▶ 0:03:50The Subcommittee on Early childhood, elementary, and secondary education will come to order. I note that a quorum is present. Without objection, the chair is authorized to call recess at any time. The notion that every student should go to college was perhaps well-intended, but it was never compatible with the needs of young people or of our country. While every student should have the opportunity to go to college, this is not the only path to success.
▶ 0:04:17Thankfully, in recent years, we've seen a renewed commitment to supporting alternate alternate pathways, in particular, career and technical While CTE is not new, its value has often been overlooked or dismissed in recent decades as the fallback option for students who don't fit into the traditional academic mold. Today, there is no denying its critical role in preparing the workforce for a skills-forward economy. CTE is for students who want to build, create, and lead. It is for students who learn best by doing.
▶ 0:04:49Over 8 million secondary school students nationwide are already participating in CTE programs. They're learning to design, weld, code, and provide life-saving care. These students gain hands-on experience that leads to good and stable jobs. And the results speak for themselves.
▶ 0:05:06Students who concentrate in CTE, completing more than two credits, graduate at rates above 90%, significantly higher than the national CTE participation also boosts academic achievement and even promotes college readiness itself. More than 40 states allow students to take CTE courses through dual enrollment enrollment programs at technical or community colleges, enabling them to earn college credits in high school.
▶ 0:05:33This can lead to associate's degrees, bachelor's degrees, and industry-recognized credentials. And students are eager for these opportunities. 85% of recent high school graduates took at least one CTE course. CTE classrooms are filled with future engineers, healthcare professionals, business owners, and innovators. It's not a second option, it's a pathway to success in high school, higher education, and the workforce.
▶ 0:05:58How we prepare our students today will determine not just their future success, but our nation's economic strength. Job creators across the country are struggling to find workers who have the right skills. This present and growing gap threatens our nation's economic competitiveness. Employers are looking for candidates who demonstrate skills, not just degrees, to meet the demands of an economy with 7.2 million open jobs.
▶ 0:06:25In our dynamically changing economy, we must reimagine student programs to meet the demands of today's and tomorrow's labor market. And that's what CTE is all about. By design, it equips students with skills that match real job opportunities, providing pathways to immediate employment. That means fewer unfilled jobs, more career-ready graduates, and a stronger economy.
▶ 0:06:48I look forward to hearing from our witnesses who have built exceptional career and technical education programs, and to discussing how we can strengthen and expand their work at schools across America. With that, I'll turn to the ranking member for an opening statement. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to the witnesses. We've been I know we both been looking forward to this hearing. I I appreciate this hearing today where we can talk about the importance of career and technical education, which historically has had bipartisan support.
▶ 0:07:16But, I do want to address the recent deeply troubling actions that threaten the effectiveness of CTE and long-standing bipartisan legacy. Earlier this year, President Trump kicked off his second term by signing an executive order to dismantle and close the Department of Education. As part of that effort, the executive branch used a questionable interagency agreement, an IAA, to transfer much of the administration of CTE and adult education programs from the Department of Education to the Department of Labor.
▶ 0:07:46Along with this $2 billion in funding for programs under the Office of Career and Technical Education was transferred out of the education department to the Department of Labor. Just yesterday, the Department announced six new interagency agreements to move more critical education programs to the departments of Labor, Interior, Health and Human Services. This is not routine. It's the consequences of this agreement will be far reaching. It's also part of a broader effort to shut down the Department of Education without the consent of Congress.
▶ 0:08:17We should all be concerned about the destructive message of shutting down the Department of Education. What does that say about our country? Scattering programs and resources across offices that aren't equipped to administer them or hurt students and schools. And I want to make clear today that we must fight to reclaim our Article 1 responsibility and conduct and conduct oversight over the administration to reverse this irresponsible decision. Moving the administration of CTE to the Department of Labor is a mistake for many reasons.
▶ 0:08:47First, CTE is more than job training or short-term job placement. It helps students, many of them as early as middle school, explore careers, build skills, and prepare for higher education or long-term careers and high-demand fields. That kind of lifelong learning pipeline can't be built or maintained without staff who have spent their careers crafting educational pathways, not just administering workforce training grants, which is also important but a different task.
▶ 0:09:16Offloading these programs to an agency that lacks that background is a disservice to our children, to the future, and it also violates the Perkins Act, which I worked with several of my colleagues here today to reauthorize in 2018 when it was signed into law by President Trump. Second, these programs are objectively worse off now than they now that they've been moved to the Department of Labor.
▶ 0:09:39Under the Department of Education, the programs were aligned with academic standards, focused on long-term success, and embedded into the education ecosystem at the state and local level. The Department of Labor's job training programs, by contrast, are often short-term, disconnected from education systems, and focused on immediate employment rather than sustained learning. This shift risks turning CTE into the type of narrow vocational training we worked for decades to move away from.
▶ 0:10:06We support it, but not it's not the same as CTE, where students, often from low-income families or communities of color, were tracked into limited job paths with little room for upward mobility. Ironically, the transfer of these programs from education to the Department of Labor has created more bureaucratic inefficiencies, not reduced them. States, school districts, and institutes of higher education are now forced to navigate two different agencies to access one program.
▶ 0:10:34We've heard stories from states are spending all their time learning a new grant management system instead of doing what they should be doing, which is innovating. Delays in grant processing and decision-making are already being reported, and we've only begun to see the fallout. It's pretty chaotic. And third, the innovation we've seen in CTE over the past decade is now at risk. And that pro- progress was made possible because states had the flexibility to tailor programs to meet the needs of their students and local economies.
▶ 0:11:02But this new hyper-partisan shift, driven not by educational best practices, but by ideology, it threatens to stifle innovation. A bipartisan success story is now being drawn into a federal bureaucratic tug-of-war, placing unnecessary hurdles in front of states that were leading the way in expanding access and improving outcomes, including my home state of Oregon. I want to emphasize career and technical education works.
▶ 0:11:27It works because it's It works because it was crafted in a bipartisan manner and in partnership with educators, employers, and communities. And it works because it's the kind of engaging, hands-on, problem-solving learning that engages students. And it works because we had career professionals in the Department of Education who understood the difference between preparing students for the future and displacing them in a job.
▶ 0:11:53I wish we could spend the whole hearing discussing the exciting innovations in CTE that states like my home state of Oregon are leading. My state's made CTE a priority. We've seen absenteeism decrease. We've seen graduation rates increase. I've heard amazing programs, including a culinary arts program at Lincoln High School in Portland, a fish hatchery management program at Warrenton High School on the coast, health sciences in Hillsboro, and a program in Sherwood, Oregon, where students actually design, build, and then sell a home.
▶ 0:12:23These have provided incredible opportunities for students to learn collaboration, critical thinking, communication, responsibility. But unfortunately, this administration is dragging us into another partisan fight. Look, just look at the Heritage Foundation's Project 2025, which laid the groundwork for this illegal move of moving the depart- the program and shutting down the Department of Education. So, we can't afford to let CTE be undermined.
▶ 0:12:49Congress must reject this transfer, restore the programs at the Department of Education where they belong, and guarantee that any future changes go through the proper legislative channels, not through backdoor bureaucratic maneuvers. Our goal should be to improve and innovate CTE. This isn't just a matter of process, it's protecting learning for millions of learners. And I do, Mr. Chairman, as I yield back, want to introduce a few pieces for the record about some of the work uh that Oregon has done.
▶ 0:13:16There's a report from Stanford Children on how Oregon's Measure 98 result, which uh prioritized career and technical education, resulted in significant growth in student achievement and graduation rates. Second, the piece from the Oregon Capital Chronicle celebrating the 97.7% high school graduation rate of students enrolled in two or more CTE classes last year in 2024.
▶ 0:13:39And an article from the Portland Business Journal on how Portland Community College is investing in CTE and partnering with industry to develop high-quality course offerings. So, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I look forward to the witnesses' testimony and without a yield back. Pursuant to committee rule 8C, all members who wish to insert written statements into the record may do so by submitting them to the committee clerk electronically in Microsoft Word format by 5:00 p.m. 14 days after this hearing.
▶ 0:14:04And without objection, the hearing record will remain open for 14 days to allow such statements and other extraneous material noted during the hearing to be submitted for the official hearing record. I know that some of our colleagues who are not permitted members of the subcommittee may be joining us at today's hearing. I'll now introduce our witnesses. Our first witness is Dr. Deb Volzer, the vice president for workforce development at SME in Worthington, Ohio. Our second witness is Mrs. Kristy Rice, a cybersecurity teacher at Spotsylvania High School in Spotsylvania, Virginia.
