▶ 0:00:12Go ahead. Mic check. Test one 1212. How house recordings? Okay, thanks.
▶ 0:12:47Test test test. Good.
▶ 0:16:54The committee will come to order and without objection the chair may declare recess at any time and good morning everyone and thank you for being here and I want to thank the witnesses for being here. Now before we begin I want to take a moment to pause and think about the service members stationed throughout the the Middle East right now. Um I alongside uh some of our colleagues just returned from a visit with our service members that were deployed uh overseas in Spain.
▶ 0:17:24Um whenever I'm met with these men and women uh it always return and I always return home with the assurance that one we have the best and most capable military in the world and two the people that do that are some of the best people in the world. Um while we were in Spain um we were going to uh visit and see the destroyers that were located there.
▶ 0:17:53They had all shipped out. Um, matter of fact, one of them, uh, it reminded me of what it was like to be a young person in the military, uh, there at, um, at the, um, reception area in the airport, was a volunteer, and she and her husband, uh, had just, this was their first duty station in Spain.
▶ 0:18:17And um I came we came in and her husband when they deploy those cruisers normally it is uh about 4 months to four and a half months out. Her husband had came back in and 48 hours went right back out. So she was learning what it was like to be a military spouse as well as him understanding what it was like to to be and and be in the military.
▶ 0:18:45So if we want to if you would just remember them all in your prayers uh and make sure that you ask for the Lord to keep them all safe no matter what their duty is. But today we're going to focus on the importance of the TAP or transition assistant program or TAP and broader themes of service members transition experience.
▶ 0:19:06A service member's transition begins during the last year of their active During TAP, a service member is required to go to classes hosted by DoD, DO, and VA. The goal of TAP is to set each service member up for success in civilian life regardless of their role in the military.
▶ 0:19:33Now, that means whether you're a young corporal or a three star general, TAP should offer the personalized assistance service members need to thrive. My staff knows that I always make this statement and I'll make it again now, so it's in my in my script here, but I'm going to add a little to it. You know, when I was a Marine when and I went through there was a tap program and the tap program was whenever the colonel tapped you on the shoulder and said goodbye, have a great life.
▶ 0:20:02The other tap program was when you got with your buddies the last time and you hit the tap at the bar. Other than that, that was the tap programs that were However, thanks to former members of this committee and the this committee as a whole, we've done a lot of work to make the program um mandatory and improve outcomes to find what works for our veterans.
▶ 0:20:29This is not to say there is still prog that progress doesn't still need to be made. Matter of fact, a lot of progress still needs to be made. Even after signify uh significant legislation, only 52% of service members meet the one-year TAP timeline I believe that 52 should not be counted as a success, but as a failure.
▶ 0:20:57Additionally, research from Pennsylvania State University Veterans Metric uh initiative shows that more than 60% of veterans are either unemployed or In many cases, this is due to poor transition.
▶ 0:21:14Finally, nearly 20% of veterans do not feel like they are fully transitioned until six years after leaving the military I also believe we must view TAP and transition as a vitally import vitally important uh to the to all volunteer and an unsuccessful transition
▶ 0:21:44can impact public view of how we treat our military members which can impact our nation's security by the fact that in all voluntary service people are not encouraged to volunteer. Clearly, there is more work to be done by this committee and by the community uh to fill the gaps.
▶ 0:22:02In front of us today are innovators in the transition These groups have unique programs and forwardthinking technologies that have helped make thousands of service members transition to veteran status better. Now, without these organizations, veterans will continue to slip through the cracks, and VA will always be playing catch-up to get these veterans back in the groove of civilian life.
▶ 0:22:33Under President Trump leadership, I know we are going to put you, the veterans, VA services, back at the center of the VA mission. And I hope to hear from these groups about the broader solution that Congress can take back the and get legislation that will boost our TAP program.
▶ 0:22:55Many of these themes are already included in my my friend subcommittee chairman uh Derek Van Orton's bill HR 3387. So with that, I want to welcome the witnesses and look forward to your testimony. And I now recognize the ranking member Takano for his opening cere opening statement. I haven't done opening ceremonies in a while. If you want to do them, go ahead. Uh thank you, Chairman Bost.
▶ 0:23:24Uh I appreciate your opening comments about keeping our service members in our thoughts and prayers. And I would ask that uh that all here and all who are watching the hearing uh keep uh uh my committee staffers uh who are service members uh uh who are in who are currently deployed. Uh Chris Bennett uh he is he actually saw and witnessed the u uh the cutter bombing.
▶ 0:23:54Uh I believe he's in Cutter. Uh Matt Reel is in the theater. I'm not exactly sure where he is. my staff director. So, I appreciate your sentiment, Mr. Chairman. I I appreciate this committee's continued focus on service member transition. Uh the period of transition is oftentimes the hardest period for veterans to navigate.
▶ 0:24:18This committee was the driving force behind the 2019 National Defense Authorization Acts improvements to the Transition Assistance Program or TAP. The improvements included offering transitioning service members more tailored courses and information. However, much of that law is still not implemented and many more improvements are needed to make sure veterans leave the military with a job, a plan for their education, or whatever resources they need for a smooth transition.
▶ 0:24:48Failure to do so can have catastrophic Studies continue to find correlations between difficulties in transition and suicides. The more difficulty a service member has during their transition period, the more likely they are to have suicidal ideiations.
▶ 0:25:07If this administration is serious about reducing veteran suicide rates, it is critical we get the period of transition This committee has treated uh transition with the seriousness it deserves having held seven hearings at the subcommittee level or full committee level over the last five years.
▶ 0:25:29However, the Veterans Affairs Committee is only one part of the story which also includes the Armed Services Committee as well as the Department of Defense and Veterans Affairs. Over the same five years, our counterparts on the House Armed Services Committee have yet to hold a similar hearing. However, because of where transition was originally written into federal code, our committee only has secondary referral and jurisdiction of this topic.
▶ 0:25:57As we see from the witnesses before us, none of the federal agencies responsible for a transition is before us. In fact, I asked that the Secretary of Defense or his designate to testify before us today. But last week, the Department of Defense abruptly refused to participate in this hearing after previously committing to appear.
▶ 0:26:19This cancellation came just days after Secretary Collins and Secretary Hexath signed a memorandum of understanding titled Strengthening Our Partnership to Those Who Serve. a memo that was not provided to the committee but rather we received from our VSO partners. Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent that thisou be included in the hearing record. Without objection.
▶ 0:26:44Now, this this hearing would have been a perfect opportunity for DoD and VA to present to the committee how their proposal to collaborate on sharing healthc care resources will work and to provide us with the details on how they plan to address VA enrollment during transition.
▶ 0:27:03Now, I've been working for years to pass my legislation, the EVEst Act, which would charge VA healthc care enrollment from an opt excuse me, would change which would change VA uh healthcare enrollment from an optin process to an opt out, meaning you're automatically enrolled in VA when you transition out of the military.
▶ 0:27:29Now, if theou is to be believed, the administration shares this view, and I'd like to hear more. It's just too bad they're not here. Finally, if DoD was here, we could learn how it plans to identify transitioning service members who may be at higher risk from mental health challenges. Now, it is impossible to mention DoD's absence and not think about the unconstitutional air strikes in Iran ordered by President Trump over the weekend.
▶ 0:27:59Congress was not provided any justification for these strikes. Congress did not vote on an authorization of military force and the public only learned about the strikes from president's on the president's personallyowned failing niche social network website. This Congress is choosing to give up its responsibility as a co-equal branch of government and that will have grave consequences. We are in the middle of an unprecedented constitutional crisis.
▶ 0:28:27There are no federal agencies here before us from which to demand accountability. What disservice are we doing to service members at this moment when they are called upon to this in this unprecedented and dangerous time? How can we respond to the transition needs? As the economy continues to spiral and we face massive threats to the programs and services on which service members and veterans and their families depend.
▶ 0:28:53None of our agency partners found it worth their time to come today and my Republican colleagues do not think it worthwhile to invite them. So where does that leave us? We are left holding a hearing on a legally mandated program that our committee lacks primary jurisdiction of. I appreciate the witnesses that are here today to share their work, but their service but service members and veterans should not be left depending on charitable donations to foundations for their postsepparation needs.
▶ 0:29:23Nor should they depend on the for-profit industry to navigate their earned benefits. Unfortunately, the lack of participation of the Trump Department of Defense, the Trump labor department of labor, and the Trump VA is indicative of the goal of this administration.
▶ 0:29:40Hollowing out federal agencies, firing workers, shifting respons and shifting responsibility of the mission of VA and DoD onto individual veterans where nonprofit entities are squeezed and overwhelmed, and where claim sharks and scammers rush in to take advantage.
▶ 0:29:57Now, this is unacceptable and this committee should not stand by and accept playing second fiddle on this issue and we certainly shouldn't accept a hearing on a federal program without the responsible federal agencies being present. Failures at transition become responsibilities for VA, VSOs, and other stakeholders. And solving a crisis is always more expensive and less successful than preventing one.
▶ 0:30:23For example, preventing homelessness with supportive housing costs one-third of what it does to house a chronically homeless person. Investing in quality education instead of allowing for-profit predatory schools to recruit veterans would save the federal government and veterans billions of dollars in wasted GI Bill benefits.
▶ 0:30:44Translating career skills gained during military service into quality employment would save tens of millions of dollars in unemployment benefits paid by the Department of Defense. Now, these are goals I believe every member of this committee agrees with. So, I put it to my colleagues, does this committee deserve better than being ignored by VA by DoD? Uh, does this committee deserve better than being ignored by DoD on such a critical issue like transition? Mr.
▶ 0:31:13Chairman, DoD's absence is unacceptable and I ask you to join me in delivering that message. I also ask you to join me in petitioning our respective leadership about updating House rules to put the responsibility of transition where it belongs with the House Veterans Affairs Committee, our committee. And with that, I yield back. Before we go on to the witnesses, you know, I want to say I find it funny now that the Republicans are in the White House.
▶ 0:31:40Suddenly, there's a concern that the Secretary of Defense and the Department of Defense is not available for hearings. Under Secretary Lloyd Austin and the Biden administration, DoD had the reputation of not showing up for hearings at all. If the ranking member did not have issue with the last Congress, I don't see the ranking member should have issue at this time. The Congress under President Trump's leadership and the department has already been to two economic opportunities subcommittee hearings.
▶ 0:32:07To me that seems like a partisan exercise that wanted to get real with the answers from DoD and responding like that. I also find it surprising that the ranking members should bring up this frankly one the secretary right now has pretty big issues in the Middle East. We both agree that we need to pray for those men and women because we talked about that.
▶ 0:32:31But I do also find it funny now that uh with the Republicans in the White House, suddenly there's a concern for our colleagues about how VA is being run. During the Obama administration, VA grew uh consider uh grew considerably. Um and this is not only from the number of veterans, but from the programs being created and reforms by the Congress and the administration.
▶ 0:32:55During those eight years, the Obama administration dropped over 92,000 bombs in the Middle East. Now, after one strike to prevent an adversary from having nuclear weapons, some people in this room think VA should halt any changes to making the agency work better or believe that VA needs additional That's ridiculous.
▶ 0:33:23If there is a conflict in the Middle East, veterans will need VA working for them instead of bureaucracy more than That is why over 75 million Americans elected President Trump.
