▶ 0:14:24Okay. Uh, there are a lot of committees going on today and I know we have a a service for Congressman LaMalfa as well. So, we're going to try to kick things off here. Um, this subcommittee on workforce protections will come to order. I notice that a quorum is present. Is it present? Uh, without objection, the chair is authorized to call a recess at any time. Today's hearing will focus on AI and other advanced technologies which are improving efforts to keep America's workers safe and healthy.
▶ 0:14:54AI-powered safety tools are moving safety management from reactive incident-based approach to a preventive data-driven model. Wearable sensors on personal protective equipment can monitor hazards like heat stress or exposure to hazardous materials and alert workers before conditions become dangerous.
▶ 0:15:12Predictive analytics can where accidents are most likely to catching hazards before those hazards lead to accidents rather than Understanding how these technologies work will help Congress better understand how they can be used to address workplace safety. The impact could be immense.
▶ 0:15:32Fewer injuries mean fewer healthy Fewer injuries mean healthier workers, increased worker recruitment and retention, lower costs, and stronger business operations, all while ensuring America's workers receive the highest standard of safety on the job. We also know where there is new new technology, there are important considerations to go with it.
▶ 0:15:53Whether it is AI today or another groundbreaking techno- or another groundbreaking technology that has emerged in the past, employers take necessary steps to understand best practices and proper implementation. These tools can be invaluable for augmenting worker safety, but they there must be space for human oversight and employers should be wary of delegating ultimate responsibility for worker safety to AI. Moving forward, the adoption of these technologies raises important questions.
▶ 0:16:24How can the effectiveness of these tools be validated? How can all parties involved, including employers, employees, and unions, understand the technologies role as part of safety practices? What safeguards are necessary to protect privacy while still allowing meaningful data collection and analysis? These questions affect directly affect trust, adoption, and long-term success.
▶ 0:16:48As we've heard throughout the this committee's series of AI hearings, effective policy must strike a careful balance between considering these questions without stifling innovation and compromising our nation's technological competitiveness. In the context of AI systems designed to protect workers on job sites, there is no margin for error and one oversight can be the difference between life and death.
▶ 0:17:12Ultimately, AI and advanced technologies offer the opportunity to make workplaces safer than ever before. By balancing protection with progress, technology can improve productivity and and actively protect people across industries. I look forward to hearing from today's witnesses to understand the real-world applications and impact of these technologies. With that, I yield to the ranking member for her opening Thank you, Mr.
▶ 0:17:42Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. Automation is not a distant theory. It is already embedded in hiring, scheduling, surveillance, and safety systems. Right now, employers are making decisions that will shape working conditions for millions of people, often without sufficient transparency, worker input, or guardrails. Automation is not new.
▶ 0:18:07However, there is a relatively new way of talking about it with the advent of artificial intelligence or AI. This term is sometimes used to tell story about automation as both a future that we cannot escape and a race that we must win at all costs.
▶ 0:18:25But underneath this story is a very small number of powerful companies with access to massive amounts of data and computing And the lessons we are supposed to learn is almost always the same, the government must stay out of the way and keep its hands off AI. But we do need government to act. From invasive surveillance systems to dangerous work speed quotas, the workplace risks posed by these automated technologies are real and immediate.
▶ 0:18:56And under the Trump administration, we have seen an eagerness to grant Big Tech corporations unprecedented access to Americans' data while rolling back guidance intended to protect workers and promote workplace safety. Weakening those protections does not drive innovation. It shifts risk onto workers and their families, making our communities and our markets worse off in the long run.
▶ 0:19:21At the same time, automation and advanced technologies can help make workplaces safer when developed responsibly. A fully funded National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health could lead the way in ensuring these tools are used to protect workers rather than harm them. Strong safety standards can usually foster innovation. One well-known example is OSHA's standard on cotton dust.
▶ 0:19:47As a result of that standard, not only did fewer textile workers develop brown lung disease, but the industry also became more productive and efficient. State governments also play a critical role. About half of our states receive federal funding to enforce OSHA standards and their state plan agencies can set standards for hazards that OSHA has not addressed.