▶ 0:14:35Our third witness is Mr. Braden Goetz, a senior policy advisor at the Center on Education and Labor and and Labor at New America here in Washington, D.C. And our fourth witness is Mrs. Nicole Gasper, the CEO of the West Michigan Aviation Academy in Grand Rapids, Michigan. We thank the witnesses for being here today and we look forward to your test testimony. Pursuant to committee rules, I would ask that you each limit your oral presentation to a 3-minute summary of your written statement. As committee members have many questions for you, the clock will count down from 3 minutes.
▶ 0:15:04However, pursuant to committee rule 8D and committee practice, we will not cut off your testimony until you reach the 5-minute mark. I would also like to remind the witnesses to be aware of the responsibility to provide accurate information to the subcommittee. I will first recognize Dr. Volzer for your testimony. Thank you, Chairman Kelly, and ranking member Bonamici, and distinguished members of the committee. Truly, thank you for the opportunity to speak on this critical issue today.
▶ 0:15:32I'm representing SME, the national nonprofit with nearly 100 years of experience in building manufacturing talent and accelerating advanced technology adoption. We have trained millions of incumbent workers, inspired hundreds of thousands of students, and work daily with employers, educators, workforce agencies, and community partners across our country from small businesses to Fortune 500s. What truly sets SME apart is our dual perspective.
▶ 0:15:59We are not only at the table shaping national strategy, we are inside the four walls of industry every single day. This connection gives us real-time insight into what manufacturers need now and how to deliver scalable, high-impact training solutions that meet our manufacturers' needs. Our manufacturers are giving us a stark warning. Their workforce is aging, their skills gap is widening, and too few young people are entering the manufacturing workforce.
▶ 0:16:27This is the reality facing our country, and the stakes could not be higher. We are not facing a future workforce problem, we are facing a future workforce crisis. And while investing in K-12 is essential, it's simply not As such, we urge Congress and state leaders to expand access to modern, industry-connected CTE programs in every community to equip the next generation for high-wage, high-tech manufacturing SME's Education Foundation PRIME program is active in over
▶ 0:16:57118 high schools across 25 states. And through a four-year pathway, students gain hands-on experience working with industrial equipment and software, leading to the acquisition of industry-relevant skills. We support this pipeline with teacher training, sustainability funding, and award over a million dollars annually in The strength of SME's education and training relies on our direct industry engagement.
▶ 0:17:24We know firsthand that when this vital connection is not there, it weakens or breaks down, students risk learning outdated skills on outdated equipment with outdated processes that no longer meet the evolving demands of modern manufacturing. SME's PRIME program is solving this issue at scale.
▶ 0:17:42And while SME PRIME and other programs can train the next generation of talent, we cannot overlook one of the most under-recognized challenges in workforce development, the shortage of qualified Without instructors, programs stall, learners wait, skill development slows, and our nation's manufacturing capabilities weaken. SME is actively addressing this challenge through our maritime manufacturing workforce pipeline.
▶ 0:18:10This program is designed to meet critical shipbuilding needs across the Gulf Coast and Indo-Pacom regions. And by integrating K-12 and post-secondary pathways in alignment to industry competencies in a cohesive K-20 model, we are building short, mid, and long-term solutions to support both current and future workforce demands.
▶ 0:18:30And finally, I would be remiss if I did not clearly state that technology is transforming manufacturing at an unprecedented pace, from automation and data analytics to advanced robotics and artificial intelligence. To keep up, our workforce and training programs need continuous alignment requiring deep industry engagement. In closing, as mentioned, the stakes have never been higher, and we are facing a defining moment for US manufacturing.
▶ 0:18:58A strong, skilled, and future-ready workforce is not just an economic an economic asset. It is a strategic necessity. Thank you for the opportunity to speak on this critical issue, and please know that SME will continue to innovate, collaborate, and lead the adoption of technology while building talent to leverage that technology to preserve our global manufacturing might. I look forward to your questions. Thank you very much, Mrs. Rice. You're now recognized for your testimony.
▶ 0:19:28Good afternoon, Chairman Kilili and Ranking Member Bonamici and members of the committee. Thank you for the opportunity to speak today. My name is Kristi Rice and I teach cybersecurity at Spotsylvania High School, a rural high school in Spotsylvania, Virginia. Despite our rural setting, we have built one of the most dynamic and successful cybersecurity programs in the Commonwealth, if not the nation. I teach a three-level pathway and coach the award-winning CyberKnights. In my classroom, I like to think outside the box.
▶ 0:19:56Instead of only lecturing about threats and defenses, my students learn through hands-on gamified activities like Capture the Flag competitions. They solve real-world challenges in cryptography, forensics, and network defense. As a coach for the US Cyber Team, I bring back elite-level strategies from international competition and adapt them for high school students. Showing them that cybersecurity is not just a class, but a pathway to national service and high-demand careers.
▶ 0:20:24I also push my students to get outside the box, literally. My students have toured the Pentagon, visited FBI headquarters, presented at the White House Quad Cyber Challenge, and attended cybersecurity conferences and networking events. For many of our rural students, these are the first experiences that help them see themselves as future professionals protecting critical systems and infrastructure. Some of these students are here today.
▶ 0:20:49To expand access, I founded the Virginia High School Cyber Cup, a hands-on cybersecurity competition hosted by the Virginia and US Cyber Range Cloud CTF platform. I also co-founded the Cyber Circuit. It's a virtual cybersecurity club that includes students whose schools don't yet offer cybersecurity or who are home-schooled. These efforts ensure that any student anywhere in Virginia can step into the cybersecurity world. Innovation in CTE must also support our educators.
▶ 0:21:17Through the GenCyber Teacher Program with Virginia Tech and the University of North Georgia, I helped prepare new teachers teach cybersecurity in their first year. And in my role as a Career Kickstart Facilitator and Pilot Teacher for the College Board's AP Cybersecurity course, I support educators nationwide on building a high-quality pathway. The impact is clear. Six of my former students have earned the DoD SMART Scholarship. Many now work with federal agencies and in industry.
▶ 0:21:47A high percentage of my students graduate with the CompTIA Security Plus. And we have seen a strong increase in female What's at stake is our national security and our economic future. If we don't connect classroom to career in fields like cybersecurity, we risk falling behind in both talent and readiness.
▶ 0:22:06When we invest in educators, empower our students, and create pathways that connect classroom to real-world challenges, we don't just prepare students for jobs, we prepare them to protect and lead the in the digital frontier. Thank you for your time in Thank you very much. Uh Mr. Goetz, you're recognized for your testimony. Good afternoon, uh Chairman Kyle, Ranking Member Bonamici, and members of the subcommittee. I appreciate the opportunity to testify.
▶ 0:22:32Um as you mentioned, I'm a senior policy advisor in the Center on Education and Labor at New America. Um my written testimony highlights some CTE innovations and talks about some recommendations for Perkins reauthorization. But I think the best use of my time is to first thank you for your past support of CTE and then to appeal to you to help us return Perkins to the Department of Education.
▶ 0:22:55Before New America, I worked for 26 years for the Department of Education, most of that time in the Office of Career Technical and Adult Education or Um when I joined Ed, CTE, then known as vocational education, was not well regarded. It was on the margins of public education, an undemanding alternative that taught narrow set of skills for specific jobs that were many of which were low wage.
▶ 0:23:20Since that time, CTE leaders and policy makers like yourselves have transformed vocational education. Um it is now CTE now prepares students for with durable skills for college and The transfer of Perkins to the Department of Labor threatens that Operationally, it is a muddle because Perkins is very clear that the Secretary of Education is the only one who can make policy decisions.
▶ 0:23:48What Ed has done is done is transferred the implementation of her decisions to DOL. So, they sent over a team of OCTAE employees who report to a DOL career official who report to a policy making official who on up to the chain of command to the Secretary of Labor. I don't understand how the work gets When Secretary McMahon makes a decision, does she call the Secretary of Labor and ask her to communicate that down the chain?
▶ 0:24:14And what happens if the OCTAE employees at the bottom of the chain have questions or they have other other issues they need policy decisions on? Do they communicate that back up the chain and the two Secretaries talk? Um it's all so confusing and DOL also does not have expertise in Ed regulations like charter school funding. North Dakota just passed a new charter school law. They're going to be coming to the Department of Labor asking for help in understanding Ed's regulations for charter schools.
