▶ 0:19:59Committee [clears throat] on Homeland Security will come to order. Without objection, the chair may declare committee in recess at any point. Purpose of today's hearing is conduct oversight of the Department of Homeland Security and assess priorities for calendar year 2026 for the Cyber Security Infrastructure Security Agency, Transportation Security Administration, and Science and Technology Directorate. Chair reminds all members that the chair will enforce the rules of decorum at all times and urges all members to be mindful of their remarks. I now recognize myself for an opening statement.
▶ 0:20:30Good morning and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. We are conducting oversight of the Department of Homeland Security focusing on TSA, SISA, and the Science and Technology Directorate otherwise known as S&T. Nearly 25 years ago, 19 hijackers exploited significant vulnerabilities in our commercial aviation system. The al Qaeda terrorist attack on September 11, 2001 killed nearly 3,000 Americans and changed our nation forever.
▶ 0:20:54Our transportation system, among other critical systems, demanded accountability and hardened security to ensure a horrific event would never happen again. In response, Congress enacted the Aviation and Transportation Security Act to establish TSA and grant DHS flexible operational authority, allowing it to prepare for and respond to an ever evolving threat landscape. Over the past two decades, threats facing our nation's aviation, transportation, and critical infrastructure have only risen.
▶ 0:21:22Today's risks are far more diverse, complex, and technologically advanced. And the motivations and methods of our adversaries have shifted rapidly with emerging technologies. Threats p posed by lonewolf actors, radicalized individuals, and homegrown extremists have only increased. Transnational criminal organizations pose a significant threat by exploiting the transportation system to traffic humans, drugs, weapons, and illicit goods. Traditional terror tactics have given way to more sophisticated methods of attack.
▶ 0:21:53Cyber security is now at the forefront of these conversations with adversaries attempting to take down our transportational systems through digital means. Similarly, the potential for coordinated attacks using drones to disrupt flights or deliver explosives represents a new and growing frontier of security threats. Sophisticated foreign adversaries, including the People's Republic of China, Russia, Iran, and North Korea, are actively targeting our digital system. systems that underpin essential services, economic activity, and national security.
▶ 0:22:24These state-directed campaigns are designed to position hostile actors for strategic disruption and coercion. Rapid advances in emerging technologies, including AI, are further accelerating the scale, speed, and sophistication of these cyber operations. In cyerspace, the United States is operating in a highly contestant environment. Congress created SISA to serve as the nation's lead civilian cyber defense agency to meet this reality.
▶ 0:22:48CIS's responsibilities included securing federal civilian networks, supporting supporting owners and operators of critical infrastructure, and coordinating with the private sector to reduce cyber systemic cyber risk. That mission has grown more consequential as adversaries become more capable, patient, and willing to operate inside US networks for extended periods of time. SISA's authorities extend across a v variety of sectors including energy, water, communications, health care, transportation and financial services.
▶ 0:23:19This committee has been clear about SISA SISA's expectations. It is not a policy think tank nor messaging agency. Its mandate is operational. When that mandate is carried out with discipline and focus, the agency earns bipartisan support in Congress and confidence from the industry. When it does not, that confidence erodess. Over the past year, SISA has faced real operational challenges.
▶ 0:23:41Those challenges include rap rapidly evolving threat landscape, the scope of the agency's responsibility in an increasingly digital world, and organizational adjustments. As with any agency responsible for our national security, it is critical these changes do not degrade readiness, responsiveness, or mission delivery. This committee supports the administration's goal of aligning department resources towards urgent homeland security priorities.
▶ 0:24:06At the same time, workforce comm community continuity, clear leadership, and mission readiness are essential to effective cyber defenses. Professionals at CISA are some of the most experienced cyber security experts in the federal government, and preserving that expertise must remain a priority. We encouraged by the president's decision to renominate Mr. Shan Planky as director of SISA. Mr. Planki is a respected national security professional with decades of experience.
▶ 0:24:30His confirmation provide long needed stability and strategic direction at SISA, which has operated without it for far too long. This committee's oversight of CISA is grounded in respect for its mission and confidence in its workforce. Lastly, several major highprofile events are set to unfold across the US, including the 2026 FIFA World Cup, America 250, and the 2028 LA Olympics.
▶ 0:24:55These events will only increase the volume and complexity of threats facing the homeland and DHS must be prepared to respond. Trump administration to its credit has taken strong steps to prior to our strengthen our nation's security systems. However, modernization of TSA, SISA and S&T will require sustained congressional support.
▶ 0:25:14As chairman of Homeland Security Committee, is my priority to ensure we support and invest in the next generation of technologies and adopt highly innovative and effective security approaches given the challenges facing the department and our country. This hearing provides an important opportunity to assess how TSA, SISA, and S&T are carrying out their missions. We look forward to hearing from our witnesses and engaging in constructive dialogue about how Congress can effectively support security, operational excellence, and accountability across the department.
▶ 0:25:42I also want to take this opportunity to thank our DHA DHS personnel who keep us safe every day, including our dedicated cyber security professionals, our innovative researchers and scientists, and our brave TSA security officers who work on the front lines to protect the traveling public and who continue to do so even without during without pay during the nation's longest shutdown last year. I'm confident that by working together, we can break through the challenges of today and prepare for threats of tomorrow. The stakes for the American people could not be higher.
▶ 0:26:12Thank you. I now recognize the ranking member, gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Thompson, for five minutes for his opening statement. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank you for holding today's hearing on oversight of the Department of Homeland Security. Congressional Republicans oversight of the Trump administration has been dismal this Congress.
▶ 0:26:35Republicans have had administration witnesses before this committee the fewest times in any recent administration's first year. Most of that was on the watch of the pri chairman who was to my favorite phase of his derelch in his duty to bring Trump administration officials before the committee. This hearing is a step in the right direction.
▶ 0:27:00The Trump administration has created serious issues at TSA, CISA, and DHS S&T that need to be addressed. Committed Democrats are committed to taking a hard look at those issues.
▶ 0:27:15From President Trump's slashing the CISA workforce to Secretary Christy Gnome's unlawful rescending union rights for frontline transportation security officers to the administration cutting programs that leverage universitybased research to address critical homeland security challenges.
▶ 0:27:36But none of those things can be the sole focus of our oversight right now because President Trump and Secretary Gnome have weaponized DHS against the American people and are wreaking havoc in Minneapolis and other communities across this country. It's an absolute disgrace that ICE isn't here today in wake of the shooting death of Renee Good at the hands of an ICE agent.
▶ 0:28:07Mr. Chairman, as you know, I asked for ICE acting director Lions to appear at today's hearing. I ask unanimous consent to insert in the record my letter to you dated January 14th, 2026 requesting acting directors lions appear before the committee without delay.
▶ 0:28:29I want to thank you for issuing that invitation, but committee Democrats and I are outraged that ICE refused to appear today. Miss Good was a wife, mother of three young children, a devout Christian, and a US citizen. We all seen the shooting video with our own eyes. Miss Good certainly did not deserve to be killed by her own government. She should be alive today.
▶ 0:28:59Mr. Chairman, at this time, I ask for a moment of silence in memory of Renee Good. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. In the wake of Miss Good's killing, ICE has an obligation to appear and answer members questions.
▶ 0:29:23Her tragic killing needs to be thoroughly investigated and everyone involved from the ICE officer who pulled the trigger to the president and secretary who sent them to Minneapolis must be held accountable.
▶ 0:29:38DHS also needs to be held accountable for its outofcontrol immigration operation, creating chaos in communities like Los Angeles, Chicago, New Orleans, and Minneapolis, terrorizing people from all walks of life and hurting US citizens and immigrants alike. Mr.
▶ 0:30:01Chairman, in order to ensure that [snorts] ICE appears before the committee, pursuant to clause 2J1 of House Rule 11, I'm providing you with a letter signed by every Democratic member of the committee requesting testimony from acting director Lions. I ask unanimous consent that this minority day letter be submitted for the record.
▶ 0:30:30Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I understand that you intend to hold a series of oversight hearings with DHS officials. I look forward to ICE being before the committee at our next hearings, Democrats insist on that. Never has oversight and accountability been more necessary than it is now.
▶ 0:30:51President Trump and Secretary Nome are doing real damage to this country and to the department that was stood up in the wake of 911 to protect Americans from future attacks. Unfortunately, President Trump and Secretary Gnome have established a corrupt above the law culture at DHS and Gnome has enriched herself and her allies at taxpayers expense.
▶ 0:31:19She has awarded multiple no bid contracts to close close associates and siphoned $240 million of taxpayers money to companies connected to her top advisor and close confidant Corey Lorendowski as well [snorts] as to her spoken spokesperson She fasttracked a contract worth almost $1 billion
▶ 0:31:49to a company led by a Trump donor and she's living rentree in the US Coast Guard housing designate designated for military members. She has also abused her power as secretary. She's acknowledged cherrypickering cherrypickering which court orders departments will comply with contrary to the rule of law.
▶ 0:32:14She's used access to disaster funds to punish political foes, illegally withholding congressionally authorized disaster funds. She has obstructed congressional oversight, barring members from visiting ICE detention facilities, and refusing to respond to oversight letters and requests.
▶ 0:32:36In short, she has enriched herself, abused the power of her office, obstructed congressional oversight, and violated her oath of office to the Constitution. Never has oversight of the Department of Homeland Security been more important and never has holding an administration accountable been more necessary. Be assured that accountability is coming. Accountability is coming, Mr. Chairman, and I yield
▶ 0:33:09Gentleman yields back. Other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be uh submitted for the record. Uh I am pleased to have highly distinguished panel of witnesses before us today and as the ranking member knows we have talked about uh doing other oversight hearings and that is uh the intent of this committee uh to to do what Congress is meant to do and and conduct oversight and u I'm pleased today that uh we have uh our first panel of um DHS officials here.
▶ 0:33:35DHS is a big department and uh there there should be several of these and we will have several of these. Uh, pursuant to committee rule 8C, I ask that the witnesses please rise and raise their right hand. You solemnly swear that the testimony will give before the committee on homeland security of the United States House of Representatives will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So, help you God. All right. Let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative. Thank you all.
▶ 0:34:04Please be I would now like to formally introduce our witnesses. Mr. Pedro Aende is under secretary for science and technology, leading the department's research and development efforts and serving as science adviser to the secretary. Previously, he served as Florida's secretary of management services and has held roles at DHS and the Department of Energy and Labor. Mr.
▶ 0:34:29Madu Gatum Mala serves as the acting director and d deputy director for the cyber security infrastructure security agency a role in which he helps to lead CIS's mission to understand manage and reduce risk to cyber and physical infrastructure. Prior to his appointment he served as a commissioner and chief information officer for South Dakota's Bureau of Information and Technology. Mr. Ha.
▶ 0:34:52Miss Ha Newan McNeel is deputy of the transportation uh security agency, a role in which she is performing the duties of administrator to advance TSA's mission to secure the nation's transportation system and improve operational effectiveness. Previously, she served as acting president, commercial, and vice president of digital identity growth at Big Bear AI. Miss McNeel also served as TSA chief of staff from 2017 to 2019. Thank all the witnesses for being here today.
▶ 0:35:22I now recognize Mr. Aende for five minutes to summarize his opening
▶ 0:35:29Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Chairman Garberino, ranking member Thompson, and distinguished members of the committee. Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. I am honored to serve as under secretary for science and technology at the department of homeland security and I appreciate the committee's continued oversight and engagement with our uh with our work. Um the science and technology directorate plays a unique role within DHS.
▶ 0:35:56We are the department's research development, test, and evaluation organization, responsible for anticipating emerging threats, identifying technology opportunities, and ensuring that DHS components have access to solutions that are timely, effective, and responsible.
▶ 0:36:14Our work is grounded in the simplest measure of success, whether technology transitions into the real world use um are effectuated and whether they measurably improve mission outcomes. In my short tenure as under secretary, I've focused on listening to the operators across the department to understand where technology is helping today, where it can help um fill certain gaps. Those conversations reinforce a consistent message.
▶ 0:36:43Technology must be operationally relevant. It must be rigorously tested and delivered with discipline. Research alone is not Capability must reach the operators in the field. To meet that standard, S&T works closely with the components uh from the early stages of development.
▶ 0:37:03Um and we assess emerging threats, evaluate existing commercial solutions and apply systems engineering and test and evaluation to reduce risk before acquisition decisions are made. When a private selection uh sorry when a private sector solution can meet uh mission needs u that is our preference.
▶ 0:37:22We prioritize adopting those solutions and adapting them um in order to accelerate delivery uh to the field and frank frankly to um to steward taxpayer dollars um effectively and At the same time, the threat environment facing our homeland is is increasingly dynamic and technologydriven from unmanned aircraft systems to cyber enabled threats to risks to critical S&T's
▶ 0:37:53role is to look ahead while supporting today's operations. And that means engaging with industry, with academia, national laboratories, and and inter agency partners to ensure that DHS remains uh prepared for the future without f losing focus of today's challenges. Ultimately, my goal as under secretary is to ensure that S&T remains a trusted partner to DHS components.
▶ 0:38:19uh one that delivers uh capabilities at work in the field, supports informed decision-making, and strengthens the security of the American homeland. I look forward to discussing our work with the committee this morning and to answering your questions. Thank you.
▶ 0:38:36Gentleman yields back. I now recognize Mr. Ganaka for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Chairman Garberino, Ranking Member Thompson, and members of the committee. Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. My name is Madu Gautumla, and I serve as the acting director of the cyber security and infrastructure security agency or CISA. Before joining the federal government, I oversaw statewide technology and cyber security operations for the state of South Dakota.
▶ 0:39:04Earlier in my career, I worked across the wireless, telecom, and health technology sectors. Those experiences shaped how I approach the role with a practical understanding of how state and local governments and critical infrastructure operators experience risk on the ground. I'm honored that the president and secretary no gnome asked me to lead this agency. Since arriving last May, I have been proud to see the professionalism, talent, and deep mission commitment of the CISA workforce each and every day.
▶ 0:39:30I'm also grateful for this committee's continued bipartisan support and for the authorities Congress has provided to enable CISA's mission. Over the past year and under President Trump's leadership and Secretary Nom's guidance, CISA has remained squarely focused on the mission Congress intended when the agency was established. That is supporting, strengthening, and securing the nation's critical infrastructure from cyber and physical threats. That mission is operational and outcomedriven.
▶ 0:39:56Every day, Cesus people work to protect the financial systems, safeguard pipelines, and ensure the digital and physical infrastructure Americans rely on can withstand disruption. In 2025, CISA made meaningful progress in an increasingly aggressive threat environment. We strengthened our ability to detect and respond to cyber threats, deepened collaboration across government and industry, and shared threat information and mitigation guidance faster and in more integrated ways.
