▶ 0:20:04I want to welcome our witnesses and thank you all for your service to our great country. Uh we are here today uh to hear from the Department of the Air Force on its FY26 budget request. Unfortunately, we've still not received uh information on the Air Force's budget request, which makes today's hearing a little difficult. Uh we'll need that budget in order to fully evaluate how Congress can best support our airmen and guardians.
▶ 0:20:33We're facing the most complex threat environment in history. Complex threat environment in history. China is moving forward on sixth generation fighter jets and sophisticated air defense systems. Uh they are expanding their nuclear arsenal at an alarming rate and they are deploying advanced hypersonic weapons and long-range cruise missiles capable of hitting our homeland. That's why it's never been more important to invest in modern systems that will deter and defeat threats against our nation.
▶ 0:21:02Fortunately, the House pass reconciliation bill makes gener generational investments in our national security. The bill provides over $7 billion to support air superiority, including funds to acquire the F-47, the most advanced and lethal aircraft ever built. It provides 13 billion to modernize our nuclear deterrent and rebuild related infrastructure. And it invests over 25 billion in Golden Dome layered missile defense system.
▶ 0:21:33But sixth generation fighters, nuclear modernization and golden dome are all big ticket items that will take years to fully develop. And the funding in our reconciliation bill will not be enough to f fully support those initiatives. That's why it's so important for defense spending to grow in the out years. Reconciliation is a one-time investment. We've got to do more.
▶ 0:21:56It must be followed by healthy increases in the base budget so we can afford to fill these critical capabilities without cuts to readiness. While I'm supportive of much of the Air Force's work, I do have concerns with some of the ongoing projects. Nuclear deterrence is vital to our national security and I'm concerned that the Air Force is not adequately prioritizing it. Specifically, I'm troubled by past mismanagement of the Sentinel program.
▶ 0:22:26We must ensure Sentinel is ready in time to replace the current ICBMs before they reach their end of life. Congress has been explicit about the need to address Sentinel's cost and schedule overruns. We have prioritized and appropriated funding to fix these problems and yet the Air Force has taken 1.2 billion out of Sentinel funds and used them instead to meet our other priorities in FY25. I want to be very clear.
▶ 0:22:53The Sentinel program is vital to modernizing our triad and ensuring nuclear deterrence. Senior Air Force leaders have made frequent statements agreeing that the service must prioritize nuclear deterrence. It's time to start walking the walk. I look forward to working with you to get this program back on track. I'm also concerned with our ability to fight and win in space.
▶ 0:23:18Specifically, I worry that when we see the budget, it may not adequately fund the Space Force. This is one reason why we need budget details so we can evaluate whether the funding is in line with our priorities within the Space Force. I want to be sure we don't lose sight of our mission. Space Force got its start in this committee driven by a desire to improve the way we buy things for space.
▶ 0:23:46Winning the fight in space requires us to quickly develop advanced systems and platforms. Doing so starts with highly trained acquisition professionals. Every guard guardian supports the war fighting mission. So I encourage you to ensure that in in the space force operators, acquisition, intel, and cyber professionals are all on equal footing.
▶ 0:24:10Finally, as the department starts rebalancing the general officer corps, I strongly encourage you to ensure that the Space Force receives additional billets to address its unique needs as a new and growing service. I look forward to working with you to ensure our American, our airmen and guardians have the resources they need to successfully carry out their critical missions. With that, I yield to my friend, the ranking member, for any opening statement he may have. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 0:24:36as as is usually the case, I agree substantially with your assessment and and the budget certainly is where the problem starts. I mean, first of all, we don't have one. Um, this is the latest we've gone um in history, I believe, without getting a budget is very important. I know you gentlemen are not in charge of that, but to the extent that you have influence, um, if we could encourage the White House to get this process moving, that would be enormously helpful. it's difficult for Congress to do its job and adequately fund our needs without having the starting point of the president's budget.
▶ 0:25:06But the second problem is what the chairman alluded to. Um within the needs that we know that we're looking at um in the Air Force's area, there's a lot to cram in there and it does not appear like it's going to all fit.
▶ 0:25:19So, I'm particularly curious as you're trying to balance, you know, as we move towards the F-47, um the former Ingad, we try to upgrade the nuclear triad, you know, meet our fighter attack needs, um deal with the UAVs, um all of that, how space, how does that come together and fit into a budget that makes sense? Because it seems like, you know, we are starting a lot of programs that ultimately we're not going to be afford to be able to afford to fund all of them.
▶ 0:25:48So it'd be better if we made choices upfront. So we're going to have a lot of questions about how does that work? How does all these programs go forward and we still wind up with the budget that we need in space? I am encouraged by the improvements um that have been made on building a resilient architecture. Space is so central to everything we do in terms of secure communications, dealing with contested logistics. Um we've made a lot of progress and I want want to thank the chairman and in abstentia. Uh thank Mr. Cooper, former member. uh it was uh the chairman and Mr.
▶ 0:26:18Cooper who had the vision to create the space force in the first place. I think that's enormously important, but we'd like to get further updates on how that architecture is being updated to make it more resilient and meet all of those very difficult needs. Lastly, as I'm sure you've heard, acquisition reform is an enormous priority uh for this committee and for Congress. We're going to take a big swing at it this year. I would be curious to hear your thoughts about what that looks like. Um, sadly within your department between the tanker, the F-35 and the Sentinel, we have a lot of experience with programs that went way over budget.
▶ 0:26:48Uh, what have we learned? How can we do that better? And then connected to that as well, something we talked about yesterday, taking advantage of a lot of in many cases smaller innovative companies that are building crucial things around missiles, satellites, UAVs, um, that are much cheaper um, and much more effective many instances. how do we integrate those new innovative companies into the defense um department so we can take advantage of the technologies and the equipment that they're building.
▶ 0:27:16Uh with that, I look forward to your testimony and I yield back. I thank the ranking member. U now I'd like to introduce our witnesses. The honorable Troy Mink is the Secretary of the Air Force. Congratulations and welcome. Uh General Chance Saltzman, Chief of Space Operations. Welcome back. and General David Alvin is chief of staff of the Air Force. Welcome back, General. Um, I want to start with you, Mr. Mink, you're recognized for five minutes. Uh, thank you, Mr.
▶ 0:27:46Chairman. So, Chairman Rogers, Ranking Member Smith, and distinguished members of the committee, General Alvin, General Saltzman, and I thank you for the opportunity to testify uh here today. We're looking forward to it. Uh, the Department of the Air Force is at an inflection point. Uh we are engaging in a fast-paced race for technology superiority against a well-resourced strategic opponent. However, we simultaneously face uh personnel and platform challenges affecting our immediate readiness.
▶ 0:28:14We must balance our requirements to generate readiness and project power today with imperative to rebuild our military and develop capabilities so that we can continue to deter our adversaries tomorrow. Our fiscal priorities are focused on addressing the balance between these realities and supporting national security objectives as outlined in the interim national defense guidance.
▶ 0:28:38The scope and severity of the threat to our homeland and national interests are significant and increasing and we are now facing one of the most dangerous security environments in our history. Department of the Air Force has structured our long-term strategy around the belief that China is our pacing threat. And this reality directly influences the department's fiscal priorities. China's defense budget has nearly doubled during the past 11 years, growing 6% annually on average.
▶ 0:29:06US defense spending has seen around 3% growth over the same period, increasing below the rate of inflation over the last five years. and many of our allies and partners uh defense spending rates are even lower than ours. These limitations have allowed China to start closing the gap. Defending the homeland is the Department of the Air Force's top priority.
▶ 0:29:24We will we will be continuing to do so by modernizing our nuclear force, especially through the Sentinel, the B-21, longrange standoff weapons, as well as the nuclear command and control and communication that supports these systems. We're also eagle eager to support the president's golden dome for America. While still in a conceptual stage, there's no question that the Department of the Air Force will have a significant role in this project. Our next priority is to deter China.
▶ 0:29:55We will do this through investments in our people, our readiness, and our posture within the Indo-Pacific region. We believe that our people are and will continue to be one of the nation's key competitive We are working to train our airmen and guardians to confront the brutal challenges that warfare without sanctuary presents. We are emphasizing readiness by creating new inspections, assessments, and exercises geared towards preparing our personnel for this environment.
▶ 0:30:24Finally, we are strengthening our posture within Indoacific region, conducting high level operational exercises that will test our ability to deploy and operate in austere environments. Lastly, the Department of the Air Force is prepared to provide critical capabilities and forces to the joint war fighter in order to defeat our adversaries if deterrence fails. We will concentrate our areas our efforts in two areas. first in our ability to fight today and second in our ability to fight in the future.
▶ 0:30:54Through our current and future investments, the department aims to establish a balance of high and low mix of combat capabilities optimized to project power both from within and outside the adversar's threat environment. The Department of Air Force is also looking to streamline our forces whenever possible. This includes finding creative ways to remove excess infrastructure and retire obsolete inventory.
▶ 0:31:19We also rec recognize our need and responsibility to pass an audit as soon as possible and we are working to make that a reality. The Department of the Air Force is extremely proud of all of our airmen and guardians defending our great nation and its interest every hour of every day. We commit to working with this committee to secure the FY26 budget request which will directly support our airmen and guardians and their uncompromising mission.
▶ 0:31:48We thank you for your time and look forward to your questions. Thank you, Mr. Secretary. General Saltzman, you're recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Chairman Rogers, Ranking Member Smith, distinguished members of the committee. Thank you for your continued support and for the opportunity to testify on the Space Force's posture for FY26. Never before in our history has space been more critical to the future of our nation. No more than ever satellites underpin our economic prosperity, enabling everything from transportation, communication to agriculture and finance.
▶ 0:32:18Space has likewise become the backbone of national security. And today's joint force is built around the assumption that space power will be there when needed. GPS allows our forces to mass and maneuver fires with unprecedented accuracy and efficiency. Satellite communications ensure command and control of operations around the world in real time. And today's cutting edge satellites provide the war fighter with constant and detailed battlefield awareness, alerting America's forces of missile launches and threatening adversarial activity.
▶ 0:32:47All of these effects and more are provided by your Space Force. At a cost of only about 3% of the larger DoD budget and with less than 1% of the personnel, there's no question our nation's space force is a great value proposition for the department and an indispensable n national asset for modern power projection. It is imperative that we match the dramatic rise in threats and increasing importance of space with resources to arm the space force effectively. The space force has been asked to accept new responsibilities and new missions.
▶ 0:33:16These new missions require new resources or we will face tough choices between delayed readiness, reduced capacity, or unadressed vulnerabilities. To illustrate my point, in the past three years, the Space Force has been asked to take on critical new missions like ground and air moving target indications, adding new space control capabilities, advanced training requirements, and a three-fold increase in launch tempo at our national space ports. The most recent addition to our mission set is the space-based technology associated with the Golden Dome program.
▶ 0:33:46These are not modernization efforts or shifts from legacy mission. They represent new requirements for missions that have never been accomplished by a military space organization. By FY26, we will have laid the foundational groundwork to continue these efforts in earnest. Our acquisition efforts are fully leveraging expanded authorities, enhanced contracting mechanisms, and new processes like the software acquisition pathway.
▶ 0:34:09If the resources are made available, the Space Force will be postured to use them effectively in pursuit of these critical priority missions at a time of increasing adversarial challenges in the space domain. To be successful in our expanding mission portfolio, we must be able to control the space domain, protecting our capabilities in space while denying an adversary the ability to use space against us. In pursuit of our critical missions, Space Force priorities have remained consistent.
▶ 0:34:35build comprehensive domain awareness, deploy resilient mission architectures, and develop the capacity to hold an adversary space assets at risk. To that end, we are developing cutting edge sensors and networks to provide critical information to decision makers. We are bolstering our launch infrastructure and deployed proliferates constellations that are more resilient to attack. We are developing a host of innovative means to protect our satellites and networks. And we are investing in robust counterpace systems to defeat space enabled threats to our forces and to our homeland.
▶ 0:35:06Driving a cultural change to increase the speed and effectiveness of acquiring these new systems will be critical to our success. In fact, this is part of the Guardian DNA. Since improving acquisition was a driving force behind the creation of the Space Force from day one. Our acquisition professionals understand the unique needs of the war fighter.
▶ 0:35:23And these guardians have driven efficiencies across all mission areas, saving hundreds of millions of dollars on launch services, leveraging novel contracting authorities to shave months off contracting timelines, and setting a new record for tactically responsive space just last year.
▶ 0:35:38All this while embracing a number of changes to our institutional culture to support improved acquisition, readiness, and sustainment, including standing up integrated units with sustainment and operations side by side and establishing enhanced acquisition training at all levels to ensure a firm understanding of how acquisitions and operations combine to com to create combat ready forces.
▶ 0:36:00We must institutionalize these early wins to ensure the complex ecosystems of acquisition, budget, and requirements continues to rapidly produce the equipment our war fighters need to win in space. Today, with your support, our nation's guardians are poised to ensure we maintain our national advantage in space. So again, thank you to the committee for providing the support to make these successes possible. And I thank you for the opportunity to highlight the tremendous work that our guardians are doing to secure our nation's interests in, from, and to space. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:36:30Thank you, General Saltzman. General Alvin, you're recognized. Good morning, Chairman Rogers, Ranking Member Smith, and distinguished members of this committee. I'm proud to represent the 677,000 total force airmen serving our nation. Thank you for your support, not only to those airmen, but to their families as well. I'd like to open by expressing my immense pride in the exemplary performance of our airmen in securing our homeland and deployed worldwide. From the Indopacific to the Middle East to our southern border, they are working around the clock to deliver air power anytime, anywhere.
▶ 0:36:59The strategic landscape has shifted dramatically. We now operate in a world where the PRC is not only rapidly modernizing its military, but is doing so with a clear intent to coers its neighbors and reshape the international order to include a PRC nuclear breakout that demands unmatched deterrence capabilities. In parallel, we are seeing unprecedented threats to our homeland. Our mission is clear. maintain air power dominance and safeguard our security, deter aggression, and prevail in conflict. To achieve peace through strength, we must adapt and evolve.
▶ 0:37:28Reinforced by our most recent interim national defense strategic guidance, our air force has three enduring priorities. First, we must defend the homeland. Air and missile threats are evolving in both speed and sophistication, and the ability to detect, track, and defeat those threats in real time is foundational to our national defense and is non-negotiable. Simultaneously, the United States Air Force provides reliable, effective, and safe nuclear deterrent that is the backbone of strategic stability.
▶ 0:37:54These priorities are paramount, cannot fail, and must be given equal weight. Finally, we must project power globally, either independently or as part of the joint force, to rapidly respond anywhere to deter aggression and win. This is what makes our air force unique, and it is needed now more than ever. To achieve these priorities, we are asking for sustained support for modernization and the development of new capabilities. The FY26 budget request is designed to build a force aligned with today's operational realities.
▶ 0:38:22This means preserving current readiness and optimizing our force tailored to design for cap for contested environments. One that blends next generation aircraft, autonomous systems, and resilient command and control. Our modernization efforts to rebuild our military include the continued development of the F-47, the integration of collaborative combat aircraft, and other possibilities to expand combat mass at lower cost. We're also upgrading the F-35 and F-15. These platforms are critical to retain the edge of our war fighters need.
▶ 0:38:52At the same time, we are recapitalizing aging fleets, essential for maintaining power projection in the interim. Our investment in nuclear modernization remains a top priority with funding directed towards Sentinel program, B-21 radar, and the revitalized B-52 fleet. These systems will anchor our strategic deterrent for decades to come. Equally important is the investment in our airmen. We are enhancing recruiting, expanding training opportunities, and strengthening family structure support structures.
▶ 0:39:19We suffered a recruiting setback due to the year-long continuing resolution and subsequent reduction of nearly a half a billion dollars in our military personnel account. This will result in our inability to fund the recruitment of 3,000 Americans who want to join our air force. Furthermore, the reduced FOY25 budget trigger triggered by the continuing resolution led to a decrease in facility sustainment restoration restoration and modernization by $642 million directly affecting our airmen's quality of life. We must find a better way.
▶ 0:39:50Investing our airmen means ruthlessly prioritizing in the right capabilities and projects while devesting from aging systems and unused infrastructure. In January 2025, we reported 23% in excess facilities and 60% in excess parking aprons and ramps. This inefficient layown of force structure across our installations suggest there are opportunities for consolidation innovation or to devest and focus our limited resources where they are most needed.
▶ 0:40:16With your support, we will focus on utilizing existing authorities to reduce infrastructure, identify cost reduction and revenue generating opportunities, and rightsize our infrastructure to achieve long-term efficiencies. We don't just need more air force. We need a more capable one. We need more tooth, less tail. A force that can deliver rapid, decisive blows and reposition quickly. That means investing in platforms and people that enhance our warf fighting capacity. More means more options for our nation.
▶ 0:40:46enhanced homeland defense, strengthened deterrence, and unmatched power projection. One strategically postured to deny adversaries. No other service can match what the Air Force delivers effects anywhere on the globe at any scale on minimal notice. Our airmen are the best in the world, ready to win today and build the enduring force for tomorrow. With your support, we can ensure the Air Force remains the cornerstone of American power through the 21st century. Thank you, and I look forward to your questions. Thank you, General Alvin.
▶ 0:41:16Thank all of you. I'd like to recognize myself first for questions. Uh, Mr. Secretary, as the Space Force works to develop, uh, the culture of war fighting in space, I want to make sure that we aren't leaving behind our acquisition guardians, uh, General Saltzman and I have talked about this at length. Uh, can I get your commitment to make sure that we aren't going to see their promotion rates falling behind the average promotion rates of Space Force officers and other categories? Yes, m Mr. Chairman, I I commit to that.
▶ 0:41:46Thank you. And uh as you are probably aware, I hope you're aware that that um our current defense and some of you have referenced this, our current defense acquisition system is failing us. Uh the ranking member and I have made it our focus this year uh to address that. Uh what specific authorities or support can we provide you um to fix this?
▶ 0:42:10Uh I think you actually you you highlighted out right away with uh making sure that we have the right workforce and promoting the right officers with the acquisition workforce. Uh the experience I've had is if you don't have the right team, the right experience uh and educated team, you're you're that can structure the program well and execute the program. No matter what else you do, you're not going to be successful. So that that's that's a starting and then you have to give the then you have to give the uh the the team the authorities, right?
▶ 0:42:37all the way from being able to manage maybe not the high level but the lower level requirements the funding the all the LDS that go into delivering these systems you have to make sure that they have that authority to do so um and to be able to have that authority that they execute quickly and in a streamlined fashion I think it's one of the problems that we have is in many cases technically we have a lot of authorities to do these things it's just there's so much bureaucracy tied up in them uh that it takes too long so those are the kind of things that's what we're trying to to to weed out so if your staff is started not doing
▶ 0:43:07so. I hope that they will stay in touch with the HA staff and the SAS staff because this is not just bipartisan. This is biccameal. Uh and make sure that the language we're putting in this year's NDAA gets after the problems you just described. Uh because we're all going to have to live with what we what we enact this year. And and go ahead, chairman. I would be happy to personally sit down and walk through that with you if you're interested. Well, we look forward to that.
▶ 0:43:36Uh, and also it's my understanding our newest KC46s are coming off the line hovering at a fully mission capab capability rate of only 60%. We talked a little bit about this in the skiff yesterday. I just urge you to get after that. 60% is not acceptable. Um, the you made reference to and uh and it's accurate uh that China's defense budget has doubled in recent years. In fact, I think it was General Alvin that brought this up.
▶ 0:44:03Uh we have got to address our defense spending in this country. We are at the lowest level of defense spending as a percentage of GDP since before World War II. Uh and it's it's unacceptable. We're going to have to deal with it. The president has set the goal. He told uh went over to Europe and told every member of NATO that we all need to be getting to 5% of GDP and defense spending. I fully agree with him.
▶ 0:44:29General Salsman talked about the need for his department to have budget relief as did General Alvin. Uh we can't do it at the current rate. Th this this reconciliation bill is going to be a a nice bump, a one-year bump, but to get after the issues we talked about uh in our opening statements and as y'all just described is going to require sustained uh increases in defense spending.
▶ 0:44:53And uh I assure you that that we're working to try to get there, but it's going to be important that you continue to talk about it. Uh the fact is the public doesn't just need to hear from the president and us. You need to be talking about it because you're the the tip of the spear and they need to hear from you what the challenges are for you to meet the threats given the constraints of of your fiscal uh support at this point in time. So, uh, with that, I will, um, yield to the ranking member for any questions he may have.
▶ 0:45:24Thank you. Uh, excuse me. Just curious, um, been a lot in the news, Ukraine's drone strikes, their effectiveness ability, basically tiny, cheap, um, drones taking a billion dollars worth of big, heavy equipment. How has that ch has it changed your thinking at all about what our needs are going forward uh in terms of having more of those cheaper uh attraitable unmanned systems and also the vulnerabilities of some of the larger systems that we're building? How does that change your planning going forward?
▶ 0:45:53Um or is the Ukraine Russia war sort of unique and not applicable to some of these other lessons? I could I can start uh Congressman and and and then turn it over to General Alvin, but to be honest, I don't think it changed my opinion at all. I' I've been very very concerned uh with that threat for years now.
▶ 0:46:15Um, we've seen it within the US against many of our installations and our inability to to deal with those actually probably lower threat than obviously what happened within Russia. But that's that's been an ongoing threat that that I think we've been thinking about for a long time and it's going to take a whole of government approach to deal with in the US. Um, it's very difficult to defend against that sort of thing if you're you're restricted to only operating within your your your the geography of your base.