▶ 0:20:13State health and safety agencies can be leaders in developing important safeguards against technology-related hazards, especially since OSHA's rulemaking process can take anywhere from 5 to 12 years. It is also not too late for Congress to do its job and There is already introduced bills that I urge our committee to consider, such as Representative Norcross's Warehouse Workers Protection Act and my bill with Representative Jayapal, the Empowering App-Based Workers Act.
▶ 0:20:43We must take an active role in shaping how AI is inte- integrated into American workplaces. AI should be a tool that improves workers' lives by making jobs safer and more sustainable. That means ensuring workers' safety is prioritized from the start instead of being treated as an afterthought once the harm has already occurred. Finally, as we continue discussing AI, we must look beyond the workplace and consider the broader impact on communities.
▶ 0:21:14The data centers that power AI and other technologies consume enormous amounts of energy, which can strain uh aging infrastructure, drive up electricity bills, and have adverse effects on the environment. Our constituents deserve greater transparency and accountability about resource use, community benefit agreements that ensure residents share in economic gains, and a real seat at the table as AI develop- development expands.
▶ 0:21:42But the truth is, none of this works if we continue to hollow out our federal agencies responsible for protecting workers and communities. My Republican colleagues like to talk about government efficiency, but then go about it in the most chaotic ways. Recklessly fil- firing safety inspectors, slashing capacity across our enforcement agencies only makes workers less safe and businesses less certain about the rules they need to follow.
▶ 0:22:10If AI is going to reshape our economy in the coming years, then we need to make sure that workers and communities truly benefit from and not just bear the cost of this technology boom. Because when we unleash technology without guardrails, workers will always pay the price. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield back. I thank the gentle lady.
▶ 0:22:32Uh pursuant to committee rule 8C, all members who wish to insert written statements into the record may do so by submitting them to the committee clerk electronically in Microsoft Word format by 5:00 p.m. today, 14 days after this excuse me, 14 days after this hearing.
▶ 0:22:50Without objection, the hearing record will remain open for 14 days to allow such statements and other extraneous material noted during the hearing to be submitted for the official hearing And now to the introduction of Our first witness is is is Mr. Johan Land, the senior vice president of product and engineering, safety, and AI at Samsara in San Francisco, California. Our second witness is Mr.
▶ 0:23:19Eric Hoplin, the president and CEO of the National Association of Wholesaler Distributors here in Washington, D.C. Welcome. Our third witness is Mr. Douglas Parker, a senior advisor at the National Employment Law Project in New York City. Welcome this morning. Our final witness, Mr. Jeff Bucaloitz, uh the president and CEO of the Mason Contractors Association of America in Algonquin, Illinois. Welcome today.
▶ 0:23:50We want to thank all of our witnesses uh for being here today and we look forward to each of your testimonies. Pursuant to committee rules, I will ask that each of you limit your oral testimony to 3-minute summary of the written testimony which you have As committee members have many questions for you, the clock will count down from 3 minutes. Pursuant to committee rule 8D, the committee practice, however, we will not cut off your testimony until you reach the 5-minute mark.
▶ 0:24:21I would also like to remind the witnesses to be aware of their responsibility to provide accurate to the subcommittee and with that, I'll recognize our first witness today, Mr. Land, you're recognized for your Thank you so much. Chairman Walberg, ranking member Omar, members of the subcommittee, and thank you so much for the opportunity to testify here today.
▶ 0:24:43We appreciate the committee's focus on workplace safety and the opportunity to share how proven deployable AI technologies are already improving conditions for millions of frontline workers and how thoughtful policy can help accelerate those benefits. While the public conversation around artificial intelligence has focused largely on quality generative text or office productivity, the most consequential impact of AI is happening far away from the desks.
▶ 0:25:10It is happening in the physical operations, on the road, on job sites, or on airport tarmacs. And these are the jobs that power the economy and move our goods. They are jobs where risk is constant and the cost of failure is not pecuniary. It's injury or loss of life. Also, Samsara, um we build connected AI-powered technologies for physical operations and our customers span transportation, logistics, construction, utilities, and public sector agencies.