▶ 0:40:24As a result, CISA supported more than 4,000 victims of cyber incidents, published over 1,600 cyber security products, shared more than 2500 threat and incident reports, and triaged over 30,000 incidents through our 247 operations center. These efforts reduced real world impact and helped ensure Americans could continue to rely on the essential services.
▶ 0:40:47As the operational lead for federal civilian cyber security, CISA worked very closely with departments and agencies to promote risk based policies and best practices to respond to the evolving threats. In 2025, we issued three emergency directives to address critical vulnerabilities and cyber threats. We also scaled the endpoint detection and response technology to over 60 agencies and more than 500,000 endpoints, giving analysts near realtime visibility to detect and stop those advanced threats.
▶ 0:41:17In early 2025 alone, Cesaw blocked more than 1.7 billion malicious connections on federal networks, including 142 million targeting the critical infrastructure. CIES also continued delivering security directly to the state, local, tribal, and territorial governments. A mission that is very personal to me given my time serving in the state level. With a nationwide presence across the 10 regions, we provided tailored training, technical assistance, and planning support, recognizing that many of our partners operate with limited budgets and staffing.
▶ 0:41:48To help address this, in August 2025, the Department of Homeland Security released funding opportunities under the state and local cyber security grant program and the tribal cyber security grant program, making available over hund00 million to help reduce the cyber security risk nationwide. Physical security remains a no fail mission for the agency.
▶ 0:42:07In fiscal year 2025, Cesar delivered more than 1,000 counter IED and risk mitigation training courses to over 26,000 participants, strengthening the preparedness, awareness, and also the response capabilities. We are also actively preparing for the major national and international events, including the FIFA World Cup, America 250, and the 2028 Olympic Games.
▶ 0:42:28In April, CISA convened more than 730 participants from over 40 agencies at the Lincoln Financial Field for a full-scale exercise of the World Cup. That exercise produced concrete improvements in coordination, communication, and public safety. As we enter 2026, CISA is executing a mission first approach. We are launching targeted initiatives to close the most pressing risk gaps facing the critical infrastructure, particularly where cyber threats intersect with real world consequences.
▶ 0:42:58We are prioritizing what works, eliminating duplication, and ensuring that every product and service directly advances CISA's regulatory mission and aligns with the administration's goals of efficiency, accountability, and impact. This includes incorporating the industry and congressional feedback into the final rule for the cyber incident reporting for critical infrastructure act. It also includes includes modernizing how we engage with critical infrastructure partners by replacing CPAC with a more streamlined and effective engagement framework.
▶ 0:43:27Finally, we recognize that a disciplined mission requires the right workforce, not a larger one, but a more capable and a skilled one. In 2026, CISA will continue targeted hiring in mission critical roles while remaining aligned with the broader efforts to control cost and maximize return. Under President Trump's leadership and Secretary Gnome's guidance, CISA remains committed to being a focused, efficient, and accountable agency, one that executes the mission Congress assigned and delivers real security outcomes for the American people.
▶ 0:43:53Thank you again for your support, and I look forward to your Thank you, [clears throat] Mr. Gala. I now recognize MC Miss McNeel for five minutes to summarize her opening
▶ 0:44:03Good morning, Chairman Garbrino, Ranking Member Thompson, and distinguished members of the committee. Thank you for the invitation to testify before you today on behalf of the Transportation Security Administration. I'm honored to be here and grateful for the long-standing and productive partnerships TSA shares with this committee and Congress. I would like to start by thanking TSA employees for their unblenting efforts day in and day out to secure the nation's transportation systems.
▶ 0:44:29TSA is an agile security agency embodied by a dedicated and professional workforce that work around the clock to outmatch an increasingly sophisticated and dynamic TSA's greatest assets is its people, and I want to sincerely thank them. From our transportation security officers and K-9 handlers to our federal air marshals, these men and women embody the AY's core values.
▶ 0:44:54They work through the longest government shutdown in American history, many without pay and experiencing personal financial hardships. Their commitment to the TSA mission and to the traveling public is unparalleled. Under the leadership of President Trump and Department of Homeland Security Secretary Christy Nome, TSA is laser focused on delivering for the American people.
▶ 0:45:16The upcoming World Cup, America 250, and 2028 Olympics present an enormous opportunity to boldly transform transportation security in the United States and usher in President Trump's vision for a new golden age of travel. Achieving these priorities starts with deploying upgraded state-of-the-art technology to our over 430 commercial airports nationwide.
▶ 0:45:40FOC focusing on our core mission of transportation security and harnessing our collective investment power and innovation through robust public private partnerships. Last year, passenger volumes at airports reached record highs, recording eight out of the top 10 busiest days in TSA's history. In 2025, TSA screened 97 million passengers, 480 million check bags, and 2.1 billion carry-on bags.
▶ 0:46:10With the transportation sector remaining a top target for bad actors and continued year-over-year passenger volume growth, it is more critical than ever to have a techno technologically advanced, seamless, and secure aviation system. I would like to thank the committee for its strong support of the AY's critical aviation security programs, including two I would like to highlight.
▶ 0:46:32First, the screening partnership program through which TSA is working closely with airports and industry to incentivize investment in more tailored innovative solutions to strengthen security. And second, the one-stop security pilot program, which significantly improves international aviation security and streamlines the transfer pro process for passengers inbound to the US with a connecting In addition to strong partnerships, we must invest in modernizing our security technology.
▶ 0:47:01One avenue to achieving this is for Congress to expand the amount and scope of the aviation security capital fund. Starting in 2004, Congress authorized the first 250 million in revenue collected each year from the passenger security fee to go to TSA's capital fund to be used for check baggage technology.
▶ 0:47:19That amount has not been adjusted or raised in 21 years with the next 1.6 billion in the fee revenue going to annual national deficit If Congress were to return the funds collected to be used for its intended purpose, passenger security, and expand it to include checkpoint technology, TSA could significantly shorten its technology deployment time frames, improving both security and the passenger experience.
▶ 0:47:46TSA is committed to making the airport experience smooth and stress-free for the traveling public, including military personnel and American families traveling with children. Last year, we established the Serve with Honor Travel with ease program, which provides screening lanes for active duty military personnel and their families, as well as the Families on the Fly program, which dedicated lanes for families.
▶ 0:48:10With the strong leadership of President Trump and Secretary Gnome, coupled with continued support from Congress and industry partners, we can transform aviation security and return America to being the world's number one travel destination. Chairman Garbrino, Ranking Member Thompson, and distinguished members of the committee. It is a privilege to testify before you today. I thank you for your support of TSA and look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:48:38Thank you, Miss McNeel. Um, the committee will now I will now recognize myself for five minutes for questions, but I I want to because it's an oversight hearing and we do have I want to make sure everybody can ask their questions, uh, I will enterain um unanimous consent at the end like we did last time.
▶ 0:48:54So, um we will accept them all just we want to do it at the end so uh there's enough time for everyone to ask questions because we do have a two o'clock very important uh two o'clock u hearing I that chairman guest is is running so I want to make sure that that starts on time as well so uh I will I will start um Dr.
▶ 0:49:14Ghana Makala there it's been a year now uh in the Trump administration um and there's been some major shakeups at CISA specifically with some rips um and there's been a lot of changes and the a but the agency still remains responsible for defending the federal civilian networks supporting state and local partners and coordinating with critical infrastructure sectors uh under sustained targeting by foreign adversaries um I have said publicly.
▶ 0:49:44I know a lot of other members on this committee have said publicly that any organizational restructuring must reinforce CIS's ability to execute its core mission and should be done so in coordination with Congress. There have been reports um that there are planned reorganization efforts for uh for SISA.
▶ 0:50:03Can you please describe what if any organizational changes uh you as acting director are planning to make uh in the months ahead in the months ahead uh and if there are any that you have already done?
▶ 0:50:18Uh chairman Gabrio thank you uh for the question. Um I I want to start by saying that um CISA is trying to get back on its mission which is protecting the critical infrastructure security from physical and cyber threats.
▶ 0:50:33Um CISA is a young agency and um we have um grown and as we continue to make sure and we are as we are rescoping as you have suggested sir uh we do have um a lot of uh changes in the last uh year but uh we do not have or planned any organizational changes and um but we are continuing to look at how we rescope our existing uh work that we have and um so that we can get back on our mission of protecting the critical infrastructure and if there is any organizational changes I issue that we
▶ 0:51:03will communicate with you.
▶ 0:51:04So, as of now, you don't have any planned reorganizational changes uh that will be coming to SISA.
▶ 0:51:11That's correct, sir.
▶ 0:51:12Okay. And I I just want to reiterate you just said you will anything you will be sure to notify Congress of any intents to reorg organize SISA.
▶ 0:51:19Absolutely, sir. We want to make sure that our resources are aligned with the statutory authorities that you have given us and we will make sure that we'll work with you.
▶ 0:51:25Wonderful. Uh do you have the is there do you have the proper staffing um right now to to uh fulfill CIS's crit uh
▶ 0:51:36Chairman Gardner, thank you for the question. We have um the staff that we need for u the mission that we want to uh protect. So um yes we have and like uh any other um situation we do have our regular attrition. We use our hiring authorities to make sure that we u go back and get back to our mission and we are protecting the nation every single
▶ 0:51:58and you are in the process of hiring for specific specific um positions right now. uh we have um we always use our hiring authorities that we have sir and uh we are um making sure that we have the right skills and the right talent that we need across our mission areas.
▶ 0:52:15Okay. Thank you very much. I want to follow up also um the cyber incident reporting critical in infrastructure act was signed into law nearly four years ago. I was one of the co-leads on it. Um and the final regulations were supposed to be in October of 2025. Dead the deadline has now slipped to May 2026. I I'm happy with that actually because a lot of us did not like uh what was coming out of the rule making.
▶ 0:52:39Um there was supposed to be I remember the secretary last year said that there was going to be possible exparte process um to update the rule. I just want to know where where is SISA right now in the rulem. Um has it is has there been an exparte process? Uh are they getting closer to the congressional intent that uh that we had when we passed the bill Uh chairman Garbino thank you for the question.
▶ 0:53:05Um the the Cersei that you are referring to the cyber incident reporting for uh the crit critical infrastructure act of 2022. Um what it does sir is it requires the covered critical infrastructure entities to report any significant cyber incidents um ransomware payments to CISA so the government can identify threats faster and assist victims more effectively and uh be able to warn others before the attacks are uh spread. I I I'm I'm just I'm going to interrupt you because I'm running out of time, but I want to make sure.
▶ 0:53:35Is is it on are you on uh is it on schedule to come out and have you been working with the private sector to address the concerns that came out uh in the original um in the original rulem process?
▶ 0:53:49Chairman Gabino, uh absolutely we are uh working very hard to make sure that we are um getting towards the closure line. Um we did not miss the deadline due to inaction. It was a um deliberate decision driven by substance.
▶ 0:54:02Some of the key drivers are we have about um 280 plus detailed public comments and uh we have the stakeholder engagement that is ongoing and extensive and uh we want to make sure that uh the protection for companies is there and we are not we are making sure that there is uh not a burden on the the people that are making those uh requirements.
▶ 0:54:21I appreciate I've run out of time. I now recognize the ranking member uh for five minutes of questions.
▶ 0:54:26Thank you very much uh Mr. Chairman, um kind of taking off on on where you started off with respect to [snorts] uh SISA staffing. Uh Congressman McCall and uh supported SISA uh becoming uh a part of DHS for all the right reasons.
▶ 0:54:51Uh and you said there are no organizational changes that you're able to accomplish the How many vacancies do you have right now in SIS? Sir uh our um headcount as of um ranking members I'm thank you again question for we we have about uh 2,400 plus um employees at CISA and uh we have the required workforce that does
▶ 0:55:22the mission support um every day
▶ 0:55:24I need the numbers how many are you short
▶ 0:55:31we have um the normal attrition like u any other federal agency sir um which is 7.5% approximately this past year um and that is uh significantly less than the previous prior years and uh as compared to the other u uh federal agencies as well um but in general we have um the um the required authorities to make sure that we go back to our hiring authorities and be able to hide the required talent. I I I appreciate it, but your staff has been cut by one/3.
▶ 0:56:02Is that not true,
▶ 0:56:06Ranking Member Thompson? Um we what we had is a uh workforce transition program and people who left the organization, they they participated voluntarily and um we have the required staff that is supporting the mission that we do. I'm sure you're going to say that, but I'm just trying to get to a number that you started with and what the president cut.
▶ 0:56:31I mean, it's it should be easy for you to just come up and say, "I lost a third of my people, but I'm able to accomplish the mission."
▶ 0:56:40Understood, sir. Ranking member Thompson, the the way um let me um uh clarify this. As of January 20th, 2025, our CISA workforce was uh 3,389 plus. Um at the end of December we were at 2389 and um we we have uh the workforce transition like I said and um we have the normal attrition but um like I said the the way we are supporting back on mission is to make sure that we are protecting our critical infrastructure from
▶ 0:57:11physical and cyber threats and our um divisions are um properly equipped and we are making sure that we are aligning our existing resources.
▶ 0:57:18Thank you very much. But you provided a a November memo uh that said contrary to what you're telling the committee. So I we will send a letter to you asking for the specific numbers uh that you're short and and and just tell us that that's the only thing.
▶ 0:57:42But this leads me to another issue since you wouldn't give me the number that I Are you aware that you reportedly failed a counterintelligence polygraph test?
▶ 0:57:58Ranking member Thompson, I um I do not accept the premise of that uh characterization. Um and I'm not going to discuss the testing outcomes or clearance matters in an open session. Those those issues are handled through the DHS adjudication processes which are currently underway.
▶ 0:58:16Did you fail the test? Yes or no?
▶ 0:58:19Sir, like I said, I do not accept the premise of that characterization and I understand why people ask that question and I'm mindful that situations like this affect people which is why I'm respecting the process and keeping the mission steady, sir.
▶ 0:58:31Yeah. But you know, you're in a very sensitive area. Uh and and CISA is important to us and I think we need to have people who are in that space that pass the standard test. Uh uh so I mean we'll pursue that a little later, but I was just looking for a yes or no answer. Uh if you took the test uh and passed it, fine.
▶ 0:58:56If you didn't, uh that's a problem, but I can't get an answer one way or the other out of you and we'll go forward uh with that. Uh are you aware uh of the chief information officers at CISA uh that you are at present trying to get rid of or have gotten rid of?
▶ 0:59:23Uh ranking member Thompson, thank you for the question. Uh individual personal matters are um not um made the decisions are not made in vacuum. it is a leadership level at the highest levels and um we we we work according to um how we see the roles fit but I'm not here to comment on
▶ 0:59:43honestly last question Mr. Tim, are you aware of a skiff being planned and paid for by DHS to be built in South Dakota? Ranking [clears throat] member Thompson, uh, thank you for the question. I don't know full specifics of um, who is building what is building, but I think it is not um, federally funded by us.
