▶ 0:00:08South Central Asia will come to order and the purpose of the hearing is to examine the historical, political, and strategic context of the US India relationship. So, appreciate the patience of our witnesses. Um Welcome to Washington, D.C. Hurry up and wait. Uh and uh we certainly just saw that coming off of the House floor. So, uh I I am going to recognize myself here for 4 minutes for an opening statement. Uh the US India relationship is no longer just important.
▶ 0:00:37It is a defining relationship of the 21st century. If America wants a free Indo-Pacific, resilient supply chains in a world where democracy, not authoritarianism, sets the rules, then our partnership with India is critical.
▶ 0:00:52While the partnership has been nuanced since India gained independence in 1947 and India's non-alignment posture shaped its strategic identity, the United States and the Republic of India share a common vision of a free, open, and secure Indo-Pacific rooted in democratic values and a desire, deep desire, for That's why every American administration, Republican and Democrat, has strengthened ties, uh or certainly at least attempted to, making clear that the United States does not see India as a
▶ 0:01:22temporary or transactional partner. Still, we must view this moment with clear eyes. President Putin's warm visit to India last week and India's participation in China's Shanghai Cooperation Organization Summit this September raised some understandable At the same time, India has agreed to purchase more American energy, thereby thereby reducing significantly its reliance on Russia.
▶ 0:01:47In fact, on my way in earlier, uh I ran into a delegation uh of parliamentarians from Latvia uh who uh through connections with Michigan and the Michigan National Guard and the Latvian military uh we're all very acquainted with them.
▶ 0:02:04And uh when I mentioned that I was going to be uh chairing this hearing on India and US relations, the first thing that they brought up was, "Please ask them to stop buying Russian oil so that uh they don't have the cash to be a threat to us." So uh message received, message delivered. Uh moreover, authoritarian powers like China and Russia are redrawing borders by force, undermining democratic norms, and coercing their neighbors.
▶ 0:02:31Nowhere is this more evident than in the Where an increasingly aggressive China threatens regional stability, global prosperity, and the open flow of commerce. China's string of pearls ideologically I ideology is no longer just a theory, but rather an overt attempt to encircle and control the Indian Ocean, its sea lanes, and expand the militarization of these strategic ports and trade routes. We cannot allow this to happen in my opinion. India knows these risks firsthand.
▶ 0:03:00Since 2020, Chinese forces have killed Indian soldiers on their shared border. India has responded decisively, pushing back against Chinese military pressure and limiting China's influence inside India and in neighboring Bhutan. Today, US-India cooperation spans defense, technology, counterterrorism, and trade. Defense ties have never been stronger. India participates in the Quad along with our allies Japan and Australia.
▶ 0:03:28Additionally, our military's conduct joint exercises from the Indian Ocean uh to reduce done and transfer some of our most advanced defense technologies to deepen military-to-military trust and the counterterrorism cooperation is equally significant.
▶ 0:03:47The LET and the TRF, the organizations responsible for the heinous attack in Pulwama were designated by the Trump administration as foreign terrorist organizations in July of 2025, reflecting our shared commitment to fighting terror wherever it occurs. This partnership is not only about security. People-to-people ties between our nations are extraordinary. More than 5 million Indian Americans contribute to the American economy. They serve in our military. They lead major companies.
▶ 0:04:17Meanwhile, American students, businesses, and tourists engage with India every year, strengthening our connection to one of the world's most vibrant democracies. In fact, I'm submitting a letter for the record from the Indo-American Chamber of Commerce, headquartered in Detroit, Michigan, supporting the work of this hearing and stressing that the US-India relationship is not just a diplomatic one, but rather a living bridge of shared values, democratic principles, and economic opportunity.
▶ 0:04:44Without any India is one of the fastest-growing major economies in the world. American companies increasingly see India not just as a market, but as a partner to innovation, especially in AI, communications, and advanced technologies, where collaboration already exists. American companies are eager to enter the Indian market on a level playing field. A new trade deal with with India under President Trump and Prime Minister Modi would further realize this goal and enhance the relationship.
▶ 0:05:15Open markets, strengthening supply chains, and driving innovation, all of which would chart a new beginning in our storied partnership. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses and on how the world's largest economy and the soon-to-be third largest economy can work together to counterbalance China and preserve a free and open Indo-Pacific. And with that, I will recognize now the ranking member from California, Representative Kamala Harris for an opening statement.
▶ 0:05:43Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. I want to commend the chair for holding this hearing on the US India strategic partnership and leaning into the very important work of our subcommittee in stewarding this critical relationship. And why is this important?
▶ 0:06:03Because the US relationship with India will be defining for both countries uh in how we are sort of placing uh ourselves in the 21st century world It is essential to sustain US leadership in all the sectors that will shape the future: defense, climate, energy, AI, space, and emerging technologies.
▶ 0:06:25Working with India through the Quad helps maintain a free and open Indo-Pacific and enhances the regional influence of the United States and our partners. The strategic convergence between US and India at a time of heightened international competition is enduring, but it certainly cannot be taken for granted.
▶ 0:06:45Successive presidential administrations of both political parties have devoted years of painstaking work to build trust and deepen cooperation between our two countries. When Trump took office at the beginning of this year, the Biden administration handed him a bilateral relationship at the height of its strength. A revitalized Quad, a budding defense tech partnership, and a trusted supply chain partner.
▶ 0:07:12These were hard-earned accomplishments and the product of strategic discipline from our two countries. And then what happened? Flush, flush, flush down the toilet the capital that Americans have built over decades in service of Trump's personal grievances and at the expense of our national interests.
▶ 0:07:33And unless he changes course, Trump will be the American president that lost India or more accurately that chased India away while revitalizing the Russian empire, while breaking up the transatlantic alliance, and menacing Latin America. That is not a legacy any president should be excited about having.
▶ 0:07:55When the history books are written about where Trump's antagonism towards India began, they will point to something that has nothing to do with our long-term strategic interests. His personal obsession with a Nobel Peace Prize. While that is laughable, the harm that it will cause is not. Singling out India for 50% tariffs, one of the highest rates imposed on any country, has effectively derailed leader-level meetings between our two countries.
▶ 0:08:22Yet, the 25% tariff rate that has attributed to India's imports of Russian oil look pretty pointless when Steve Witcoff is striking backroom deals with Putin advisers to sell out Ukraine in exchange for some business investment. There have been real strategic costs to this protracted trade negotiation. The annual Quad leader summit, one of the most important unity-projecting platforms for the US and our Indo-Pacific partners, has been indefinitely postponed.
▶ 0:08:48This has sent a dangerous signal to our allies and the PRC about the US withdrawal from our most pressing interests on the world stage. And beyond tariffs, Trump has also attacked the people-to-people ties between the US and India. The $100,000 fee on H-1B visas, 70% of which are held by Indians, is a rebuke of the incredible contributions Indians have made to science, technology, medicine, and arts in the United States.
