▶ 0:10:29The Committee on Homeland Security Subcommittee on Counterterrorism and Intelligence will come to order. Without objection, the subcommittee may recess at any point. The purpose of this hearing is to examine unfortunately the growing threat of anti-semitism within the United States, particularly as it relates to the circumstances surrounding the killing of is Israeli embassy staff in Washington DC, as well as assessing the current counterterrorism measures in addressing the threat of anti-semitic violence targeting
▶ 0:10:59Jewish Americans and foreign diplomats on US soil. I now recognize myself for an opening statement. I want to thank my colleagues. I want to thank our witnesses and all who have joined us for today's important hearing on a deeply troubling and persistent issue, one that strikes at the very core of our national values.
▶ 0:11:21We convene today in the shadow of a deeply unsettling trend, the continuing rise in anti-semitic attacks across the United This alarming pattern has been brought into sharp and painful focus by the recent incidents in Washington DC, older Colorado, and unfortunately many other events. Here in our nation's capital, just a few blocks away from where we sit right now.
▶ 0:11:47Two young and innocent lives were taken in a brutal attack at the Capitol Jewish Museum following an event for young Jewish professionals in Boulder, Colorado. Several individuals were severely injured in a horrific act of violence during a peaceful demonstration meant to highlight the plight of Israeli hostages still being held by Hamas.
▶ 0:12:09Most recently, anti-ICE riers in Los Angeles and in fact many other cities have attacked federal agents, torching streets, defacing property, and assaulting officers for enforcing the law. an attack on our very core of law and order that is related to the subject that we are talking about today. In Paramount, agents deployed tear gas and flashbangs to disperse violent mob.
▶ 0:12:34President Trump has responded decisively, sending National Guard troops to restore order and protect the public. Instead of standing with law enforcement to protect communities, Governor Nuomo dismissed the deployment, downplaying violence altogether. And this reckless refusal to acknowledge the severity of the crisis undermines public safety and sends a message that lawless lawlessness will be tolerated in certain places throughout our country.
▶ 0:13:01Last week, al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula released a video calling for attacks on US soil, specifically targeting government officials, specifically targeting members of Companies tied to the war in Gaza and Jewish institutions were also called for with violent attacks. The group's leader even cited recent attacks here in DC as examples to follow.
▶ 0:13:32This should be a chilling reminder. Anti-Semitic, might we say, anti-Jewish hate is not only rising, it's being weaponized by foreign terrorist organizations and inspiring violence right here in our homeland. These incidents are not isolated. They they reflect a broader and deeply troubling surge in anti-Semitic rhetoric and violence both online and in our neighborhoods.
▶ 0:14:02As the numbers continue to rise, fear has taken hold in many Jewish communities nationwide. For the fourth consecutive year, anti-semitic incidents have increased in all 50 states. This is not a localized problem. It's a national crisis. We cannot talk about national security without addressing the policies that are allowed that allowed this environment to take root.
▶ 0:14:29When President Trump took office in January, we quickly saw the truth. What we had been told for four years that our hands were tied by current laws was a lie. We didn't need more legislation. We needed leadership that was willing to secure the border and and enforce laws that were already in existence. And while this new leadership led to historic lows and illegal border crossings, the danger we now face comes not from those trying to get in, but from those that are already here.
▶ 0:14:59For four years, the Biden administration opened the floodgates, allowing millions to pour across our border unchecked. Among them are individuals who now exploit weak immigration enforcement and thrive in a system that refuses to apply existing laws in certain communities. laws that were meant to protect us from exactly this kind of hate and violence. Last year, right here on this committee, I confronted Secretary Alejandro Mayorcus about these very dangers.
▶ 0:15:30I warned about people already living among us, people who had been radicalized, emboldened, and driven to hate. And today, we are seeing this threat materialize right before our eyes. These heinous acts of hatred are not only attacks on individual lives. They are assaults on the very principles of religious freedom, safety, and security that form the foundation of our democracy. What's worse, this hatred is not confined to dark corners of the internet or lone extremist.
▶ 0:16:00It is now showing up in our institutions, in places that should be safe and inclusive. Our schools and our universities have become breeding grounds for anti-semitism. Jewish students are being harassed, intimidated, and in some cases physically attacked, often with little to no response from university leadership. This is a fact. This is happening. Literally dozens of people have reached out to my office, people that I don't know, that I have never met that have said that this is happening.
▶ 0:16:28And nothing has been done at some of these universities and institutions. This failure to act is not neutrality. It is complicity. Let me be absolutely clear that anyone who refuses to call out these hate-filled actors, who fails to condemn their vile actions loudly and unequivocally, is no longer a bystander. They are complicit. Silence and apathy in the face of anti-semitism is not neutrality.
▶ 0:17:00It is permission to continue to act that way, and it enables the hate to spread and the violence to escalate. We will no longer tolerate cowardice or indifference when Jewish lives are under threat. The Jewish community has long been a vibrant and integral part of the nation's fabric. Yet today, too many Jewish Americans are now living with an everpresent fear for their families, their institutions, and their future simply because of who they are and what they believe.
▶ 0:17:29This hearing is an opportunity to confront the threat head-on. It is a chance to hear directly from Jewish leaders, from law enforcement officials, and community experts on the front lines, and to ask ourselves and to determine what more Congress and our government can do to respond effectively and prevent this type of behavior from continuing to grow in this country.
▶ 0:17:53President Trump has issued a vital executive order to combat anti-semitism on college campuses and to protect Jewish students. Yet, despite these steps, widespread harassment of Jewish students at dozens of universities has Whether it means improving how we track and report hate crimes, investing in stronger security for atrisisk communities, or expanding education to dispel anti-semitic myths. One thing is clear. Action is not optional. It's imperative.
▶ 0:18:24Our purpose today is clear. to understand the root causes of this rise in anti-semitic violence, to hold accountable those who would perpetrate and enable it, and to strengthen our response to protect vulnerable communities. Communities that should not vulnerable or subjected to this kind of fear, threat of violence, and might I say terrorism. We must examine how we can all work together to confront hate and build resilience.
▶ 0:18:55This hearing is a call to action to reaffirm that hatred and bigotry have no place in America and to ensure that every citizen can live without fear of discrimination or violence. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses, from our experts and working together with colleagues on this committee to forge a path that promotes safety, justice, and unity.
▶ 0:19:18My hope today is that those that serve on this com this this committee, regardless of party affiliation, will boldly condemn the actions that have led to violence against the Jewish community.
▶ 0:19:36The actions that just a couple of short weeks ago took the lives of two young the actions that have threatened our communities in places like Boulder, One thing is going to be absolutely clear today. There is no room for anti-semitism in the United States of America. Not in Washington, not in Boulder, nowhere.
▶ 0:20:04And we will know today where this committee stands. This committee was formed in the wake of 911 as a result of the most horrific terrorist attack that our nation has suffered and we have to get a grip right now in this committee on what continues to drive those that would perpetrate this violence inside the United States.
▶ 0:20:28We have to understand and also recognize that there are people that were led into this country over the last four years that have a tie to radical groups like al-Qaeda, like ISIS, and that still affiliate with these groups and are prone to radicalization, and do want to do harm to many communities, including our Jewish community. I want to thank the witnesses for being with us this afternoon, this morning.
▶ 0:20:58And I yield back. And I will now yield to the ranking member, the gentleman from Rhode Island, Mr. Magazer, for his opening statement. And thank you to the chair for calling this important hearing, and I thank our witnesses for being here today.
▶ 0:21:13I want to begin by honoring the memories of Yaran Luchinsky and Sarah Mgram who were senselessly killed last month following the American Jewish Committee's annual young diplomats reception here in They were a young couple who had their whole lives ahead of them, including a planned engagement. And I know that every member of this subcommittee extends our deepest condolences to their families and friends.
▶ 0:21:39We also grieve for the victims of the horrific attack in Boulder, Colorado, who had Molotov cocktails thrown at them while walking in support of hostages held by Hamas. Both of these incidents were anti-Semitic terrorism, and we must clearly call them out for what they are. We must condemn them. The same is true in the arson attack on Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro's home a few weeks ago.
▶ 0:22:04According to the Anti-Defamation League, in 2024, there were nearly 10,000 reported anti-Semitic incidents across the United States, a 5% increase from 2023, and the highest number on record since the ADL began tracking anti-semitic incidents 46 years ago. Anti-semitism exists throughout our society. It can be found on the left, on the right, in the middle, and it must be called out everywhere.
▶ 0:22:32But while it is true that Jews in America face the threat of anti-Semitic violence throughout our country, it is also true that the Jewish people have friends and supporters throughout our country. In the year 1790, President George Washington visited the Turo Synagogue in my home state in Newport, Rhode Island, and prayed with the local Jewish congregation to demonstrate his wish that America would be a country welcoming of all faiths and specifically the Jewish faith.
▶ 0:23:02Now, this is personal for me as well as the son of a Jewish father and a Catholic mother. Uh, I have family who were driven out of their home countries due to anti-Semitic violence. I have experienced personally, as have other members of my family, anti-Semitic harassment here in the United States. It is a daily fact of life, unfortunately. And I am concerned about our government's ability to counter the rise of anti-semitic violence.
▶ 0:23:32I want to make sure that our government is doing everything that it can to stamp this out and to keep people safe. That is why I am concerned that President Trump has fired staff across the federal government who were tasked with investigating cases of violent anti-semitism and other forms of hate, including over a 100 employees at the DHS Office for Civil Rights and Civil Liberties, tasked with investigating and stamping out violent anti-semitism and other
▶ 0:24:02domestic violent extremism. some 250 attorneys, about 70% of the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division, and at least 240 staff at the Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights. Let's be clear, anti-semitism on college campuses is a real problem that must be dealt with.