▶ 0:33:36That is also exactly why what Secretary Collins has appointed has why he's been appointed by the president and what his intention is is to do the job of the VA for our veterans be as they trans and now we want to talk about why they're transitioning and how they're transitioning and how we make that So testifying before us we have Mr.
▶ 0:34:00Mannanish uh Gupta, Chief Technical Officer at Combined Arms, Mr. Ross Dickman, Chief Executive Officer of Higher Heroes USA, Mr. Joseph Joseph Lumis, founder and chief executive officer of Turbo Vets, and Miss Rebecca Bergus, a senior fellow at Yorktown Institute.
▶ 0:34:28Will the witnesses please stand and raise their right hand? Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to provide is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the Thank you. Let the record reflect uh that the witnesses answered in the affirmative. You may be seated. I now ask Mr. uh Guptra uh for five minute opening testimony if you please.
▶ 0:34:57Chairman, Ranking Member, and distinguished members of the committee. Thank you for inviting Combined Arms to testify and for your unwavering commitment to our veterans. Combined Arms is a nonprofit technology company that empowers veterans and military families with access to vetted veteran sources service organizations through our innovative SAS platform. As the chief technology officer of Combined Arms, I lead a network that harnesses advanced technology to strengthen veterans transitions.
▶ 0:35:28Our platform spans all 50 states, integrating 650 vetted organizations that provide over 1500 available social services, including housing, job, healthcare services, and When joining combined arms, veterans complete secure profiles detailing service history, skills, and wellness needs, enabling personalized support pathways to match them to resources.
▶ 0:35:59Veterans are able to select services such as job training or mental health support using filters by location and category. We also provide real-time analytics that tracks delivery and accountability of services. Our pilot with USO will engage with active duty 18 months pre-trans pre-eparation. Our innovative data strategy streamline access to essential help delivering an Amazon shopping cart style approach to navigate social services.
▶ 0:36:29We are proud to serve over 85,000 veterans and military families across the country connecting them to thousands of social The transition assistance program or TAP which is a result of inter agency partnership across the federal government provides information, tools and training to ensure service members and their families are prepared to enter the civilian life. TAP is a vital bridge to connecting veterans to civilian resources.
▶ 0:36:56With enhanced collaboration from Department of Defense, veteran affairs and labor, combined arms platform could serve as a force multiplier for TAP. Our closed loop data powered digital marketplace can significantly enhance TAP's ability to deliver seamless personalized support to service members. For example, DoD collaboration could provide early service data allowing TAP to tailor pre-eparation career and benefit plans.
▶ 0:37:25VA integration could accelerate benefit access linking veterans to healthcare and or education support. DL partnerships could enhance job pipelines integrating programs like Skillbridge to boost employment Our platform is equipped with provider interfaces featuring case management, inter agency referrals, digitized forms and ADA 508 compliance and has been endorsed by the VA and George W.
▶ 0:37:55Bush Institute. We recommend standardized VA leaison's flexible policies for community innovations like mentorship and national community of practice. Our digital hub could enable tap stakeholders to share best practices leveraging over 220,000 strong audience reach to drive continuous improvement. Our platform can strengthen TAP's outcome measurements, employment, mental health and civilian satisfaction.
▶ 0:38:25We provide advanced analytics which facilitate over 14,000 careers placements since 2020 and layer client data with public metrics to generate county level heat maps identifying service gaps in rural or unserved areas with DoD VA and do data sharing. TAP could accommodate resources, track long-term well-being, ensuring adaptability to veterans evolving needs and as recognized by the VA.
▶ 0:38:56These analytics empower datadriven decisions, optimizing TAP's effectiveness across diverse western communities. To realize this vision, Combined Arms recommends Congress fund technology integration with TAP platform, leveraging VA systems for costefficient personalized support, enhanced VALE task force to standardize collaboration and integration, private sector networks, and support pilot programs to test these solutions with metrics tracking
▶ 0:39:26employment and In conclusion, with robust DoD, VA, and DL collaboration, combined armed platforms could serve as a force multiplier for TAP, revolutionizing veteran transitions through technology. We stand ready to partner with this committee and stakeholders to build a future where every service member thrives. Thank you, and I welcome your Thank you, Mr. Goodman. Mr. Dixon, you are recognized for five minutes for your opening statement.
▶ 0:39:57Chairman Bost, Ranking Member Takano, and members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify on improving outcomes for veterans and transitioning service members. I'm Ross Dickman, CEO of Higher Heroes USA, the nation's leading nonprofit focused on veterans and military spouse employment.
▶ 0:40:15We serve over 25,000 clients every year, primarily transitioning service members, veterans, and members of the Garden Reserve, offering personalized one-on-one support to help them achieve meaningful and lasting careers after service. The transition from military to civilian life is more than a single moment. It's a process, one that can take years and looks different for everyone. Multiple factors contribute to the transition and the unique circumstances surrounding a service member's um experience.
▶ 0:40:45Though rank often serves as a key indicator of success. The American Enterprise Institute's April 2025 report spotlighted that junior enlisted veterans face the most challenges post service, including high unemployment, poor economic outcomes, and low utilization of existing services. This highlights a clear need. We must move beyond a one-sizefits-all approach to one that is responsive to the different experiences, challenges, and goals of each veteran.
▶ 0:41:14While helpful for broad awareness and education of benefits, the transition assistance program's current structure is not optimal for individualized employment success. Last year's RAND report and a similar GAO report a year earlier determined that nonprofit organizations fill a critical gap to supplement federal transition programs. Of the 13 billion the government spends annually to support transition services.
▶ 0:41:41Approximately 97% of funds are spent on education despite career support being the number one requested service. Allow me to offer three areas of concern that deserve congressional action. First, outcomes must matter more than outputs. Success cannot be measured solely by tap course completion or number of attendees. Many veterans are undermployed in roles that don't reflect their skills, experience, or leadership potential.
▶ 0:42:0961% of veterans report undermployment 3 years post separation, and that number barely budges after six years. These numbers signal that we must redefine a successful transition Second, skills-based hiring must be elevated and incentivized. Many veterans possess advanced experience and leadership capabilities that don't align with traditional degree requirements, but make them highly competitive and qualified for in- demand roles.
▶ 0:42:38At Higher Heroes USA, we help veterans articulate and validate these transferable skills to employers. But broader adoption of skills-based practices supported by federal incentives could dramatically increase access to meaningful employment. Third, public private partnerships are successful and they work. Federal programs like TAP are foundational, but their structure limits the level of personalization. That's where nonprofits like ours come in.
▶ 0:43:05As an original partner of the Department of Labor's employment navigator and partnership program, Higher Heroes USA has delivered faster and more sustainable employment outcomes for thousands of veterans. These results are made possible by highquality nonprofit partners who deliver these services at no cost to veterans and without compensation from the federal government. This model is not sustainable.
▶ 0:43:28Based on these concerns, we recommend the following to improve veteran transition to civilian First, we encourage Congress to prioritize individualized solutions and federal transition programs. Concerted efforts should be made to focus on service delivery during the two years immediately following separation from service and on the promising practice of skills-based hiring. Second, outcome measures must align in the public and private sectors.
▶ 0:43:54Metrics like underemployment, skills utilization, and long-term financial security must be part of the equation. Lastly, we urge Congress to incentivize long-term sustainable participation of of nonprofits in these programs through contractual agreements and competitive grants. Private organizations relying on philanthropic support have mitigated TAP shortcomings, but declining resources jeopardized the private sector's continued sustainment of individualized employment programs.
▶ 0:44:24Veterans deserve a transition system that reflects the realities of today's labor market. One that empowers them with the tools, guidance, and opportunities to build the futures they've earned. We look forward to working with Congress to improve this system to benefit all veterans and military spouses. Thank you for the opportunity uh to be here today and for your leadership on this issue. I welcome your questions. Thank you, Mr. Bigman. Mr. Luton, you are recognized for five minutes to open your opening statement.
▶ 0:44:52Chairman Bose, ranking members and distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to speak with you. My name is Joseph Lumis. I'm the Navy veteran and the founder of Turbo Vets and CEO, a veteran focused technology company committed to improving how service members and veterans apply and access all their benefits and services at no cost for the entirety of their lives.
▶ 0:45:14Over the past 20 years, I've been I have led innovation in cyber security, advanced technology, building companies that solve complex problems and challenges, including systems integrations in many of the agencies. At Turbo Vets, our mission is to close the gap between policy and technology, ensuring that service members as well as veterans experience a streamlined, supportive uh successful transition from civilian into civilian life beyond and life beyond service.
▶ 0:45:42The current transition assistance program is obviously outdated and insufficient in addressing actual needs of the dynamics of a service member. Despite the efforts of dedicated agencies, the structure often leaves military service members without clarity, relevant instruction, support, and resources. Like many veterans, I also experienced firsthand challenges in navigating the maze of the disconnected The process felt like more death-like power death by PowerPoint and the the consequences are much more significant.
▶ 0:46:13Today we are seeing a rising rates of unemployment, financial hardship, mental health crisis, increased homelessness, as well in the veteran community. Most concerning of all, we continue to lose more than 6,000 veterans to suicide each year. This is not just a number. It's a call in action to why my team and I started Turbo Vets. A problem that we saw we are solving today with the Department of Veteran Affairs and the Department of Defense.
▶ 0:46:37TAP can be and must be reimaged into a long-term personalized journey rooted in the trust and capability and support. The transformation requires public private that integrates both technology at every stage of the service members transition process, but it also is more than just briefings. It's more than just learning and continuous uh statements that were made by command leadership.
▶ 0:47:02It's tailored tools and podcasts, relevant video instruction, personal mentorship, transparency, and real-time products. We must envision a secure centralized platform, a true one-stop that is similar to the evolution of technology A system that allows online resumes, job building, uh connections to nonprofits like my witnesses here today.
▶ 0:47:25The platform must seamlessly integrate into government systems with providing real-time data, automating eligibility verifications, eliminating fraud, uh protecting veterans from claim sharks and other organizations, leveraging their benefits un unbeknownst to their eligibility. The vision is the foundation upon what we built Turbo Vets. It's a veteranled team uses. We use AI automation system integrations from our previous experiences in building companies.
▶ 0:47:54We were partnered with the agencies in order to solve this problem together. Technology can no longer be a luxury anymore. It's a necessity to integrate and exist in the world today. My team and I, as well as my fellow Americans, owe our veterans not just gratitude, but effective modern solutions that deliver meaningful outcomes. It's our duty to serve for those who served us. And I've committed my life to partnering government agencies to fulfill this responsibility.
▶ 0:48:19I'm confident that with the leadership of the VA and DoD and a collaboration with Turbo Vets, we will build that outcome and success we seek today. Thank you for the opportunity to share this vision. I look forward to working ahead in the chance and take anyone questions. Thank you, Mr. Lumis, Miss Burgers, you are recognized for five minutes for your opening statement. Chairman Boss, Ranking Member Tano, and distinguished members of this committee. For 250 years, every branch of the US Armed Forces has had one consistent output, the military veteran.