▶ 0:46:41I think we have to work with the whole of government to make sure that we have an approach to to deal with that threat because it is it is huge. Specific on that in terms of ah this is a system that we've been looking at that we desperately need now because of that whereas maybe we shouldn't build all of this because it's really expensive and really vulnerable. Uh if I could I'll turn to General Alvin maybe take a couple of those. Thanks. And Congressman, you you make the right point where we we shouldn't learn too much and we shouldn't ignore what happened in Ukraine because there are uh geography dependent, context dependent.
▶ 0:47:12But I would say that uh when something like this happens, it turns the idea of uh small and less expensive uh um capabilities from an academic conversation to a real conversation because we've seen it. And so understanding the context that made it successful and those which might be limitations is important. But to Secretary Mang's point, we sort of always knew this in the back of our mind.
▶ 0:47:33So when we're looking at it from two directions, first of all, to your point of where are our exquisite systems and what are the vulnerabilities we hadn't considered before and which might be most vulnerable to those that might have to cross an ocean and part of our continent rather than just the the geography of Central Europe. understanding those nuances, but understanding also that there are the more the more sophisticated and dependent we are on those exquisite capabilities, the higher level of defense we need to have for them.
▶ 0:47:59The flip side that I like to bring up is is something that solves another problem. When we see how effective these can be, we need to think about putting them into our offensive arsenal. And that's what we're looking at United States Air Force is our change and our new force design understands this this sort of range of capabilities to include those when they could be responsive at low cost and be disruptive. So there's an offensive thing we need to consider on this as well. Somewhat connected to that is the whole golden dome concept and I have a number of different concerns about it.
▶ 0:48:27Um it reminds me vaguely of the um future combat systems that the army cranked up 30 years ago where it was like we know we got to do a lot so let's just put a name on it and say we're going to do everything and it's all going to work. It was a complete disaster. Um and go the golden dome idea that there's one system that's going to protect every it is a lot more complicated than that. So I'm don't have that much time so I'm going to put both my questions at you and then see.
▶ 0:48:53So number one, are we really going to make smart investments about systems that have real world application as opposed to engaging in some fantasy about some perfect system? How much money could we potentially waste on that? And number two, I haven't seen anybody um in the White House or around this system talking about the implications in terms of how destabilizing it can be in the longunning understanding of how to prevent nuclear war. Um which is that it's not winnable.
▶ 0:49:22uh both sides need to be vulnerable. If the message starts to get out there, we're going to build a golden dome so we can be protected and we might win. That can be incredibly destabilizing. Now, there's probably ways to manage it, but the fact that nobody working on this is even talking about what we say to the Russians and the Chinese about this is a little bit concerning. So, in 44 seconds, can you hit those two points? Uh Congress, I'll do my best to to the first part about the capabilities.
▶ 0:49:47I think we uh I have confidence that at least in the air domain in the United States Air Force, the capabilities that we imagine will be integrated as part of the Golden Dome are not just bespoke boutique capabilities for that uh you know domain awareness, the ability to to intercept hypersonics and cruise missiles and those sort of things that those are applicable globally. So we will ensure that that that's what it h that's what it better be. I'm not confident that we're there. We better take a look at it just quickly. Yes.
▶ 0:50:12On the other strategic stability, Congressman, very quickly, I would say what we need to focus on as a nation is re re getting our our intellectual uh capacity to understand strategic deterrence in now like we did in the cold war, but understand it now with three capables, which is different. It's not just an algebra equation. It's different when you have three uh great powers or aspiring great powers with nuclear capabilities. It's a it's a different equation we need to sort out to understand the risks. Absolutely. I just I just hope we we seriously consider it. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 0:50:42I yel back. Thank the gentleman. Chair and I recognize gentleman from Cal uh South Carolina, not California. Wouldn't do that to you. South Carolina, Joe Wilson. And thank you, Chairman Mike Rogers, for your proven leadership, positive leadership and correcting states correctly, too. Okay. We we appreciate all of your service and uh for a strong America for peace through strength. Uh we're in a cold war. We didn't choose between dictators with rule of gun invading democracies with rule of law.
▶ 0:51:11War criminal Putin and the Chinese Communist Party continue to expand and modernize their capabilities and rapidly expand while we're forced to react to changes in the battlefield. President Donald Trump is correct. Iran must not have a nuclear bomb to achieve their goal of death to Israel and death to America. The US must remain ahead of our adversaries to ensure we do not fall behind again to maintain peace through strength.
▶ 0:51:38With that in mind, uh Secretary Mink, uh we are really grateful that the courageous Patriots of Ukraine caused devastating historic damage to Russia's strategic bombers with a sophisticated drone attack. Ranking member Smith is correct as he just recognized bipartisan support of our Ukrainian allies and the courage of the people of Ukraine.
▶ 0:52:05With that in mind, ever since war criminal Putin has invaded Ukraine, we're seeing drone take a larger role in conventional warfare. The most recent attack once again demonstrates the damage that lowcost weapon systems can have to battlefield. Does the Air Force currently possess the capability to protect its bases from such attacks in the United States and abroad?
▶ 0:52:30If not, what is the Air Force doing to ensure that we're able to counter these threats in a timely So, I think currently it's it's very challenging. I I think as I mentioned, we have a technical challenge uh that we're addressing as quickly as we can with counter counter drone capability. Uh but I also think there is a there is a there is a basically an operating operating conditions challenge that we have uh with and it really is going to require a whole of government.
▶ 0:53:00Um as I mentioned trying to defend against that sort of attack when when we're limited to just operating within our geographic constraint of our base is very challenging. You have to be able to address these issues in a much much broader perspective. uh working with FAA, um uh local law enforcement, the whole that that all has to be addressed or I think we're going to be continue to be very very challenged to address to address that threat within the US or overseas. I I can see the challenge. I grew up in the holy city of Charleston.
▶ 0:53:29And so you have the uh air force base and the uh civilian air base airport next door. Good luck. Uh also, Mr. Secretary, the United States is known to have the most powerful air force in the world. However, we can't take for granted our adversaries, especially China, as they continue to modernize. And I especially appreciate the issue, as my father served in the uh 14th Air Force, the Flying Tigers, uh in China during World War II, Kunang Changdu.
▶ 0:53:59Does the US cap currently have the capability to deter our enemies on multiple fronts simultaneously? Congressman, I'll take a shot at that. I I certainly you know as we look to uh size our air force we also need to look at shaping and to your point of being able to project power anytime anywhere and be able to deter you know we have uh within the limited capacity we have a range of capabilities from high-end to lowend and and as I mentioned about our reimagination of our force design
▶ 0:54:30understanding we're learning from things in the Middle East that we're seeing that there are their lowcost capabilities we are starting to develop some lowcost capabilities of our own so we're not on the wrong side of the cost curve when we're engaging with uh the the Houthis and etc etc. So as we do that we are preserving the force for the most pacing threat that our national defense strategy has basically set over the past near decade for the pacing threat of China.
▶ 0:54:53However, we retain through our capacity and capabilities and our interactions with our allies and partners the ability to uh deter across the rest of the world. And and General in regard to the A-10 fleet, we see that they're getting ready to be retired, but is there they've been so successful and important. Is there any way that instead of retiring them that we could provide them to our allies uh such as Jordan uh to um to deter aggression? The challenge with that, Congressman, is the cost. It seems like it's cheap. It's not cheap.
▶ 0:55:21You have to have the ability to maintain the dep depot dep depot dep depot dep depot dep depot dep depot structure to sustain them the pilot uh uh training institutional. The actual overall cost versus the value is more expensive than our allies could really afford or want to pay. And for us, we can't afford it within our budget to be able to privilege the higherend capabilities we need against the pacing threat. Well, we we have your uh trust uh in what you're doing, but any way we can protect our allies uh such as Jordan. Thank you very much. Thank you. Gentleman yields back.
▶ 0:55:50Chair recognizes a gentleman from Massachusetts, Mr. Molton. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Uh Secretary M. congratulations on your recent confirmation. Uh as Secretary of the Air Force, you oversee twothirds of the nuclear triad as well as the Space Force. So, um, I I just want to pick up on some of the questions from the ranking member about the implications strategically for for Golden Dome. There are a lot of things that that are parts of Golden Dome that we clearly need to do.
▶ 0:56:16The Ukrainian attack on the Russian bomber fleet highlighted the vulnerability of bases and that's a vulnerability we face as well and you said that we've worked been working on addressing it. There's also bipartisan agreement on the need for better do domain awareness so that if uh we get attacked by hypersonics or other uh uh missiles coming our way, we know uh in time to respond.
▶ 0:56:40Both of these things would increase strategic stability because we and our adversaries know that our nuclear deterrent is safe, reliable, and effective. So in other words, if they attack us, we'll know they're attacking and we will be able to respond. And what establishes strategic stability for the world and has prevented a nuclear exchange for 70 years is the fact that both sides know that.
▶ 0:57:04So how do you expect Russia and China to respond to the idea that their nuclear deterrent is not effective because Golden Dome will shoot down all their incoming missiles? that you think or thanks for the question uh congressman that you know that when we go to deterrence you're exactly right this something you know started with MAD many many years ago mutually assured destruction I think as we the world we're in right now is
▶ 0:57:34is a little bit different you have that high level strategic deterrence you need to do um but there's also a significant threat um of of a of a smaller scale attack um that is less than a fullup strategic kind of engagement but is I agree.
▶ 0:57:49But my question is expect Russia and China to respond to the idea as the president has stated that we will shoot down all of their incoming Well, I I would hope that the response would be that that they would they would be more open to negotiation to ensure that those engagements never happen in the first place. Uh in the end, you know, peace through strength, right? make sure that we can protect ourselves and then and then it it opens a lot more opportunity for negotiation.
▶ 0:58:20Right. Mr. Secretary, hope is not a strategy and it would be helpful to know if we're going to spend what the CBO estimates could be about 500 billion taxpayer dollars that we understand how our adversaries are going to respond because a more logical response would be for them to develop ways to get around Golden Dome. That's exactly what they've done ever since President Bush pulled out of the anti-bballistic missile treaty in the early 2000s.
▶ 0:58:46That's why they've developed hypersonics to get around those defensive capabilities. So, if we're going to put something up in the sky for $500 billion and it just starts an arms race and then it doesn't work because they can get around it, then that's a massive waste of taxpayer dollars. But even more concerning, it decreases strategic stability and it makes it more likely we have a a nuclear exchange.
▶ 0:59:12But what is the administration doing to just un to develop a philosophy, a plan, a strategy for how this thing is going to work? The enemy gets a vote here. The enemy does get a vote and and I would say two things. Yeah, first off, we've there's really there's been an on race arms race ongoing already to be honest.
▶ 0:59:34What we're doing is responding responding to the arms race both from the space perspect not just the from the nuclear perspective but from the the the counterpace space control perspective. Um the US has actually sat idle for quite some time and allowed the Chinese to make huge advances and really in some cases gain the high ground in that area. So, so sitting back and and and not doing what's necessary to not work, Mr. Secretary. The high ground in what area?
▶ 1:00:00Well, well, actually, unfortunately, Congressman, they've made they've made significant advances both in space, air, maritime, across the board. They made significant advantages advances. Where have they made the most advantage sort of percentage-wise? Where have they increased their capabilities the most? I think their fielding of their their space systems. I would agree space, but I I wouldn't underestimate I wouldn't underestimate Mr. Secretary, I'm running out of time, but I agree that space is where they've expanded the most.
▶ 1:00:30So, why are you cutting the space budget? Why are you cutting our space budget? So, the the the final total budgets have have not been released, but we have we've never gotten budgets later talk about it, but but what we know right now is the space budget is going to be cut. So you have no theory for how Golden Dome is going to work, but we're doing it because China is increasing in space and you have no and you you plan to cut to this the space budget. That doesn't sound like a good plan, Mr.
▶ 1:00:56We do have a I think we have some pretty good ideas of how Golden Dome would be developed and I think the We'd like to hear those ideas now recognizes the gentleman from uh Virginia, Mr. Whitman. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank our witnesses for joining us. General Saltzman, I was uh really encouraged by our conversations yesterday and I'm glad that you share my sense that we need uh extensive launch capability across all the different spectrums, especially small and medium launch.
▶ 1:01:21We know that we're quickly getting to capacity there at Canaveral and at um uh and there in California. We we want to make sure that we're using the other areas uh to the same extent that we're using Vandenberg and Canaveral.
▶ 1:01:35uh from your perspective um give me your thoughts about the value of small and medium launch capability especially in the context of the national security space launch program phase 3 lane one and the rocket systems launch program all of those integrated to make sure we continue to build that capacity we are still ahead of the Chinese there but we know what they're doing to to quickly catch up our existing facilities are getting at capacity pretty pretty quickly thank you sir I agree with you completely capacity is an important important issue with regards
▶ 1:02:06to our launch infrastructure. Uh if we're going to continue on the pace of growth uh that we've seen over the last few years, we're going to have to increase that capacity. Uh with regards to small and medium launch capabilities, this is an important area in terms of putting up experimentation, putting up prototypes, putting up demonstrations.
▶ 1:02:22This is all a campaign that reduces risk in programs that matures technology and rather than a large satellite or a large investment with a with a high-end satellite, the ability to test payloads at smaller scale using small and medium launch will be important uh going forward. Well, I'd like to formally invite you to join uh Representative Kiggins and myself at the Mid-Atlant Mid-Atlantic Regional Launch Facility there. I hope that your staff will work with ours to set a date for us to go there and visit and continue this conversation.
▶ 1:02:50I think it's incredibly important. I also want to um talk about the space force's effort to have a tactically responsive space mission. I mean, we we talk about the threats in space. Those continue to grow. We have to be able to do the tw the launch of a satellite in 24 hours scenario and that requires things across the spectrum. I think capacity at our launch uh facilities and the cadence that they can provide is there.
▶ 1:03:16the challenges is how do we bring our partners in that produce uh the space launch platforms, the constellations, the interfaces, those kinds of things. So, wanted to get your perspective. Uh you know, we know we have the caster program that has now been ramped up to where we can use existing uh assets in space, but there are going to be instances where our adversaries are going to look to take out key assets and we can't find layering opportunities there. We're going to have to be able to launch uh literally on a on a moment's notice.
▶ 1:03:44I'm interesting in uh interested in your thoughts about how can we leverage commercial space launch capabilities, not just the launch itself, but also the interfaces and the satellites to go along with it. And can we use that capacity for test and training activities that can actually uh provide us opportunities to exercise and develop a capability if necessary to go at a moment's notice? Thank you, sir. I thanks for that question because I agree completely.
▶ 1:04:14Uh first, I'm very proud of what our acquisition corps has been able to do in terms of reducing the timeline associated with what we're calling tactically responsive space. Uh we were able to take a satellite from a warehouse and put it on orbit and operationalize in less than 90 hours. Uh we were going to beat the 24-hour launch order to orbit. Uh 3 hours of weather kind of got in the way. We did it in 27 hours. We really reduced all of those uh to really provide a real capability. Your point about test and training is spot on, sir.
▶ 1:04:41The ability to buy capability and and maybe it's there for an insurance policy, but because we can't just have pay hundreds of millions of dollars for an insurance policy to use it on a routine basis to add test and training capability uh on orbit uh and then replenish that with the next reserve launch capability, I think is a good strategy that we're exploring. Very good. Thank you, General Alvin.
▶ 1:05:04uh you have a pretty complex uh calculus problem in front of you to go ahead and modernize tactical aircraft, strategic aircraft, all the different uh uh elements there, modernizing our our nuclear deterrent both both aircraft and with missile platforms. Give me your perspective on on how do you how do you do that? How do you do that too in a in a realm where there may be a little infusion of resources, but if you look longer down the road, you know, we're going to have to find ways, I think, internally to make best use of the resources that we already have.
▶ 1:05:35And then you talked a little bit about maybe redirecting resources and being able to to maximize efficiency of what happens within the air force structure. So, just give me a quick quick um viewpoint on that. Thank you, Congress. I say very quickly, it's two parts. The first of all is do what we we have been doing more recently which is more clearly articulating what we think the value of air power is to the nation and that lets the department the president and the congress decide how much air force that they're willing to resource. So we we want to prove that.
▶ 1:06:02But the other part is internally we're making sure every dollar goes to the maximum lethality, but also solving for agility, not putting ourselves in into capital investments that we won't be able to adapt to the future, ingest disruptive technologies, etc., etc. Gentleman's time's expired. Chair and I recognize gentle lady from Pennsylvania, Miss Huland. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm going to do my very best to ask two pretty wonky questions in my five minutes.
▶ 1:06:26I was in the Air Force as an acquisition officer and in keeping with this committee's emphasis on procurement and acquisition uh modernization. Mr. Secretary, my first question is to you. Uh we've long uh long been supportive on this committee of the Air Force's innovation efforts particularly through AFWorks and agility prime program.
▶ 1:06:46Uh I'm concerned by very recent reports that the vertical takeoff and landing or VTOL portfolio is being descoped and terminated not due to contractor performance but because of budget constraints and contracting shortfalls. These actions are obviously very risky because they waste taxpayer dollars and private sector dollars and they also delay or derail capabilities that our military urgently needs.
▶ 1:07:10So one my first question and there are many is are there any transition plans in place to ensure that there would be continuity or orderly transition uh of the contract that's being administered by a AF affl contracts. Is there a standard uh transition protocol that you're aware I'm not aware. Uh Congressman General Alvin are you aware of that issue?
▶ 1:07:34one uh Congresswoman, one of the reasons why we had we looked to descope is again with the limited capacity budget, we're looking to find ones who did have a transition partner. So, it's really about making sure we look at the force design and see how these capabilities can find their way into actually delivering capability to the war fighter. And so, as we look at that, we are we are transforming our organizational structure to move towards a more integrated capability command that can take those great innovative ideas but be able to see more clearly their value proposition.
▶ 1:08:03So, I appreciate that and this is where I'm trying to tease this out. When I was a while ago looking at my phone and realizing all of a sudden there was a capability to text or voice to text, my first thoughts were why would I ever need that? Um, I think the problem that I'm struggling with right now is that these are technological ideas and innovations that don't necessarily have a natural transition because why would I ever need such a thing?
▶ 1:08:26Um, I think that that's our problem in acquisition is that we're not being innovative enough and we're looking for traditional pathways that we used to have in acquisitions rather than being thoughtful about our our our I think that's correct. And it's also a matter of th those are the art of the possible that are always competing with the art of the known with respect to the readiness and the modernization challenges that we know of. So that's a constant tension that we have. But I I take your point that we don't want to pass opportunities up just by focusing on the known risks.
▶ 1:08:55I would love to continue to follow up with you on this. Um I also have understood that there is conversation or reports suggesting that the Air Force doesn't have enough people to manage these kinds of contracts. Is this something that's true? Uh what is the basis if that's true for this shortage? Is this happening because of Doge cuts or or perhaps early retirements or resignations or perhaps in my case because we didn't see a pathway for promotion? So I I made over there.
▶ 1:09:23I I don't think it's a numbers games, Congress. Congresswoman, I I I think it's what you hit on the end. I I think we need to make sure that that we are we are training and properly incentivizing the acquisition workforce to ensure that we have that that skill mix from the very entry level all the way up through the senior general officers and that is something I will be focusing on because get back to my earlier comment is it the most important thing in acquisition love to talk more with you about it congressman woman but the the most important thing acquisition is have a skilled uh
▶ 1:09:53well educated team otherwise you have no have no hope and it's not just innovation we We have to be innovative but we also have to innovate faster than our potential adversary and they're innovating very fast. So it's it's a combination of just innovation but you have to innovate quickly in the team to do that of the time that I have. The other thing that I remember very uh acutely is that this is not just a force of uniform personnel. There is a significant force of uh civilian personnel as well that we rely upon.
▶ 1:10:22Um, and my real concern is that we're doing these people without understanding why they're important because they are critical to our mission. Yeah, I I came through most of my career has been as civilian acquisition person in both the IC and the DoD. So, I agree with you, Congresswoman. Uh, and that is will be a priority to not only in the military side of the house, but in the civilian side of the house to make sure we're recruiting and and quality of service. That's key to not just quality of life, quality of service across the board. Yes.
▶ 1:10:50And I only have 30 seconds left, so I probably will submit the bulk of this question for the record. But my other concern is with the Space Force General. Uh whether or not we're continuing to be very thoughtful of taking advantage of commercial capabilities that are already available to us rather than re reinventing them. I remember the not invented here problem and would love to make sure that we're following I follow up with you on that concern as well. Thank you and I yield back. Gentle lady yields back. Chair not recognized. Gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Turner. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:11:21Jo Altzman, thank you for your leadership, not just for the um amazing u way in which you are rising to the threats that we are facing, but also your um your leadership in shaping the organization that is is new and is rising uh to the the needs that we have. Um the the topic I'm going to discuss with you is not going to be a surprise to you.
▶ 1:11:42um the and that is what um I believe is the Cuban missile crisis in space and that the fact that we are facing the prospects that uh Russia might place in space an anti-satellite nuclear weapon. Uh Secretary General of NATO Route um recently just said that as early as this year uh Russia might place an anti-satellite nuclear weapon in space.
▶ 1:12:07Uh I believe as do many on this committee that that that that anti-satellite nuclear weapon should never be permitted to be put in space. U you I believe coined the the best phrase ever and that was you said if that went into space it would be day zero. U be and many people think of that if it was if a anti-satellite nuclear weapon was in space and was detonated that that would be day zero.