▶ 0:24:23The way you deal with that is by strong oversight from the Department of Education, including the Office for Civil Rights, which has been gutted, not by cutting off funding for medical research. President Trump recently installed Thomas Fugate to serve as the director of DHS's Center for Prevention Programs and Partnerships.
▶ 0:24:45For those of you who don't know, this is the office that is tasked with partnering with local law enforcement, nonprofit organizations, churches, synagogues, private sector organizations to prevent hate driven violence. Mr. Fugate is a 22-year-old who just graduated college with no counterterrorism, national security, or law enforcement experience. I bring this up not to be partisan because again, there is anti-semitism on all sides of the political spectrum. Believe me, I know that.
▶ 0:25:14But I genuinely am concerned that this sends a signal about how serious the administration actually is in doing the work of stamping out anti-semitic hate and violence. Words are nice, but actions are important and personnel is important as well.
▶ 0:25:34If the administration takes combating violent extremism seriously, why put this man in charge of the office tasked with preventing domestic violent extremism? We need an answer to that. People want to know. We also want to know why the FBI has transferred agents and intelligence analysts out of the d the domestic terrorism section and cancelled the development of a national domestic terrorism incident database.
▶ 0:26:03Again, the policies matter and I hope that this will be an opportunity for us to course correct and to surge resources toward those agencies that are tasked with stamping out domestic violent extremism, including anti-semitic violence. We should be surging resources to those agencies, not gutting them.
▶ 0:26:24And I am, it is a tragedy that it has taken the deaths of two innocent people and the severe injuries of a dozen others to remind some people of the importance of cracking down on domestic violent extremism, including anti-semitic violence in this country. We should be increasing the federal government's focus on preventing violent extremism, not cutting funds, and not shifting personnel away from those efforts.
▶ 0:26:56I hope in light of these terrible events that the administration will reconsider, shift resources, and put the very best people in charge of the agencies tasked with doing this important work. I hope we can use this hearing as an opportunity to hear from our expert witnesses on how the federal government can disrupt the surge in violent anti-semitic extremism that we have seen since October 7th and stop the normalization of anti-semitism and enhance the
▶ 0:27:26safety of the Jewish community in our country. We cannot lose anyone else to anti-semitic hate. Full stop. I thank our witnesses again. I look forward to hearing from you and I yield back. I thank the ranking member. Other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for the record. I'm now pleased to introduce uh four distinguished witnesses before us on this very topic. But I first ask that they rise uh and please raise their right hands.
▶ 0:28:00You solemnly swear that the testimony you will give before the Committee on Homeland Security, the United States House of Representatives, will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So, help be God. Thank you. The record reflects that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative. I now like to formally introduce them. Mr. Carrie Sleeper currently serves as deputy director of intelligence information sharing at Secure Community Network.
▶ 0:28:21In this role, he coordinates with DHS, FBI, and many other governmental and non-governmental agencies to provide a 247 coverage for SCN's National Jewish Operations Command Center. Mr. Orin Seagull serves as senior vice president of counter extremism and intelligence at the Anti-Defamation League and oversees the the Center on Extremism, the Center for Technology and Society, and Law Enforcement Teams. Dr.
▶ 0:28:46James Kafano is a leading expert in national security and foreign policy challenges and has previously served as a Heritage Foundation's vice president of foreign and defense policy studies. And finally, Miss Julie Raymond is the senior vice president of policy and political affairs at the American Jewish Committee. She has helped launch the bipartisan task force for anti-semitism, the Congressional Caucus on Black Jewish Relations, and the Congressional Hellenic Israel Alliance. Again, thank you to all the witnesses.
▶ 0:29:16I will now recognize you in order. Um, we have your written statements and we appreciate those. If you can please summarize those in five minute uh five minutes and there is a clock to alert you of the timing. Mr. Sleeper, you are now recognized for your opening statement. Dear Chairman Fluger, ranking member magaziner and members of the subcommittee, thank you. My name is Carrie Sleeper and I currently serve as the Cir Community Network's deputy director of intelligence and information sharing.
▶ 0:29:47I oversee SCN's 247 Jewish security operations command center and lead our intelligence coordination efforts with federal, state, and local law enforcement as well as with our Jewish communal security partner partners. I sincerely appreciate your invitation to testify on this critical matter. America's Jewish community is under attack and we need to take decisive action to save lives and mitigate the escalating threats.
▶ 0:30:15The threat of targeted violence being faced by the Jewish community is complex and continues to evolve. This threat will likely persist for several years. As recently as last week, our analysts have observed a notable increase from foreign terrorist organizations aligned media that appears to be doubling down on calls for attacks in the US and Jewish targets.
▶ 0:30:40These groups appear to be coordinating efforts and amplifying shared narratives to encouraged these acts of violence. These evidence these groups are evidently trying to take advantage of the morbid appeal of the recent attacks in DC in Boulder by violent extremists to incite followers to commit additional violent acts in retribution for the ongoing war in Gaza.
▶ 0:31:06These violent trends are fueled by a persistent ecosystem of anti-Israeli networks operating the US and online groups such as the students for justice in Palestine within our lifetime, unity of fields and online propaganda hubs such as the emer emerging isnad network consistently amplify messaging aligned with foreign terrorist organizations and Iranianbacked information operations.
▶ 0:31:36While not all are directly tied to designated foreign terrorist organizations, they help blur the lines between protest and incitement, justifying, glorifying, and promoting violence against the Jewish Israeli community in the name of Gaza. Now, I'd like to briefly describe how SCN manages threats against the Jewish Israeli community.
▶ 0:31:59Our analysts work tirelessly to identify, analyze, and communicate threats to life directed to the Jewish community found online. Threats to life are defined as threats to kill or maim a victim with the perpetrator being assessed to have the intent and capability to carry out the threat. Our analysts utilize state-of-the-art technology and keyword algorithms to search the surface, deep, and dark web for threats specifically targeting the Jewish community.
▶ 0:32:29Last year, our analysts identified approximately 500 threats to life that they shared with the FBI's National Threat Operations Center. This year, SCN is on track to s surpass 700 threats to life, a 40% increase, refle reflecting both the rising threat environment and the operational demand placed on our analysts and infrastructure. Even these efforts illustrate only a portion of the threats facing the Jewish community.
▶ 0:32:59Following the 21st May shooting outside the Capitol, Jewish Museum in DC, SCN analysts identified approximately 6,000 violent threats targeting the Jewish community posted on social media in just a one week period of time.
▶ 0:33:15SEN has issued strategic warnings for over a year that warned God that would have serious domestic implications, including a surge in anti-Israeli, anti-Jewish, and anti-semitic attacks, many of which have now materialized, as our analysts had warned. Our analysts assess that the as the conflict continued, Jewish and Israeli communities in the US would face elevated threats from pro Palestinian or anti-Israeli violent extremists.
▶ 0:33:40Over the past 20 months, every analytic brief SCN has produced has warned of this rising threat, exasperated by online incitement from Iranian linked groups and designated foreign terrorist uh including Hamas, Hezbollah, al-Qaeda, and ISIS, which have promoted and justified violence against Jewish civilians globally under the banner of retaliation for Israel's military action in Gaza.
▶ 0:34:09If our adversaries are coordinating their actions, so must we. We are long overdue for a national strategy to specifically combat targeted violence against the Jewish community. To date, our community's front line for defense against these acts have been nonprofit organizations like the one you see in front of you, including Jewish communal security organizations.
▶ 0:34:31And while we have done a remarkable job in identifying threats and to protect our communities, facilities, and people, we need to recognize that we have nonprofits operating on donations who are defending against foreign terrorist organizations and incitement uh and extremist groups who are constantly pounding the drum beat of kill the Jews.
▶ 0:34:52Today's threat to the Jewish community requires a clearly defined national strategy that identifies and leverages resources from federal, state, and local governments as well as Jewish communal security organizations and groups like you see in front of it today. We have seen numerous instances of groups adversarial to the Jewish community posting planned documents on how to attack our community. It's time we had a plan to protect our community.
▶ 0:35:19I would respectfully suggest that this committee with your focus on intelligence and counterterrorism and your demonstrated interest in protecting the Jewish Israeli community would well be positioned to drive the development of a national strategy. Finally, this is the appropriate form to thank the FBI fusion centers and our state and local law enforcement partners across the nation for their unwavering support and constant vigilance in protecting the Jewish community in these perilous times. Thank you.
▶ 0:35:51Thank you, Mr. Sleeper. I now recognize Mr. Seagull for his opening statement. Uh, Chairman Fluger, ranking member magaziner, distinguished members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity uh to testify today. My name is Orin Seagull and I serve as senior vice president of counter extremism and intelligence at ADL.
▶ 0:36:12My team works to track, expose, and disrupt extremism, anti-semitism, and hate every single day across the ideological spectrum, online, and on the ground. I'm here today because the Jewish community in this country is not just facing elevated threat, but one of the most diverse and complex threat landscapes in recent memory.
▶ 0:36:38We have experienced a surge in violent anti-semitic attacks included calculated missiondriven violence. In the past 12 months, ADL has documented nine terror plots or attacks in the US motivated by anti-semitism, more than the previous four years uh and a half combined. Three weeks ago, a young couple was murdered outside the Capitol Jewish Museum here in Washington DC.
▶ 0:37:06The suspect who reportedly shouted free Palestine after the attack posted a manifesto rejecting nonviolence. 10 days ago in Boulder, an attacker also shouted Free Palestine at a peaceful vigil while attempting to burn his victims alive with Molotov cocktails and a flamethrower.