▶ 0:48:48And yet for 250 years, our nation has never articulated a national veteran strategy. Not even when we returned to our voluntary service roots in 1973 did we recognize the importance of the welltransition veteran for the sustained success of the AVF. This failure to what to ask what it might take society to sustain a volunteer professional military is rooted in the failure to understand there is a life cycle to military recruitment that both begins and ends with the veteran. The veteran is the unagnowledged but permanent ambassador of national service.
▶ 0:49:17How we treat them, talk about them, legislate about them directly relates to how society conceptualizes military service. Perhaps we come to this failure honestly. We have separated our department of defense from our department of veteran affairs. That physical structural breaking apart has resulted in a mental breaking apart, especially among those employed in the defense department, treating soldiers as national security concerns, but veterans as vanishing into the either of someone else's domestic policy concern.
▶ 0:49:44Our first need then is to recognize that any failed reintegration of a veteran is a discouragement against joining the Army, Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force, Space Force, or Coast Guard. Every successful reintegration is equally an incentive to join.
▶ 0:49:57The several service branches and their secretaries and DoD at large must be brought to recognize that it has a vested interest in the successful reintegration of each veteran after their active or reserve duty is completed and in the nation having a coherent, modernized, effective, and efficient suite of programs and services to make up that transition process.
▶ 0:50:16Two concrete steps to take in this regard are to reestablish the chairman's office of reintegration, thereby returning DoD leadership to the transition process while signaling to all stakeholders that transition outcomes are crucial to the sustainment of the AVF. Second, perhaps this step would finally trigger the armed services committees of both House and Senate to hold joint hearings with those of Veterans Affairs. Around 200,000 service members exit the military every year, having access to some 45,000 registered nonprofit veteran service organizations.
▶ 0:50:46Numerous VA benefits such as the post 911 GI Bill, DoD Skillbridge apprenticeship and immersive career programs and corporate hiring initiatives. Most of these services and programs have come about haphazardly. The result is that the current institutional framework governing the scope of challenges affecting veterans remains far too desperate, reactive, and administratively marginalized. Survey after survey consistently reveals that the number one source of stress and anxiety for veterans they themselves identify is about knowing where and how to navigate these benefits.
▶ 0:51:17We know that transition is both an event and a process taking up to 10 years for some individuals. Generally speaking, the first 90 days are crucial, but the bulk of the reintegrating work occurs in the initial two-year period after receiving one's DD2 and 4. Though significant numbers of at least post 911 veterans have felt that they were not entirely fully transitioned at even 6.5 years after service. The Veterans Metrics Initiative have identified seven domains that are critical to success in transition.
▶ 0:51:44Employment, education, finances, legal security, social connections, and physical and mental health. Furthermore, we know that our junior enlisted women and minority veterans are facing the steepest post service challenges which are exacerbated by low utilization of existing employment services. Explanations for why include the current fragmentation of the veteran support system. But further insight continues to elude us because of a lack of data transparency and a lack of data about veterans.
▶ 0:52:11Simply enhanced data sharing among the DoD, VA and other entities is essential. Connecting the VA DoD identity repository database and information available from the Social Security Administration specific to payroll information at the zip code level would go a far way toward enabling a better delivery of resources targeted to regions of the country with enduring economic challenges. The majority of VA programs appear only to measure outputs rather than in outcomes.
▶ 0:52:40This leaves us in the dark about whether the billions of dollars that are annually allocated for these programs are accomp accomplishing anything other than smoke signals. Any funding would therefore be directed to the programs that effectively improve veteran outcomes and have concrete evidence of the same. Similarly, neither VA nor Congress have articulated any key performance indicators to measure key transition goals. The result is there is no standardized set of outcomes and impact measures for veteran serving programs.
▶ 0:53:07Mandating evidence-based funding and third-party oversight to ensure alignment with measurable goals via implementing a veterans impact dashboard would allow for the tracking of the effectiveness of any of the investments in support programs for government delivered and nonprofit and private organizations that receive federal dollars. In conclusion, what we need for an improved transition from soldier to civilian is not more programs or more money, but better coordination, data sharing, and outcome measurement of existing programs and initiatives.
▶ 0:53:34We are 52, if not 250 years behind in examining and understanding the dynamics that exist between our society, our government, and our military branches in order to sustain an entirely volunteer military. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. B. I want to say thank you to all the witnesses. And the written statement of all the witnesses will be entered into the hearing record. And we're now going to go to questions and I recognize myself for five minutes.
▶ 0:54:05Uh, Mr. uh, Gupta, Combined Arms has over 312 member organizations and has successfully made 85,000 military connections. What is the biggest gap you see from the TAP program that transition service members need from combined arms? Thank you for the question, sir.
▶ 0:54:29uh combined arms focus continues to be supporting the veterans and the military families and part of the taps transition program. The biggest gap we have seen is the early intervention in making awareness of how nonprofits programs like ours platform like combined arms can support that transition into civilian life.
▶ 0:54:47translating their skills, the experiences in a translatable civilian job profile manner and helping them find the resources and services they need in a very unified single open door policy where they don't have to think or worry what the next step step of support might structure might look like. So what have you uh what feedback have you received from the companies that hire through combined arms?
▶ 0:55:14uh what do you hear from them uh that they need when hiring veterans? So veterans have identified the corporate structure lacks the awareness and the discipline to guide the transition uh the transition to civilian in terms of translation of their benefits offered by the government and a available to them through their GI bills. That's the biggest gap in the overall administration on how they move forward and receive the resources and the care they need. Thank you Miss Bergus.
▶ 0:55:43In one of the your articles, you discussed the broken veteran narrative. What can Congress do to reverse this narrative and especially when it comes to transition? Thank you very much for that question. I believe that actually the tone of of congressional legislation can help us nationally uh reverse that broken veteran narrative. So, in other words, most of our legislation historically has always taken a kind of victim aspect, looking at the needs and the wants um and the potential hurts um of of veterans.
▶ 0:56:13If we could flip that narrative where we are we are encasing the language in which we identify bills as veterans as social assets that need particular particular programs that will um lift them up rather than social deficits. I think this could go a very large way towards changing the veteran narrative um at that national level.
▶ 0:56:34I think the frustration that we see with this committee and I've expressed it to other members uh many times from from this committee and that is the fact that we quite often always have to deal with you know what are we going to do to get physically and mentally straightened out. Painting a picture that all veterans are broken and all veterans are not broken. They're the best employers that you could have. they're going to show up for to to work on time. Uh once you give them a mission set, they're going to accomplish that mission because that's what they're used to.
▶ 0:57:03And we need to focus, I think, more on that to make sure that people know and understand that. Do you agree? Absolutely. And if I could add, um I think something we've not looked at nationally is to try and understand veteran transition. If it is about a 10-year process, how does that compare to the civilian transition from college and the identity that you create um in college to those first years in the professional world? We all we all probably went through it. It was a very um you know, unsettling time.
▶ 0:57:31What is unique to the veteran and what is unique, you know, just to young adults taking on a new new identity and sense of purpose? Mr. Dickman. Uh, what ch uh challenges do junior enlisted veterans face during transition compared to Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman, for that question. Uh, junior listed service members face some of the largest barriers in terms of their relative uh perceived inexperience, their uh overwhelming lack of degrees.
▶ 0:58:00Um most junior enlisted service members uh almost a 20% differential from civilian uh job seekers don't have a bachelor's degree which impacts them in their career search. They also struggle to connect through like a no wrong door policy into organizations that can help them with the right coaching to leverage the experience they do have them in the military and the skills that they do have that translate immediately to direct hiring action.
▶ 0:58:27When that's done well and that they are supported from someone that understands their experience, they do tend to use more services. Um, within our organization, they use about 2.7 services compared to other um, clients of ours and they get hired very well using technical skills, but it takes time to help them translate that and find the right pathways. So, are there other groups? I mean, obviously the difference between a junior enlisted and officer, it's just maturity and everything like that.
▶ 0:58:56someone who was in the military. Are there other unique areas of certain people coming out with different non-skll sets or whatever that we could look at? There certainly are. Uh, Mr. Chairman, I mean, we we look at women veterans have uh unique struggles as well in terms of leveraging their experience and networks appropriately.
▶ 0:59:15Um, we also see uh and don't want to minimize the challenges that military spouses face and their career search and the impact that has on the sustainment of the service members participation as an active duty service member. Um, but junior enlisted from our research, we've been doing this for 20 years as far as delivering service interventions. That's the group that has the had the most consistent struggles in obtaining equitable employment after service. Thank you very much. My time is expired and I now recognize the ranking member. Thank you. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 0:59:46Mr. Chairman, in your rejoinder uh uh in your remarks about uh uh the role of DoD, I just want to point out that I actually think uh you actually made my argument that uh DoD is not here. The argument is that they're busy, but even when they're not busy, um you know, DoD has not made transition services a priority regardless of which party is in control.
▶ 1:00:11So, uh, you know, I would just submit to you, uh, that the energy and the bipartisanship behind ideas to move transition forward has come from this committee and we shouldn't have to do it through the NDAA. And so I would just enjoy request that you join me uh in going to our respective leaderships and ask for this change because I would rather have changes to taps uh come straight from all of us here.
▶ 1:00:40I I see you nodding yes. Uh and uh so I'm I'm not calling out Pete Huggth on this particular issue. Uh I just say I'm just uh think that uh the talent and energy from this committee on a bipartisan basis would be better channeled if we if we had the jurisdiction. So with that I'm going to ask my question to uh first question to Miss Burgess.
▶ 1:01:03Um uh last month with no explanation Congress, VA and DoD announced a memorandum of understanding strengthening our partnership uh in service to those who serve. And while DoD was asked to attend this hearing to explain thisou, they declined testifying. My question for you is regarding the automatic enrollment into VA healthcare. My legislation, EVEst requires automatic VA enrollment during transition, changing an optin to an opt out.
▶ 1:01:32How would this shift service members? How would this shift uh serve service members and veterans? Am I understanding you correctly? Your question is how would it shift the narrative, the public perception of the vet? Well, how would this shift to an opt um an opt out, meaning you're automatically enrolled in VA uh from an opt in where you have to go and sign up for VA?
▶ 1:01:59How would that how would that shift uh serve service members and veterans? I think it would help many of the veterans who are uh who assume that they are automatically enrolled. Um, this is a a point of interest maybe to many veterans or to those who serve veterans. Many veterans don't understand that it's not an automatic process and it comes as a shock to them.
▶ 1:02:20Um, sometimes after the process, if they were already automatically enrolled, it would take out potentially some of the stress um of of those the first 90 days or the first two years of trying to scramble after they already need a service and getting into a hole of service. So, you know, if we have 200,000 veterans a year transitioning from military into civilian life, um, and they were all automatically enrolled, um, that would mean VA could stay in touch with them.
▶ 1:02:46Um, they could make sure that they knew about programs that VA had, uh, to reduce the stressors of that transition. Um, you know, employment programs, training programs, uh, health programs, etc. Um it also strikes me that uh uh well I will go on to Mr. Gupta. Um Mr.
▶ 1:03:08Gupta uh the G reported on March 2024 that younger and lower ranked service members and service members facing unanticipated separations for short notice administrative or medical separations were uh uh experienced a more difficult transition. What are some of the unique transition challenges you've observed among these groups of veterans?
▶ 1:03:32So the unique challenges across any veteran is the adaptation and accumulation back to the society with their basic needs to be met. What we have seen based on the datadriven strategies and active feedback from our strong member audience is navigation of the space with combined arms as a technology platform which has a open door policy.