▶ 0:24:45Good luck to them. Also troubling are the implications for ensuring that all students have equal access and opportunities to succeed in CTE. Since 1979, state Perkins agencies have been responsible for proactive civil rights monitoring. It's also known as methods of administration. Department has not clarified what happened to those responsibilities abilities and who's helping them with them. And some states has been struggling to get access to their money.
▶ 0:25:13Um yesterday I was surprised to hear uh the department put out a fact sheet that said that 35 grantees had had access their Perkins money since the transfer. Well, there are more than 35 Perkins grantees and it's been 2 months. It's been very difficult for states.
▶ 0:25:31There are third there are 57 grantees including DC, Puerto Rico, outlying areas, Virgin Islands, but only 35 have And for all of this, from what I understand, Ed is paying DOL $200,000 per quarter. That's a lot of money to pay for something you can do yourself. Of course, you could address all of these problems and uh simply amend Perkins and move it to DOL, but that would be a mistake. CTE is fundamentally an education program.
▶ 0:26:00It is not job training. DOL's training programs serve an important function by helping adults who are out of work find work quickly. Most common programs are in ground transportation like truck driving and nursing occupations that require less than an associate's degree. Many of them pay less than the median That is not the orientation or the result we want for high school CTE programs.
▶ 0:26:25We need to be building long-term pathways to prosperous futures for every student, not steering them into the next available job regardless of its quality. Moving Perkins also puts DOL puts the federal government out of step with the states. CTE is universally regarded as a CTE program by states. 47 states and the District of Columbia run Perkins out of it K-12 agency or higher ed agency. Locating Perkins DOL threatens to re-marginalize CTE.
▶ 0:26:55We have made so much progress. Please do not let Secretary McMahon take us back. Thank you. Thank you very much. Uh and Mrs. uh Gasper, you're recognized for your Chairman Kyle Lee and Ranking Member Bonamici and members of the committee, thank you so much for the opportunity to share with you what we get to do with and for our families at the West Michigan Aviation Academy. We are a public charter high school located at the Gerald R.
▶ 0:27:23Ford International Airport in Grand Rapids, Michigan, where we get the privilege of serving just over 600 students in grades 9 through 12. We are heavily focused on aviation as our name indicates, but also heavy STEM, and the uh piece that really sets us apart is our professional culture. At the Academy, Career and Tech Ed is key to what we get to do for our young people.
▶ 0:27:54It's critical to our mission. We get to create meaningful talent and over the 15 years, we've demonstrated that by having just under 200 high school seniors earn their private pilot's licenses by the time they've graduated.
▶ 0:28:12We've also had 27 of our students earn their Part 107A commercial drone's Both of them are portable credentials that our young people get to walk out of our high school with. Our robotics team has found themselves multiple times on the world stage down in Texas, and we've also had a state-recognized Science Olympiad team.
▶ 0:28:37Our students currently in our Build-A-Plane course, um we've not only built a Carbon Cub EX-2 that was uh deemed airworthy that we sold to replenish the project. But now our students are refurbishing a 1975 Blanca Scout and a 233 Schweizer glider. Both of which are real-world skills.
▶ 0:29:02Additionally, to give you a picture of our school, we have 6% of our graduates, on average, choosing military service. So, while that's not specifically CTE, it does show an additional pathway. And that is three times the national average of young people graduating going into the military. These accomplishments address our workforce needs. We know the global command and the avi- demand in the aviation sector is great.
▶ 0:29:32Um, we're looking at nee- a need of over 600,000 pilots and technicians over the next decade, and additionally, 15,000 over the next couple of years for the domestic pilot shortage. Our mission, vision, and values guide every decision we make at the academy, and we believe that excellence truly begins with both connection and upholding high expectations.
▶ 0:29:58Every student is paired with a trusted where we get to uphold clear and high standards. For example, we don't issue D's. Our students get to earn A, B, C, or F. Our students get to earn 26 credits to graduate for their high school diploma, where the state of Michigan requires 18.
▶ 0:30:22Our students also get the opportunity to give 100 hours of community service as part of their diploma from the academy, along with a required job shadowing requ- opportunity. Because we're located at an airport, you can imagine the unique opportunities that get to come our way.
▶ 0:30:41We believe that students need a lot of exposure during their formative years, and so that is a key element of our Students have access to our direct flight line. Um we also have access to the airport public safety.
▶ 0:30:58And we have an incredible amount of guests that get to visit our students to share different career opportunities within the aviation and engineering We've even had students to um test for landmines with a partner at the airport as well. However, these partnerships extend beyond the airport.
▶ 0:31:20We have our wonderful charter authorizer, Grand Valley State University, um who also, along with other post-secondaries, give our students dual credit for the CTE programs in which they participate. All of our aviation programs are state certified in CTE.
▶ 0:31:40Additionally, we've also taken the lead in the state of Michigan in working with um other partners to help develop the CTE standards for aviation general and professional pilot programs. I'm very proud to say that 66% of our juniors and seniors are involved in CTE at our academy.
▶ 0:32:03My hope today is that I can share the West Michigan Aviation Academy with you as a national model, um that can show what is possible when you have business and industry, private partnerships, and public education coming together for the central Michigan mission of serving our young people. It truly does create a pathway to career for our young people as they get to experience all that's in front of them.
▶ 0:32:34Again, thank you so much for the opportunity. I look forward to your Thank you very much. Under committee rule nine, we'll now question witnesses under the five-minute rule, and I'll first recognize myself uh for five minutes. And I just want to thank all our witnesses. Really inspiring testimony. I think a big part of what we do on this subcommittee, uh apart from the policy levers we have, is to showcase just truly tremendous uh examples of what's going on at school districts across the country. And as Mrs.
▶ 0:33:01Gasper just said, uh what you're doing, uh what all of you are doing, really provides a national model that I hope uh can be a a source of inspiration uh in in every state. So, I do want to just briefly address off the top this issue of the interagency agreements in the Perkins uh program. Um and so, Mr. uh Goetz, you raised a number of of criticisms of this and in the ranking member as well, and I don't want to dismiss that. I want to really try to understand it. I think there's probably room for debate whether the chain of authority that you described is exactly as you described it.
▶ 0:33:30Uh certainly, if there are issues accessing the grants, that's something that needs to get worked out uh quickly. Uh but as far as sort of your broader critique, the problem as you describe it seems to be that, well, DOL is going to have to talk to the education department, and they're going to have to call each other back and forth. But kind of the entire premise of CTE programs is we want to have this connection and coordination between schools and and industry, right?
▶ 0:33:53So, so what's wrong with sort of recapitulating that or mirroring that uh in terms of uh fostering greater coordi- coordination between the Department of Education and DOL. Well, I think in past Can you push the Can you turn your mic? There you go. In past administrations, we've had a lot of close coordination between the two departments, including in Mr. Trump's first term. They met constantly, and we were often collaborating on issues where we intersect. Registered apprenticeship is an example of that. In Mr.
▶ 0:34:22Trump's first term, the department put out a guide to aligning CTE with the apprenticeship. In Mr. Biden's term, we put out a a about registered apprenticeship being an allowable use of Perkins funds. So, we have had that collaboration and cooperation. We don't need to do it through an interagency agreement where we transfer the entire program over to another off- another agency. All right. Well, thank you. Um Dr.
▶ 0:34:47Wolzer, thank you very much for your testimony and a point you made that I think is really important is just the way things are changing so fast in the work in the workplace right now when it comes to AI and robotics and and everything else that you need to sort of have that perspective like in real time in order to have your programs really be serving the needs of our workforce.
▶ 0:35:08I guess the challenge is that because things are changing so rapidly, what students learn in CTE programs may quickly you know, become not applicable to the workforce as it exists 1 2 3 5 years from now. Now, they'll be gaining additional skills once they're in the but that seems to me like the fundamental challenge is how do we structure these programs in an era where we know that students once they graduate from them are going to be in a rapidly evolving workforce.
▶ 0:35:36Thank you for your question and I think that really is where it comes down to deep integration with local industry and alignment to education. Not only how the programs are designed, but making sure that the skills that are being taught in those classrooms are directly applicable inside the four walls of industry.
▶ 0:35:56One of the things that the SME Prime program does specifically is we do a a significant amount of research into the industries, the equipment that's being used, the processes that are being used, the new technologies that are being integrated, and make sure that that same exact equipment is inside the walls of the high school so that when they step into that, they are productive day one. They are continuing to learn and in fact, they're bringing innovation.