▶ 0:09:15Trump's policies towards India can only be described as cutting our nose to spite our face. And this is doing real and lasting damage to the strategic trust and mutual understanding between our two countries. Because, let me be clear, being a coercive partner has a cost. And this poster is worth a thousand words. You do not get a Nobel Peace Prize by driving US strategic partners into the arms of our adversaries.
▶ 0:09:44We must move with incredible urgency to mitigate the damage that this administration has done to the US-India partnership and return to the cooperation that is essential to US prosperity, security, and global leadership. Congress understands the stake of this relationship on a bipartisan basis, and I thank the chair for providing the opportunity to get that on the record today. I look forward to a robust discussion, and I yield
▶ 0:10:13General lady yields back. The chair reminds other members of the committee that an opening statements that they may have may be submitted for the record. We're pleased to have a distinguished panel of witnesses before us today on this important topic. First, we have Mr. Jeff Smith, the director of Asian Studies I'm sorry, the director of Asian Studies Center at the Heritage Foundation. We have Mr.
▶ 0:10:38Dhruva Jaishankar, the executive director at director at Observer Research Foundation in America. Thank you, sir. And Samir La Sorry, Lawani. Samir Lawani is the advisor of special competitive studies project and senior fellow at the Indo-Pacific program at the German Marshall Fund of the United States and the research affiliate at MIT Security Studies program. I would hate to see your business card, sir.
▶ 0:11:06So, at this point I am going to give myself 5 minutes for for my I'm sorry, we're going to be Sorry, I'm getting ahead of myself. We are going to have each of our witnesses give us their opening and certainly I understand the issues that are important here before us, and and we're very appreciative of your time, especially as we had fairly significant delay while we were waiting for things
▶ 0:11:36to get resolved on the House floor. Uh your full statements will be made part of the uh record and I'll ask you to keep your spoken remarks to 5 minutes or to uh allow us some time for member questions. So, with that I'm going to start with you, Mr. Smith. You are recognized for 5
▶ 0:11:52Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to the ranking member for having me today. I have been a vocal advocate for the India-US relationship for nearly 20 So, it has been a bit difficult uh for me to see the two sides hit choppy waters this year.
▶ 0:12:09Let me start out by saying I think the strategic partnership has been an unmitigated success for the United States and in fact, I think it has been a rare success in a sea of foreign policy mistakes since the turn of the This is one of the few bipartisan successes that I think we'll be able to point to in the history books. Um my written testimony explains India's growing importance geopolitically and to the United States in greater detail. I will just briefly relay some of the greatest hits.
▶ 0:12:39We are of course talking about the world's largest democracy. We are talking about now the most populous country in the world. We are talking about a country that um has nuclear weapons, aircraft carriers, a space program, and nuclear submarines. So, it is many ways at the top of the geopolitical pecking order. Um it is the fastest growing large power. It is a top five economy and a top five military today and very soon it will be a top three economy and top three military.
▶ 0:13:09In other words, very soon China, India, and the US will be in a class of their own. And where India is positioned between China and the US matters a great This has been a low-cost, high-benefit partnership for the United States and the dividend from that investment has brought us material benefits.
▶ 0:13:30Now over 30 billion dollars in US arms sales to India, over 200 billion dollars in annual trade, over 40 billion dollars in Indian investments in the US supporting over 420,000 jobs. India is now buying 15 billion dollars worth of American energy and that number is likely go to go up to 25 billion in the near future. We are doing joint patrols in the South China Sea. We are training for mountain warfare in the Himalayas. We are tracking Chinese submarines together in the Indian Ocean.
▶ 0:14:00We are refueling each other's warships at sea, resupplying each other's militaries, and India has granted us access to strategically located military bases, which is of utility to the United I want to talk briefly about what happened this year. Expectations started very high for the second Trump administration in part because the first Trump administration went very well.
▶ 0:14:26In fact, it was arguably the best four-year stretch in the contemporary relationship, including the reviving of the Quad group, a boost in arms sales, a more formal relationship between India and CENTCOM, and a suspension of aid to Pakistan, um among other things.
▶ 0:14:46So we entered Trump 2, I think, with high expectations and a visit by Prime Minister Modi in February that went relatively well, but we uh unfortunately had a few hang-ups. First, we were unable to reach a trade deal, which resulted in 25% Liberation Day tariffs on India.
▶ 0:15:04Second, the Trump administration imposed 25% tariffs on India for purchases of Russian oil, a form of sanction in order to persuade India to stop buying Russian But between those two events, um something frankly even worse happened that was not a major event in the US press, but it certainly was in India. Gunmen from a well-known Pakistani terrorist group snuck into Kashmir and went to a honeymoon mountain retreat and started shooting young couples dead in broad daylight.
▶ 0:15:33That prompted a response from India, including strikes on terrorist training camps, and an eventual exchange between the Indian and Pakistani militaries to include missiles, artillery, and drones. Pakistan made frantic calls to Washington, and the Trump administration ultimately intervened and helped to create a ceasefire between the two countries, which was an unmitigated good However, I believe uh our administration's messaging on that conflict and the ceasefire put
▶ 0:16:04Prime Minister Modi in a difficult position at All of sudden, he was not claiming victory against India's arch-nemesis, but his critics portrayed him as bending to the will of the US and being subservient. And I think that made it difficult for Prime Minister Modi to to message appropriately on this, and I think both sides could have done a better job handling uh that ceasefire announcement.
▶ 0:16:29I have a lot more to say on the China-India relationship, uh on the India-Russia relationship, but I would just say it would be strategic malpractice of the highest order to discard the quarter-century dividend of trust and partnership we have built with India, and I'm confident we can get the relationship back on a positive footing moving forward. Thank you.
▶ 0:16:51Thank you, Mr. Smith. Uh I now rep- uh recognize Mr. Jaishankar for an opening You're recognized for 5 minutes.
▶ 0:16:59Thank you. Uh Chairman Huizenga, Ranking Member Comfort the Dove, uh and members of the subcommittee, I'm grateful for the invitation to appear before you I appear in my personal capacity as an Indian citizen, and my testimony reflects only my own views as an analyst of international relations. The US-India partnership has strengthened considerably since 1998.
▶ 0:17:18From severe US sanctions following India's nuclear tests, we've come a long Congress was instrumental in enabling the lifting of those sanctions under Bill Clinton and in passing legislation in 2006 to enable civilian nuclear commerce with India under George W. Uh it has Congress has also supported the major defense partnership under President Obama and the resurrection of the Quad under Presidents Trump and In India, three successive Prime Ministers over the past 27 years have invested in a closer partnership with the United States.
▶ 0:17:49Today, that strategic strategic partnership is very significant. The two countries have signed a series of agreements on military logistics, supply, and information sharing. All three military services have done military exercises this year. US sales of defense equipment to India have also grown, and India now operates 10 major US defense platforms. So, why have five US Presidents and three Indian Prime Ministers invested in this relationship over 27 years?