▶ 1:03:53What we see is most veterans are engaged in in one aspect of life like job security resulting into other opportunities and support services which they might not have been aware of. Awareness seems to be a bigger challenge in navigating the space and how to seek assistance. That's where the platform connects and reaches out menown their basic needs and overall life life standards are met. Well, thank you Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:04:21In closing, let me just say that um uh I I'd hoped that the both secretaries would communicate uh more um forthrightly with members with such an important memorandum. Um and uh especially I'm delighted that both secretaries are looking at some sort of automatic enrollment um and doing it administratively.
▶ 1:04:44Um, but I would appreciate if we could get uh representatives from both departments to explain how this memorandum of understanding would be implemented, what the details are, etc. Um, thank you. Representative Mace, you are recognized for five minutes to question. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, I appreciate the opportunity to discuss the transition assistance program today. An important step for our service members as they leave active duty and embark on the next chapter of their lives. We owe our veterans a seamless path to success after service.
▶ 1:05:15For many service members, the transition from the structure of military life can be overwhelming. Every individual has different needs when it comes to leaving service. And the TAP program must equip every departing veteran with the skills they need to succeed in civilian life. When TAP communities prosper, local businesses gain skilled employees, colleges enroll motivated students, and veterans are given the skills they need to thrive. I'm particularly interested in the ways the Department of Veterans Affairs can leverage technology to improve TAP.
▶ 1:05:46So, the bulk of my questions will be related to that today. Modernizing TAP through digital platforms and datadriven approaches greatly improves our ability to prepare service members for civilian life. By embracing technology and streamlining processes, we can deliver personalized guidance earlier, monitor outcomes more effectively, and adapt quickly to evolving needs.
▶ 1:06:07A more connected tap bridges gaps, simplifies access, and ensures every veteran completes this journey, ready to succeed in their next role in life and civilian life. Private companies have played an important role in modernizing and improving the TAP process to better serve our veterans. So my first question is for you, Mr. Gupta. How do your services differ from the traditional TAP So uh thank you for the question.
▶ 1:06:33At Combined Arms, it's a opt-in model and it's a big mo force multiplier for any veteran or the family members seeking assistance. Like previously mentioned, we focus on the care and life uh supporting a sustaining life healthy thriving models. Regardless of your need using our technology predictive anal analytic datadriven approach, we analyze the patterns of a given veteran.
▶ 1:06:58individualized care is provided based on the frequency of the resource needed or the amount of care needed for that individual scenario. Can you talk to a little bit about technology integration into the TAP program to leverage VA systems? How can you elaborate a little bit more on how that would work?
▶ 1:07:15So g uh given the predictive and datadriven storytelling and overlaying of AI with a data governance and strict cadence given and only partial only the needed data of a veteran is shared with the resource agencies we we can establish patterns and technology pathways to guide and predict the next steps in a journey of a family care. Is that solely AIdriven? Oh no AI is just a force multiplier. You can never replace a human interaction to understand the underlying cause.
▶ 1:07:45Uh entry point to a resource might be uh let's say job or food assistance. But through the frequency and the nature of engagement of a veteran and the services they need, AI predictive models, prescriptive models can help analyze the pattern and the next best care made available to that veteran. Can you talk to some of the collaboration between DoD and VA in this model? Yeah. Uh early awareness. Okay.
▶ 1:08:14The uh the prepar right from preparation. How early when you say early awareness, how do you define early awareness? Right. From the engagement or the enrollment into a taps program or a class uh streamlining the a uh a veteran community, potential community and tying it back to geographical locations the transitions might happen. Balancing that with the natural resources care facilities in that area made available to that veteran can help bridge this gap and make the transition very smooth. Okay, Mr.
▶ 1:08:43Lumis, you got my last uh minute and a half. Um, can you speak to how your digital platform connects veterans with job opportunities and career guidance? Yes, thank you, Congresswoman. More specifically, I think it has to do with the way the world is integrated today and becoming more and more integrated. So it's understanding the the service members, you know, story, what their journey is like. Everybody's journey is different and that's more specifically around what their, you know, their role or their career was in the military.
▶ 1:09:10You know, what their likes and preferences are, where are they geographically wanting to be located during discharge or their last destination? More specifically, what are their what are their objectives? What are their five-year goals? What are they looking for in order for uh job placement? And then working with we we are real more of an integrator where we integrate with organizations that offer job placement programs for veterans. More specifically to the witness to my right, Mr.
▶ 1:09:34Dickman, it's really about enabling the veterans data to drive what the potential and the possible job opportunity that sets them up for success. You know, it's not a matter of just applying for every job that you can. It's more about what are the top five employment opportunities that were ideal for me to succeed uh in my career and that's really the integration point. Thank you Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Representative Papis recognized for five minute. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:10:03Thanks to you and the ranking member for holding this session here today on an important topic, the transition from military to civilian life. I want to thank our panel for their contributions to this conversation. We know that TAP continues to fall short in many ways. Many service members report that the program feels more like a checkbox rather than a serious investment in their futures. 60% of post 911 veterans report difficulty adjusting to civilian life. Many relocate to entirely new communities with little support in finding housing, employment, or structure.
▶ 1:10:33And although TAP is a multi- agency effort, I've heard from far too many veterans who complete the program only to scramble later in life for answers on benefits, job placement, and stability for their families. So these gaps underscore the indispensable role of VSOs, nonprofits and NOS's. Uh your organizations are often the ones filling the void, offering career prep, benefit navigation, job placement, and much needed support structure uh along that uh road. So I wanted to ask you a question, Mr. Dickman.
▶ 1:11:01I I appreciated your discussion about uh measuring outcomes, about skills based hiring opportunities and public private partnerships. Um, Skillbridge is one program that Congress has focused its attention on over the last many years. I've seen the success of this in my district and we know that these experiences help service members build resumes, gain exposure to market relevant skills and in many cases lead to post-ervice employment with the same organization.
▶ 1:11:25In my state, partners uh offer uh opportunities in advanced manufacturing, aerospace, software development, and even public service roles with our state department of transportation. So, Congress has taken step steps in recent years to expand and institutionalize skillbridge. I'm wondering if you have any observations for us in terms of what is working. Uh, what more we can do to modernize this program for today's workforce, cut back on red tape, and invite more employers to be a part of it. Thank you, sir, for the question.
▶ 1:11:54Yes, we're as at Higher Heroes USA, we're not a SCOBridge facilitator. We're a sort of an upstream preparation for active duty service members and military spouses before they compete for a skillbridge opportunity. If you think about it, Skillbridge as an internship model has the same um challenges that any other veteran might encounter. They have to interview for that internship opportunity. They have to know what their skills are. They have to know what their value proposition is. They have to be able to kind of land that internship and perform well in it.
▶ 1:12:24What we have seen that works really well is when service members engage in one-on-one coaching with one of our transition specialists at Hire Heroes USA for skills development, resume, interviewing, prep, and ability to articulate what their goals are. They perform better in their skillbridge internship and are more likely to obtain employment afterwards.
▶ 1:12:45So what I would encourage to improve that system is more upstream interventions that are aligned around a timebased sequence for what that service member might need to compete more effectively at that maximum point closer to their transition when they're eligible for skillbridge. So understanding how to articulate and validate their skills in a way an employer would recognize and use those to make a hiring decision that can happen upstream and doesn't need to happen right at the point of transition when everything's very stressful for a service member.
▶ 1:13:14I appreciate that and I think that responds to the statistic you cited 61% of uh veterans that uh report being undermployed uh once separated from uh military service. Um if I could go to you, Miss Burgess, uh question about just the mental health um issue uh that you cited in your testimony.
▶ 1:13:35I'm wondering if you can uh provide any additional observations on gaps in the continuum of care from uh DoD to VA and what steps we should be taking to address those gaps. You talked about data sharing and coordination as important priorities. uh any other observations you might have I think are incredibly helpful as we uh work to provide the best mental health support we can. Thank you very much Congressman for that question and the opportunity to elaborate a little bit on that.
▶ 1:14:02I think that um one of the most difficult things for Congress when it comes to mental health of veterans is that you can't legislate hope but you can legislate the things of hope and I think the things of hope for the the transitioning veteran are many of the things which all of my fellow panelists were speaking about today.
▶ 1:14:17Are there particular programs that are rooted in especially education, employment, legal services, financial well-being, but but especially what the research continues to show um both in the US and uh recent studies out of Sweden and out of the UK show that the sense of identity is the single most important element of of the transitioning veteran. They're losing a very important uh identity which is rooted in a public a very large sense of service and purpose.
▶ 1:14:46And so trying to enable them to return to to refind that um sense of purpose um is what each of these programs should be helping them as one rung of the ladder to be able to do. Uh so enabling them to connect with these different programs at their own level and as they need it. This is what gets to that 247 model of the technology importance of the technology rather than thinking about a job fair for you know the 21st century. Um where does a 21-year-old or 25year-old go today?
▶ 1:15:14they talk to their buddy or they go online and do a Google search. So we need better better um immediate kind of touch points SEOs um that enable that veteran to find the support services that they need um and that come to them in a way rather than them having to go out to discover across the board what may or may not work, what may or may not be that in that area.
▶ 1:15:33Um, and as as someone who has worked and has observed um combined arms in the past, uh, to me, this is a model that could be scaled um, because it brings to the veteran um, kind of a clearing house of here are all the programs. It asks you the questions that you need and you're able to input what you're looking for and then it spits back out at you and, you know, unscientific language. um here are the different programs or or um government agencies that you could be connected with that could help you and then it makes those appointments helps you find those people.
▶ 1:16:03Thanks for your thoughts. I yield back. Dr. Melon, make sure you're recognized for five minutes. Uh thank you very much. I really want to thank Chairman Bost for having this extraordinarily important hearing. This is something that we hear about. uh and as a 24-year army veteran who left uh who left the service and to your point, Miss Burgess, I actually left to pursue education to go to medical school. So, I had hope uh that uh there was a career pathway for me outside of the military.
▶ 1:16:31I think how we help assist active duty uh to go into the veteran space or into civilian life is extraordinarily important. There's a ton of questions I would love to ask, but uh I now have four four minutes and 27 seconds. Uh, Mr. Gupta, the recently congressionallymandated report showed that 52% of veterans met the mandated 360day timelines for TAP. Do you think service members would be more prepared for transition if there was accountability to actually get service members to TAP on time?
▶ 1:17:04Uh, thank you for the question. The accountability translates in in our mind is towards awareness and the benefits and education. It's not just a matter of just a class, one class and you're done. It's more of engagement and enrollment and also outreach to the local community in terms of being readiness to accept that volume of veterans coming in. So, it's a two-way street and has to be coordinated appropriately. Yeah. And our governor Brandanstead had did that with an initiative called uh home homestead Iowa.
▶ 1:17:33So, we have communities all throughout that prepare to receive veterans and veteran spouses. Um in your testimony you mentioned that combining technology integration into the TAP program to leverage VA systems would be beneficial. Can you elaborate uh elaborate on how this would practically work through the transition?