▶ 0:25:39And sectors that represent more than 40% of global GDP and millions of Americans workers performing some of the most dangerous jobs in the economy. And we work with some of the world's most complex logistical transportation and infrastructure companies and public sector agencies that keep this country running. And we have seen firsthand that in these environments, AI is not an abstract concept. It's a task-based, situational, and preventative tool.
▶ 0:26:06And our platform combines sensors and AI-powered video to turn real-time data into actionable safety insights, detecting distracted driving, alerting ground crews to unsafe conditions on the tarmac, and protecting lone workers to ensure they are not invisible when something goes wrong. And this means fewer crashes, fewer injuries, higher retention, and safer workplaces for millions of frontline workers.
▶ 0:26:29For instance, we work with the city of Allentown and Bethlehem Public Works in Pennsylvania to ensure city services are delivered efficiently while keeping drivers safe. But technology alone is not enough. The greatest safety gains occurs when detection is paired with skills development. And instead of hours of generic training, AI also enables targeted coaching based on actual events.
▶ 0:26:54Workers receive timely, personalized feedback that fits into their day and addresses the specific behavior that matters the most. Consider for a second commercial Vehicles can weigh 80,000 lb and operate at highway speeds. Nearly 42,000 Americans die on US roads each year. And in a recent sur- survey that we did of 1,500 professional drivers, 79% of them reported experiencing a close call due to distraction in the past year.
▶ 0:27:25An AI-enabled safety system directly address these risks. So, across Samsara customers, fleets using AI safety technology see an aggregated 37% reduction in crashes within 6 months, a 96% reduction in mobile phone usage while driving, and a 69% increase uh decrease in harsh driving events. And these are measurable operational outcomes and importantly, these are workplaces, even if they're not always thought of it that way.
▶ 0:27:54The same principles apply beyond the road. Um and ranking member Omar, at the Minneapolis-Saint Paul International Airport, our asset tracking and AI cameras give operations teams the visibility needed to coordinate responses and keep runway operations and crews safe.
▶ 0:28:11And elsewhere across the country, in construction and field services, AI-enabled wearables and fall detection ensure that if a lone worker faces danger, help can be dispatched Now, technology expectations in the workforce are also changing.
▶ 0:28:27And in a survey of leaders overseeing 5 and 1/2 million workers, 85% said that a modern, tech-forward approach makes frontline careers more Safety technology also improve retention. And after deploying Samsara across thousands of vehicles, DHL, a Samsara customer, saw a 60% drop in harsh driving events, but also a 50% increase in driver retention.
▶ 0:28:56That is, when workers feel protected, they stay. So, AI is not the future promise. It is improving workplace safety today where the risk is the highest. And with thoughtful policy, we can expand these proven tools to protect more workers across America and we look forward to working with Congress to do so. So, I want to thank you so much and look forward to your questions. Thank you. Uh now, Mr. Hoplin, we recognize you for your testimony. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 0:29:25Chairman, ranking member Omar, members of the committee. Uh my name is Eric Hoplin, I'm the CEO of the National Association of Wholesaler Distributors. We call it NAW and we represent the entire wholesale distribution industry in America. It's about 35,000 companies and they're moving products and goods through the supply chain every single day. Uh all told, we account for about 1/3 of America's GDP and we employ more than 6-million Americans. And I have the privilege of every week I'm in a different distribution center or warehouse and they come in all shapes and sizes.
▶ 0:29:56But but really what differentiates these distribution centers are the products and the goods that move through them. So for example, you might be in one that specializes in large building materials. You might see pipes that are the size of this room. You might see huge sheets of metal. You might see pallets full of shingles, heavy shingles and everything in between. Other distribution centers have smaller building materials, tiny fasteners, screws, bolts, nails, everything everything you might might need to fasten something together. Other distribution centers they move medical equipment.