▶ 1:00:07uh which means um we will probably be supporting in terms of um like any other skiff that we have irrespect of what the location is.
▶ 1:00:15So you don't know anything about it?
▶ 1:00:18Yes sir. Of course I know um that there is uh propositions for uh a skiff like any other location.
▶ 1:00:27Mr. Chair, I'll follow up with some more questions for this for the witness. I yield back.
▶ 1:00:31Chair recognizes himself for five minutes. I um let me just say first u when I was chairman of this committee 2015 we passed the cyber information sharing act uh the ranking member and I did together. It's been a very bipartisan issue. Uh 2018 we passed the cyber security and information security agency permanent authorization.
▶ 1:00:57And the reason why I'm going through this legislative history, it's very important to know what is still authorized today and what is not. Um, one of the most critical pieces of CISA as we imagined in Congress was to share information with the private sector, not only to the private sector, but from the private sector, which holds about 80% of the cyber threat information. Would you agree with that, uh, sir? Yes sir.
▶ 1:01:27Yeah. So that was vitally important as the authors of this agency and we had quite a battle with [clears throat] I'll have to say with House Intelligence over whether this should be warehoused under the National Security Agency which is not a civilian agency to interact with the private sector. We thought a civilian agency would be the better fit. I like to think that we were right about that.
▶ 1:01:53But then the goal was to to um to expand the capabilities so that you could meet those requirements. Uh do you feel that you have those capabilities sir? um the uh the CISA 2015 the uh the cyber security information sharing act of 2015 that you're referring to it provides the legal foundation for um cyber threat information sharing between the federal government and the private sector and it remains one of u the most important authorities for defending the US um critical
▶ 1:02:23infrastructure against uh increasingly sophisticated cyber
▶ 1:02:29Okay. [clears throat] So now let me go back to the authorizations because this is really important for the committee members to to know that now uh CIS of the agency was permanently authorized. So there's no expiration. However, there is one on the cyber information sharing act which was brought about by a compromise with various members who would not vote for it unless we put that expiration term in there.
▶ 1:02:57So, as of now, it is [clears throat] um no longer authorized. It was temporarily uh reauthorized in the CR, which will expire January 30th. So, if I could correct myself, it will expire on January 30th of this year. Um Mr. Garberino and M and Mr.
▶ 1:03:21Thompson introduced um a reauthorization that passed in the Homeland Approach Bill but did not go to the Senate. Uh it is not in the Homeland Approach that we're voting on this week.
▶ 1:03:35Um my question to you is while you still have appropriations uh to the majority I think of your agency I think if not all to not be authorized to have a lapse in at this point in time where the cyber threat is far greater today than when Mr. Thompson and I first created the agency and the information sharing act.
▶ 1:04:04In addition, coupled with the World Cup FIFA events coming up, uh the Olympics and the um anniversary or 250th anniversary of the Republic, um how does that harm your efforts to protect the
▶ 1:04:21Congressman, thank you again. Um I like I said um I personally support and DHS also supports the long-term reauthorization of uh the CISA 2015 and um I understand that um the uh the act expires um Jan 30th and one of the strengths of CISA is the partnership and collaboration with the private sector and the private sector understands that uh this will be extended um through the continuing resolution and like we we have worked with um chairman Garbrino
▶ 1:04:51and the committee and the the widespread
▶ 1:04:55You know, if I could my time is going to expire, but this is not your fault. This is Congress's fault, you know, and I it's incumbent. It's I think the House has done its job, but the Senate has not done their job on this. And so, it's vitally important, and this is a message to the Senate, that when we do pass this again, that the Senate reauthorize your mission.
▶ 1:05:19Otherwise, your ability to collect 80% of the threat information from the private sector is gone. You're no longer authorized to do that by law. And so that is why that is so important, sir. And I this has always, as Mr. Thompson knows, has always been a bipartisan issue. I really hope I I don't have any doubt on my colleagues on the other side of the aisle or in the House we're going to get this done.
▶ 1:05:45of the Senate for the sake of the the nation and our security needs to act on this is highly irresponsible and quite frankly it's just downright dangerous what they're doing and they're playing they're playing games with something that's very serious and with that uh I now recognize um who is next to you
▶ 1:06:08Mr. Korea
▶ 1:06:10thank you Mr. Chairman, I want to thank the witnesses for being here today. Um, Dr. Meu, if I may, just I wanted to follow up at some of the questions and thoughts, directions of uh the chairman and the ranking member. Um, you said, correct me if I'm wrong, a third of your people have left
▶ 1:06:37About 806 people, sir. Yes. Third, um, it was just stated from both sides of the aisle that the threat, cyber threat is incre is ever increasing. It's even worse now. When I go home, I get stories from a local vendors that they've been hacked. I get stories that they've they're essentially being held ransom because somebody from outside the country has got to them.
▶ 1:07:03From that level up to Colonial Pipeline, cyber threats Your agency lost a third of their staff. We're about to vote on a bill that cuts your funding by about $270 million. Is that correct, sir? Yes. No. Maybe. You're under oath, by the way.
▶ 1:07:30Congressman, thank you. I appreciate um the um the the
▶ 1:07:33Yes or no?
▶ 1:07:34I I have to look, sir. We have
▶ 1:07:36We haven't looked at it yet.
▶ 1:07:37We We have a president's budget of 2.5
▶ 1:07:40Are we about to cut your budget by $270 Vote to do that. Are we? Yes or no? Yes or no?
▶ 1:07:48I don't have the
▶ 1:07:49We are. We are. Just watch the votes in the next couple days. And yet you've said that you can still do your mission, your assignment to defend this country satisfactory. Is that what you're Yes or no,
▶ 1:08:04Congressman? Um,
▶ 1:08:05yes or no? Can you do we need more
▶ 1:08:08Congressman? We We are
▶ 1:08:10Yes or no? Do you need more resources, sir? You're under oath.
▶ 1:08:14can you assure the public of this country that based on all these cuts, you've lost a third of your personnel, we're about to cut your budget, that you can still do your job?
▶ 1:08:25Yes or no?
▶ 1:08:26Congressman, thank you for the question. like um
▶ 1:08:28yes or no.
▶ 1:08:30Sir, editing.
▶ 1:08:30Thank you very much. I've got a 2 and a half minutes left. If you could answer that to me in writing later on, I'd appreciate it. Uh Miss McNeel, thank you for being here today. Um, quick history. Homeland Security, Department of Homeland Security was created as a result of 911. That cowardly attack on our country that cost us thousands of lives.
▶ 1:09:02We don't want to see that repeated again. If I remember correctly, hijackers, terrorists broke into the cabin of a number of airliners, airline flights on that day, took command, control of airplanes, and use them as weapons against the United States. Is that correct? More or less.
▶ 1:09:23That's correct.
▶ 1:09:26Do you have the resources today to defend against something like that?
▶ 1:09:31We do, sir. Since uh the establishment of TSA, we've taken uh a concerted layered approach to aviation security.
▶ 1:09:39Recently, if I may. Yes, sir.
▶ 1:09:41Um reassignment of some of your personnel to ICE and CBP over the last year or so. Is that correct? You've lost about 250 air marshals. Air marshals who are randomly on airplanes on commercial flights to prevent another 91 from happening. Those folks are now assisting in ICE removals. Does that not concern you?
▶ 1:10:08You think you're still okay doing your job of defending this great country against another hijacking attack?
▶ 1:10:14Uh yes, we do. Uh Congressman, and the federal air marshals today are more agile than uh at any time before.
▶ 1:10:21Well, they're agile, but do you have the personnel to actually carry out your
▶ 1:10:26Yes, and they are deployed based on risk um on our flights. They also offer groundbased security and and yes, they do support uh our colleagues across DHS to advance uh the national security and transportation security mission that includes our colleagues at ICE as you mentioned also the secret.
▶ 1:10:42If I may, I have less than half a minute left. If you can answer this question for me in writing, you're focused more on investment in technology. Uh I like the focus on trained personnel. Sounds like we're cutting back in personnel and trying to focus more on technology. I think it's a combination of both. But if you can explain to me how we can assure this our citizens that they are safer today than they were back in 911.
▶ 1:11:12Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. My time is up and I yield.
▶ 1:11:16Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Guest, for five minutes questions.
▶ 1:11:22Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Miss McNeil, thank you for being here. Uh, thank you for the dedicated uh, men and women who serve uh, under your command. Uh, particularly want to thank you in light that uh, those men and women work for a period of six weeks uh, without being paid uh, as my colleagues on the other side of the aisle chose to shut down the federal government. But they continue to come to work. They continue to protect the traveling people.
▶ 1:11:50So thank you for their professionalism, for their dedication, uh for their hard work, particularly in a time where you talk about uh in the statistics that you gave uh that last year passenger volume reached record high. Uh you say in your opening statement that eight of the 10 busiest traveling days were last year.
▶ 1:12:12uh and that the men and women who serve under TSA that they screened over 96 million passengers, 480 million check bags, and 2.1 billion carry-on bags, all for six weeks without getting paid, continuing to do their duty to the traveling public. You also mentioned in your opening statements some challenges opportunities uh that lie ahead.
▶ 1:12:40Uh those include the 2026 World Cup where we know that people will be coming from across the globe to America uh to enjoy uh soccer in the World Cup being hosted here. America 250 also next year. And then 2028, we know that the Olympics will be held in California. And once again, we will have individuals coming from across the globe here uh coming to America to enjoy those events.
▶ 1:13:08And so I want to talk a little bit about and you mentioned this in your statement. I know this is something that is near and dear to the chairman. Uh the passenger security fee diversion. uh for now some 20 years uh we've seen a diversion of those funds funds that were originally set up $566 for a one-way ticket $11.20 for a roundtrip ticket uh for reinvestment back into aviation security.
▶ 1:13:39Uh we know that some 20 years ago before most of us were here in Congress uh that a decision was made to divert some of those fees. Uh and that diversion now totals roughly $1.6 billion a year. Uh also in your statement, not only we we talk about the diversion of those fees, but uh we talk about the aviation security capital fund uh which also was established some 20 some odd years ago.
▶ 1:14:08Originally $250 million was set aside in revenue to screen luggage that is checked by passengers and we've seen that that number has not increased now for 20 years. Uh you talk about the fact that we are in need of and one uh returning those diverted fees back to TSA, putting that money back into aviation security, which is what it was created for. Uh and you also talk in your opening statement about the need to increase the aviation security capital fund.
▶ 1:14:38Uh so I want to give you just a minute if you could to expound on both of those.
▶ 1:14:43Uh absolutely. and and Congressman, I I thank you for recognizing the workforce because seeing them turn up day uh day in and day out throughout that uh government shutdown was nothing short of inspiring. Uh and they kept our skies safe for the traveling public and did so with uh absolute commitment to the TSA mission. Um it is our responsibility to ensure that they have the best tools at their disposal to do the job that we are asking them to do and that is why uh investment in technology is so critical.
▶ 1:15:11We are facing year-over-year volume growth at our checkpoints in infrastructure constrained environments. Uh the only way that we're going to be able to maintain our security posture and improve our security posture and deliver uh an an increasingly improved passenger experience is through that combination of our human talent and technology. Uh and that is what we are looking to work with this Congress to do to ensure that the passenger security fund is used for those purposes.
▶ 1:15:37Um I would say that there are uh several different buckets of uh technology advancements that we would want to ensure that we're investing in. One is that cutting edge screening technology at the checkpoint that we all experience when we fly through the airports. Making sure that um that is uh detecting uh threats adequately uh as we face an evolving uh adversary and threat environment. Second is is around uh identity uh verification. Right?
▶ 1:16:04that one of the cornerstones of our aviation security system is knowing who is coming through our checkpoints and doing that adequate vet vetting so we know who they are before they even show up and then third is really bringing our checkpoint into the 21st century and providing that IT infrastructure that so that we can really drive improvements on a continual basis to our checkpoints
▶ 1:16:23Miss McNeil thank you my time has expired I yield back
▶ 1:16:26gentleman yields back I now recognize the gentleman from Michigan Mr. Tenidar for five minutes questions.
▶ 1:16:31Thank you chairman and thank you ranking member for this hearing. Uh Miss McNeel, I have the honor of representing Detroit Metro Airport, Michigan's busiest airport and one of the largest airline hubs in the world.
▶ 1:16:50Given that I represent Detroit, which u prides itself on its long history of bluecollar contributions to our great nation, you must also know that I am a strong supporter of unions, organized labor, and collective bargaining rights.
▶ 1:17:11In March, TSA announced it would be stripping the collective bargaining rights through the American Federation of Government Employees for TSA personnel, but was blocked by the In December, TSA tried again to strip collective bargaining rights and were again blocked by the courts.
▶ 1:17:35Earlier last year, you were questioned regarding the role of TSA and if you believed that TSA should be privatized. You said that nothing is off the table.
▶ 1:17:50In July, TSA announced it would be seeking private sector assistance for the development and deployment of turnkey solutions for [snorts] use at the airport security Many speculate that this announcement means that the TSA is seeking to replace its personnel with private sector security.
▶ 1:18:18A common union busting tactics. Miss McNeel, I have very little time, so just a yes or no question. Do you value the work of our hardworking TSA personnel?
▶ 1:18:37Uh, thank you, Congressman, for that question. Yes, absolutely. And in my opening statement, I stated that TSA's greatest assets are its people. Now, if you believe that their work is so valuable, why are you seeking to make their jobs harder by getting rid of collective bargaining rights, which would help them with job security, safe working conditions, and ensuring accountability in the workplace?
▶ 1:19:07the uh the existence of a collective bargaining agreement is inconsistent with the mission that TSA has to perform and the agility with which we need to run this agency and our employees know that and actually the accountability of ensuring that we don't have 200 personnel that are doing non-screening work uh is in place and returning them to the checkpoint is actually better for uh our employees and the morale time and
▶ 1:19:32look this is hardworking men and women they're taking taking uh It's a very stressful environment. They they do their best to work as hard as to keep America safe. Look, it is a fact that workforce morale and retention increased significantly since the Biden administration expanded bargaining rights.
▶ 1:19:53The move to end collective bargaining rights is wrong and I look forward to the courts to continue to block these attempts to harm the rights of our nation's workers. Now, while I appreciate the TSA uh workers working so hard, I kept hating a video that was kept showing every time I'm crossing um the TSA line.
▶ 1:20:21Uh, Miss McNeel, in October, a video of Secretary Gnome blaming the government shutdown on Democrats aired at TSA checkpoints across the country. As I am sure you know, this was a blatant violation of the Hatch Act, which bars partisan activity using government resources.
▶ 1:20:44It also violates the Anti-Deficiency Act, which prohibits federal agencies from spending funds beyond what Congress has appropriated since the TSA was operating without funds at the time. Miss McNeel, why did you allow these blatantly political charged videos to play at TSA checkpoints across our country?