▶ 0:36:22That is what the next generation of learners it's not just about the technical skills. It's not just about uh the academic skills. It's not just about those workplace ready skills. It's the innovation that the next generation is bringing because they are comfortable with technologies. Um and that is what is inspiring the next uh adoption of technologies uh inside our our our classrooms.
▶ 0:36:45And so, I would say to me, this is while you look at national systemic issues uh and we really have to pay attention to our small to medium-size manufacturers, they often can't step outside their four walls to really engage with academic uh education leaders. We have to make sure that we're reaching inside those four walls so that we can align and make sure there is that continuous education um and skill ready development. Very well said. Thank you.
▶ 0:37:13And I guess that sort of uh capacity to adapt and innovate within a particular domain is itself sort of the core skill set in many cases that you're trying to uh to teach. Uh Mrs. Rice, just very quickly, I was uh very excited to to read your your and hear your testimony. I know that we've had big shortages when it comes to cybersecurity. And so, I wanted to just ask a little bit more about the pathway cuz I think a lot of people think that well, cybersecurity is just kind of an offshoot of software engineering or some other field. Not true at all, right?
▶ 0:37:39So, what is sort of the distinct nature of your pathway and the and the needs that it fills? Um my pathway, cybersecurity, I mean, there's a huge skills gap. And there is currently over 600,000 jobs that are open right now across the nation. So, um and personally in my path through pathway in Virginia, uh we we have a three-course pathway including um we have an intro class, we have a you know, networking class, and then we have a more advanced class.
▶ 0:38:08And it it gets the kids prepared for the Security+ and the um . Thank you very much. I'll now recognize the uh ranking member. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to the witnesses. And wonderful testimony, all of you. I appreciate it. And I want I want to follow up on the chairman's question about the pace of change. And Mr. Gates, you said in your in your written testimony that job training is not CTE, and CTE is not job training.
▶ 0:38:32And in fact, you cited an article from 1986 in which experts recommended abandoning wrote entry-level job training and reforming what was then called vocational education, as you explained, uh to integrate academics, teach teamwork, critical thinking skills. And here's a quote from your testimony, "Prepare young people for a world working life of continual learning, problem-solving, and communicating." And I And I couldn't agree more. Uh and I submit that's even more critical today than it was in 1986 with the pace of change.
▶ 0:39:02Things are very different than they they were in 1986. there were there were no computers in classrooms in 1986. And students didn't have cell phones. We didn't have AI. It's a different world, and preparing students for the jobs of the future is not the same because we don't know what the jobs of the future will look like. It's very different. And CTE is important and beneficial because, as I mentioned, it's typically this hands-on, project-based learning.
▶ 0:39:27And you know, when you look at the 21st century job skills, collaboration, critical thinking, communication, confidence, creativity, those are skills that matter, no matter what path someone takes, or no matter what job someone goes into. So, I I I we need to strengthen this and realize that why CTE is important, and it's not what this administration is doing. They're kind of stuck, I think, back in 1986 when it's 2025. So So, Mr.
▶ 0:39:54Gates, the statutory requirements for Perkins program include academic achievement measures, alignment with postsecondary programs of study, support services that are embedded in educational institutions, and then transitions between secondary and postsecondary education. These are all elements that presume administration in an education-focused agency, as you mentioned.
▶ 0:40:14So, is Is that 77% of states implement CTE through their state education agency that K-12, 14% through post-secondary education, and 6% through standalone CTE agencies? That's correct.
▶ 0:40:28right. So, will those state entities be better served by the Department of Education or by the Department of Labor? Uh by the Department of Education with whom they've had a relationship for many And and the staff at the Department of Education who were accustomed to this work. And and also, Mr. Gates, we've heard reports that the transfer of funding and administration has already caused some serious problems, as you mentioned.
▶ 0:40:52At least four states have reported they could not access Perkins formula grant funding during the transition period uh when um OCTAE attempted to move grantees from education's payment to the DOL's payment management system. And some states have reported delays in receiving their pay e account numbers needed to access their formula Perkins funding, and other states have had challenges getting bank accounts even be recognized by the new payment system.
▶ 0:41:18Other sick requirements like wet signatures, all these things are creating significant challenges in accessing formula dollars since the transition was uh initiated. And all of this suggests the transition from the Department of Education to the Department of Labor has failed. So, could all of this have been avoided if the Perkins formula grants were still administered by the Department of Education? Absolutely. They've made it harder to get uh Perkins funds than it is to get a mortgage.
▶ 0:41:45And and I just I want to emphasize, too, that this committee has worked hard on the Workforce Innovation Opportunity Act and other workforce programs. And those are important. I'm not minimizing those, but they're not the same as educational programs such as the CTE programs that are mentioned. And I We heard some great examples today. I think they're wonderful. There are so many uh industry partnerships that are happening. But again, the focus needs to be on current technical education.
▶ 0:42:11It's not going to career in technical job training and it's even more critical with CTE at middle schools and high schools. Again, we don't know what the jobs will look like. Um so Dr. Balder, um Mrs. Rice and Ms. Gasper, do you uh agree with Mr. Gatz that career technical education is education? Anybody disagree with that? Go ahead.
▶ 0:42:41Anybody do do you all agree that it is an educational program, career and technical education? It's more of an educational program than a job training program. Go ahead, Dr. Balder. I'm almost out of time, so go ahead. Sorry. I I think it you can't separate the two. Education to align with skills that secure sustainable thriving waged occupations should be the goal of education.
▶ 0:43:06Building a well-rounded individual is absolutely critical when we talk about workforce ready skills. It is those critical thinking, problem solving. And and quickly in maybe one sentence, your thoughts on the education aspects of CTE, Mrs. Rice and Ms. Gasper, because I'm I'm out of time. Maybe one sentence.
▶ 0:43:27Um I think when we when we look at what we get to do through career and tech ed, it's really determined at our local level in terms of the educational component piece. Thank you. I I really am out of time. I'll yield back. Thank you. Uh thank you. I will now recognize the chair of the full committee, Mr. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for this uh this hearing and thank you for the panel being here.
▶ 0:43:52I'm I'm tempted to ask how many of you educators that are here at the table noticed anything negative coming from the 7-week shutdown by my Democrat colleagues in the Senate when the Department of Education was shut down for 7 weeks. I won't ask that question. Um I'd also say thank you to my uh my colleague from Oregon for showing us what a state can do in CTE. Amazing things by itself, the state doing the work.
▶ 0:44:21Um knowing what they need in their own state of Oregon, and I think the same is true in Michigan, and Virginia, and the students here in the room can attest to that as well. Um Dr. Volzer, you work closely with industry partners. Uh you've said that. Um what strategies best strategies have you shown to work and be effective for sustaining employer participation in your CTE programs?
▶ 0:44:49And again, as I said at the beginning, when we look at developing out these programs, we're looking at locally what the needs are for those industry partners, what equipment, what skills, uh and what future technologies are being uh integrated into that environment into that local so that we can best support those local uh entities. Um but that grows beyond that.
▶ 0:45:11What employers are finding is understanding demand signals and working closely with their education partners to ensure that those not only those programs align, but the duration, uh the the durability of those programs align to the demand signals of their industry.
▶ 0:45:28So those are some of the things that we look at once the uh they also do the evaluation at the end to ensure that what is produced through our education systems is aligned to the needs, and not only just immediate needs of employment, but securing that continuous education um that ensures that our industries uh you know, grow with uh the economic needs of our nation.
▶ 0:45:51So key, that continuous understanding of it's continuous education for a lifetime, but being up close and personal, as you've said, customizing what fits with business and industry. Thank you so much. Um Mr. Rice, um how do you incorporate artificial intelligence tools specifically uh into cybersecurity education and what guidance or resources do teachers need to do that responsibly? That human moral touch on AI.
▶ 0:46:23Thank you for the question. Um integrating um artificial intelligence in my class um is essential. So um first I I use AI for hands-on um learning um for hands-on problem solving with my uh students with uh capture the flag um activities. So we will um first use it to AI-assisted analysis of challenges uh whether they review a log or decode patterns.
▶ 0:46:51Um and then I push them to va- validate those results as well to make sure um that they're doing that manually so they're not just depending on that AI analysis. Um I also create AI fishing emails or have them um evaluate deepfakes.
▶ 0:47:09Um but it's important by letting them see AI from an adversary's perspective, um they develop a deeper understanding why ethical decision-making, uh bias awareness, and human oversight isn't important as technical skills. Uh we use it more as a tool um so that the students can understand it, evaluate, and um use it thoughtfully. Um I also use um AI in my classroom to personalize learning.