▶ 0:37:28My team also uncovered videos posted on Telegram recorded by the suspect in Boulder before the attack in which he declared that God is greater than the Zionists, greater than America. And two months ago, Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro's home was targeted by a firebomb on the night of his Passover Each one of these horrific incidents was an attack on the entire Jewish community.
▶ 0:37:56And as if that's not bad enough, these attacks have been justified, celebrated, and normalized by groups operating on American soil as well as across digital platforms. They fuel an environment where targeted attacks against the Jewish community become increasingly likely.
▶ 0:38:16While the grievances driving the violence are often framed as opposition to Israel, they frequently include expressions dehumanizing Jews and Zionists. And they also include support for terror groups. When Jews are blamed for the policies of the state of Israel, it's not only anti-semitic, it is dangerous. And let me be crystal clear, criticism of Israel or its policies is not anti-semitism.
▶ 0:38:46Mere criticism does not factor into our data. But when Jewish individuals and institutions are targeted with protests, vandalism, harassment, and violence, that is classic anti-semitism. And that type of hate has been driving has been a driving force behind the surge of incidents we have documented in the US especially since the October 7th massacre by Hamas.
▶ 0:39:12In 2024, ADL documented over 9,000 anti-semitic incidents of assault, vandalism, and harassment, the highest number we have recorded in 45 years of tracking. And for the first time, the majority of those incidents referenced Israel or Zionism. On campuses and in cities around the country, we've seen flags of terrorist organizations alongside slogans calling for globalizing the antifat or bringing the war home.
▶ 0:39:43Online platforms like Telegram among others enable foreign terrorist organizations to share and promote their propaganda to thousands across the US and around the globe. Groups like Samidun, Unity of Fields and even some students for justice and Palestine chapters have crossed a dangerous line amplifying terrorist propaganda. And some of those groups are even supported by fiscal sponsors with little oversight.
▶ 0:40:12The time to act is now, and Congress should take the following five steps. Increase funding for the nonprofit security grant program to protect at risk houses of worship, schools, and community centers. Invest in community-based violence prevention, such as DHS's CP3. Empower the inter agency task force to combat anti-semitism, ensuring it has a mandate and resources to coordinate across federal agencies.
▶ 0:40:42pass the anti-semitism awareness act and the Holocaust education and anti-semit anti-semitism lessons act to strengthen the accountability in our education system. And finally, address hate on our digital platforms by enforcing transparency and cracking down on violations of material support laws.
▶ 0:41:02Despite years of warnings and mounting data, anti-semitism and the violence that it animates continues to be dismissed, minimized, and politicized. Too many families are asking the ADL, is it safe to be Jewish in public? And while Jewish communities are strong and resilient, they cannot be expected to bear this burden alone. We need leaders to condemn anti-semitism without hesitation.
▶ 0:41:32The federal government has the tools and the responsibility to act. Thank you and I look forward to your questions. Thank you, Mr. Seagull. The chair now recognizes Dr. Kafano for his opening statement. Thank you. I want to thank the committee for addressing this vital issue and I have a statement for the record which I will super briefly summarize and it starts with a really big confession. I sadly have many many decades of experience in the national security, homeland security and counterterrorism space to draw on.
▶ 0:42:00And so when I was asked for this hearing, I just started with one very simple question. So from that perspective of what's worked and hasn't worked over decades and if your goal is to reduce the threats of terrorism in the United States and enhance public safety, what are the single most important things you could possibly do?
▶ 0:42:22And I I boil it down to one on this issue and that is to focus on the ven diagram on the nexus of activities between violent action and the planning and organization and supportive execution enable and make them possible and that is principally material support.
▶ 0:42:40Um, I have a number of recommendations for the record, but I I I just want to uh focus on what I think are the two really important buckets that if we get nothing right in this between uh the Congress and and the administration that these are the ones that they have to get right.
▶ 0:42:56And the first one is you have to put maximum effort into the investigatory actions of material support and and related criminal activity like RICO crimes um and organized uh uh uh organized support for for public violence um at the federal, state, and local level. And the real sweet spot is connecting the three of those togethers to maximize the benefits of each of them.
▶ 0:43:22And so I would point out for example something like the 287G program which Congress uh enacted which when it was originally designed for state and local cooperation with federal law enforcement. But in the initial when this program was first introduced many of the uh law enforcement agencies that participated in it were actually focusing on counterterrorism. And Florida for example was a a great innovator and advocate of this.
▶ 0:43:46So it is a it is a a a perfect program to illustrate how you can bring those resources and authorities together to really expand your investigatory actions. And I think what the committee has to ask is is are there other areas we can expand this in not just in terms of immigration enforcement uh and not just in the DOJ DOJ space but in the homeland and under the authorities homeland security and possibly in other areas as well commerce treasury and so on.
▶ 0:44:11The second area is one of the most vital sinnus in the connection between material support and violent action and that is terrorist travel. Everybody remembers the 911 report. Very few people remember that the 911 commission considered terrorist travel such a vitally important task that they wrote a whole separate volume just on that.
▶ 0:44:41And so I think any of the range of activities which are really designed to thwart militias travel and presence and entry in the United States are are extremely efficacious in helping diminish the capacity to provide material support and and reducing the likelihood of terrorist actions. So, border and immigration, imig uh immigration enforcement, deportations, denial and revocation of visas.
▶ 0:45:06Uh I think all of these are absolutely critical uh support for this and I I just want to end by thanking the committee for having this hearing and taking this mission on because truly you are doing God's work. Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Kafano.
▶ 0:45:24Uh the chair now recognizes Miss Raymond for her opening You hear me? Now you're on. Now I'm on. Okay. I appreciate the opportunity to be a part of today's very important conversation and I'm grateful for your bipartisan leadership in addressing the anti-semitism crisis in our country.
▶ 0:45:51Much has been said about the tragic murders of Sarah Mgrim and Yuron Lashinsky. So, I just want to take this opportunity to say um because they were cherished friends of AJC and because they were murdered outside of an AJC event um to again extend condolences to their families and to thank the Secure Communities Network for the extreme amount of support and assistance that we've received from SEN since that incident happened as well as before that attack as well as the one that followed
▶ 0:46:21in Boulder simply occurred because their attackers consider considered all of those who support Israel's existence and perhaps even all Jews to be proxies of the Jewish state. As we see horrific acts of violence being committed under the guise of resistance, it's clear that a disturbing and increasing number of people consider all Jews to be responsible for Israel's actions and to somehow therefore be deserving deserving targets of hate, discrimination,
▶ 0:46:52and Ongoing investigations into these attacks will reveal how or whether the perpetrators engaged with or were inspired by terrorist or anti-Israel extremist groups. Such groups pose a real and rising threats to Jews safety at home and abroad in their capacity to incite and facilitate violence transcends borders.
▶ 0:47:14Groups like Samadun, which the Treasury Department sanctioned last year for channeling funds to the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, carried out a theatrical performance cosplaying the October 7 attack as recently as this last weekend in Brussels. At the same time, while terror linked groups are one driver of today's horrific situation, there are many threats facing Jews that are not directly or indirectly attributable to them.
▶ 0:47:41A's state of anti-semitism in America report in 2024 found that an equal number of American Jews believe that the political right and the political left represent an equal anti-semitic threat in the United States today.
▶ 0:47:55Whether from the political right, from the political left, from Christian nationalism or extremism in the name of Islam, all threats to Jews safety and security demand a robust government There is no question that terror and material support for terror are illegal. Breaking the law, violating the rights of others are not legitimate forms of protest. Full stop. These activities must be addressed using the full weight of the law. However, I also want to be clear.
▶ 0:48:25As we seek to counter these harmful behaviors, we have to adhere to the guarantees of free speech and due process that apply to all people in the United States. While anti-Semitic and anti-Israel rhetoric and violent anti-semitic attacks pose extremely serious challenges, they must be addressed with different approaches. Speech, no matter how offensive, is protected. Suppressing it doesn't just violate our American values and and responsibilities.
▶ 0:48:54It allows those who are advocating hate to be cast as Your leadership, and this is vital. Public leaders on both sides of the aisle have an obligation to respond promptly and strongly. Ambiguity is unacceptable. The message must always be that nothing, absolutely nothing, including events in the Middle East, can justify anti-semitism.
▶ 0:49:17Leaders must categorically reject calls to globalize the antifod or resistance by any means necessary because while some are protesting, others are In addition to strong specific and public condemnation, there are other critical ways that Congress can act. The exorbitant amounts doowled out for Jewish communal security are in effect a Jewish tax.
▶ 0:49:42Congress should provide at least $500 million for the nonprofit security grant program administered by FEMA, which has been under underfunded for years and support the Center for Prevention Programs and Partnership CP3, which strengthens our country's ability to prevent violent and terrorist um activities. These programs and other anti-terrorism grant programs must be appropriately resourced and staffed.
▶ 0:50:09To address anti-semitism online, Congress needs to pass fundamental reforms to section 230 of the Communications Decency Act and press social media platforms to enforce and strengthen their own policies that relate to anti-terrorism and incitement to There is also a real and urgent need for the government to adopt a broader comprehensive strategy to counter anti-semitism and foster American Jewish life.
▶ 0:50:36Congressional advocate advocacy in favor of a national action plan and a point person to lead inter agency coordination can make an important difference in making this happen. It is only by addressing anti-semitism holistically regardless of political or ideological source and inclusive of both anti-semitic rhetoric and violent attacks that we can counter this surging anti-semitism which I think we can all agree is not just a problem that faces American Jews but affects American society and democracy as a whole.
