▶ 0:15:52Sorry, I'll moderate that in the future. Good afternoon. Subcommittee will come to order. I want to uh thank by uh or start by thanking our witnesses for being here today and for the testimony that you're going to provide and the insight you're going to give to our committee. I appreciate that. I want to kind of set the stage for why we're here today and why the committee is interested in this topic. Um, nothing in the VA functions without technology. I think we all understand that and it's a huge part of what makes the VA work and in certain instances make the VA not work as well as it could.
▶ 0:16:23Uh, it's also the really predominant focus of course of the jurisdiction of this subcommittee as well. It's a simple statement, but it gets the heart of what OIT why OIT's mission is so important. The VA needs reliable, modern technology in order to provide the highquality benefits and services that our veterans deserve and have earned through their service. Since its creation in 2016, OIT has been constantly fighting a two-front battle.
▶ 0:16:49Uh the first of which is to maintain and secure the existing technology systems that we have to shore those up from vulnerability and make sure that they function properly and in the way that we've expected. The second is to replace or modernize what is broken and outdated. It reminds me a little bit of our physical infrastructure throughout the country where you have roads and bridges that are being maintained over time but also those that reach the point of needing replacement and having to do both at once is a difficult and challenging process.
▶ 0:17:17So you have my respect for the uh difficulty and and challenges that that presents. While it's easy to ask for more money, history has shown that funding alone does not necessarily uh result in the outcomes that we would like. and uh many of OIT's persistent issues um raises important questions in this way. Is OIT getting the best possible result for their technology investments?
▶ 0:17:44Is OIT prioritizing cost effectiveness and veteran outcomes in their Does OIT operate a certain way because it is the best way or is it because it's the only way we've ever done it? uh sometimes we get into a uh decision matrix where we've done things a certain way over time and that becomes the bit of a de facto experience. I run into that here in Congress and uh you know we're elected to do a certain job and oftentimes we're faced with well we've always done it this way so that's the way we're going to continue to do it.
▶ 0:18:12I was pleased to see that President Trump's VA budget request for fiscal year 2026 laid out a brand of smarter not bigger and a strategy for OIT that takes direct aim at many of OIT's problems. According to the strategy, OIT will take advantage of past investments in automation and digital services to streamline and become a more coste effective organization. They plan to change workflows and align similar functions across services to become more efficient.
▶ 0:18:41OIT will be making substantial investment in cyber security monitoring and infrastructure readiness to ensure that their hardware and software can meet the demands of VA's growing operations. I look forward to hearing about these plans and more from our VA witnesses today. As technology changes and new problems arise, OIT needs to be flexible and adaptable in order to deliver the best outcome for our veterans. OIT's priorities should be should determine how the organization is structured, not the other way around.
▶ 0:19:12However, we can't talk about smarter IT strategy without talking about the money that VA has spent on IT projects that have not delivered as were expected. For years, this committee has highlighted the wasteful spending, the overbudget projects, poor outcomes that seem to come with all IT projects in VA, but really throughout government, as I've seen, OIT needs to be involved in the conversation from the very beginning before VA buys new IT systems, starts projects, or makes major investments.
▶ 0:19:43As I said before, nothing in VA functions without technology. So there must be real ownership and emphasis from the VA central office to involve the experts at OIT in technology decisions. Doing so might help avoid costly disasters down the road. Earlier this year, we held an oversight hearing on VA software licensing management where we dug into the reasons why VA struggles to track whether the software licenses that are purchased are actually being used.
▶ 0:20:11VA still does not know exactly how much money they are wasting on unused or duplicative software licenses. This committee has heard examples of software that VA purchased, tested, and then put on a shelf never used after that. That's taxpayer money that is not being used to fix or modernize VA's IT systems because it was spent on it that nobody will ever use.
▶ 0:20:34It's also not going to the benefit of a veteran or rapidly uh responding to an appeal or developing a claim in a more um thoughtful or meaningful or efficient process. Major IT projects that support health care systems, education benefits, and financial management are ways are way over budget and have consistently fallen below expectations. These are just a few examples and there are many more uh that we could point to.
▶ 0:21:01The people of Michigan's seventh congressional district sent me to Congress to make VA smarter and work better for our nation's veterans. And I want to do my part to uh make sure that we follow on that commitment. As the chairman of this subcommittee, my job is to make sure that the billions of dollars that VA spends on it is accounted for and produces real results. The strategy that OIT is taking seems to focus on being more careful with big projects, making sure they deliver results, and spend money wisely and are involved in IT decisions from the start.
▶ 0:21:31I look forward to discussing the strategy and more with our witnesses here today. Lastly, I'm looking forward to working with the president's nominee for VA CIO, Mr. Ryan Coat, after he is confirmed by my Senate colleagues, and we urge them to move quickly and swiftly in that direction. OIT has an important mission and the work that OIT is doing today as well as the work that Mr. Coat will do has a direct and meaningful impact on veterans lives. And with that, I want to yield to ranking member Bazinski for her opening statement.
▶ 0:22:01And again, thank you all for being here. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, uh, for holding today's hearing. I'm glad VA's acting CIO is here to present to discuss the Office of Information and Technologies organizational structure and priorities. Everything VA does to provide veterans with world-class health care and benefits they have they have earned happens on computers. Information technology is foundational to the department. I'll say that again.
▶ 0:22:30I really truly believe that that is foundational to the services we provide to our veterans. I am extremely concerned that this foundation is at risk. OIT's fiscal year 2025 budget request was already ma was already what many deemed a quote unquote maintenance budget mostly due to Republican spending caps.
▶ 0:22:51This meant that many and the department's modernization efforts had to be throttled and VA's already aging IT infrastructure continues to crumble. To make matters worse, the VA administration and Secretary Collins just informed Congress that they tried to illegally transfer $182 million from OIT to VHA and VBA to compensate for even more community care expansion and mandatory overtime for claims examiners.
▶ 0:23:23And as if that wasn't bad enough, the fiscical year 2026 budget request cuts OIT's budget by half a billion dollars. In each of our hearings over the past six months, I've repeatedly highlighted the importance of OIT and the critical employees in this office. The budget and the planned reorganization of OIT makes it clear that Secretary Collins and the Trump administration do not share those same feelings.