▶ 0:30:26Some move food. Some move grass and fertilizer and and and plants. You got furniture, everything that you can imagine that moves through the supply chain. And the reason why I'm describing it a little bit is to understand that no warehouse and no distribution center is alike because the weight of the things that are moved, the size of the things that are moved or the different mix of products that are moved mean that each warehouse or distribution center operates in in a different way.
▶ 0:30:53I will say though on the other hand there are two commonalities really that cross every distribution center in America. And and the first commonality is they're all run by people. I'd say that the workforce that is powering America's distribution industry is bar none the best workforce in the world. And and the second thing is every distribution center has a culture of safety. Every time I walk into a distribution center I receive a safety briefing.
▶ 0:31:18I receive some safety material before I walk in and you can tell within two or three steps inside a distribution center what the cultural safety norms are. Everybody is following them. Everybody is reinforcing them. And so this has been something that we've been doing for a long time is is having these established safety protocols.
▶ 0:31:35So as new technologies are coming online, artificial intelligence, one of the things we're very interested in as part of our safety culture is how can we harness these tools to enhance the safety of America's warehouses and and distribution centers. Now it's important to note that we're not the developers of this technology. We are the deployers of this technology and and we're finding that there's there's four main areas of AI that are helping to improve safety in in America's work in America's warehouses.
▶ 0:32:04The first is something called disembodied AI. It's AI that is scanning the entire environment of the distribution center to maybe spot in real time if there's a safety incident. Something abnormal is happening, they can alert us in real time or they can track this data over time and maybe make some recommendations for how we might change operations or things inside the distribution center to make them safer.
▶ 0:32:26The second is predictive AI and predictive AI is using data that can track machinery and other tools to see are they nearing the end of their life cycle? Is something different happening with maybe a forklift that its brakes are running low or running out and we should replace them before they run out and possibly cause a a safety incident. The third use of AI is human-centric AI. It's wearable technology.
▶ 0:32:52Maybe someone's wearing something on their hard hat, maybe in their vest or maybe it's a key fob that just gives them a little alert. Maybe it's a little pulse or a little tone that lets them know that an incident may be approaching that's unsafe or or maybe it's ergonomic in nature. If you're bending over in such a way or you're you're picking up something that's too heavy, want to prevent you from alert you that this might strain you in some way. And so we use it in that way.
▶ 0:33:16And then the final is automated assisted AI which is a retrieval system where we're using robots and and AI to bring the goods through the distribution center to stack them and to store them but to bring them ultimately to to the worker. So as as we go through the hearing and we talk about these in in in more detail, as you think about legislating or regulating the artificial intelligence, two things to keep in mind. Number one is one size doesn't fit all because every distribution center is is different.
▶ 0:33:45We think it's really important that we empower the local leaders who are partnering with their workforce to design the best environment that will be safe for for those those employees in the distribution center. And the second thing is too much regulation can be burdensome and expensive and it can increase the barrier to entry. Most distribution companies are small. They don't have a lot of capital to spend on artificial intelligence so don't make it harder for them to deploy that technology that can make their distribution centers safe.
▶ 0:34:13So in conclusion, we would say that all of us know that AI is changing the world in ways that many of us can't even fathom. But if there's one thing we do know, artificial intelligence is helping us to enhance the safety of America's warehouses. Thank you for the opportunity to testify and I look forward to your questions. Thank you Mr. Haplin. Mr. Parker, you're recognized for your testimony. Thank you.
▶ 0:34:36Thank you Chairman Walberg, Ranking Member Omar and members of the I appreciate the opportunity to be here today to testify on how artificial intelligence and other emerging technologies are affecting worker health and safety.
▶ 0:34:49For the last 15 years I have closely tracked emerging technology trends in occupational safety and health from the perspective of a regulator when I was Assistant Secretary at OSHA as well as at Cal/OSHA as an enforcer of safety and health standard and as a promoter of employer investment in safety and health. AI now dominates that conversation about new technology. It is a powerful tool with real potential to reduce injuries and illness.
