folks that he brought in that you've admitted.
▶ 1:02:57You haven't you didn't hire, you didn't you don't know their backgrounds, if they have anything in education, yet they're helping you fire half of your employees uh right now. And you know, I'm really concerned about that. Do you know if any of them have requested or gained access to any sensitive data held by the department, including student loan borrower data? Well, as government employees now, they have been vetted through the same uh process than any other government employee would. And so what access would be granted to other government employees? They have That's fine.
▶ 1:03:26And then uh do you know the number of people that you've had a reinstate of those fired? About it's about 74. About 74. So how did that happen? Um because you know I've been an employer for 37 years. The dumbest thing I could possibly do is fire someone just to rehire them, right? Because you've given them no job security. It's like beyond stupid, right? Um, not saying that because you didn't do it. Clearly, it sounds like this is from Elon Musk, but how did that happen that people got fired and no one thought of you might need them in your department? Some of that did happen when I returned. Okay.
▶ 1:03:56Now, I was in the private sector. I have done restructuring in firms and it's painful to do that. Yeah. But fire people to rehire them. Have you? Here's the thing. Like usually that's not a strategy when you are restructuring in a company. You hope that you're just cutting fat. Sometimes you cut in on in the muscle and you realize it as you're continue with your programs and you can bring people back to do that or you can plan ahead and not hire fire people to rehire them, right? That would be another strategy that I think is more often used. Would you agree? Well, I'm saying that I have been on both sides of that coin and I found them both to be effective.
▶ 1:04:27Okay. Interesting. We we have a different perspective on that. But maybe the world of all-star wrestling is different than my world of businessto business. Um, you talked about uh I and I agree with you about uh contracts enriching private contractors at public expense. Does Elon Musk have any contracts with the Department of Education? This is First of all, I I just need That's a simple question. Please, I just noticed my time. I have 38 seconds. Please, I don't know if he does or not. You don't know if Elon Musk has any contracts in your department and you've met with him multiple times?
▶ 1:04:57Elon Musk doesn't have contracts in my department. So, Department of Education, there are no contracts with any Elon Musk company. That's what I'm asking. Not to my knowledge. Okay. All right. You want to check a blue card real quick or are you pretty sure of that? I said not to my knowledge. Okay. If I find out differently, I'll be happy to get back to you. All right. And just in the last few seconds I have just real quick on um private schools getting public dollars.
▶ 1:05:20Just so you know, uh something like 3/4 of the students that wind up going into those schools already attend those schools and they're getting tax money. So, if we get rid of the Department of Education, should we put the private voucher program under ways and means because it's really more of a tax benefit than an education benefit? Well, I I'm happy to get back to you on that as to how we restructure the Department of Education going forward and how those pro programs are handled. Great. Appreciate it. Thank you, Madam Secretary. Welcome, Mr. Moore.
▶ 1:05:50Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Madam Secretary, for being here. Um, typical line of questioning, someone's a little obsessed with one guy. It's interesting. Uh it's every hearing now. So, um thank you so much for being here. I did want to just for the committee highlight a program that I stood up in the state of West Virginia is called the hope scholarship program when I was state treasur of West Virginia. It was actually one of the most expansive ESA programs in the country.
▶ 1:06:19Uh we offered our per pupil student funding formula, state money obviously to children that decided to leave the public education system. And this has been a tremendous win for the state of West Virginia. Uh they can either choose homeschool or they could choose some private school institution.
▶ 1:06:42And we have seen just since I started that program in 2021 uh our standard um uh or pardon me our academic achievement in our test scores have increased by 3%. So a state like West Virginia that's a really big deal. Now our state my state of West Virginia we are one of the poorest states in the country.
▶ 1:07:06So we receive per capita more federal funding than most of the states compared to say like a wealthy state like Connecticut or New Jersey or Massachusetts. They're not receiving the same type of money that we are uh because we struggle in this. Now that said, we spend more per capita on our kids on education than most states in America and it's been a failure.
▶ 1:07:32And ever since the Department of Education has been instituted, we've seen academic achievement just plummet year after year. Every year it gets worse. Now, one of my questions for you is as you talk about national school choice, which I am a huge advocate for, how would you see the states being able to access those federal dollars?
▶ 1:07:58for example, the HOPE scholarship program, which is obviously a law at at the state level. Um, how could we pull down those federal dollars to have those students that have elected for school choice to be able to have access to those uh as you start to uh, God willing, wind down this department and return education to its rightful position back to the states? Well, thank you very much and and I certainly agree that states should have the opportunity to do that.
▶ 1:08:29Um, what we are looking at more and as we discussed a little bit before uh and winding down some of the programs and doing block granting to governors of states to take to take a look at some of the programs that they need to fund. And I have talked to so many governors who have said that they would welcome the opportunity to have funds block granted to them because they know what's best for their state. They know working with the local superintendent what is needed.
▶ 1:08:55So if the money was block granted with fewer strings, less regulation for those governors, they've indicated uh how successful they believe they would make their states. Now I'm the first one to admit some governors going to do a better job at this than others. Some state superintendents are going to do a better job than others. But look at some of the programs you've already talked about. The hope scholarship programs in Oklahoma, some of the programs in other states as well. These are done by innovative governors and innovative superintendents.
▶ 1:09:24This is not the Department of Education coming in and say, "Hey, you ought to try this. You ought to do it." No, it's because these people in these states look at their programs and look at what they need and they'll allocate that money here. Uh if a grant comes with strings that say you have to spend the money here and a governor says, "Man, if I just had that money and I could put it over here, I could have a lot more effect." or that state superintendent, that chief of education working with the students. I want to give them that opportunity.
▶ 1:09:53The president wants to make sure that governors and states have the opportunity to compete with one another, but to service the people in their state the way that they see best. Well, thank you for that answer. And um myself, my children, we use the hope scholarship. We've elected for school choice. My kids are in Catholic school. uh just like Representative Boy Bice here is her children run as well.
▶ 1:10:18But it's not so much about my kids that I want to highlight, but in the southern coal fields of West Virginia, we've had children driving with their parents an hour, hour and a half to just be able to access better educational opportunities and outcomes for their kids. And the thing that drives me crazy is so many people are like, "Oh, this is a giveaway to the rich so they can send their kids to private school." Well, news flash, they're already sending their kids to private school if they're rich. That it's not really a determinant factor.
▶ 1:10:47This is going to raise a lot of families to me out of poverty and give them choice that they would uh otherwise not have. So, please, anything you can do to help us be able to have access to those federal dollars to these school choice programs at the state level would be hugely beneficial. And I yield back. Thank you, Mr. Moore. Uh, Miss Frankle. Thank you. Welcome. Um, I'm I'm going to just start by saying uh I'm going to echo my ranking member here.
▶ 1:11:16How how deeply troubling it is that the Trump administration is dismantling the Department of Education, an agency that was established by Congress and you're blatantly disregarding the funding priorities we set in the 2020 25 budget without our consultation or agreement. I'm going to move on.
▶ 1:11:36I I speak to you today not just as a member of Congress, but I'm also a mother and a grandmother, and I share the values of millions of Americans who believe that educating our children is one of our most sacred responsibilities. So, I have a few questions. I'm going to help answer them and then I have a big one for you at the Uh so my first question to myself is uh why why do we why should we have a strong public education system?
▶ 1:12:07And the answer to that is because when we educate our children, we invest in their future and ours. A quality uh public education empowers children with the knowledge, skills, and confidence to pursue their dreams. It opens the doors to better jobs, higher earnings, and more fulfilling lives. It fuels economic growth and strengthens our democracy. Now, let me be clear.
▶ 1:12:29I am not opposed to parents using their own money to send their children to private school, but it is a strong public school education system that ensures that every child, no matter their background or zip code, has a fair shot at success. So, my next question for me is, should education only be a state issue? And I answer no. Because education is not just a state issue.
▶ 1:12:54It's a national responsibility, one that requires a shared commitment from local, state, and federal governments and from civil society. Federal support helps close the gaps, enforce civil rights, and ensure all schools have the resources they need. Without it, those gaps will only grow wider.
▶ 1:13:11And while uh the state's administration uh administer education policy and local control is important, it's the federal oversight that guarantees fairness, accountability, and equal opportunity. From desegregating schools to supporting students with disabilities to to protecting children discrimination based on race and sex, disability, national origin, or shared ancestry, the federal government has played a vital role.