▶ 0:51:06Thank you and I look forward to your questions. Thank you Miss Raymond. Uh members will now be recognized in order of seniority uh for five minutes of questioning and we may elect to do an additional round of questioning. I now recognize myself um for five minutes of questioning. Um, and I appreciate hearing from from everyone, especially hearing about free speech.
▶ 0:51:29And Miss Raymond, your your comments are um you're absolutely right that we have to protect free speech, that we have to be able to express um views and no matter whether we agree with them or not and then acknowledge that there's a line. So what I want to ask because it was it was mentioned by Mr. Seagull is so Mr. Seagull, I'll start with you.
▶ 0:51:56When somebody at a protest says free Palestine, how does the Jewish community receive that? Uh context is is always the key uh with with any slogan and that includes chance of a free Palestine. I think, you know, in many protests, if some in the community hear that, they don't really think twice about it.
▶ 0:52:21But I think if free Palestine is uh used to write graffiti on a on a suka or a Jewish institution, that's a very different to violence. Uh Free Palestine inherently is not calling for violence on its own. But if it's being yelled at when somebody's trying to burn people alive, you could bet you could bet it is. Okay.
▶ 0:52:42Do do Jewish students in a rally that seems to be um heating up in a way that that is trending towards uh what what could be physical violence when somebody screams free Palestine with a Palestinian flag. Does that is that received by Jewish students on universities as a a rally rally cry for violence? Yeah, I mean even thought amongst Jewish students is not monolithic. I think different students may take it in a different way.
▶ 0:53:12I think what is important to focus on is when those types of uh sentiments or slogans are used uh when uh targeting specifically uh Jewish students or or other individuals elsewhere. That's the context that is really troubling about that. Uh Dr. Kerafato, what is in your opinion a rally or a free Palestine cry at a at a protest mean to the Jewish community? Right.
▶ 0:53:38So I I agree that context is everything and I think one of the things that we focus on is it's it is a difference I think if you are a US citizen uh in a context of exercising your legitimate free speech and in the sense if you are here on a visa as a student or as a professional uh and you are promoting extremist ideas in the United States you're a guest in the United States and the US it's very clear under US legal authority that that if you violate the the uh terms of your of your stay in the United States you you should
▶ 0:54:08be uh removed from the United States. If you want to come to the United States and you have a track record of extremist violent statesman that the US government thinks does disqualifies you from entering the United States, you should be you should be denied entry to the United States. I do think that those are those are really important distinctions. And there's legislation that uh that that I am sponsoring and many others are supporting that uh gets at the heart of the overstay of those visas, especially those that would perpetrate those attacks. And Mr. sleeper.
▶ 0:54:33When you think about um the terrorist uh in the Boulder, Colorado event um what what was this person's mindset? How did they become radicalized? How did they get to the position uh where they are espousing these um foreign terrorist organization ideals and this viewpoint of anti-semitic and and violent action? Thank you, sir.
▶ 0:55:02The commonality amongst all three events were that the condoned their actions in the name of Gaza. They had all been consuming the same material, the same information.
▶ 0:55:18When you have three events, violent events targeting the Jewish community within eight weeks and all three offenders say the same thing, use the same terminology, it's clear that there is a consistent message being conveyed uh and that message is targeting the Jewish community and it's being conveyed by everywhere from forest ter foreign terrorist organiz organizations
▶ 0:55:49to nation state actors like Iran. Their goal is to do whatever they can do to incite violence against the Jewish community. Thank you, Miss Raymond. Um, should those on a visa studying at a uh at a participating in some sort of protest? Uh, so not American citizens, but those on a visa, should they be allowed to burn an American flag at a I want to start off by saying and and scream free Palestine.
▶ 0:56:19Yes. I want to start off by saying that to to be in America as a as a resident, as a student, is a privilege. It is not a right. And for those who are not upholding our values or threatening the safety and security of Americans, there needs to be some process for consideration of removal. burning an American flag, shouting free Palestine are elements of that freedom of speech.
▶ 0:56:48And there are, as has been just discussed before, a great many interpretations of of what that means, of what those types of messages mean, right? For many who would say, for example, from the river to the sea, right? They're seeing that um ignorantly as a synonymous for free Palestine, right?
▶ 0:57:11Um but if you look at where the river is and where the sea is um and if in fact they're what they mean when they say that is that it is only for Palestinians and not for Jews, that's a very different message. Thank you. And I'll come to you. My time is expired and I'll give you the uh I'll yield to the ranking member and also be uh if you need an extra minute, we can do that. Appreciate it. Thank you to the chair and to our witnesses um for some very good testimony. Um I I'll start um with Mr.
▶ 0:57:41Seagull and your recommendations which were very helpful. Um your first one was expanding funding for the nonprofit security grant program. Uh that resonates with me because I know in my district in Rhode Island, we have numerous synagogues, churches, schools, mosques that have utilized that program.
▶ 0:58:01Uh this is a federal program that helps uh those religious and community- based organizations get the security upgrades that they need to keep people safe, cameras, facial recognition, etc.
▶ 0:58:15Um, as of yesterday, and I believe this is still the case, uh, the Trump administration has still not awarded $210 million of nonprofit security grant funds from fiscal 24 and has also not even noticed the funding uh, for fiscal 25, an additional 274 million for availability.
▶ 0:58:37So that's in total nearly half a billion dollars that the administration is withholding in nonprofit security grant funds to say nothing of the budget for next year that they've proposed which is also inadequate. So can you just I mean help us out here. Part of our job as Congress as members of Congress is to hold the administration accountable and to make sure the administration is doing everything that it can to protect people from anti-semitic violence in this country.
▶ 0:59:05Can you just speak some more about the importance of releasing these grant funds right away and why the administration needs to act immediately on it? Yeah, thank thank you for the question.
▶ 0:59:17you know, attending uh an event at a Jewish museum or uh marching or walking peacefully uh to show solidarity with um or walking to class or even just walking down the street in Brooklyn should not be an act of courage. But that's where we are. Yeah. And so the community is feeling vulnerable.
▶ 0:59:47Uh this is a crisis moment and we need to rely on our leaders and the government to help protect communities when they are at most risk and and I think that's what we hope people will understand and that these dollars are going to go not for superfluous issues but to protect people so that they don't have to be courageous just to be publicly Jewish. That's very well said. Thank you.
▶ 1:00:16And I I'll just say again, I mean, I I genuinely appreciate that the administration has stated that cracking down on anti-semitism is a priority. It should be, but the actions need to follow the words. And a very basic action is to release the nearly half a billion dollars that Congress has already appropriated for the nonprofit security grant program so that lives can be saved. Your second recommendation uh had to do with the CP3 program.
▶ 1:00:43Again, for people at home who may not be familiar, can you explain what that is and why it's important? Yeah, the Center for Prevention uh uh programs and partnerships at DHS. Uh the idea there is that it would help prevent mass casualty attacks and extremism, not just respond to it afterwards. And my sense is that based on some of the work that was done there, they helped save lives.
▶ 1:01:11You know, anti-semitism is the lifeblood of many extremist movements both domestically and globally. And so, if we can push back against the narratives that we know animate people to violence at the earliest stages, the community will be safer. And that's what CP3 has the potential to do. It's about preventing people from becoming radicalized, especially young impressionable people.
▶ 1:01:35And and if I could just again, I mentioned this earlier, but this again is the agency that President Trump has appointed this individual to lead, Mr. Fugate, a 22-year-old who just graduated from college earlier this year with no law enforcement experience, no national security experience, no intelligence experience. So I think what a lot of us are wondering is why? Why? Like there are plenty of qualified people out there. Is this the best we can do?
▶ 1:02:06I think there are some who are speculating that it's because the administration intends to shut down the CP3 program entirely and and Mr. Fugate is there as a placeholder while it's round wound down. Uh it's it's from what I understand there's been significant firings and layoffs at CP3 which would support that theory, but the the answer is we don't know.
▶ 1:02:28Um, now if this is some whiz kid who is qualified somehow to lead this important office, then I think we at least ought to get him in here to ask him some questions about what his vision and his plans are. And you know, with the extra minute that the chair was was kind enough to grant me, I'll just ask any of our witnesses, does anyone feel comfortable having an individual with Mr. Fugate's profile and experience leading an office like CP3 given the charged environment that we're in right now.
▶ 1:02:59Yeah. You look, I just like to say that if you look at the entire federal architecture in the four years that got us here, I I think it was an abysmal failure. Yeah, but I'm asking about who's in charge right Well, that's the point, sir, because you have all these people who were charged with reducing anti-semitism and anti-ionism in this country.
▶ 1:03:21But for four years, my time, I don't think that justifies any of this justifies appointing a 22year-old with no relevant experience to an agency charged with keeping us safe. An agency that the ADL has flagged in one of their top five recommendations as needing more support, not less. Sir, I think you asked the wrong yield back. Gentleman yields. I now recognize the gentle lady from Georgia, Miss Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:03:46There is a unifying belief of the left, a hatred of America and Western civilization. Anti-Israel extremism is frequently part of a broader anti-western sentiment. It's why so many of the protesters at the LA anti-ICE riots are flying Palestinian flags while burning the American flag.
▶ 1:04:07and why Isra the the daughter of a congresswoman who sits on foreign affairs Ilhan Omar said on her Instagram last week from LA to Rafa there is one common oppressor death to the colonial empire she also drew this connection between ICE enforcement in LA and Israel's war against Hamas for the left everything can be reduced to white people oppressing brown people.
▶ 1:04:37Whether it be a BLM riot, a pro Palestinian encampment, or an attempt to impede ICE from enforcing federal immigration laws, these protests are all organized by the same professional left-wing activists whose intent is to cause a much as much civil unrest and chaos as possible. Elias Rodriguez, the man who shot and killed two Israeli embassy officials last month, was deeply involved in this far-left activist ecosystem.