▶ 0:23:52I expect to hear from my colleagues that they think Congress has long since overbudgeted and overresourced this office without fixing any issues. I also expect to hear about how the Democrats are simply fine with quote unquote the status quo. I could not disagree with that more.
▶ 0:24:10While there are many struggles in VA's technology modernization efforts, they are not going to be fixed by siphoning money and resources out of the office to fund BB VBA overtime pay or community care. This year's budget request indicates one thing and it is not a decrease of bureaucracy.
▶ 0:24:30For years, we have seen a continuous dismantlement and capa of capacity by expanding its portfolio of what it must take on without making equitable investments in resources and staff. More work with less resources is never a recipe for success. Further, I have strong issues with the written testimony VA submitted for this hearing.
▶ 0:24:54It's almost as if VA is bragging about the loss of trusted, hard-working, and knowledgeable federal employees, many of whom are veterans themselves, to the voluntary retirement program or Vera. of those partic of those that participated in the DRP and Vera programs, VA notes 78% of these were retirement eligible, which reads to me that VA lost a significant amount of institutional knowledge and technical expertise.
▶ 0:25:24That is extremely troublesome, especially as the remaining VAS are poised to take on more and more work to compensate for contract cuts, staffing cuts, and accelerated deployments. The fatigue that is likely to cause creates major risks for system stability and cyber security.
▶ 0:25:45I am also concerned about the office's reliance on quote unquote natural attrition to reach whatever staffing goals that have they have set for themselves or have been set for them. With natural attrition, you can control the size of the team, but it is much harder to control the VA has already lost critical technical expertise and if the department doesn't get this under control, it's going going to lose even more.
▶ 0:26:12Ultimately, I'm concerned that if VA's IT foundation is allowed to continue crumbling, the department won't be able won't be there for generations of veterans. We cannot allow this to happen. I look forward to hearing from both the VA and GAO witnesses today on this reorganization and the potential intended and unintended impacts. I'll close by saying that I hope VA gets Senate confirm a Senate confirmed CIO soon.
▶ 0:26:40I hope that whoever the administration chooses, they are competent and qualified to lead one of the largest information and technology programs in the country, if not the world. VA employees and veterans deserve nothing less. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield back. Thank you, Ranking Member Bazinski. I'm now going to uh introduce our witnesses. Um from VA's Office of Information Technology, we have Mr. Eddie P, acting assistant secretary for information technology and chief information officer.
▶ 0:27:09Very long title, sir. Um, thank you for being here. Accompanying Mr. Pool is Mr. Jack Galbin, acting principal deputy assistant secretary and deputy chief information officer. Also lot fit on a business card. Um, Mr. Tim Pittz, deputy chief information officer for IT, budget and finance and chief financial officer. Uh, Miss Devin Beard, acting deputy chief information officer for people science and chief people officer. I think we used to call that human resources. Is that correct? Okay. Thank you.
▶ 0:27:38And finally, we have Miss Carol Harris, the director of information technology and cyber security at the Government Accountability Office. And I was telling my staff, Carol, that I think we're just going to have to get you an office in the Canon building at this point since you're here as frequently as you are. And we appreciate your uh willingness to come participate and uh give us your insight. So, thank you all. I ask the witnesses to please stand and raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear under penalty of perjury that the testimony you're about to provide is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
▶ 0:28:10Thank you. And let the record reflect that all witnesses have answered in the affirmative. Uh Mr. P, you are now recognized for five minutes to deliver your opening statement on behalf of EA. Thank you, Chairman. Chairman Barrett, Ranking Member Bazinski, uh and distinguished members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to testify on behalf of the Department of Veterans Affairs, Office of Information and Technology.
▶ 0:28:34Um, I am Eddie Performing the delegable duties of the Assistant Secretary for OINT, uh, and VA's Chief Information Officer. I'm honored to appear before you to provide an update on the status of OINT and the critical work we are doing to deliver secure, modern, and veteran veteran centered IT solutions. I am accompanied by my colleagues, Dr.
▶ 0:28:59Timothy Pittz, chief financial officer and deputy CIO for IT budget and finance, Mr. Jack Galvin, deputy CIO for end-user services and acting principal deputy assistant secretary for OINT, and Miss Devin Beard, acting deputy CIO and chief people officer for the Office of People Science. Today I will focus on three strategic imperatives. Budget optimization, workforce reshaping, and cyber security dominance.
▶ 0:29:29First, the budget. We are executing a bold mission first approach so every dollar delivers maximum value to our nation's veterans. Over the past few months, we have conducted an exhaustive review of our budgets, resulting in the immediate reinvestment of $89 million into infrastructure readiness programs with an additional 100 million poised for strategic reinvestment.
▶ 0:29:53We have intensified contract oversight and enforced accountability with acquisition partners without degrading service delivery. And in many instances, we have enhanced delivery of those We are consolidating VA's digital experience into a single modern platform with the goal of securely and seamlessly delivering the benefits and services to our nation's veterans.
▶ 0:30:16This platform now supports over 16 million monthly unique users along with over three million veterans who have downloaded the VA mobile app. Our overarching goal is to bring VA to the veteran through this platform.
▶ 0:30:32Additionally, we are launching an initiative to consolidate VA contact centers to deliver an improved experience for veterans, whether they reach us by phone, chat, text, or other To further optimize, we are requesting changes to appropriation language to eliminate rigid statutory sub accounts and authorize a three-year availability for IT funds.
▶ 0:30:55This will empower VA to plan and execute with greater agility, align investments with outcomes, and minimize procurement risk and operational delays. Second, the workforce. We are reshaping OIT's workforce to achieve veteran facing outcomes with speed and precision through participation in OPM and VA deferred retirement programs and early voluntary early retirement authorities.
▶ 0:31:2078% of voluntary departures resulted in In our reshaping efforts, we are simplifying our organizational structure and reallocating and aligning positions to critical IT functions.
▶ 0:31:34This reorganization and reallocation of positions is designed to cut bureaucratic overhead, accelerate decision-m and focus every OINT position on delivering secure, reliable, and modern IT solutions to improve veterans And finally, cyber security. Cyber security threats are not static and neither is our posture.