▶ 0:18:15The first major impetus for better relations has been economic opportunities for both countries. The figure of 212 billion in goods and services trade arguably understates the importance of the economic relationship for both countries. Taken together, Indian investors, importers, entrepreneurs, students, AI researchers, doctors, and tourists contribute conservatively over 200 billion dollars to the US economy and are responsible for at least 830,000 American jobs in every one of the 50 states and every territories.
▶ 0:18:46The second rationale for closer ties has been strategic, related to China's rise and assertiveness in the Indo-Pacific. In recent years, China has expanded and modernized its nuclear arsenal, undertaken one of the largest naval build-ups in its history, and unveiled new unmanned and cyber systems. In 2020, a major mobilization by the PLA resulted in clashes in which 20 Indian military personnel lost their lives.
▶ 0:19:10China's also developed a network of potentially dual use ports across the and beyond that might be used to secure critical choke points. The Indian Navy has a result has stepped up, increased the tempo of its patrols, and contributed to maritime burden sharing in the Indian Ocean and Pacific. Both the United States and India also have enormous trade deficits with China, $296 billion in in the case of the United States, $99 billion in the case of India.
▶ 0:19:35And China's rare earth export restrictions have reinforced concerns about supply chain concentration as leverage with competitors. Another area of strategic convergence convergence between the United States and India has involved stabilizing the Middle East. The Abraham Accords brokered by the first Trump administration enabled an economic dialogue involving India, Israel, the UAE, and the United States. And more ambitiously, India and the US have plans for an India-Middle East-Europe economic corridor.
▶ 0:20:01However, this considerable progress in consolidating the relationship has uh been now is now at a political political The biggest obstacle concerns tariffs. Uh President President Trump's desire to balance trade with India uh and access India's market is precisely what India is offering. India has signed five trade agreements in recent years and is actively negotiating at least five more. a solution to a trade and tariff differences between the United States and India is therefore at hand.
▶ 0:20:31The second challenge in India relates to the United States renewed engagement with Pakistan's military leadership. Pakistan has a long and well-documented history of using non-state terrorist proxies against India. Uh as a result uh of over many years, uh India's experience is that third-party mediation has often contributed to Pakistan's adventurism.
▶ 0:20:50And so the United States pursued a policy of hyphenation between India and Pakistan, engaging with both and but minimizing involvement in their There remains considerable progress for future collaboration should differences between over trade and Pakistan be successfully managed between the United States and India. The outline of what is possible was filled out by President Trump and Prime Minister Modi in February. This includes $500 billion in trade by 2030, which will be facilitated by a bilateral trade agreement.
▶ 0:21:18The United States is now a major provider of oil and gas to India, and coal exports have also increased. And civil nuclear cooperation is possible. As is cooperation on defense, uh on AI, and a variety of other emerging technologies. There's also the possibility of cooperation on the Quad and in the Middle East.
▶ 0:21:36The written testimony that I have submitted contains significantly more detail concerning the value of the US-India commercial partnership, India's challenges with China and Pakistan, the ongoing trade negotiations, the India-Russia relationship, and the considerable potential for US-India collaboration on trade, defense, technology, and energy. Thank you, and I look forward to your
▶ 0:21:54Thank you, Mr. Jaishankar. I now recognize Mr. Luwani for an opening statement. You're recognized for 5
▶ 0:22:02Chairman Meijer, Ranking Member and distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to testify on the US-India strategic partnership and its importance to a free and open Indo-Pacific. I'll focus on first principles, US strategic objectives, recent progress, challenges, and some recommendations if I can get to them. For more than 25 years, there's been a strong bipartisan consensus that India is essential to US strategy in the Indo-Pacific for three simple reasons.
▶ 0:22:28First, India's consequential to world order as a rising pole and a major economic, military, and innovation power. Second, the US and India share core strategic interests, namely peace and prosperity for our societies underpinned by a free and open Indo-Pacific. This involves a stable balance of power that deters aggression from any nation. Third, our partnership is grounded in common values and democratic institutions. We may differ at times on individual issues, but we remain aligned on the core principles that underpin a stable international order.
▶ 0:22:59So, what are US strategic objectives? First, economic opportunity. India's India is a fast-growing market with highly skilled workforce that offers opportunities for American businesses and consumers across energy, defense, technology, agriculture, and health care. Linking our supply chains reduces dependence on China, strengthens resilience, and supports new jobs and Second, science and technology cooperation. India's proven its innovation prowess from advanced lunar missions to world-class digital public infrastructure.
▶ 0:23:27India offers one of the most dynamic innovation hubs at scale, rapidly advancing in AI, quantum, biotech, space, and software. It produces enormous STEM talent and hosts nearly 1,500 global engineering centers. Partnering with India helps the United States sustain its own long-term technological leadership and win the strategic tech competition with China. Third, defense cooperation, which plays a a critical role in balancing China's military power.
▶ 0:23:53Joint US-India military exercises, intelligence cooperation, and logistics agreements, and defense codevelopment enhance deterrence in the India can eventually shoulder more day-to-day security responsibilities in the Indian Ocean, complicate Chinese military planning in a cross-strait crisis, and provide industrial surge capacity in a protracted conflict. Over the past decade in recent years, we witnessed significant progress in our relationship.
▶ 0:24:17First, new strategic frameworks such as the TRUST initiative transforming the relationship utilizing strategic technology, and a new 10-year framework for the major defense partnership, which are driving defense and economic cooperation as well as joint pri in space, defense, cyber, Initiatives like INDUS-X in Asia have helped network startups, R&D, capital, and primes to build uh defense capabilities for both countries. Second, our militaries are training together at an unprecedented pace, scope, and sophistication.
▶ 0:24:46Complex exercises on land, air, and sea um are are complemented by a multitude of routine exercises deepening India's also working more closely with US allies and contributing to standing maritime security missions in the Indian Third, defense industrial cooperation is accelerating.
▶ 0:25:04We're advancing more codevelopment and co-production of systems such as drones, sonobuoys, jet engine components, satellites, and Indian deep tech companies are also expanding into the United States, bringing jobs and innovation to our Now, every relationship has its challenges, but some run deeper than others. On the India-China relationship, fears of a of a recent diplomatic thaw, I think, are overstated.
▶ 0:25:27Border disputes, strategic rivalry, and Beijing's coercive economic behavior will ensure that relationship stays India's legacy dependence on Russia for defense equipment and energy is real, but also steadily shrinking. Russia, unlike the United States, plays little role in India's technologies of the future, like AI, quantum, and biotech. Recent trade frictions with the United States and tariff escalations have catalyzed some concerns in India and risk eroding some trust.
▶ 0:25:52While a major trade agreement can unlock significant gains, we still need to rebuild that confidence in US reliability. But perhaps the biggest challenge we face right now is a say-do gap. Implementation has not always matched ambition. Slow progress on major initiatives, such as jet engine co-production agreement, can dilute strategic benefits and weaken deterrence. Closing this gap requires investment of sustained resources, focus, and leadership. So, to strengthen the partnership, I offer several recommendations.