▶ 1:05:08Mr. Kafano, what far-left groups was Elias Rodriguez involved with? So you rais a really important point which is why that the threat of anti-semitism and anti-ionism in the United States is a bigger and broader problem because when we look at the organizations which have support and encouraged or discussed these short on time Mr.
▶ 1:05:31Kafano what what organizations so this is the party of uh socialism and li liberation great which has also been engaged in activities like BLM and and other riots as well now would that be linked to Neville Ray Singum is does that name ring a bell he is widely recognized as a major funer of the organization and that's from Wikipedia so right and just to just to go further on who Neville Ray Singum is he's the son of a Sri Lankan immigrant and Cuban immigrant but in 1974 he was inst investigated
▶ 1:06:01by the FBI for his ties to groups engaged um against the United States interest. He was a member of a Mauist group. He's also uh said to be nearly a billionaire and gives his money frequently to uh left-wing organizations. Um he's even linked to the CCP. He currently lives and works in Shanghai. He shares office space with a Chinese propaganda firm focused on presenting a positive image of China to the global south.
▶ 1:06:31And in 2019, he conseded a consulting business with Chinese partners partners active in the propaganda apparatus of the CCP. He has provided significant funding to pro-China media outlets around the world and even married Jodie Evans, the founder of Code Pink in 2017. She used to be against China, but she's not anymore. And she's currently co-authoring a book titled China is not our enemy.
▶ 1:06:57You know what's really interesting about this man uh is he uses the Goldman Sachs philanthropy fund. Uh there's a lot of Americans invest their money with Goldman Sachs, but the Goldman Sachs philanthropy fund is a dark money clearing house to obscure his identity, Singum's identity, while facilitating the transfer of substantial sums to nonprofit.
▶ 1:07:21things like the People's Forum, which received over $20 million from Singum through the Goldman Sachs philanthropy fund, organized anti-Israel protests across the country, and was heavily involved in the protest at Colombia and the takeover of Hamilton Mall. Singum also funds $20 million through the Goldman Sachs Philanthropy Group to the Justice and Education Fund, which provides money to pro-China media outlets around the world.
▶ 1:07:48And just as you mentioned, the Party of Socialism and Liberation, that's the group that's organizing these lovely events happening in LA that Democrats call mostly peaceful, but the people in LA call fiery, violent, and call a war against He also funded and and unbelievably the pro Palestinian protests around the country and on campuses.
▶ 1:08:16and Elicus Elias Rodriguez, the man who killed the two young Israeli diplomats. Uh, Singum coordinated the anti-ICE LA protest. Again, this picture just can't be shown enough. And these have been coordinating these they have been coordinating these anti-ICE protests around the world. I mean around the country and more to come is what the Democrats tell us. Uh, Mr. Kafono, one last question.
▶ 1:08:44Do you believe China is funding the war against America? Uh there's uh a lot of activity in the public record that show Chinese money is flowing into as many of these organizations which have been involved in planning and organizing and supporting these activities. Absolutely. Thank you, Mr. Kafon. I yield back. Mr. Chairman, gentle lady yields. The chair now recognizes the gentleman from New York, Mr. Goldman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:09:06It's a little rich to be lectured about anti-semitism from somebody who could not even bring herself to vote yes on a anti-semitism resolution that was uh supported by all but two members uh of the House of Representatives. Uh but we are here I think for a very important purpose and I I do thank the the chairman for raising this issue and calling this hearing.
▶ 1:09:32I I was disappointed that the partisan uh accusations that somehow uh President Biden and his administration are responsible for the rise in when President Biden issued the first national strategy to counter anti-semitism and nonprofit security grants uh and the funding for them uh significantly increased during the Biden administration and now that we've had three very
▶ 1:10:02serious violent anti-semitic incidents, the need for those nonprofit security grants is even greater. And I was certainly disappointed to see that the subcommittee uh on appropriations allotted only 305 million for nonprofit security grants, the same amount in fiscal year 23 before October 7th, before the dramatic rise in anti-semitism and before the violent events uh that have occurred over the last couple months.
▶ 1:10:32Uh, Miss Raymond, you are here from the A and uh, one of those tragic uh, violent events occurred at an AJC event. Could you just briefly and and obviously we we express our condolences to you and and the organization and the Israeli embassy.
▶ 1:10:50Um, but can you describe what additional security measures AJC will now need to take after and as a result of the murders of Sarah and Euron? Thank you so much for the um the condolences and and recognizing AJC's sort of unique place in this horrible anti-Semitic landscape that we're all navigating in this moment.
▶ 1:11:18Um there's of course an active investigation into into what took place um the night of the murder of Sarah Neon. Um, so I can't comment too much on that, but I can say that we've been in very deep and many conversations um with law enforcement, with the FBI, with the Secure Communities Network about protocols um and have been largely reassured that the existing protocols that AJC has in place
▶ 1:11:48for our events are parallel to what Jewish community organizations and advocacy organizations across Ross the board are using um and that we we have done everything. I guess the question if I could just interrupt is please I I'm assuming that after this event where there was terrible violence that you're going to have to increase security. Yes. That will cost money. Correct. Yes. Yes.
▶ 1:12:15And that and that is true for just about every single Jewish organization whether it be a synagogue or a nonprofit like AJC. Absolutely. And there becomes a point where um questions have to be asked. Do we have a program? Do we go on a trip? Do we engage certain constituencies? Or is the security cost simply too high? Yep.
▶ 1:12:37And and I think that that's worth noting because last year alone there were almost a billion dollars of applications through the nonprofit security grant program. Obviously there was about 450 million so not all of them could be granted.
▶ 1:12:53um the what you're saying and what certainly I've been told by many synagogues and and Jewish organizations is now that these extremist anti-semitic protests that previously had been uh included intimidation, harassment, some assault uh but had not crossed over the line to violence and murder as they now have are
▶ 1:13:23going to have to increase security. And the federal program that provides funding for that security is the nonprofit security grant program. And if there were a billion dollars of applications last year, we can only imagine how much more need there will be this year.
▶ 1:13:40And I certainly hope that the chairman who I know cares uh very deeply about this issue uh will encourage his colleagues uh on the appropriations committee and uh in leadership of the Republican party to dramatically increase the $35 million.
▶ 1:13:59Uh many have been calling for at least 500 million which I have also supported and I know AJC has supported and it is absolutely essential for the Jewish community that the nonprofit security grant funding be significantly increased from last year, not decreased. Uh and I'm hoping we can work in a bipartisan way to do that, Mr. Chairman, because uh I know you do and and many of your colleagues on the other side of the aisle care very much uh about the Jewish community.
▶ 1:14:29And this is essential to the safety and security of the Jewish community. Congressman, if if I may, um, if we have just one second, I would only say that the nonprofit security pro grant program doesn't just help Jewish communities protect our institutions. It's for all vulnerable communities. So, as we're increasing this amount, we need to make sure also that it's not at the at the cost or the jeopardy of other communities.
▶ 1:14:56So we need to not only elevate it to meet the needs of the Jewish community, but make sure that all vulnerable communities throughout the United States have the capacity to apply for and receive these important grants. No question about it. Thank you. Gentleman's time is expired. The chair now recognizes gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Evans. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, ranking member for holding this hearing. Of course, thank you to the witnesses for coming. And first and foremost, our hearts go out to the Jewish community for these attacks.
▶ 1:15:24And anti-semitism must be condemned wherever it rears its ugly head. Full stop. But we have to do more than that. The anti-semitic terrorist attack that harmed Jewish advocates in Boulder, Colorado on June 1st happened 25 miles away from my house. And as we've talked about, not an isolated incident, but representative of the surge that we've heard about of anti-semitism in Colorado and across the US.
▶ 1:15:50And unfortunately, uh, per data from ADL, uh, 2024 marked the highest number of recorded incidents of anti-semitism in Colorado's history, we're now ninth in the nation. Anti-semitism has no home in Colorado or the nation. And again, I'd like to thank the chairman and the ranking member for this hearing so that we can find I was a an Army veteran of the uh Army veteran of the global war on terror. I was a cop for over a decade in the Denver metro area.
▶ 1:16:19And so I know that solutions, one of the solutions is effective information sharing between federal, state, and local law enforcement agencies. In the case of the Boulder attack, uh there's several different nodes at which that attack might have been stopped.
▶ 1:16:35uh when he was admitted entry into the United States, having previously made many anti-semitic statements, when he illegally overstayed a visa, when he illegally attempted to purchase a firearm, or again the uh uploading anti-semitic content to social media in support of extremists. Unfortunately, some of that coordination did not occur and the attack was planned over the course of a year in our backyard. Mr.
▶ 1:17:00Chairman, I'd like to enter into the record and play for the committee just a very short video of some of the statements made by the Boulder perpetrator before he carried out the attack. So order. And let's suspend the time until we can get the video. When the video starts, you can resume the time.
▶ 1:18:21Thank you, Mr. Chairman. First question to Mr. Sleeper. uh in light of statements like that, overstaying a via visa, uh trying to purchase a firearm, should should that have raised some red Yes. Knowing uh knowing what we do regarding uh individuals who may be inclined to uh pursue the Jewish community, excuse me, um pursue the Jewish community uh as a result of their grievances.
▶ 1:18:52Uh yes. uh law enforcement, the intelligence community should be able to focus more acutely to identify issues that are suggesting an individual contemplating mobilization to violence. Thank you. And then last question, I got a minute and 12 seconds left. You mentioned in your testimony fusion centers.