▶ 1:12:30But you identified it's it being placed in space as day zero because you said that would be the day from which we would no longer be able to depend on space because the very next day it would be irresponsible to depend on space because if it was detonated as Dr.
▶ 1:12:47Plum has said here um that um it would wipe out everything in low earth orbit and it would and low earth orbit would be unhabitable um for up to a year and it would take trillions of dollars in technology that we don't have uh in order to be able to respond to that loss.
▶ 1:13:06So, since this is a budgetary hearing, General Saltzman, um if that uh if day zero happened, how would it affect your budget, the budget of DoD, the budget of the Air Force, if we were at day zero um and that anti-satellite nuclear weapon was permitted to be in space and we had to suddenly face that it would be irresponsible to count on space the next Well, thank you for that.
▶ 1:13:33And obviously I agree with you that this is a a tremendous threat that we have to think through in terms of contingency planning. Um a detonation on orbit would be catastrophic across a number of mission areas. It would foul the the domain. Uh it would foul certainly lower earth orbit and potentially middle earth orbit for an extended period of time. So it would make replenishment and reconstitution extremely difficult. it would put at risk the lives of the astronauts that are currently on orbit. Um, catastrophic.
▶ 1:14:03And so when you ask me how would it affect our budget, if if this was if this came to pass and it became a real threat that we had to invest in to mitigate, uh, we've run some some basic numbers in terms of trying to harden satellites and and trying to position them in a way so that there's redundancies. Should we lose any portion of the constellation, would we have redundancies? And I can't get to a a costreason reasonable number to say with with three trillion dollars I can fix this.
▶ 1:14:31I just can't come up with a reasonable number. And and so that's why I I I try to I'm trying not to be too alarmist, but day zero really is that we just can't count on space because I don't know how to create the replenishment and the reconstitution to overcome that kind of a detonation should never be permitted to be placed in in space. assultsman, thank you for the clarity of of your description of the threat if that is in space. Uh Mr.
▶ 1:14:55Secretary, um you have some of our most important advances that need to be made uh for our being able to address the advances that our adversaries have made. You have missile defense, you have hypersonics, you have nuclear deterrence, you have our new advances in weapon systems, you have our advances in air, both manned and unmanned systems. Our adversaries are currently doing some things that we can't do and you are the one who's supposed to close that gap. CRS have an impact on that.
▶ 1:15:25Uh how are you going to close the gap and could you please give a commercial as to why Congress should stop giving you the impediment of of continuing resolutions that affect your ability to close that Yeah. Well, yeah, continuing resolutions are are are very very challenging. uh they have implications as was mentioned just from a personnel perspective.
▶ 1:15:49Uh the personnel budget um it has also a a significant and in in some ways an an outweighed effect on acquisitions. Um how you do acquisitions, how you start new, how you be innovative as our last discussion is heavily infected by by particularly with a year-long CR. Um it it stops a lot of that or at the very least makes it much more challenging to get to get approved. So so yes, it it has a huge impact.
▶ 1:16:14on our ability to innovate and innovate quickly as well as uh making sure we have the personnel that can execute those programs. Yeah, the the Chinese have made uh be happy to talk about in a different uh a different form in more detail, but they made phenomenal advancements. Chair and I recognize gentleman from Connecticut, Mr. Courtney. Uh thank you uh Mr. Chairman and thank you to the witnesses uh for your testimony uh today.
▶ 1:16:38Again, at the outset, I just want to uh associate myself with uh the remarks of the chair and ranking member about the lateness of the budget. We're less than four months away from the start of the fiscal year. Uh and we're now being told that the actual budget document won't be over here until the end of the month, last week of the month. Um and you know, I certainly agree with Mr. Turner about the harm of CRS and the testimony of the secretary, but having a delivery date of the budget with less than three months to go uh before the start of the fiscal year.
▶ 1:17:07Uh I think you know we're this process is doomed in terms of trying to avoid a CR. This this place is not a rubber stamp. um article one of the constitution makes it pretty clear uh you know who's the decision maker in terms of both appropriations and authorizations and the lateness of the delivery of the budget is the real impediment that we're facing u right now. So again, um the sooner the better in terms of it coming over.
▶ 1:17:31On page 11 of your testimony, um paragraph special mission aircraft, um there's a discussion about the replacement of Air Force One, uh program. Uh again, I serve on the uh committee with Mr. Kelly that has jurisdiction over executive airlift.
▶ 1:17:48Um, we had a hearing a couple weeks ago where Barbara Costello, the acting uh, secretary, assistant secretary of the Air Force, testified that there was actually some progress being made as far as the replace the recapitalization of the two aircraft that were purchased back in 2018. And she actually talked about possible delivery date um, sometime during the calendar year of 2027. Mr.
▶ 1:18:12Secretary, can you uh sort of give us uh your uh view of that Uh I uh yeah, yes, Congressman, we have and thanks for the question. We have been uh working closely with the contractor uh Boeing in this case to accelerate that program. Uh as you know, it it has experienced significant delays. Um is it going to get back into 27?
▶ 1:18:36And I I I couldn't guarantee that, Congressman, but but we are doing whatever we can to pull it back to I think it was before they started working to pull it back. It was in the 30s, I believe. Uh so it's it's tough to do and but we're working with the contractor to pull it back. I think 27 is going to be really tough, though. Yeah, it was actually 29 I think was the last sort of guesstimate that was there and certainly um yes, we've been tracking this from day one.
▶ 1:19:00Um, can you give us the cost estimate of the retrofit of the Qatar uh plane that uh is all over the news? I I think it would be I think it'd be difficult for me to give you the exact details here, but we'd be actually happy to talk about some of those specifics in in a different form. I think there's been a number thrown around on the order of a billion dollars, but a lot of those costs associated with that are are costs that we'd have experienced anyway. We've just we will experience them early.
▶ 1:19:26buying additional platforms for training, for spares, uh things like that are actually the majority of that majority of that of that amount. So, it wouldn't be anywhere near that, but we can talk in details about exactly what we're buying in a different form and what the cost drivers are, but it's nowhere near that much. So, I I think, you know, it's unfortunate that again and when we're hearing about all the challenges the Air Force faces that what I think is going to be a pretty big ticket item can't be sort of uh discussed publicly because I think people need to know that.
▶ 1:19:53Um, and I would just say based on the experience of the 2018 planes, uh, we know that the contract for retrofit was, uh, $3.9 billion. Again, some of that was purchase of the planes from Boeing, roughly about 800 million. But again, if you just do the math, it was about three billion for retrofit. There's been cost overruns. They had to strip those planes that were built for another purpose down to the studs. And as you said, there's been issues. The contractor who was doing the interior work went out of business.
▶ 1:20:21and Boeing has had to kind of figure out a a plan to do the the fitting out of the interior of the plane. But again, just using that as an an extrapolating from that, I mean, it's clear that this new third plane is going to cost well over a billion dollars. I mean, it's just you can't retrofit a plane that's built for another purpose for Air Force One and expect it to to be a free plane. Um, you've got to, you know, install encrypted communication technology. You have to harden the defenses.
▶ 1:20:50is you have to put counter measures in there. Obviously, you need to have all the the it's a flying situation room um that's there and the notion that we can't find out when we're about to be, you know, take up a very difficult budget and and based on the experience we already have gone through with retrofitting uh planes that 747s.
▶ 1:21:10Um, it's clear that this is going to be a drain on the Air Force's budget and and I think that the sooner we just sort of rip the band-aid off and get that information out there, it would be helpful for us in terms of deciding whether this is a a smart path to go down without Oh, go ahead and we'd be happy to come down and talk to you in detail about it in a different environment. Unfortunately, some of the particularly some of the things you're talking about, what the what those costs are are those are classified uh sensitive capabilities that we put on the platform.
▶ 1:21:38So, we'd be happy to come down and talk to you about the specifics, but I I again I'll restate that that we believe the actual retrofit of that aircraft uh is actually sign it's it's it's probably less than $400 million to retrofit that aircraft. We be happy to come talk to you about it. Uh gentleman's time expired.
▶ 1:21:55I I just want to emphasize a point that uh Representative Courtney just made and I'm not blaming you uh but Congress is going to decide what we do and don't um the administration, OM in particular, not giving us a budget is not going to compel us to comply with what they give us late.
▶ 1:22:16So, whoever is listening to this hearing from OM needs to understand we want to have a healthy dialogue with military professionals like this about what we need to spend to get us where we need to be. We need a budget to help inform that dialogue, but if we don't get it, we're going to ride it without it. uh we've gotten a skinny budget which legally allows us to comply with the requirement that we receive a budget. So there's no reason not to get us some uh some information. But I think Mr.
▶ 1:22:45Courtourtney is right and we all need to acknowledge the fact that being uh u delayed with that presentation is not helpful. With that I will recognize the gentleman from Tennessee Dr. Dejar Lee. Thank you Chairman Rogers. General Alvin, uh, I appreciate our meeting yesterday and, uh, also your comments about doing everything we can to accelerate Sentinel.
▶ 1:23:07As, as I noted to you, and as our, uh, chairman made abundantly clear in his opening statement, I'm concerned that the Air Force's decision to cut funding for FY25 adds risk to the program, uh, the Sentinel program, particularly if, uh, we begin FY26 on a continuing Secretary Mink, I'd like to ask you a question I raised with General Alvin.
▶ 1:23:32Will the Air Force be prepared to submit an anomaly request for Sentinel or reprogram additional resources to the program to avoid disruption? Is that something you'll consider if the circumstances warrant? Uh so Congressman Sentinel is if not the number one priority for me. It is definitely in the top three two or three. uh we will do whatever it takes to to deliver that program as quickly as possible. It's nuclear deterrence at national security.
▶ 1:24:01We we will we will do whatever is necessary to ensure that that program is properly funded. Uh I I expect you probably know it's in the middle of a number so some of the work has been slowed down which which required a rephasing of the resources but we are making sure the resources are there and that we are taking the appropriate recommendations out of numacurity to restructure and and move forward with that program. It has my highest. It's the thing I've spent the most time on since I've been in this job. It's only been two and a half weeks, but it is it is the program I spent the most time on. Okay.
▶ 1:24:30And by the way, congratulations. Uh wanted to talk just for a second about uh Arnold Engineering Development Complex. Um First General Alvin, I I thank you yesterday, I want to thank you again for taking time to meet with the Arnold Community Council from AEDC last month. that that visit was deeply appreciated not just by the local community but by also the broader Tennessee congressional delegation. Uh and Secretary Mink, we look forward to hosting you at Arnold at your earliest convenience.
▶ 1:24:58Uh as you knew as you know Arnold Engineering Development Complex plays a central role in testing for hypersonics, next generation aircraft and potentially an expanded mission in the space testing depending on what happens with the basing decision for space command. Uh but based on what we've seen, the current funding model doesn't appear to keep pace with the scale or complexity of those demands.
▶ 1:25:21Do you believe there's a need to rethink how we resource and manage test infrastructure like AEDC to ensure it's aligned with the Air Force and the broader mission uh where it's headed? Yeah, thank you, Congressman, for that question. I think it's it's very important and as uh as I was mentioning before, we need to make sure we're getting every bit of capability out of every dollar we put in to the United States Air Force.
▶ 1:25:44And so the manner in which we're sort of reimagining the way we develop capabilities in an integrated fashion uh different from the past where we might look at developing a fighter system and over here a mobility system and here in a uh you know an IT system looking at it from an entire we call a mission thread what it takes to do everything from the concept to developing an entire capability.
▶ 1:26:06uh that will allow us to to shed more light on some of those critical but maybe not headline grabbing capabilities much like AEDC and those things that require the testing that that if you don't fund them they will find their uh themselves the cause of slowing down of a program. So as we look at it through more of that lens I think we're going to be able to highlight and advocate more for those critical but less popular uh parts of the entire capability development portfolio. And Secretary Mink, did you have anything to add to that?
▶ 1:26:35just uh wholehearted agreement that the the testing infrastructure across the board is just critical uh for us to be able to train and in against uh train against the representative threats of what we are almost assuredly going to see overseas. Well, thank you both for that and I'll just note for the record that OSD's OE requirements are placing a real burden on the work being done to modernize Arnold.
▶ 1:27:00Director Wilcox, who oversees uh T& has been a strong advocate for Arnold's unique mission, but as far as we're aware, there's no clear path to address this through NDAA uh only through OSD's internal policy direction. So, I plan to raise this directly with Secretary Hegsth in the coming weeks and hope I can count on your support as we look to accelerate our testing enterprise. And with that, chairman, I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair and I recognize gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Crow.
▶ 1:27:30Thank you, Chairman. Uh, General Saltzman, what is your most important asset? We're talking about the onorbit capabilities. Uh, we I hope you say it's your people. Well, of course. I mean, there's no doubt that the acquisition and operators and intelligence personnel. It's the guardians are the assets. Do they have a unique skill set and and technical capability? Yes.
▶ 1:27:54Uh, do you rely on a large civilian Uh, in relative comparison, probably it's about 5,000 civilians in the space force of our total less than 15,000. Uh, so about about a third over a third, which is large larger proportion than most services. Yes, sir. Um, Secretary Mink, would you share that assessment that your most important asset is your people? Yeah, definitely, Congressman. And that your people have unique skills and capabilities. Yes, they do.
▶ 1:28:24And that the civilian workforce is an essential element to your mission. Uh yes, across the entire department. Um can General Saltzman, can you force your civilian workforce to Uh not most of them. Guardians, active duty service members, you you can you can compel to move, but you can't go to a civilian and say you have to relocate you and your family with very few exceptions. They they can leave. They can actually leave employment if you do that. Correct.
▶ 1:28:51What would happen if you lost half of your of your civilian workforce for a major unit or It would the that unit would be underperforming. Is China moving really fast? Yes, sir. Uh are they are they moving faster than us in some capability in some technologies?
▶ 1:29:13Uh I I don't know how to measure speed of of certain capabilities, but they are definitely moving fast in counterpace capabilities for So if we slowed down one of our capabilities, would that put us at a strategic disadvantage? I I do not want to slow down development of any of our capabilities. Secretary Mink, um US Space Command is headquartered in Colorado. Uh it's at full operational capability and it relies substantially on a civilian workforce. Correct.
▶ 1:29:44That's correct. Um, are you familiar with some of the surveys that were done of the civilian workforce that if it were to be moved out of Colorado, a substantial portion of that civilian workforce would refuse to move? Uh, yes, Congressman, I'm I'm aware that that we would we would have attrition and it would be very important that we manage that that move over over a period of time if that occurs. Would it would it would it with what General Saltzman just said, would it slow us down though relative to the speed of China?
▶ 1:30:15I I I think it would be our job to to do everything we can to assure that doesn't happen. Well, of course it would be your job, but it is true those civilian workers, many of whom have said outright they will not move. And that's why it's unacceptable uh in a in a very important command and mission that that we move it at this time uh or ever. It's it's working. It's built out and we owe it to America and our national security to invest in it in Colorado.
▶ 1:30:43Uh and there's a lot of folks in in Congress who um believe that is an important part of our mission in national defense. General Elvin to you. Are you familiar with our national defense strategy? I'm familiar with the current one as well as the national defense strategic guidance. And what's the number one goal of the national defense strategy? Defend the homeland. Uh, and do we have an integrated fully capable air defense system that that can operate without fixed wing aircraft to do that job? Could you repeat the question?
▶ 1:31:12Do we have a can we do that without fighter jets in the United States? Not currently. No. In the next in the next eight years, could we do that without fighter jets? Hard to predict if we have our collaborative combat aircraft. It's unlikely, isn't it? Given our current inventory.
▶ 1:31:29Are you familiar with the north the the commander of Northcom came before this committee and just last year testified that it is essential for his capability to protect the homeland that there be fighter jets in Colorado on mission ready status to conduct to protect the western United States. Are you familiar with that testimony? I'm not familiar with the testimony, but I trust Jung Go and I trust that if he said that he did that under his predecessor authority as uh the responsibility for Nora Northcom.
▶ 1:31:59I represent Buckley Space Force base where that mission is located. Uh there are there there's a F-16 squadron there that actually does that mission of protecting the western United States. Yes. Um there is no integrated fully capable mission missile defense system in the United States. Um, we need a plan to recapitalize that fighter wing to keep that capability and protect the homeland. We all want to invest in long-term capabilities, but that is a ways out.
▶ 1:32:26We need to make those interim investments today to make sure we can accomplish that mission. I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair now recognizes his gentleman from Nebraska, General Bacon. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to all three of you for being here today. And I enjoyed seeing all three of you at the Air Force Academy graduation. What a moving ceremony. I got to tell you, there's nothing like seeing the graduating class march out on that field uh with the music. So, it was incredible sight to see.
▶ 1:32:54I am concerned about what we're hearing on the president's budget. It it it appears he's proposing a minor increase for the Air Force and a decrease for the Space Force. And if that is true, it's hard to put that up with the fact that we're trying to counter China because both the Air Force and the Space Force will be front and center in any fight in the Far East.
▶ 1:33:17I would anticipate if we were serious about countering China that we'd be seeing a sizable increase in both the Air Force and the Space Force uh I also want to just remind folks in this room and those listening that 20% of the budget that goes to the Air Force and Space Force is pass through money and doesn't even go to the Air Force or Space Force. It goes to DoD agencies. So, if you look at the the share of the pie of what the Air Force and Space Force is getting, it's quite a bit smaller than the Army and the Navy.
▶ 1:33:46And I just think we need to re readress this uh in the in this committee, but also in Pentagon. I have my first question is to the M secretary. I really enjoyed chatting with you about the Looking Glass mission. I'm excited that you understand that mission better than most. Could you give us an update with what you know that's going on there? For those who aren't familiar, the Looking Glass gives us the capability to command our ICBMs or bombers or submarines, if the White House is hit, the Pentagon's hit, if Stracom is hit.
▶ 1:34:15We used to have a 24-hour a day airborne mission. We stopped doing that when the Cold War ended. However, I think we're going back to the threats where where this capability is needed again and we know the Navy is at some point walking away from this mission. So, I'd love to get your update, Mr. Secretary, on this important mission. If I could, Congressman, I would just say I I I agree and thank you for coming out to the academy graduation just under three weeks I've been here. That was pro that was the funnest thing that I've done.
▶ 1:34:45And it's it's impossible to not get kind of excited when you have 900 cadetses. The keynote speaker must have got you excited. Come through the Yeah. Come come come come come come come come come come come come come come come come come come come up there they're also excited. My hand got a little sore after 900 cadets but it was uh it was it was great. U yeah so the the back specific your question. Yeah looking glass you the air the air force is postured to support our role in that and we will continue to do so.
▶ 1:35:07Um, as you've alluded to, there is discussion going on about the future of the mission and we will we will we will continue to participate in that and and and we'll take on whatever role uh that the department assigns to us. Uh, General Alvin, if you have anything else. No, I just is and the Navy is is uh agreed to continue that until they're relieved. But when they're relieved, uh, if the mission comes to us, we'll take it. We we would ask be appropriately resourced for it. But as long as that mission is required, we'll ensure that between us and our other services, we're able to support the nation that critical mission.
▶ 1:35:37I submit to you it's critical with a 15-minute warning times with some of the nuclear weapons that Russia and China can deliver here with hypersonics. We need to have the survivable thinking and it's it's important for deterrence. They need to know that no matter what they do, they can't decapitate us that we have the ability to respond. Uh John Alvin put out two-time classmate with me. The air combat command says we need over 20 compass call aircraft. yet the the program of record is at 10.
▶ 1:36:08Could you give us a a your mind of what we should be doing with this in the future? Congressman and correctly so we're understanding that you know uh electronic warfare is sort of drifted in the back of our mind is now back in the front of our mind as we see the criticality of that. Uh the great thing about the EA37 is once we put this you know once we put the operators in the back of them uh those things they are creating new and interesting ways to really put dilemas on the in the minds of the enemy.
▶ 1:36:35So that that the program of record right now is 10 and understand those uh ACC has puts a requirement is higher. This is a matter of resources. Is it is it this or munitions? Is it this or tankers? Is it this or other things? All of the things we need. But I will tell you, we are uh understanding how we can squeeze every ounce of capability out of every platform that we get and they all go into the big prioritization. General Saltzman, what are the one or two things you think you need to do first uh to posture the space for the Golden Dome?
▶ 1:37:07Well, I I think as we look across the portfolio of things that we already bring to bear, whether it's sensors, whether it's the data networks that have to move the data quickly, uh the software that enables rapid decision making, uh even before we get to theectors that actually can mitigate the threats, that all has to be stitched together. So, we're doing the mission analysis and I think that's the first thing that has to be done. Which systems are required to put together so we can move data to the right places and most effectively orchestrate a very complex mission set. So, we got to do the mission planning first. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 1:37:37With that, I got one second left. I'll give it back to the chairman. Thank you. Chair now recognizes a gentle lady from New Hampshire, Miss Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. Uh, I really appreciate it. I I appreciate your testimony at the outset about the importance of an audit. It's something I care about deeply. Uh it's something that's important to my constituents and their public trust in our military. And I wanted to ask you, Mr.
▶ 1:38:05Secretary, if you could tell us more about the concrete steps you're taking to ensure that uh the Department of the Air Force passes a clean audit this fiscal year. Thanks, Congress. Congresswoman, yeah, we um spend quite a bit of money in the military. Uh want to make sure we are we are good stewards of the taxpayer on how we do that. um you know my my my previous job uh the organization I worked in we had actually had 16 clean consecutive audits.