▶ 0:26:21First, increase funding for US-India defense innovation, including INDUS-X, joint challenges, joint accelerators, and field testing integrated field testing integrated into joint Second, create a joint investment fund to support deep tech partnerships modeled on successful prior US co-investment platforms. Third, increase funding and authorities within the Departments of State and perhaps Commerce to support trust the trust technology agenda, bilateral innovation centers, STEM exchanges and visitor programs, and IMET.
▶ 0:26:51Fourth, streamline export control processes and timelines for India using approaches similar to recent August With enhanced commitment and sustained focus and oversight, we can ensure this partnership reaches its full potential. Thank you.
▶ 0:27:04Thank you very much. Um I uh now recognize myself for 5 minutes of questioning. The United States and India share a vital interest in ensuring that the Indo-Pacific remains free and open. Sea lanes of the India and Indian and Pacific Oceans carry the trade that literally fuels the global economy, including billions of dollars in US exports and nearly 80% of the of the global seaborn oil trade.
▶ 0:27:29If adversarial powers gain control over these routes or expand their bases across the Indian Ocean, they could have a dangerous leverage over the uh global economy. Given China Sorry, given India's strategic location along key sea routes in the Indian Ocean, increasing naval cooperation seems vital to counter China's maritime ambitions. Uh I'm going to start with you, Mr. Smith, and kind of work down the uh the the line here.
▶ 0:27:55What concrete actions should Congress take to improve US-India maritime cooperation specifically and intelligence gathering to bolster deterrence in the India Indo-Pacific? I think you had mentioned uh doing joint uh sub uh monitoring and some other things that are going on and uh just please elaborate on that.
▶ 0:28:16Yeah, there's already a good deal of cooperation underway, uh particularly intelligence sharing around the subject of maritime domain awareness that has improved significantly in recent years. I frankly think there's always room for even more improvement. Chinese uh submarines had not been present in the Indian Ocean until the last decade.
▶ 0:28:36Around they started doing routine patrols, couching them as anti-piracy missions, although most of us know you don't need a nuclear submarine to counter pirates off the Somali coast. That understandably has India very concerned. China also has, as you mentioned, these string of pearls bases around the Indian Ocean, including in its close strategic partner Pakistan. That presence has India feeling increasingly encircled. Right?
▶ 0:29:03So, they have the border dispute issue, but there's also a maritime component to the rivalry, and that has been heating up You have the US with a base in Diego which has been under question as of late. I think it's important that the US maintain access to Diego Garcia. But, on the other side of the Indian Ocean, you have an Indian naval base at the mouth of the Strait of Malacca at the Andaman and Nicobar Islands. And frankly, this is an extremely valuable asset for any country, certainly for India.
▶ 0:29:33I would like to see even more US and Indian cooperation around that location because it allows both of us to monitor the traffic coming in and out of the Indian Ocean from the Western Pacific. Mr. Jayashankar.
▶ 0:29:46Thank you. Jeff has actually covered many of the main issues. China established its first military overseas military base in Djibouti to the west of India. And so, as he suggested, India is now confronting the idea of a militarization of the broader area to its north, west, south, and east. It The Indian Navy has since 2017 increased the tempo of its patrols in the Indian Ocean. It conducts regular piracy operations, humanitarian assistance, and disaster relief.
▶ 0:30:16It has also taking a bigger role in the Western Pacific as well. This year the Indian Navy did exercises with Korea, South Korea, and Australia, visited Papua New Guinea and Fiji, and did exercises off of Guam as well. So, there's a lot more that can be done, particularly in the underwater in the undersea domain. That's been a particularly sensitive issue for the US Navy, Um, uh, that remains an area where they can be much more cooperation.
▶ 0:30:44Okay, sorry, my time's going quickly. Mr. Lawali, I'm I'm going to have you answer my next question. Um, we, uh, just this week the United States and India hosted the 21st meeting of the Joint Working Group on where they discussed emerging threats, terror recruitment and financing, a number of those things. Uh, what specific counterterrorism initiatives between our two countries are proving most effective, and how can the United States strengthen our ties with India to achieve meaningful outcomes that degrade radical Islamic terrorism?
▶ 0:31:15Well, thanks for the question. I I think there's a number of things we're doing already that are effective. We have a lot of, uh, collaboration in law enforcement, intelligence sharing. That I think that's sort of historic and been going back since, uh, the Mumbai attacks in 2008. Uh, we've been collaborating a lot on counterterrorism counter terror financing uh, at the Financial Action Task Force. Um, we have, uh, actually a standing mission at the Combined Maritime Force that's doing a lot of interdiction of illicit, uh, trafficking, shipping, arms, uh, drugs and and financing.
▶ 0:31:45sort of finance, uh, terrorism. And I think the areas where we could start to build even more in is on capability development. So, as India acquires more intelligence capability, space-based intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance, um, AI tools and applications for better data fusion to more rapidly address threats, uh, I think we'll start to see more effective, uh, deterrence and and, you know, counterterrorism operations.
▶ 0:32:08And everybody has been spectacularly on time. Never We haven't gone over a moment until, uh, just now. So, uh, with that I will, uh, recognize the ranking member for 5 minutes.
▶ 0:32:20Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to our witnesses. You know, it is rare to have, uh, this relative bipartisan agreement on an issue, so I want to capitalize on it for a moment. I will ask each of you, um, the same question. Uh, it's no gotcha, I promise. um but it really is a a simple yes or no, and I'll start with you, Mr. Smith, and then we'll go to Mr. Jaishankar, and then we'll go to Mr. Lalwani. Um so, Mr.
▶ 0:32:48Smith, would you say that our partnership with India is critical to countering China's malign influence, yes or no?
▶ 0:32:58Okay, thank you, Mr. Jaishankar.
▶ 0:33:03Okay. Yay. And so, um would you say that India's role in the Quad enhances our ability to promote a free and open Indo-Pacific, Mr. Smith? I'll
▶ 0:33:15Absolutely, yes.
▶ 0:33:18Okay, perfect. Last question. Would you each say that a strong US-India partnership makes it easier to maintain deterrence in the Indo-Pacific, Mr.
▶ 0:33:31Okay, it is fantastic and wonderful uh to hear that we are all on the same page, and I would have said yes to each of those questions as well. Um so, now I want to walk us through the 50% tariffs that are currently holding the US-India relationship hostage, and Mr. Jaishankar, I will ask uh you uh these next few questions.
▶ 0:33:55Did the US and India begin negotiations on a trade deal before or after Trump announced in April that he was going to subject India to the 25% liberation day
▶ 0:34:09Uh thank you uh Congresswoman. Um the um this is actually be a question that I think the office of the US Trade Representative would be best equipped to answer, but based on what has been publicly reported, yes, the negotiations began before February 13th. It was on February 13th that President Trump uh announced uh tariffs.