▶ 1:21:09Our responsibility at TSA is uh in part to inform the traveling public of what they can expect when they arrive at our checkpoints. And during the longest government shutdown, that was absolutely necessary to ensure that they understood the environment that they were coming into and the uh and and uh the the facts be uh behind that environment and the secretary is very supportive of the
▶ 1:21:32I have just a little bit of time.
▶ 1:21:34We have no time. Gentleman's time is
▶ 1:21:37Thank you. I now recognize a gentleman from Florida, Mr. Jimenez, for his five minutes of questions.
▶ 1:21:42Thank you very much. And I'll try to keep this brief. Miss O'Neal, um, have we ever had the capacity to put an air marshal on every single domestic flight in the United States?
▶ 1:21:53Uh, uh, the deployment of federal air
▶ 1:21:56Yes or no? Have we ever had the capacity to put an air marshal on every single flight in the United States?
▶ 1:22:00Uh, no. That is not
▶ 1:22:02Okay. That would be an all same as me as a fire chief closing down a fire station every once in a while and hoping a fire didn't happen in that area. So that's what I feel about the the air marshall program. We're going to have to have a lot more conversation about the air marshall program in the future. I don't have time right now. Second thing, uh Mr. uh Gatu Mukala, I'm sorry if I I butchered your name. Sorry. Um uh where does the Secretary of Homeland Security
▶ 1:22:28in the NCAA region? She's I think she's from South Dakota. Okay. Don't you think that as a secretary of homeland security every once in a while she's going to be need access to a skiff? Yes. Thank you. Uh all right. Uh now back to Miss O'Neal. Um I don't represent an airport. I actually ran one. Okay. As a mayor of Miami date county. I ran Miami International Airport. And so uh airport security is really important to me.
▶ 1:22:56Um, we talk about passenger fees and all that and and if we if we use the schedule you have right now, by what year are we going to have the things that you think are are vital to our nation security installed in all our airports?
▶ 1:23:11Um, at the current pace of funding, Congressman, uh, for our computed tomography technology, we're looking at 2042 and our credential authentication by 2049.
▶ 1:23:202049. I hope I'm alive. I don't know. I was gonna get close. Okay. So um how do they fund these security measures in
▶ 1:23:33Uh in Europe it's a it's a vastly different construct than uh than here in the United States. Uh the the regulatory bodies set the standards and put the requirements on the airports to uh
▶ 1:23:44That's right. They put it on the airports. You know why they put it on the airports? Because they can get it done. All right. we're not going to get it done because we have uh fiscal constraints. So let me tell you how an airport works right an airport uh decide in the beginning the budget what happens is what is it that we need in order to operate this airport and there's a number and then after that they go okay how how do we attain that number well they attain that number through passenger fees landing fees
▶ 1:24:14concessions etc because there's revenue that comes into that the airport and then they balance so if we were to set the standards for what we believe we need to secure the American public. I think it would make a heck of a lot more sense for us to say the airports because we're actually doing this for you and the airport and the and the traveling public etc.
▶ 1:24:40make it safe which by the way if we make it unsafe and people don't travel by air anymore it's an unbelievable economic impact on the United States. The number one economic generator of Miami date county is Miami International Airport. And I'm sure that in other communities around this country, the number one economic generator is probably their airports. And I would, you know, and I and I bet you, you know, bottom dollar that in Atlanta for sure, okay, the number one economic generator is the airport. Chicago probably too.
▶ 1:25:08New York, the three airports, too. So why don't we use the European model? Why don't we tell the airports what they need to purchase? they will figure that into their into their budgets, finance it, and then give those assets over to um to us, which some airports do when they want to actually be a little bit ahead of the game. Isn't that correct?
▶ 1:25:32We yeah we have great partnerships with uh with airports across the country and uh we we have uh put in place several different ways for which uh airports can drive investment to to their checkpoints and uh we have a capability acceptance program where airports can uh essentially donate uh qualified equipment uh to TSA so that we can upgrade uh the equipment at the checkpoint.
▶ 1:25:54That combined with um appropriated funds and looking to improve programs like the screening partnership program allow us to provide options to airports on how to drive that investment. I'm a big believer in public private partnerships. Uh like you said, airports are major economic engines of the community around them and this should be an all hands-on deck approach and we are an important part of that and our partnerships are actually absolutely critical to to advancing that.
▶ 1:26:20And by the way, we divert a lot of what's supposed to be used for security to other purposes. The passenger security
▶ 1:26:28annually about 1.6 billion,
▶ 1:26:30right? Which is supposed which when I pay a passenger security fee, I expect it to be used for passenger security and not to help balance the federal budget, which is what we do here. All right. And so I don't think we're going to be able to solve that. And so, Mr. Chairman, I'm going to be introducing legislation to change the change the way that we fund security at the airports. more like the more like the uh the European model and uh and so finally we can uh we can get the security that we need at our airports before the year 2049. Thank you. I yield back.
▶ 1:26:59Gentleman yields back. I now recognize a gentleman from Rhode Island, Mr. Magaziner, for five minutes of
▶ 1:27:05Thank you, chairman. On a Saturday morning in Cicero, Illinois, a young couple got in the car with their one-year-old child and drove to a Sam's Club to go grocery shopping. When they arrived, they saw a large law enforcement presence, some sort of an operation going on in the parking lot, and so they turned their car around to leave. As they were leaving the Sam's Club parking lot, this happened.
▶ 1:27:28Please show the first video of what appears to be pepper spray thrown by a federal agent into Raphael Verza's car. He says he was just pulling out of the Cicero Sam's Club parking lot with his window rolled down when the spray hit Verza on the side of his head.
▶ 1:27:49Mommy, you okay, mama? You okay?
▶ 1:27:51Seconds later, he realized his daughter, one-year-old Ariana, was in the back seat, also battling the chemicals. Verza says she couldn't open her eyes and struggled to breathe.
▶ 1:28:02I had water to water down my face and basically water down her face because I didn't know the effects of the pepper spray towards her. Raphael says Ariana did not have to go to the hospital, but he did. He says the pepper spray hit him directly in the ear, which caused him to have a severe reaction with his asthma.
▶ 1:28:18When I got to the hospital, my heart beats were at 263 per minute.
▶ 1:28:25Do you know how dangerous it is to spray pepper spray into a moving vehicle? Not only could that kill the people inside the car, it could kill other drivers and bystanders who might be hit by the vehicle. There is not a law enforcement agency in this country that teaches its officers to do that. In fact, in most law enforcement agencies, those officers would be fired. But not in Donald Trump's Department of Homeland Security. We don't know who these officers were or if they were disciplined in any way.
▶ 1:28:55All we know is that the White House keeps telling them that they have quote absolute immunity. Absolute immunity. Pepper spraying a young family in a moving vehicle. And whenever we call attention to these kinds of abuses, the first thing the administration does is try to blame the victims. But this is a family of United States citizens. They weren't even protesting. They were just out to get groceries. And this keeps happening again and again and again. Show the second video, please.
▶ 1:29:32From our son's basketball game at Anderson Middle School. As the night
▶ 1:29:36we started to see, you know, light
▶ 1:29:38One North Minneapolis family trying to make their way home.
▶ 1:29:42Like even trying to leave, I couldn't go backwards, forward, none of it was like I was stuck.
▶ 1:29:47Destiny and Shawn Jackson along with their six kids had just left the nearby grocery store after the game when they turned onto Lindale. Shawn says they tried to take a side street after they saw the crowds.
▶ 1:29:57There's nothing we can do if it's blocked off.
▶ 1:30:00Shawn and Destiny say they were stuck between crowds of protesters and law enforcement. When law enforcement tried to disperse the crowd,
▶ 1:30:08all we heard was boom and every airbag
▶ 1:30:12They say a flashbang went off near their car as tear gas enveloped them.
▶ 1:30:16And I was screaming for my other my oldest son, Sean. I'm like, "Get out. Get out." Like, "I can't, mom, and I can't breathe."
▶ 1:30:21Destiny says bystanders pulled her into a home to check on her as she screamed that her six-month old child was still in the car.
▶ 1:30:28He was just like lifeless. like he had like foam like around his mouth and you can see he had tears coming out his eyes. I was getting him out to mouth and I remember stopping and I said, "I will give you all my breath till you get yours back because nobody wants to see their kids."
▶ 1:30:49What was the dispon the response of the Homeland Security Department leadership after this? Did they express remorse? Did they suspend the agents or launch an investigation? No. They put up a false tweet blaming that family, the victims, calling the Jackson family quote radical Now, unlike a lot of the victimlaming tweets that the administration posts, they actually took that one down because it was so indefensible. But why was it put up in the first place?
▶ 1:31:18What does it say about the rotten culture at the Trump Department of Homeland Security that when American citizens are hurt by federal agents, the response is to immediately blame the victims before you even know the facts? Now, we can keep going and going. These are just a couple of examples. And I know that this hearing is supposed to be about TSA and cyber, which is important.
▶ 1:31:37But when the federal government is sending poorly trained masked agents into the streets, beating and gassing peaceful people, including American citizens, we cannot pretend that this is normal and act like it should be business as usual.
▶ 1:31:51We need real standards in place just like every other law enforcement agency in the country has to make sure that federal agents are well trained, do not use excessive force when when not warranted, and are held accountable when they do things like tear gas a family inside a moving vehicle. This has to stop. I yield back.
▶ 1:32:11Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Gonzalez, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 1:32:16Uh, thank you, chairman. Thank you, panelists. uh director um got the moakala this uh you know SISA isn't a isn't a small little agency that you just go to retire at. It's arguably one of the most important agencies in our government that most people don't realize what's happening this year. Uh I would argue one of the biggest thing that's going to be in your purview is going to be this election. It's going to determine the future not only of our country but also the future of of the world in general.
▶ 1:32:42So midterm elections, my question to you is what is CISA doing to ensure our midterm elections are safe, secure, and fair?
▶ 1:32:51Congressman, thank you. Um we we election security is very important for national security and um somehow the claim that um DHS of CISA has rolled back election security protections is u not accurate. We we treat election security like any other critical infrastructure sec uh sector and u our election security services remain fully in place including cyber security support that we provide uh the physical security guidance uh provided.
▶ 1:33:22There is um the incident response that we provide and also the threat be briefings for the state and local election officials. The the election infrastructure owners and uh operators continue to receive the same level of support as other critical infrastructure entities. So uh the what changed was the scope uh not the security sir. Uh we uh we ended activities that were um outside its core mission but not the election protections itself and um the election security is focused on the infrastructure by all means.
▶ 1:33:52Um what it means is we are exclusively focused on defending the election infrastructure from any cyber threats, any physical threats and also any foreign adversaries um that are out there and um as you may know sir um foreign threats remain a core priority for us. The nation state adversaries continue to pose risks to our election infrastructure and CISA we we are providing that threat intelligence.
▶ 1:34:15We're conducting that um the um the vulnerability scanning to all our state and local infrastructure owners and we are making sure that we are coordinating that incident response across the board. Um election security remains integrated into CISA's broader cyber and uh physical security mission.
▶ 1:34:31I I I ask that you make that a top priority because it's a top priority for many Americans. Uh is you know you can win election, you can lose an election, but it has to be fair and has to be secure and our adversaries don't want that. Uh my question to you is how many how many cyber intrusions do we expect this midterm election?
▶ 1:34:49Sir, uh we um we look at it as uh incident by incident and we'll look at what the risks are. I I don't have a specific number in mind.
▶ 1:34:56Well, we should have that number. We should it should first start by how many intrusions did we had last midterm and the midterm before that and midterm before that. I don't want to wait I don't want us waiting until after the fact to be able to go, "Yeah, we got it wrong and it turns out our adversaries influenced our election." Uh to that point, what actions is CISA doing to work with other partners like CyberCom to ensure that uh that these uh these adversaries are not intruding in our
▶ 1:35:23We we have a very good working relationship. Our our strength is collaboration. We want we want to make sure that we're working with our law enforcement and trusted intelligence partners across um the country and international partners to make sure that we are uh we are safe. CyberCom in particular. Uh is is CISA working with CyberCom on any cyber offensive actions to prevent our adversaries from interfering in our elections?
▶ 1:35:46Congressman, thank you. We work with CyberCom on threat intelligence sharing and making sure that we have the incident response and we are working with the private and um um stakeholder communities to make sure that that threat information is shared.
▶ 1:35:59Okay. Uh we need that to be a priority. That needs to be a priority uh between between Cybercom and SISA. you two are the two organizations that are going to keep this nation and our world safe to ensure that these elections are fair and secure. Uh to that point, what actors what actors uh what state or non-state actors are the most aggressive in interfering with our elections?
▶ 1:36:22Congressman, thank you. I think um the the threat actors uh continue the foreign state adversaries especially the people republic of China um and u Russia seems to be the most um aggressive um nation state actors uh the strategic ad uh adversity is China they are long-term and um they have patient campaigns focused on prepositioning in our critical infrastructure uh for a strategic advantage as you might have seen with world typhoon and salt typhoon they are
▶ 1:36:52both a PRC um state sponsored campaign focused on prepositioning themselves inside the US critical infrastructure for potential disruption for a future crisis unlike um the traditional espionage these actors use living off the land techniques.
▶ 1:37:07Director, I I have 10 seconds left. What I'd say is you just said everything that everyone has ever come before this committee and said, the same actors over and over and over again. So, it's no surprise that these actors are going to be involved. They were involved in last election. They'll be involved in this election. They'll be involved in every election going forward. What I ask is instead of the United States playing defense, it's long time we play offense and prevent these bad actors from influencing our elections. With that, chairman, I yield back.
▶ 1:37:31Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentle lady from Illinois, Miss Mr. Ramirez, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 1:37:36Thank you, chairman. And I do have a number of articles I want to enter into the record at the end. So, as a Chicago, I know the terror that DHS can inflict with unlimited resources and unchecked power. You just saw some of that. uh with what Congressman Magazina just showed. Our constituents are being surveiled. They're being threatened. They're being teargased and subjected to warrantless arrest, rammed with vehicles. They're being kidnapped. And you've seen it. They're also being disappeared.
▶ 1:38:05Yet those the there are those in Congress who would still expand DHS's budget and ICE capacity to enact Trump's mass deportation agenda. And so I often get asked back in my district, how is this possible? How is it that they can behave this way? How can they tear gas a six-month-old baby? Isn't Congress supposed to be a check on DHS?
▶ 1:38:31Well, first I say to them, that would require my Republican colleagues to agree that bringing senior ICE officials to testify before this committee is critical. And I do hear, chairman, that that may happen in six weeks or so. I think it's far too late. they should be here right now. Secondly, that would also suggest that DHS is behaving in ways outside its design. Now, let me be clear. DHS and ICE, it's not rogue. Let me tell you why.