▶ 0:47:37Um especially in a rural school, we have a lot of um kids that want to take my class that might feel like they're intimidated by it because their learning level is not where it needs to be. Um so I will use it for differentiation and um it helps make complex concepts like scripting and digital forensics and malware analysis um for many of them it makes it feel it more cybersecurity is more accessible. Well, thank you. Thank you.
▶ 0:48:07Uh may you continue to succeed on that. Ms. Gasper, I I had the opportunity of touring your school and wishing that it was in my district. I can't have everything good in Michigan in my district, but I'm glad you're there. Could you tell us a little more about the school? I would assume most of the students are from upwardly bound uh home set settings, high incomes, and all of the rest. Uh is that true? Actually, that's not true. Um so that is one of the
▶ 0:48:37I set you up for that one. Thank you for That is one of uh the biggest misunderstandings actually um being a public charter high school in Michigan, we serve every type of child um and we accept all children that apply. Unfortunately or fortunately, however you want to look at it, we um have more student applications than spots available.
▶ 0:49:03And so last year as an example, we had double the amount of freshman applications than the spots available. Um so while that's a blessing, it's also unfortunate that we can't serve every child. It's working. We'll We'll push for choice, more choice. So, thank you. I yield back. Representative Lee of Pennsylvania is Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 0:49:26Uh Republicans can't simultaneously hold a hearing about uh how to strengthen student skills through career and technical education while also allowing this administration to dismantle the sole agency tasked with expanding these same students' educational opportunities and protecting their civil rights. In May, the Department of Education transferred the Office of Career, Technical, and Adult Education's program to the Department of Labor.
▶ 0:49:53Yesterday we found out that the Trump administration plans to transfer many more of the Department of Education's core programs to four completely different agencies, flouting congressional authorization to effectively dismantle the department and abandon public education. This has been a key part of the administration's authoritarian playbook from day one.
▶ 0:50:14One thing history makes clear is that we will not successfully strengthen career and technical education if we don't have a body that is invested in its equity. We value all career paths, whether it's a trade or working in the arts, a career in science. They're all important.
▶ 0:50:31But we also can't ignore that vocational education was conceived as a tool of segregation to track students, particularly of color, into training programs for jobs that were then deemed undervalued, that are physically intensive, that lower life expectancies, while reserving what people deemed prestigious academics for wealthy white students.
▶ 0:50:53Even within career and technical education today, white students are more likely to have access to manufacturing and information technology pathways, while black and brown students are placed in classes for now devalued professions like hospitality or tourism. One of the reasons the Department of Education exists is to help states and schools address these educational inequities.
▶ 0:51:15This is literally one of the reasons why Congress tasked the Department of Education with administering Perkins and other career and technical education Mr. Gatz, aside from the fact that it's a direct attempt to dismantle the Department of Education without congressional approval, will transferring the administration of Perkins to the Department of Labor exacerbate segregated pathways that disproportionately track students of color into undervalued careers?
▶ 0:51:41Well, as I mentioned, methods of administration is a proactive civil rights monitoring that state Perkins agencies are supposed to be doing to address some of the issues that you're talking about. We have no idea what the where those responsibilities lie now with this the change that they've done in the IAA. So, the Department of Labor is not equipped to handle issues of educational equity. It's not equipped to primarily handle issues of education at all.
▶ 0:52:06We've also already seen the DOL's level of investment in equitable in equitable access to job training when they tried to eliminate Job Corps this past spring. Now, the Pittsburgh Job Corps has long been a beacon of opportunity for young folk in my district, especially young people black and brown and low-income young people. And after seeing what the DOL tried to take away from them, why should we have faith that they'll treat Perkins any differently?
▶ 0:52:33Republicans also love to to reframe the removal of equitable education opportunities as an expansion of choice. So, when we see an increased focus on choosing career and technical education, we need to be asking what it might be replacing. For example, we're seeing more instances where financial literacy classes fulfill a social studies requirement. Mr.
▶ 0:52:55Guest, if career and technical education is administered by the Department of Labor, will it be more difficult to ensure that all young people have access to a holistic, well-rounded education that can include academics, arts, STEM, and career and technical training and education? I'm very concerned that we will lower academic expectations for students in career and technical education if it remains at the Department of Labor. Thank you. As the wealthiest nation on Earth, we should be able to offer holistic education to all children.
▶ 0:53:25A robust career and technical education shouldn't come at the expense of foundational academics. Students need and deserve both, and we can't let an administration that doesn't value education pit one against the other. Any hearings about how to strengthen federal education programs while this administration is actively dismantling Department of Education or a waste of students, families, and educators time.
▶ 0:53:52We should be focused on what we plan to do to keep the department and its programs intact. I thank you all for your time and I yield Representative Mesmer of Indiana is Thank you Chairman and thank you to the witnesses for being here today. Miss Miss Casper, you worked in both regional service agencies and CTE development. What can we do to help share innovative CTE models between states? Thank you for the question.
▶ 0:54:23I think really it comes down to what do the communities need? And so focusing there should be be our first goal. In addition to that, once we see in terms of place base what's needed, then being able to leverage partners.
▶ 0:54:41So for example, the partnerships that we've been able to leverage have been able to come about because we've been so clear about our mission, vision, and values and what we need in order to serve our young people. So in addition to that, once once you have that clarity, then partners can decide how how they fit into that I also think it's important to think about the mutual partnerships.
▶ 0:55:08So when you have career and tech ed in public schools and then you have business and industry what are the mutual benefits to both? So for example, we have a tenant that leases space from us, which is incredibly unique. So as a public school we have a private business named Mayday Avionics.
▶ 0:55:31It's an avionics company that leases space for from us so that they the importance of that is that our students can actually see real business and industry, be able to work on aircrafts while our young people are sitting in the classrooms looking through the glass walls. So, in terms of looking at partnerships, it's really about being clear about what the community needs, and then being able to solidify those partnerships. Okay. Thank you.
▶ 0:56:01Uh what can Congress do to help take away the stigma of the students wanting to choose vocational careers versus traditional four-year degree uh careers, and elevate the value of high high-demand, high-pay technical I think it's what you're doing right now. It's being able to showcase successful models for others to be able to learn from. So, for example, I've been in public education my entire career of 30 years.
▶ 0:56:29Um being at the academy has tremendously renewed my faith in public education because so many of the barriers to innovation have been removed. Um we have It starts with Well, let me just backtrack. It's all about the people. Right? It's being able to come together with a group of people who are and willing and able to focus around a single mission, vision, and set of values.
▶ 0:56:59And so, coming at a coming to a public charter school um where you have an who is solely there to serve that is very different. It allows the school leader, like myself and the leadership team, to be able to focus on the important work every day for our young people. And additionally, I think if we can showcase these models, which we do. We have tours coming in all the time.
▶ 0:57:28We have people flying from different states. We have other school leaders visit us and say, "How can we do what you're doing? How can you scale? How can we duplicate?" It comes down to it's about the people. It's about finding that single mission. What is it you're trying to accomplish? And then taking away all the what ifs, taking away the excuses of why we can't do this with and for our families.
▶ 0:57:54So, I appreciate that we're being showcased not not we as in the academy, but we as in these are models for others to build to learn from. Thank you. Uh Mrs. Rice, what's being done in your field uh in the K through through 12 space to scale up programs like yours in Virginia? Can you repeat that?
▶ 0:58:15Oh, yeah. What are What are What are you able to do to help scale up the programs you're doing uh across Virginia and and and and cybersecurity to other parts of the country? Any Anything? Um I showcase what I do um and I get my students out there doing things. Um and by just telling talking about what I'm doing in the classroom and what I'm doing outside of the classroom with my students really helps showcase what we're doing. Um we also bring awareness.
▶ 0:58:46We have a great initiative in Virginia, the Virginia Cyber Range, which is a cloud-hosted virtual environment that all our schools can use um to practice these safe these skills uh cybersecurity skills in a safe environment. So, um but just talking about what we're doing in Virginia and sharing it across the nation. And helping other educators um do what I'm doing in their Yep, thank you for your responses and I'll yield back.
▶ 0:59:17Representative Mannion of New York is Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you to our witnesses uh for joining us here today. I'm very excited about this subject of today's hearing because career and technical education is expanding rapidly in Central New York and we have a great history of innovation and technology in the region that has served this country as well.
▶ 0:59:39This country well and made us a leader around the world uh legacy that we must continue by an investment in our public schools and our higher education institutions. with the growth of major industries like advanced manufacturing and uh semiconductor chip manufacturing our region has launched transformative CTE initiatives including an advanced technology framework that's being piloted across 10 of our local school
▶ 1:00:09districts. This unique program will provide hundreds of students annually with a curriculum focused on real-world skills and meeting the employment demands of our local employers and future employers.