▶ 1:38:34So I do understand the kind of the steps that and the things that are required to do that. Obviously this is much larger scale. Um so so I'm in the process of actually assessing where we have our deficiencies uh and then laying in a plan to go after those. I just signed out a note to put the under secretary as one of his primary jobs is to ensure that that that that gets accomplished. Um but the fundamental thing is Mr. Secretary for identifying those deficiencies.
▶ 1:39:02So those those deficiencies you know with the past audits have been many of them have been identified. I think the question is is what do you do again? What's the st as you probably know congressman what does you congresswoman what do you do to address those deficiencies? Some of them can be very challenging. Some of them is just tying together all the systems that manage the data manage the the the finances. Those can be really challenging steps and and so identifying those efficiencies, budgeting to fix those things, right, and get them right is is what we're going to be focused on.
▶ 1:39:32Well, would appreciate the chance to hear from you in real time, how your progress is going and what this committee can do to support you in that effort. Um, we've got the National Defense Authorization Act, uh, which is one of the reasons I came to this committee. It's knocking on wood. 63 years in running a bill and we we'd very much like to work with you to be sure that you can join uh our colleagues from the Marine Corps and passing a clean audit as soon as possible.
▶ 1:39:58I wanted to also ask you about, you know, another issue that matters a lot to my constituents, the right to repair. Uh could you tell us a bit about your understanding of what the right to repair means to me? Uh the notion that our military cannot repair our own equipment and weapon systems and aircraft is is an outrage. We it's costing us billions and billions of dollars to the taxpayer.
▶ 1:40:27It's delaying our military readiness. Um it's it's a driver of waste, fraud, and abuse. And we're we're all very committed to cutting down on waste, fraud, and abuse. So I wanted to ask you uh we heard from Secretary Driscoll yesterday about his commitment um to ensure that going forward any contracts and you know the the way that the right to repair is undermined is really through highly obscure and technical provisions in our contracts that
▶ 1:40:57going forward that doesn't continue and working retroactively. So can you tell us about your efforts on this front? So, first off, I as with uh Secretary Driskll, I I I gave you my commitment that this this will be something that we will ensure contracts going forward that we have full full flexibility. Um, and I think as you alluded to, there's a whole spectrum.
▶ 1:41:18It can be all the way from the contractor has the full right and authority to do that to even if they don't, the government doesn't actually have enough of the technical specs to actually do it. So, we're still relying upon the contractor. Um, so one of the things I've been doing and and it's and it there isn't a one-sizefits-all because there it varies across the different contracts we have uh within the department looking into the conditions are different and we're going to have to go in and address every one of those every one of those conditions in a little bit different way.
▶ 1:41:46But in the end we we and we have already made some progress but in the end I think we we will we have to get there. There's no question about it. I don't know general if you have any other comments on it. I I just totally associate with what the secretary said. It's the some of the contractual pieces that we entered into, the more we can get relief from that, the more flexibility. We're all about that. Well, I appreciate that and we want to support you. We've got bipartisan support for provisions in this year's NDAA and we would love to work with you on that. Um, General Saltzman, I thank you for being here.
▶ 1:42:16My home state of New Hampshire is home to the New Boston Space Force Station in Hillsboro County. And, you know, I had a chance to visit New Boston. They're providing critical around the clock satellite command and control capabilities for for for our country.
▶ 1:42:31I wanted to ask you I I only have 10 seconds left, so maybe we can follow up um offline, but I'm eager to talk to you about how we can ensure that our infrastructure installations like the new Boston space force station are protected from the wide range of vulnerabilities that are out there. Very quickly, we have a gentle times expired. Chair now recognizes a gentleman from Florida, Mr. Jimenez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:42:56U last weekend, I think uh we saw a a pivotal moment in warfare when the Ukrainian uh Ukrainian army um launched an unbelievable attack on the uh Russian air force. But it also for me uh under underlined a uh a vulnerability for us.
▶ 1:43:17Um for a long time we thought uh you know distance was a great equalizer but now you with the with the you know with the onset of drones etc you could have u malign actors here in the United States take out a lot of our assets in a very short period of time. What are we doing to protect against drones this kind of activity um to protect our assets here on the homeland?
▶ 1:43:44Uh, General Alvin, thank you, Congressman. And to the conversation we had earlier, it's really a it's a it's a joint force problem, and it is one of those that is multifaceted, different. It is different in um characterization than what happened with Russia and Ukraine, but it certainly shows the consequences if we don't pay attention to it.
▶ 1:44:04Uh this is one of those where we have to have an understanding of the current restrictions that we have in place with respect to rules of engagements with the local, county, state, federal For forget that. Okay. Okay. Do we have My my concern is the capability of us being able to defend against uh AI drones. We may have the capability to defend against piloted drones. All right. But I've always been afraid of AI drones that are unpiloted and that you you basically have to knock them out of the sky.
▶ 1:44:33You just can't say, "Okay, you can't pilot anymore." And they fall to the ground. That's not the case anymore. I'm worried about our capabilities there. All right. And I'm that's that's all I'm going to say. And also not only for our civilian our our military but also on our civilians and our civilian uh uh transportation infrastructure because if some kind of an attack happens on a civilian aircraft then basically air travel it grinds to a halt. Nobody's going to take a plane.
▶ 1:45:00And so I would hope uh secretary that uh that we're on this and not only just for uh milit protecting our military assets, but also our our entire transportation um uh network. U so that's that's that's all I'm going to say. I really don't want to get into what you're doing. Uh but uh maybe in a classified setting, we would find out what it is we're doing to protect against this uh this threat. I've been really worried about this threat for a really long time.
▶ 1:45:28and uh and what happened uh last weekend just you know puts an exclamation point on my worry about what's could happen here just for for the sake how much does a a B2 bomber cost yeah I think it's probably I don't know what the replacement cost would be I think originally it's multiple billion are they are they all clustered around the same place yeah a lot of them are okay so one of the things maybe we maybe should be at as maybe dispersing
▶ 1:45:59our assets, okay, in the near term uh until we figure out how we can do deal with this um on on the on the on the on space. And I think that we do need to enhance our capabilities, but I also think that eventually we're also going to need to develop redundancy to a lack of space. If somebody knocks our space assets out, are we too reliant on space? Do we have redundancy so that we can continue to operate without the space uh platform?
▶ 1:46:28Uh General Saltzman, no. I don't I think there are missions we're doing from space that we can't easily just redundantly cover uh if if we were to lose space. Well, I think if we're too overly re reliant on on on space and we don't have redundancy, we're asking for trouble because everything that we can put up can be down. And and you have to you have you know I I kind of believe in Murphy's law which doesn't mean that everything that it means that everything that bad can happen will.
▶ 1:46:57It just means that anything that can happen will and so let's not rely too much on I'm not saying invest in space absolutely okay and try to defend it as much as we can but in just in case it does get taken out we can't be helpless as a nation. And so, Secretary Minsk, I'm asking again, are we do we have redundancy? Are we developing redundancy to space? Again, that's another question for another time.
▶ 1:47:25Um, are we are we are we u uh investing in directed energy? I think at this level we can say yes, we are we are investing in direct energy. Okay. Very very good. And you know, I guess I have 15 seconds left and I guess my time is up and I yield I yield back to the chairman. Thank you. I would follow up let the gentleman from Florida know that we have been for many years developing directed energy capabilities and it's maturing at a nice clip.
▶ 1:47:54What you just saw happen in Israel with iron beam is part of our investments but yes and a lot of it we I'd be happy for you to learn more in a skiff but I'm very proud of that technology and it's got great potential in the future. With that the chair and I recognize gentle gentle lady from Maryland Miss. Thank you Mr. Chair. Gentlemen, thank you for being here and good morning. I echo the chairs and the concerns you heard from both sides of the aisle of this committee around the lateness of the budget and particularly Mr.
▶ 1:48:21Courtney's concerns around having an open, honest, and transparent conversation around the future of Air Force One. I'm going to start with the local issue and then expand to a national issue. We've talked about A10s quite a bit. I know that you all talk about the future of ATNs quite a bit in every every one of our states, but as you as you well know, Maryland's National Guard uh our 175th wing is unique.
▶ 1:48:43It comprises both the flight component and the cyber component, which I'm very grateful for the expansion of that cyber component, but with the devestment of the A10s, we'll lose that flight mission, but the cyber component has not yet stood up. And so there's going to be a bit of a gap in our mission. And I would just love some some greater clarity. Um I guess general general Alvin about uh cyber wings expansion when do you expect the full operational capacity? What's our planning to manage this transition period? I'm giving you all this at once.
▶ 1:49:12And then uh how are we coordinating with cybercom in particular to properly integrate this expanded wing. Well, thank you very much. And it it truly is a key mission going forward in a growth industry in the cyber wing. So it it's we want to go as fast as we possibly can. So it really is not going to be a a gap of sorts. There'll be a gap from full capability to full capability, but we expect the the sun downing of that to of the A-10 mission by the end of fiscal year 25.
▶ 1:49:38So in about five months, but in October is when we start building and we expect within 36 months of that, we will have a full an initial operation capability. But in between times, we will slowly be gaining missions. So there will be things we're already doing just robusting up in both capacity and sophistication. And then having Fort me right up the street is one of those where we're going to be able to leverage that capability to bring that on as fast as possible. One of the advantages is the greatest asset that we have in a cyber wing are are the personnel.
▶ 1:50:06And so being able to attract that talent in that area is is one of the big advantages there. And it also reduces the ability for potential extra milcon that would go with another platform coming in. So we are going to be aggressively standing up between 1 October 2025 beginning of 26 36 months later we're looking to get IOC and we'd like to get it sooner. I share I would like to get it sooner as well and and Mr. Mr.
▶ 1:50:29Secretary, just following up on that, our our airwing in Maryland, uh we've we've seen eight combat deployments in in just 20 uh since 2001, just over 23 years. Um my governor, Governor Wesmore, recently sent you a letter, I believe it was last week, asking for a meeting. I I appreciate you've been on the job two and a half weeks.
▶ 1:50:48Uh but to expand in in detail on what the general just shared, can I ask for a commitment right now, you and your staff to meet with my my governor and the Maryland delegation to walk through this so we have that seamless transition? I'd be happy to. Okay. I my staff will follow up with your staff literally as we walk out the door. Thank you very much. Okay, moving um Thank you for that. Moving on to to General Saltzman. Uh well, actually to to everybody at the panel. Um I bring this up.
▶ 1:51:13I'm a broken record, but I'm really proud that my first Kodell being a member of Congress, 153 days so far, was actually to Vandenberg, and I greatly enjoyed that experience. It also kind of opened my eyes to the to to physically seeing you have a a solar field. You're generating energy at Vandenberg, which is very exciting. We talk about energy resilience and capability, particularly as you know, we're overly relying on 50 states uh for for energy generation and delivery.
▶ 1:51:42So you have a a solar generating farm, but you have no storage. So it gives me great pause to think about our vulnerabilities both just from a grid system, but also our vulnerability from from foes. Uh very easy to to disrupt readiness capabilities when we don't have energy to and from. So if you could speak specifically to Vandenberg General and then Mr.
▶ 1:52:06secretary, your plans to obviously the lowhanging fruit is is is a Vandenberg, but I would love to hear your plans on how we're going to make sure our installations are energy as energy independent and resilient as possible from a readiness perspective. Well, thank you for that and appreciate you coming out to Vanber and taking a look at all the great people and mission they're doing out there. Um I I couldn't agree more that energy resiliency is operational readiness and especially in the space force where we do all most of our missions from our inbase locations.
▶ 1:52:36Uh we don't have to deploy to do space operations or launch operations and so we take it very seriously. We do continu mission continuity exercises on a routine basis to uncover where the particular shortfalls or vulnerabilities are. We we flow those back up to try to make sure we're as resilient as possible. The the other initiative that we've taken on is is a weapon system infrastructure accounting drill. Uh making sure that when we talk about power generation, it's a part of our readiness account. Uh we haven't traditionally done that.
▶ 1:53:05That's not something that uh other forces have to do to the same degree we do. So we're redesigning how we have transparency of our readiness uh in that kind of infrastructure. And I think that'll gentle lady's time's expired. Chair and I recognize a gentleman from Texas, Mr. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Gentlemen, thank you for coming to see us today and thank you all for your service. Uh, Miss Elf and Mr. Wilson actually started this conversation about the A-10s.
▶ 1:53:32I I was I think I got lost in space when I was talking I'm not talking to you when I that that the A10's shelf life is gone and then we're going to create an the next asset. I think that's a horrible idea. Um, I think the A10 is probably one of the b best creations we have. And I've been in the theater of war calling that plane in and it has saved my life countless times.
▶ 1:53:57And there's nothing more terrifying than that flying bathtub with bombs and that gun hanging off the front of it. And I think we're in a bad spot if we clack off somewhere and we put boots on the ground. That's going to be the asset that we're going to be flying overhead. I'm not going to take anything away from everything else that we have, but uh I just I felt like I needed to say that because again that that plane has saved my life and my teammates lives more times than I can possibly count. Um I'm going to shift gears.
▶ 1:54:26Um so I'm talk hypersonics. Um Mr. Secretary and Mr. General, you guys can kind of pick which one's going to answer this. I um I have the a list of the weapon assets and the weapon systems that China and Russia have right here. Um and general you said um rapid modernization evolving um kind of evolution of technology and in in the PLA.
▶ 1:54:52I think they're there and I think we're kind of looking at them is that's kind of the the bar that's been set very focused in on hypersonics. Can you give me a current briefing on where we are and when that capability and that asset will be able to be employed? I I can give you the broad brush at this classification level. Yeah. Absolutely. Yes.
▶ 1:55:14The broad brush and it's interesting because when you juxtapose uh you know the rapid advance in technology and going to hypersonics and you compare it to what we all love which is the A10. It's that the second question this is sort of the answer to the first. Those sort of things are making that awesome A10 less and less survivable. The most important thing for us agree with you if we had hypersonics that worked.
▶ 1:55:35Well, I would I would say it's not only hypersonics, it's the other advanced capabilities are going to be more survivable for our boots on the ground in the future given the enemy capabilities than the A10 which we all love. In the element of hypersonics there at this level, I will tell you that we are looking we are developing and have you'll see in the in the budget submission assuming it's it's what we had put forward uh two different programs. One is a a larger form factor that is is sort of more strategic long range that we have already tested several times.
▶ 1:56:05It's called Arrow and the other one is Hackom. There we go. Those that's we'll just leave it at there. But the there are two systems that are now continuing to develop and moving beyond the RDT and getting into the procurement range in the very near future. And I will be happy to go to higher classification level the specifics of both of those but we are accelerating in our development not only of the technology but of the procurement of the capabilities that it'll create. Mr. Secretary, are you having conversations about increasing funding for hypersonic capabilities in the Air Force or?
▶ 1:56:34Yeah, fielding fielding those weapon systems. Well, two two two sides of that that coin. First is we really need to as we've matured the technology, we focused on maturing the technology. Now, we need to focus on lowering the cost and getting into production. Um, it's got to be affordable. We've got to be able to buy more than 10 of these things, right? So, so that that's a big focus right now is is is lowering the production costs.
▶ 1:57:00Well, ramping up the production and lowering those costs so we can get enough of that kit to actually make a difference. Um, but yes, on the other side of the house, making sure that if once we do kind of get more efficient in production that we properly fund those programs, deliver that capability. And it's really across the across the force, not just in the Air Force, but the the entire department is is looking at these systems. And there's no question the Chinese moved uh uh really fast on these capabilities.
▶ 1:57:26General Saltzman, as far as AI capabilities in Space Force, um when the current budget plan comes out that we get to see, are how are those numbers looking? Are we comfortable in in where we sit at this classification level? Uh yes sir. A lot of it is early S&T work that's being done. Uh I'm focusing heavily on decision support kinds of AI. uh take a lot of data and turn it into decision quality as fast as possible. There's some good returns in the S&T environment and it's fully funded in support of those efforts. Okay.
▶ 1:57:56And I'll close with this. Um and Mr. Secretary, you and the general answer this and I know General Alman would say the same thing, but your most cherished asset is your your people and their health and well-being is everything. And I I would ask that you take a that if even if you are an art, take a very hard look currently and as they transition out because once they transition out, we get lost in space. And Mr.
▶ 1:58:24Secretary, you most likely probably already know that, but the generals mark my words. Okay. So, health and welfare of our service members as they transition out, current and transitioning out, please. Gentleman's times expired. Chair, I'd recognize gentleman from California, Mr. Whitesides. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, thank you all for being here today. Mr. Secretary, congratulations on your confirmation. It's good to have someone with your depth of relevant experience leading a military department. I had the opportunity to work with Director Scaliz back at NASA. So, welcome.
▶ 1:58:51Uh, I represent the northern side of Los Angeles County and I want to begin by just thanking your teams uh for their crucial role in fighting the Los Angeles Firestorm in January. Between the fire guard data program, firefighting aircraft and other aspects, we're deeply grateful to your teams. I want to support those efforts going forward as much as I can.
▶ 1:59:09I'm also enthusiastic about the possibility of using autonomy and a aerial platforms and advanced remote sensing to enable us to more quickly suppress fires that threaten critical installations like the Vandenberg Space Force Base and our home communities. And I'd love to work with your teams to continue to think about that. As you know, I'm proud to represent plant 42, the home of the B21 Raider. To me, that program is really a gold standard. It's delivering tremendous capability with an efficient development and manufacturing program.
▶ 1:59:38With that said, I want to follow up on a question that Senator Fischer asked this group during the SAS posture hearing late last month. As Senator Fischer noted, General Cotton has recommended that the Air Force procure at least 145 B-21s. Couldn't agree with him more, especially when increasing our total could decrease costs and move the production timeline to the left. Mr. Secretary, you noted uh to Senator Fischer that you were going to meet with General Cotton and discuss his B21 requirements. I was just wondering has that discussion happened? Are there any updates that you might be able to share at this time?
▶ 2:00:08I I I have not, but I expect to have an opportunity to talk to him next week next next Tuesday, right? Um just checking. Uh I have not had that detailed conversation with him, but but I will soon. Uh and and and we yeah, we are looking uh very closely at how we increase production just to get to the 100, right? We want to increase the production rate. uh that that's you know the program is executing very well.
▶ 2:00:33The really the challenge we have right now is getting the production rate up um to to deliver the numbers that we'd like which then gives us the opportunity to increase numbers if if if we can. Thanks for that Mr. Secretary. Um the committee has had multiple discussions over the past few months about the importance of developing robust space domain awareness something that I strongly support. Most of my career, I've been focused on securing US leadership in space. Space both from an economic and national security perspective.
▶ 2:01:00Remote sensing is central to the fight of the future and space-based capabilities are critical. That said, as I recently raised with General Guo and as Representative Emz discussed, space-based capabilities cannot be the basket in which we put all of our eggs. We need redundancies across domains. Uh that's underscored by the insatiable appetite for remote sensing information from forward operators. Mr. Secretary, I know you spent much of your um incredible career around space assets.
▶ 2:01:25Can you give us some reassurance that you'll support an appropriate balance between space, air, and terrestrialbased systems when it comes to remote sensing capabilities? Yes, Congressman, I can. You can never allow yourself to be put into a a single point failure situation to where if you lose a system, you've totally lost that capability. So, so both on space, redundancy in space is going to be critical. um the uh General Salsman talked a little bit about that earlier.
▶ 2:01:52So that that's going to be important but also uh you know mix between the different domains is going to be critical going forward. Uh and that is something we intend to continue. It's always a balance right you're never going to be able to forward everything as was mentioned we have a lot of modernization going on simultaneously across the department. So never going to be able to necessarily afford everything you'd like but it is important to make sure that you're not you know single point failure on on these critical Thanks so much.
▶ 2:02:19Um, last week I had a great visit to Edwards Air Force Base, which is just north of my district in the 412 test wing. And, uh, just on the point that represented, by the way, you've got an incredible team out there. They're doing incredible work. And, uh, General Alvin, uh, we're we're grateful for the great support you've, you've made to them, uh, just on the point minor point, but on the point that Representative Elfreth made about energy storage. they have a huge private solar installation on that base territory.
▶ 2:02:41And if you could just provide a little linkage and solar uh local storage, I think uh you can make Edwards uh ensure that it's keep operating through potential na natural and man-made disruption. So something to think about for the future. And with that, I yield back. Thanks so much. Gentlemen yields back. Chair now recognizes a gentleman from Guam, Mr. Mlin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. and to our distinguished witnesses. Thank you for your leadership and joining us here today.
▶ 2:03:10General Alvin, uh given the recent reports of unsafe and substandard conditions in unaccompanied housing on Guam, what steps is the department taking in the FY26 budget to address these deficiencies and ensure habitability of our service members? Thank you, Congressman. I appreciate the question and it certainly uh that that is something that we take very seriously.
▶ 2:03:36We always pride ourselves in really working hard for unaccompanied housing and and when the secretary of the Navy went out there he happened to find our very worst uh through the building condition index uh assessment the very worst in our United States Air Force but even our very worst should not be that bad. So with respect to specifically Palao dorm and then roa after that uh we aren't waiting until FY26.
▶ 2:04:02We had seen this coming and it's been about 56 months since we took over all of those uh uh facilities from the Navy and we had tried to identify and and ensure that we were moving forward with all of our unaccompanied housing across the way and then of course MUR didn't help at all. But this year we now expect to award $53 million for the improvement of Palao dorm this year and it should start within uh we should award it within 90 days and should start within 60 days after that. And so we are getting after that right now.