▶ 1:19:13How can federal policy strengthen the original mission of fusion centers by equi equipping them with the tools to detect and respond to these anti-semitic or other terrorist threats? And what does that look like in terms of threat reporting? Thank you. Fusion centers play an absolutely critical role in sharing threat information, timely threat information across our domestic intelligence architecture.
▶ 1:19:40SCN leverages fusion centers every day we work. When we identify a threat to life, we include fusion centers to ensure that there's redundancy in sharing that information. as as we look ahead and we develop a strategy to mitigate targeted violent threats against the Jewish community, the intelligence component is absolutely essential. We need to understand what our adversaries are doing.
▶ 1:20:11Much of the discussions we're having today are defensive. Um what can we do to protect this until we get to the point of we understand what our adversaries are trying to do, what they're targeting. Um and the incorporating the fusion centers working in conjunction with the intelligence community, federal, state, and local law enforcement.
▶ 1:20:36then we will have a seamless perspective on information being shared specifically to this Yield back. Gentleman yields. The chair now recognizes gentleman from Puerto Rico, Mr. Hernandez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I represent probably the largest Jewish community in the Caribbean, and I take the responsibility very seriously. Jewish people deserve to live without fear and with the full protection and support of their government.
▶ 1:21:02Anti-semitism has no place in our society and I stand firmly with the Jewish community and remain committed to confronting hate with strength and determination. Part of my commitment includes investigating and understanding how anti-semitism spreads online, how it spreads through digital spaces like encrypted platforms such as WhatsApp and Signal or social media platforms such as Facebook X, Instagram, YouTube and decisions by these companies
▶ 1:21:33and full disclosure I used to work for one of them have an impact. We've seen how loosening content restrictions at Meta have led to an increase in anti-semitism online. For example, a spike in anti-semitic comments on the Facebook accounts of 30 Jewish members of Congress.
▶ 1:21:52Now, Miss Raymond, while I disagree with the idea of reforming or changing section 230 because I believe that section 230 is what enables content moderation without liability. I think we can find some common ground with some minimum uh level of of uh oversight, right, of moderation.
▶ 1:22:13Do you think that social media companies should reinstate previous policies around hate Social media companies have a lot of work to do both in terms of reinstating previous policies um increasing the number of content moderators. Um there was a trend to have more humans monitoring social media and looking for for problematic posts.
▶ 1:22:40that trend um is is changing and without the humans who are trained to understand what's going on it's much harder to combat. Um with regard to section 30 I would very respectively push back um and give an example. You remember the attack in Paris on the Baklan theater in 2015 where 90 were killed.
▶ 1:23:05There were clear examples of how social media had inspired and allowed for that attack to to be facilitated. An American was killed in that attack and sued the social media company. The initial court dur de deemed that they were liable but they could not be found guilty because of section 230. So American lives are engendered because social media platforms cannot be held liable.
▶ 1:23:34No one's saying that they need to be liable for all of the hatred or all of the ridiculousness that exists on social media. Um, that's what they're built for in a lot of ways, but there need to be some lines and when there's and I'm sorry and I'm sorry to interrupt because I also have another topic that I want to move on to, but I do agree with the fact that we do need standards around content moderation. And I would be open to legislation at least requiring some auditing of whether those companies are enforcing those standards and their success rates. Yes.
▶ 1:24:03uh but I do think that we need to protect their uh intermediary liability status because it's crucial to protect freedom of expression and also for the platform's functioning but naturally we can continue this debate uh for eternity. I I I' and I agree with your point that online harm can lead to real world harm and that's something that we need to guard against. Um I'd like to switch over to the controversy surrounding Harvard and the limited time I have left.
▶ 1:24:29You know, I understand that there is much to be done by universities across the country to ensure that all their students feel safe on campus, but Harvard has implemented several initiatives to ensure that its Jewish and Israeli students feel supported and have a strong sense of belonging belonging. And I disagree with the administration's decision to freeze over $2 billion in critical funding to a university known for groundbreaking research and using the pretext of failing to address anti-semitism on its campus is deeply misguided.
▶ 1:24:59My question is for Mr. Seagull. Given the ADL's partnership with Harvard to develop tools and best practices for combating anti-semitism, can you share what measurable impact these initiatives have had so far in supporting Jewish and Israeli students on campus? Well, I I'll just start by saying, you know, to effectively combat anti-semitism, we need to safeguard those efforts from political exploitation.
▶ 1:25:25Uh I would also say that you know banning uh you know foreign students from attending a university or removing their accreditation like that's not going to solve the anti-semitism problem. And and I agree I think we have to stand strongly against anti-semitism but we also have to stand strongly against weaponizing anti-semitism for political gain. I yield back. The gentleman yields. We will now enter a second round of questioning.
▶ 1:25:55Only those that were here for the first round will will be allowed to ask a second question. If somebody new who was not here for the first round comes, then they'll be allowed to ask, but it'll be a single uh fivem minute period. Uh the chair now recognizes I now recognize myself for five additional minutes of questioning. Um Mr. Sleepy, you talked about the threat of future attacks. Um, and you said that you're worried about the attacks that SCN has predicted that there will be a rise. What about those?
▶ 1:26:25So, we saw in the case of Boulder that this was a a visa overstate issue. Are you worried about those that entered this country illegally that had a tie to um to terrorism? Could they also uh pose a threat? Well, certainly if there's individuals in this country that have a tie to terrorist organizations, they should be a priority in monitoring.
▶ 1:26:53Um, ties to terrorist organizations, without a doubt. Yes, sir. And do they pose a threat to the Jewish community? If there's an individual in this country that has a tie to a terrorist organization, we should consider them a threat to the Jewish community. Okay. Yes, Mr. Um Dr.
▶ 1:27:11Kafano when I think about the lawlessness that is happening across our country in many cities talk to me about the is are these protesters in some cases being paid to go from city to city to protest whether it is a um from the river to the sea mindset or an anti- ice mindset. Are there common threads that we see in these protests?
▶ 1:27:42We we do see organizations that have in the public record supported activities including the BLM riots, the anti-semitic riots that we've seen at universities and other places and people in California. This is undeniable. Now, the question, you know, as I said in my testimony, the key thing is material support. It's a real crime. It is a red line. Now, I'm not accusing anybody of having conducted material support, but the answer is where do you look for material support?
▶ 1:28:07You look for people who are involved in activities that that that result in in harm to the public, whether it's a terrorist act or or public violence. So when you see communities that uh fail to take these protests seriously when they do cross the line of protected speech to an area where it's not protected violence, threats of violence and those types of things, is there a uh an incentive in these communities to continue to fment
▶ 1:28:37this type um of attitude? uh and is that leading to the growing danger and the growing threat across our country? I mean, I think as a as a general threat of some estimate, we could say that a lot of the public organized public violence that we've seen in the last half decade is what we would call top down, right? It's not like the civil rights movement. It's not like people saying, "Let's let's block the bridge in Montgomery, Alabama." It's people being organized and sent to the streets.
▶ 1:29:04Uh and we're seeing the same people or the same groups organizing across a range of different issues. So if you say is there an external threat of a a button to push to say when do we want to create public discord in the United States and and make that happen we've seen a series of occasions now where there appears the answer to that is yes and then as I said the real question is because we're worried about public safety if that crosses over into material support now you just not you just don't have somebody that's fermenting public unrest for political motives
▶ 1:29:34for international motives but you might have people that are actually creating a physical physical threat to American citizens. M. Raymond, you talked about having both sides of the ideological spectrum covered. Um that that doesn't matter that they're you see it on both sides, but characterize those that are committing these uh that are inciting these violent protests right now. Um what what side of the political spectrum are they on?
▶ 1:30:00The ones that are screaming from the river to the sea and free Palestine in a way that incites violence and protest. Certainly what's been I think most jarring for many in the Jewish community over the past few weeks has been the shift from um what we had seen as sort of peaceful but uncomfortable protest to violent protest. There's no question about that. Which side of the political spectrum do they lie on? They're coming from the far left. Um and according to our survey, I didn't give this statistic before.
▶ 1:30:31Um, we ask American Jews, where do you where are you most concerned about the threats? And 33% say the far left, 33% say the far right, 33% say Christian nationalism, and 33% say Islam. What I want to hone in on right now though is um these protests have been going on for quite some time, for several years in fact, and they be they've become more violent uh in nature.
▶ 1:30:59So, do you see that same character in that 33% that you just identified on the far right in the in the terms of massive amounts of people um in massive protests that go from peaceful to violent? The really tragic part of what we are seeing in anti-semitism in America today is that we cannot look in only one direction.
▶ 1:31:25Right now, it would be very easy to turn all of our attention to the far left to the anti-Zionist protesters and say this is where the threat is coming from now and ignore every other source of anti. We cannot do that. We don't have that luxury. I agree. Thank you. My time is expired. I yield to the Raiki member. Thank you. And on that point, I mean again, I think it is important that we call out anti-semitism wherever it exists and that we act to prevent violence, whatever the motivation.
▶ 1:31:52And you know that is certainly true when protests turn violent on the far left. It's also true for example in Charlottesville uh a mass protest that turn violent replete with chance of Jews will not replace us among other inappropriate and incendiary slogans. So we got to call it all out. Um but you know one of the dynamics that I find here and this has not been the case. I want to thank the chairman for a very good conversation and for calling this hearing.