▶ 0:31:57We are pivoting from compliance-based checkboxes to dynamic threatinformed defenses with proactive risk mitigation to stay ahead of evolving threats. This shift demands that FSMA and FISCAM audits accurately reflect the complexity and operational re reality of VA's massive digital infrastructure.
▶ 0:32:18We are implementing zerorust architecture enterprisewide, instilling a security first mindset that includes rigorous identity verification, continuous monitoring, and strict access Our success requires continued reinvestment in modern cyber security tools, skilled personnel, and rigorous standardized processes. The sensitive information we steward demands nothing less than unwavering vigilance and worldclass cyber defenses.
▶ 0:32:50In conclusion, the changes we are are focused on a single mission delivering unparalleled life-changing outcomes to Americans America's veterans. We are not simply modernizing IT systems. We are building a future ready VA where platforms are secure, teams are agile, and every taxpayer dollar generates maximum impact for the veterans we serve.
▶ 0:33:19And with that, I welcome your questions. Thank you, Mr. P. And uh your written statement will be entered into the hearing record. Um and I assume um the rest of your panel from VA is is accounted for in your remarks as well. Thank you. Uh we'll now go to Miss Harris. You're recognized for five minutes to deliver your opening statement on behalf of GAO. Thank you, Chairman Barrett and Ranking Member Binski.
▶ 0:33:44I appreciate the opportunity to talk about VA as you examine the department's planned efforts to reform within its office of information technology. VA operates and maintains an IT infrastructure that is intended to provide the backbone necessary to meet the day-to-day operational needs of its medical centers, veteran facing systems, benefits delivery systems, memorial services, and all other systems supporting the department's mission. It is also responsible for protecting veteran data against cyber security threats.
▶ 0:34:14We have reported on VA's challenges with managing a myriad of major IT acquisitions and operations such as software licensing and cloud procurement over the years. VA's track record of delivering failed or troubled IT systems is in large part why we designated VA healthcare as a high-risisk area for the federal government in 2015. We also added VA acquisition management to our high-risisk list in 2019 due to challenges with managing its acquisition workforce and inadequate strategies and policies among other things.
▶ 0:34:45Both areas remain high-risisk today. As requested, I'll highlight some key reform efforts of VA's IT26 FY26 IT budget request and then our work on leading practices and selected questions for assessing agency VA has requested $7.3 billion to fund its IT systems in FY26, an almost $300 million overall decrease from the prior year.
▶ 0:35:11It has also requested funding to support roughly 7,000 full-time equivalent employees, which is an overall decrease of about 11.7% from the 2025 enacted levels. Additionally, the budget requests proposed amounts also reflect reduced spending on duplicative legacy systems and pauses in procurement of new systems until VA can conduct a full review of them, resulting in about a $500 million reduction.
▶ 0:35:36Further, VA's request states that a reduction of 931 full-time equivalents is consistent with maturing technology delivery models and a shift toward automation and digital We have found that effective reform efforts require a combination of people, processes, technologies, and other critical success factors to achieve results.
▶ 0:35:57Our prior work work describes 12 leading practices that federal agencies can use in agency reform efforts, including efforts to streamline and improve the efficiency and effectiveness of operations. These 12 practices fall into four broad categories, such as the process for developing reforms and strategically managing the federal workforce. Our prior work also identifies key questions that can be used to assess the development and implementation of agency reforms.
▶ 0:36:24For example, what data and evidence has the agency used to develop and justify its proposed reforms? How has the agency ensured their continued delivery of services during reform To what extent has the agency conducted strategic workforce planning to determine whether it will have the needed resources and capacity, including the skills and competencies in place for the proposed reforms?
▶ 0:36:48Consideration of these leading practices and relevant questions can benefit VA's development and implementation of its reform efforts. My hope is that VA will be able to satisfactorily answer these key questions for you today and if not be able to pivot to do the work necessary and adjust plans accordingly to be able to give you satisfactory responses in the near future.
▶ 0:37:09Because if these leading practices and relevant questions are effectively implemented, such efforts can result in success in overcoming VA's long history of ineffectively managing IT resources. On a final note, we have 26 open recommendations that relate to VA's IT operations and cyber security posture. They are foundational in nature, so I strongly urge the department to get those fully addressed quickly. Doing so will put them in a stronger position to succeed in many of their planned reform initiatives.
▶ 0:37:38That concludes my statement, and I look forward to addressing your questions. Thank you for your uh testimony, Miss Harris, and the written statement uh you provided will be entered into the hearing record. Uh from there from here rather we will proceed with questioning. I'll recognize myself for five minutes. Um again thank you all for uh participating in today's hearing. Um Mr. P wanted to begin with your uh statements and has some questions for you.
▶ 0:38:06Um the FY2026 budget document that OIT has laid out a smarter not bigger IT strategy. Um, can you give me some examples of how OIT is not being as smart as they could be currently? Thank you, Mr. Chairman, uh, for the question. Um, to your comments that you made in your opening remarks, um, I believe it was the stuff that was never used. Um, that's stuff that we are no longer doing.
▶ 0:38:36Um, so our budget for 26 and beyond will be spent on things that again have drive maximum value to the to the veteran community. Um, and things that don't have a use or don't provide value uh or maximum value, those will be repurposed uh and reinvested where again we're getting the biggest bang for our buck for the veterans of this country as they deserve. Thank you. I appreciate that.
▶ 0:39:01Um uh from there, can you tell me how you are reorganizing your workforce to deliver services more efficiently um through the process improvement that you kind of touched on in your opening remarks? Sure. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Again, for OINT's reorganization, we are focusing again not just our uh investment capital, but our human capital as well.
▶ 0:39:27making sure that our organization is aligned to effectively deliver the most most significant outcomes that we can for the department. Um so where we have things that again are not driving significant value we are um looking analyzing and and realigning those functions to again bring that um bring those outcomes that we're after.
▶ 0:39:48So essentially we are we're simply making sure that every decision that we make, every dollar we spend, every realignment re repurpose re you know everything that we do um again our northstar is that we're driving absolute maximum value for the department and in turn the the the greatest impact we can make on the veteran community. Thank you.