▶ 2:04:29It it's it's never enough and as you know Guam is such an important place we need to make sure our airmen are focused on mission rather than just their housing. So between uh the Palao dorms and the roto dorms and across the board we have an aggressive schedule against that. That's great to hear General. Thank Thank you so much for that. And as a followup, is the department considering privatizing unaccompanied housing as long-term solution? And what oversight mechanisms will be in place to ensure quality and accountability?
▶ 2:04:59Now, I would of course the secretary say he's only been in for two and a half weeks. We certainly haven't had those conversations and it's and it isn't really in of all the things we would consider privatizing uh that really isn't on our list right now because of that criticality of the young airmen who are living in there are sort of need sort of that oversight and leadership of the next level NCOs to be there. So that's not currently in the plans for me to propose for the secretary. We want to remain that under government control. I'm looking forward to this great improvements. Thank you, General.
▶ 2:05:27Uh, one another question, General Alvin, your testimony highlights reflect and the need to operate from austere airfields in contested environments. How is the air force resourcing Guam to support agile combat employment, particularly in terms of dispersed logistics, airlift, and handling of infrastructure under real world contingency conditions? Thank you for that question, Congressman.
▶ 2:05:56We're very excited about uh the refor pack uh resolute forces specific exercises. This will be one of the largest exercises that we've done uh since the cold war quite frankly because as we do exercises by sort of peace parts we get insights but we really want to see where the true shortfalls are and we expect and we've talked about this congressman that we know logistics is going to be important. It's not just logistics because of the tyranny of distance. It's going to be logistics under attack and understanding those contested environments. We're going to ring that out. Ring this out this summer.
▶ 2:06:25We have already in the past couple years been putting forward uh requests in our budget for things like um uh shelters and hardening and some non-kinetic capabilities to sense. So we know we have work to do to make this very critical concept of agile combat employment work. This summer this exercise is going to help expose any more shortfalls that we haven't already identified.
▶ 2:06:47In addition, we know having preposition of parts and and and forward storage to be able to accelerate the repair of the platforms when they when they break down. That's also another cre performance that we have to have in the Indo Pacific. And that's why I put in my unfunded priority list about a 1.5 billion for spare parts to increase the health of the shelf so we can increase the combat generation under attack. Excellent. Thank you, General. Uh Secretary me on Kodell on a Kodell last Congress.
▶ 2:07:17I flew to Guam with my colleagues on an Air Force C40. The jet suffered a landing gear malfunction and was stranded on Guam, which doesn't mean it's bad to be stranded on Guam, but it was stranded there for several days while awaiting parts for from Konas. Does our operational force encounter this type of issue? And how can new force design concepts or prepositioning ensure airmen are not stranded while operating in the Pacific?
▶ 2:07:50I know we don't have much time. So, just real quickly, yes, that that happens. I think the key thing is you almost alluded to is making sure you have enough spare parts and enough uh supplies to repair the aircraft uh across the force and that's a that's that's a focus in our budget submissions. And then prepositioning uh you know, we we can't pre-position everywhere um because we just will never have uh that would be terribly inefficient. Um, so those sort of conditions do happen, but but those are the two things.
▶ 2:08:18Make sure we have the right parts, make sure they're expired. Uh, I would uh point out that all housing at Guam has fallen in fallen into a unacceptable state of disrepair, not just unaccompanied. And there's a lot of blame to go around up on the dis as well as at the witness table, but we all need to be focused on correcting that.
▶ 2:08:39and General Albert, I'm thrilled to hear about what you just described, but I would urge you and General Saltzman and and the secretary to let us know how we can help deal with all of it because uh that is a critical area uh for our national security and we need to start putting a lot of resources against its capabilities and what we need to do for our service members that are stationed there. With that, I'll recognize gentleman from California, Mr. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 2:09:06chairman and uh thank you to all our witnesses today for taking time out of I know what are your busy schedules uh to be with here today. Um General Alvin, I appreciate in your opening comments uh about the continuing resolution and really the effect that it's having on quality of life as well as recruiting.
▶ 2:09:26You know, I wonder if you could go into more detail about uh how important it is to have a robust budget with recruiting in order to recruit individuals because we are competing with corporations out there today that is vying for the same talent. So, please thank you for that, Congressman. It really is because we are uh our recruiters are just the hardest working in the business right now and they work very hard to bring those Americans who want to raise their right hand and serve in the United States Air Force.
▶ 2:09:54We work very hard to to give them some sense of this is what you can expect. Welcome to the team. This is when you're going to get here. And if we don't have that funding to be able to follow through on that and to bring those in, not only to keep the Americans to want to come into our force, but to ensure that we are bringing the right talent at the right time without that predictability of funding or in this case the mark that when we had already intended to to recruit 3,000 more, we had to back off of that because we didn't have the funding.
▶ 2:10:20It's very disruptive and that lack of reliability, it has ripple effects well into the future, right? And so even though it's we're talking about a continuing resolution now, a possibility of maybe another one, um I mean, how many years down the line could that have effects into into your Well, actually, the fact that we've been under a continuing resolution about most of the time for the past decade plus, that's part of the the challenge that we're seeing here today. Well, thank you for that. I appreciate your your answer on that.
▶ 2:10:49uh General Saltzman um former Secretary Kindle had written an article really at the beginning of this year about the future of the space force and really about how it needs to really kind of transform I think the example he used is was he used Navy analogy of a merchant marine going into actual becoming a fighting force navy um where are we on that timeline and really what's it going to take us to get there where we can see the space force becoming that
▶ 2:11:20the fighting force that it should be. Yeah, thank you for that, sir. It's it's equipment, it's training, and it's the operational concepts. I think we've done some pretty good work on the operational concepts. We we generally know what we want to do. Uh acquisition uh of the equipment is a little longer lead item, but I feel good about the protection assets that we put in place in terms of resiliency, and now we've got good plans in place to put together the counterpace capabilities that convert us to the Navy, not the merchant marine. Mhm.
▶ 2:11:47And then training, uh, modeling and simulation, range assets, uh, highfidelity simulators, um, to to train our people to make sure that they practice the tactics that are going to be necessary. All of those are coming together. We'll have to grow a little bit as a force as we bring new capabilities on, new missions on. Uh, but I think we're well along our way uh, to to that evolution. And as um, you know, all the services still do space, they're still in the space game there.
▶ 2:12:13But as a space force grows and becomes, you know, larger and it is it taking over more of these roles to where now it'll be space force will kind of be there or will be more of a working together with the other services to kind of oversee their missions as well. Well, thank you for that because it came up a little earlier too and and I think General Alvin would agree with me. When we think about our missions and how we're going to perform the missions, the last question we ask is which domain should we use first? It's about what are the threats? what are the capabilities?
▶ 2:12:43What what's required of us to be survivable to create the effects we want? You can get to uh what where should this platform be located? Is it an airborne platform? You can get to that, but that's not our starting point. And so I see all of our our challenges as all domain challenges. Some of those will play out in space. Some of those we I rely on maritime capability uh to do the counterpace missions. So it's an all domain effort now in thisorked environment. The modern battlefield doesn't just restrict itself to one domain or another. All right. Thank you for that. Uh Mr.
▶ 2:13:13Secretary, you commented earlier about the uh Qatari 747 about a 700 or $250 million or Yeah, $250 million to uh to retrofit it. Um, but in that estimate that you gave to kind of modernize it or bring it up to to standards to meet the president's needs, did I also consider what it's going to take to go through that and make sure that that aircraft hasn't been compromised?
▶ 2:13:42Because as soon as I heard about this in the news, if I was a, you know, the CPC, I would be trying to get somebody on there bugging it, doing what they ever can. So, how are we going to make sure that the aircraft was not compromised? So, thanks Congressman. First off, I didn't say 250 million. Um, and we can talk more details in a different environment about what needs to go on there, but part of upgrading it is is essentially doing a deep sweep to make sure that there's no uh counter intelligence threats on the platform.
▶ 2:14:12Gentleman's time's expired. Chair, I recognize gentleman from Texas, Mr. Jackson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. I have three real quick questions I'm going to try to ask uh for General Alvin and for the secretary all related to Shepard Air Force Base, but start with uh one of my early achievements as a member of Congress was back in 2021 when I was successful in getting the new child development center at Shepard Air Force Base funded and authorized years ahead of its schedule.
▶ 2:14:35Shortly after breaking ground in 2023, however, construction crews identified asbestos in the ground, and the project has still yet to be completed. I'm concerned the Department of the Air Force has not been aggressive enough in resolving these types of issues. Uh Mr. Secretary and General Alvin, uh how are we addressing delays for projects like the CDC at Shephard? Would both of you please commit to ensuring that this project can stay on track if at all possible and we can deliver this critical support that we need for our families at Shepard? Absolutely.
▶ 2:15:05I can commit and I can commit to uh you know proposing to the secretary that we put the right funding against it. The remediation should be complete by October. Get us back on track. We understand this is one of those that discovery. The last thing we want to do though is put a CDC where there's uh lead and harm to the children. So, we wanted to make sure that entire environment is fully cleaned up. And so, by October 25, we should be able to have the remediation, get back on track. Yes, sir. I understand that and I appreciate that, Mr. Secretary. Oh, yeah.
▶ 2:15:32I think we're we're expecting if if it by the end of the year, get it cleaned up, get going. I think we're looking at like 28 to have that have it complete. Thank Thank you. I appreciate that. And if there's any opportunity to expedite things after that to make up for some of the lost time, I think we should do that. Thank you. I appreciate it. Uh, another question here. Across the air across the aircraft fleets in the US, Air Force inventory pilot training is foundational to our readiness as the service continues to struggle with the pilot shortage. I'm also concerned about the delayed acquisition of the T7, which is further constraining pilot training pipeline.
▶ 2:16:03Uh despite announcements earlier this year that the program may achieve an accelerated initial operational capability, there's been limited information about whether uh this will translate into expedited deliveries. Uh General Alvin um or Alvin, sorry. Uh would you provide an update on the T7 timeline and what these delays mean for the Air Force's ability to train our pilots?
▶ 2:16:22Uh what actions has the department taken to expedite delivery of these platforms and when could we expect delivery at Shepard Air Force Base in Yeah, Congressman, we can give you the uh the current understanding of of the layown of the order and the sequence and the timing. Uh it still is for Shephardd. I'll go to the last question first. Right now, it's about 7 years from now for the for finally. However, that that can be accelerated. Here's what we've done to accelerate that. We have taken some of the articles that were going to be production articles and we put them into test.
▶ 2:16:53We've accelerated the number of T7 platforms that are in test. Now, we've completed 140 flights. 67 of them were in all of last year. Already this year, we've made up the other ground. So, we are accelerating the test and as a test pilot, I've been checking in with it uh quite often and the airplane is performing phenomenally. So, we're trying to buy down the risk as fast as we can.
▶ 2:17:13If when we put the more platforms in, we can accelerate and move it to less by downing buying down the test risk, we're ready to do that because, as you know, Congressman, the T38s are operating great, but those J85 engines and all those challenges are things we don't want to contend with into the next decade.
▶ 2:17:26So we are stepping through and making sure that the milcon is lined up associated with all the funding and with Shepard of course we have it's crown jewel it's got the euronato piece and so which means they all get a say in when funding goes in to do the milcon and so we want to make sure we don't get ahead of that make promises that our international partners would have to put money against that we have to reneg on. So, we want to make sure we have confidence in that and buy down the test risk as we lay out the uh the actual production and the uh delivery capability across. It's a great platform.
▶ 2:17:56We can't get it fast enough. Well, thanks sir. I appreciate that and yeah, I agree 100% and obviously as important as that training program is to not only our pilots but our our allied pilots, uh seven years is a long time. So, anything that you know that I can do on my end, obviously from where I sit, I'm anxious in and willing to to help expedite that. It just it it seems like that's a long ways out. Thank you. With that, I yield back, Mr. Chairman. Illinois. Gentleman yields back. Chair now recognizes a gentleman from Illinois, Mr. Sorenson. Thank you to our chairman and ranking member. Uh good morning.
▶ 2:18:26Uh just about good afternoon. Uh and welcome to uh Secretary M, General Alvin, and General Staltzman. Thank you for your many years of service and dedication to our nation. Uh, I first have to say I'm really excited about where the Air Force is headed in terms of investing in new technology and new capabilities while also making sure that we're equipping the Air National Guard. Uh, these new assets and capabilities will be crucial to our national security.
▶ 2:18:52Uh, our next generation air missions like the F47s and CCAs must also be fielded to the Air National Guard. I proudly represent the heart of Illinois, home to the 182nd Airlift Wing in Peoria. As you all are well aware, they are the gold standard for Air National Guard service. And I know I speak for everyone back home when I say that we're so excited to welcome C130J model to our airports and our airspace.
▶ 2:19:21The 182nd Wing is exemplary and I'm proud to support their work. Doing the crucial work that many of our neighbors, my neighbors are doing, Title 5 employees at the Peoria Air National Guard. Like so many of my colleagues here in the committee, I'm troubled why Donald Trump's administration thinks that cuts to the defense workforce are a good idea. This drain of expertise is detrimental at a time when we should be improving our readiness to meet the challenges of today and tomorrow.
▶ 2:19:50I'm concerned about what the loss of Title 5 civilian employees at our Air National Guard bases across the country and what it means for overall readiness. To the secretary, could you explain how the loss of these employees and Air National Guard um will impact our emissions, but you know, how should other federal workers feel? How are they supposed to keep their morale so high if cuts are happening to the best workers on their Mr. Congressman, thanks.
▶ 2:20:20I can't speak specifically to Poria. Um been there a couple times, but uh can't speak to the guard base there and how they're going to handle the the civilian workforce impacts. I think overall though uh across the department. Uh the push and again civilian workers have been uh critical. I've been one for 30 odd years. Uh so so critical to the defense defense department. Uh saying that though there's always an opportunity to improve efficiencies.
▶ 2:20:46any organization has an opportunity to prove efficiencies and I think that's what's uh going on at the department right now is how do we how do we continue increase efficiency support or prioritize the workforce on the highest priority missions so that we can deliver these capabilities we have more free more resources delivered to critical capabilities but it's always going to be a balance right you're always going to be a balance um I've seen this many times in my career where there's give and take on on the size of the workforce and and we're in another area we're trying to improve our efficiencies Um
▶ 2:21:16and and you know I I've done it before and that's what we working across the department try to make sure that uh we continue to meet the priorities. So what do I say to people when they back home when somebody hears we want to improve efficiency? There's a skip of your heart because does the improving of the efficiency mean it's my job? What do I say? So it's always hard. You're you're exactly right. It's always hard.
▶ 2:21:42Um uh but as we've discussed the prioritization of funds both on hardware and people are the tough decisions sometimes that we have to make and but we do and need to do everything we can to support the workforce as we do that. You know, I'm also concerned about our National Guard federal technicians. Um do you expect that the president's 2026 budget will request adequate funding to support our National Guard's federal Be happy to discuss that once the budget's released.
▶ 2:22:10Congressman, I look forward to seeing it as everyone does. And while I have uh just one minute left, I want to acknowledge uh that just yesterday, the Rock Island Arsenal's Joint Manufacturing and Technology Center just received their AS9100 certification. Uh this will allow them to deliver the best components to the aerospace industry. And I I strongly urge the Air Force to make efforts to partner with our organic industrial base to make sure that our war fighters have everything that they need.
▶ 2:22:37Um, also as a meteorologist, um, I'd be remiss as we begin hurricane season, my thanks, uh, to the courageous folks at the Air Force Reserve hurricane hunters, uh, who do everything that they can to fly into these the world's biggest storms with the sole purpose of keeping us safe. Uh, so may they stay safe in this hurricane season. And if you ever need a meteorologist from Congress to fly with them, I just give me a call. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 2:23:07Chairman. I yield back. That's a first for me. Uh, gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Magcguire, is recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to our witnesses. Thank you to our men and women in the military. Your service is important, and we would not have a country without you. I want to make a couple of statements before I get into um questions. Um, I have a resolution I'm working on. It's HR 3478. I'd ask the witnesses to write that down. HR 3478. It's the manned aircraft clarification act.
▶ 2:23:37There are many reasons why Langley and other places didn't engage drones. I'm sure you know some of that I don't know, but I believe a lot of the hesitation was an advisory put out by the DOJ in 2020. So, the manned aircraft uh clarification act HR 3478 will take care of mo almost all of the SLT problems and almost all of the DOT problems. And I know you guys have got actual ways of shooting them down.
▶ 2:24:02Now, my wife and I were with our church in Israel about three years ago on a mountain looking into a valley and we saw F-35s coming and landing and then disappearing underground kind of like an aircraft carrier. I'm sure that would be super expensive, but with looking at what happened in Russia, I'm sure you guys would consider that and other options. All right, now to the questions. Secretary Mink, I think I heard one of you say earlier that new missions require new resources.
▶ 2:24:27Um, the Air Force continues to prioritize modernization across its missile enterprise, including next next generation missiles, uh, propulsion, advanced tactical and air defense systems, space launch, and nuclear modernization, all of which depend on solid rocket motors. Concerns have been voiced about the domestic supply chain and increasing domestic demand signals for these critical Air Force needs.
▶ 2:24:51How is the Air Force working to ensure a stable and competitive domestic supply of solid rocket motors to meet program requirements to include addressing current industrial-based constraints and production bottlenecks? Uh so, Congressman, um thanks for the question. I I'm not sure I can speak to the the overall approach. I'll ask General Alvin for help on that.
▶ 2:25:14I know we've seen a couple of challenges particularly in uh some of the actually in some of our launch programs and other programs there's been some challenges with the solid rocket motors that are being addressed right now but for the overall particularly in the missile category I'll turn to all of actually nothing to add systemically across the board but with each you know the integration has always been the challenge and making sure that we have the right capability on those but uh we can take that one for the record and see if there's anything more sure has the air force considered supporting campus style solid rocket motor production models that
▶ 2:25:44would leverage proven private sector sector expertise collate located manufacturing. I went towards Starbase in Texas and they've got this campus style. Everything's all in one spot. So, I'd ask that you guys consider that. All right, General Salsman. Um, President Trump's Golden Dome executive order calls for development and deployment of non-kinetic capabilities to augment the kinetic defeat of advanced cruise missiles.
▶ 2:26:10Some of these capabilities include lasers and particle beam weapons technologies which require a large amount of power to operate. I'd expect the Space Force to fully uh explore deploying these capabilities to their interceptor architecture. Uh since I've entered Congress, I've been a big proponent of deploying advanced nuclear reactor technology like small modular reactors and micro micronuclear reactors orbit and and micro reactors in orbit.
▶ 2:26:37Nuclear energy has 1,000 times the power density of solar and will power not just lasers but our communications and data collections as well. So is the space force looking into the adoption of nuclear technology into our next generation space architecture? Well, first and foremost I I can say that we are looking into directed energy. Uh we see this the same way you do. This is a very promising technology that we have to explore. Uh if you don't mind, I'd like to talk to you maybe in a different environment about the things that we are doing and see if there is room for that. I'm not we'll have to take that for the record.
▶ 2:27:07I'm not uh tracking anything specific. That sounds great. And then um Secretary Mink and General Alvin, what is the Air Force strategy to store and transport a large stockpile of CCAs? How are you coordinate your efforts with the US Transportation Command? Yeah, thank you for that question, Congressman, because the beauty of of what we're doing right now, we are still having those the CCAs be uh developed in a prototype uh part of its life cycle. At the same time, we are standing up an experimental operations unit.
▶ 2:27:36So as we understand the platform, we understand the autonomy, we're looking into how we intend to actually employ, sustain, maintain them. And that will drive our operational concepts as to whether they are uh some are forward positioned or whether they're forward deployed or whether stored here. That is that is work that is ongoing. But that is front of mind for our experimental operations units understanding how to make sure that we take on this capability as the game changer that it really is. Well, thank you very much. I yield back my time. Gentleman yields back.
▶ 2:28:04Chair and I recognize a gentleman from North almost has good barbecue. There you Mr. Thank you for acknowledging that, Mr. Mr. Secretary, um congratulations on your recent appointment and actually I'm really look forward to working with you. So congratulations to you and General Salsman.
▶ 2:28:28Um thank you always for you know what you're doing in the space General Olvin, it's always good to see you. I appreciate, you know, conversations in between these meetings and I probably just want to spend a little bit more time on questions that we've already talked about just um having reassurances, you know, towards those conversations to be candid.
▶ 2:28:53So the first question is as we are talking about Seymour Johnson Air Force Base um could you please expand on the commitment if it remains as we've had many conversations now or several conversations and I'm saying beyond just you General Spain and others um regarding um bringing um the block 20 229 F-15 East um to Seymour Johnson Air Force Base once they um those F-35s come Yeah,
▶ 2:29:23thank you. That continues to be our plan as we get them there. So, that is that is on track with the the manner it has been in the last couple years. We still think it's the it's the right thing to do to keep that capability and keep see Johnson is one of sort of the core for F-15 F15X training as well. Thank you so much. Which then also brings me into the next question been that we're seeing um an increase role of the training at Seymour Johnson Air Force Base contingent upon obviously a reconciliation package going through.
▶ 2:29:52Um how do we plan to address that increased training? Yeah, we're certainly working with that with Air Combat Command to understand what the increased throughput would be. uh right now is we're we're also looking at getting uh more pilot training graduates out as we're starting to increase that pipeline. So air combat command is looking at specifically to make sure we can handle now at at that point it just becomes you put more platforms in do we require more maintenance and more instructors etc etc to accommodate that.
▶ 2:30:19So we're looking at the increased throughput caused by those which is going to be ramping up over the next few years. So we're taking a close look at that right now. Thank you so much for that. And then obviously it then brings me back to still dealing with reconciliation. Um when we have dealt with Congress the conversations the prior conversations dealing with investment obviously there was a period as we were dealing with those conversations and the ultimate decision.