▶ 1:38:58Because from its establishment, Congress empowered DHS to violate our rights under the pretense of securing our safety. Who feels safe right now under DHS? DHS was un was intentionally established with an over broad mission and unchecked power which has been expanded by Republicans with a blink check, unlimited personnel and no guard rails whatsoever.
▶ 1:39:23And Trump with his authoritarian tendencies is only making visible what so many communities have already known to be true. DHS is a threat to our collective safety and funding it only fuels our destruction and our human suffering. It's why 32 people have died in detention in ISIS deadliest year yet. US citizens are being shot and killed. And the agency doesn't even know who they're hiring and doesn't seem to even care who they're hiring.
▶ 1:39:51Yet Trump's campaign donors are profiting off the pain of our neighbors, including children. And so today, I say enough. I am introducing today the Melt ICE Act that would prohibit DHS from using funds to detain or monitor immigrants, effectively limiting ISIS authority and ability to continue to cause pain and terror while redirecting the funding that they have, taxpayer dollars that they're using to kill US citizens back into the communities impacted by ISIS terror through wraparound services.
▶ 1:40:21Because we know that DHS is being used as a weapon to be pointed towards anyone the government considers a public enemy and fascism always requires a public enemy. So we must take the weapon away and hold those who have allowed our communities to be terrorized accountable. So let me get to the witnesses here. My understanding is that your agencies are working with ICE in some capacity under the Trump administration. Miss McNeel, is your agency sharing data with ICE? Yes or no?
▶ 1:40:52Absolutely. We are part of a homeless or Thank you. Miss McNeel, I have a follow-up question for you.
▶ 1:40:58Why is TSA m making life miserable for people every right to that have every right to travel domestically and who pose no threat to aviation instead of focusing on your security mission?
▶ 1:41:11Uh I I don't agree with your statement, ma'am. Uh, as we have seen, the men and women of TSA are absolutely dedicated to the transportation and national security mission, and that was very apparent during the 43day shutdown where they continued to show up to work while we waited for funding to come.
▶ 1:41:26Thank you, Miss McNeel. It is clear that people are living in fear and TSA is working with ICE to terrorize our communities. Dr. Gamala, has your agency taken personnel off mission to work for ICE? Let me add to that. That includes details and reassignments from your agency to ICE or CBP as well as to the Federal Protective Service and US Marshals in communities with ICE enforcement operations. That's a yes or no question.
▶ 1:41:56Uh, Congressman, not in my times u at
▶ 1:41:59so in the last year, your agency has not taken personnel off mission to work for for ICE. Yes or no?
▶ 1:42:06Not in my time, ma'am.
▶ 1:42:07Okay. I'll have something into the record that indicates the opposite. So, let me ask you another question. Does it concern you that your personnel might already have staffing shortages? Uh, as we just heard a moment ago, over a third in staff shortages, yet the administration is asking for your staff to be used for ICE enforcement.
▶ 1:42:31Uh, Congress, I congresswoman, I think um the
▶ 1:42:34Does it concern you? Yes or no?
▶ 1:42:37We are on mission. We are doing all the cyber from physical.
▶ 1:42:39Let me ask you a follow-up question to that. Has your agency transferred funding to ICE? Yes or no? Has any of your funding gone to ICE? Yes or no?
▶ 1:42:49Congresswoman, I we not
▶ 1:42:52The answer is yes. My time is up.
▶ 1:42:53Thank you.
▶ 1:42:56Gentle ladies, time is expired. I now recognize gentleman from Alabama, Mr. Strong, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 1:43:02Thank you, Chairman Garberino, Ranking Member Thompson. As my colleagues have noted, the United States is entering a period marked by high-profile special events and increased global travel, underscoring the importance of readiness across the homeland security enterprise. Uh, thank you to our witnesses and their teams for their work to meet these Uh, Mr.
▶ 1:43:25Ala day within the science and technology uh director at R&D uh where does the threat u posed by unmanned aerial systems and counter UAS capabilities rank as a priority?
▶ 1:43:43Thank you, Congressman.
▶ 1:43:46Apologies. Thank you, Congressman, for your question. Um I think uh the it's it's very high on our priority list. um that's exhibited by Secretary Gnomes creating a program executive office within S&T that brings together uh both the policy and the uh R&D aspects uh acquisition support aspects uh to um handle the counter UAS mission uh particularly uh in a speedy manner as we approach uh the FIFA World Cup uh LA 2020 2028
▶ 1:44:17um Olympics and uh America 250 given the rapid um evolution of drone technology. How is S&T keeping its counter UAS research ahead of its
▶ 1:44:32Thank you, Congressman, for the question. Um at present, our focus is uh getting to speedy delivery of uh systems into the field uh in preparation for these events. So we're providing uh technical review and assistance to um to our partners uh to ensure that the the right systems that work well get out into the field to prevent the threats. Um we are also doing uh a number of testing development and evaluation uh efforts to um look at new technologies that may help change the the game for us.
▶ 1:45:02Um but at present given the short time frames the thrust of our effort is getting delivery out into the fields.
▶ 1:45:08Okay. My district is home to the joint S&T FBI and TSA Tide Center as well as the FBI's terrorist explosive device analytical center. These centers work closely together to protect our homeland and stay ahead of potential threats. Um, how does the FBI's expertise inform S&T's efforts at TIDS and how does the collaboration enhance TSA's implementation of effective screening
▶ 1:45:41Uh, thank you for that question. Um we uh you know as as an agency focused on delivering transportation security the uh traveling public are always focused on looking at cutting edge technologies and how to advance those uh in collaboration with our partners at S&T and across the the US government. Um the evolving threat requires us to always evolve our posture uh and that includes technology.
▶ 1:46:04So, uh, you know, we look forward to to our continued partnership across DHS to ensure that we're meeting that mission, but also to work with, uh, this this committee in Congress to ensure that we've got the funding to to be able to deploy that technology into the hands of our operators.
▶ 1:46:17Thank you, Dr. Gham. How do you say it? I won't ask again.
▶ 1:46:24You're good, sir. You can call me with my first name.
▶ 1:46:26Dr. G. There we go. Um uh SISA was created by Congress with bipartisan support to protect national security. Unfortunately, the Biden administration transformed an agency once focused on cyber and foreign threats to critical infrastructure into an unaccountable censorship agency that uh pressured social media companies to take down speech protected by the first amendment.
▶ 1:46:50Can you confirm that SISA has stopped those policies uh or policing American speech and returned to its uh authorized mission scope? Congressman, thank you for the question. Um I I mentioned earlier u what changed was the scope, not security. CISA ended all the activities that were outside its core mission, not um election protections.
▶ 1:47:12The activities that ended involved monitoring any uh Americans lawful speech, any narrative management or any coordination with those uh social media companies on election related posts. Those activities are not operational election security services. So we ended abuses, sir. We're not any protections that we do with election security.
▶ 1:47:32You said earlier and I quote, SISA is trying to get back on mission. Close quote. For the record, during the Biden administration, what got CISA so off its core mission?
▶ 1:47:43Congressman, thank you for the question. Um, as part of this administration and under the guidance of um, Secretary Nome, we are reviewing line by line on all the items that we do and we are eliminating any redundancy. Uh, we have eliminated duplicative oversight um, roles and uh, we have consolidated fragmented IT support structures. We uh unified a lot of uh fragmented IT functions under one office. We eliminated overlapping IT operations.
▶ 1:48:11We removed over 300 plus duplicative contractor roles. Uh we um modernized some of the enterprise IT environment.
▶ 1:48:19thank you. My my time's expired. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
▶ 1:48:22Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from New York, Mr. Kennedy, for uh five minutes of question. Sorry about those bills, buddy. Yeah, we're we're uh we are in pain um with Bill's Mafia. Thank you. Uh we're here to talk about some very important issues here. Mr.
▶ 1:48:38Chairman, I want to thank you for bringing uh this committee together today, but I am terribly disappointed both by the answers that I'm hearing or the lack thereof answers as well as the lack of um ICE being here with us to answer some very serious questions. They should be here testifying under oath answering pressing questions that all of us have.
▶ 1:49:00Uh this committee needs answers from The people of this country need answers of what is happening across this nation. Like what happens to families like Renee Nicole Goods who are left with a massive hole in their hearts because of this administration's lawlessness? And what credibility can investigation into this tragedy possibly have if it ends as quickly as it begins and scrutinizes everyone in Minneapolis except for the agent who shot her?
▶ 1:49:31And how many US citizens and lawful residents have been swept up in the Trump administration's immigration raids? How many of them have seen their due process rights, those enshrined in the US Constitution willfully ignored? Why is Secretary Gnome taking no responsibility for the violence she has brought to our communities? And how much farther is she willing to go to destroy the American dream as we know it? What critical DHS missions are being neglected at the expense of Secretary Non's extreme immigration agenda?
▶ 1:50:01And that last question, I'd like to ask the witnesses in detail about reassignments away from your respective agencies in immigration enforcement missions. We know that Secretary Gnome's taken thousands of federal personnel from their assigned duties, and it's felt acutely in my community in Western New York. My district has four bridges that connect New York and Canada. And yet, many of these travel processing booths are empty because Secretary Gnome is diverting resources from northern border communities.
▶ 1:50:32This drives up costs, takes away good paying jobs, deters travel with our closest ally to the north, and make makes things less safe. So, I understand both SISA and TSA have had employees reassigned to oversee the Trump administration's immigration and deportation operations along with its draconian crackdown on Americans exercising First Amendment rights.
▶ 1:50:58So, acting director Gatam Gatamala and Deputy Administrator McNeel, how many people from SISA TSA have been Congressman um not to the knowledge of um I I don't have the knowledge of any people from CESUB
▶ 1:51:17but your agency's been cut by over a
▶ 1:51:21The we the team participated in a voluntary um the workforce transition program and we are working towards our own mission of making sure that we are protecting the critical infrastructure from cyber and physical threats.
▶ 1:51:33Mrs. McNeil, Miss McNeil, how many of your employees have been reassigned? Uh I'm not aware of any of our employees uh being moved over to ICE.
▶ 1:51:42Um and 250 air marshals you testified today are have been reassigned. Is that
▶ 1:51:48That is not a reassignment. The federal air marshals are providing in-flight security for deportation flights which is actually uh falls uh within their within their mission space
▶ 1:51:58outside of commercial flights. Outside of commercial flights, they have been reassigned to other flights. 250 air marshals have been re reassigned. How can we assure the American people that flying in this country is safe post 9/11 if the air marshals that have been provided to do the work to keep them safe in the skies have be reassigned off of those commercial flights?
▶ 1:52:20Providing inflight security for deportation flight keeps our skies safe. And I I don't think that your number is accurate, Congressman, but we're happy to uh make sure that we get
▶ 1:52:28I believe that's the number that was mentioned in this testimony today. Do you believe that TSA employees have the right to organize, MCN? uh as I stated earlier uh the the administrator has uh has the authority to set the terms and framework of employment of the TSO workforce and we need to do so uh in a way that keeps in mind the mission of TSA which was granted by Congress.
▶ 1:52:51Is that a yes or a no? Do you believe that the employees that keep our skies, our communities safe have a right to organize in this country? Uh I think that is determined by uh by by the administrator and actually what we are focused on is delivering aviation and transportation security for the American people and being a good steward of the tax.
▶ 1:53:12I will I will take that as either a non-answer or quite frankly sounds like a no to me which is very very disappointing disheartening not just to to this panel and to this committee but to the rank and file working families that are out there protecting us each and every day. It is their right in this country to organize if they choose to do so.
▶ 1:53:34And quite frankly, it is an obligation of this government to work with them in a collecting bargaining scenario to provide them the rights that they deserve.
▶ 1:53:47I yield back. Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Arizona, Mr. Crane, for five minutes of
▶ 1:53:58Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to start by pushing back against my colleagues on the other side. You know, it's interesting to me. I've only been in Congress for three years now, but they clearly created this catastrophe. We warned about it in the last Congress while the southern border was wide open and many of our visa programs were being completely exploited. Now you have 15 million people in the country. That's a figure they won't even argue with.
▶ 1:54:24And now the American people elected President Trump and this administration to go and solve the problem. And now so they've turned on ICE whose job is to get the criminals and these people out of the country. And so they've turned on ICE. We even have a member on this panel again who assaulted an ICE agent. And we wonder why this stuff continues to happen.
▶ 1:54:48Um and I didn't hear any of them talking about the deportations that took place under President Obama, who I believe was deporting even more people than President Trump has in his first year. Next, I want to turn to what this committee is actually about. And I want to start with SISA. Um, Dr. Guda Makala. Um, under the Biden administration, censorship, deplatforming, and flagging speech of Americans they didn't like was very common and often reported.
▶ 1:55:18Um, they censured American citizens who were posting about election integrity. There were also deep platforming. Anybody who talked about COVID 19 and its origins um what is correct me if I'm wrong doctor but I thought SISA was for um you know protecting American infrastructure um and cyber security. Is that correct?
▶ 1:55:44Why why do you think SISA started you know going after Americans for exercising free speech?
▶ 1:55:50Congressman thank you for the question. you're absolutely right. Election security is focused on infrastructure and CESUS election security role is focused exclusively on defending the election infrastructure from cyber threats and physical threats and foreign adversaries. And um this that includes any voter registration systems, election technology and supporting systems, not speech or content moderation. And um precisely why uh I keep saying is that what changed was the scope not the security.
▶ 1:56:19We ended activities that were outside its core mission and uh not election protections. Those activities that invol that ended involved monitoring any Americans lawful speech and um narrative management and you rightly said sir uh coordination with social media companies on election related posts. Those activities are not operational election security issues.
▶ 1:56:38Thank you. Thank you. Sorry I got to cut you off. I got more questions. I want to turn to uh Miss McNeel uh with TSA. Um, on July 8th, TSA ended its shoes off which was obviously in place because we had, you know, incidents like the shoe bomber that tried to bring a a bomb in a shoe on board an airplane. Why was that policy in ended, Miss McNeel?
▶ 1:57:06Thank you for the question, Congressman Crane. Um, at TSA, we're continually looking at the risk environment that we operate within and um, uh, improving our standard operating procedures and operations at the checkpoint to reflect that risk picture. Uh, there had been, uh, multiple risk assessments done in past years that allowed us to make that change um, and amend our procedures to to maintain the safety of the skies while delivering for the American public. Um, continual improvement is something that uh, you know, TSA embraces. And
▶ 1:57:34M. McNeil, real quick. Do you think it with technology adapting, it's impossible for somebody to make make a bomb out of their shoes?
▶ 1:57:43Uh the the way that we approach security is to deploy multiple different layers of security and pieces of technology to ensure that nobody can essentially game the system. Uh we have multiple layers from identity and vetting through um all of the uh physical screening that happens at the checkpoint and then inflight security as well. So through that layered security approach um is how we deliver for uh for the American public and and that's something that you know has been in place since the inception of TSA.