▶ 0:40:09Would you uh would you agree with me that um essentially it and this technological improvement is done to alleviate the need for more manual human-driven processes that we can rely more on automated features or more uh process improvement. um thereby requiring us to have fewer manual processes in there and as a result fewer people involved in that that chain of activity going on.
▶ 0:40:39Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, absolutely. It it is about um automating where we can automate, working smarter um not harder. Um absolutely. Yeah. I don't think we're in it's not the position of me or or certainly of others I assume on this committee to completely automate anything to the point that we don't have human interaction in in the process to to bring about the best outcome necessary.
▶ 0:41:03But I think um since the dawn of technology we've used it to do things that alleviate the the necessitation of of manual you know processes and labor along the way. um the discussion around reduction in in some of the uh IT staff around 12%. I think Miss Harris pinpointed it a little bit more at 11 something close to 12%.
▶ 0:41:29Um can you give us some insight into what that would involve and and who would who exactly would be impacted by that? Thank you m Mr. Chairman for the question. Yes. Um in terms of the overall staffing numbers today we are at approximately 8,205 uh FTEES.
▶ 0:41:50Um as part of our organizational reshaping uh a lot of those um billets are being looked at analyzed and like I said u the the goal is not to reduce necessarily any numbers but it's to make sure that we're optimizing how we allocate those resources. Um I I will turn it over to uh Miss Devin Beard who can speak a little bit more about um the breakdown of the numbers for you. Thank you. Thank you, Eddie.
▶ 0:42:15So, yes, we are currently about a decrease of a 100 employees from the start of January and we did participate in the OPM, VA and Vera program within the VA. Those were sprinkled across our organization, but we were able to sustain those without any impact to our veterans due to secession planning, cross trainining, upskilling, reassignments, the tools that are in our toolkit to make sure that we every day have the resources that we need to meet our Met veterans. Thank you.
▶ 0:42:45Can you uh briefly, I've only got about 15 seconds left. Can you confirm that no position with uh actual IT application like interfacing, coding, things of that sort are being um eliminated throughout any of this process. Once again, we're going through the workforce reshaping activities. Those are all being focused on are they delivering the largest value. So, as long as they align with our guiding light, then absolutely we are retaining those so we can meet our mission. Okay.
▶ 0:43:15Um I was told in some briefing ahead of this that it was mostly in support not direct IT interfacing positions but more in the supportive roles of that. Can you confirm that? Yes I can confirm a lot of the back office or uh administrative type support functions are absolutely being evaluated uh as you mentioned in your opening. Do the processes that we have today need to remain in the way that they are?
▶ 0:43:43Are there redundancies of builtup overtime that we need to re-evaluate and make sure that we can um accomplish what's still needed but do it in the most effective manner? Thank you. Uh ranking member Bazinski for five Thank you chairman and I'll actually try to pick up where um you left off here and my question was going to be for Mr. P, but I'll open it up to Miss Spirit as well if you have the answers to this. But so were you just saying that there are a hundred people that have taken either the DRP or the Vera?
▶ 0:44:13They've accepted res you've accepted their resignations 100 people within OIT. Is that what you'd said? Um let me hand it over to uh Miss Beard uh ranking member. Um it's actually uh not 100. It's it's actually somewhat north of that. So So our total participation in the programs is 1,172 as of today. Okay. That that took advantage of one of those two. Okay.
▶ 0:44:41And then when you were talking about and I appreciate what you were saying that these are folks that are providing support. I guess my concern is that support though does support the overall mission of OIT. So at what level or what point does um th that type of a level of vacancies then erode the overall mission of OIT? And I guess I'll direct this to you Mr. P.
▶ 0:45:02if you could kind of further elaborate on when you were accepting these um early retirements or resignations, how did you kind of consider that when they came to you? Does it in any way erode what you're trying to accomplish within OIT? Yeah, thank you uh Ricky Member Bazinski. Yes.
▶ 0:45:21Um to answer your question um this is largely an opportunity where we have looked at where duplicated functions exist within IT and where these administrative functions are being performed elsewhere. I'll use HR as an example where in Ont we built our own IT function within the IT department. Um this is a shared service that we can get from the department level HR uh areas.
▶ 0:45:48So um that in itself is a pretty significant opportunity where we are able to re basically reinvest um back into the you know mission focused functions of it to be as again as as missionfacing mission purposed as we possibly can.
▶ 0:46:05So I guess just to would it be possible to provide to this subcommittee kind of a list of you know who participated in this reorganization and where these um these resignations or early retirements have come just so we can kind of better understand. I appreciate the example you gave with HR but obviously if it's well north of a thousand people um you know just concerned about where all those are coming from. Yes. Uh yes Congress we can absolutely do that. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 0:46:34Can I just ask then, Miss Harris, could you kind of elaborate a little bit on, you know, what you've been able to observe as far as OIT's workforce planning and how they looked at this? I know they've done a significant amount of restructuring. Yeah. So, back in January of 2025, we actually um issued a report evaluating VA's um cyber workforce in particular, but I think of those trends can probably be applied across OIT.
▶ 0:47:00Uh what we found was OIT's strategic workforce plan was incomplete. They don't have an inventory of their current workforce skills and competencies. So in terms of if you know with a restructuring not even having a baseline of what it is that they have, it's going to be difficult to tell okay um from there what is it that that you're going to project to and what you're going to need in the future. Um they also didn't comprehensively identify their current and future human capital needs, skills, and competencies.
▶ 0:47:29So, those are essential things that you're going to need with any reform effort. Whatever your goals are and and objectives are for a reform effort, you're going to need to make sure that the workforce matches that that need. And so, being able to have those processes in place and have a complete picture of your what you currently have and what you need to have in the future to match your reform effort, that's essential. And right now, um, VA does not have that that capability. We have open recommendations related to that. Okay.
▶ 0:48:00Could I just Mr. P ask you to kind of respond to that? I would be curious kind of how you might have looked through your process in in um these different um early retirements etc. What processes were in place and and talk a little bit more about that and kind of trying to meet this metric I think the GAO is pointing out being important to the overall again the mission of OIT. Uh yes, thank you for the the question again, Congresswoman.