▶ 1:00:22Um these hundreds of students uh have a curriculum that's focused on real-world skills, experimental learning and this includes our newly uh opened regional STEAM school, the first of its kind, a countywide school drawing 60% of its students from the Syracuse City School District and the remaining students from the rest of the county.
▶ 1:00:46Unique innovative programs exist at this school and were designed uh by many of our local employers. Additionally, our five high schools in the Syracuse City School District have unique technology programs. Um the city of Syracuse is one of the most impoverished cities in the country.
▶ 1:01:05So, my concern is around Title One funds, making sure that we meet the needs of that school district and provide continuing pathways out of poverty for our students in these high-demand Um additionally, the state of New York, the governor, has created a program which I supported called Reconnect New York where individuals that are pursuing a second career between the ages of 25 and 55 pursuing a career in a high demand field can attend community colleges without
▶ 1:01:36any cost. Um I'm confident that these initiatives will serve as national models for career and technical education. Certainly it shows that it is possible that when states education employers labor unions all have a seat at the table, great things happen. And this is just the beginning.
▶ 1:01:56As our partnerships deepen, there'll be more opportunities for work-based learning uh union endorsed apprenticeship programs and other models that create pathways to high-quality jobs. As I said before, my concern is that in shifting the Perkins program out of the Department of Education and uh concerns about making sure that these funds go to impoverished communities as they are intended for, that a Hunger Games is not
▶ 1:02:26created and rubrics are not created for funding to states, that states like New York that have a commitment to civil rights will be left behind and will fall short on that rubric. We have seen this in other programs in this administration. So with that in mind, uh my question is for Mr. Gates.
▶ 1:02:46Given the momentum behind these regional partnerships and the demand for skilled talent, what are the most effective models that you found of work-based learning and youth apprenticeship programs and adult apprenticeship programs at high school or community colleges level, especially in fast-growing sectors like advanced manufacturing, the skilled trades, health care, and others? So what are the most effective models?
▶ 1:03:10Well, let me let me answer your question first of all by saying the the best way to promote more work-based learning opportunities in this country is to make sure that every school district has a Perkins allocation that's large enough to support a work-based learning coordinator. Um, that's going to take a bigger investment, but it's about time that we did that. Everyone is polarized about a lot of things, but not CTE. Now is the time to increase funding for for Perkins.
▶ 1:03:37Um, in answer to your question about models, there's a great program in Surry at Surry Community College in um rural northern North North Carolina. They've created a um for young people a a CTE dual enrollment program in health. Um, young people complete by high school graduation a um a uh certified nurse assistant uh credential.
▶ 1:04:02Then they go on and they enter at Surry Community College a registered apprenticeship that is combined with a nursing degree program. They are getting and because the North state of North Carolina waves tuition for apprenticeships, um they're getting a free ride, a nursing degree, getting paid while they do it. It's outstanding program and we need more of them. Thank you, Mr. Gatz. I appreciate it. I yield back, Mr. Chair. Mr. Moylan of Guam is recognized.
▶ 1:04:27Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh one of our career trade education programs is is run by our Guam Trades Academy or a Guam Contractors Association or Trades Academy. Uh and they recognize our emergence our emerging leaders committee, our young professionals under 40, and they conduct regular outreach programs with the middle schools and high schools. And how they how they attract our our young kids is through two main events.
▶ 1:04:55Uh one is spring, it's called pizza, pop, and power tools. It's aimed at encouraging girls and women to enter the And then in the fall we have construction warriors. That's aimed at recruiting both boys and mans and girls and women to enter construction careers. Now the trade academy was developed around also working adults and it works very well for high schoolers because they treat them like adults.
▶ 1:05:19And because the Academy is developed around people also without diplomas, also works well with people who speak English as a secondary So our trades Academy has a partnership also with our Guam Department of Education and as a pilot program where there are existing troubled students to go through the trades Academy. And students must finish their certification and their high school diploma.
▶ 1:05:48Now these troubled students, 11 out of 12 of them graduate and one on the honor roll and despite entering the program with poor attendance records and grades. So the Guam trades Academy annual annual evening classes high school integrates into the the adult classes and its goal is to earn credentials, to get employed above the minimum wage and to graduate high school. So those high school students who graduate had jobs right out of school.
▶ 1:06:18And the trades Academy has been successful in getting females into construction as well. The National Centers of Construction and Education Research serves as the basis for the Guam's trades Academy and GOD programs and it's highly successful. Right now we have 362 people in this class in the trades Academy. And recently we started a welding program which cost a lot of money and building up also a diesel mechanic class.
▶ 1:06:45Guam's trade Academy is also looking into starting up a fiber optics and elevator repairs too. And the trades Academy is working with Alaska, Hawaii and an army base in Korea. So the bottom line for our Guam trades Academy and states and territories is need for more authority and latitude in determining spending for CTE programs because they are closer to the problem. And Trades Academy at times doesn't pursue funding because there's just too many strings attached to that.
▶ 1:07:16So, first question is for Dr. Bolser. And manufacturing remains a significant effect affected by skilled gaps. And we have a a new manufacturing company on Guam, also I helped cut the ribbon just the other month. It's called Applied Science Tech Research or Astro it's a 3D additive manufacturer. And so, Dr. Bolser, could you elaborate on how industries identify regional workforce needs and aligns them with local training programs?
▶ 1:07:48Thank you for your question. And congratulations on the ribbon cutting of that exciting uh industry. Um one of the things that we do and I'm going to speak specifically to a program that we have SME has launched and it has launched nationally uh and that is called the Manufacturing Imperative Workforce Pipeline Challenge. We are working with 25 colleges across 17 states.
▶ 1:08:10And when you talk about scaling uh and and finding out best practices and sharing those, we're doing it in multiple ways and I promise I'm going to get to your question. Uh one of the things as I've said that we do is that we really look at industry needs currently, industry demands, future demands for that area, and we look at the demography of that area. Who is inside the classroom? Who is not inside the classroom?
▶ 1:08:35And how do we make sure that we are supporting the local economy by making sure everyone has accessible opportunities to gain gain the skills needed to uh enter into living wage We do this also as well by these presidents across these 25 institutions, community colleges, meet uh quarterly.
▶ 1:08:56And they engage in addressing the questions of what are the policies, what are the funding barriers that are preventing them from doing what they set out to do, which is educate um their communities with the right skills to secure living wage jobs. From that also we uh integrate with the manufacturing association so that we understand what the needs are from a state perspective. On top of that, we bring in SME's national perspective.
▶ 1:09:22What do we know industry needs, what are they adopting, how do we help integrate that? So we are looking nationally and we are uh catalyzing locally, we are understanding locally, and we are scaling nationally. And so those are some of the efforts that we do uh Congressman to make sure that when we enter in and understand the needs of industry, not just immediate, but it's it's industry, but it's also what are the needs of the demography that are going to be working inside those four walls.
▶ 1:09:52What are the best programs, what are the skills gap, what are the job uh you know, trajectories for those individuals to continue to uh sustain that employment there, grow the economy, and bring more industry uh to those uh communities. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I'm looking forward to the CTA programs having more authority. Thank you. Representative Adams of North Carolina is recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today.
▶ 1:10:19Before I get to my questions, I do want to take a moment to address a crisis facing my district. Over the weekend, the Trump administration deployed Customs and and Border Patrol agents to Charlotte, North Carolina, arriving in unmarked cars uh without badges, dressed in body armor, wielding assault rifles, and and they actually terrorized our community.
▶ 1:10:40Many of my law-abiding constituents, regardless of their immigration status, were afraid to go to church, work, and even school uh because of the language they speak or the color of their skin. One of my constituents, a U.S. citizen, had his car window bashed out, dragged onto the the street, pinned down, and put in handcuffs, even though he is a US citizen. This is disgusting behavior and frankly un-American.
▶ 1:11:06But this mass deportation agenda is not only a moral crisis for our country, it's also an education crisis for our students and and our teachers. On Monday morning, almost 27,000 Charlotte-Mecklenburg students were absent from school. That's of the entire student population, afraid to use their constitutionally protected right to a high-quality public education because of the Trump administration's campaign of terror.
▶ 1:11:32If this many students were missing school for any other reason, I'm sure that this committee would be coming together to hold the hearing. I think it's shameful that we're not doing that. Another dangerous action that was announced just recently, yesterday, by the Trump administration, is a plan to eliminate the Department of Education without the consent of Congress, using the Economy Act, which is unprecedented.