▶ 1:13:40And that's why I strongly object to this administration's effort to dilute funding for the Office of Civil Rights, the very agency tasked with enforcing those protections. And my next question, which I will answer, is the claim that public schools are failing our children a false narrative? And that answer is yes. A child's ability to learn is shaped by more than what happens in the classroom.
▶ 1:14:07It's shaped by a lot of factors including access to early education, food security, health care, family engagement, and this administration with the Republicans attacking all of it. Slashing food assistance, driving up costs with chaotic tariffs, cutting health care costs for our most vulnerable children and families. Can you believe a hungry children does not learn? I don't care what school they're in. And did you know or do I know? Yes, I know.
▶ 1:14:35There are hundreds of thousands, hundreds of thousands of children on waiting list to get into Head Start, a proven program that leads to a child's success in school. And in my home county, Palm Beach, where the president lives, uh millions in education funding in the 2025 budget are being illegally held, which means our school district's going to be forced to cut tutoring, afterchool summer programs, social services, college readiness, teacher training, and student aid.
▶ 1:15:04for college students are going to be gone. So my next question is, is the Trump administration sifting money out of public schools into unregulated private institutions? That answer is yes. You're cutting billions from public schools and pushing a new scheme, this tax scheme. Here's how it works. Wealthy donors give money to private scholarship groups and then that money gets right back to them through a special tax break. So in the end, the taxpayers are paying the bill. There's no oversight.
▶ 1:15:35There's no accountability. Madam Secretary, 90% of our children attend public schools. So I ask you, uh, is your final mission to get rid of the United States Department uh, education cruel and f foolish? Oh, yes. I'm going to answer that. Yes, it is cruel and foolish. But I have a question for you.
▶ 1:15:55If Congress refuses to go along with your misguided plan to dismantle public education, will you commit to spending the money we appropriate in the 2026 budget as directed by law? Well, that was a lot to unpack, but well, just answer that last question if you could because you have two seconds. We will abide by the law. Good, good answer. Thank you.
▶ 1:16:22I yield Mr. Elseie. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, ranking member. Thank you, Madam Secretary, for being here. Um, let's go back in history a little bit. The creation of the Department of Education came about after the 1976 election in which Jimmy Carter got elected and he promised the NEA, the nation's largest union, a Department of Ed education.
▶ 1:16:48Previously, those roles had been Department of Health and Human Services and a couple of others. So, in order to get that done and get the endorsement to win 1980, we created the Department of Education, I'm I'm pretty sure that my wellspoken, well- reggarded colleagues on the other side of the aisle who have questioned you previously, with the exception of one, not one of them, got their public education under this Department of Education on the federal level.
▶ 1:17:19They were all educated by public education without having the Department of Education, Health and Human Services, uh, Department of Justice. Um, they all had different roles and then we put it all into one. So, we've spent billions and trillions of dollars as you mentioned.
▶ 1:17:35Meanwhile, the state of Texas, I checked with my friend in the legislature, the state of Texas, which is perfectly capable of taking care of kids in the valley, in West Texas, in the panhandle, in North Texas, down on the coast, all of which have different demographics and different needs. We're going to spend a hundred billion dollars in the state of Texas over the next two years providing for our own public education according to our standards because our local school districts know how to educate their kids.
▶ 1:18:05So if this is a question of mental health, well that belongs at Department of Health and Human Services. If it's about civil rights, that belongs at the Department of Justice. 10% of the funding that goes to public education in this country is sent from the states back here, washed, employs a whole bunch of people, has some strings attached, and then goes back down. So this existed prior to 1980.
▶ 1:18:27All of my colleagues on the right, except maybe Stenny Hoyer because he's pretty young, were educated without the Department of Education. So, being a Navy pilot, I tend to watch a few movies. One of my favorites is Office Space. So, let me ask you, what do you think as the Secretary of Education, what would you say you do here? What would you say the Department of Education does? And is it accomplishing that mission, Madam Secretary? Well, thank you very much.
▶ 1:18:57Uh you've you've made my case uh quite a bit for me already. But I I what I found in talking with so many people when I took on this position was was the misunderstanding what the Department of Education doesn't do. It does not set curriculum. It doesn't hire teachers. It doesn't specify books. It doesn't do all of those things.
▶ 1:19:19It is actually a pass through mechanism for funding that is appropriated by Congress and whether the channels of that funding are through HHS or whether they're funneled through uh the DOJ or whether they're funneled through uh uh Treasury or SBA or other departments, the work is going to continue to get done. So, what I've been focusing on at the Secretary of Education is really understanding where these grants are, where these programs are.
▶ 1:19:49How do we make sure that they aren't wasteful? How do we re-evaluate the contracts? As I talked before, let's do savings going in as we're recommending, you know, our budget cuts. Let's make sure that the programs that we're putting in place are best serving the students of those states. And that's that's the work that I'm focused on every day. Thank you. I I I want to make it clear to my colleagues that I think there's a lot of waste, fraud and abuse in the federal government.
▶ 1:20:15Remember 1980 Department of Education 2001 Department of Homeland Security which Jason basically just added added another level of bureaucracy and cost the American taxpayer with a questionable amount of return on that investment on safety because all those agencies underneath already existed just like they do in the Department of Education.
▶ 1:20:35I would argue that I don't think that the folks of Connecticut want somebody like me telling them how to educate their kids any more than I want anybody from Connecticut telling me how to educate my kids in the state of Texas. This is better done at the state level. There's nothing about education in the constitution. Not one word. So my case is it's not in the constitution. Let's start with that.
▶ 1:20:58Let's reabsorb this the functions of the Department of Education and other agencies just like it was before and I think we're going to be just fine as my wellspoken highly intelligent colleagues on the right side who were not educated under the guidelines of the Department of Education as it currently exists can attest. Thank you and I yield back. Mr. thank you so much. And uh Secretary Man, thank you for being here.
▶ 1:21:26Uh, I want to talk about early childhood education. I probably think more about early childhood development than some of my colleagues because I'm still living it every day. I have two young daughters, Lillian and Karina, ages three and one. Uh, like millions of parents, I know firsthand how critical access to early learning is, not just for kids, but for working families and the future of our communities. Secretary McMahon, do you believe every child deserves access to a highquality early childhood education?
▶ 1:21:55I believe that every child deserves access to a high quality equal access to Great. And I think we agree. I I think every child and every family should be able to enroll their kids in in highquality safe preschools. Uh as you know, research shows that children who attend preschool are 18% more likely to go to college than those who didn't. We know that early childhood education shapes lifelong outcomes. It impacts literacy, graduation rates, employment, even health and public safety.
▶ 1:22:24These are real facts. Uh, but I'm concerned about what's happening with Head Start, a program that makes preschool reality for over 800,000 families. I know this technically falls under HHS, but as Secretary of Education, I can imagine you'd care deeply about this topic as you're responsible for the future of every kid in America. Um, have you discussed Head Start funding with the administration and the budget? And what are your views on what's happening uh with the current uh freezes and the challenges with the Head Start program?
▶ 1:22:53I I've not had conversations with um with uh with the department of HHS. Uh and uh so no, they're not they're not part of my budget considerations at this point. Do you have a view on whether or not preschool through Head Start is important as a grounds for a student's education? I think the earlier we can start education, the better it is for every child.
▶ 1:23:17I look at I look at mothers who spend time with their children uh you know reading to them when other children may not have that benefit. I think those children definitely have an advantage and you you like to see that but I don't think that the federal government has the responsibility for that. I think that that should be looked at more in state budgets and how states can best set up their programs. I I I hear you. I I uh did a lot of reading with my daughters and continue to do so.
▶ 1:23:45But did did I understand that you do not believe that the federal government should be supporting programs like Head Start uh and that should be the job of other other organizations and states and and and parents? Well, currently it is the uh responsibility of a different agency and I'm sure that they are looking at what aspects they are funding as they go through their budget process. Well, I think this is has real implications on the work that you do. This is a cornerstone of American education.
▶ 1:24:11Uh, and I I think that what's happening with Head Start is very concerning. Uh, we're seeing these delays, these freezes that ultimately hurt kids. We've seen Head Start schools close across the country because they only have three days of funding right now. Every Head Start program in the country has three days of funding. Uh, and I think that is going to have an implication on our kids' ability to read, write, and do math.