▶ 2:30:46Now, the decision's been made um and we're bringing forth now revenue appropriations 127 million uh to address the current needs in terms of operational needs at Seymour. Um the F15e that are currently there, those 220s. Um could you speak on that please? The commitment of making sure that that those funds remain in place. Well, yeah, because those are just as critical as the others.
▶ 2:31:13we still have uh a portion of our force that is flying in the 220s and and regardless of that the the the quality of the support infrastructure and everything that makes that mission happen. We can't let it drop because as we see with an increase in the introduction of the F-15 EX there's just a general proposition that this is going to be a platform with both variants that's going to be a part of our future, a growing part of our future more so than we thought of when we started these conversations several years ago. That's right.
▶ 2:31:39And I I would just take a moment to continue to articulate uh I'm constantly on the base, constantly stand engaged and realize the dire need that exists there. And some of this is because of just dealing with the prior decisions that now have been made. But nevertheless, as decisions are being made, we need to make sure we're still in position to deal with the addressing those decisions. And I just want to continue to uplift those, bring them to the forefront.
▶ 2:32:08Now looking into the future, obviously have a lot of interest in Seymour Johnson Air Force Base in the world of we continue to talk F-15EXes. Um, and notice the the argument and and our conversations are driven just trying to increase the F-15E presence at Seymour with the two 29s.
▶ 2:32:33But do you maybe see the world a world in which there maybe either F-15E exs or you know under um ENGAD you know my question would be you know even potentially F-47s it see we certainly need to look at the the mission course when we think of the F-47 it eventually is sort of the follow on to the F-22 so it's never a one for one replacement but understanding the different mission sets that are required of those different types of platforms But
▶ 2:33:03when we certainly look at the future, we need to also understand where we might want to put and let me take my last 5 seconds here. Do you see the world of transferring aircraft from Seymour to the guard to help we we need to have a balanced total force to make sure that we have a capability for the future. So I wouldn't take anything off the table at this point. Inspired chair, I recognize a gentleman from Georgia, Dr. McCormick. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you gentlemen for being here with us today. That's awesome.
▶ 2:33:31Uh, one of the things that really worried us about the lessons learned we had overseas right now with the operation rough rider and the the deployment to uh the Yemen area. Uh, what kind of lessons uh I I'll probably this with you general uh what kind of lessons have we learned with the Houthis and what we can do better with uh both measures and countermeasures offensive and defensive coordination against those sort of uh terrorist organizations?
▶ 2:33:58Well, we're certainly learning a lot in in the sentime and you mentioned the Houthi specifically between that and the salvo that the uh that came from Iran, you know, 18 months ago or almost two years ago now, we are learning a lot about uh how we need to address threats that might be low cost, high volume and don't end up on the wrong side of the cost curve. And so uh even ju just most recently we have developed capabilities that were lower cost that we are now putting on platforms over in the Middle East.
▶ 2:34:25So, for example, whereas before we would have an F-15E with a an M9 uh X on it, which 400,000 a pop to maybe an AMA, which is over a million dollars pop shooting down the the cheaper drones. Now, we need to protect our assets. So, we we did what the what what the situation required. However, we have more recently developed capabilities to where we can have laserg guided rockets which are doing the same thing against those platforms.
▶ 2:34:49So instead of $400,000 or a million dollars a pop, these things are $32,000 a shot and you could put 42 shots on an aircraft. So it's showing that we have the ability to adapt our current force structure to meet those threats in the in the Middle East that we aren't expending all the resources that we need to do to develop the capabilities, the high-end capabilities to meet the Chinese threat in in the Indo Pacific. And do you think on countermeasures as far as like the the cheap drones they can send after us on our localities?
▶ 2:35:14We saw um we had some US troops actually killed uh not that long ago by drone strikes uh from terrorist coordinate and it was on our bases. Uh what kind of hardened structures are we using or even nets? Anything cheap, whatever we can use. Are we looking at some things that are realistically going to be deployed against these things that are very difficult to go after mass-wise? We are and and in in fact within St.
▶ 2:35:37come and I'm looking I'm speaking for the air force bases of course this was at al-Assad but in the air force bases I was in uh in in in one of the bases here over Christmas time and they are using these various stitching together the various counter UAS systems but rethinking this is not only just the capabilities it has to be the operational concepts on how to defend a base in a way we hadn't thought about because they'd been uncontested for 25 30 30 years so now having a a unit train ahead of time to know how to defend the base and go and preserve that installation
▶ 2:36:08and the force generation that it provides is absolutely key. I think we're making some progress on that. It's not only the capabilities, it's the units that are trained to go over there and fight, but they're trained ahead of time as units. That those things are key. Perfect. And Mr. Secretary, I know one of the things that we talked about AI predictability and and maintenance and and we talked the sec the chair talked about our ability to stay up above 60% about uh especially aircraft.
▶ 2:36:32I'm a pilot and I know that when you have a bunch of aircraft that are down because we didn't predict it uh appropriately, it puts us at a disadvantage. Uh some of the readiness rates are really really poor. Obviously, are we using AI predictive models to get on top of that? We are. Um there's been a number of of efforts to to start doing that and and I I think that's going to help.
▶ 2:36:55Uh but I also think even over the years because of budget pressures we've squeezed that and even though we knew we knew we were squeezing it. Um so we really didn't take advanced predictive models to know that we were actually squeezing it. Um and that now we're trying to reverse that. We're trying to put more focus on readiness, trying to make sure that we have the parts and sustainment and we had a little discussion earlier about right to right to repair those sorts of things.
▶ 2:37:20So there's going to be a focus across the board, but some of the advanced analytics to help predict that are going to be uh important as they are now, but they will continue probably increase in importance. Great. And I always encourage the the secretaries uh just like the commonants and the leaders of each individual service to be as transparent as possible about the stuff that you guys need. And you always need more. Always need more. I remember uh when General Kruak was the only general out of the service commanders that that really said, "Hey, we need more. We're suffering." And then when when everything started falling apart, they're like only one general told us we needed more.
▶ 2:37:50The chair has been very open and honest about the fact that we need more invest in our military. So just be uh very aggressive on that. We'll receive that. Well, I think uh final question. Um now this doesn't really apply to the Space Force because you guys are brand new, but we can see a lot of legacy systems that aren't benefiting all the services. The Marine Corps is trying to shed some of those things that we don't use for the next war, not the last war. And there is some protectionism in Congress, I think, on systems. And I think the last recent futures command analysis of the air force is like 30% of your assets really aren't futuristic.
▶ 2:38:20They're not thinking about the next war. They're thinking about the last war. Maybe they're protectionist from the standpoint of people have things produced in their districts. I would love to see you identify stuff. We can we can re replant those things with with the futuristic cheaper better stuff that we use in the future. I hope you'll work with us to identify those things that we don't need anymore. It's okay. Work with us in Congress. We'll help you collectively. Gentleman's time's expired. Chair and I recognize a gentleman from California, Mr. Tran. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary Mink, General Saltzman, General Alvin.
▶ 2:38:51Thank you all for your service and for your testimony today. As you know, the Space Development Agency was created to drive innovation and field capabilities rapidly. But as the SDA transitions further into space uh the space force, there are uncertainties about maintaining its agility and unique acquisition model. Recently there have been rumors suggesting that SDA's tanch 2 and tanch 3 transport layers are facing termination within the current 2026 DoD budget in favor of uh milnet.
▶ 2:39:18As you know SDA's transport layer is the only directto platform constellation in development. The alternative currently does not have a direct to directto platform capability and is uh optimized for high data rate transfer to ground stations and then dissemination of data. SDA's transport layer provides essential low latency communication that reaches the tactical edge. Transport is the only proven link 16 capability in space with transport link 16 capabilities will not exist for at least three years.
▶ 2:39:45Not only would cancellation of Trunch 2 result in the termination of hundreds of millions of dollars of ongoing fixed price contracts, severely degrading and eliminating areas of the growing space industrial base, but also would delay getting this critical capability directly to the war fighter. uh can you ensure that SDA's tranch 2 transport layer will be protected within the department's 2026 budget?
▶ 2:40:07Please also speak to generally about the importance of SDA to the growing space industrial base in California and across the country and how it ensures uh competition and resiliency moving So the FY26 budget of course is not finalized yet. The the the request hasn't come over yet. So we we'll take a look uh at the specific details once those are finalized for sure.
▶ 2:40:32Let me um I I agree with you 100% that the capabilities that SDA is pursuing are vital to almost every aspect of the space force mission and the joint force at large. The data transport layer is vital. Um and and the capabilities that we're delivering in trunch 2 in particular are key to that success. Uh so we're committed to making sure that that program is successful and looking at the broad array of capabilities that might complement it. Thank you so much. I appreciate that.
▶ 2:41:00Uh the Air Force has emphasized the urgency of the combat collaborative aircraft CCA program in enabling affordable mass and operational advantage against peer adversaries. Yet there's concerns that increment one aircraft under development may be treated primarily as test beds rather than operational assets.
▶ 2:41:18What specific steps is the department taking to ensure that these increment one platforms are not merely prototypes for evaluation but are in fact fielded in meaningful numbers on an operationally relevant timeline to meet the pacing threat from China. Thank you very much for the question because frankly that's the first I'd heard that anyone was considering them only becoming test articles. We are absolutely integrating them into our operational air forces.
▶ 2:41:40Matter of fact, the two competitors that we down selected for prototypes, General Atomics and Andre are competing very heavily against each other to for us to be able to use both of them. In parallel to the to the development and the prototyping of the actual platforms, we have a a simultaneous program going on for the development of the autonomy. It's called Project Venom. So, we're understanding how we can leverage the autonomy, put them into the platforms, and make better use of them in human machine teaming. Simultaneous to that, we have the experimental operational unit.
▶ 2:42:09So as soon as they come online and we're expecting to have a couple hundred of them by the end of the phep soon as they come online we want to be able to integrate them employ them and advance their capabilities and learn about the human machine teaming in an operationally relevant time frame. The challenge is that we're going to stick with is there's always something you say if you spend a little longer we could put something else on it. We can put something speed to ramp is the key here. Get it out there get the usefulness of it and learn from it. Fully expect them to be operationally uh utilized. That's right. Thank you so much, General.
▶ 2:42:39I appreciate that testimony and thank you to all three of you for being here. With that, chairman, I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair recognizes gentleman from North Carolina, Mr. Herrian. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And uh thank you for your testimony today, gentlemen. Great to have you here. Uh we had uh the Army in here yesterday uh and and learned a lot from them. And uh I wanted to talk to you, General Alvin.
▶ 2:43:02uh in January of this year, you wrote an op-ed uh for Breaking Defense in which you stated that the Air Force is now kind of at a break a makeorb breakak moment. And I fully agree with you. Couldn't agree more. The Air Force cannot afford to keep doing things the way that it has always done them. And if we're truly serious about prevailing in the next conflict or properly deterring the next conflict against the PRC, we've got to get serious about how we actually align our resources.
▶ 2:43:30And when I take a look at the equivalent of the balance sheet in the P&L for the Air Force, it it bleeds red from both a infrastructure perspective and a legacy systems perspective. Your onm budgets are just absolutely bleeding. And you talked a little bit about that today. You talked about some excess infrastructure that you have both from facilities perspective as well as from an available apron perspective.
▶ 2:43:56Uh my colleague from Georgia talked about identifying certain systems that u as we all know here uh may be parochial right they may be and and some of these decisions have been made in the best interests of certain districts across the country but they haven't been made in the best interests of the United States and America moving forward and I I I I think we need to fix that.
▶ 2:44:19So my question for both you and the secretary is are and do you have a similar plan much like we were briefed yesterday by the army the army transformation initiative.
▶ 2:44:34Do you have a similar plan in the Air Force to purge these legacy weapon systems, these legacy force structures, and reallocate some of this real estate that you have that's not helping your budgets right now so that we can create the Air Force of the future? Do you have a formal plan for that? I'll take the first shot and then let the secretary correct me 100%. But our plan is different from the Army's is that our plan it requires growth either way.
▶ 2:45:03And so when we look at specifically with the infrastructure, that is one that is one where there can be pure savings. But it's not as easy as saying, "Well, let's just close this or that." Which is why we really want to work with Congress because because you might have 10 installations that might have 10% excess each on them, but that doesn't mean you close any one of them without some collaboration or understanding for for me and for my, you know, advice to the secretary is however that gets uh resolved.
▶ 2:45:29As long as it's off my books, that excess infrastructure, whatever it costs to do that, we can recapitalize that. So that would be one plan is to work with ways to generate revenue or do something to where that excess infrastructure that is not supporting our airman's quality of work or quality of life is no longer on our books because that is that is when in tooth to tail that's all tail and so eliminating that is part one. The other part is it the tougher part is really fully divesting ourselves of some of the legacy force structure.
▶ 2:45:57I will tell you though that this prioritization that we were directed to do to ensure what what would it look like if we had to drop off some percentage of our budget to make room for the president's priorities that sharpened our focus. And so it's very clearly in the aggregate three things defend the homeland from the air and we do uh the the nuclear recapitalization to support strategic deterrence and then projecting power uh to deter the PRC. Some things fall out of the bottom of those but they're very important to the joint force. But we find that the joint force loves the air force as well.
▶ 2:46:27So we find ourselves challenged to say pull any of the the main capabilities out. Not only because there are parochial interests within districts and states, but also there are some parochial interest interests within other parts of the joint force. So we will continue to identify those things that are least dear to us. But before it makes it out of the Department of Defense, we need to understand they may not they may be least dear to us, but if they're so dear to the joint force, then that that needs to be resourced elsewhere. So that is a challenge for us. It's a great general. And before Mr.
▶ 2:46:55Secretary, you give your answer, I'd like to say very clearly, I don't think anybody has any interest in closing off any infrastructure, right? We've got to make it relevant because once we lose it, we never get it back and it's a loss of national capability. So, just to clarify that, Mr. Secretary, do you have any thoughts? We've got about 40 seconds. I I I guess I'd just reinforce your statement that uh evolving and and and and modernizing the force is critical.
▶ 2:47:20question asked earlier about some of the things we learned in Yemen and yeah, a lot of the low-end threats, but we also learned that unfortunately the proliferation of some of the high-end Russian anti-aircraft and other systems and the and what we've seen within the Ukraine theater is if if you don't have a survivable system, you're in trouble even if you're over Yemen. Mr. Secretary, threat 10 seconds, I'm going to reclaim my time here.
▶ 2:47:42I just encourage both of you to take a very hard look at the assets that we have and if they have not helped us win the last 30 years of war and if they are not helpful deterring or defeating China, we need to do the hard make the hard decisions and get rid of them. Thank you. Chair now recognize a gentleman from California, Mr. Gary Mindy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary Mig, welcome. Look forward to working with you in the days ahead.
▶ 2:48:08I note your extensive uh experience in space operations and I'll focus on that. General Saltzman, good to see you once again. You're going to get a buy this time. As will you, General Alvin? We've been down through this. Would you be disappointed if I didn't take up the Sentinel? I suspect uh Secretary you've been well briefed. I understand the Sentinel has come up from some of my colleagues and that's good. Uh this is a uh question for you Mr.
▶ 2:48:39Secretary. Uh this is a quote from the president not so long ago. There is no real there is no reason for us to be building brand new nuclear weapons. We're all spending a lot of money that we could be spending on other things that are actually hopefully much more productive. Secretary Mink, do you agree or disagree with the president?
▶ 2:49:07Well, what I'd say is that nuclear deterrence across the board is one of the highest priorities of uh of or the nuclear enterprise, national security is the highest priority and Sentinel is one of those programs. We continue to to obviously support that program and we're doing everything we can to get it back on track. I think the concern has been um and this is really the delivery system for nuclear weapons, not the nuclear weapons themselves. We we don't we don't build those.
▶ 2:49:32Um this is the delivery systems and and just the fact that we need to modernize given the age of the Minman 3 is critical. Um as well as some additional capability we need to operate in in the future uh environment that we could talk about in more detail uh in a separate environment. U so we are spending a lot of time making sure that we're doing this program right. Um it just went through McCertie so obviously cost grew. We got to make sure that we execute, execute, execute uh so that we are efficient in line with the president's directive to support the homeland and deter China.
▶ 2:50:04If I were to look at the written testimony that will soon be available, yours and others, it would seem as though you disagree with the president because the Sentinel is a new nuclear delivery system. So, so Congressman, I' I'd have to go back and look in specifics at the quote you pulled. I have never and do not believe that I disagree with the president on anything.
▶ 2:50:26I think we're supporting his priorities which is support the homeland and this is one of the programs that we will use to support the homeland along with a number of the other uh programs that the the department provides to the nation. This introduction was specifically to bring to your attention a $200 billion new weapon system. The rocket itself and the various infrastructure needed is well over 150 billion now.
▶ 2:50:54Uh there is a new nuclear bomb, new command and control systems and other bits and pieces along the way that'll push this to 200 billion. Quoting the president, we're spending a lot of money that we could be spending on other things that are actually hopefully much more productive. Direct quote from the president. Uh and I'll get that delivered to you.
▶ 2:51:18Bottom line of this is that um we have a third leg of the triad, the Minute Man 3, which under the current plan for the Sentinel would require that the Minute Man 3 continue to be operative for at least another decade, at which time the first Sentinel would be available to begin the replacement process.
▶ 2:51:47We don't have to stop the Sentinel program, but we can certainly delay it and then spend that money on things that have been discussed by my colleagues here which were much more relevant to today's fighting. There's a very interesting word that is used in support of the Sentinel and the Minute Man 3 and that is that it is the most responsive leg and I would appine that the reason it's the most respon responsive is that it
▶ 2:52:18is the use it or lose it leg in which the rockets would have to be deployed or be taken out by an incoming nuclear lear attack. However, there are other very responsive ones. Uh the U B21, for example, had something less than a billion dollars a copy. Let's just assume that's $150 billion.
▶ 2:52:44How many B-21s could you have that are clearly responsive? Congressman, I'm not going to try to do that math in my head. I I I would say that that somewhere about 150 the Sentinel program is designed to be actually a very survivable system. Um and and and gentlemen's time expired chair and I recognize gentleman from Texas Mr. Fallon. Uh thank you Mr. Thank you to the witnesses.
▶ 2:53:10Um what I want to talk to you general ele about is recruiting the we had posturing on the army and literally when the secretary of the army mentioned that they had hit their goals I cheered and other members of this committee did because we were in a crisis mode yearover year. It's one thing to miss your recruiting goals in a given year but when you're doing it year-over-year three four five in a row then it gets to be crisis. So if you could talk to us a little bit about where we are with recruiting with the Air Force uh why you think it turned around.
▶ 2:53:39What I would also encourage you to do and the secretary as well is let's find out the reasons. Everybody has their suppositions and maybe expectations as to why, but I'd really like to figure out why people are now joining so we can then replicate it and continue on if you could expound. Thank you very much. And I'm going to be very brief because I could go on for an hour with you. Maybe I'll I'll come and see you afterwards. I would say first of all, I love the way you characterize it. Crisis versus a challenge. The Air Force only had one year we didn't make it. Okay. We've only had one year that we didn't meet our recruiting goals.
▶ 2:54:08Since then, we have we think it's a combination of several things. The COVID hangover where we couldn't get our folks into the schools and start getting the Americans excited about joining the United States Air Force. We also had certain maybe outdated policies. We also had the the sort of mixin of of of the new medical system by which uh you evaluated people's ability to join and and that caused some bottlenecks in the time between when you got the contact or as the Marines say contact to contract.
▶ 2:54:37that sort of mucked up that for a little while. All those things came together, but fundamentally we think it's a it's several things. It's also a unifying focus, focusing on the threat, focusing on the warrior ethos. All of these things come together. And as we do that, we want to ensure to your point, Congressman, to your point, we want to ensure the things that we are doing different, we want to track in a longitudinal study format to see year-over-year, are those the recruits, the ones that are staying, the ones that are performing. So, we are doing that analysis.
▶ 2:55:06We are confident with good shoe leather, good IT support for our recruiting, it'll continue to get more contacts out there. And that's the key. In general, roughly what's the number when you talk air guard, reserve, and active uh on a year-over-year basis? What are we looking at? Well, on on the active side, uh we look for about 31,000 uh was the goal for analyst recruiting. And on the guard side, it's closer to I want to make sure I got it right. Uh guard reserve total. Uh well on the guard side I think it's 6,000 and and the reserve is 4,000.
▶ 2:55:36I will get you. Okay. So roughly 40. Okay. Thank you. Uh and then do are we making real quickly because I want to move on a couple other things. Uh for those that qualify in every other regard but they have maybe some physically they're not quite up to mark. Are we having uh we doing anything special for them? We are we are still holding them to the same standard. Okay. They get there this year. But but we're not like if they miss I think one of the other branches is putting them through another month of prep. Uh they're not kicking them back. We haven't had to do that. We haven't had to do that. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 2:56:05Um as far as Mr. Secretary with and I'm sorry, General Saltzman with uh cyber uh it tomorrow is going to be more important than is today and and furthermore uh how are we uh attracting folks to serve in cyber because it is such with specificity and maybe not just with the military, maybe with on the civilian side.
▶ 2:56:27uh and how are we training them and how are we retaining them and then what can we do in Congress to give you the tools to get these very critical people uh in the future today and in the future. We've had a lot of luck uh with recruiting. Uh there's a lot of interest in coming in and learning cyber techniques and cyber capabilities in the military and we're taking advantage of that certainly.