▶ 0:48:27We looked at um every single one of the individuals that took advantage of these opportunities and assess that from a leadership perspective to ensure that this would not create any operational gaps or introduce unnecessary risk to the department. Um and where we in going through that process, we made certain that um in order to honor the requests, the voluntary requests that were being submitted that again we had mitigation strategies in place to ensure continuity of operations.
▶ 0:48:54And um uh as I mentioned previously, it gave us the opportunity to actually bring efficiencies in some areas and optimize some of those processes and workflows to really um again provide a better outcome for the department. So it was very very rationalized and very very closely analyzed as we went about that process. I think I'm out of time but I'll yield back for now. Thank you. It's uh Sherless McCormack for five minutes.
▶ 0:49:21Thank you Chair Barrett and thank you ranking member Bodinsky for convening today's hearing. Um, as a former healthcare executive and former ranking member of this subcommittee, I understand that information technology is vital in delivering worldclass health care and fulfilling our sacred promise to our veterans. I also know that significant significant organizational change can be disruptive but often necessary. The way Doge and Mr. VA have approached this change these changes at OIT seem intentionally cruel.
▶ 0:49:51I've heard you are trying to write this ship and recognize the valuable contributions of VA employees while implementing the change. Mr. P, what other steps are you taking to repair employee morale? Uh, thank you for the question, Congresswoman. It's a good opportunity to talk about uh the bigger picture at VA. Obviously, change is very challenging. In this particular instance, change is very necessary.
▶ 0:50:18It's an opportunity under this administration um to really improve um things at VA on a scale really not seen before. So as we go about that, we're doing very frequent communications. Um we have a lot of activities underway. We have surveying and taking a pulse of the of the organization again just to check in and make sure um you know the workforce is is getting the information that they need.
▶ 0:50:43uh particularly through the DRP programs, we made certain that we had uh lots of frequent communications, lots of options, lots of questions and answers with the workforce so that the the employees could make the best decision for themselves and the families with given the opportunities present. And what are you doing to bolster retention efforts? To bolster retention efforts, we are again making our mission focus back on on the veteran.
▶ 0:51:08you know, we are focusing exclusively on trying to optimize everything that we do to drive maximum value and I think that in itself has been a uniter uh with the staff uh and a good good focus for the organization to really again focus on our core mission. You know, what what can we do to improve services to veterans across the board through Do you have any mechanisms in place that can actually track feedback to make sure that you're getting the desired effect? Yes, uh Congressman, we absolutely do.
▶ 0:51:38In fact, I will yield to uh uh Miss Miss Beard who will talk a little bit more about those mechanisms. Yes, thank you for the questions. During a time of change is so important to have strong communications with the staff and make sure that we're providing back the visibility and understanding the why we are doing what we're doing. Since uh January especially, we've been we've been doing a lot of uh town halls and other communications. Uh we have an over an 80% satisfaction rate with over 78% attendance.
▶ 0:52:06So good saturation along with strong satisfaction. In the development side, we also have released uh a career development portal for all categories along the NIST cyber security codes uh for employees that focuses on not only assessing their current skills and upskilling into the areas they want to do. So our focus around retention is not only to take care of them now, but also take care of what the VA is going to need and what they need to continue their growth here with OIT. Thank you.
▶ 0:52:36My next question has to do with the chief information security officer since there's been significant changes within the organization. How much involvement has the CISO had? Uh thank you, Congresswoman. She has been involved as has her executive team. I believe that organization has uh four executives in the department. Um what we've done is primarily focus on the operational aspects.
▶ 0:53:02Um and then again with the SISO herself that's going to be more focused on the policy side of things. Um operationally we're looking at those immediate immediate concerns but as we evolve and grow uh throughout this reshaping effort um this will be probably much more involvement on the policy side and how much control and execution um control does she have? Congressman I'm not sure I understand the question.
▶ 0:53:28Well, how much control, operational control over the execution does the um CISO have since that person is going to be held accountable? How much control do they have? Uh, Congresswoman, I would say quite a bit of control. I mean, this is an environment where we um welcome feedback from from all areas of the organization. Um, and where that is available to collect and inform our strategy, we certainly maximize the opportunity to collect that.
▶ 0:53:56And why is the CISO not here today? Congresswoman, I can't really speak to that. I know that uh operationally most of the components for our reshaping u are being aligned more towards the technical operations side of the organization. Again, moving security functions where the next to the operations they support and most of that is under Mr. Jack Galvin to my left. Um and so I thought given the organizational direction we're going, it would probably be better to have Mr.
▶ 0:54:23Galvin here to speak to some of those Since I only have a second left, I just want to say that I just do have some deep concerns that we'll be holding this person accountable and they're not here to actually talk about the level of control they have and what they've been how they've been participating. Thank you. I yield back. Thank you. Uh I will recognize myself for five uh minutes. Uh again, uh Mr. Galvin, I want to make sure we get your uh parking validated for your participation today. So, I got to ask you a question.
▶ 0:54:52Um, OIT has gone through reorganizations in the past. Um, can you tell me what's different about this current reorganization and what lessons learned we've had that we can apply to this process uh that we're in now? Sure. Thanks for that question, Chair. Uh, you know, uh, I think the big game changer for this one is the singular focus that the administration has put on standardization and priority on veteran outcome.
▶ 0:55:18You know when you had your hearing on the software asset management for instance you know we're having conversations now that we it's it's on the how not the why. We're all in sync with what we're priority what our priorities are. So saving you know uh duplication u enabling functions for software for instance that you know don't duplicate but solve the requirement at hand you know I think that's the uh big gamecher I think or change in this organizational change than uh you know in the past I've
▶ 0:55:48been through many of them um each one is built upon each other you know I'd like to say that uh you know principles have staying powers there's priorities that change but principles of operation especially in IT have staying power and you know we still have the principle of cyber security the protection of veteran uh data the uh you know performance service performance uh ensuring we're accountable for system uh reliability and accountability I think to speak to some of the other conversation is there's there's an excitement building now
▶ 0:56:18uh to deliver uh you know real outcomes you know ehrm acceleration I mean we're chomping at the bit to show that you know in your area in Michigan you know we're ready to go our four sites in Michigan are already prepared in terms of their heavy lift uh IT infrastructure. We have a complete dashboard that shows every site in across the VA in terms of their readiness status.