▶ 1:58:10Thank you. I want to turn to some of the Somali cash going through airports. Um it's estimated that 700 million in cash in passenger luggage was leaving the Minnesota airport in the last two years. Has TSA made any changes to its policies to prevent this activity that is tied to the fraud in Minnesota from continuing
▶ 1:58:33We are extremely proud of um the team at TSA for highlighting this issue uh by reporting what they saw in their the normal course of their screening uh in
▶ 1:58:44But report reporting is not enough, right? It continued to go on and we got 700 million in cash. Has anything been changed? That's the question I asked you. We are working we are working with our uh inter agency partners and law enforcement partners to ensure that uh you know this this issue is being addressed. Uh we continue being a good partner to them.
▶ 1:59:04The money that was moved through was moved through uh through legal means and so this is where I think Congress has a role to play to think about the authorities um around around this bulk cash movement.
▶ 1:59:15Thank you. I yield back.
▶ 1:59:16Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentle lady from New Jersey, Mr. Gyver, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 1:59:21Mr. Crane, I don't know what your obsession is.
▶ 1:59:24I thought you were supposed to address the chair.
▶ 1:59:26Tired of you mentioning me. And
▶ 1:59:28Mr. Chairman, is she supposed to address [laughter] me or the people of Arizona, not me? If you quit assaulting ICE agents to order, I am reclaiming my time. Committee will come to order.
▶ 1:59:39Watch your mouth when the rules of the
▶ 1:59:42Thank Excuse me. I'm reclaiming my time. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and ranking member. Let me get to the business that I'm here for for the people of New Jersey, not Mr. Ukraine, thank you for holding today's hearing. Here we are three weeks into the new year and finally we're having our first full committee hearing in more than a month. During that time, the lawlessness of DHS under Donald Trump and Christy Gnome has increased tenfold.
▶ 2:00:09Just last week, a parent in my home state of New Jersey was detained by ICE after ordering food for his six-year-old daughter. When her dad didn't come home, the little girl was then found crying and wandering around for hours outside parentless. Parent parentless. How inhumane. Like I told Secretary Gnome when she sat in this room last month, the greatest threat to the homeland right now is the Department of Homeland Security under her control.
▶ 2:00:37Unfortunately, the Republicans like Mr. Ukraine in control of Congress are not up to the task. In the face of the administration's appalling escalation of violence, the majority has set up this hearing with a random assortment of DHS leaders who are not the ones we really need to hear from in this moment. I join my colleagues in demanding that we bring ISIS acting director Todd Owens before the committee as soon as possible. Respectfully, Mr. chairman.
▶ 2:01:07That would be just the start of providing the accountability and change our constituents are demanding of us right now in this moment. Now, since having administr having having administration witnesses is a rarity this Congress, I do want to talk a bit about TSA. Acting administrator McNill, I want to note that I am the top Democrat on the transportation and marine time security subcommittee, but this is the first time we have met.
▶ 2:01:35In fact, this is the first time we we have had a single TSA witness before the full committee or any subcommittee this Congress, even as the majority is embarking on an effort to reauthorize the agency. Miss McNeil, as with other DHS components, this administration has been lawless in its direction for TSA.
▶ 2:01:57Last month, Secretary Gnome tried to abolish the workforce's collective bargaining rights in a blanket defiance of a court order to keep them in place. My fellow Democrats and I wrote to Secretary wrote to the secretary and to you to demand that you halt those efforts and I am glad that a court has since ruled that those efforts are in fact illegal. However, we still did not hear from you, Miss McNeil.
▶ 2:02:24recognize you have no control over Christy's gnome's lawlessness and cannot speak to whether she will continue to break the law. But speaking for yourself in this moment, yes or no, will you commit to abiding by the court order to keep TSA TSA's collective bargaining agreement in place and fully honor its provisions?
▶ 2:02:47Every step that the secretarian that we have taken has been in compliance with the courts.
▶ 2:02:51Is that yes or no? I'm talking I'm speaking on on behalf of you, not secretary. No gnome. Will you commit to that? Will you commit to the provision to be in compliance?
▶ 2:02:59Will you commit to the provision as the acting administrator?
▶ 2:03:03Yes or no?
▶ 2:03:04We are We are both
▶ 2:03:06Okay. Well, I'll go I'll go to my next questions, Miss McNell, because you're going to do this today. I don't have much time. Okay. Miss McNeil, what has TSA done prior to providing passenger data to ICE to ensure compliance with the law? We are acting within our absolute authorities. We are part of the Department of Homeland Security. It was a department that was set up by Congress to ensure that these agencies weren't operating in silos. And that's what we are doing today to advance the mission, the national security mission of the department.
▶ 2:03:34Miss McNeil, TSA mission is to secure transportation, not to assist ICE with immigration enforcement. There is no law that forbids undocumented people from flying domestically within the US. The vast majority of undocumented people have no criminal record and pose absolutely no threat to aviation. Under what authority is TSA sharing passenger data with ICE?
▶ 2:03:58We are absolutely within our authorities to share information within the Department of Homeland Security to further the national security mission.
▶ 2:04:04What statute are you following or point to the policy or the statute that you are following under what authority is TSA sharing passenger data with ICE that you are allowed to do that.
▶ 2:04:16We are allowed to do that.
▶ 2:04:18What policy or statute are you
▶ 2:04:20We can I can get you the exact policy.
▶ 2:04:22Oh, please do. We will wait on that. With that, I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 2:04:27Gentle lady yields back. I now recognize a gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Ogles, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 2:04:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to the witnesses. Um, you know, there's been a lot of talk about ICE, uh, and unfortunately really outside the scope of this hearing, and for that to our witnesses, I apologize because science and technology, TSA, the chairman of cyber, I'm going to spend a lot of my time, uh, with the good doctor here.
▶ 2:04:55But uh, if you would please, uh, if there's anything that we can do as members of this committee and Congress to help you affect your job more efficiently, please, if you'll reach out to my office, I'd love to have an offline conversation with you, TSA. Uh, same with you as well. And, you know, and I commend you and your office and your agents uh, for the job you're doing uh, during this shutdown. And it should be noted, Mr.
▶ 2:05:18chairman that uh Joe Biden uh you know reassigned air marshals to assist with the uh movement of illegals across the southern border. So when we talk about reassignment of roles uh let's look at the the large scope of how it's been done under previous administrations.
▶ 2:05:37So and then you know again collective bargaining you want to talk about manufacturing uh when you look at six sigma lean and lean six and efficiencies within operations uh the fact that we're bringing that to the uh to the uh government is a good thing as we move forward and so we specifically to Mr. Dr. Dr.
▶ 2:05:56Vala we had the privilege of talking when you look at reductions within your agency one of the things we said or I said in the previous hearing the cyber subcommittee was that it's about quality not necessarily quantity can you speak to the numbers and quite frankly the trend lines your your department is uh when you look at attrition slightly below the federal average average take it away sir
▶ 2:06:19thank you congressman uh
▶ 2:06:20gentleman yield
▶ 2:06:21I do not thank you
▶ 2:06:23congressman thank you for the question and um first of All I want to say that there is um um continued bipartisan support across for uh CISA and um the um the personnel that we have we are making sure that they are on mission um for somehow um the bad press or whatever we see we we miss the point that uh CESO personnel are deployed across the 10 regions in support of all 56 states and territories working with the local
▶ 2:06:50specifically good doctor because we have limited time so roughly 800 agents what percentage of the workforce is that 23 some percent.
▶ 2:06:57That is correct. So sir about 23% participated in the workforce transition
▶ 2:07:01And then the the national average of aside from that uh roughly 9% across federal agencies you're trending what 7 7% attrition.
▶ 2:07:09That that is correct sir. Compared to the previous years it's about 9.25 um approximately across all federal agencies and we are or we were at um 6.5 to 7.5% from a natural attrition this year. So the sp the facts quite frankly speak for themselves and as chairman of cyber uh you know I spent a lot of time in the skiff getting updates on the constant attacks that we face uh from threat actors like China, like North Korea, like Iran, like Russia. And yet you're doing more with less and you're doing it more efficiently.
▶ 2:07:39And so for that I say thank you. You know, one of the things that we talked about and and what's important I think to the American people when we again I said it in the the hearing is the war has already begun. We know who the adversary is. uh our primary adversar adversary is China. It's important that we on this committee and you and your agency have better communications, increase communications and then we're updated on really on a much more timely basis.
▶ 2:08:06So with that uh again per our conversation do you agree that members of this committee and in particular the subcommittee on cyber security and infrastructure which has direct oversight of CISA will be informed in a timely manner and quite frankly when needed in a skiff so that we can do our jobs and help you and assist you in doing your search.
▶ 2:08:24Congressman I appreciate uh the support. Yes definitely sir and then you know to change subjects and and I appreciate you one willing your willingness to meet with me. I appreciate all of you for being here. Uh when we look at the mission statement and the directive we have here with the committee, it's important that we keep things in perspective. We have an obligation to the American people and to the American taxpayer.
▶ 2:08:48And one of the things that we've seen under the previous administration, administrations plural, is the absolute suck on our system, our infrastructure and our welfare. So for example, Baton 81.4% are on are on welfare.
▶ 2:09:02Yemen 75.2% 2% Somalia 71.9% Marshall Island 71.4% Afghani 68.1 Dominican Republic 68.1 Bangladesh 54.8 Pakistan 40.2 and I can go on but this idea that doctors and lawyers were brought into this country to help our society is absolute nonsense. Go back to heart seller back to the 1960s. Let's abolish it and quite frank frankly deport them all.
▶ 2:09:31This is the United States of America. We get to decide who comes in. And Mr. Chairman, we get to decide who leaves. I yield back.
▶ 2:09:38Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentle lady from New Jersey, Miss Poe, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 2:09:45Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, so as we sit here, DHS is operating an armed invasion of an American state, Minnesota. Local law enforcement described DHS tactics as quote profoundly detrimental to public safety. An American citizen was shot in the face and killed by an ICE agent.
▶ 2:10:12Secretary Gnome, ICE Director Todd Lines should be here testifying under oath what happened to Renee Good and the pervasive ICE violence against Americans because we know Non's taxpayers funded media tour continues to spew outright lies about her department, including calling Rene Nay good
▶ 2:10:43a domestic terrorist. Just this weekend the secretary went on TV and said that 70% of the people held by ICE have committed violent crimes. In fact only 25% of individuals of in ICE custody have criminal convictions with many being minor offenses like traffic violations. And that's a fact.
▶ 2:11:07No one here can speak to the rampant DHS corruption like the 200 million dollars in taxpayers money used for an ad campaign to the secretary's aid and family or her so-called borders are who accepted a fast food checkout bag stuffed with $50,000 cash bribe. Why is DHS illegally blocking Congress from entering ICE facilities?
▶ 2:11:35Is it is it to cover up the 32 people who died uh in ICE custody last year or the four this year, including a reported homicide at a Texas ICE facility earlier this month? There are now reports that in my home state of New Jersey, ICE is looking to convert massive warehouses into detention centers, including one in Roxbury.
▶ 2:12:03None of these witnesses can speak to any of these abuses, but there are important questions that uh that we can cover. Starting with election uh security. I am alarmed by the administration's termination of funding for state and local elections offices for uh election security. We talked earlier and someone asked about how safe are uh our elections. Are they uh fair?
▶ 2:12:32Will they be in indeed uh secured? This president has attempted to weaponize CISA and spread disinformation about his election lost in 2020. So I'd like to ask Dr. Gatum Gatamu Kala um did Donald Trump win or lose the 2020 election? Yes or no?
▶ 2:12:59Congresswoman, I will be more than happy to talk about submission. I I'm I'm not here to discuss about 2000 election or the 2020 election.
▶ 2:13:07Did Donald Trump lose the 2020 election? Yes or no?
▶ 2:13:13Ma'am, I'll be more than happy to discuss about work that CISA does. I get back on mission. I can understand why you would want to I you know I will tell you it's a this is a simple question that only has the right only has one right answer. Yes, he was in fact Do you believe that Donald Trump defeat uh defeats?
▶ 2:13:40Do you believe that Trump's defeat in 2020 contributed to this administration's cutting funds to support election security for state and local officials? Yes or no?
▶ 2:13:54Ma'am, election security is focused on infrastructure and u as CISA, we are exclusively focused on defending the electron election infrastructure.
▶ 2:14:04Quite honestly, it's it's very simple. What kind of justification could explain this reckless cuts? Please explain that.
▶ 2:14:14Ma'am, once again, I have explained before the
▶ 2:14:17It's clear that you're not going to be able to do that. I'm sorry, but it's obviously clear that you're not looking to answer a simple question with a yes or no answer. I am very concerned uh Mr. chairman uh over the fact that one of my colleagues asked earlier about sharing information and Miss McNeel, the passengers, are are we are we in fact making uh TSA uh American citizens aware that TSA is in fact diverting resources and how are they
▶ 2:14:48those uh personnel information being shared between agency? Do the American people know that their information may very well be shared? the gentle lady can maybe respond in writing to that question and she is the time has expired. Oh, I appreciate that.
▶ 2:15:04Chairman, I yield back. I would like however to be able to ask that question.
▶ 2:15:08Absolutely. I know all committee members will have the time to submit questions in writing. Um, following us. I know I have a bunch that I'm going to miss.
▶ 2:15:14Thank you very much.
▶ 2:15:15Thank you, gentle lady. I now recognize the gentle lady from South Carolina, Miss Biggs, for five minutes of
▶ 2:15:21Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our panelists for being here today. I would like to elaborate on um my colleague, Congressman Crane, what he was um stating. It is concerning to me that for two years, Somali residents were walking through the Minianapolis airport with duffel bags filled with cash. Um nearly $1 million a day, totaling nearly $1 billion.
▶ 2:15:51I think that's astonishing. TSA reportedly flagged this flood of money and raised it to DHS int and intel agencies. So, Administrator McNeel, did that really happen? And who were these individuals responsible for this? And where was the cash going? Because to me, it if if that is what was reported, why wasn't it stopped immediately?
▶ 2:16:19Uh, this money could have easily been used for um terrorists and tied to the same massive Somali fraud networks that we keep seeing across Minnesota.
▶ 2:16:34Thank you, Congresswoman, for that question. Um uh TSA did indeed uh report these incidents as uh it came across the checkpoint because bulk cash shows up as a mass on the on the X-ray and so our officers have to resolve what they can't identify on the X-ray machine and through the course of uh their normal day-to-day duties. They they reported that uh to our uh law enforcement partner partners uh in compliance with their standard operating procedures.