▶ 1:24:35Uh and so I would think as the secretary of education that you should have a a a perspective on this and a real goal towards committing to the parents of Head Start uh students in in my district across the country to fight to make sure that this program is fully funded. Uh is that something that you believe in that this program should be funded and pushing back on any attempt to cut it? I'm I'm going to let uh the department and the agencies that are responsible for those parts of the budget do their job. I think it has a implication for the Department of Education that is real. Let me tell you what's at stake.
▶ 1:25:06In my district, 1600 kids rely on Head Start. This is the first type of education that any student receives. And I think passing it off on some other department is unacceptable because we know that Head Start students are 13 percentage points less likely to commit a crime. They're more likely to graduate high school, less likely to experience a teen pregnancy. This is our kids' futures and our entire communities are lifted up because of this program. So, I think saying that this part of the education system isn't your responsibility doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
▶ 1:25:34I think you should be terrified at the idea of Head Start being gutted because it's going to have major ramifications on our students ability to have the future that we want. It's your duty to make sure that programs like this continue. And so, I hope that you see that our kids aren't line items. They're not pawns in a political game. They're not disposable.
▶ 1:25:52and that we need to make sure that Head Start is continuing to be strong and that cuts like the ones we've seen over the last couple months uh don't happen if we're going to be able to make sure that every Quidd has quality education uh in the United States. I hope you remember that and I yield back. Mr. Simpson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for being here today. I appreciate your testimony. And just very very quickly for Mr.
▶ 1:26:18Pokehan's uh education is professional wrestling a business. Sir, I uh it very definitely is a business. So, you ran a business. Okay. Just so that you're aware of that. Anyway, let me ask you let me ask you a couple of questions. I I don't disagree with my colleagues on the right have been saying. I agree with what Mr. Elie uh said. Education and I have no problem with trying to move much of this education back to the states.
▶ 1:26:48had a couple superintendents tell me a couple years ago that their problem was they got 5% of their funding from the federal government and 95% of the rules came from the federal government. But there are some successful programs that we want to maintain. You said in your statement that you encouraged all of your children to go to post-secary school that they needed to continue their education to be successful. You said that you evaluated uh and looked at these programs and wanted to get rid of those that were uneffective.
▶ 1:27:16And in the skinny budget, you specifically said, "Trio and Gear Up are a relic of the past when financial incentives were needed to motivate institutions of higher education to engage with lowincome students and increase access. I'd like to see some of those studies and evaluations because every one that I've seen says it's one of the most effective programs ever.
▶ 1:27:35In fact, when we had Secretary Spelling here 20 years ago, they tried to comp put all these programs together and just send them out to the states." She said they had studies that showed that they were not a very effective program. And I asked her for a copy of those studies. It's 20 years ago. I'm still waiting because there are no studies out there that show that it is ineffective. It is one of the most effective programs in the federal government.
▶ 1:27:58These are for, you know, one of the best programs in the history of education and most meaningful has probably been the GI Bill. We took veterans from World War II and gave them opportunities to go to college. This is the GI Bill for lowincome minority communities. Uh, and it's supported by many, many members of Congress. We have about 800,000 low-income potential firstg generation college graduates. And I don't know if you've ever gone and talked to any of these students.
▶ 1:28:28These are people that had never thought of going to college because nobody in their family had. Nobody in their community have ever done that. We got a problem in Indian Health Services trying to get doctors and dentists to go out on reservations. The only way you're going to educate, the only way you're going to do that and solve that problem is when Native American children go to college, go on to medical school, go on to dental school, and come back to their reservation to serve their people. That's how you're going to solve it in the long run.
▶ 1:28:53So, can you speak to me how the department arrived at this funding level and how you plan to ensure that TRIO remains accessible to the students who rely upon it? Well, thank you very much. And um and I understand that that there are many services that are served. I mean, TRIO started out as three programs. It's now about eight. Uh and it it first started when uh there were first generation of of students who were going to college, you know, for the first time.
▶ 1:29:21And I agree with you, there are a lot of parts of TRIO that talked about those students and what their possibilities could be and interested them. I did see in one um one example trio recently uh that one child was brought on board and talked about going to college, but part of the TRIO program was taking them to Disney World at that time. So, I'm not sure that all the expenses uh in TRIO should be there.
▶ 1:29:46I think TRIO uh you know those those monies are going to be going out you know for this program for for this year. So, we are looking at all of the programs. The need for TRIO I don't think is nearly as strong because there are outreaches from colleges now into local communities and there should be more of the universities and uh and secondary education levels reaching into those communities.
▶ 1:30:10They should be talking to them about college, but I think they should also be talking to them about other ways that they could have skills that they could support whether it's the tribal nations that you were talking about or whether it's their community. As I mentioned a little earlier, I might have been before you came in that uh I think we need to reimagine and look at education differently at our country that I think we need more work-based projects, teaching in our middle schools and high schools to prepare people to get into the economy.
▶ 1:30:39I mean, we kind of made um we focused on college and degrees and we kind of made trade skills. Hey, that's something that you go into if you can't really make it at college. We need this workforce. Yes, we do. We need this workforce. So, let's train a lot of those different kind of programs. Let's give them skills that can make it available for them to go to work right away and be in the economy. Then maybe they will also put themselves through.
▶ 1:31:02Before you eliminate TRIO though I need to see what those programs are that you're proposing that we're going to change them to because this is the most important program for lowincome people who had never thought of and you know you gave the example of one individual out of 800,000. The program is highly successful. I'd like to say other government programs could learn from this program frankly and I would like to know if we're going to change it how it's going to change and how we're still going to have access to to those kids.
▶ 1:31:28And I understand that the department has not yet released the continuation awards uh for the TRIO upward bound program even though those grants expired on May 31st. Could you tell us where we are on those awards? Yeah, I believe I believe that they will be going up by July 1. I think that is correct. If it's not, I will get back to you. Thank you, Miss Watson Coleman. Thank you, chairman, and thank you to my uh colleague who just asked those questions about important programs that get students ready for college.
▶ 1:31:58Um, good good morning and good morning. Thank you for being here. I'm going to ask you a a couple of questions that I just need yes or no. Do you believe that there is illegal discrimination against people who are black, brown, um, and and other types of discrimination in jobs and education in this country? Yes or no? I think it still exists in some areas.
▶ 1:32:24Then can you tell me why the office of civil rights in the department of education is being decimated? Well, it isn't being decimated. That is what is it being? We we have reduced the size of it. However, we are taking on a backlog of cases that were left over from the Biden administration.
▶ 1:32:43Then why would you reduce the resources if you've got a backlog in addition to having uh confronted those cases that are going to come before you now because we're working more efficiently in the department. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 1:33:00Um, I I I've got real serious questions regarding your commitment to civil rights uh to to our students, to our teachers, to our faculty um and places of that of that nature. Do you um believe that migrant students should have access to public education um resources?
▶ 1:33:26Well, migrant students do have access to Do you believe that they should continue in some instances? Yes. Okay. Do you believe that the position of this administration to reduce the resources and the support to migrant students? At the same time, they've encouraged and perhaps facilitated the um coming to this country of white a South Africanas.
▶ 1:33:55I'm not sure is an is an issue of favoritism and prioritization of white over color. Well, if I am going to have to take a couple of minutes to answer this because this ad this administration, President Trump has made it very clear that he will not tolerate discrimination, whether it's anti-semitism, whether it's race related at all on any of our I'm gonna
▶ 1:34:25answer this question if I may. I'm going to tell you, I know what the president's position is. He's made it quite clear. I'm asking you as a ch as the secretary of education were you how you perceive this yes or no if this is the secretary of replacement and favoritism say no if it is say yes I am the secretary of education who has been uh approved to run this agency
▶ 1:34:56by congress and I was appointed by the president and I serve at his pleasure under his mandates So therefore the direction of his administration is what I will follow. Do you recognize the fact that one of the important reasons that the federal government got into public education was to establish that there would be standards so that children would be treated equally in pursuing education.
▶ 1:35:21that states had been found to be to discriminate against uh black students in particular in uh many of the states. And that to send that responsibility and authority back to the states would just enhance those disparities. Again, considering the environment in which this president continues to foster about who's important and who's not. Yes. or no.