▶ 2:56:48Uh we rely on the Air Force uh training pipeline to train our uh enlisted cadre with regards to cyber and we're almost uniquely wholly committed to cyber mission defense. Meaning we're not protecting our unclassified networks, our administrative networks. We're focused on just the weapon systems and those mission networks. So we have a smaller cyber force uh uh dedicated to just that mission network protection. Uh and but you the point you raised about can we keep them in and keep them retained.
▶ 2:57:18We are doing everything we can to make sure they stay on the leading edge of cyber defense technology. Uh working with industry, deploying some of our uh Guardian cyber people into industry to learn the techniques there and then come back and deliver to us. So we're trying to do as much as we can to keep the education at a high level and and if we have to in Congress today provide any monies for specific scholarships uh just let us know, Mr. Secretary, what we can do in that regard uh because it is so critical moving forward. And with my last 20 seconds, I want to say Mr.
▶ 2:57:47Secretary, uh, welcome. You are the right man at the right time in the right place for the right job. And it's, uh, great to have you here. Thank you. You have 11 more seconds. Thank you very much, chairman. I yield back. Chairman, now recognize a gentleman from Massachusetts, Mr. Katy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank our witnesses. U, I just want to deal first with the probe about research and development readiness issues.
▶ 2:58:11uh and I notice you know with uh F works and I notice with F ventures you know coordination uh with the air force and the commercial side of things but one of the areas I think that really would be advantageous is to have more uh of a collaboration with the universities colleges and other schools uh I know the air force does that with Howard but you know in my district um I'm looking at uh collaboration sometimes with MIT um Lincoln
▶ 2:58:42Laboratories, those groups. But I also look at a program we have. We deal with the Navy and it's at the University of Massachusetts in my district where uh they have a program for marine undersea technology research and they developed their own curriculum in conjunction with uh the Navy uh and they're working on on the research very successfully. but also those people are uh pipeline to more recruitment and more service personnel.
▶ 2:59:11Uh in elsewhere in my district's community college working on avionics. Uh uh the Cape Cod Community College has a program on avionics training and they have avionics maintenance technician licenses that come out of it. uh avionics electronic uh technology technicians licenses on it there and there's a waiting list uh to to participate in this.
▶ 2:59:37So could you uh tell me what avenues you have either with grants or other outreaches to the universities and the schools that that are there? Uh Bridgewwater State University, my district has a pilot training program. So can is there ways we can link because I see a a benefit uh all the way around to uh really expanding interest in these kind of uh you know relationships. I guess Mr.
▶ 3:00:05Secretary or General Alban probably would be the better two I guess for this. Uh so so congressman I I agree getting access we we develop and operate some of the most complex systems uh and innovating faster than adversary is just critical for us to maintain our lethality edge. Uh access to the technical um skills within the US not just industry but at at at in at at universities is is important.
▶ 3:00:32Uh one of the things interestingly just yesterday I had a conversation about how we might uh make it easier for to get access to that to some of that technical skills. You know some sometimes it takes a while for us to set up agreements with universities. Is there a way we can standardize that? The Navy for instance has a grant. Yeah. Maybe we can make it a little bit easier for us to get access and more flexible for us to get access to that that talent. Um so so I think it's important and that that's something that that that I will continue. Yeah. I think it's not just research. It's a pipeline to recruitment. Oh, sure.
▶ 3:01:02Once once you get access and trained recruitment, too. They're already trained. Yeah. One one of the one of the best ways to to to to maintain and and get people to stay uh in the service is keep them interested. And one one of the ways to get them into the service is to get them interested through university programs like that. Well, thank you. I I I I just have a little over a minute left and uh I just wanted to just touch on one issue. We've done a lot of discussions about morale from the bottom up.
▶ 3:01:30Can you discuss I I have some concerns from morale from the top down uh uh in our on our branches. How important is is it to have that strong morale at the top of the uh chain of I think it's critical across the board uh to ensure that you know and and of course by the time uh you hang around as long as Salty and I have uh you know you've got that commitment uh and you got you know what the purpose is but it's very important to keep the morale
▶ 3:02:00great amongst yeah I'm worried because you know and I understand there's discretion uh and it can be but the in in the short period of this administration there's uh there's 40 generals somewhere along that lines fourstar ranking above and 10% of them have been removed. Uh, and that's the discretion of the administration. But I'm worried.
▶ 3:02:20And you know, when I look at someone that I've had great admiration for by being on this committee, General Timothy Hawk, uh, I mean, few people uh, in our military have the expertise that that he had. I mean, he's he's got the cyber expertise unmatched, I think, among uh, many, and the technical intel that goes with that. He had he was extraordinary resource and and he was removed without cause even though he served four presidents.
▶ 3:02:50He was removed without cause and the rumors were or the reports were the only reason was a conspiracy theorist for 9/11 Laura Loomer. So I am worried if this continues for morale from the top down and I yield back. Gentleman yields back chair and I recognize a gentleman from Georgia Mr. Scott. Thank thank you Mr. Chairman.
▶ 3:03:08Uh, Secretary Mink, uh, the Robins Air Force Base, uh, Robins Air Logistics Complex is a crit critical logistics depo, maintenance, uh, part of the of the United States Air Force. Uh, I'd love for you to come down and visit Robins and accompany you there, as well as Moody, where we look forward to accepting the F-35. Uh, can you confirm that the US Air Force is still committed to three depot strategy?
▶ 3:03:38Uh yes, Congressman, I can confirm that and uh looking forward to coming for a visit and Robin's critical infrastructure. Yes, sir. Um as the Air Force uh as other branches continue to divest um old older equipment, non-survival equipment. Uh I want to speak specifically to ISR. So we're getting rid of a lot of the theater theatorn airborne ISR.
▶ 3:04:04uh how are you going to handle the demand for uh the ISR services that the combatant commanders uh need? Um how are we going to task that with the draw downs? Hey, Congressman, that's always you ask any combatant commander, they're always looking for more theater ISR. And they say ISR when you think about it, intelligence is an outcome. SNR, you know, surveillance and reconnaissance is a mission.
▶ 3:04:33They really want that situational awareness to help them make decisions. That's what it is in historically it's come through platforms. And so that's what they say, I need the theater ISR. They really need some of those decision support mechanisms. And so as we move from some of that that's been uh manned to some of that that's been unmanned. Some of that's been an airborne layer. Now some of that's going to go to space. Some of it has been evolving with open source intelligence fusion. So I think we need to be creative about understanding what is the capability you need rather than the platform you need.
▶ 3:05:01And as they do desire the platforms in any one domain or another, then we're going to have to manage those scarce resources as we evolve to those things that we've used in the past because we've had more permissive environments to those things that will be survivable in the most contested environment. I I agree with you on that.
▶ 3:05:16I I would also tell you though that we have the western hemisphere, we have uh large areas of Africa that we that we do have systems that that are capable of operating in those areas and we're drawing down those systems uh in in the belief that we're going to have other systems and and I just I do worry that we draw down faster than we put up and uh when it comes to carrying out the mission uh we're collecting a tremendous amount of data in the new platform.
▶ 3:05:46forms that data has to be processed and turned in information to carry out the the mission on the ground. And so so there are a lot of steps there and we have to get every one of them right because any missing link you know causes a problem for you know the troops that are that are carrying out the mission on the ground. Um one one last question uh the training ranges uh this was brought up during the confirmation hearing of uh General Kaine.
▶ 3:06:15He highlighted how the the training ranges are inadequate to prepare uh both air and space forces for our modern adversaries. Uh how do you intend to better incorporate lowcost uh electronic warfare targets and decoys to better replicate nearpeer adversaries? Thank you, Congressman. And I can let uh General Salsman speak to the space side.
▶ 3:06:40But on the air side, obviously the Nevada Test and Training Range and J Park out up in Alaska and in the Pacific are the primary ones that we want to ensure we're pay for the high-end threat. To the extent that we can bring up the other ranges, we will do so. But you made the right point which these these threat emitters are the ones that can replicate better than they have been able to do in the past to get better training on those ranges. Those low and midcost thread emitters are the key.
▶ 3:07:06And as we do that, we also need to to to look into the the procurement of those emitters just like we're doing everything else. Think about open systems modular architecture that allows us to take new technologies as a new uh characterization of threats changes that we need to be able to adapt so the so the emitters that we have today aren't obsolete tomorrow. So those are the answer. You you hit the answer. Getting getting more of those emitters, putting them on the ranges and being able to exercise them is going to be the key going forward. And that's that's our that's our path.
▶ 3:07:36General Salsman briefly I would just add to that that we're investing heavily in digital uh ranges to make sure that that the operators have the threat replication to practice their tactics but we're also looking at on orbit capabilities both for live test as well as training to make sure we get live data to to better build the models that go into our digital ranges. Gentlemen, thank you. Gentleman yields back. Chair recognize a gentleman from California, Mr. Carvajal. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 3:08:03chair and thank you to all the witnesses for being here today and your service. General Saltzman, as you know, the increased launch cadence at Vandenberg, which is in my district, has caused noise disturbance um as the cadence of launches has increased. The number of constituent complaints have grown. Uh space is critical to our national security, and I'm one of the biggest supporters in Congress.
▶ 3:08:33But we need to get buy in from the surrounding bases. The leadership at Vanderbrook has been extremely helpful, I must say, and working with me and my team to find solutions like changing launch windows and trajectories when possible to minimize sonic boom impacts to area residents.
▶ 3:08:55So, I wanted to thank you for General Saltzman, do you think additional studies on sonic booms from launch would help us better understand how to minimize their impact on nearby Well, thank you for your support, Congressman. It's good to see you. I you know, I I think absolutely having data that we can assess based on the new environmental conditions with the launch tempo, the the fog alone uh changes the acoustics out there on the point as you know.
▶ 3:09:24So uh collecting that data which we are actively doing and then building modeling and simulation software to ingest that data and help us determine exactly how we might be able to best mitigate those circumstances is what we're pursuing. But we're doing that handin glove with uh community outreach because we want to make sure we understand precisely what the issues are and where those issues are being seen as part of the data collection and we want to be as transparent as we can with the local community because they're so important to us. Thank you.
▶ 3:09:51I also appreciate you putting sound monitors throughout uh the central coast to make sure that we get it as best and as right as possible in mitigating the noise. So, thank you again. So far through NSSL only SpaceX is certified to launch out of both the eastern and western ranges. ULA has had to give up two of its previously won launches out of Vandenberg because it lacks certification on the West Coast.
▶ 3:10:22Blue Origin can't even compete for launches from Vandenberg because they don't yet have a West Coast launchpad. If NSSL launches out of the Western Range can only be provided by one company, then we don't really have competition, do we? The space force can create an environment for competition, but we still need providers to compete seriously.
▶ 3:10:48General Saltzman, will you say it is a national security risk to only have one NSSL provider certified to launch out of the western range? And what can the Space Force do to ensure we have all our lane 2 launch providers operational on both coasts? assured access to space requires that kind of resiliency.
▶ 3:11:13That's that's industrialbased resiliency as well as geographic resiliency and different rocket systems so that a problem in one doesn't create an assured access problem for us. So I agree with you. Uh we are working quickly and there is a pathway to getting ULA certification on the western range. Uh, and I just was out there and I listened to the leadership team talk about their long-term infrastructure plan to add additional launch complex capabilities uh to to allow for other entrance to have the launch complexes they need as well.
▶ 3:11:41So long-term plan uh those aren't those aren't quick, but we do have a plan in place to do that. Thank you. Well, the quicker the better. General Saltzman, are there plans to make uh TAC SRT a program of record? If not, why?
▶ 3:11:59because it's uh heavily reliant on commercial services and so I I don't want to take it on as a program of record where it's organically done by us because I think we would miss out on the innovation we get through the commercial imagery providers and so TAC SRT the benefit of it is that we only pay for what we need when we need it and we allow the the commercial industry to innovate as quickly as possible. I just need the money to to bolster the marketplace so there's a continued demand signal for that commercial imagery.
▶ 3:12:29Thank you. And my last question may not get to an answer, but um General Salsman, can you speak to the Space Force's commitment to the attack RS initiative, particularly how it plans to continue support responsive space maneuvering for orbital warfare and space surveillance? Yes, sir. tactically responsive space isn't a key element of what we're trying to do and we're committed to getting it better and more robust as we go forward. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Thank the gentleman from California.
▶ 3:12:58I recognize a gentleman from Indiana, Mr. Msmer. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you witness witnesses for being here today. Uh General Saltzman, during an interview earlier this year, you stated that the Golden Dome would need a layered approach with Space Force playing a central role in this new initiative. How significant is a contribution uh of space force have from a spaceb space interceptor and space-based radar uh perspective?
▶ 3:13:22Yes, congressman, we are central to that effort because there's going to be a sensor network that has to be space enabled that will have to move the data quickly which will have a a space component to it as well. And then as as mentioned in the executive order that space-based interceptors uh is technology that we're pursuing, but it'll be a system of systems that's going to be more than just the space force to try to stitch together. Right. Which leads to my next question. Have there been preliminary conversations on how the Space Force will contribute and integrate with other other service Absolutely.
▶ 3:13:52It's it's absolutely essential that we do. Okay. Uh Secretary Mink and General Alvin, can you also comment on the Air Force contributions to the Golden Dome for American Yeah, Congressman, again, as that as that plays out, we we do believe that there's the air layer in there. So, there's a sense of domain awareness that we have to do.
▶ 3:14:10We need to understand how we can support and integrate with the sensing and the capabilities that are coming from space to be able to to either you work with through uh C3 battle management integrate that command and control with it or be able to do the uh defensive interception of of hypersonic and cruise missiles coming through the air domain and air layer but they come through multi-dommain as General Solzman messes we all look at this multi- domain. So my part United States Air Force is to ensure that we have those capabilities to integrate overall in the in the golden dome. Okay, thank you.
▶ 3:14:40Which kind of leads to my next question, General Alden, uh during the Senate Armed Services Committee a few weeks ago, you you stated that air and missile threats are evolving from a both both a speed and and sophistication standpoint, hypersonics being one of the more uh significant significant new threats. How has the Air Force prepared for rapid innovation by Russia and China in their hypersonic programs? Yeah, so defending against hypersonics and then there's creating our own hypersonics. I think you're alluding to the defense against hypersonics.
▶ 3:15:09This becomes more and more challenging and we find that it's one of those it's not just uh an air force only problem. It is a joint force problem. Anytime you have fixed defenses or things that could be the uh the target of those sort of hypersonics capabilities uh ballistic or cruise missiles, this is a this is a overall joint force challenge. And so we are looking at anything from the you know the kinetic aectors to directed energy to the non-kinetic understanding that these are threats we need to we need to have a layered approach to. the further out you can get after them, uh, the better.
▶ 3:15:38And if you can actually get after them to where as they're they're seeking their target, so through their long range kill chain, you can interrupt that, we're looking at that as well. So, we're trying to make sure that we aren't just fighting them from a point defense area. We're trying to fight them from as far away as possible, further left of boom as possible. Right. There you go. Um, and and does that that obviously involves uh combining ground and and satellite sensor systems? Absolutely. Multi-dommain as General Saltzman said many times. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 3:16:05Uh, Secretary Mink, the Air Force's ability to project power through global strike and rapid mobility is critical. How's the Air Force integrating directed energy systems into its airlift and air aerial refueling programs to protect these assets from drone threats during conflicts? I I believe what I can say at this level at this level is that that we are looking at directed energy across the spectrum for both protection and defense and offense. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 3:16:34Um, Secretary Mink, when President Trump recently spoke at Michigan's Sulur Air National Guard base, he stated that the United States Air Force will likely invest in guard in the guard to uh reinstate fighter wings in my district in the 8th district of Indiana, the 181st Fighter Wing, transition to the in 2008 to the 181st Intelligence Wing. Bringing fighter capability back to Indiana is a priority of me and my district.
▶ 3:17:00Uh what can Congress do to assist the air force in expediting the process of re-implementing fighter capabilities to former fighter wings? Let me take a start at it and then hand over to General Alvin for additional comments. So they yeah the the the biggest thing is is is support us in the production of the aircraft as we um both grow all the way across from FNX's to the 35s uh F47 going forward.
▶ 3:17:27uh the more airplanes we have, which is what we need, the the more opportunity there is. General Alvin, another comments. Absolutely. It's about the funding and quite frankly, when we're looking at the overall capabilities, we sort of do need to squint into the future and long range and say the the capacity as far as physical assets in the Air Force is going to be different in the future from what it is right now. So, just trying to to regurgitate to make sure we have capabilities at the same number of installations that we have before, I think is something we're going to need to be very careful about.
▶ 3:17:55so proud of what Indiana has done in the transition to that wing. I think it's very important. So, it's an overall force structure where cyber and intel are are gaining an importance. I we want to make sure we just don't recreate what we had before. Gentleman's time's expired. Chair and I recognize gentleman from Missouri, Mr. Bale. Uh, first I want to express my disappointment with the chair for recognizing North Carolina barbecue and not St. Louis and even Kansas City.
▶ 3:18:22Um, General Salsman, General Alvin, thank you for being here today and for your continued service to our nation. I also want to join my colleagues in congratulating you, Mr. Secretary, on your recent confirmation to the role. Um, and also want to recognize the service members uh sitting behind you. Uh, thank you for your service as well. Um, I'm proud to represent St. Louis, a region that plays a critical role in our national security.
▶ 3:18:53Every day, my constituents contribute to vital missions from intelligence work at the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency to sustaining global mobility at Scott Air Force Base just across the river to advancing the capabilities of our war fighters through aerospace innovation and manufacturing. St. Louis is home to the production of some of the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world, including the F-15 EX.
▶ 3:19:22Our region also plays a central role in the development of the Air Force's sixth generation fighter jet. However, while these contributions are vital, we must also recognize that the same people building our national defense are facing severe challenges at home. Many are still recovering from the worst natural disaster to hit our region since the late 1950s.
▶ 3:19:48My constituents are dedicated Americans helping to defend our country, not only in uniform, but through their work on our defense industrial base who now need our support. We cannot overlook their needs, nor can we afford to weaken the very industrial base they sustain. That brings me to another crucial concern. The Air Force has contracted for 98 F-15 EXS.
▶ 3:20:17EX aircraft with final delivery expected by 2029. I'm concerned that without continued procurement beyond that point, we risk not only losing critical workforce capacity in places like St. Louis, but also jeopardizing the strategic resilience of our tactical air aircraft industrial base.
▶ 3:20:40Uh, General Alvin and Secretary Mink, uh, do you agree that maintaining a degree of redundancy in the nation's tactical fighter manufacturing capability is is a imperative? Uh, thank you for that, Congressman. I do and uh, the F-15EX, it's it's so far it's proving itself out very well. We will see going in the FY26 budget and and beyond uh, what the possibilities for the future are.
▶ 3:21:06But we are seeing that it is it is uh putting more weapons on rails and being able to do that in is very relevant way in the Indo Pacific. Secretary did you want to agree u and and you know we have multiple locked Boeing there are two primary uh 16s are still F-16s are still being built in the US. So we actually have three contractors are building fighters in the US.
▶ 3:21:28I think it's important to maintain that that level of uh uh redundancy for competition in the future as as well as just you know resilience. And then given the evolving and unpredictable threat environment our war fighters are now facing what is the rationale behind not maintaining two active tactical fighter production lines until the next generation act aircraft is fully operational. General, I think we are.
▶ 3:21:57Yeah, if your question is why aren't we having more fighter lines, it's it's a matter of uh resources. I mean, we would take all the resource and those are prioritizations against you. We want to make sure also they're competing with munitions, also with the refueling capability, also with the infrastructure. And so, it really is just a matter of trying to build the whole force to the level that we think the nation needs and not having a a misshapen force that has too much of one thing that can't be used because we don't have everything else.
▶ 3:22:26And the F15EX that just achieved initial operating operational capability last year is an even more capable aircraft building on the payload range and speed of the F-15 with the addition of next generation capabilities for enhanced lethality and survivability.
▶ 3:22:43Can you talk about the importance quickly of the F-15 EX to the Air Force's fighter Adding that in, it's starting to prove its worth uh not only in our exercises but in our larger scale exercises and seeing it uh performing in the Indo Pacific. It provides more weapons on rails and more range and more relevance and survivability in the Indo Pacific. Okay.
▶ 3:23:04And I'll yield my remaining seconds back to the chair if he wants to respond to the allegations that we're going to resolve this probably denied to the NDAA. We'll have to have a little competition. uh will engage with that. I will recognize a gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Crank. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Colorado has nothing to offer in regards to barbecue.
▶ 3:23:28By the way, uh Secretary Mink, I hope you'll agree with me that the number one priority of the federal government is our national security and that the first question our military leaders must consider when making major decisions is how it could affect defense on the homeland.
▶ 3:23:45With that in mind and cognizant of the growing spacebased threat from China and from Russia, to your knowledge, has the location of US Space Command headquarters at Peterson Space Force Base caused the Air Force to need to withhold or suboptimize any support to the command in any way that is undermined readiness? uh and I'll ask for a little help from General Saltzman here as well.
▶ 3:24:12But with respect to the current space command uh location, we've been supporting them uh to the full level uh required for them to get to FOC as you're aware. I'm sure there's restrictions with respect to Milcom. Um but we are supporting them uh uh for readiness at this point. Yes, Congressman, we we have not seen any drops in readiness as a result of the location. Okay. Um, as you know, may know, Mr.