▶ 1:32:22I want to thank all of the witnesses for bringing I think good actionable recommendations. But I think one of the things that frustrates some of us, particularly, you know, those who are Jewish members of Congress or who, like myself don't practice but have Jewish heritage, is sometimes, you know, we feel that anti-semitism is being used to justify whatever the political agenda is that someone is trying to push when really what we need to be doing right now is listening to the Jewish
▶ 1:32:52community in this moment, in this moment of crisis, and asking the Jewish community in America, what do you need? So in that vein, hearing recommendations from these panelists is very instructive and I want to make sure that those recommendations are the center of what we take away from this recommendations like fully funding the nonprofit security grant program and getting the nearly half billion dollars that has already been allocated out the door to organizations that need it, funding and supporting the CP3
▶ 1:33:23program so that we can prevent radicalization before it occurs. That is a recommendation that is actionable that we in Congress can have influence over that we need to support. Uh, another recommendation that I noticed uh in in Mr. Seagull's testimony had to do with the Office of Civil Rights in the Department of Education. And I think particularly in the higher education conversation right now that's important. So I'd like to offer you a a moment, you know, Mr.
▶ 1:33:49Seagull to explain the rationale for that recommendation and why it's important. Yeah, I mean we we need to kind of attack where we are seeing anti-semitism. And I I will say it's not only um on college campuses, we're seeing it, you know, throughout our our society. Um uh we're seeing it online. We're seeing it at the mouths of some of our leaders.
▶ 1:34:15But I think, you know, when you think about ways to try to attack this issue before it gets worse, um finding ways to deal with it when people are younger and giving them alternatives is going to help prevent future uh issues of anti-semitism. Yeah. And I I would just like to say, you know, the attacks of tomorrow are being incubated today.
▶ 1:34:37Whether it's in online spaces, whether it is in people uh feeling emboldened to harass their Jewish classmates, etc. And so the education department being able to focus on Title Six, for example, cases hopefully will help. That's incredibly important. I agree. And again, just for the record, I stated this earlier. So far this year, the administration has cut at least 240 employees from that office at a time when we should be surging resources.
▶ 1:35:08The way to deal with anti-semitism on campuses is by having strong Title Six enforcement, by having the Department of Education exercise oversight, not by cutting funding to medical research, not by turning away the best and the brightest from around the world who want to study in the United States.
▶ 1:35:29So again, I just want to make sure that we are listening to what our expert witnesses here are asking us for as a Congress and that the administration is listening as well. Um, look, I I I I do retain optimism. I believe that we can get past this period of divisiveness and hate that we're living in and and we can build a brighter and better future. But we need to put the resources in the right places.
▶ 1:35:58Support DHS. Support law enforcement. Support the people who are doing the work of enforcing Title Six. Do the actual work. Put the funding where it belongs. This is not a time to be pulling back. And yes, going after hate online is absolutely essential. And I'll just end on this. The social media platforms will pretend that they are neutral conduits for speech.
▶ 1:36:24But when their algorithms amplify certain kinds of content, content that promotes violence, content that promotes hate, when their algorithms do that, they are not being neutral. The algorithms are not neutral on those platforms and therefore they have a responsibility to exercise their power responsibly. If they don't, then Congress has a role to step in. So, thank you all again. I yield back. The gentleman yields. Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Evans. Thank you, chairman.
▶ 1:36:55Uh, thank you for the, uh, the second round of questioning. Um, this was something that had come up in the first round, and what I'll probably do is I'll frame the question and then we'll go down the line and just hear each of your thoughts on it. Uh, as a cop, you get to learn all sorts of fun case law. And in this particular case, Brandenburgg v. Ohio from 1969 is the current governing Scotas case around uh, where does free speech end and where does criminal action begin?
▶ 1:37:18And so just for the sake of framing this, I'll read you a quick synopsis of it uh which is that uh speech may not be forbidden uh advocating the use of force or unlawful conduct unless that advocacy is directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action or is likely to incite or produce such uh lawless action. And so it goes back to the old hypothetical is it is it allowed to um yell fire in a crowded theater? Well, that depends. Is there actually fire in a crowded theater?
▶ 1:37:48then yes, you should absolutely yell fire in a crowded theater. But if you yell those exact same words with the intention of sewing discord, causing lawlessness, somebody gets hurt in a in a chaotic evacuation and you knew there was no fire, you did it out of malicious intent. Well, then of course that's not protected speech. And so um in the in the case of the discussion that we're having here, I'd just like to go down the line uh starting with Mr.
▶ 1:38:10sleeper and hear your thoughts around some of the slogans that we're hearing, free Palestine, the river to the sea, and and help break down the things that you're looking for that would help to define that line between something protected by free speech or something that is, as it says here in Brandenburg, v Ohio, calling for imminent lawless action or likely to incite that imminent lawless action. We got three and a half minutes left. Thank you, sir. Um our analysts uh are trained and managed to a privacy policy.
▶ 1:38:41We have a very rigorous pri privacy policy uh at at seen. We are specifically looking for individuals online who are making violent threats to the Jewish community. Not threats, not comments about the Jewish community, but but threats to life. Uh and clearly that uh meets the exemption policy in the first amendment. Real threats are an exemption.
▶ 1:39:12Uh uh attempts to intimidate and create fear are an exemption. So that's exactly what we're doing in the sense of staying true to the constitution and the first amendment but still being effective in identifying individuals. Okay. Intent upon threatening the Jewish community. Thank you, Mr. Sigal. Yeah, I would just say quickly there there are two elements that that we look at. One is, you know, there is completely protected speech that can still be very damaging.
▶ 1:39:42Not because it's immediate, but this is a slow boil. And the more that you dehumanize Jews and Israelis over time, the more that you normalize the type of language that isolates them and encourages people to try to um attack them, the more likely it is possible. So it doesn't mean the speech is illegal, but it means we still need to do something about that and find some counter actions.
▶ 1:40:06The second part real quick, online spaces where a lot of these discussions are starting and that animate what we're seeing in the real world include terrorist organizations being able to share their propaganda, their communicates with a whole host of people around the globe. that may be a space like on Telegram to interrupt some of the language that we know is not only by foreign terrorist organizations but actually is animating that violence.
▶ 1:40:34So I'd like to find a way and I would like to work with any leaders here to find a way to drive a wedge in that space. Thank you Dr. Carfano. The reason why I focus on material support is because it's an action that we absolutely know stops terrorists and public violence and it as you pointed out in the legal opinion there is a bright line there. It is not a free speech issue period.
▶ 1:40:53Can I just make a very quick comment on your last question which was on the the information sharing in state and local because if a 287g program had been in place in Boulder, Colorado, it is very likely that that perpetrator would have been found or removed from the country. There was only actually I think one 287G program. It was in Ter County. It was actually invalidated by the courts because it violated state law. Yeah, it was invalidated by state law directly in 2023 because I debated that state law in the state legislature. Thank you. We got 34 seconds left.
▶ 1:41:22Miss Raymond, I'll be very speedy. Um I want to echo what um Orin said about whether it's permissible or not, we have a responsibility to push back against language and rhetoric that when it seeps into the consciousness um of even some if not all can be dangerous.
▶ 1:41:42um and flag for the the subcommittee a resource from AJC called translate hate that is a visual glossery of anti-semitic terms and tropes that sometimes hide in place plain sight it talks about when they are and when they may not be anti-semitic um and it includes terms like from the river to the sea globalize the antifat happy to provide this and any other resources after the hearing today thank you yield back gentleman's time is expired the chair recognized gentleman from New York Mr. Goldman thank you Mr. Mr.
▶ 1:42:11Chairman, um, as the co-chair of the bipartisan House Anti-semitism Task Force, uh, I think a lot about how to address anti-semitism, uh, and I think one of the most important ways not to address is to make it partisan and to try to, uh, put place more relative blame on one party or another party for I I
▶ 1:42:41will say as uh a member of the Democratic party that those people who uh rhetoric that from the river to the sea, globalize the antifada also in many cases are anti-American and They are not part of the democratic party. They are extremists.
▶ 1:43:05I don't know if they're part of any political party, but I and and many of my colleagues disavow them. They're not part of our party. If you are anti-American and anti-democratic, then you are not part of any party. And I hope we can stop trying to place more blame on one or the other and use it for uh partisan gain or political points. Um Mr. Mr.
▶ 1:43:31Seagull, I want to go back to I I think what's a really really important area uh to discuss, one that I've been focused on for quite a while, and that is uh the rise of anti-semitic uh rhetoric and uh terrorist action or terrorist conduct and rhetoric on social media. Um starting in November of 2023, uh I wrote three uh different letters.
▶ 1:44:00ultimately uh to Speaker Johnson asking for an investigation uh of X because X had been promoting terrorists on its platform notwithstanding its uh rules and conditions.
▶ 1:44:16Now Meta has followed X and has decided not to have any content uh and according to a recent tech transparency project report uh that you can search for and co collate uh pages and pages uh for the ex Islamic state for al-Qaeda by that are automatically generated by Facebook when you just list that terrorist group in uh or
▶ 1:44:47you check in to a terrorist group. Now, Facebook says that it bans Islamic State and al Qaeda and says that its technology is specially trained to detect them, but that's flatly not the case. Tik Tok of course uh has been the well documented to be promoting anti-semitic rhetoric, anti-semitic speech uh and supporting terrorist organizations uh that that preach uh and anti-Israel
▶ 1:45:18uh beliefs. And this is what has the three recent perpetrators of violence. They have been radicalized And I I think your point about figuring out how to uh put a wedge in the social media platforms to prevent the proliferation and the um the promotion
▶ 1:45:48of that content is essential to combating anti-semitism. Um I'm very interested in working with you. You know, I urge the chairman to pick this up because I think that if we do want to address anti-semitism, we have to tackle uh it online because that is unquestionably where people are radicalized right now.
▶ 1:46:14And I guess in the last uh minute or so, if you could just describe some suggestions and recommendations for actions that we could take uh to do that, I'd be grateful. Thank thank you for the the question and we would be delighted to work with your staff on on ways to to move this forward. You know, I think the the the big point here is it's not just the presence of anti-semitism on these platforms.