▶ 0:56:40In fact, all 13 sites in the next year in FY26 are ready in those four key areas of you know devices, uh network infrastructure, wireless all of that is done already. In fact, next year we'll be working on FY27 thanks to Dr. pits here and keeping a steady flow of the infrastructure readiness program and the funding that we have for technical debt. Thank you. I uh I appreciate that. Um and I understood some of what you said. So that was uh that was helpful.
▶ 0:57:11Um the um uh the to me it feels like in the past some of what we were doing with technology was like layering on, stacking up. Instead of replacing systems with one another, we were kind of adding to and layering up and up and up. And next thing you know, we've got so many systems, there's not as many unique users using each one of them.
▶ 0:57:31But nobody wants to give up the legacy model of whatever they had that they were used to using instead of kind of learning along the way and upgrading into what they what they were, you know, more familiar with. I remember when uh what was it? one of the legacy uh Windows uh versions finally stopped being supported and people were struggling to you know move up to whatever the next or newer generation of that was.
▶ 0:57:55Um sometimes that's necessary and I feel like with technology we can't move at the pace of the slowest participant. We have to move at the pace that is necessary to move the organization along and I think that having that in mind is important.
▶ 0:58:10Um, I've I've heard the secretary speak a number of times at some of his observations and how when he walked in the door on his first day, he couldn't even know how many people were in the department and where they were all assigned because you had different payroll systems and different human resources management systems and all these other things that are not again not delivering care and benefits to veterans. They are simply the the you know running the system itself.
▶ 0:58:36um and uh they are kind of a a drag if you will on the efficiency of the overall system if we have duplicative processes and more than one system in place doing the same thing or this you know part of the department over here is using this thing but this department's using that they do the same or they have the same purpose but they're now duplicative in nature and then you've got to have IT resources designed to cover both of those when instead you could have one that covers the total system.
▶ 0:59:03So, uh, I think that there's a lot there that can be done better. I think I hope that we all recognize that, especially when it relates to, uh, to it. Um, uh, Dr. Pitts, can you tell us um from your perspective, how important is it from a resource allocation perspective to have an efficiently organized workforce specifically around these IT projects so that people kind of know their mission and they have the site focus that they need?
▶ 0:59:34Thank you for the question, chairman. When we talk about resources, people and money, it's only as effective as we put against the actions that drive outcomes. So, it is very important to answer your question that we have that aligned. Like we talked about in the beginning, it's not about bigger budgets, it's about smarter budgets. And so, that's where that alignment occurs.
▶ 1:00:00Do you have the traceability from the dollars that were requested through the activities that they're invested in to ultimately what is produced for the veteran at the end of the day? It's about setting controls uh working with IG to have a control environment to make sure that the plan is enacted as as as placed by the Thank you. I appreciate that. I am uh out of time on on this round of questions. So I will yield to ranking member Bazinski for five minutes.
▶ 1:00:30Just like to say I you know I hear you when you're say this is about smarter not bigger. Part of today is not anybody's talking about bigger. We're talking about bigger cuts. The cuts that are actually happening and what that's going to mean um for what the mission is for OIT. That's that's more of that is my concern. I do want to go back to this question about staffing and and the the lower levels of staffing through the DRP, the Vera and then natural attrition. Mr.
▶ 1:00:57P, if I could ask you, OIT staffing looks now lower um than what was budgeted than what is budgeted for fiscal year 2026. Will OIT now need to rehire staff actually after essentially paying employees to leave? Thank you, Congresswoman, for the question. Yes. Uh we will likely need to continue to hire folks just as we will in perpetuity. It's a cyclical thing.
▶ 1:01:25You've got people coming in, going out, different life cycles of the employment process. Uh many of the folks that left were again retirement eligible. As I mentioned before, 78% of those resulted in retirements. Um and so we will continue to recruit. We will bring in new folks to the workforce. Um, and as we do that, we'll be focusing exclusively on mission.
▶ 1:01:47So whereas we might have hired across the board previously, we're going to be looking at prioritizing for the most again value added opportunities and how we're driving the mission forward for the department as we recruit. Yeah. So, and I can imagine you could hire new folks, but I mean for those that have left, do you imagine having to rehire any of them because the the vacancy itself is too critical? They left. We need to bring them back. Can you see that happening? Uh, Congresswoman, no, I I wouldn't see that happening.
▶ 1:02:15You know, again, as we went through this process, we put a lot of of of rigor behind how we um approved uh folks that wanted to take advantage of these opportunities and again making sure that we didn't create any operational gaps. And so, it would be uh highly unlikely that we would be hiring folks back as a contingency.
▶ 1:02:35many of them are um again available to the end of the year, but I don't anticipate that being a contingency we'd have to And I should just say like some of my concern is coming from the fact that over the last eight years it seems like OIT staff, the OIT department has been saying we're way understaffed and now we've seen um a major attrition of of employees over just this last six months. So I guess that's part of where my concern is.
▶ 1:03:02But the question I'd also have is how are you then prioritizing when you're talking about mission and we want everything to be missiondriven of course but within that mission you're going to have to make probably with less staff some really hard decisions on what is prioritized and what is not. Can you walk me through what that looks like? Yes, certainly.
▶ 1:03:22Um you know it goes back to the opportunity here with You know, previously in the construct that you you referred to, OINT would be positioned to support maybe five, six, seven, 10 or more um similar type workflows, capabilities or systems across the department for one set of um as the department standardized down to a real enterprise process on how we do business
▶ 1:03:53that allows OINT to come in and really automate an enterprise solution around those functions. And so that in itself um will be a tremendous um um efficiency driver for how we staff the organization. Um and then second, as I mentioned previously as well, we have a number of administrative functions that we've have grown into the organization.