▶ 1:35:51Congresswoman, there are laws on the books in title six that totally laws don't mean anything to this administration. I'm asking you how you do you realize that to send authority back to the states to eliminate your oversight to eliminate your accountability to eliminate your determination as to u uh resources going to schools that are that are teaching public schools that are teaching
▶ 1:36:22underserved communities. that this will result in the very reason that we had to get the involvement of of the federal government in this issue. And that's a yes or a no. Either you believe it isn't a it isn't a yes or no. But I will not respond to any question based on the theory that this administration doesn't care anything about the law and operates outside it. So that is a mischaracterization and I will I reclaim my time for five seconds because you can say anything you want.
▶ 1:36:51Your rhetoric means nothing to me. What means something to me is the actions of this administration from the from the president of the United States conducting himself in a corrupt manner to his family, enriching him and uh his himself uh corruptly to determine that this administration can tell you what's right, what's wrong, what's lawful, what's not. That it can arrest judges, it can arrest lawyers.
▶ 1:37:20It can use its power to bully people. And I'm telling you, the Department of Education is one of the most important departments in this country. And you should feel shameful to be engaged with an administration that doesn't give a damn. Miss Lilllo, I yield back. Secretary McMahon, I thank you for being here and thank you for your dedication uh towards furthering education in our country.
▶ 1:37:47We were so grateful to have you in that chair and I think all my colleagues uh on this dis and and most in Congress would agree that education is the answer. Education is the answer to lifting uh communities out of poverty. If you educate a child, you give them a future. And I know you believe that wholeheartedly. And one thing that we've seen happen uh across our state of Louisiana is uh when parents don't have a choice uh that's a travesty.
▶ 1:38:14And so, uh, for those, uh, parents who public education was failing their students, uh, they had the opportunity to, uh, form charter schools. And what a blessing that has been, uh, to Louisiana. I'd like to give a shout out to one of, uh, my most impressive charter schools that I've had the the opportunity to tour. It's called the ACE Charter School.
▶ 1:38:36was a group of concerned parents, especially mamas, mama bears, who came together and said, "We need an option for our artistic children, uh, to be able to have a place where they can grow and thrive and receive special education, uh, directed straight towards them, and it's been, uh, an incredible honor to witness them thrive. They have a waiting list uh, that blows my mind how many parents are eager to get their children into those schools.
▶ 1:39:01And so uh while we wait on what the final plan will be for the department of education to send more power back to the states, I was encouraged that in the skinny budget you plused up a bit for uh charter schools and would just like to hear your thoughts on how we move forward uh with that option for parents. Well, thanks very much uh for your question and um with the increase in the budget, I think the president is showing his commitment to make wanting to make sure that all students had the opportunity of choice.
▶ 1:39:31There about a million students on the waiting list now for charter schools and hopefully this plus up in the budget which is not going to cover all of the needs for sure but will give more opportunity for charter schools and other options you know for choice. I've seen the results what happened in Louisiana. I know Kate Rumley. Yes. Who is your uh your your chief of education in the state and I've talked to uh Governor Landry about uh a lot of the accomplishments that have been that have happened.
▶ 1:39:59I've toured ACE and spent some time there uh and was totally amazed uh with the uh with those students who many had said were uneducable right and looking at the things that they have been able to do because they did have the opportunity to go to that particular school and uh I'm I'm very very pleased that actually the founder of ACE has come on board with us for a short term uh at the department of education for her consult so I'm very pleased about that.
▶ 1:40:27Uh so I do believe that uh with more choice, with more opportunity, we will see our scores go up because um what's happened is there are many children that have been trapped in failing schools. And oh, my esteemed congresswoman has left. I was going to say one of the things that I think is the most detrimental uh to underprivileged students or or any child that doesn't have equal access is they get trapped in a failing school. And that should not happen.
▶ 1:40:55They should have their parents should have the ability to say my child should be able to go to this school over here because they are doing better. They can do better if they have that opportunity. And if we continue to pigeon hole students in failing schools and not give them that opportunity, we are failing them. And quite frankly, we have failed uh in education uh in in our country. When we see these scores continue to decline and we and the answer is we'll throw more money, create more programs, let's do more of this. It's not worked.
▶ 1:41:26It has not worked. The scores continue to go down. Where we've seen the most successes are in states with innovation policies. And I have the most ultimate respect for teachers. I think teaching is one of the most respectful professions that we have should be the most honored.
▶ 1:41:44And when teachers are allowed to teach and be creative and innovative in their classroom and not spend half of their day in compliance with regulatory requirements because of the programs that are there, we will see better outcomes and results. And I am a firm believer in that. I'm a firm believer that education is the cornerstone of our country. Uh it's the cornerstone for developing our economics, our defense, and every other thing we do.
▶ 1:42:09But there does not have to be a bureaucracy in Washington that is dictating how our students and our children throughout our country do get educated. Could not agree with you more and thank you uh for supporting our governor and superintendent. I think they're doing a fabulous job and the numbers prove it as our scores continue to climb.
▶ 1:42:27Real quickly, um I have a bill that I introduced, HR 3453, the empowered charter school educators to lead act that would provide modest targeted planning grants using existing charter school programs funds to help experienced educators with early stages of designing a highquality charter school. Uh do you agree that a small amount of planning funding can make a big difference in helping strong local applicants get their innovative charter schools across the finish line?
▶ 1:42:54Well, I do hope that this plus up with the president's budget some funds and it can be used for many different kinds of programs. Okay. Thank you for your time. I yield back. M Miss Dean. Thank you, Chairman Adhalt, Ranking Member Delaro for holding this hearing and I thank you, Secretary McMahon, for being here today. I want to start with the role of the Department of Education. I I come at this as a mother, as a grandmother, a former teacher myself, a former state legislator with two grandmothers who were public school teachers.
▶ 1:43:23I have a lot of experience with the education system in Pennsylvania as well as the country. Uh first, the history of the federal education uh involvement. Uh and Miss Watson Coleman was getting at some of this that I'd like to build upon. uh federal investments in education began to increase dramatically in the 50s and 60s and 70s in tandem with the rise of the success of the civil rights movement. Americans finally began to recognize the vast inequalities in our education system.
▶ 1:43:54Thus, federal funding was used to improve education access for students from poor backgrounds or minority students, for women, for people with disabilities and other marginalized groups. Finally, Congress established the Department of Education in 1979, replacing the Office of Education. McMman, it's alarming that you and the president want to turn that clock back.
▶ 1:44:18You take us back to a time before any federal oversight of education, before many of the programs that guarantee free and equal access to education for all Americans. You said as much in your testimony. After all the Department of Education's work to ensure equal access to education, you're embarking on the department's final mission. You intend to put yourself out of a job. That's a little jarring to me. If you were a pediatric oncologist, I'd welcome that.
▶ 1:44:48Let's get you out of a job through cures, through healing, through ending of pediatric cancer. but ending a department that is supposed to oversee the education of our very youngest to guide their future. Have you taken the time to educate yourself about this history? I'd encourage you go ask students who attended school back then, black students, brown students, students with disabilities, students from poor families.
▶ 1:45:14What was access like for them before the Department of Education? Frankly, eliminating the Department of Education to me is rather Orwellian. The president and his administration don't want an educated populace. Why don't we just go back to the book 1984 if it hasn't been banned? It's clear to me you this administration wants an uneducated electorate so that Mr.
▶ 1:45:40Trump and his courtiers can control thought therefore control votes and control the population. I'll note a secondary uh measure here that is going on the increase in funding for charter schools. We know that charter schools originally were supposed to be incubators of the best ideas, great practices to be brought back into the public school education system so that every kid had an access to such things.
▶ 1:46:06But this administration and you who want to put yourself out of a job following the playbook page 319 of project 2025, first sentence, shutter the department of education. You're all following the book that book. Too bad that one wasn't banned. And yet privatizing is really the other ambition. An uneducated electorate and profit and privatization of our education system. Do you promise us that that isn't your ambition?
▶ 1:46:37That clearly is not my ambition. I think I've stated that very well today. And why in God's name do you want to shutter it? Why don't you want to protect kids with disabilities? Why don't you want to protect kids who have been every decade denied equal access simply because of how much their parents make, the zip code they live in, the color of their skin. Why are you shuttering a department that's supposed to lift up those children? Because those programs don't have to flow through the Department of Education and they they can flow through the state.