▶ 1:46:37It's the ability for these platforms to amplify it and for anti-semites to actually monetize those products because of their anti-semitism. Right? I mean, that is even beyond just merely having it show up. And so we need stronger trust and safety uh uh um uh parts of these organizations which have been decimated by some of them.
▶ 1:46:59Um we need to make sure that there are teams that are actually whether it's using automated technologies or human beings like they need to enforce their terms of services, right? I mean they mean it's that simple, right? They have the the regulations, they have the restrictions, they're just not enforcing them, right? And you know, ADL, for example, we have a hate symbols database.
▶ 1:47:24We have all sorts of information that if someone's really looking for anti-semitism and hate, all they have to do is train their algorithms on what we provide, which is publicly available, to identify that hate and then make a dent into those types of uh exploitation of their platforms by anti-semites. But there needs to be a willingness there. They need to want to put people over profits. And frankly, if they're not going to do it on their own, I think government needs to step in and provide an opportunity.
▶ 1:47:54Mr. Chairman, I I appreciate the extra time and I really sincerely hope that we can tackle this issue because it's uh incredibly important on the issue of counterterrorism and anti-semitism. Thank you for the extra time. Gentleman's time has expired. The chair recognizes uh the gentleoman, Miss Pal. Thank you, Mr. chairman and to our ranking member magaziner for holding this very important uh hearing today.
▶ 1:48:19Let me just begin by indicating that clearly the rise of the anti-semitism in the United States and across the world is alarming especially after the October 7th uh terrorist attack the anti-semitism attacks have increased Uh, no one should feel threatened or scared because of who they are. And we must call out anti-semitism each and every time that it rares its ugly head.
▶ 1:48:49Um, today I I want to point out though that President Trump and his administration has cut vital federal programs, funding, and programs that are key in fighting against anti-semitism. these freezes um and cuts must be reversed immediately. It's something I've actually spoken about here in this very committee.
▶ 1:49:13Uh my first question, but I'd like to direct it to um uh to uh I'm sorry, director uh deputy director Sleeper. Let me just make reference to the fact that these nonprofit security grants is a critical federal resource that helps organization at a high risk of terrorism and other extremist attacks improve their physical security and prepare for the myriads uh threats they face
▶ 1:49:44for synagogues, mosque, churches, schools and community centers. uh this program is not only medium to uh is not the only medium to obtain the protections that they need to keep their community safe.
▶ 1:50:00Unfortunately, as I pointed out, to date, the administration has not released any notice of funding opportunity for the fiscal year 2025 or conducted its usual public webinar to help potential applicants understand the uh the the the grant application Nearly a month ago, right here in this room, I pressed Secretary Gnome on when our communities would receive guidance on this critical uh funding.
▶ 1:50:28Unfortunately, she did not give me an answer and here we are today still waiting by the way. So with that uh dire uh deputy director how are the delays in receiving the notice of funding opportunities along with the absence of public facing guidance like the webinar impacting the ability of vulnerable organizations and group to access resources necessary to protect their Thank you.
▶ 1:50:56The nonprofit security grant has and should continue to be an essential component of a comprehensive security strategy to secure Jewish Well, thank you. We obviously know that, but unfortunately I just want to stress the fact that that is still ongoing and not released and that is something that we're all advocating for, but unfortunately that is still uh something that has not happened.
▶ 1:51:24We also re recognize that homegrown uh violent extremists and domestic terrorists pray on our Jewish community. This is why our New Jersey Office of Homeland Security identified attacks from these groups as the highest threat in to New Jersey. But the administration, the Trump administration is redirecting counterterrorism personnel and funds that should be used to fight homegrown domestic uh terrorism.
▶ 1:51:54For example, the FBI field offices across the country has been ordered to reassign agents away from our counterterrorism and counter intelligence. recent uh anti-semitic uh attacks at the Capitol Jewish um museum in Washington DC and in Boulder, Colorado underscore the urgent need to double down on efforts to combat domestic terrorism and simply not walk away from
▶ 1:52:24them. So with that said, uh Mr. Sego, how how does redirecting once again the federal uh resources from the homegrown extremists and domestic uh terrorists uh affects the safety and security of the Jewish community? It affects the safety and security of the Jewish community.
▶ 1:52:44We need to seize this moment now when the Jewish community is in a crisis of violence and anti-Semitic incidents targeting the Jewish community to make sure that we are using every opportunity to uplift invest in not contract funding in those entities that will help protect the Jewish community.
▶ 1:53:05So, I know I have five seconds, but let me just say I hope that you are sharing that thought and uh making that statement to the front office, the uh the White House, so that these funds can do exactly what you're talking about and advocating making sure to protect that because that is not The general ladies, I back chairman, thank you so very much. I'm sorry uh for mispronouncing your name, Mrs. Poe, earlier.
▶ 1:53:32Um I'll now recognize ranking member for a very brief uh closing statement and I'll follow as well. So again I want to thank the chairman for calling a hearing on this absolutely essential topic. Thank our witnesses for doing an excellent job today and coming I think with a very thoughtful and also productive approach to this hearing and giving us some good recommendations that we should absolutely consider and act on. Um look, a lot's been said already. Um I'll just say it again.
▶ 1:54:00I think both in Congress and from the administration, when it comes to combating violent anti-semitism, we need not just rhetoric, but also resources. Um, that is important and it cannot be overstated. So, I'm going to continue to fight for those resources.
▶ 1:54:17I hope and I expect that we'll have bipartisan support in that effort and that we will all continue to find the inspiration to call out anti-semitic hate wherever it exists that we will continue to work together to meet this moment that we're in and uh combat the culture of hate that unfortunately has taken root across much of our society. Um, I'll end.
▶ 1:54:46I I open by referencing uh President Washington's visit to the Turo Synagogue in Newport, Rhode Island. It was an important signal uh 235 years ago from our first president that he wanted our country to be a place that was welcoming to all faiths and particularly uh uh the Jewish faith. And uh the building still stands. If you ever find yourselves in Rhode Island, I encourage you to visit it.
▶ 1:55:12It's it's quite moving and In advance of his visit, he wrote a letter to the congregation that I'll quote from and from now. Uh, and hopefully his words can inspire us as it inspired Americans in his time. He wrote, quote, "May the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in this land continue to merit and enjoy the goodwill of the other inhabitants, while everyone shall sit safety sit in safety under his own vine and fig tree, and there shall be none to make him afraid.
▶ 1:55:42May the father of all mercies scatter light and not darkness in our paths and make all of us in our vocations useful here and in his own due time and way everlastingly happy. With that, I'll yield back. I think the ranking member um and I think our witnesses agree with the ranking member on a thoughtful dialogue today with recommendations that are very helpful. Um and I I'll note as an observation that there is a movement in our country to stifle free speech.
▶ 1:56:13Uh it's real. Uh it is happening in many different places. It's happening in universities. It's happening um in fact in the last administration uh with the the thought of a disinformation board to be run by this department, the Homeland Security Department. A horrible idea.
▶ 1:56:34Um, and so we balance the safety and security of our citizens uh with free speech and this is a hard thing and and the testimony that we've heard from each of you has been very helpful to balance that. Um, and when protected speech turns into violence, when it turns into the threat of violence, when it turns into uh the inciting of violence um is where we cross over that threshold and we will struggle with that here.
▶ 1:57:03I'm very glad to hear my colleague from New York uh talk about those who have made um horribly not just uh but false and violent statements um from one party or another. In the case I I believe that my colleague from New York was referring to those in his own party. Um, and we do need to call out those who are making egregious and what can be referred to as uh inciting violent type of statements.
▶ 1:57:33Um, I don't think it's just funding. I do think we need funding, but it's not just funding. It's policy. It's it's a willingness. It's the political will to stand up to an anti-semitic mindset that unfortunately has permeated our society. It's a willingness to prosecute in places that are not upholding law and order.
▶ 1:57:57And whether it's an anti-ICE protest that turns violent or it's an anti-semitic protest that turns violent, it's an unwillingness to prosecute those that is way more important than any sort of funding could ever be. And I think we know this because not a single law changed, not a single amount of funding changed and the border immediately became secure.
▶ 1:58:19So yes, we will work on funding where we need it and I agree with the ranking member that where we can put good resources to use, we will. But what I'd really like to call on is and if this is equally across the spectrum a problem as has been testified to today, which I'm not sure that I believe that, but if it is, then I hope that we will be able to call it out because right now we do see an ideology that has permeated in a far-left mentality that
▶ 1:58:49has attracted thousands of people. And and I hope that I can count on the Riking member to call that out. and if and when we find out that there is an ideology that is associated with uh the other side that we can do the same. Um I think the safety and of the Jewish community has been threatened.
▶ 1:59:12I'm glad that we're holding this hearing to figure out some of the facts with more research to be done to understand where legislation can be helpful and what we need to do to take the next steps because this isn't a bipartisan issue. This is a nonpartisan issue. It's not just the Jewish community. It's every community that could be targeted in one way or another. And we have to we 100% have to recognize that.
▶ 1:59:40right now it is the Jewish community that's being targeted and that's unacceptable. So I I thank the ranking member uh and the members who joined this hearing. Uh I thank our witnesses um and commit to continuing to combat this and continuing to find good solutions. I want to um acknow and and say to the members of the subcommittee that if you have additional questions for the witnesses, we would ask the witnesses to respond to those in writing.
▶ 2:00:10Pursuant to our committee rules 7E, the hearing record will be open for the next 10 days and without objection, the subcommittee stands adjourned.