▶ 1:17:50The biggest challenge is adaptation and education and acceptance and through technology uh not only veterans who can be aware made aware of social services and event community events or any kind of campaigns going on but it's also important for the community to be aware of the veteran skill set coming in the hardships they've gone through and how do we translate a military life to a civilian life. So that partnership really helps. I'm going to follow up on that with Mr. Dickman with over 100,000 successful hires.
▶ 1:18:20How does Hire uh Heroes USA, what do you do to find opportunities for veterans and help them stay employed? And do you uh track attrition rates? Thank you for the question, Congresswoman. Um and actually probably as we're speaking today, we'll pass 110,000 unique service members and military spouses put into work through our uh program.
▶ 1:18:40Uh the way we work on that is is through a one-on-one personalized care model where a member of our staff is both their coach, their guide, and at times the uncomfortable trutht teller that a service member might need to hear about how do they need to leverage their skills and apply in their job search. Um, running behind them in the back end that the veteran may or may not be aware of is a complicated series of both searches, placement activity, and employer engagement systems that are aligning that skill experience.
▶ 1:19:10Um, so that we're running searches in the background based on the experience and data that we have. Um, we also then tap into forward- facing and more active searches, so webinars and engagements directly with employers so they can build that connectiv. Um, we do track attrition and we've seen that when placed well, veterans stay longer at employers and are promoted faster, but it's that first role that tends to be the most critical.
▶ 1:19:36Um, the challenge point that we see is especially with uh long delay in seeking services and support is that often veterans have to make a choice of getting a job now versus finding that right job where their skills are going to be put to the best use. mentioning that uh nonprofits currently bear a lot of the burden of assisting veterans and transitioning service members. Mr.
▶ 1:20:00Lumis, the veteran post-transition outcome data is lacking and is one of the main reasons it's been so hard to get government agencies to prioritize TAP. Uh can uh how can uh Turbo Vets help fill this gap? The priority, thank you, Congresswoman, for the question. the priority really comes down to the collaboration and the first time we're really driving the the idea that the DoD and the VA need to be working together and to integrate this new technology.
▶ 1:20:24There's no way that historically it's always been a very uh siloed approach where one owned ver one version or phase of it and then another agency owned the next phase and that disconnection really the veteran or the service member would feel the most.
▶ 1:20:37And so our collaboration of working with the Secretary of Defense's office as well as the Secretary of VA's office um more specifically to focus on that integration of being able to connect their data of what the DoD has for the service member, integrating that into the job market and then integrating that also into the veteran status role model. And our approach is is getting the veteran to sign up for VA benefits automatically with our product.
▶ 1:21:00So whether you know we can get the law and the acts passed and the policy uh endorsed in order to make that happen, we're doing it for them because we want to get the veterans. That's an excellent point. My time's expired and I yield Representative Badinski. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you, Ranking Member Tano, for holding this hearing. And I want to thank the witnesses for being here as well.
▶ 1:21:24I'm really glad that this committee is spending time focusing on that transition period for active duty military into civilian life. We do know and I know it's been mentioned there have been a number of improvements made to the TAPS program, TAP program, but we also acknowledge that we still have work to do in this space.
▶ 1:21:43Um, I would share with you I've heard from my Women Veterans Advisory Council and recent reports from the Wounded Warrior Project, DAV, and others confirmed that women veterans are among the most vulnerable in the transition process. I'm especially concerned about the mental health challenges veterans face obviously during this transition.
▶ 1:22:04It's why I introduced um a bipartisan bill, the VA Mental Health Outreach and Engagement Act with Congressman Edwards, which would expand VA's outreach to veterans about the mental health services that are available to them. There is bipartisan consensus that too many transitioning service members and recently separated veterans are still falling through the gaps.
▶ 1:22:26Organizations like those represented here today um help fill those gaps by connecting veterans with peer support, career services, and assistance navigating VA benefits. But we are missing the opportunity today, which is disappointing to hear from the direct department of defense directly, which I understand declined to join today's hearing.
▶ 1:22:46It's incumbent upon DoD in partnership with VA and the Department of Labor to ensure that every service member, every veteran is afforded transition counseling and supports uh that they need to flourish in civilian life. The federal government must lead this using key performance indicators and outcome measures to improve transparency and accountability.
▶ 1:23:10During the previous administration, governmentwide work on navigating the transition to civilian life produced valuable insights. Now, we must use these insights to take action to reshape the transition experience so that it's easier and more tailored for each service member's individual needs and goals. Um, so my question is for Miss Bergus. Um, your testimony highlights that women, minorities, and junior enlisted veterans face the steepest postervice challenges.
▶ 1:23:40You bring up the need for better demographic data to research and understand this. Um, what would you recommend to reduce those gaps and could you also speak to what key performance indicators would you recommend um to access um to assess Thank you very much, Congresswoman, for your for your comments and your question.
▶ 1:24:01Um, I think uh one of the most important things when it comes to women veterans, again, we suffer so much in this area from a lack of actual data or access to data for those of us who live in the research world and want to understand this, especially if you don't um have a background in actual n um ser military service. Um but but the other thing is is changing the narrative about me about about mental health itself. That for a veteran accessing uh health care, mental health care is not about um giving yourself a life sentence.
▶ 1:24:31We have completely distorted what happens to a veteran after their terms of service. In fact, maybe only 10% actually experience PTS where most most transitioning veterans actually experience something called transition stress. Um, and then there's something else that many of our our special operators especially experience, which is operator syndrome. And all of these have these new um, medical research has made leaps and bounds about how to um address and access these things.
▶ 1:24:58But for most of the American public and most of the transitioning veterans, the idea is that if you seek mental health, what mental health, you are acknowledging to yourself that you have this life sentence ahead of you. and women especially um uh shrink back from that type of a label for themselves.
▶ 1:25:14So while we have also found um through some some research of just social databases that women veterans are frequently the most to express some of their concerns socially and amongst social media, they actually are less frequent um to find and actually do something about it for themselves. And that can also just go back to some of the other support services that um you know are out there that should be identified for them because they have a lack of help of access to child care or their caregiver in addition to maybe going to school.
▶ 1:25:44Um and so it's identifying which of those um other underlying um issues might be there that is uh preventing them from actually seeking the health care provider or is it simply not understanding that there is an online component that they could um avail themselves of.
▶ 1:26:00So that's one um aspect and and something that could help us understand where whether it's kind of financial and local to a region versus in general um is what I mentioned in my testimony which is connecting VA and DoD identity repository database with information from the social security administration that's specific to the payroll um at the zip code level.
▶ 1:26:20that could tell us so much information um that we could then isolate out even types of of service whether it's national guard which none of us have have mentioned today about the struggles of national guardsmen or women coming back um versus reser active duty um etc.
▶ 1:26:37So that's one idea could go on all day but I'll that's really wonderful thank you that's helpful and would love to hear more of your ideas too after today so thank you thank you and I'll yield representative is recognized by Thank you, ranking member and um chairman You know, we wouldn't have the veteran community if we didn't have DoD and we wouldn't have DoD if we didn't have the veteran community. You you most of you, the panel has said it. There needs to be a relationship between the two and it it seems like it has fallen short or has fallen short.
▶ 1:27:07I'll just be brutally honest. It has fallen short and there's a lot of intangibles, a lot of pitfalls between there and here when it comes to DoD and the VA. you know, we need to take a hard look at, and I call them children, but they're grown men and women when they when they enlist in the military, especially our junior enlisted service members, and they'll come out of high school at 17 years old, 18 year olds, spend a short amount of time or extended extended period of time in the military, and then they're kind of cast out into the civilian population. Well, there's a lot that happens.
▶ 1:27:33So, if you leave high school and you go to college and your parents kind of put you in this position here, you learn how to be an adult. And I don't have a better way to say it, but um you have the nobody's paying for your nobody's paying for where you you know when you go out at night paying your bills, your car payment. You take that And junior listed service members, they're taught how to walk, talk, shoot, do all the other kind of stuff, giving a place to live, given a place to eat. No matter what, they're taken care of.
▶ 1:28:02And then when they're when they're when their time's up, here we go. And welcome to the real world. Now, if they're married with children, if they have a disability, that's a lot to shoulder the second that you step off that train that's traveling down the track. And when we we're talking about transition assistance and the platform itself, and how do we assist these members?
▶ 1:28:20There's there I don't know how you and I don't mean this in any in a negative connotation, but how do you teach somebody how to be a responsible adult in in a way that when you're in the civilian world when you haven't had to do that more or less when you're in the military again because it's provided for you a lot of times. Um, and that's another one of those things that we're going to have to figure out.
▶ 1:28:40Now, when we when we're populating the digital footprint in your um I want to make sure that everybody is specifically that we focus on each individual specifically. Like if my resume or my portfolio is inside the organization and his is inside the organization, his and I are very similar, but we're very different people. I'm obviously a way better congressional member than this guy and I was a way better SEAL at the time. That's not true.
▶ 1:29:09Um, but Mr. Gupta, I heard you speak on the personal relationships that you have inside your organizations with those members. Now, I think that we should start transitioning a member's resume from the time they complete basic training until the time that they exit the military. That way, when you're talking to a Marine like, "Hey, what did you do?" The the response from the arena is like, "Show me bad man. I take bad band away." You know, that's kind of an infantry marine's response. That's their job and that's the responsibility. But how does that translate into the civilian world?
▶ 1:29:37And we are responsible for making that articulation the day that we leave. Hey, here you go. Thanks for playing. Figure it out. And the communication breakdown in between these organizations is one of my primary concerns from start to finish. Again, um Mr. Dr.
▶ 1:29:54Lumis, can you could can you kind of walk me through what you think the best way to have VA and DoD communicate because again two very large organizations that live on different platforms um and this committee always runs into whomever we're speaking to is like we don't talk to each other very well. But if we are creating a digital footprint to assist our veterans, how does that how can that work?
▶ 1:30:20Thank you, I I think it like it goes back to your point about when people join the military and then having something that they can uh build a relationship with uh along through their journey of military service including uh their their goal and their career goal aspirations while they're in the military.
▶ 1:30:36I do believe that the way that we're talking with the VA and the DoD right now is is to build ecosystem that essentially allows a service member to understand what benefits there are in the military and staying in the military as well as the benefits of going into civilian life. I think that's not presented well when it comes to service members when they're going through TAP. uh including what pitfalls there are, what difficulties, what what what opportunities there are to retain certain talent to stay in the military.
▶ 1:31:07Uh and I think the integration that's going on today between the DoD and the VA is more around the service member's journey. What is this service member doing? What are their goals and do can we match those goals? Can we can the VA can the DoD aid in keeping that service member enlisted to join and achieve their goals? If they cannot, then what can the VA do to help that service member achieve their goals? Whether it's a career in in exe in technology, whether it's being, you know, owning your own business, going through the vocational readiness program.
▶ 1:31:37So, I think it's more about the way that the data is shared, right? The DoD does not share data with the VA very well, including the service member. They don't get their DoD uh data very easily. I think that that the way that the data connectivity is with working with our platform is to build that in the service member has their data with them 247 365 from the day they join the military to the day they transition to the day that they need any kind of benefits. Thank you Mr. Chairman. I yel back. Representative Brownley.