▶ 1:11:58It's shameful that that we my colleagues on the other side of the aisle are unwilling to assert congressional authority here. Mr. Gatz, during your 20 years of service at the Department of Education, what experience did you have with interagency interagency agreements? And have you seen any interagency agreement used at such a large scale? And do you think the agreements announced yesterday are Um I've never seen anything like this. It's unprecedented.
▶ 1:12:28And when I first saw it and read it, I thought, "Well, that's why the secretary fired all the lawyers in the department." Well, listen, moving these programs to agencies without experience in education policy will lead to worse outcomes for our students. I'm sure you'll agree with that. In July, the Trump administration moved management of of Perkins career and technical education to the Department of Labor.
▶ 1:12:54You mentioned in your testimony that there are inefficiencies with how this administration is implementing the Perkins CTE program. Essentially, you've got two agencies working on one program. So, can you highlight for us some examples where this redundancy is creating obstacles for grantees? And specifically, how has this transfer of administration and funds made it more difficult for the states?
▶ 1:13:23Well, we still have states struggling to get access to their funds after 2 months after this transfer happened. I I watched the webin- the 1-hour webinar that explained in a 75-slide presentation all the things you have to do to get access to your money. Um I don't understand why the Department of Education, which has had a relationship with these state agencies for what, decades, couldn't have transferred their information over to this new contractor. Why are we putting people through this? Well, listen.
▶ 1:13:53I I have that same question. Well, do you think that that grantees with fewer resources like HBCUs applying for Augustus Hawkins grants will have an even harder time navigating the Trump administration's new Uh what do you think about that? Well, I'm I'm very concerned about the people that worked on the Hawkins program and to make sure that they continue to stay working on the Hawkins program. I'm not sure about their fate, but those are experts that really help applicants advise good applications and make good use of the funds.
▶ 1:14:24Wow. So, one of the important facets of a quality of partnership program like registered apprenticeship programs is the embedded quality standards like the minimum hours of an on-the-job training and classroom instruction. So, do you have any recommendations on how to expand access to registered apprenticeships to historically disenfranchised groups? Uh I I sure do.
▶ 1:14:46Um last year uh the House and the Senate um agreed on a a a WIOA conference a WIOA reauthorization bill that included a $65 youth apprenticeship readiness grant program. I hope that gets revived in this Congress. Other things that we can do is better articulate CTE with apprenticeship. Right now, we don't really talk about apprenticeship in the Perkins Act.
▶ 1:15:10And if we had I I mean, I think things like let's let's challenge districts to align their uh upper-level CTE programs with the related instruction in apprenticeship. Let's create a dual enrollment program for apprenticeship where young people can get credit and get advanced standing in an apprenticeship after leaving high school. Thank you, sir. And Mr. Chairman, I yield back my time.
▶ 1:15:33Thank Representative Owens of Utah is Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um Our first of all, thank you guys for being here. Uh I love to see innovation. Uh it was so well needed, and I'm glad we're at that that that space where we're embracing it big time. Our children are the most precious resources uh we have, and we want them to live the best of their lives. And CTE helps them this possible giving our students the opportunity to experiment with careers before graduating from high school.
▶ 1:16:04So, they're more knowledgeable of their own interests and aptitudes. CTE also offers students a chance to build tangible, practical skills for use in life and work in the work force. Uh in the workplace. In Utah, for instance, uh Ju- uh Jordan School District has used CTE to change lives. Students enrolled in CTE courses at and have a higher graduation rate than the general population students.
▶ 1:16:28In addition, Jordan has provided over 16,000 credentials of value and 10,000 credits for students that will serve them as they continue education and development. Furthermore, six out of 10 students planned to to pursue a career related to CTE coursework they've done. These lives have been changed forever for the better, and I believe that Jordan School District and their hard work and CTE teachers deserve recognition and thanks for the impact they're making. So, with that, I'd like to start my questioning.
▶ 1:16:59I want to first of all direct my first question to Dr. Bolser, Mrs. Rice, and Mrs. Casper. Um we keep hearing my my colleagues, my Democratic colleagues, about the strong disapproval of interagency agreements signed between the Department of Education and Department of Labor. I'm trying to get a sense of whether there's anything to this noise um that they're making. You are the innovators. You're out there making these things happen.
▶ 1:17:24You're on the ground in classrooms, developing programs, creating critical partnerships, and reporting strong outcomes. Uh would each of you like to please uh answer this? Does interagency agreements at all affect your programming, your work, or your outcomes? I want to start off with Dr.
▶ 1:17:44I want to start by saying uh nearly 100 years ago, 33 tooling engineers came together to do something bigger than themselves, knowing that our nation uh required us to do more. Um I think opportunities to collaborate, to innovate, but to ensure that funding is uh you know, maintained uh for these programs is critical to our nation. Thank you.
▶ 1:18:14Thank you for the question. Um as a classroom educator, my focus my focus is delivering the highest quality learning experience for my students, regardless of where funding is administered. Uh what matters most um to me is that CTE programs will continue to receive stable, consistent support um so that students have access to tools and technology um and opportunities that they need. Um, I will continue to advocate for strong resources, industry alignment, and hands-on learning.
▶ 1:18:44Um, but my my commitment is to maintaining the quality of my cybersecurity program um, remains the same. Okay, thank you. Similar to um, what they just said, my primary focus is on ensuring that we have excellence across all of our programs, including our CTE programs. Um, it sure would be nice if we could see some continued innovation at the federal level.
▶ 1:19:13Um, I'm not someone who tries to predict what will happen and live in fear, but instead I try to embrace the opportunity to see what type of new innovation can can come out of it. So, I would also like to not have to fight for every dollar that we get. Um, so having more control locally would be More control locally is coming your way. Um, and so is innovation. I just want to say this real quickly.
▶ 1:19:42I'm reading here, Um, Biden intera- uh, in- uh, interagency agreements use it um, for uh, wind off- offshore wind wind energy and to allow the states to combine their plans with Perkins V. So, just know this is not something new and I'll tell you the fact that we're talking, innovating, figuring out how to how to do it better is just the way it should always be. Um, Ms.
▶ 1:20:08Rice, you helped design Virginia's uh, cybersecurity pathway. What mechanisms should school districts have in place and should the curriculum standards align with industry certificates, certifications, and employment needs? Um, thank you for the question. Um, aligning yourself with industry partners. I know something um, in Virginia we actually just did this last week is we just reviewed and rewrote our competencies for our cybersecurity course.
▶ 1:20:37Um, we do that every 3 to 5 years based on the course. Um, and we have uh higher education in the room. We have uh industry uh partners in the room and we have other high school teachers. So, we we just make sure that it's always updated and and fresh. Thank you. I just want to say thank you again for innovators. Uh well overdue. If we don't innovate, we die. So, thank you. We're going to make We're going to make this a great uh future for our kids. So, appreciate that. Thank you. I'll yield back.
▶ 1:21:06Uh Representative Hayes of Connecticut is recognized. Thank you. And thank you to our witnesses for being here. Before I begin, I would like to address a question that the chair of the full committee asked and none of you had an answer for. Just to give it a little context. He asked, "How did the federal government shutdown affect school districts?" And then followed up by saying it didn't. That is absolutely not true. School districts do not operate budgets on a week-to-week basis.
▶ 1:21:35So, much of the Title I funds and the IDEA funds that support our special education students had already been dispersed over the summer. So, schools were already operating with that. Many school districts, especially Title I districts that rely heavily on federal funding, saw delays in uh reimbursements for meal programs for their free and reduced their students with free and reduced lunches. And they had to direct funds from other places.
▶ 1:22:04We saw around the country Head Start programs that experienced closures or temporarily reduced services. Again, Title I districts saw a halting of federal grant-making opportunities and technical assistance to support them with those grants as they plan for the next year.
▶ 1:22:28I can tell you that my friends at the Department of Defense Education Activities, which is DODEA, our military schools, worked for several weeks without being paid, and many of their extracurricular activities were halted. They still showed up. So, the students didn't feel the impact, but if you ask them if there was any direct effect from the federal government, I'm sure that their answer would be different.
▶ 1:22:53And I think the thing that is most important and incredibly egregious is a constituent of mine who has a complaint with the Office of Civil Rights for a transition program for her severely disabled son who will be graduating soon, and she needs to make sure that his supports are in place as he transitions, and she lost weeks of getting an answer or at least a a meeting or a decision so that her son can transition
▶ 1:23:23out of high school. So, for our most impacted students and our most vulnerable school districts, if you ask them if there is any impact for those teachers working in those communities and those administrators trying to plan for the next year, they absolutely felt the effect of the last several weeks.