▶ 1:47:08I'm a state leg I was a state legislator. That's called shift and shift. I've spoken with the governor of Pennsylvania. They can't pick up the tab anymore for education of our students. Not to mention, it would be inequitable by state by state by state. Why are you in this job at all if you don't have a dedication to the future of our children? Why are you in this job? I too am a mother and a grandmother and I want the best for my family going forward.
▶ 1:47:37Voucher for my grandchildren, for my great grandchildren and hope to leave a legacy that we have established best practices for education that all the states can use. That would be that would be a great legacy to be able to leave to be able to show states these are some of the things that they can do. I think states have to look at their budget. Madam Secretary, the legacy you will be leaving is that I shut down the Department of Education. How we educate our children determines not just their future but our own. I think it's a sad legacy you will leave. I yield back.
▶ 1:48:07The Department of Education is not educating anyone. Well, I can say this and I will, Dr. Harris. Thank you very much. Let's uh pick up where you just left off. Um, if I read the test results correctly, uh, we are getting worse, not better. Is that right? as a country re let's take reading fourth grade. That is true. Oh okay. So the department of education is failing.
▶ 1:48:38I mean as it's currently structured it fails because the the purpose of the department of education is to improve America's scoring. Our our collective American scoring and we'll talk about reading in the fourth grade in a second is uh to actually improve education. Right? So when we spend 20% more than we did a few years ago, we would expect like a 20% improvement in test scores, a little improvement in test scores. No, we actually get a decrease in test scores.
▶ 1:49:03Uh I just want to remind people that the kind of the the best example of American education are our private universities, right? I mean Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Dartmouth, go down the list. They're all private. We're demonizing privat privatized education. We're demonizing private education, which is actually the crown jewel of the American system, is are our private universities. This is this is a little bizarre.
▶ 1:49:30If we wanted to create an electorate, we' juice up the Department of Education because it's actually winding down the education. If you look at test scores, I'm just look objective. You know, it's been years since we uh since we put the NAP in place. Let's just look at the trend lines. If you wanted to create an uneducated electorate, you would continue doing exactly what we're doing because we have schools in Baltimore City where we spend an inordinate amount of money where that have zero reading proficiency.
▶ 1:50:00Like zero. Oh, but they spend $57,000 on cell phones from the ESSER, the ESSER uh funds uh during the pandemic. So, they had money to buy cell phones for administrators, but not to actually improve scores. I don't know. I think I think we have a horrible record in this country of failing our children and uh you know the thing that well states can't pick up the tab. Oh, no, no, no. The federal government can't pick up the tab because we are two trill we're running a$ two trillion dollar deficit.
▶ 1:50:31As I remind my colleagues frequently like sound like a broken record, we had a Moody's downgrade last week and they basically said we have to stop federal spending large S. And I think you pick the department that is an abject failure and you go look we got to we got to stop spending. You either make it better or you stop. And I don't if you could block grant maybe the states know how to do it better. Clearly Washington does not know how to do it better. That's just my opinion. Charter schools are great as you know and I'm sorry I'm late.
▶ 1:50:59I missed part we're you know we're negotiating this little reconciliation bill and it does include for the first time a federal voucher program. Now I would advocate that charter schools are okay but in some states like mine the public school system has a strangle hold on charter schools and they look in the end mostly just like public schools and perform only a little bit better. But the voucher program I think and the gentle lady from Louisiana is absolutely right. I think that's the answer is is always competition.
▶ 1:51:28That that is what makes America great. That's what makes almost every aspect of America great is is competition. I will ask you about the Mississippi miracle and I want you to describe it and how important it is that we actually uh convince all the states to do what Mississippi did because of its tremendous improvement in uh in test results as a result. If Madam Secretary, if you could explain the Mississippi Miracle, and I'm sorry, maybe you did already, but if not, I didn't. Please explain. I'm happy to.
▶ 1:51:55The Mississippi Mississippi Miracle was really about their reading program. What they did was return to basics. Uh what they've done in Louisiana, what Texas is now looking at, what other states are looking at too, and that is the returning to the science of reading. I did talk about that a little bit earlier, the science of reading, which is getting back to phonetics uh and teaching the way that students learn to read better uh in in the beginning and we are seeing incredible improvements.
▶ 1:52:23Mississippi Miracle, I think Mississippi was number three from the bottom in terms of their proficiency in reading and through this program that they launched, they've come up to number 20, maybe a little higher by now, but that was a huge jump. And my understanding m if I could just just remind everyone the miracle was they didn't do social promotion on reading. You had to learn to read. Yes. When you left the third grade because the studies are pretty clear. The star study in Tennessee pretty clear.
▶ 1:52:52If you don't read by the end of the third grade, forget it. Everything beyond there requires reading skill. You will fail in the rest. I'm sorry I interrupted you if you want. No, but that that's exactly right. Uh and and as I said earlier, uh up through third grade, you're learning to read, and beyond that, you're reading to learn. Yeah. And and you're right, you you cannot be successful if you cannot read. Yeah. And Yeah.
▶ 1:53:14And our current policy just condemns, unfortunately, frequently inner city youth to a life that is we condemn them to a life where they can't read and because they can't read, they won't succeed like everyone else does. So, I congratulate you for your efforts, Madam Secretary, and I yield back. Thank Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um and uh thank you, Secretary McMahon, for being here in our committee hearing this morning.
▶ 1:53:43Um, you know, I believe we are very fortunate to have you and uh I think President Trump made an amazing pick when he nominated you and I think you will take the Department of Education to where it needs to be and that is supporting the states, sending education back to the states.
▶ 1:54:03You know, for decades, the Department of Education has grown far beyond its original intent, imposing mandates, funding ideological programs, and entangling schools in red tape that distracts from its core mission of education, but not education at the federal level, but education at the state level. All the while, student performance has declined, as have been mentioned plenty of times. Costs have ballooned, and bureaucratic overhead has exploded.
▶ 1:54:30President Trump's FY26 budget is a Quest budget request is a strong step in the right direction as it cuts wasteful and duplicative programs and it lays the groundwork for an education system that is more accountable and far more responsive to students than the one we currently have right now. This budget would spend less, centralize less and return power to where it belongs to the to the states to the parents and to the local communities.
▶ 1:54:56But first, I want to address the radical gender ideology promoted by the Department of Education during the last four years of the Biden Harris administration. In April 2024, the department finalized a new Title 9 rule redefining sex-based discrimination to include gender identity. Protecting all students is essential for a strong learning environment. And yet, this extreme policy put female students at great risk.
▶ 1:55:21We've seen the left force female students and athletes to share spaces such as bathrooms, locker rooms, and sports with biological males. They have no interest in protecting young girls or women. After all, if you cannot define a woman, you cannot defend a woman. In fact, at last year's budget hearing, former education secretary Cardona repeatedly refused to define what a woman was, dodging my question three separate times.
▶ 1:55:46So, Secretary McMahon, can your Department of Education now define for me what a woman is? Me. Perfect. I was born a girl and I grew to be an adult woman. Thank you. Thank you. It's refreshing to see that the Trump administration uh and the Department of Education with you at the helm is returning to common sense policies grounded in biological reality to protect young girls in schools.
▶ 1:56:12I was proud to see President Trump on his first day in office sign an executive order to push back against gender ideology and restore biological truth in federal policy. Surrounded by young female athletes, he also signed an order effectively banning biological males from women's sports and spaces. President Trump took swift action to end the left's harmful agenda that has endangered and devalued women across the country.
▶ 1:56:36Remarkably, just one day after the order was signed, the NCAA updated its eligibility policies to prohibit biological males from competing in sports. Secretary McMahon, as you know, President Trump signed an executive order on March 20th, 25 to dismantle the Department of Education. And I'd like you to clear up some misconceptions about this executive order.
▶ 1:56:59Can you confirm that the president's budget fully preserves critical funding for schools, specifically Title One Part A for low-income districts and special education funding under the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act, while also targeting wasteful bureaucracy, but not the essential resources that students and teachers rely upon. Yes. He he Thank you. Thank you. Since 1980, taxpayers has spent nearly $3 trillion on federal education funding.
▶ 1:57:30Per pupil spending in public schools has skyrocketed since then. Yet test scores, as has been mentioned many times, have failed to improve meaningfully. Reading and math scores have either flatlined or declined across according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress. Does streamlining bureaucracy at the Department of Education mean students and teachers will receive less funding or does it actually mean does it actually ensure that more of each dollar reaches the classroom?