▶ 2:17:01Um this is why it's really important to take a whole of government approach on this and levy the authorities of all these law enforcement agencies uh both across DHS and with the department of treasury to ensure that we are taking a concerted uh whole of government approach to this and I think this is where uh the role of congress is also critical to ensure uh that we have the right framework in place uh to take action.
▶ 2:17:23uh as I mentioned earlier uh the the movement of this money uh historically had been done through uh legal channels and so you know I think we're going to have to collectively uh work on this.
▶ 2:17:35Okay. I still didn't hear what is actually being done about it.
▶ 2:17:40Uh we continue to to to report it based on our standard operating procedures. I know there's a you know an ongoing investigation with our law enforcement partners. We are part of that and we're uh happy to brief you and the members of this committee on any uh developments that we see on that front.
▶ 2:17:55Okay. I guess my um next question would be why is Congress finding out about this from journalists and not from DHS?
▶ 2:18:07Um I can't I can't speak to I mean again I I think we you know are committed to transparency with this committee and as the investigation uh evolves we are happy to brief out on our part in this um and you know work with with the rest of the US government to to make sure that we're taking action.
▶ 2:18:24Well thank you for that. My um constituents and the American people would love to hear a followup on that. Thank you. So my next question um TSA the touchless pre-check is a biometric identity verif ver verification capability that enables enrolled pre-check travelers to verify their identity at airport checkpoints using facial recognition and eliminating the need
▶ 2:18:54uh to present a physical ID. What is TSA's long-term vision um for this TIS? And is it intended solely as a checkpoint identity verification tool or does TSA envision it becoming a broader identity platform across the transportation system?
▶ 2:19:15Uh so we have launched uh the touchless identification system as you mentioned TIS uh in 15 uh locations today for pre-check. Um it is a voluntary facilitative uh technology that we offer to our pre-check members. We're going to be rolling out additional locations.
▶ 2:19:34Um you know based on based on the experience and feedback that we're getting from our pre-check population is it is uh well very well received and again I would just state it's voluntary and it's meant to really provide that seamless experience to our trusted population as they travel through our airports because you don't have to take out your identity or your boarding pass um at the checkpoint. So it's it is it is um a facil facilitative tool. Um that is the intent of of that program is uh to offer that benefit to our pre-check
▶ 2:20:04Just one more quick thing. So is it beyond passenger screening? Um will it be like for cargo or international operations? Is will it go in more in
▶ 2:20:17It is it is intended for passenger screening and for a pre-check
▶ 2:20:21Okay. Thank you. I yield back.
▶ 2:20:24Gentle lady yields back. I now recognize gentleman from Texas, Mr. Green, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 2:20:30Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank the ranking member as well. Thank the witnesses for appearing today. Um, [clears throat] Mr. the transportation security officers union is under attack. And thankfully, a court injunction has kept TSA's union in place.
▶ 2:20:55Most recently, the secretary openly defied the court order and tried to disband TSA's union for a second time. Last week, the court said those actions plainly defy its injunction and order the secretary to keep TSA's collective bargaining agreement in place or risk contempt. My question to you, um, acting administrator, is this.
▶ 2:21:25Um, will you commit to abiding by the court's order to keep the TSA's collective bargaining agreement in place?
▶ 2:21:38Uh, Congressman, every step that we've taken to date, uh, and we will continue to since I control the time, if I may, This question can be answered with a yes or a no. And if it's anything less than a yes or a no, I will assume you mean no. So now back to you again. Will you commit to honoring a court's order? A court's order. A court's order.
▶ 2:22:04When when you when you don't honor court's orders and you're the secretary, you could be impeached. So now, will you commit to honoring the court's order? Yes.
▶ 2:22:16Thank you. And I'm pleased that you said yes because the secretary needs to confer with you. She needs your advice. The secretary quite frankly um is probably being influenced by the president. This disobeying court orders is something that is antithetical to the Uh the courts are there for a reason.
▶ 2:22:43And if we can disobey court orders, we no longer have a constitution that we can count on. You're defacing, demeaning, and and denigrating the Constitution when this happens. Not you personally. You've already said yes, and I'm grateful to you for saying yes, but that's what's happening.
▶ 2:23:01And I can assure you people are growing tired of seeing what's happening in terms of the lawlessness emanating from this uh this this department. They're they're growing tired of it. What happened to Miss Good is something that people are not going to forget.
▶ 2:23:26And for the secretary and others to contend that she was a domestic terrorist is beyond comprehension without even having investigated immediately.
▶ 2:23:40Uh this was a Christian woman with children according to her wife they had whistles and they indicated that the had pistols as evidenced by the fact that she's no longer with us. People are getting fed up with this behavior and the justifications for lawlessness.
▶ 2:24:11We must return to the rule of law. And one of the ways to return to the rule of law is to enforce the law. And one of the laws that we can use to make sure the rule of law prevails is This secretary is putting herself in harm's way as it relates to impeachment.
▶ 2:24:37Not a physicality, but in terms of how she is conducting herself in office. And my guess is if she is not very careful, she may become the first secretary to be removed from office. Uh we have a long runway here. It doesn't end at the end of this year. There's a long runway.
▶ 2:24:59So, I'm going to beg you to counsel with her and help her to better understand that the law prevails and she is not the law and neither is the president. I yield back the balance of my time.
▶ 2:25:11Gentleman yields back. I now recognize a gentleman from Oklahoma, Mr. Keane, for five minutes questions.
▶ 2:25:15Thank you, Mr. Chairman. To our witnesses, thank you. Um, as typical in Washington, some of us having to shift in and shift out because of scheduling conflicts. I am certain because I heard some of the commentaries I walked in, some of what we're going to be discussing on my part is a little bit redundant.
▶ 2:25:31Please forgive me because I did miss some of the prior discussion um relative to SISA and um the the weaponization that many felt like through the social uh component, social media. Um I just want to make this is just a statement. This is kind of a rhetorical statement.
▶ 2:25:51That is something of major concern to us that under this administration, we continue to pay attention to that and make sure that our government is not um allowing that to continue that we saw in in years past. That said, and moving on for TSA and for the oversight we're conducting with the World Cup, with the Olympics, I know Director McNeil that you are, you know, very much attuned to um what's ahead, the high
▶ 2:26:21volume, the international traffic. Um, look, the heightened threat level, the landscape that we had in this hearing months ago because of the illegal population that was let in by the prior administration, there is a different threat landscape and um whether it be the biometric security screening, Real ID enforcement, the gaps in that. It's it's been astounding to me to find out the number of states that are allowing Real ID compliant driver's license.
▶ 2:26:49I've had some state elected officials show me how that is in the past played out to where by the way the prior administration was implementing parole and the work permit and process that real ID compliant driver's licenses were being handed to those who were here illegally.
▶ 2:27:08And so to be able to and I by your response I I'm taking uh it for granted that you may have not heard this before but it's something I would very much like some feedback for our office to obtain where we're at on ensuring that with Real ID coming into compliance this year and all the objections and I was one of them on the state level that if we have that type of possibility of illegal aliens getting a Real ID compliant driver's license what a major security concern that All right,
▶ 2:27:38I want to shift over. I know you've talked about the Somalian incident, the cash, you've you've talked about um you know, in terms of what you all are doing. My question on that is when was it when were you all as an agency made aware um that that this was happening? What what was the timeline of of the millions of dollars that you know flown through the um airport security system? What timing did you all become aware of this? Um, I believe that the reporting started uh back in 2017.
▶ 2:28:082017. Okay. Um, okay. The with the World Cup uh with the Olympics. I'm I'm about to say something that I'm I'm going to make sure my words are precise and give you a chance to kind of think this thing through because there's an element to this just for national security The DHS Inspector General released a report on November 1st, 2025 on its independent covert testing of TSA checkpoint
▶ 2:28:38screening to see how effective it is at preventing threat items from being brought onto commercial We cannot publicly talk about the contents of that report due to the sensitivity of the information. But let me ask you generally, are you aware of the report? Have you read it? When did you receive it? Uh yes uh yes to both of your first questions and uh last November.
▶ 2:29:03Okay. And do you agree with the findings and recommendations of that report?
▶ 2:29:08Um and I I do and it's not anything that actually we didn't know already and fully consider in in our security
▶ 2:29:15Um would you commit to providing this committee with results of any follow-up analysis conducted by TSA related to this report? uh we would be glad to have a briefing on this topic uh in in the proper classified environment.
▶ 2:29:29Thank you. Transition to another little little uh different direction here. Many travelers are confused by TSA's facial screening practices. Can you please clarify whether this is mandatory or
▶ 2:29:41It is uh it is absolutely voluntary. Uh we have signage at our checkpoints that uh notify the passengers of that and if they don't opt in, there are alternate procedures that they go through. So it is 100% voluntary. And with the 25 seconds I have le left, would you say what would you say to travelers who are concerned about their biometric data being retained as a result of that process?
▶ 2:30:03Uh I would say that we don't retain the data that um is captured at the checkpoint. It's solely for the purpose of identification at that point in time as they traverse through the checkpoint.
▶ 2:30:10Thank you very much. Thank you panel. I yield Mr. Chairman.
▶ 2:30:14Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from New York, Mr. Goldman, for five minutes.
▶ 2:30:18Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, it is good that we're having a full committee hearing here. I I appreciate uh you calling this uh this hearing. Uh, of course, it relates to nothing that we have an urgent need to do oversight on.
▶ 2:30:34Um we do not have uh acting director Lions here when what we're seeing around the country is a mass secret agency drag net using violence against American citizens and others. And it's bewildering to me because I I know the chairman is is a a very good person. We work together uh on legislation.
▶ 2:31:04In fact, I'm optimistic we will pass the Zadroga Act uh together um to make sure that 9/11 survivors uh have certainty and security in their healthc care.
▶ 2:31:17But I know I know that you and your colleagues cannot possibly be okay watching secret masked ICE agents barging into homes without a warrant, pulling American citizens out in their stopping American citizens on the streets and demanding their citizenship.
▶ 2:31:46And that of course is not even to mention the violence and Renee Good's murder as well as everything else we're seeing. There is a urgent urgent need to conduct oversight from this committee of the Department of Homeland Security, but it is not the Science and Technology Directorate. It is not the Cyber Security and Infrastructure Security Agency. It is not the TSA.
▶ 2:32:11All of which are very important agencies and certainly do very important work. I am not disparaging the work you all do. But the urgency in this country right now is what's going on with ICE. Why are we having a hearing with Department of Homeland Security officials who do know nothing about ICE? We get such misinformation from this Department of Homeland Security. We're told, "Oh, it's the worst.
▶ 2:32:42It's the murderers. It's the in our home state." Mr. Chairman, of the 202 of the 30 of the 3,212 people ICE arrested in New York City in 2025 up through October 15th, had no pending criminal charges and no criminal convictions.
▶ 2:33:1215% had pending criminal charges, which of course with due process would have to play out before they are removed. 15% were convicted criminals and 5% had serious felonies. That is not the worst of the worst. That is what we should be doing oversight of.
▶ 2:33:30But since we do have the TSA here, Miss I want to ask you about this new policy that uh my understanding is you have implemented where you are the TSA rather is providing uh information to ICE to assist them with the deportation effort. Um you're familiar with what I'm referring to? I
▶ 2:34:01Um, and just to be clear, this this was a new policy implemented under this administration. Correct.
▶ 2:34:08It is not new policy to share information between the agencies of the Department of Homeland Security. Past administrations have shared information.
▶ 2:34:15No, that's not what I asked. Is it is it the is it a new policy that the TSA sends identification information of of all passengers to ICE so that they can check for potential deportation orders.
▶ 2:34:30That is uh that is not uh what is occurring. Uh we don't send the information uh to ICE. We help ICE check against information and yes absolutely we do that. Um, and we are supporting the mission of our colleagues at the Department of Homeland Security. Uh, and that includes enforcement of immigration laws. And um,
▶ 2:34:49can I can I just because I have a little time, can I ask you um, in last year, Secretary Gnome said that the uh, Biden administration allowed immigrants who are in our country illegally to jet around the country without identification? Uh, is that true? They had no identification, but yet they were able to get on an airplane.
▶ 2:35:11I can't speak to what occurred before um you know this administration took place, but as you know, we started enforcing Real ID last year, which is a law that was passed by Congress over 20 years ago. And
▶ 2:35:22just cuz I'm running out of time, is it your is it your view that the Biden administration said it's okay for people to go on airplanes without identification? I've never been on an airplane without identification, but it's Was it okay in the Biden administration? Apparently, they were uh it was loud.
▶ 2:35:38Apparently, because Secretary Gnome said it, you ought to be careful what you testify to, and I yield back.
▶ 2:35:44Gentleman's time is expired. I now recognize a gentleman from Pennsylvania, McKenzie, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 2:35:50Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to all the testifiers for being here today. Obviously, each of you cover very important agencies, and having you here is critical to the work we do as a Homeland Security Committee. I'm going to focus my questions uh to Ms. McNeel. Uh, the TSA is an important agency that keeps all Americans safe. And first, I'd like to commend our local TSA agents at the AB uh, Lehi Valley International Airport.
▶ 2:36:18They just went through the highest record and busiest year in history at the Lehi Valley International Airport. over a million passengers moved through successfully uh and safely and we thank all of them for their work especially uh during a Democrat-led shutdown where they were not being paid for a period of time. We thank them for for their service and their work. Uh two things that I would like to highlight.
▶ 2:36:40First is ways that you were actually reforming the administration to move passengers through more quickly and improve the passenger experience. One of those is the families on the-fly initiative and can you speak to that and how that program works? What you're doing to help families uh typically with children under the age of 12 uh to not only move them through more expeditiously but also speed up lines for for everybody else.
▶ 2:37:06Uh thank you Congressman Mackenzie for that question. Uh Families on the Fly is an initiative that we rolled out last year in support of American families traveling through our airports. It dedicates a lane um a specific lane for families uh that that go through the checkpoint. Um you know, as as many of us know, when you travel with children, there's a lot of gear and equipment that gets brought through. And so it provides a wider lane, easier access for families to go through and extra assistance to screen uh all of the their gear that they bring through.
▶ 2:37:35And it has the added benefit actually to driving down weight times in uh non-family lanes as well. And so uh you know, it's been a win-win for everyone. and we're really happy to be able to support uh families traveling through our airports.
▶ 2:37:48Well, thank you for that. It's an important uh improvement to make in the agency. Obviously, uh a lot of people outside of AB have difficult experiences with TSA and while it should be predominantly and primarily focused on safety and security. Uh we it is also a customer service facing organization and we want to improve that experience. Uh so I think there are lots of great ways that we can coordinate to make sure uh that passengers have the best experience possible. The second thing I would like to focus on relates to the last administration.
▶ 2:38:17So I understand you may not be in a position to share all all the uh information that I'm looking for here. If you don't have the information, I would ask that you do follow up with committee uh with Rick and documentation of the information that we do have. And what it relates to is during the last administration, there was something that was commonly referred to as ghost flights where illegal immigrants in this country were being moved on planes across the country to different locations. Many times it was minors.