▶ 3:24:41Secretary, section 2889 of the fiscal year 2024 NDAA blocked the Department of Defense from constructing a new headquarters for Space Command at Peterson Space Force Base until the DoD, IG, and the GAO released their reports on the 2023 basing decision led by the Secretary of the Air Force that found Colorado Springs to be the best home for Space Command.
▶ 3:25:05The DoDIG report has been released revealing the alarming loss of capability and personnel that would result if Space Command was moved from Peterson. And the JO report finally came out last week highlighting the unique benefits to the command that the close proximity to Northern Command allows.
▶ 3:25:23The GAO report also says that Space Command is struggling to meet its staffing needs due to uncertainty regarding the command's final location and this is delaying the command's ability to build long-term institutional knowledge. The result is clear. The most effective home for Space Command is Peterson Space Force Base in Colorado Springs. And it's essential the issue is put to rest once and for all so space command and the men and women who work there can put their full focus on one goal, defending the nation.
▶ 3:25:54Secretary Mink, now that the conditions of section 2889 have been satisfied, is it your understanding that the planned and the planning and design of a permanent headquarters building for Space Command at Peterson will resume immediately? So, Mr. Congressman, the uh we are in the process of reviewing the report, the final report out of the GAO. Uh I would defer uh questions on the final decision for location of space command to White House affairs. Okay.
▶ 3:26:24Thank you. Uh General Saltzman, any comments? Nothing to add. Thank you. Okay. Thank Um, very quickly, in the FY2025 NDAA, Congress required the Department of the Air Force to submit a report to Congress on how it intends to better coordinate emerging space activities such as spacecraft re-entry recoveries at DoD test ranges with other federal agencies like the FAA.
▶ 3:26:52The report was originally due on January 31st of this year. The Air Force then delayed delivery of the report to March 31st, then to May 31st, and then last week it was delayed again to August 31st. Meanwhile, US commercial re-entry operators uh are seeking out and currently utilizing re-entry landing sites in other countries such as Australia. I know this all took place before you were sworn in, Mr.
▶ 3:27:18Secretary, but it's frustrating that we'll not have this report until after the committee drafts and marks up this year's NDAA. Mr. Secretary, I'd like to respectfully ask for your commitment that this report will be delivered to the committee no later than August 31st and that it will contain a description of the factors leading to its delay. I'd also appreciate a a briefing on the report as soon as possible. Yeah, I'll commit to getting giving getting that to you as soon as possible.
▶ 3:27:46Uh, I have to go back and check on the status and I'll let you know one way or another. Thank you, Mr. Secretary. Thank you for your service and congratulations on your confirmation. Yes, I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair and I recognize a gentle lady from Hawaii, Miss Tuda. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Secretary, in 2004, the Air Force completed a full environmental impact statement for the closure of Johnson Atoll following decades of nuclear testing and chemical weapons storage.
▶ 3:28:13That exit process took years and involved extensive inter agency and stakeholder coordination. Now, as the Air Force moves to reactivate the site for the rocket cargo vanguard program, we're seeing far less rigor. An environmental assessment promised for public comment is now delayed until the fall. And from from what we're hearing back home, the process feels very rushed, risky, and dismissive of ecological and community concerns, especially given that Johnston is a national wildlife refuge.
▶ 3:28:42Coming from Hawaii, I fully recognize the strategic importance of this project to advancing forward logistics and sustainment in the Indo-acific. But that being said, if a full EIS was necessary just to close the site, why isn't one being done now to reopen it, especially given the ecological sensitivity, the long-term risks, and the growing public concern around Johnston?
▶ 3:29:04Uh, Congresswoman, um, we we continue to value safety not only for our the people in the military, but the communities. Uh, I'm not that familiar with that particular issue, but I will make sure I go check on it and get back to you on why we're not doing additional activities. I know General or General Alman, if you have any Well, I can definitely tell you that there's concern that at least an EIS is not being done and the EA is delayed.
▶ 3:29:29Um I I would also suggest then um as you further review this um given SpaceX role in this project um we would love the Air Force in fact we would like the Air Force to factor in the company's environmental track record particularly incidences like those at Bokhica where wastewater discharge violations were confirmed by the EPA uh when evaluating the environmental risks in this assessment.
▶ 3:29:55Um, do you are you familiar with the fact that SpaceX is involved in this project and they've had past environmental um, issues and concerns in other areas where they're stationed? I'm aware that I'm aware of the operations of SpaceX um, in in that area in in the past. I am not fully aware of the environmental uh, impacts. Um, but I I will I will take it for the record. Okay.
▶ 3:30:17again um in looking at this environmental assessment and perhaps why a full EIS should be required um considering the partners involved have been in violation of uh various discharge um you know regulations. I would suggest that I raised this though uh issue as part of a larger conversation unfolding across Hawaii. As you know, we're in the middle of land lease renewal negotiations at heava the 2029 deadline.
▶ 3:30:41And just recently, the Hawaii Board of Land and Natural Resources rejected the Army's EIS for Hakaloa training area and will soon consider Army training lands on Aahu. In Hawaii, environmental stewardship matters, respect for our natural resources, the waters that surround us, the ecosystems that connect us, and how the military across all branches handles sensitivity um towards environmental and cultural issues shapes how our community views your presence and your partnerships, especially in the Pacific where our lands and waters
▶ 3:31:12are all seen as uh connected and one. All of this matter. So while the army may be at the center of those land lease debates today, the air force actions on Johnston Atoll which native Hawaiians call Kalama are part of that same equation as to how this will proceed successfully or unsuccessfully going towards 2029. And I think we all want to find a sustainable path forward but one that respects, recognizes and embraces and protects our host culture, our natural resources and our ecosystems.
▶ 3:31:41So I look forward to your response to that when you are prepared. Um wanted to move now to Noah and the uh our capacity given that we are currently and officially in hurricane season. Uh Noah is forecasting a 60% higher chance above normal year for um experiencing a hurricane. This is especially high stakes for Hawaii and other coastal communities.
▶ 3:32:03The Air Force and Noah have a vital partnership through Hurricane Hunter flights, which collects life-saving data to support storm forecasting, evacuation planning, disaster response. But a recent GAO report found that both agencies are struggling to meet growing demand due to aircraft maintenance issues, staffing shortage, and poor coordination. It's now further compounded by the fact that there was a decision to slash Noah's budget, lay off two of its eight flight directors, engineer and an engineer reducing its mission capacity by over 25%.
▶ 3:32:33Did these reductions concern you? And what steps is the Air Force taking to respond to the GAO's findings and ensure both the continued accuracy of our storm forecast and the strength of our partnership with Noah? I I certainly can't speak to the impact uh with respect to Noah, but I can tell you that our performance uh from the hurricane hunters and all those who gear up every year for this is uh they are they are preparing and certainly looking to put their best foot forward in whatever you know, mother nature brings.
▶ 3:33:02But I don't have a sense really of how the impact. Are you aware of the go report? I have not read it, but I'm okay. If you could please, I've ran out of time. If you could look at the report and respond how you will be addressing those shortages in addition to Noah's 25 plus% cuts. Gentle ladies, time's expired. Chair not recogniz gentleman from Arizona, Mr. Amade. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Now, I have the honor of representing Arizona's 8th congressional district.
▶ 3:33:25I am the only member of our delegation on the House Armed Services Committee, and right next to my district is Luke Air Force Base, home to the world's largest fighter ring. Elsewhere in the state, we have Davis Monthan Air Force Base, a KC135 refueler wing in Phoenix in the Barry Goldwater range. Now, the Air Force is of huge importance to Arizona, but my first question is to you, General Alvin. Uh, it was good to have that phone call with you earlier this year, and I know you have deep roots in Arizona and Pinetop.
▶ 3:33:52And, uh, it's, you know, pretty rare to meet somebody from Pinetop, Arizona. And, uh, but General, I'm concerned about, um, what I've heard. Well, I'll agree that we have too many flag officers and too much blow. I received confirmation recently that Luke Air Force base is being downgraded. Have you heard of that? Yeah, we're certainly considering that in the context of the geo reduction and the the reorganization for our Air Force. Yeah. So, has any decision been made yet? It hasn't become final, but it it's certainly in our planning horizon. Okay.
▶ 3:34:21I mean, I just have concerns with it because Luke Air Force Base trains 75% of the world's F-35 pilots and I know uh image and stature matter with our foreign partners uh quite substantially and it's important to keep a unified command behind a one-star general at Luke Air Force Base. Uh but if you have an assessment, can you send that over to us for the ramifications of Luke Air Force Base for the downgrade, potential downgrade? Sure, we can put an assessment together for you. I think to your point about the value of Luke Air Force Base, that that is undeniable.
▶ 3:34:49But I think more so than stature, our foreign partners look forward to look at the quality and the quality is there and the instructor pilots and all of that. I'm not sure that uh a general officer versus a colonel leading that is as important as a quality of training that when you're trained by the best in the world, that's how you aspire to be the best in the world. So, we're never going to let that uh slip at all because that is what the real value of Luke Air Force Base is in in the instruction at the of course, but it's also being led by a one-star general this whole time.
▶ 3:35:15So, I just worry that a downgrade I don't want to see it affect our training mission over there. Um but hopefully we can arrange a meeting with you and the secretary with the Arizona delegation to talk about this further as well. And um I have another question I believe for you, General Alvin. You know, as you know, Arizona is home to the massive Barry Goldwater range and uh used by the Marines and the Air Force and our Fort Wuka as the Army's premier test bed for unmanned systems.
▶ 3:35:40And now, no single post, base or range can enable the testing across the expanse of kill chains. Yet, we can link these different domains together to simulate island chain warfare even within the American So, how do we better connect all the airspace, land area, and signal spectrum owned by different branches and think bigger and broader about joint capabilities rather than just within the service silos? It's a great point, Congressman. It's about collaboration, coordination. We're getting there. We are doing that.
▶ 3:36:07We're seeing that, of course, as you know, the ranges were uh because of Arizona's unique sort of topography and geography. Those were great things for each service, but right now to your point, we can stitch them together and we can replicate something that really can't be replicated in many other areas of our United States and that is sort of a long-range killchain scenario. So, we are working with the FAA and we're coming to the sort of the final throws of a negotiation to be able to do that on a more periodic basis and sort of more routinize it. But right now, we have been stitching them together to do these in exercises like Bamboo Eagle.
▶ 3:36:37It's a it's a unique opportunity and a place so close to the West Coast that uh we are continuing to work with the FAA to make sure that's something we do more often, but it's just coordination and collaboration amongst all services. We can all see value in it. Very good. And uh congratulations, Mr. Secretary, for your recent confirmation. And with that, I yield back. Gentlemen yields back. Chair and I recognize gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Benman. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you to the witnesses for coming today. General Salsman, General Alvin, great to see you again. And Mr.
▶ 3:37:06Secretary, congratulations on your confirmation. Um, I have three military installations in my district about 25 miles from where we sit right now. Um, Dalgrren is a Navy base, but it houses the 19th Delta, and I was privileged to go down there and and observe the the unique and critical um, skills and and frankly the integral role they play in national defense. And so, uh, I just want to mention that that they're um, I was truly impressed by the work they do there.
▶ 3:37:34I want to turn my attention to operation spiderweb which revealed how adversary military or terrorists could coordinate mass drone swarms, electronic jamming and longrange precision strikes to paralyze US strategic bombers, power projection capabilities before even a single shot is fired. It's really, if you think about it, a poor man's air force. Uh, in fact, if it these drones exhibit the same characteristics and advantages as as an air component does.
▶ 3:38:00So, uh, Secretary, uh, Mike, General Alvin, General Salsman, I'm going to open this to all three of you. What specific investments or shifts in doctrine are the Air Force and Space Force making to detect, disrupt, and survive this kind of integrated domain attack. I I'll start and then and then uh have General. Um, we talked a little about before. I think you need to both look at the offensive and the defensive side of this equation.
▶ 3:38:28Um and and the Ukraine attack demonstrated both, right? It demonstrated what you can do with a a pretty innovative approach to utilizing UAVs uh at scale u but also the challenges if you don't defend against it. Right? So both of them are of interest to the department of the air force and we are investing on both sides. Um as we discussed before, you know, there's a there is more than just the technical aspect of building systems to defend against UAS's.
▶ 3:38:57is there is there it's really a whole government requirement. It's almost easier to defend some of our bases overseas than they are in the US just because some of the restrictions uh and the air traffic that surrounds our bases and how careful we have to be. So you have to really look at both the technology side on the defense on the technology side and then then on the the whole government approach to getting the proper authorities so that you can operate and actually protect your bases against something like that. Um on the offensive side of the house we are looking closely at that as well.
▶ 3:39:24If I can leave it that and let the generals also u pop in here. Yeah, I I associate with what the secretary said and of course as we've had conversations all through it out this hearing about this. Uh this is an area where we we're taking note. Uh I I would maybe adjust the characterization of a poor man's air force. It does do some things to the air domain to be able to do it at scale to be able to do across all geographies to be able to do in different areas of contestation is a little bit different. But the wakeup call is we we've already been awoken awakened to this.
▶ 3:39:54But it is showing that maybe our highv value assets there's different ways we need to we need to look at defending those. These are not just air force issues. These are joint issues as well. And that's what makes it a poor man's air force versus the air force that we real air force. Right. Um General Salsman, anything to add on that? Well, just real quickly, um it's the asymmetric attack that was most disturbing, I think. And one of the ways I'm thinking about that is uh as we put together a network of networks uh that increases the surface area for attack.
▶ 3:40:21And so we have to make sure that from a cyber perspective we're looking at the vulnerabilities where the shortfalls are where somebody might have inroads into our systems. You don't have to attack space capabilities on orbit. You can attack it in the networks. And so we're looking at cyber mission defense as a key attribute. Thank you for that.
▶ 3:40:37So what I'm concerned about is that I mean I don't think we have really good deterrence uh against these types of threats uh both from uh terrorists or from nation states because we're not going to if we have um our bases attacked and we lose billions and billions of dollars in strategic assets. We're not going to drop WMDs or anything like that. We're gonna have to uh respond conventionally and um if they have these capabilities that and we've already been degraded.
▶ 3:41:06I just feel like uh we're in danger of losing deterrence in this regard and especially if we think about the fact that they're killing the the archer, not the arrow. That is a critical approach. And Mr. Chairman, if I may, um given the nature of this threat and how far behind we are, I'd suggest we go as far as creating a select committee uh to address the revolution in drone warfare both in the offense and defense. We know the regulatory issues associated here. There statutory issues.
▶ 3:41:33there multiple committees um in the house that um this has uh you know overlapping jurisdiction and industrial barriers and and the cost if we fail in this regard are just too too large to imagine I think u 8 seconds does golden dome do anything to protect us against this threat yes or no I'd say it's too early in the mission analysis to determine Gentleman's
▶ 3:42:04time's expired. Chair not recognizes a gentleman from Michigan, General Bergman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and u welcome to the fight, Mr. Secretary. Uh General Albvin, nice to hear you use the phrase warrior ethos. Warriors don't leave warriors behind, no matter whether it's in basic training, in the fight in housing. And General Salsman, great to see you. I got good news and bad news. So, let's start with the bad news.
▶ 3:42:31Um um the air force is I believe way behind in fulfilling its obligation at Wartsmith Air Force Base in Oscot, Michigan. Subject is PAS. There's been a lot of promises made over the years and despite years of testing and monitoring the POS levels in the groundwater uh you know like Vanetton Lake which is right uh next to it still sits at literally tens of thousands of times above the EPA and Michigan safety standards.
▶ 3:43:02So given the persistent uh and severe PAS combination too many syllables for a marine u we're behind the air force is behind. I know you're coming into this but there's been promises made but promises not kept over too long a time.
▶ 3:43:23We've done all the testing necessary, but the delay that the interim cleanup would be uh in the interim cleanup to address most of these the the PAS plumes uh has not occurred. The remedial actions have been delayed for years and uh now are not expected to begin until late in 2028 or potentially 2029. So, this really is a breach of trust with the local residents up there and uh because they're concerned about that.
▶ 3:43:52Now, It's a combination, but but we've been dealing with this for well, let's put it this way, too long a time. We're talking decades now. So, I'm I'm going to I'm not going to ask you how the Air Force is justified in doing the de the delays.
▶ 3:44:09I'm asking you to to dig into it as the new secretary and make this right for the folks up there because we know POS is is not going to go away uh on its own and there has to be mitigated cleanup and I I sound like I'm giving a lecture now, but I just wanted to inform you of this because we're we're leaving some warriors behind and their families with the PAS piece. Um now let's turn to something a little positive.
▶ 3:44:36Uh, Selfridge Air National Guard base is now slated to get F-15E exs. In fact, I did literally a personal drive tour at the base a couple of days ago because I still have my retired military ID and I can just go on the base and they didn't even know I was there, which is great because then nobody was trying to show me what they wanted me to see and not what I wanted to see.
▶ 3:44:58The point is Selfridge is a base that given its proximity to the Great Lakes and the training ranges that we have, the capabilities that are there right now currently, the A-10s that are being phased out. By the way, there was a flight of two taken off when I pulled in and they were landing as I left. So, it was it was really kind of interesting that uh you know the powers that be gave me a free air show there, the A-10s as they leave.
▶ 3:45:24But the challenge is the okay the EXs are coming the A-10s are leaving. We don't want to accidentally create a gap where the the people who do the maintenance and all the technical capabilities that we we don't lose readiness because of that. So I again I'm I'm really not asking you for answers now.
▶ 3:45:50I'm I'm asking you just for the the prioritized consideration of blending when the A-10s leave with when the EXs arrive so we don't accidentally create some personnel gaps, skill set gaps, whatever it happens to be. Okay. Um you all are in a different because space force is going to fight in space.
▶ 3:46:20The air force is going to fight you know in the in the sky. What you know what the air force does. The challenge we have as a committee is understanding how your vision of the fight is developing and how we appropriately fund you without um without some of the maneuvering that has gone on in the past. Okay? You be honest upfront.
▶ 3:46:50You're going to have a a pretty much a bipartisan effort here to support you. So, I'm just I'm glad you're here, but let's get rolling on the PIFA up there and and honor our commitment to those fine men and women up there and just consider how we avoid the personnel gap. So, with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair, I recognize gentleman from Louisiana, Mr. Higgins. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 3:47:16Gentlemen, you have you have displayed a impressive command of the issues and refreshingly uh candid and unscripted. So, thank you for that. Uh I have the opportunity.
▶ 3:47:34I'm a hardworking guy, but I believe I'm the only enlisted veteran of prior service, army, military, police corps on this body, which is why the chairman gives me the the the privilege of of uh questioning last on a regular basis.
▶ 3:47:52Um, I talked to I talked to my people and across my district and state and indeed the country and the American people are stakeholders in the decisions that we have to make regarding deployment of our assets and how how we spend our money. And the American people have been through a lot and and have been paying attention.
▶ 3:48:22Some things have happened. Recent phenomena of of the of the drone incursion on the east coast. This this was this was alarming to the American people. U observations of modern warfare and surprise attack in the in the Russian Ukraine war.
▶ 3:48:43I mean the the the people are observant of this the terrorist actions in our own shocking the what we went through in 2021 22 23 and 2024 regarding open borders at our southern border.
▶ 3:49:05This this this all together is has impacted the American citizenry and brought us to a point where there there's a clear understanding amongst the Americans I speak to that that our military must posture domestically to stage uh effectively to be able to to to patrol our borders and our maritime borders and to respond to threat.
▶ 3:49:32Which us to my question to you gentlemen uh Mr. Secretary and General Alvin regarding the uh the 159th Fighter Wing at Bell Chase in Louisiana. The National Guard there supports a 247 aerospace control alert mission with F-15C support.
▶ 3:49:55It just ensures our maritime southern border response in the Gulf of America and to to protect against threat. But I'm concerned that the Air Force is not fully focused on the utility that the F-15 EX that unique capability can bring to maintaining our southern border security which again America is calling for and our security against unknown and and
▶ 3:50:25alarming and surprise attack from the air and the sea. Um that I spoke with General Guillot of Northcom about having F-15 EXs at Belchase. He wants them. He wants F-15 EXS. So I ask you, Secretary and General Alvin, what are the plans for F-15 EXS for the 159th Fighter Wing in Louisiana? The the plans for that really haven't changed.
▶ 3:50:54We they're coming to Louisiana now as we have this new integration. The some of the fielding of it is how fast we can get Boeing to produce when we procured them. And then we're trying to find the right feathering of this in with the selfridge decision from the president to ensure that we don't have a gap anywhere. We want to ensure that until we switch to the F-15 EX, we make sure those C's are like the platinum F-15C's, but we are on we're on path uh to continue that as we have to make sure that the F-15Xs do come to Belchase.
▶ 3:51:21It was a beautiful answer and I I I stand at your avail sir to assist in that and I happen to have a pretty good relationship with the chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. I feel confident that he'll help as well. Mr. yeah, the chief hit it nail on the head there that the problem the challenge with F-15E is the same challenge we've had with the 35 and and and the B21.
▶ 3:51:48Now, it's getting the production rates to what we need to support what we're trying to do, right? They're just we it's very difficult to ramp up the production rates on these platform. So, we're just managing that crossboard. And there there's a there's certainly recognition in your office, sir, and amongst your senior staff that the American people were alarmed about some of the things we have suffered and observed. I I think we were all alarmed at it as well as with the American people for sure. Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Mr.
▶ 3:52:17Chairman, my time is expired. I yield. Gentleman yields back. Uh, I want to thank the witnesses. Good job. Thank you for what you do for our country. Thank you for being here today. And, uh, we are adjourned.