▶ 1:32:08Thank you Mr. Chairman and thank thank you to each of you for what you do for our nation's veterans. I'm not sure what our system would look like without you. So I am very very grateful. Uh Miss Burgess, I appreciate how uh in your testimony you describe the role veterans play as the unagnowledged but permanent ambassador of national service and how they are treated after service can have a big impact on public perception and recruitment uh for our country's
▶ 1:32:38all volunteer force. Clearly, highquality health care is a solemn prom promise that we make uh to our nation's veterans, and that's certainly why the VA benefits and service brief during the tap course is required and so consequential for transitioning service members. I'd like, Mr.
▶ 1:32:58Chairman, I'd like to ask unanimous consent uh to enter into the record an article from the Guardian published on June 18th, 2025 titled VA hospitals remove politics and marital status from guidelines protecting patients from discrimination.
▶ 1:33:15Without objection, are you familiar uh Miss Burgess with the new uh medical staff bylaws language discussed in this article that eliminates the requirement for health care professionals to care for veterans regardless of their politics and marital Unfortunately, I haven't kept up quite on that aspect of Okay. All right.
▶ 1:33:41assuming um that it's true and it is true that the VA um has changed the bylaws uh in their language that would allow the VA medical professionals um to the bylaws at least eliminate the requirement for health care professionals to care for veterans regardless of politics and marital status.
▶ 1:34:05So what that really means is, you know, it could be um that individual providers could now decline care for patients based on their personal characteristics or their marital status um and and that would not be protected under the law. So, do you think a change like that should be brought to service members attention during the TAP program during the VA benefit and service brief?
▶ 1:34:35I think one of the difficulties is when they're in those TAP programs, they feel so inundated by by information that it goes in one year, out one year, and they don't remember any of those particulars. Um, so I would like to say while in theory maybe um when else would they understand that or be presented with it, but in reality they're not going that will be so far down on their list of of concerns outside of a few um you know where their lifestyles might um have them particularly attuned to that type of issue.
▶ 1:35:03Well, I think probably the more important question um is uh what do you think the impact will be on perception and recruitment if members leaving the service transitioning to to be a in veteran status now learns that they could be discriminated against based on their marital status or their political beliefs uh by medical professionals within the VA.
▶ 1:35:31I I think again this that will vary by kind of subsets of culture within in the military. Many of those who might be already concerned about those questions might never think about joining the military in the first place because they might see it as not conducive. Um do you think they have the right to be to to know and understand that they may be denied care? Well, sure we all have every American should understand their rights in in terms of accessing health care.
▶ 1:35:57Um I I do think um though on on the health care side um I'll just I'll yield. Never mind. Okay. All right. Well, m Mr. Chairman, I I bring this up because I I find that this policy is really outrageous and it's a concern. I mean, it it's not just uh you know, their political views in one direction or the other.
▶ 1:36:22It doesn't matter in terms of what your political views are, but if a medical professional believes and doesn't like that political view, he or she can deny care. Simple as it's the chair the secretary did give a full video explaining that that was not the case. And I don't know why they published it in their bylaws to say that.
▶ 1:36:53It just telling you what's what the other I think it's consistent with the Trump administration that they're inconsistent in their messages. So I will just leave it at that and I will um Well, it looks like my time is up, but I will leave it at that. And I and again I I I am very very concerned that our our nation's veterans could be denied care based on their political beliefs and or their marital status. And I will yield back.
▶ 1:37:21Representative King Heind, you are recognized for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Ranking Member, and thank you to all of you for being here today. Um, I just wanted to see what the interplay is with regards to your organizations. Are you in some sort of a a database or data bank where a vet for example can going to your point about alocart services?
▶ 1:37:47Is there a one-stop shop or a site where if I was a vet and I was looking for different options or different services that are available through nonprofits, is there a site that I can go where I can pull that information or resource? Yeah, yeah, thank you for that question. So, at Combined Arms, we have a very vigorous vetting process for all the VSOs. It's at no charge to the veteran and the organizations will never charge the veteran.
▶ 1:38:16Through full transparency and an open door policy, a veteran coming in can reach out to any organization, seek any resource and the agencies are under combined arms agreement to help them to the best they can and forward on the veteran to other agencies without them having to search and start all over again. Okay. Did you Yes. Thank you representative for the question.
▶ 1:38:41Um, for example, our our organization is one of the vetted organizations that's partnered with Combined Arms. So, if a service member in Texas joins Combined Arms network and is curious or needs help with their job search, their filters would then direct them to us for support, and our one-on-one transition specialist would support that veteran with their career search. But we're only an employment um service delivery organization.
▶ 1:39:08So we carry a network of about 1,600 referral partners who serve other need areas such as housing or financial insecurity, um food insecurity, any other area that we have also vetted and we'll refer them to.
▶ 1:39:22Um there's a variety of open- source websites that attempt to serve as sort of a catchall um index of veteran service organizations, but with about 45,000 out there, the closest are probably some of the more tailored lists that stick to the top 100 or 200. Do you do you service places outside of the continental United States like the territories?
▶ 1:39:44I'm from the northern Marianas where access to services is very limited and so is there an opportunity to be able to provide folks with the resources that you currently provide whether through online platforms or whatever other mediums. Thank you representative. Um yes at Higher Heroes USA we serve any veteran, any service member, any military spouse. It doesn't matter when they served, how long they served, what rank, the constitution of their service or where they live.
▶ 1:40:11So any uh member of your constituency as long as they served one day in uniform or were married or partnered with a service member is eligible for our services all through our web-based platform and then our online coaching is a distributed and remote model. Okay. And just to add to that, currently at Combined Arms, we do have active veteran and military family profiles leveraging the platform from union territories and other states, Puerto Rico, Guam equally. Okay.
▶ 1:40:41And and they all services available either regionally or at national level to them. Okay, that's good to hear. Did you want to chime in? Yes, ma'am. And more specifically, we want to talk about what our focus is, unlike uh the witnesses here, is to really how benefits application process and management goes. So, we're more on the benefits and application process or all benefits across all different services.
▶ 1:41:04So, it could be disability, vocational readiness, GI bill, healthc care, uh even active duty service members would wanting a VA loan. We're working on automating the VA loan to lower costs to the service members as well. being very disruptive of how all benefits uh operate on a single unified platform.
▶ 1:41:21And while we handle all the technology of benefits management when it comes to services and support nonprofits integrations like working with you know you know higher heroes or combined arms which we're in conversations with is to to elevate that where you know we there's too much repetition in the nonprofit and services community.
▶ 1:41:39I quite frankly think it should be combined uh in order to uh remove the redundancy and combine the you know really do a force multiplier but I also think that you know when it comes to recruitment and how to recruitments and how to service members have access to services that they don't even know they have. Like when you're active duty there's education benefits that you can do for continuing education that most service members don't know they have. And so that is the benefit of of putting all the benefits on one unified platform that we're building. All right.
▶ 1:42:08Well, may I yield the balance of my time? Dr. Conway, you were recognized for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have uh listening intently. I guess um where I would start uh with Mrs. Mrs.
▶ 1:42:29Burgess, do you have um a thought or an opinion about how the the yearlong um educational process on the transition of veterans from the service works?
▶ 1:42:42um you know the data that they provided uh to us suggests that uh and I guess despite this uh long transition uh education uh there is a appallingly low uptake uh of completion of those services.
▶ 1:43:02Do you have thoughts about how we want to change that process to raise the number of veterans transitioning from the service actually complete uh the training uh so that they can uh successfully transition from the Yes, thank you for the question.
▶ 1:43:21Uh though I'm not a specialist in all of the nitty-gritty of of all the tap um ins and outs, I would say one, there is a radical solution that I would love to to put on the table, which is to think of the end of service with a 30-day leave. So you don't just um say that you're going to um exit the service um and then be gone and and then leave, you know, be in uniform one day and and out.
▶ 1:43:43you have 30 days in which you could really get through each one of those um aspects of of reintegrating into uh civilian service as in try and figure out where you're going to live, where the jobs are that you want to be etc. Um the other is that uh it seems very anecdotally um again this is one of the issues of the data.
▶ 1:44:06So much of this is anecdotal from individual soldiers uh and those from other branches coming back um telling us that the year-long it's when they start they forget the information that they may have received and they forget at at which point in that year it'd be the most helpful to apply some of that especially regarding enrollment in say VA healthcare um type type issues.
▶ 1:44:30So perhaps um you know it needs to be thought of um as a more condensed issue at one particular po point rather than over that year though in general. I think I just want to reclaim my time because you know your answers I think you'll agree have been quite long. Any uh comment from uh the other uh members of the panel uh good because let me move on.
▶ 1:44:50I I I just uh certainly want to say that I'm concerned about uh the statistics uh that 60% of of veterans um are having a difficulty finding employment after 6 and a half years. Um and clearly we we need to do more and uh I'm hopeful uh that our uh committee uh here in the Congress and other uh interested members of Congress will address that issue.
▶ 1:45:18I do have uh a concern uh about privacy in particular. Uh this question is is to Mr. Lumis. Um as I understand it, you are leveraging a data uh to help uh veterans apply for services and the like. Um but you know, I'm a data privacy legislator. I'm very concerned about uh access by private entities to personal data and how that might be misused.
▶ 1:45:46Um, in fact, I've introduced um the VA data act uh which u would restrict special government employees from accessing and extracting data in possession of veterans affairs. I'm concerned about data. So, could you just uh describe to me and the committee how you access uh and get access to the data that you're using to help uh veterans uh access the services that you are offering in u uh in um in your program, Mr. limits.
▶ 1:46:16Thank you, Congressman. So, the data access is through technology. Uh, it's through secure communication between the VA database systems and our database systems. That's done through a program called Lighthouse. It's a Lighthouse team that goes through a rigorous program of terms of service. What is used with that data? The data is never used. It's never repopulated. There's no advertising of the data. It's never sold to any organization. So, the veteran owns their own data. They can delete their own data.
▶ 1:46:43they can consent to the data uh uh you know extraction from the VA in order to apply for benefits uh and aid with them with it. So more specifically because of my cyber security background data security is a very big serious concern for us as well. More more importantly we're working on hosting uh the platform inside of the federal ramp which is the government cloud so that this data is not out in the commercial marketplace. It's that it can protected environment behind the government infrastructure so that government systems can securely communicate to each other.
▶ 1:47:13Uh thank you. Uh thank you Mr. Chairman. I'll y back. Thank you Mr. Van or Representative Van Orton. Thank you Mr. Chairman. Um unfortunately uh you know I've got a bunch of stuff I want to ask but I got to counter what my uh Democrat colleagues have been saying. Uh, this is a this is an email from the VA that directly disputes that article from the Guardian. I'm sorry for using that profanity, sir.
▶ 1:47:41I want this uh with I'd like this entered into the record. What Miss Brownley, who I respect tremendously, without objection, uh said is an absolute flatout lie, and we're not going to take that. uh when when my Democratic colleagues decide to lie like that, it makes people not want to go to the VA and that that increases the risk of suicide and that's unacceptable.
▶ 1:48:04My Democrat colleagues also have seemed to rail against President Trump deciding to take out the Iranian nuclear problem. I don't recall any of them and many of which were in Congress when President Obama executed four American citizens with drone strikes. So enough is enough. We should not politicize this. I am the chairman of the subcommittee for equal or for uh uh EO.