▶ 0:34:27Right before Valentine's Day. I I that information as well. Um and that would lead me to believe that the tariffs were not even really needed uh to kick-start negotiations since they were already happening. So, uh Mr. Jaishankar, is it your understanding that since February uh US and Indian negotiators were working in good faith and were very close to reaching a deal when Trump went ahead and imposed the 25% tariff?
▶ 0:34:57So, not asking like what the deal was, but is it your understanding that they were close to getting to a deal?
▶ 0:35:03I do not know how close they were at that point of time. Uh the the tariffs kicked in uh on April 2nd. Um, but negotiations had started. My understanding is uh by early July the two sides had reached uh quite close to uh a
▶ 0:35:16So, that's my understanding as well, that by July there was actually a deal on the table uh that both sides had negotiated, but it was a deal that for some reason Trump didn't like, and so he essentially imposed these tariffs and put everybody back at the negotiating table. So, now we have the 25% Liberation Day tariffs, and then to everyone's surprise Trump imposed an additional 25% tariffs for India's imports of Russian oil, bringing the number to 50%.
▶ 0:35:48So, my question for you, Mr. Jaishankar, is did the administration make clear that India would be subject to a cumulate cumulative 50% tariff for Russian oil imports before or after they actually imposed the 50% rate?
▶ 0:36:05Uh so, I believe on August 6th there was an announcement by President Trump that using uh executive authority that he uh would have the ability to impose it. It would kick in in September. Um, and um so, that was when I think the official announcement took place. The uh tariff extra 25% tariff was imposed in
▶ 0:36:26After. exactly. So, I'm sharing this because for me the theme of this administration seems to be to punish your partners and abuse your friends. And I don't know about you, but this is not how I would do a partner. Um my job, I do want to say that my job is not to be a sole cheerleader for India, but it is to ensure that the US has the best strategic alliances around the world.
▶ 0:36:51And I consider India to be one of those strategic alliances that we should be continuing to cultivate. And I would argue that Americans will be less safe if India has a stronger relationship with Russia and China than with the United States. Because the tariff rate on India is currently higher than the tariff rate on China. Meanwhile, Russia and China are getting pretty good deals from the administration right now.
▶ 0:37:20A favorable resolution for Russia and Ukraine and an effective policy freeze on sanctions and export controls for China. I I just think we should be, Mr. Chair, rethinking how we treat our partner, how we treat our partnership with India. And with that, I yield back.
▶ 0:37:37The ranking member yields back. I now recognize myself for 5 minutes. Thank you to our distinguished witnesses for being here today. Over the last several decades, America and India have developed strong defense, economic, and technological As we meet today to discuss the Indo-Pacific region, I look forward to hearing how the US can continue to strategically partner with India.
▶ 0:38:07Mr. Smith, in your written testimony, you note the important partnership between the US and India in countering China's influence. You stated, "Of all China's neighbors, India has offered the stiffest resistance to China's more aggressive foreign policy under General Secretary Xi Jinping. What steps can the US take to maintain and strengthen our strategic security partnerships with India to counter
▶ 0:38:35Uh yes, sir, thank you for the question and I just want to underscore again the point I made in my written testimony, which is that India indeed has shown the stiffest resistance. It has engaged in it has stopped Chinese coercion at their at their border. Unlike us, it was able to ban TikTok essentially overnight when it saw an espionage and influence operation problem with TikTok.
▶ 0:38:59In fact, it banned dozens of Chinese apps when they became And it has put up fierce restrictions on Chinese investments in India that could pose security risks. So, I just want to underscore again that India has been much tougher than many of its other neighbors that have been bullied and coerced by China in offering some resistance. I think there are a number of things that we can do to continue to strengthen the India-US partnership.
▶ 0:39:24I think developing the Quad, continuing to develop that and even potentially to expand the Quad to allow for observer nations to join in in Quad military exercises would be a way to broaden that coalition. Um there are always more things that the United States and India can do together in a bilateral way. There are several weapons platforms that could be useful to India in deterring Chinese aggression at the border and in the Indian Ocean that the United States should be prepared and willing to sell to India.
▶ 0:39:54Um and there are a number of intelligence sharing arrangements that I think we could put in place that would help India to monitor Chinese movements along the disputed border, for example, or Chinese submarines in the Indian Ocean. But, I think we also need to do a firmer job supporting India diplomatically when it faces coercion from China and showing it that it has a trusted partner and friend in the United States. Good. Uh thank you. Uh, Mr.
▶ 0:40:18Jaishankar uh, continuing on this subject, what strategic role does the Quad play in countering coercion in the Indo-Pacific?
▶ 0:40:28The, uh, uh, under the Biden administration, the the the Quad was resurrected under the first Trump administration, primarily as a coordination mechanism. Under the Biden administration, uh, it became elevated to a leadership level meeting, and a number of working groups were established to work in a very large number of, uh, areas. I would say a signature achievement was the creation of a Indo-Pacific Maritime Domain Awareness Initiative.
▶ 0:40:54Under the Trump administration, uh, the there's been a pairing down of the Quad on a few key areas, which is really maritime security, economic security, technological security, and humanitarian assistance. And these are all areas where the Quad could be doing a lot more. In fact, this year, in a small way, the Quad continued to do a lot of that work. Um, however, a Quad leadership summit has been repeatedly postponed. India is expected to host the next one.
▶ 0:41:18Um, I think breaking the impasse in US-India relations would help in, uh, getting to that summit, uh, and, uh, uh, achieving more, uh, through the
▶ 0:41:29Thank you. Uh, Mr. Lalwani, uh, you highlight in your testimony the important role of economic partnerships between the United States and India. How can continuing to deepen America's economic ties with India counter China's economic coercion?
▶ 0:41:51I think there are a number of ways. Um, one of them would be, uh, onshoring investment, um, and enhancing Indian capabilities, uh, production, manufacturing, uh, so that it becomes less dependent on on Chinese trade. I think there's a I think previous witnesses have mentioned the stark imbalance in trade, uh, and depends on, um, for both of us with China. and so that's at least certainly one way where you can sort of wean off or help India wean itself away from dependencies on Chinese imports.
▶ 0:42:21Probably some other ways have more to do with also technology. So for example, Apple's making iPhones in India. Scaling up that manufacturing moves the supply chains away from China, increases you know, the supply chains in democratic countries and is in both our mutual interests.
▶ 0:42:40Thank you. I now Mr. Barr from California for 5 minutes of questioning.
▶ 0:42:48Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um I appreciate the opening questions by both the chairman and ranking member and you know the strong bipartisan support that um that Congress has shown for the US-India strategy.
▶ 0:43:02You know, we recently introduced a a resolution a sense of Congress that was bipartisan 24 members um talking about three decades you know, of strategy going back to President Clinton to President Bush to President Obama to um President Trump's first term to President Biden. It's clear our interests from the congressional perspective and the administration perspective is a closer relationship.
▶ 0:43:26Both our economic interests our geopolitical strategic interests um to create a a an atmosphere of security, peace, prosperity um that that yeah, I think both the Indian government Indian people want that we also want. Mr. I appreciated Chairman Huizenga's questioning about the importance of the Indian Ocean region.