▶ 2:38:44The last administration then proceeded to lose thousands of minors that were supposed to be in their custody. And when we went to our local airports and other airports in the region and asked for documentation of who was on those flights, they could not provide any ma manifests or logs of those flyers on the plane. We couldn't get any information on these individuals, whether they were here legally or in some kind of protected status. We couldn't get any information on who paid for those flights.
▶ 2:39:12Many of those people were in the country illegally though we know uh based on some of the information that was shared publicly uh from the last administration where they just said that it was people that were minors here in the country illegally and being moved to a different location. So those individuals do not have proper documentation. So the last questioner asked if people were being moved on flights without proper identification. The answer is undoubtedly yes. We know that for a fact.
▶ 2:39:39And so my question to you is what information, what has this department of DHS done under this administration to look into those transgressions that occurred in the last administration, those ghost flights? Uh what can we now share with the public about what was going on, who was paying for them, who was on those flights? And again, if you don't have that information, I would ask that you uh look into it and get back to us with as much detailed information as possible.
▶ 2:40:06even if it has to be anonymized so that no individual uh information is disclosed. But that program and that activity uh is is highly egregious and very concerning for the American people.
▶ 2:40:17Uh what I can say is that uh under no circumstances would that happen under this administration and uh the initiatives that we've rolled out of at our airports. uh namely under the leadership of the secretary, we've rolled out Real ID, uh a law that was passed 20 years ago that really does enforce identity verification standards at our checkpoints. Um I mentioned early on in my in my statement, identity verification is a cornerstone of our aviation security system. Knowing who is uh accessing our aircrafts is critical to our security posture.
▶ 2:40:47Um and I'm happy to get back to you on on the details of of uh the scenario that you you raised earlier. Please do look into those ghost flights. Uh it's something that again should not have been occurring, should not occur going forward. Uh I know it wouldn't stand under this administration. So, but any information you can shed on what the last administration was doing incorrectly would be helpful for us going forward. Thank you and I yield
▶ 2:41:10Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Virginia, Miss Wenshaw, for five minutes questions.
▶ 2:41:16Thank you, Chairman Garberino, for convening today's hearing and for our witnesses for joining us. Last week, I visited Minnesota with 27 other members of the House where we heard from community leaders and members about the brutal masked secret police that have been unleashed in their streets. They've shackled peaceful protesters, pulled guns on children, dragged pregnant mothers, and as we all know, shot an unarmed mother in the face.
▶ 2:41:44Just yesterday in Minnesota, we heard from local law enforcement leaders that their offduty officers, United States citizens have been targeted by ICE. Had the department honored the committee's request, and I appreciate the chairman for making the request for acting ICE director Lions to testify today, I and I think others would have questioned him directly about his role in escalating tensions by deploying thousands of
▶ 2:42:14masked immigration officers, I should say masked and minimally trained immigration officers in Minnesota. Uh, with that said, I want to just discuss another one of this administration's failures. Last year, President Trump's Doge and its chainsaw wiped out 72,000 federal jobs just here in the national capital region, which includes the district in Virginia that I represent, including a lot of cyber professionals.
▶ 2:42:43These are patriotic Americans who chose a career of public service and instead they were fired, pushed out, or moved to support this administration's mass deportation effort that's currently, as I noted, harassing US citizens, including law enforcement officers in Minnesota.
▶ 2:43:02SISA, as we know, is a lead agency to defend and mitigate against threats to our cyber and physical infrastructure, lost a third of its One year ago at SISA, much of its career workforce was bullied into quitting. They were threatened with riffs that would not come with any severance. So-called probationary employees were fired.
▶ 2:43:26In the recent government shutdown, some CISA staff even received the illegal riff notices, and court after court after court has determined that those riffs, attempted riffs, were illegal. Others were moved to ICE or to CBP or told they'd be fired if they didn't accept their transfer orders.
▶ 2:43:43SISA has cut support to critical partners like the multi-state ISAC and the election infrastructure ISAC while the department has dismantled key oversight and prevention efforts including eliminating the cyber safety review board and the leaders behind the pre-ransomware notification and secure by design initiatives have left at a time of persistent and growing cyber threats from malign foreign actors.
▶ 2:44:12These choices by the president and the secretary have weakened our defenses and left our critical systems and infrastructure more exposed and the American people more vulnerable. Dr. Gutu Makala, has CISA conducted an to prove that its current staffing level levels enable mission delivery? Have you done that analysis?
▶ 2:44:37Congressman, thank you for the question. Um, please allow me to clarify. I think um capability somehow I think um the narrative comes across in the media as these 800 people just left overnight. That's not the case. This is a workforce transition program. People who participated in the program did so voluntarily. And um yeah, I don't I don't agree with that, but just answer the question, please. Have you conducted an analysis to prove that your current staffing levels today enable you to accomplish your mission?
▶ 2:45:07Where is that Congressman, um the the work that we do is mission focused which means capability is measured by outcomes not headcount and CISA remains fully operational from what we do from securing the nations from
▶ 2:45:22So you have not conducted an analysis. Is there an analysis you can provide to the committee to determine you can meet your mission with the workforce you have
▶ 2:45:31Congressman, we support every single statutory authority given to us and we support every single one of that for the
▶ 2:45:37Okay. that has not been compromised by
▶ 2:45:39okay so there is no analysis funding for the multi-state ISAC has been eliminated I referenced it I'm sure you know a lot about it the center provided no cost services for cashstrapped state and local governments especially small local governments in rural communities who don't have the ability to do to do this on their own has the threat landscape against state and local governments diminished or increased over the past year has it gone up or down
▶ 2:46:06congressman thank you for the And again um consistent with all ISACs there is no federal funding but we do work with all the ISACs in working releasing the joint uh security products. We deployed automated communication for the joint cyber communic joint cyber defense collaborative expanding the real-time
▶ 2:46:27You've managed to answer none of my questions. You haven't answered a single question but thank you for coming.
▶ 2:46:31Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from California Mr. Fong for five minutes of questions. Uh thank you, Mr. Chair. Um thank you to the panelists uh for uh for the work that you do. Uh I want to start with um uh with Under Secretary Aende. Um the threats our nation faces required us to continue developing new technological capabilities.
▶ 2:46:53Um specifically my district is home to the Naval Air Weapons Station China Lake, which supports the Navy's research, development, acquisition, and testing and evaluation um of advanced weapon systems. Recently, the Department of Homeland Security Science and Technology Directorate in coordination with the US Coast Guard and the Naval Air War warfare center weapons division at China Lake tested a contactless vessel stopping capability prototype that uses uh high energy radio frequencies to safely stop small non-compliant vessels,
▶ 2:47:24which is an exciting new development. How do S&T's uh partnerships with key military bases enhance testing and development efforts? That's right. Thank you, Congressman, for the question. Um, at S&T, we take a a whole of component, whole of DHS approach to understanding the needs and requirements and we take a whole of government approach uh to reduce uh duplication and create efficiencies.
▶ 2:47:48Uh, often some of the systems that are developed for other departments including the department of war may have a civilian application uh or the core technology may be transferable. Um obviously they're very different mission sets. Uh but uh the the the technology you're referring to [snorts] uh is very promising. Um we we would like to do some continued testing on it to make sure that it is it is um suitable for deployment.
▶ 2:48:12Uh but it is a a concern that I heard both um in my engagements with Coast Guard and from CBP and others uh in my trip to California this past
▶ 2:48:22Well, you're always welcome in California. So, uh, certainly if you're in in the area, please, uh, we'd love to we'd love to roll out the red carpet for you. Um, I wonder if you can describe how S&T is working with private with private sector vendors to ensure technologies being developed, procured, and deployed or up-to-date, incorporate the latest innovations, and avoid becoming obsolete before they are fielded. So, what does the procurement process look like? Are there changes that need to be made?
▶ 2:48:46Um certainly as as mentioned before we have major special events occurring in the United States with the World Cup and the Olympics um and and the celebration of of America's 250th birthday. Um how can we facilitate the spread of these techn technologies and and deploy them ahead of these events and for any uh threat that
▶ 2:49:07Sure. Thank you for the question. Um the private sector is able to address a number of problems that um government just really could not do on its own uh in in many aspects. Um and it it's it's generally wise to uh look for those technologies and the applications that they might be suitable for. Um we do that um soup to nuts at the department. We're always looking for opportunities to bring in existing technologies.
▶ 2:49:30Um I guess my answer to you is if there's something that that can be applied our preference will be to uh either adopt it or adapt it for our use um rather than going through a long um research development timeline. Now in fairness there are those areas where there is no private sector market and in those instances it's it's suitable for us to to take lead on that.
▶ 2:49:54C can you expound on that? what what type of capabilities I mean is there does a demand signal have to be provided for the private sector to to address some of the the department needs or is it something that is solely focused within the department that you just prefer to have it in house?
▶ 2:50:11I'd say there's there's two sets of demand signals. There's something that the private sector has developed with a private market in mind that may have a very uh good government application and then there's the the alternative which is something that is a almost uniquely government niche that ultimately has a private sector application. Uh and in those instances we'd be looking to do tech transfer uh at the earliest possible moment. Um and that's private sector uh for the components our our you know operational delivery is is our goal.
▶ 2:50:41And so by either method, we look to get out in the field.
▶ 2:50:46Do you have a particular time frame you look at when you're trying to deploy uh with with your processes in place? ASAP is really my preference. Um there's some nuance to that. Of course, you want to make sure that it is uh properly tested, evaluated, and uh in a position to be deployed. Uh and we have very smart people that get after that issue.
▶ 2:51:09Sure. Well, I know that when it comes to the threats uh that that our country faces, the technology is going to be critically important for us to address that both on the private sector side and and on the research and development side. So, any way we can facilitate the deployment of promising technologies, uh please let us know. And with that, I yield back.
▶ 2:51:29Gentleman yields back. I now recognize a gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Van Eps, for five minutes of questions.
▶ 2:51:34Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for sharing with us today. This department is tasked with the most sacred mission to protect the American homeland. Our witnesses today represent vital aspects of that mission and I'm grateful for your time. I'm going to build off of my uh my colleagues questions. Uh Mr. Mr. Ayande um S&T's Office of Safety Act implementation, OSAI, plays an important role in mitigating litigation risk to incentivize the private sector to acquire and deploy anti-terrorism technologies.
▶ 2:52:04Building off of uh previous questions, what additional resources, if any, does OSAI require in order to process applications for designated and certified anti-terrorism technologies at a speed sufficiently appropriate to keep pace with emerging threats and technologies?
▶ 2:52:23Thank you, Congressman, for the question. Um, I would I would like to ask for a uh an opportunity to come back and and brief you on this. Um, I can tell you we uh we currently have a a large number of applications pending. We've had a 50% increase in applications which we attribute to uh FIFA LA 2028 and America 250. Uh [snorts] and uh we are working very diligently to get through those. Uh I have some time actually scheduled towards the end of this week to uh see how many we can get through.
▶ 2:52:52Um but but certainly it is it is top of mind and and not something that we take lightly.
▶ 2:52:57Great. Thank you. uh to and to what extent does OSAI perform evaluations of technologies that have already received safety act certifications or other safety act designations to ensure that these technologies remain effective at mitigating terrorist acts and is OSAI adequately resourced to complete necessary re-evaluation processes in a timely fashion.
▶ 2:53:22Thank you Congressman. Uh there are different sets of certifications uh that are offered by OSAI and each of these is on a renewal review period. Um so we periodically uh revisit the applications. Uh there's a whole host of requirements that that are part of that including could include evaluations of sites and so on. Um so yeah we we we we do try to keep with the times and and the emerging threats if that's that's a I think that answers your
▶ 2:53:51Great. Thank you. Pivoting here, U and this will be uh for administrator McNeel. Uh TSA announced at the end of last year that passengers who do not present a real ID or acceptable form of ID at the TSA security checkpoint would have to pay a $45 fee for a 10-day travel authorization under a new program called confirm ID, which we've talked about some today.
▶ 2:54:15Um, with the new program um, starting February 1st, the committee has concerns about whether TSA um, holds the requisite authority to levy this fee and build out a contract for an alternative travel authorization system. Can you please explain to the committee why this confirm ID proc program is necessary?
▶ 2:54:36how this program uh does not go against TSA's goal to enforce Real ID compliance and uphold identification security since it would allow individuals without proper identification to still travel simply by paying the fee.
▶ 2:54:49Thank you for your uh question, Congressman. When we rolled out uh enforcement of Real ID in May of 2025, um we saw approximately 93% compliance rate. Today it's around 94%. Um the confirm ID is really meant to address the continuing non-compliant population. So about 6% of what we see through our airports um every day. Uh it's been 20 years since Congress passed this law.
▶ 2:55:15And uh you know for f folks to show up with a non-compliant ID is a draw on our resources operationally. Um and so uh and and that cost today is borne by the taxpayer. And so the fee is really meant to defay the cost of us processing people um who don't show up with the acceptable form of ID, ensure that they do not pose a threat to our skies um and have the fee borne by the non-compliant
▶ 2:55:41And could you just talk a little bit about how TSA determined that $45 would cover the cost of a travel travel authorization for a passenger without an acceptable ID? Um I I believe the original uh amount considered was $18.
▶ 2:55:55Absolutely. So um you know with uh any any fee that we issue there is a a fee study that we conduct. Um there was a realization that uh you know we did not include all of the costs in the initial assessment. That's part of our fee revision process. Um and you know we will do so on a recurrent basis to ensure that the the fee reflects the cost of carrying out that program.
▶ 2:56:15Great. Thank you. Uh Mr. Chairman I yield back.
▶ 2:56:18Thank you very much. Gentlemen yields back. I will now entertain uh and I appreciate my colleagues wait until the end. I'll entertain you um motions.
▶ 2:56:25Uh thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I ask unanimous consent to introduce into the record a staffing chart provided by CISA that shows 65 employees have been transferred out of CISA in management directed reassignments since January 20 uh 25, January 20th, 2025.
▶ 2:56:50and that CISA has lost 998 employees since January 20, 2025, nearly onethird of its total personnel. Further, I ask unanimous consent to include in the record two articles describing how TSA and CISA are contributing to ISIS deportation push on behalf of Mrs. Ramirez.
▶ 2:57:18Without objection. Well, I want to thank you all the witnesses for for being here today and um one of the main things we do here is oversight and this was the first of many hearing and uh you all run very important departments uh under Department of Homeland Security. Um and I appreciate your your willingness and your time coming here today. Uh and the members of the committee may have some additional questions. I know I do. Uh and we would ask that all the witnesses respond to these in writing.
▶ 2:57:48Pursuant to committee rule 7E, the hearing record will be held open for 10 10 days. Without objection, this committee stands