▶ 1:48:34I'd like to thank Chase, Holly, and Ally. They are my subcommittee staff. So I take personal responsibility for the TAP program. I don't mean them. I don't mean this committee. I mean me. Uh the DoD has testified twice in front of my subcommittee. So maybe they don't like the folks on the other side of the aisle. But but they've been here and they've showed up and I appreciate that tremendously.
▶ 1:49:04I got to ask some very pointy questions. Mr. Gupta, how much money do you receive from the federal government for your programs? Uh, I'm sorry. I don't have the information top of my hand, but we can get back that to you. But you receive money from the federal government. We work at a state level. We do. Okay, good. Dickman, how about you? Uh, thank you for the question, Mr. Congressman. It makes up the smallest portion of our total revenue. How much? Uh, it's about 5% for homeless veterans program. How much is that? Give me that. It's less than $700,000.
▶ 1:49:34Okay. How about you, Lumis? Zero. We're we're privately funded organizations. Okay. Miss Burgess zero. Okay. Um, are you guys familiar with the Muddy Oaks Warrior Foundation? You are. Okay. They're they're the most successful program uh that has ever existed to prevent veteran suicide. They receive zero money from the federal government.
▶ 1:50:00So the answer to my colleagues on the other side of this disas is not federal dollars. It's the application of will. And ma'am, you talked about hope. You want hope, you're going to find it in faith. You're not going to find it in a federal dollar.
▶ 1:50:16So, I just want to bring us all down to zero and understand that if in fact we have very very successful programs that receive zero money from the federal government, um we should look at that and we should we should apply those same things. So, uh Mr. Gupta, how many veterans do you We have over 85,000 veterans on the platform, sir. Mr. Dickman, we serve 25,000 annually.
▶ 1:50:47Mr. Lewis, what are you looking to serve? Every veteran service member. We're we're aim to to put on the platform for free of charge. Miss Burgess 18 million veterans alive and all those come in. Okay. So, are you guys familiar with the enlisted ladder? That is a program. It it takes a person when they join the Navy to a 30-year career.
▶ 1:51:13What I would like to do, and if you're not doing this, you should take that from the 30-year career into your entire lifetime. And I I think that's very uh it would be valorious if we're able to do that. So, I'm looking forward to working with all of you guys in the future. And listen, I don't care if you're a private public thing, if you're a public thing or a private thing. I don't care if you're helping our veterans. I'm with you. And on that note, I have 43 seconds. Will everybody here in the audience raise their hand if you're a veteran?
▶ 1:51:45All right. How many people went through the TAP program? How many people thought it was worth Yeah. Thanks. Well, Mr. Chairman, maybe I should resign because that's my failure. So, I want to thank you all for coming here. Um, and my office is always open for you cats. Jason, thanks for showing up, pal. There's another frog man there, too. So, uh, with that, I will yield back, sir. Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:52:15Yes, Mr. Chairman. Does the committee have rules on decorum if it does and I would and I was going to express my concern that the quorum should be followed and the rules are that way regardless how frustrated you are. Um, and with that, Representative Ramirez, you're recognized for 5 minutes. Thank you, This weekend, many of us watched appalled as the president launched an illegal and unauthorized attack on Iran that have put our country and our service members in harm's way.
▶ 1:52:46And he justified taking us to the brink of war with the same excuses his predecessors used to send service members to endless wars. This administration is fully committed to undermining our democracy, undermining our security and our safety through reckless disregard of the Constitution, irresponsible and unpredictable governance, dangerous and unaccountable decision-making.
▶ 1:53:14But the way he approached foreign affairs this weekend is not unlike how this administration has approached veterans care. You see, there's a pattern here. Reckless disregard of VA workers, 30% of whom are veterans, by the way. Irresponsible and unpredictable rulemaking, dangerous and unaccountable empowerment of Doge to make unproven changes across agencies.
▶ 1:53:39While the administration is running around bombs out and middle fingers up, we as members of Congress still have a promise to uphold for our veterans. Veterans deserve to know that we are doing everything everything to ensure their peace and safety when they return home. The transition to civilian life is complex. Many service members return with physical injuries and mental health challenges that requires so much more than the transitionary to-dos and checklist.
▶ 1:54:08The transition assistance program we know is a vital means of ensuring that veterans achieve peace, fulfillment, and safety after service. We know that from employment assistance to health services, housing support, and continued education, our veterans deserve an integrated education and streamlined comprehensive approach to TAP that provides them with the resources and the supports that they need to succeed. It's why you're here.
▶ 1:54:33TAP should be a gateway to stability, to opportunity, and dignity for every service member leaving active duty, not just some, as we saw a moment ago. But nearly 70% 70% of service members are still not accessing the program on time. To me, that is systemic failure that Congress has to rectify. I I want to talk about Skillbridge.
▶ 1:54:55Last week, I met with pre previously approved Skillbridge providers in my district who were recently and without notice without notice removed from the Skillbridge provider website. They still don't know the exact date or reason why they were unlisted. They didn't get no notice, no explanation. And you and I both know that the skillbridge is an important component of TAP. So, Miss Burgess, can you explain what it means for veterans if trusted Skillbridge providers are being quietly removed?
▶ 1:55:25My followup to that, how will this affect service members transition um into your program? Thank you for your question. So, I don't have a program. I'm a researcher, PhD um and I look at the whole ecosystem. So from kind of that 10,000 foot view, I would say probably my colleagues um at this table have better more detailed tangible uh answers to you.
▶ 1:55:48In general though, of course, it will affect um whichever employers uh potential employers uh that were dropped, any of those individuals who are interested in those particular types of of employment. Thank you, Miss Burgess. So let me ask you then, Mr. Lumis, Mr. Digman, or Mr. Gupta. Uh, what can Congress do to ensure that service members have the greatest level of access to skillbridge approved organizations?
▶ 1:56:12I think a strong public private partnership that's endorsed and supported by the regardless of administration that allows private organizations and nonprofits to be able to work with government to do the heavy lifting. I think that's been proven that innovation and disruption comes from the outside in the commercial markets and and really is the only way to integrate and I believe tap should start probably 12 uh 12 12 months prior to discharge primarily so that you can either retain the individual for a military service career that because of it's a good opportunity for them or to
▶ 1:56:42start the transition process including repair of financial viability credit repair all that stuff takes time at 30 days is not going to solve that. So, you recommend 12 months in advance? At least 12 months in advance. Thank you. What about you, Mr. Dickman and Mr. Gupta? Uh, thank you for the uh question, Congresswoman. Um, I I would recommend to the constituents who uh that had their skill bridge removed to obviously keep uh pursuing that discussion with the Department of Defense.
▶ 1:57:09Unfortunately, I'm not an expert on skillbridge administration, so I wouldn't be able to advise them on what rules that they would have to follow, but I would encourage them as well to expand their talent pipeline considerations for veterans, transitioning military and military spouses. There are numerous other direct hiring actions that they could take that plug into already separated veterans or military spouses or others who aren't eligible for skillbridge who equally are struggling with underemployment that they could My time is up. Um, Mr. Mr.
▶ 1:57:37Gupt, if you want to do three seconds before Yeah, I would agree with our speakers here and then focusing on the need and the feedback from the veteran on where the lack is is a primary target and focus how we serve them better. If it's education, extensive partnerships as long as they geared and supported to the veteran well-being. Thank you, Mr. Gupta. Look, I I I know my time is up. So, chairman, I'm going to yield back and just remind us that we have to make sure that these programs are effectively helping every one of our veterans.
▶ 1:58:07It's actually how we honor their service with action. So, thank you. With that, I yield back. Representative Hamnne, you are recognized for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As a veteran myself, and I also serve on the Armed Services and Veteran Affairs Committee, and you know, this program, uh, I've been through it as a former Army reservist when I was getting off my deployment of 14 months. I didn't find it all that useful, especially because I was a reserveist going back to my civilian job. So, I think we got to have some common sense in a lot of this uh policies.
▶ 1:58:37Um, but we also need personalization. And I want to first ask my question to you, Mr. Lumis. Your Arizona based company, Turbo Vets, aims to make TAP technologydriven and personalized. And one complaint I consistently hear is that the TAP program feels like a one-sizefits-all checkbox. So, you've spoken about customization. And in your view, what steps could the DoD and VA take to make it a little bit more personalized? Thank you, Congressman. The personalization comes from the individuality of the person that's going through TAP.
▶ 1:59:07That includes their upbringing, their service connectiv uh services that they did, their career that they did in the military, their desires, their interests. TAP needs to be built on what their inadequacies are and what their goals are. More specifically, that changes by the individual.
▶ 1:59:23So the individual when it that's the problem but with AI today and the ability to consume lots of data and being able to build a roadmap we like to build a custom curriculum per individual that specifically focuses on five-year goals, what their career in the military was, what their weak points are, what their strengths are so that they can have good job placement but they can also work on their their what what they're struggling with.
▶ 1:59:47If they've got, you know, weak financial viability, they need to have, you know, put together a program about budgeting, you know, financial saving, credit repair. You know, all of these things are required prior to discharge. You know, if you try to get an apartment or a home after military service and you've got bad credit, that's going to be a real problem. And so, that's the goal of financial uh financial literacy is a very very strong component to individualizing every everybody's transition. Yeah, I like that. I think a lot of the innovation comes to the private sector. So, keep it up. Um, and another question, Mr.
▶ 2:00:17Lumis, I'm also concerned about the classroom approach and how it fails to resonate with a lot of the transitioning service members. Um, how do we bridge that civilian military gap and what would a technology enable TAP program actually look like on the ground? So, on the ground, thank you, Congressman, for the additional question. On the ground, it's more about partnerships. So, we're working with the Medal of Honor Museum in Arlington, Texas. We're working with, you know, popular shod podcasters that are out there. You know, Mr. Mr.
▶ 2:00:45Ryan, who is obviously a Navy Seal as well, to really personalize the the experience where these are service members talking to veterans. That that connectivity of personalizing it, getting, you know, digital learning is different today than it was 25 years ago. You know, people are looking at five minute clips of video to gather and consume the data rather than reading a chapter of a book. And so, you have to kind of keep up with time.
▶ 2:01:10So on the ground it's about building that digital platform to be able to have one the content that is changing to the market. We cannot we cannot sell and and uh and teach based on PowerPoint anymore. People you will lose their attention. They'll be thinking about what they want to do tomorrow. So more importantly it's about staying with relevant with data and then obviously good stakeholders human effect. We don't need AI teaching everybody everything. We really need to have good content from video creators and and obviously social media platforms. Very good.
▶ 2:01:39And Miss Burgess, I got a question for you. In your testimony, you mentioned that a majority of the potential employers believe that veterans need more training or additional education on soft skills uh before they are ready to maintain a career in the civilian sector. Can you elaborate on that? How we can better prepare the soft skills as aspect of it? Sure, thank you for the question. Essentially, it comes down to um translating the skills that they had in the military into more civilian speak.
▶ 2:02:06Um so uh communication skills is often considered uh the first uh or most principle of this in terms of how do you do an interview? How do you present yourself in an interview in a civilian interview? Elaborate about your um your personal characteristics and what you bring to to an employment um location. Very good.
▶ 2:02:24I know there's a lot of foreign investments coming to the United States and every every single one of these companies that have met with me, I encourage them to hire Americans and hire veterans specifically because there's always, you know, they always mention the challenge of our workforce, but I know the veterans are the hardest workers. As the chairman uh said earlier, they show up on time, they're disciplined, and I think they make the best employees. And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Representative Jeff McCormack, you are recognized for five minutes for question. Thank you so much, Mr. chairman and thank you so much for your service and being here and helping our veterans.