▶ 1:04:15We have a lot of things that don't are not a pure IT focused mission that are consuming resources within the department and we're no different than the rest of the organization. We're going to get back to our core mission which is delivering it and where we can get services and functions from other places in the department that are not IT related we will be pursuing that. Could you give me an example of what that would be? Sure. I'll go back to the example of HR.
▶ 1:04:42you know, we um in it over the previous uh administration decided uh to build our own HR function within the office of information technology that consumes 300 plus resources to do that. At the department level, we do have um an HR department. We have several HR options within the organization. And so again, it doesn't make a lot of sense uh financially or otherwise to uh build that function inhouse when we can leverage the department level resources for that.
▶ 1:05:12And I appreciate what you're saying about standardization because this comes up a lot and when we've been talking about the er ehrm um moving that forward standardization seems to be really important but I would just kind of point out my bigger concern here is without enough people power to help the VA actually and OIT standardize that could set yourself up for failure if you don't have the people to do the standardization because the VA is such a unique place and has a lot of challenges as it relates to standardization. So maybe easier said than done.
▶ 1:05:43So I'll yield back. Thank you. Um I'll now recognize myself for five minutes again. Um Mr. P wanted to uh circle back just for a moment on something the ranking member just asked you. You said there are 300 uh under the previous administration there were 300 people in the HR part of the OIT. Is that correct? Doing HR functions. Uh yeah, Mr. chairman, that was a estimate around 300.
▶ 1:06:11Um, I believe Miss Beard has the exact number if you wanted or we can take that for the record, but roughly 300 resources. So, 300 out of 8,200 were doing HR functions that could have been or would have otherwise been done by the department as a whole and absorbed into the workflow of the department into the I'm sure robust HR portfolio of managing 400 and some odd thousand people within the department. Would you say that's fairly accurate? Absolutely, Mr. Chairman. I mean, again, that does put it in great perspective.
▶ 1:06:41You know, we have 8,200 folks roughly in Ont. Do we need a 300 plus person organization to do our own? Um, we're driving the business to standardize on common technologies. We we will do the same. Yeah. Miss Beard, do you have anything further on that? Yeah, I just do have the number. It's 242.
▶ 1:07:04We do have some additional upcoming attritions through the programs of impacting that, but but do reinforce the focus about how we can once again make sure we still get the services we need for OIN to meet our veterans needs, but also make sure that we have the capabilities to achieve that through the HR functions. Sure. And is that roughly 300 or 242 or the number you gave me, is that included in the roughly,00 uh that you talked about in like deferred um retirements, things of that sort?
▶ 1:07:34Uh yes, Mr. Chairman, it's it's spread across the board. It's really uh you know, again, we did not exempt any positions um as part of that from a perspective for the DRP programs or And so that 1100 consists of multiple different domains and areas within the Sure.
▶ 1:07:52But they also those 300 people I'm not minimizing or or suggesting they don't have a legitimate you know work ethic or anything but if that job can be done on an aggregated level there's not a reduction in benefit for a veteran or a delayed in a claim or anything of that sort that would result from that job being done by a higher level department Yes Mr. Chairman, that's correct. You know, again, and it is um those no Chinese cyber attacks are affected by that.
▶ 1:08:20No, you know, uh no update to the mobile app that that I use or veterans like me use throughout um the management of our claim or or interfacing with the VA. So, okay. Thank you. Um Mr. Pool, VA's um budget documents describe a buy before build strategy. I think that's a good insight into some of the motivation for how we make this better.
▶ 1:08:45You know, do we have to design it from the ground up or can we take something that is pre-existing and kind of, you know, modify it for our use within the department? Can you kind of give me some insight into how that works and what the motivation behind it was? Uh, yes, Mr. Chairman. Uh, again, thank you for the question. It's a it's a really good one in terms of how we um are approaching optimizing the organization.
▶ 1:09:06So the the the buy versus build is really driven by the the need to look at enterprise standard tools out there today that can deliver functionality for the department. Um previously we've invested in building and building and building and so we have a very large portfolio of products that are custom. Uh they're built and maintained and we're perpetually stuck um and a lot of those get into the legacy portfolio.
▶ 1:09:33Um when you go out and buy capability from industry um you can generally get that an enterprise platform that you can consolidate a standard workflow and process for the department on um and maintain and keep that system modernized and again it's just a much better model um with that comes increased cyber security um a lot of other you know efficiencies in terms of you know just how we maintain those Sure. I uh I I appreciate that.
▶ 1:10:01I I had worked previously in our state treasures office a number of years ago and we were using legacy systems that were built from the ground up and we were having a hard time finding servers that would actually run them any longer. These things were like 30 years old at the time. Um and that was just one hardship that we were encountering.
▶ 1:10:20Whereas if you have a process or you have a product that is purchased off the market, it has the robust backbone necessary to kind of keep it functional and running just you know as one example and necessitates less maintenance over time and people um doing that to be sure. Um I am uh almost out of time so I'm going to yield to the ranking member for for five minutes for her questions. Thank you. Thank you Mr. Chairman. Um Mr. pool.
▶ 1:10:45Can you tell me why are millions of dollars being transferred out of OIT to plus of other parts of the department when there are nearly 20 unadressed unfunded priorities on the one to end list? Uh thank you, Congresswoman. You know, I can't really speak much about what's driving uh transfers. I can speak about what we're investing in OINT in. Um I turn it over to Dr. Pittz.
▶ 1:11:11Maybe he can provide some more insight for you on There's two two uh specific things that we need to address to your question. The first is that there is OIT but we are driving the larger department and for the needs for veterans across the entire department.
▶ 1:11:31So at the end of the day we may have a one to end list but VA has also has a one to end list and sometimes the other administrations and staff offices may have a priority above it and that is a decision that it sits with the secretary. The second aspect of that is you asked about the one to end list that exists within OIT.
▶ 1:11:52It's important to remember that when we submit that one to end list as part of our congressional justification that is a point in time and since and since that time when that is submitted we almost immediately start funding into and against that list. So that list that you've seen we've been able to start to drive down our one to end list. We look at this monthly with our end of month close and where we are able to identify savings.