▶ 0:43:46I recently visited with Western Naval Command and and sat there in the maritime partnership between the United States and India is extremely strong right now and I think there's a desire to do more joint training, more exercises. That's a vast region and we will have to partner with India.
▶ 0:44:02I'd love to get Australia more engaged in the Indian Ocean area as well because you know, we were probably a little slow into the Pacific Island region and so forth and and lost some ground but we see what competitor nations are doing in that region and you know, for a free and open Indian Ocean region for maritime security for freedom and navigation. It's going to be important for us to work together and much more closely together. I guess I will ask a question.
▶ 0:44:29I know um the ranking member had a uh a picture of of um Prime Minister Modi with um Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping. and that does cause some heartburn um for for folks in Congress but I also My assessment is India understands their long-term interests. They have to coexist with with China. They have to you know, trade with China. Um look for ways to be competitors with China.
▶ 0:44:59But my assessment having been in India recently is they also understand a lot of their long-term interests lie with you know, the the the West. Um a lot with the United States, with Europe, others. They're welcoming um US multinational companies investing and you know, um there's some synergy there. I guess I'd start with you, Mr. Lalwani. You say that in act is an accurate?
▶ 0:45:23Mr. Shankar.
▶ 0:45:25Mr. Smith.
▶ 0:45:27Right. Um I also you know, some of the recent announcements the the $100,000 tariff when on the H-1B's um you know, it was announced when we were landing in in India so I spent a lot of time um trying to do some damage control there. My perspective is this fee hurts American companies, disadvantages our companies. Um I'm glad that I've heard the president at times say, "Hey, wait a minute. We we need this talent. We need um these relationships.
▶ 0:45:56We need to work with like-valued allies and and or I wouldn't say out like valued partners to solve these big challenges, whether that's AI, whether that's bio health security, whether that's creating redundant supply chains.
▶ 0:46:10So, I'm glad to see the president starting to put out those comments and you know, I hope we can work together in Congress to come up with a visa that allows um you know, Indian scientists to travel back and forth to the United States, as well as US um scientists and and engineers to move back and forth to India. And that's something that, you know, um we've had conversations about to create a visa category or um corridors where we can freely move back and forth.
▶ 0:46:40These are not folks that are um threats to overstay their their their visas. In fact, you know, the dynamism of young Indian um talent that's come here to get educated, many of them are not going back to India because you see dynamic markets in India um where there's tremendous growth in the domestic economy there that, you know, they can do proof of concept with their ideas. They can scale up in India and then bring those ideas back to the United States. So, I would hope we see more of this cross collaboration.
▶ 0:47:08Um I guess the the last question I would have or or it's probably a statement. Um yes, we do have some concerns about India's closeness with Russia, but just based on historic norms, that's to be expected. What I would like to encourage India to do is the president sincerely does want to find a cessation to the con- conflict in Ukraine.
▶ 0:47:31India can play a unique role given their lines of communication with the Russians, given their ability um to understand the the the the Russians, to bring them to the table. I would think the president would look at that um very favorably. I think this is a time for India that wants to take a bigger role on the global stage to, you know, step up to the stage and use the Your father's a very seasoned diplomat who I've gotten to know.
▶ 0:47:59um So, I think he's very capable of doing this. And then when this conflict ends, we are going to have to work together to figure out how do we bring Russia back into the fold. What does that look like? So, I think India can play a big role there. Thank you.
▶ 0:48:13Gentleman's time has expired. With that, the gentleman from India, Shri is recognized for 5 minutes.
▶ 0:48:19Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Appreciate this opportunity to to offer a statement and to ask a question of our witnesses. As some of my colleagues have noted this afternoon, America's dependence on China for our essential supply chains is an ever clearer vulnerability. Beijing increasingly dominates in pharmaceuticals as it has for some time in critical minerals and other core inputs. It's not an academic concern. It's a national security liability.
▶ 0:48:50In a crisis or conflict, we can count on China disrupting the flow of basic ingredients and materials that keep our economy and our military humming. Even with America's world-class innovation and manufacturing, our system leans too heavily on China for the chemical building blocks of our our pharmaceutical supply relies upon. And that's certainly a big deal back in my state. Take ibuprofen.
▶ 0:49:17And I didn't know this until more recently, but Chinese manufacturers, by some accounts, 95% of the ibuprofen sold on our shores. China's the dominant global producer of many of the generic active chemical ingredients, especially antibiotics. Estimates place its share of those API supply chains at around 80%.
▶ 0:49:41If Beijing ever turned off the tap, we could count on major shortages in our supply chain within weeks even, uh not surely months, depending on the drug. Critical minerals paint a similarly sobering storyline. China controls some 70% of global rare earth mining and about 90% of the refining.
▶ 0:50:06Many of us in this uh committee and certainly our witnesses are keenly aware of that. These minerals are the backbone of everything modern. Semiconductors, cars, electronics, medical devices, also big in my state, batteries, advanced defense systems. China's already shown its willingness to weaponize these exports.
▶ 0:50:25A full cut off could halt key production lines in the auto sector or leave hospitals scrambling for critical equipment or choke off components essential to our most sophisticated defense systems, such as the F-35. Dependence on China for these strategic minerals is unsustainable. Congress has a responsibility, working with our allies, to secure, strengthen, and diversify these supply chains that we find ourselves in this preventable crisis. Uh a question first for Mr. Smith, please.
▶ 0:50:57You note the growing US-India cooperation in your written testimony. I'm sorry I didn't get to hear that in person. In the pharmaceutical supply chain security, especially around these these these generics, these APIs, and that's encouraging. Are there additional tools Congress can provide to help accelerate and strengthen this effort,
▶ 0:51:17Thank you for the question. Uh a few things of higher priority should be a higher priority for us. I thought we learned our lesson with COVID supply chains. We didn't. I thought maybe the critical mineral supply chains would have woken folks up here. In terms of APIs, first we need a clear mapping of APIs and where they're coming from.
▶ 0:51:35We need to be able to separate the China-dominated inputs from those where we're realistically getting from I think targeted incentives and faster regulatory pathways to those high-priority APIs, as well as an expansion of the Strategic National Stockpile that focuses more on non-finished drug APIs and precursors would be of significant utility.
▶ 0:51:57I think we also could work with countries like India on joint workforce training and standards alignment that would make the cooperation easier, but the but the reality is we're going to have to work with other countries and India is at the top of the list if we want to get these supply chains off of China and we have to. We are not an independent and sovereign country if we are reliant on our communist adversary for our key
▶ 0:52:20Uh Mr. Mr. I appreciate that straightforward response. A question for Mr. Jaishankar, uh given Latin America's strategic importance and the wealth of critical minerals, can you detail how our partnership with India can help foster interaction with the Mineral Security Forum members including south of our border, Ecuador, Venezuela, uh Peru, and Mexico.