▶ 1:57:59More of each dollar will reach the classroom because we're eliminating a lot of your bureaucratic red tape that takes time and money to comply with. Thank you. Thank you. My last question, how does this budget begin the long overdue work of returning educational control to parents and local communities and how does it support school choice initiatives that expand parental options and improve academic outcomes? Well, thank you sir for that question.
▶ 1:58:29Uh it, as we said, it does protect um title 1A funding and also IDEIDA funding. So those streams are going to continue to come to provide uh that that necessary budget requirements for those students. But just by as I've been speaking about the president's looking at making sure that no student is imprisoned, if you will in a failing school they should not happen. So he wants to have more options, more opportunities.
▶ 1:58:59One of those is through uh increasing the charter school budget. He doesn't say charter schools are the beall and endall. He's simply saying it is a choice. If the public school is not uh providing the kind of education that student needs and there's an opportunity for a charter school or there's an opportunity for that child to attend a Catholic school or to be homeschooled, how can that child under the supervision of its parents uh and working with the local school system get the best education possible?
▶ 1:59:29It can't happen efficiently from Washington DC. It needs to happen on a local level. And that's the president's goal and intent to uh improve education in our country. He was uh angered and embarrassed when he saw what the national scores were. And he said openly when he was campaigning that this cannot stand that America in order to be continue to be the superpower and the number one country in the world, we have to have the best education in the world.
▶ 1:59:58We have to provide equal access to quality education for every child in America and that is his goal. Well, thank you. That is very refreshing to hear and thank you for your strong leadership and I yield back. Thank you. Uh we will now uh move to the second round of questioning and uh we'll cut back on the timing a little bit to make sure everyone gets their questions in. So we'll go with a threeminut round and I'll start with ranking member Deluro. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 2:00:28Um, I I want to hit back on TRIO for a second. Um, your budget justifies the elimination of two bipartisan college access programs. There's TRIO and Gear Up. And you claim, and this is a quote, access to college is not the obstacle it was for students of limited means. What is your basis for that claim? Simply because we have more programs reaching into the communities and schools are being more active in recruiting those schools and and if they're not, they should be.
▶ 2:00:56um because it is uh I believe up to schools also to be reaching in their communities in and the state level. And so if we can if we can be helpful and and looking at programs that can help with that that kind of outreach from the state level, then that's what we should do. Well, let me just data is clear. Students from wealthy families are almost three and a half times more likely to attend college than students from lowincome families.
▶ 2:01:24And 76% of students from the upper income bracket complete college in six years versus 48% of students from the bottom income bracket. As Secretary of of Education, you cannot look away from the needs of youngsters from lowincome backgrounds hoping to get a college education or a technical education.
▶ 2:01:47How can you justify the elimination of TRIO and Gear Up when we have so much more work to do on college access? I refer you to a document by the Brookings Institute that talks about the college enrollments vary depending on the socioeconomic status of a student's family.
▶ 2:02:08So, TRIO and Gear Up, which has been a bipartisan effort, I can still hear the voice of the chair at the time of this subcommittee, Ralph Regula, who spoke eloquently about the benefits of TRIO and Gear Up, and the chairman of the full committee with whom I have um uh put bills together over the years, a mutual support of the issues of TRIO and Gear because what kind of access it provides ides
▶ 2:02:38to youngsters from lower income families. Uh and to deny people that opportunity because of um I I I don't know what your decision is based on. What is the study?
▶ 2:02:54What is scholarship except some construct that you or the president or Elon Musk has come up with that it is not an obstacle for students of limited means? Do you have any idea how people live here in this country today? People are living paycheck to paycheck.
▶ 2:03:21their wages have not gone up and they find themselves wanting to figure out how they can pay their health care costs, how they can pay their housing costs, how they can put the food on the table and how they can get their kids educated. Let us see the studies as Mr. Simpson pointed out which want to see it and the decision making. What was this based on except someone's whim or idea? I yield back. Thank you.
▶ 2:03:49And I'll now recognize myself for three minutes. Madam Secretary, I appreciate your emphasis on reading and I think that is really very important. It certainly opens up a whole opportunity for students. Another area where there's an opportunity for students that if they don't make the most of that opportunity, it really limits their capabilities and that's in middle school math.
▶ 2:04:17And uh by that I mean if if someone engages in middle school and learns math and is competent in math that opens up doorways for math for science at the upper levels. If they don't they consider themselves not a math person and disengage and we lose a lot of people who could be very strong in the STEM fields.
▶ 2:04:41I wonder if that's something that you and the department could factor in in terms of innovative partnerships with states as well as the private sector because I do believe math and science students are going to be vital to compete in the years to come. Well, that is I would like to see more uh public private partnerships especially clearly at the state level.
▶ 2:05:02uh as I have visi I visited uh a few schools now and uh I have seen some of the uh private partnerships where the companies are coming in and they're bringing um let's let's take for instance one of the ones that I that I saw just recently robots robotics into schools I went into a school classroom where uh kids were not very much engaged in math and suddenly they had the opportunity now to work with these robot component components in these
▶ 2:05:32robot kits. In fact, I think um former Governor Cenounu up in New Hampshire actually activated one of these programs in New Hampshire that the company provided these kits uh and and the kids who suddenly took these kits, they had to have motor skill coordination. They had to learn how to what the spatial relationship was to attach all of the parts. And so then they would have competitions.
▶ 2:05:58And suddenly when they had to figure out, oh, I need a 2 inch piece for this or a one and a half centimeter for that, whatever the math they were looking at, they suddenly were making that connection with the math because they were doing something with hands-on skills. I think we can just look at how we're teaching things differently and looking at a lot of those projects that are being brought in by the private sector. They get great results. Thank you.
▶ 2:06:23And uh I just want to get your thoughts on the activities of the Chinese Students and Scholars Association in America that's collectively overseen by the CCP's United Front Work Department. According to one academic estimate, the China Scholarship Council funds around 18% of all Chinese national students in the United States.
▶ 2:06:47And the CSSE is a Chinese governmentrun talent recruitment program overseen by the Ministry of Public Security among other government agencies that directs students research priorities and requires students to sign loyalty pledges to the CCP. I'm wondering if there are rules and procedures that you have in place to mitigate the risk posed by the CSC to research security and student safety.
▶ 2:07:15and if and if it's something that we can strengthen those rules by working with you and the department. I I'd like to work with you on that. I need to learn more about it. I'm not all that familiar with it at this point, but I'd look forward to working with you on that. Thank you very much, Mr. Hoyer. Thank you very much, Madam Secretary. In three minutes, we can't really do much in terms of these questions, but let me say it. is somebody who's a strong supporter of education.
▶ 2:07:42Frederick Douglas said, "It is easier to build strong children than it is to repair broken men." Agnu, Ted Agnu said, "The cost of failure far exceeds the price of progress." If we fail in educating our children and let me make sure that maybe we ought to be a little humble. Many of the countries that score much better than we do, how is their education system organized? Now, I know the question is rhetorical.
▶ 2:08:12By nations, not by this group. Why did Mississippi do so badly? Because they were poor. Why did Louisiana do so poorly? Because they were poor. Not totally. They're getting greater wealth now. But we ought to be working together because I can't believe there's a member of this dis or sitting before us that doesn't want children to do better. Why?
▶ 2:08:39Because we're in a very competitive world. And we ought to be humble enough to understand that the nations we're competing with, you mentioned China, they're turning out some pretty damn good people that are competing very heavily with us in a federal government organized system. Does that mean we ought to go to that system? Absolutely not. Do we like our freedom and individual effort in innovation? We do.
▶ 2:09:08but yelling at one another uh and pretending that you Democrats are all for, you know, just mediocrity. This is absurd any more than than I would look to the the Republican side of the aisle. Don't think they want Frederick Douglas's uh vision to be realized. We all do.
▶ 2:09:31But this is not a cooperative administration that says they want to close close down the department of education without saying how we're going to replace it without doing some study without without coming to the congress and say let's talk about this let us presume that we do want similar objectives and that is a well-educated healthy country and so I would urge you to be part of that conversation not part of that direct directive
▶ 2:10:01that we're going to shut down this agency. I don't think this agency is going to be shut down. I don't think the will of the people as reflected by the Congress is going to affect that end. So I I mean I think you've you've been very articulate. Uh I care deeply about this. As I told you, there are 86 Judith P. Hoyer early childhood education centers in our state where she brought everybody together full service.