▶ 1:23:45I'm glad we're having this hearing today, but I also understand that this hearing is yet another example to try to make the case for why we do not need a Department of Education. Um, the the decision by this administration to cut CTE programs is deeply troubling for me, and I know that the Department of Labor excels at directing federal funds to short-term job training programs, but Ms.
▶ 1:24:13Rice, I listened to your testimony, and you talked about these programs as being a first experience, exploration, career development. Those are all things that educators do. I know this because I am an educator, if you can't tell already, but a person who has a cybersecurity background could not educate your students in the way that you did, in the way that you do. Could not align that work to the standards, could not make sure that they're exploring and having a club and different opportunities. Ms.
▶ 1:24:41Gasper, you talked about many of your students, the percentage that go on to the military. In my school, every student enrolled in a Perkins program also took the ASVAB tests, the practice test, and the actual test, and their guidance counselors aligned them with the classes to make sure that if they didn't pass it the first time, they would pass it on their subsequent attempts. All of those things happen in schools.
▶ 1:25:05And there should be a conversation and collaboration between business and the workplace, but teaching is a profession and it is different. And just because someone runs a business doesn't mean that they can teach young people to love a career, or have opportunities to explore, to fail and try again. So, I have a lot of questions, but I already know the answer to many of these questions, so a lot of this is rhetorical for me.
▶ 1:25:32what we should be doing on this committee is finding ways to match teachers with partners in the business world, so that they can bring that real-life experience in real time to keep them updated. But, we would be hard-pressed to think that someone who runs a successful business could stand in front of a classroom of high school students and transfer that knowledge and allow those kids to grasp that information. So, Ms.
▶ 1:25:56Christie, I really appreciate what you said about you don't care where the money comes from, you just want to make sure it's there and available for kids, but I hope you hold firmly to the last part of CTE, and that is the education part, and our kids deserve that aspect. My time is up. I have no questions. Uh, the uh, ranking member of the full committee, uh, Representative Scott of Virginia is recognized. Uh, thank Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:26:25before I got into Congress, I was involved in legislation involving job train job training and CTE. And one of the things about CTE there was we focused on was the fact that we're not helping a student, we just give them a skill, but not the basic education.
▶ 1:26:45And that that job they trained for may become obsolete, and if they have no background basic education, they would not have been well served. So, let me ask all of the, um, witnesses whether or not CTE is in addition to the basic education or instead of the basic education. Ms. Gasper, you want to start?
▶ 1:27:15Sure, I would say it's in addition to, uh, the basic education, and I think, um, Is this This is good. Pardon? Mr. Gates. Absolutely. It It should be something in addition to a strong rigorous academic Ms. Rice. Yes, I agree with them.
▶ 1:27:38It's an The three components that ensure a CT pre CTE program is effective is academic, technical, and employability
▶ 1:27:50Okay. And Ms. Gasper, do your students get a waiver on anything about the basics, the number of basic courses that have to be taken for No, sir. Mr. Gates, uh, you heard the question about, uh, interagency agreements. Have you heard any Have you heard of anything like what's happening in education in terms of interagency agreements?
▶ 1:28:18No, we used interagency agreements to transfer funds to support a an evaluation contract that another agency or because our contracting agency was was backed up and we needed to use the contracting agency of another agency. Those are the things that we use IAAs for. We don't transfer entire programs across the federal government. Mr.
▶ 1:28:41Gates, can you tell me what one of the problems with um the old time CTE is the students got we were advised when I was doing job that you shouldn't track people if if a student decides later in life like junior or senior year that they actually want to go to college they should not be so deeply tracked that that is not a good choice. That's not an available choice.
▶ 1:29:09Can you tell um the dangers of tracking students in the future in a CTE that does not include the basics? Sure, we want every young person to be prepared for further learning after high school regardless of what they choose to do. Um that's an important component of Perkins. You you were a leader in making sure Perkins focused on academic expectations for young people.
▶ 1:29:33Um I lost the question. I'm sorry.
▶ 1:29:42is it the tra- tracking? Oh, tracking. Tracking. Well, I think we need to make sure that in ninth grade young people have exposure to all careers. Real opportunities to try them out and then they make a choice in high school whether they want to go but they always have a choice opportunity to change their mind. And so they have the academics that they can do whatever they want in their lives. And so CTE like you said is an addition to the basics, the number of math courses, English courses, and everything else. Absolutely.
▶ 1:30:15Mr. Chairman, I'll yield back. I'll now recognize uh ranking member Bonamici for closing remarks. Uh thank you. Thank you very much to the witnesses. I I think it's been an excellent discussion and and I don't think there's any question uh that we all agree on the importance of career and technical education. That that is Uh there is a a difference uh in in looking at career and technical education as education or looking at it as job training. I think we need to continue that conversation.
▶ 1:30:46Um I I also want to note that the the full committee chairman, Mr. Walberg, talked about uh complimented Oregon, which I appreciate very much, and I just want to note that Oregon runs its CTE programs through our Higher Education Coordinating Commission that works with the Department of Education. Uh our workforce programs are run run like apprenticeships are run through our Bureau of Labor and Industries, but workforce and and uh career and technical education are are And and I I know from listening to the testimony today, especially Mr.
▶ 1:31:17Goetz, with your years of experience at the Department of Education, that the decision to transfer career and technical education programs from the Department of Education to the to the Department of Labor was not made with students or educators or communities in mind. It's part of a political agenda of eliminating the Department of Education and and And that that to me is incredibly disappointing uh when the the people with expertise uh are losing their jobs and the expertise is not there anymore.
▶ 1:31:43Um what was once a cohesive education-rooted system designed to support lifelong learning is now being fractured between these two agencies, one that uh the administration wants to eliminate, and two agencies have different missions and different capabilities. And as I said in my opening statement, CTE is not simply about job training or placement. It's about building pathways for students from middle school through post-secondary education and teaching them skills they can take into meaningful careers.
▶ 1:32:11And that work demands experienced educators and robust academic alignment, deep coordination with local communities is something that the Department of Education has long provided. We're already seeing the consequences, delayed grants, disjointed program administration, the erosion of trust from those on the ground trying to implement the programs. And I do want to note as well that Perkins doesn't set curriculum. That is done at the local level. There's a suggestion that Perkins or fed the federal government is setting curriculum. We don't do that.
▶ 1:32:40That is up to the states and localities and you think you could see by the the testimony that it is local decision-making. It's the Perkins dollars help. They help with equipment. They help with the funding. And let's not forget the broader context that this move is part of the as I said, the the strategy to dismantle the Department of Education and that's part of the Heritage Foundation's Project 2025 is a deeply concerning. This is not about job numbers or job training.
▶ 1:33:09If we care about student opportunity, if we care about educating students of today to fill all of the jobs of tomorrow, we cannot allow this misguided transfer to stand. We should restore these programs at the Department of Education and require that future changes go through Congress, not through political back channels. So, Mr. Chairman, I sincerely hope that we can work together to strengthen CTE programs, but especially I hope we can work together to counter this unprecedented power grab by the executive branch.
▶ 1:33:39This is not a decision that the executive branch can make on its own, but it's trying to. Congress needs to have a say. And I hope we can continue to talk about the harmful effects that dismantling the Department of Education will have on today's children and future generations. So, I again appreciate all all your testimony and and the the great work that you're doing and I look forward to further conversations and I yield back the balance of my time. Uh thank you uh very much to our witnesses. I think this has been a great hearing.
▶ 1:34:07It's been uh really inspiring to learn more about the incredible work uh that you're doing uh and the exciting educational opportunities you're providing for young people that put them on a path uh to fulfilling careers and provide a tremendous asset uh to our country. And thanks as well to the young people who are here as uh tremendous uh models uh uh look forward to meeting you guys here after the hearing and thanks for coming uh to DC. I also want to thank the members of the committee on both sides.
▶ 1:34:34Uh while we are not always in total and complete harmony on every aspect of education policy, I uh am really encouraged that there is uh substantial bipartisan support uh for CTE. I think that for uh a while the pendulum swung way too far towards this mantra of college uh for all uh but now it's starting to swing back. We have tremendous uh momentum for CTE across the country and we need to do everything we can here uh to keep that going. It's more important than ever now. Without objection, there being no further business, the committee stands