▶ 0:52:46Uh India's been widening its presence in Latin America. It's opened up new diplomatic missions there. There's new forms of engagement with that region, uh including in in security and trade. Um one thing that has been explored has been a US-India joint investments uh through the Mineral Security Partnership in uh critical minerals in in several areas, but uh there there's a lot more that could be done in that area.
▶ 0:53:07I thank you. Uh Mr. Chairman, my time's expired. I yield back.
▶ 0:53:10Chairman yields back. With that, the gentlewoman from Washington state, uh Ms. Jayapal, is recognized for 5
▶ 0:53:17Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um very proud of my roots in India, uh my birth country where my mother still lives um after my father's passing earlier this year. And as the first and only Indian-American woman in the United States Congress, I'm deeply invested in this strong US-India bilateral relationship.
▶ 0:53:38Our relationship has has been forged in shared democratic values, um countering the influence of China, and strategic partnerships on everything from innovative technologies to pharmaceutical manufacturing. Um, and I think a relationship that strengthens both of our countries while calling out areas of disagreement, uh, if necessary, is very important.
▶ 0:54:00We've both Both our countries face enormous challenges today, including democratic backsliding, including discrimination, decreasing freedoms of press and religion, and increasing human rights abuses. We also are facing challenges around tariffs, both here in the United States and in India. These tariffs are damaging India's economy and also hurting American businesses and consumers.
▶ 0:54:24Just last week I heard from a fifth generation family-owned company in Washington state that relies on agricultural products from India that can't be sourced at scale in the United States. They told me that these tariffs are the greatest threat to their business in over 120 years, and they're looking at either downsizing or offshoring their production to meet increased costs.
▶ 0:54:45Meanwhile, this president has threatened people-to-people ties by shutting down legal pathways to immigrate, reminiscent of a legacy of discriminatory quotas that made it extremely difficult for Indians to immigrate in the first place.
▶ 0:55:00As the only member of Congress to have been on both a student visa and an H-1B visa, um, I deeply understand the harms of those policies and I'm committed to making sure that we continue to provide strong legal pathways for people to come to this country from India as well as around the world. Um, I've also been concerned about and just met with this morning a coalition of groups that's been working on anti-Indian hate that has been rising in the United States and I've been hearing about from my own constituents.
▶ 0:55:28Just want to make the point that Indian Americans are extremely important to our economy, an integral part of our society, um, running major Fortune 500 companies as well as startups and leading cutting-edge research to save So, I want to start with tariffs and I'll, uh, come to you, Mr. Lalwani. In August, President Trump doubled tariffs on many Indian goods to 50%.
▶ 0:55:52Um, how concerned is India over the fact that its neighbors, Pakistan and Bangladesh, have secured lower tariff rates than India while India continues to actively negotiate? And how could the perception that you the US is no longer a reliable partner impact India's relationship with BRICS and the Shanghai Cooperation, uh, organization?
▶ 0:56:14Well, I think it is certainly a tremendous concern, um, within within India, certainly because of the costs of of of goods are or the export potential is sort of is limited now. Um, and in terms of the relationship with the SEO and the BRICS, I mean, I think it can push India closer to those countries. We saw some evidence of that and the president took note of it, um, I think in September.
▶ 0:56:34Yeah, we could we could certainly have the opposite effect, I think, than perhaps what is being stated as the goal of those tariffs. Um, under the Trump administration, as I mentioned, we've also seen a wholesale attack on legal immigration and immigrants, in particular on student and H-1B visas. Uh, Mr.
▶ 0:56:51Lalwani, between the attacks on legal immigration and the anti-Indian rhetoric that's coming from individuals in the administration, what do you see as the effect on the US-India relationship, um, and the people-to-people ties that build our goodwill and connection?
▶ 0:57:08I think I would worry a little bit about the deterrence of students, um, scientists, and Indian businesses, um, uh, technologists that we have accounted on for our own technological prowess, uh, going forward if we if if, uh, there's hostility towards them.
▶ 0:57:26Um, the last thing I want to talk about is is, uh, just our, uh, the increasing instances of transnational repression. And just last week I sent a letter to Secretary Rubio expressing concerns about Pakistan's use of transnational repression to stifle dissent. I do need to call it out in the case of India as well.
▶ 0:57:47In November of 2023, the US Department of Justice unsealed an indictment alleging that an Indian national working with an Indian government official plan to assassinate Sikh American activist Gurpatwant Singh Pannun Pannun in New York was reportedly part of a broader plan involving multiple killings across the United States and Canada. And in addition, Indian intelligence has been linked to digital harassment and disinfo labs.
▶ 0:58:13Um this was an article that actually named me as one of the targets of of that uh efforts. And so, can you just briefly, I have 3 seconds, discuss how this repression hurts our bilateral
▶ 0:58:29I think this is an area where I'm less informed and in less of an expert in in these these subjects,
▶ 0:58:36Do you have nothing to say on transnational repression?
▶ 0:58:38worry about that as an American citizen as well. Um but I I just think the cases that you're referring to are ones that the administration probably have better expertise on that than myself.
▶ 0:58:48Thank you. Are you there?
▶ 0:58:49The gentlewoman's time has expired. Uh with that, the gentleman from Washington, Mr. Baumgardner, is recognized for 5 minutes. I I will note that we will be having votes coming up shortly, so we're going to keep this tight.
▶ 0:59:03Well, thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh I frankly I believe this is one of the most important uh committee hearings uh of this Congress. Uh the future uh if we're going to have a successful uh next 50 years in a ever-evolving and very complex and dangerous uh international arena, the US-Indian relationship uh is going to be have to be a foundation of peace, stability, and opportunity uh for the world.
▶ 0:59:28We all know the commonalities between our two countries, democracy, when our countries are at their best, the world is at its best. I had a wonderful opportunity to visit India this summer.
▶ 0:59:45It was very grateful, learned a lot, and shortly thereafter, I was one of the first uh members of the House to visit China for the first time since 2019, and uh um learned a lot on on both trips, appreciate both trips greatly. Uh I feel like to some extent that America through the past previous decades has wanted to have a closer relationship with India than India has wanted to have with the United States.
▶ 1:00:15And I know there's a lot of flowery things said by both countries, but I would be interested to hear on your view of actually what kind of relationship India wants with the US. And uh in particular, uh I am one of those I work on a on a on a subcommittee here trying to bring efficiency to US arms sales, which both benefit our economy here and deepen our alliances, and uh you know, so one of the show me aspects of the US-India relationship
▶ 1:00:46is increasing military cooperation in the forms of how much military equipment is shared between the two uh countries. And so, uh if we could just start there, uh Mr. Jaishankar, I'll start with you. Could you give me a thumbnail sketch of what India wants out of the United States? As do we want the same thing? And and what is your prediction on how much military equipment we will see India purchasing?
▶ 1:01:10Um so, on that, I think it's quite clear India wants a close strategic partnership with the United States, and I would underscore the word partnership there. The United India is not has not sought a kind of treaty alliance of the kind that the United States has say with NATO partners or with Japan or with Australia. We've had three Prime Ministers now since 1998 who have all in their own way invested in a deeper with the United States sometimes against political opposition in in their own country.