▶ 2:10:28not stovepipe, not you're a teacher, you're a nurse, uh you're a social service, you're you you help parents have housing. She brought them together. We have 86 of those centers. Uh and we need to bring America together in saying we're not accomplishing an objective we all know is critically important and that is making sure that every one of our children is not a cost to us but a contributor to
▶ 2:10:58the welfare of our country then America will be Well said. I certainly appreciate that. The fact is, sir, with all due respect, we have failed with everything that we've put in place with programs of the best of intentions of working together and we've not done it well enough. We have failed our students to look at these scores. We have to do something different.
▶ 2:11:24I am definitely want to work with Congress because that is the only way I think that we can achieve our goals is working with Congress and I look forward to that. Thank you, Representative Vice. Thank you and thank you Madam Secretary for staying uh some additional time. I want to circle back on my final question in their earlier round in regards to the anti-semitism we've seen across the country um not only in colleges and universities but also in elementary schools across the country.
▶ 2:11:52I mentioned I have an individual, a friend of mine whose daughters were at a public school. Um they were uh harassed and the issues were not addressed and the parents were forced to take their children out of a public school and put them into a private school um for their own safety. And so I'd like to you you wanted to I think uh follow up on that issue and I wanted to give you the opportunity. Well, thank you.
▶ 2:12:16I certainly uh the president has made it very clear that he does not condone any kind of discrimination racial uh and especially it we we've we've seen it religious we've seen it across our college campuses some of the most elite in the country and we took very strong and very decisive action against those universities who clearly were not protecting Jewish students against anti-semitism against some yeah anti when
▶ 2:12:47they were anti-semitic um those that were attacking them when you've seen students barricaded in the library and others pounding on the glass going death to Jews death to Israel death to the United States that is unacceptable in our college campuses and we reacted uh we re we reacted to Colombia first did not that happened this incident happened at Colombia and uh I met with the president of Colombia I've had two conversations now with the current president of Colombia.
▶ 2:13:17We've talked about things that we need to do at those universities. Uh we want to be able to be supportive, but those universities, albeit they're private, do receive federal funding. We have leverage to withhold some of that federal funding or to cancel some of the grants. And we will do that unless it can be proven that these colleges and universities are going to respect all rights and set their policy in place and and enforce them.
▶ 2:13:46And I was complimentary to um President uh the the acting president now at Colombia uh Claire Shipman when I talked to her last week and I said you reacted just as you said you would to the recent uh uprising on campus. You you uh uh you you looking at whether or not you you've expended students, are you going to suspended students, are you going to expel them? Uh and that's still what she's looking at.
▶ 2:14:14So, we've seen that that kind of action can deliver results. Um and I appreciate that very much. I want to make sure that we also focus on elementary um you know K through 12 because it's happening in our public school system as well. The last thing is I've introduced legislation the last two congresses titled the workforce and education partnership act which incentivizes public private partnerships between educational institutions and employers to improve workforce development.
▶ 2:14:41You mentioned it earlier in your testimony that this is something your um your agency's looking at. I'd love to work with you on that legislation. I look forward to that. Thank you, Madam Secretary. I yield. Thank you, Representative Frankle. Thank listen uh I'm not going to ask myself any questions. All right. So you better you can listen listen carefully but thank you. We we might not agree in everything but I thank you so much for being here. Couple of follows up. Uh first on this uh discrimination the anti-semitism and so forth.
▶ 2:15:11Uh my understanding is that uh half of the office of civil rights is now what's called on a riff. That means they're going to be fired in June. half the half half of your staff are going to be fired on June and there's a cut uh a proposed cut of $49 million which is a 35% cut.
▶ 2:15:33So what I'm asking you to do if you are sincere about uh fighting anti-semitism and also all kinds of unlawful discrimination that you please take a look at that. And there are a couple of other things I'd like you to take a look at.
▶ 2:15:47uh near and dear to my heart as the mom of a a United States Marine veteran who actually did go to college, but I I saw him when he came back and I've uh known other veterans and I see the diff difficulty sometimes they have in just transitioning to just everyday life. Uh he's good. He's fine now. That's not the problem here. But a lot of veterans come back. They want to go to college. They haven't been in college. And I'm and and it is for lots of them the transition's difficult.
▶ 2:16:16So we have with a small amount of money set up uh these student veteran centers at colleges around the country and they are very very successful and they are at risk of being cut. They're they're in the current budget. I would like you to take a look at that and see whether or not you can fund them because uh applications are supposed to go out now for the grant. So please look at that.
▶ 2:16:42Now the other thing I'd like you uh to look at uh yesterday was a me a meeting with health care uh and they are concerned with this the uh limit on the PEL grant eligibility the cap cap on the amount students can borrow and especially eliminating the grant plus loan program which helps the graduate students including those in medicine and nursings uh to cover the full cost of tuition and living while
▶ 2:17:12exhausting standard loans and they were very very very concerned and they said there's a big shortage I think we all know there's a shortage of doctors and nurses and they believe that by eliminating this plus program uh we we're going to lose lots of people from entering the medical field so I would just ask you to please take a look at that and you can answer but I really don't have a question other than would you please take a look at those items yeah yes we will because I do think it's fairly incumbent.
▶ 2:17:42We do know that we have a shortage of nurses and doctors and I think there are a lot of educational programs, you know, that we can look at to to train nurse technicians uh to get them into the marketplace faster to service a lot of the needs. And so, a lot of those different kind of programs I'd like to discuss with you, okay? And take a look at those loan programs because that's what they are worried about. And again, let's enforce the discrimination and let's help our veterans. And with that, I yield back. Thank you.
▶ 2:18:10Thank you, Representative Litlo. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Madam Secretary, I know you've addressed it multiple times today, but just to put my constituents at ease. I represent a mostly rural district, and I know there's been a lot of fear-mongering out there about Title One funding. Can you help me put their minds at ease that those dollars will find a way to get down to the rural districts who don't always have access to uh a different option for their children? Title One funding is Title One A funding is totally intact.
▶ 2:18:41Wonderful. I'll be sure to to let them know that. Um, you know, last year I actually uh uh questioned Secretary Cardona on his handling of uh providing more administrative staff to work on student loan forgiveness as opposed to the disastrous FASA rollout that we were dealing with. I come from higher education so I know how detrimental that can be for higher ed and especially for parents and students trying to figure out what college they're going to go to.
▶ 2:19:10Uh so can you kind of put our minds at ease that what is the department doing to ensure that the federal student aid offices are returning to its focus to its core mission which is serving students administering aid and supporting successful loan repayment uh making sure that they're doing their jobs. Yeah. Well, we we've spent quite a bit of effort, you know, with FSA and uh and with the FASA program as well. You know, that kind of went off the rails. Uh so it's back on.
▶ 2:19:39Uh it is up and running and ready. The the the current year is uh proceeding as it should. Uh we are getting the year after that, the year after that ready to be in place and we've made great strides uh in doing that and so we're back up and running and functioning fully. Thank you so much. My universities will be ecstatic to hear that. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Thank you, Representative Dean. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh Secretary McMahon.
▶ 2:20:07Um I wanted to hit quickly two topics. Mental health uh cuts. The administration cut a billion dollars. Well, actually, let's put it this way. Just stop paying. A billion dollars allocated for mental health service professional demonstration grant and school-based mental health services grant. Do you recognize that our school children uh are struggling with mental health? Many of our children are struggling with mental health.
▶ 2:20:33I think mental health is uh is do you recognize our students critical component around the country? Our students some students. Yes. Yes. Uh it was made worse during the time of COVID. It is exacerbated by school shootings. I I noted that you uh said you were going to meet with parents uh and children uh who had struggled and suffered the trauma of school shootings. I've done that uh over the years.
▶ 2:20:59Sadly, I've had the opportunity uh to meet with Uvalde parents, with Parkland parents, with Sandy Hook parents. Are you meeting with uh parents and children students in those places? I have only in Sandy Hook because that happened in my my state of Connecticut. Yes. So, I have met with some of those parents shortly after and I can't imagine a more horrible tragedy than that. How about the students to see how they are affected? I I've not talked to many of the students. No. Do you plan to do that? Sure.