▶ 1:12:19we're able to reinvest in in real time. So, we don't wait for the end of the year to come and then pay down our one to end list. It's happening in real time. So, again, with budgets, it's point in time and good organizations um aren't just planning for the future. They're they're moving in real time to create it. So, a follow-up question to that because I did to take time to look at the one to end list and like the top five, you know, issues. One was cyber security and incident report.
▶ 1:12:48The second was data privacy and security. The third was governance, risk and compliance. Um you go to fifth, it's threat and vulnerability management. These are all at the very top of the one to end list. Um and those sound very serious to me. So what you're saying is that those have been resolved. So in the opening testimony from Mr. pool.
▶ 1:13:09You've seen that when we were here last year about this time, we said that we are carrying some risk within our cyber security and IRP and that we will uh fund against that to uh really buy down that risk. So that's exactly my question. Excuse me. Excuse me. So that's my question though is you've transferred money away.
▶ 1:13:32My understanding though is that if if you if those millions of dollars, you know, the fiscal year 2026 budget requests um 434.2 million decrease um uh from fiscal year 2025. That difference alone from what we understand would basically solve 70% of what's on that one to end list. Yes ma'am, that is correct.
▶ 1:13:56I can also say that we have invested over a hundred million in our IRP and I just signed off documentation to uh put a major investment within our ZTA just in the last few days. So the funding is being redirected to these key priorities and we're we're spending down against that Okay. Um Mr. Mr. Pool, your testimony highlights a reinvestment of nearly 200 million from contract cancellations.
▶ 1:14:26Can you provide the committee a full list of contracts canceled within OIT and where this money is being reinvested? Uh, thank you, Congressman. Yes, we can take that back for the record and uh provide uh a list uh um as as requested. Um I would like to just add on the last question. Um, just for clarity, you know, our one to end list are a capturing of requirements, whether they be valid requirements or things that we'd like to do. These are outside of our base budget.
▶ 1:14:56Normally, these are things that we know are unfunded largely uh that we would we we will be able to fund um as funding becomes available, you know, from a from for various reasons. Um, this is how we prioritize those lists. So, the ones that you mentioned on top, those are largely ones that you can normally assume will be funded. is when you get further down the list, it's just a racking and stacking to make sure that we capture those requirements and then we can invest in those as we're able to do do um throughout the fiscal year.
▶ 1:15:26So, just to clarify, so you're saying that with the 434 million that's being cut from OIT's budget in fiscal year 2026, you're still going to be able to resolve all of that on the one to end list. Congressman, like I mentioned previously with the standardization approach to how we're approaching things. Um again the reference to where we may have 20 30 different similar capabilities in the environment today.
▶ 1:15:50Uh consolidating down to one enterprise platform uh you know again the opportunity from a fiscal perspective is pretty substantial. So yes I do believe with the funding that we have we will be able to meet uh the majority of our Okay. I have a question about Doge. Was was Doge or any of its representatives involved in the contracts that were we don't have Doge employees at VA.
▶ 1:16:17Um, and I do understand that there is um being sensitive to ongoing litigation that I'm aware is underway. Um, we'll have to refer you to our office of general counsel uh for a followup on Okay. I'm over time. Sorry about that. That's okay. We're going to move to uh closing statements.
▶ 1:16:36So, I want to recognize you for your uh closing Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you again to the witnesses for being here. I hope that both VA and OIT leadership have heard the concerns that I've raised today.
▶ 1:17:01I'm not I'm not one for maintaining the status quo nor throwing money at issues needlessly. I am not one for maintaining the status quo. And again, I I do believe in missiondriven work. So, I appreciated those comments. Improvements to VA's organizational structure, processes, and strategies, and operational workload can and should occur.
▶ 1:17:25However, as the ranking member of the subcommittee on jurisdiction of this jurisdiction, I believe that this change must happen methodically and must be driven by data. VA's IT Foundation will not continue to support the department's mission otherwise. Unfortunately, I've not heard today anything that really reassures me here. VA's answers have not indicated that the reorganization, staffing, or budgetary decisions were reached using data or evidence-based strategic thinking.
▶ 1:17:53I'm concerned that this was rushed to be finalized before a new permanent CIO could be confirmed. I would hope that the department could would delay implement implementing such drastic changes until a CIO can be appropriately named, vetted, and confirmed. Mr. Pool, I hope that we and your team can continue our dialogue here and ensure that OIT can find the right balance in terms of structure and staffing.
▶ 1:18:18The work for employ your employees perform undergirds much of the work VA performs and I want that talent to be recognized, appreciated and cultivated. I hope you and whoever is confirmed as the next CIO share that same desire. Thank you and I yield back. Thank you ranking member Bazinski and thank you to our panelists for being here today. Appreciate your insight and testimony uh to helping us drive uh you know good decision- making within this committee. So thank you.
▶ 1:18:46Um, OIT, it stands hopefully without saying, but it has an important mission and many competing priorities and we even saw some of that on display here today. But when everything becomes a priority, nothing then reaches the top of the list, right? And uh, we have to do a job of determining within those priorities what stands out as our most necessary uh, attention.
▶ 1:19:07I'm glad to see that under Secretary Collins leadership, OIT is re-evaluating where they are investing, how they are utilizing their workforce, what they can do to be a more efficient organization. No organization, not even the federal government, has unlimited resources. During this hearing, we have discussed several important steps that OIT is taking as part of its smarter not bigger strategy to become a more effective and efficient organization.
▶ 1:19:34Starting fewer large development projects that come with the risk of ballooning budgets and poor outcomes. Re-evaluating the current organizational structure in order to make OIT a smarter and more resourceful organization. Investing in IT infrastructure, cyber security monitoring, and reducing technical debt to make VA more resilient. And some of the things, Mr.
▶ 1:19:54Pool, that you pointed out about enterprisewide largescale systems that can be delivered more efficiently and with greater um cyber security are important to to see and review. I look forward to working with the OIT witnesses here today and uh m and once Mr. Code is confirmed to accomplish these goals and more. As the chairman of this subcommittee, I will continue to ensure that OIT has the right priorities, the appropriate responsibilities, and is organized in a way that best supports the VA's mission.
▶ 1:20:24I ask unanimous consent that all members have five legislative days to revise and extend their remarks and include extraneous material. Without objection, that's so ordered. And this hearing is