▶ 1:01:38In 2008 the Manmohan Singh government actually put its future on the line and had a vote in Parliament actually on the on the question of a closer partnership with the United States. Prime Minister Modi has hosted three successive US Presidents two in in India. So I think there is a great keenness on having that closer partnership and it's it's materializing in in a number of ways and I can provide any number of metrics to the United
▶ 1:02:03you speak to me to the arm sales?
▶ 1:02:05Oh yeah, sure. So India currently uses 10 major US defense platforms. I think we'll see a reduction in direct purchases. We will still continue to see some there's been some authorization by the US State Department recently on some more purchases by by India. But I think India's also looking at indigenizing its own defense industry and that actually opens up room for co-production and co-development of future systems as well.
▶ 1:02:30Just in in the interest of time I just want to say that on my wonderful trip where I learned a lot in one of the waiting rooms as I was leaving the airport there was a wonderful book on the history of the Indian Army and it was very impressive history and but I got to a page of foreign partners and there was a full page picture doing training with Russians.
▶ 1:02:50And there was a small little box doing training with Americans and and the next time I go to India I'd like to see those pages reversed. Finally I'd just say that of all the things that that American India will need to deal with successfully countering transnational terrorism will continue to be an extremely important part of the relationship. You know, we saw the terrible attacks originated in Pakistan uh, earlier uh, the year. Uh, can you just speak quickly uh, Mr.
▶ 1:03:20Smith on the future of the US-India relationship regarding transnational terrorism? here's what I'll say on the the future of counterterrorism cooperation. I think President Trump's instincts in his first term or were correct. And I will quote from him directly, "The United States has foolishly given Pakistan more than 33 billion dollars in aid over the last 15 years and they have given us nothing but lies and deceit thinking of our leaders as fools.
▶ 1:03:48They have given safe haven to the terrorists we hunt in Afghanistan with little help. No more." Unfortunately, one of the things that binds the US and India together is our shared history of being under threat from Islamist terrorism and unfortunately a great deal of deal of that terrorism has emanated from Pakistan. And I think we need to do more as a as the US government but also in collaboration with India to eliminate that threat and to convince the Pakistani military to stop using terrorist groups as assets of their foreign policy.
▶ 1:04:17Thank you.
▶ 1:04:19Uh, gentlemen, time has expired with that votes have started uh, but we will uh, push through and uh, recognize the delegate from Guam, Mr. Moylan for 5
▶ 1:04:30Appreciate that, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to our panels as well. Uh, India matters to our Indo-Pacific strategy and it may become one of the most important maritime partners. Just a few weeks ago uh, Guam hosted Indian Navy sailors for the 29th integration of exercise With what began in 1992 as a bilateral exercise between the US and India years before the Quad even existed.
▶ 1:04:58Malabar has since grown into a sophisticated multi interlateral Navy exercise with Australia and Japan as regular participants. Today, Malabar stands as a clear example of what Quad cooperation can achieve. Because the Quad works best when it delivers practical outcomes and and particularly at sea. But the Quad can still improve be improved upon.
▶ 1:05:24Critical first step is to expand the Quad Indo-Pacific maritime domain awareness initiative into the Western Indian Ocean. An area where nearly 80% of global seaborn oil trade flows and where Chinese navy actively is We've seen this playbook before.
▶ 1:05:45China normalizes its presence, expands gray zone tactics, and gradually increases This is just as it's done against the Philippines in the South China Sea. India understands this reality and its priorities are clear. Safeguarding the Indian Ocean, monitoring PLA activity, and working closely with partners.
▶ 1:06:08That's exactly where the Quad can be most effective reinforcing stability, building interoperability, and deterring I'm aware that the Quad is not formally military, not a formal military alliance, but it is still critical strategic partnership of maritime nations committed to a free and open Indo-Pacific. It's time we invest in ensuring that Quad can meet our shared challenges. So, Mr.
▶ 1:06:36Smith, India's maritime strategy under Prime Minister Modi is increasingly focused on China's Chinese China's presence in the Indian Ocean. Will this strategy drive a shift in Quad maritime cooperation? Or will India continue to limit the Quad's role to exercise and dialogue?
▶ 1:07:00Um it's a very good question. Um I think there actually has been more of a shift toward a maritime focus for the Quad in some ways since we revived the Malabar Quad trilateral naval exercises. Technically, they are not a part of the Quad itself, but they are the same four countries exercising together and sharing information. And so, I think if anything, the Indian government has been leaning more firmly into both security cooperation at a quadrilateral level and also at a bilateral level.
▶ 1:07:30There was a period not long ago where India was reluctant to specifically name China as its top threat or to uh publicly admit that it was concerned about Chinese submarines operating in the Indian Ocean. I think we've actually been moving in the right direction in that regard and that our maritime cooperation is improving, although I personally would like to see the Quad assume an even more explicit security focus broadly and in the maritime arena
▶ 1:07:57Uh thank you. And Mr. Lavina, considering the way the Indian India-China border crisis escalated several years ago, how credible are Indian's abilities to deter China at sea without escalation?
▶ 1:08:13Did you say to deter it at sea?
▶ 1:08:17Um I think they are increasing and growing, but would depend a lot on United States partnership for enhanced deterrence capabilities, naval capabilities, anti-submarine warfare, things like that, which is also happening with the Quad, which I I think is a important to draw out, too.
▶ 1:08:31Okay. We got less than a minute left, but last question. Uh Mr. Jaishankar, uh how has India's maritime approach shifted after Shangri-La Dialogue? Did discussions at the Shangri-La alter India's assessment of China's maritime intentions in the Indian Ocean?
▶ 1:08:50Um I think there's been a big shift since 2017 and particularly since 2020 in India's approach to um to maritime security. And I'll give just a couple of quick examples. One is combined US-India um or coordinated US India cooperation within the combined maritime force in the Indian Ocean. So, we've seen again we're talking we're doing now in some ways coordinated operations. And then India's now providing military equipment to countries including the Philippines. These include anti-ship cruise missiles.
▶ 1:09:19So, these are just some of the ways in which India is actually doing a lot more operationally as well in the Indo-Pacific.
▶ 1:09:25Thank you very much to your panel. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
▶ 1:09:27Gentleman yields back and I want to thank our very distinguished panel for your valuable information today. I think this was this was great. I agree with Mr. Baumgardner. I think this might be one of the more important discussions that we are having out up here and it is going to influence and affect the the next 50 years geopolitically tremendously.
▶ 1:09:49So, the members of the subcommittee may have some additional questions for you all or some extensions of that and we ask you to respond to those in writing. They will come to me through the chair and then on to you. And pursuant to committee rules, all members will have five days to submit statements, questions, and extraneous materials for the record subject to the length limitations. So, again, thank you very much. We deeply appreciate your time and effort here again as we had an extended period due to floor activity.
▶ 1:10:20So, thank you for that and without objection, the committee stands