▶ 2:21:29I would enjoy doing that. Uh how soon can you do that? Because you did talk about doing that on CNN recently. I'm not sure how quickly, but you're the secretary. You could do whatever you want because after all, you're cutting all this funding. You've got time. I've got a lot of responsibilities to do and we're going to focus on the things that I think are going to ensure that we're providing equal education for all of the students in our country. That's great. Uh which is just in contrast to actually what you have said and what you said the president cares about.
▶ 2:21:59He wants the best educated students, right? He wants to make education great again, right? Yes. I don't understand. It seems like a logic fallacy to me. You think the federal department of education is not living up to what it ought to be doing and you cite some statistics uh for students who are not doing as well as they ought to be and yet you decide that the answer to that is not to check on these investments and make sure students are achieving.
▶ 2:22:29It is shut the whole dog on thing down. That doesn't make any sense. Well, I think the fallacy is the way you're stating it and what I have looked at and said from the very beginning, we have failed this system we have in place doesn't. So, it is your mission that it is the mission to shut down the bureaucracy of the department of education and return education. Shut down the department of education to shut down the bureaucracy. What's the balance right now? To shut down the bureaucracy the balance right now education in the funding for education.
▶ 2:22:58What's the split the pie chart? How much is federal? How much is state and local? Federal is about uh 8 to 10%. Correct. The rest is state and local. The burden is already there. And you don't want to come up with the 8% to help our kids succeed to help their mental health. Excuse to help kids with disabilities. You're wrong. You're mis logic fallacy. No, no, no. You were misstating the funding. It's not taking away all of this funding.
▶ 2:23:24I've already said title 1A funding, IDA funding is still going to come. How about the mental health funding that there may be some more of that funding if if HHS overseas then the president unconstitutionally therefore that funding may come into those states. So I think we have to see and I think we have to see what those programs are that are going to best serve every student and not uh just be put by the wayside.
▶ 2:23:51As I said you you on page one of your testimony gentle lady's time president's vision is to make education great again. It's a logic fallacy, but I guess we're not going to teach our kids about logic fallacies. Thank you. We haven't yet with the Department of Education in place the way it has been since 1980. I I I'm on I'm on the record of ruling for change. I now recognize the ranking member for her closing statement. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Madam Secretary, uh for for for being here.
▶ 2:24:20I appreciate your time and your effort. Let me um just repeat um state and local taxes overwhelmingly pay for education in this country. And what we do know is that if you block grant current federal funding and you get it try get it to the states there is a cut. There will be programs cut.
▶ 2:24:47What we do not know anything about at the moment is what is going to be cut. We have no knowledge and we're doing this hearing about appropriating dollars on a budget that we know nothing of at the at the moment. So given that but block grants we know are cuts.
▶ 2:25:06There is everybody at this dis people who are here and people who are gone and more than anything else the states know that you talk to any governor and they will tell you they're going to cut our funding and I dare to say they're not a lot of states uh today and a lot of governors who have the uh uh resources um that they will need in order to be able uh to continue these programs.
▶ 2:25:32Um, let me also say, Madam Secretary, as I said in my remarks, you have no authority to dismantle the Department of Education. The president has no authority to dismantle the Department of Education. And yes, the Supreme Court has opined on that with uh a Supreme Court Justice Scalia saying there's no inherent authority.
▶ 2:25:56And there's plenty of other uh uh uh cases and court uh determinations that it's not there. So you don't have the authority. You do not have the authority to steal congressionally appropriated dollars. That is in the United States Constitution. I hear people in the administration talking about adhering to Constitution. Article one, it's there.
▶ 2:26:25So what you are doing now get to your budget for 2026. What's happened right now is unlawful. It is unlawful. And uh you have uh uh really un unlawfully um created uh and recklessly canled grants for mental health uh for the professionals in our schools, psychologists, counselors, social workers.
▶ 2:26:54grants to support effective educator development. Teacher quality partnership grants to make sure that more qualified educators are entering classrooms and relieving local teacher shortages. the Institute of Educational contracts to researchers so we can learn about what works and what doesn't work to improve student literacy which you care about.
▶ 2:27:21Reduce chronic absenteeism, ensure college students complete their degrees so that they can get a good job. You have no authority. If children, teachers, principles benefited from a federally appropriated program in the last school year, they should benefit from that program this school year and not be subjected to any unlawful chaos that you seek to impose on them.
▶ 2:27:53You said right here and and several times this morning that you will abide by the law and I believe that the law budget is under a continuing resolution based on the 2024 budget which has pages of directives as to what can be uh of
▶ 2:28:23uh what are the resources for what the programs are for. I I understand you and your commitment to abide by the law which means that we are going to reverse these efforts that apply to 2025 and we will hold you accountable to that. I am glad to hear that you will abide by the law and we all know what the law is. It was passed in the House. It was passed in the Senate.
▶ 2:28:53Civics 101. And the president signed it. It's the law of the land. You can't back off it willy-nilly. Let me mention just I have a copy here of the um the table labor, health, and human services and education related agencies here. And this is move to the 26 budget. and and and people need need to know this impact aid.
▶ 2:29:21We have no information about comprehensive literacy development grant eliminated innovative approaches to literacy eliminated. We go to um school improvement uh programs uh most of it to be determined. We don't know where where it's all going here. Uh Indian education, no info to be determined. innovation and improvement. Basically, there's money for the charter schools, but everything else is to be determined.
▶ 2:29:50Um, uh, safe schools and and and citizenship education, no information. English l language acquisition eliminated. I go back to my father couldn't read or write the language. They laughed at him and he left school. We do have kids in our schools who need to have English language and to do it quickly. That's what we talk about here.
▶ 2:30:15Special education, rehabilitation service, I'm sorry, rehabilitation service and disability research, no info. Special institutions for persons with disabilities, no info. Career and technical and and and adult education training, uh, no info. And we had the secretary of labor here just a few days ago and they have eliminated adult training and youth training and the WEOA programs here. Adult education here eliminated.
▶ 2:30:43Um we don't know that what will happen to PEL grants that is that is to be determined. The SEAG program a federal supplemental education opportunity grant eliminated a student aid administration to be determined.
▶ 2:31:00Uh this is of higher education eliminated parts of it or there are uh of or no specifics international education and foreign language no specifics post-secary programs for students and intellectual disabilities you got federal you got trio and gear up eliminated no specifics teacher quality partnership eliminated childcare access means parents in school eliminated fund for the improvement of postsecary education eliminated um well
▶ 2:31:30Howard university. No real specifics in that effort. Long and the short of it, this is the table that this committee with appropriations is what we're doing is without any information without any information we are being asked to provide resources and resources that have been cut by 15%. The 12 billion dollars we have no idea where it's coming from.
▶ 2:31:55So the 18 programs are getting eliminated, replaced with a block grant that's cutting four and a half billion dollars. And we have no idea and no detail of what is on the chopping block. That should say something um uh to to to my colleagues on the appropriations committee because this is our job.
▶ 2:32:15The role of secretary of education is an enormous The American people look to the man or woman who holds this post as someone who performs their responsibilities with deep knowledge of our public schools and colleges.
▶ 2:32:31But when you opine about strategies to improve literacy, how to improve academic achievement or help people get a college degree, I struggle to see why the public should look to you as such an authority.
▶ 2:32:47What experiences, what knowledge that you bring into this role that should give them any confidence that what you say or what the administration is saying is credible in terms of the future of their children. It is beyond distressing, Madam Secretary, to see public education decimated and as I said in my remarks, not on our watch.
▶ 2:33:15I yield Thank you, ranking member. And uh Madam Secretary, I want to thank you for being with us today and for your testimony. I've been very encouraged to hear about your efforts to make American education great again.
▶ 2:33:29And you're doing it by empowering states to take back the reigns of education from the federal government in Washington DC and also encouraged by your efforts to put families at the forefront of their children's education which is where it should be and by emphasizing parental choice charter schools and other education freedom policies. Nothing is more important to parents than the education of their children.
▶ 2:33:57Similarly, I'm pleased to hear about your efforts to rein in waste, fraud, and abuse within the department. And finally, I'd like to thank you for your efforts to ensure that both K12 and institutions of higher education adhere to civil rights laws, especially to address As you noted in your testimony, every student deserves an education free from bias, unfair treatment, or ideological agendas that undermine equal opportunity.
▶ 2:34:26So, thank you again, Madam Secretary, for your hard work and for joining us today. And we look forward to partnering with you as as we consider the department's budget request. And with that, the hearing is adjourned. Thank you very much. Thank you. Got to get this next meeting.