▶ 2:02:54Um, we've talked extensively about the TAP program and the problems with it, but I wanted to deep into take a deep dive into some of the services that you provide, especially some of your software. Now, we know the most critical thing is connecting our former service workers into jobs that they want where they can leverage their talents. So, my first question is for Mr. Lumis. I understand that your company is currently designing and testing a product that helps transitioning service members to identify employers that want to hire our veterans.
▶ 2:03:22Can you walk us through the product and what has the preliminary feedback been from our veterans and also the employers? Thank you, Congresswoman. So, the preliminary feedback is is that it it's a high-speed solution right now and it's customized. So, transition is a very tricky thing because everybody's transition is different, right? Some might going through it with no financial literacy and no financial stability.
▶ 2:03:45And I think the institutionalization that happens when you're a service member, we take for granted that we're being paid, fed, and housed without thinking about it. No matter what problem comes up when you're military service, you have a chain of command that will help you solve that problem. And I think with transition, it's it's really preparation. Do people and individuals going through the service uh through the TAP program as service members, do they understand those differentiations that you're going to have to provide for yourself? You're going to have to feed yourself, you're always going to have to house yourself.
▶ 2:04:15I think they we take that for granted. Even from myself, it was a big change to make that. And so the feedback that we're receiving is the individuality that comes from everybody's situation is different and it should start 12 months prior to discharge because if someone has made a bad loan when they were young and they didn't know that 30% loan that they didn't pay ruined their credit that's going to be a problem when they're in the civilian world and it takes time as we all know in this committee to repair your credit.
▶ 2:04:42So the time and the the accessibility of solutions that is key so that you know with technology we can connect those dots. We connect with partners that are on this panel as well. Now with looking at that feedback is there any recommendations you would make directly to Congress that we can institute to help you also in your um feedback and what you're finding to help our soldiers transition. Yeah. The 12-month requirement. I also think that one day uh one or a few hours a week per command endorsement.
▶ 2:05:11We find that a lot of commands don't really support the tap program because the individual might be a high performer and that individual then doesn't really get any time off. You know, they kind of they kind of leverage them to the day they get off. And I think that it would be important that every command in the US military endorses and supports an individual spending and doing their tap. Give it they really need to back them in that second transition from the first and I don't think that's happening today.
▶ 2:05:39I think that the command sometimes will just disregard that as not important compared to the mission itself. Now, has there been any negative feedback that you've gotten from your application? No, the only negative feedback is when can we have more features? Uh, everybody's pretty impatient with when can I when can you have more stuff in your product road mapap come online? Well, one of the biggest complaints I hear from my veterans in my district is that the military assumes they want to continue the same or similar jobs that they've been doing when they were civilian workforce.
▶ 2:06:08Um what do you is there a filter that helps matches them because they might have other talents that they would like to explore? How are you actually bridging that gap for our veterans who feel the same feel that way? Yeah. And that's the partnership with like you know heroes for hire and also there's another company called Opline that actually does the matching and and the other thing is is a lot of veterans and service members don't realize that you can also contract back to the military for your same job.
▶ 2:06:32And so there's an opportunity if you have a very specialized skill set like working on certain aircraft that only the military has, there's contracting opportunities for those individuals to to continue their service in the civilian world. And so another question that I get um also is that we hear a lot about how veterans are being exploited for a profit by claim sharks. How does the TurboVets product prevent veterans from the predatory practices of claim sharks and what safeguards are in place to prevent the claim sharks from accessing this product? Thank you.
▶ 2:07:03That is our number one driver is to eliminate the the the the vulnerability that exists with veterans that don't know that's there's free help out there. There's good help with the depart. You know, the disabled American veterans, American Legion, the VFW, all have VSOs and the county veteran service officers, Texas veterans commission all have free services to help these veterans. So, our goal is to build a shielded environment. We are shielded from access of anybody of a claim shark. For example, we work with a company called ID.me, me, which all veterans are familiar with.
▶ 2:07:32We use it to log into va.gov. Blake Hall is a very good friend. We only allow veterans or validated individuals, including accredited agents or VSOs, access to our platform. So, there's no cross-selling, there's no poaching, there's no manipulation. Our goal is to eliminate the the Claim Shark business whatsoever altogether in its entirety. There's no need for veterans to be giving up their compensation for getting, you know, their forms filled out and for the proper things done. Well, thank you so much. My time is up and I yield back.
▶ 2:08:02Representative Kiggins, you are recognized for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the witnesses for giving us your time today and sharing how Congress can help the men and women who served our nation transition into civilian life more easily. As a Navy veteran, the wife of a retired Navy veteran, and the representative who represents a very large v veteran population down in Hampton Roads, Virginia, I understand the challenges service members and their families face when transitioning from a missiondriven career into everyday civilian life outside of the uniform.
▶ 2:08:30I hear it time and time again just when I'm I'm out and about in the community uh about uh the challenges just of uh of leaving service and leaving that really uh the job we do every day uh and and taking on a new life. So, uh, so they're very communicative and I appreciate just being part of the solution. So, thank you for your work. It's estimated that 200,000 service members transition from the military into civilian life each year. It's getting harder and harder for them to do so.
▶ 2:08:56Nearly 60% of the post 911 veterans have reported difficulty adjusting to civilian life compared to 25% of veterans from earlier eras. You must support programs that make the transition from the service to civilian life as smooth as possible. I'm excited to announce today we've introduced the Veterans Energy Transition Act or the VET Act.
▶ 2:09:14This legislation will create a Department of Labor Grant Program for employers in the Energy and Advanced Manufacturing sectors to train and hire eligible veterans and transitioning service members, addressing workforce shortages in these critical sectors, as well as ensuring our veterans have ample opportunities for gainful employment. This bill directly complements the mission that many of you have here today and I thank you again for being here to discuss how we can establish new and improve existing programs to make this transition period smoother for our nation's veterans. So I have a question for Mr. Dickman. Mr.
▶ 2:09:44Dickman, one of the main goals of Hire Heroes USA is to help veterans secure employment after their time in service through one-on-one support that aims to help them. Can you elaborate in the sort of skills that many veterans leave the service with and how those match up with what skills employers are looking for? And how often are employees employers in the energy and manufacturing sectors looking to connect with skilled veterans? Uh, thank you so much for the question, Congresswoman.
▶ 2:10:08One of the things that we've learned and and learned through our partnerships with McKenzie as well is that junior enlisted and enlisted service members have really strong represented technical skills that employers make hiring decisions off of really quickly.
▶ 2:10:21So in the manufacturing sector, in the logistics sector, in the healthcare sector, um and in the energy sector, um anything dealing with manual labor or um cyber IT, those inform hiring man manager decisions and those enlisted service members get hired on those skills really quickly. Where they tend to struggle is that their leadership or personal or soft skills aren't as recognized as much. So they struggle to be upwardly mobile within those organizations.
▶ 2:10:51More senior service members, their leadership skills, um decision- making, product management, program management, those are more recognized um and are way more into hiring manager decisions for those more senior and executive type of transitioning military. Um but they're not often hired on technical roles in those types of industries. Great. We'll continue to work on that.
▶ 2:11:13and during a service member's transition, what does this period look like for the family and how does Hireer Heroes USA make the families of service members leaving the military just help them to make the adjustment as well? And thank you for the continued question, Congresswoman. It's extremely stressful on the family. Um, you know, not only is the service member leaving that culture that they're part of, but the military spouse and children are leaving that tight-knit community as well. We do work with military spouses.
▶ 2:11:41any military spouse, regardless when they met their partner, if they're still partnered with them or not. Any any marriage to a service member, affects the career trajectory of that spouse and has long-term effects. Um, we encourage military members that we're working with to have their partner or spouse sign up with us as well for continued career support, especially if they're moving to a new area. And we're happy to say that a lot of our referrals come from partners of um an already existing client. Great.
▶ 2:12:11Thank you for that. As a as a military spouse, that's important and and as a mom to future veterans, I know that that will be important to them as well. So, thank you for that work. Uh and and last question for uh Miss Burgess. Miss Burgess, in your testimony, you know that around 200,000 service members exit the military each year as well as that there are around 45,000 registered veterans service focused non nonprofit organizations. That is one nonprofit for almost every four veterans. The issue is obviously not with the amount of organizations, but rather access to or the coordination of programs.
▶ 2:12:42So, how can government agencies better focus on employment services for veterans to create a more efficient experience? How can we streamline the existing landscape to perhaps put things more in one place? I'll echo some of the um some of the other um witnesses on this testimony. Um I think that it comes down to public private partnerships um and leveraging what which each side each side is doing best. Um, but I think more importantly is we need to start with uh measuring outcomes uh not outputs.
▶ 2:13:10And that's something that is directly something that Congress um can mandate for all of these VA programs. We're not going to know what works best unless we know what the outcomes are. And to know what the best outcomes are first, we have to determine what it is that Congress wants out of all of these programs. Thank you. We'll continue to do our part as well. Thank you so much. And I yield back, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
▶ 2:13:30Um, so, Representative Schiffus McCormack, is there any closing statement you need to make for the All right, then first off, I want to say thank you uh to our witnesses. Um, as you know, this is a very important issue to each of us on this panel. Um, sometimes I think uh we should stay focused on the issue out here than the bringing up the other issues around that kind of cause havoc in that.
▶ 2:13:57Let me say this that I would agree with the ranking member uh in his statement earlier that regardless whether Republican or Democrat, whichever administration's there, it has been difficult to get the DoD to communicate with the VA on this issue. I'm hoping that we are working with the administration to try to find that common ground. Remember DoD and when I look at our veterans that are sitting at the table there, uh remember DoD job is to put a bullet down range or support those who do.
▶ 2:14:26and trying to find that window and trying to convince commanding officers uh that how important the TAP program is is a challenge for all of us and we want to make sure that we do that in a way um as I explained in my opening statement that it's got better but by no means are we done yet. Okay. Um it is vitally important.
▶ 2:14:53Uh I've watched my own nephews uh grandson uh go through this. Um I was blessed in the fact that I went home to a family business, knew what I was going to do, and believe me, by the time my uh this this this will stick into your mind. By the time I had my mullet and curly perm grown out, um I had already transitioned no problem. But not everybody does that. Okay?
▶ 2:15:18and and um we need to make sure that that program is there and that our military personnel are advised. And I also want to bring up that, you know, when we went out and visited the uh TAP program in 29 Palms, one thing that they did that was very wise is they did bring the spouse uh in because quite often our military personnel when they're getting ready, especially junior, when they're getting if they're married, if they're getting ready to leave, they're just want to get
▶ 2:15:49their spouse quite often is more worried about the landing zone than they are. And so trying to put this together, this is vitally important. I hope that we will sit down with both secretaries uh and try to find that place and and their through uh their employees so that we can find that place where we can focus on making sure there's plenty of time for the TAP program. So with that, I want to say thank you again.
▶ 2:16:13uh and we're looking forward to continue to work and I ask unanimous consent that all members have five legislative days to revise and extend their remarks and include extenduous material. Hearing no objection, so ordered. The hearing is now journed.