▶ 0:35:16But if AI is not grounded in fundamental safety principles and an ethical framework, it can introduce significant physical and psychological hazards into the workplace. My testimony today will cover three First, to be clear I support new technologies to protect workers. I have witnessed how collaboration between government and the private sector has brought technology into the workplace that saves lives. However, many of the AI tools on the market today focus on modifying worker behavior instead of addressing the root cause of hazards.
▶ 0:35:47While these tools can be a helpful part of a safety program, the first question in addressing a workplace hazard is whether the danger can be eliminated, isolated or controlled through engineering. Skipping these steps and simply training workers to adapt to hazards makes workplaces less safe. And safety purposed AI should not be used to discipline employees. That undermines safety.
▶ 0:36:09Second, new technology should not introduce new hazards into the Algorithmic management tools that track worker activity can create physical and psychosocial hazards. Fear of surveillance, loss of privacy and anxiety about job loss affect mental Physical injuries and illness can result from production pressures that cause workers to skip needed rest breaks or work at unsafe speeds. These risks can be reduced through prevention by design.
▶ 0:36:35Practical strategies for prevention by design in AI include development of risk assessment tools, auditing standards and a safety certification process focused on ensuring technology does not harm And employees should have a seat at the table. Transparency and understanding are key. My final point today is that the government must build its capacity to understand and interact in an AI-enabled The question is not whether to regulate AI.
▶ 0:37:04It is how to prepare agencies to address the impacts of AI so that they can carry out their basic missions in an AI-enabled world. Thank you and I'm happy to answer any questions. Thank you Mr. Parker. And now Mr. I recognize you for your testimony.
▶ 0:37:21Thank you Chairman Chairman Walberg and Ranking Member Omar and members of the for for giving me the opportunity to participate in today's hearing exploring such an important topic, how we can use technology to keep our nation's employees safe and productive. My name is Jeff Berkowitz. I'm the president of the CEO of the Mason Contractors Association of America. I will represent a $41 billion industry that employs about 4 million employees all from coast to coast.
▶ 0:37:48When we got started, we were actually developing AI programs, AI safety programs for our employees. As an industry, we we decided we needed to build tools and programs that actually work specifically for the masonry industry. I tasked my team to go innovate and we have spent the past four years building George, a purpose-built AI system for the masonry industry.
▶ 0:38:12George is named after our first president of the MCA many years ago, about 76 years ago, and takes pictures and videos of job sites to immediately tell my members, their foremen and employees if their wall bracing plans and implementation meet safety regulations, safeguard job sites during the initial phase of the wall being assembled, and ensure in real time employee PPE compliance so that remedies are immediately implemented instead of focusing on a what what if or what happened after an accident has occurred,
▶ 0:38:42and be a virtual storehouse for best practices and safety regulations that can immediately be recalled at a moment's noticed. Over the next five years estimates are showing that the construction industry will lose over 40% of our workforce to Construction is hard working.
▶ 0:38:59We must embrace systems that not only keep our employees going home safe every night, but they can also use it used to increase productivity, keep the wear and tear of construction work to a minimum, allow longer careers, and allows them to safely complete their jobs more efficiently saving time and money. Technology is allowing young men and women who might otherwise not think or be think of or be able to join the masonry industry to join them to to actually join the masonry industry.
▶ 0:39:27Technology is ensuring our employees are working efficiently, productively and safely. Technology is a tool that can immediately change the landscape in how we train our employees, whether new to the industry or new to a best practice. Technology analysis has the potential to completely change the way we learn about job sites and what new equipment or practices are actually being utilized or not and why. The positives are endless.
▶ 0:39:55My one ask of you here today would be to partner with industry in a bipartisan manner to ensure that technology is use is encouraged in a responsible manner. Not to be used to punish, not to be used to replace workers, not to be used just to keep to be keeping and staying relevant, but used to increase employee safety and protection. Used to prolong careers and productivity, used to learn how employees go about their jobs and how they can conduct them in a safe in the safest way possible.
▶ 0:40:23We are sitting at the forefront of a truly groundbreaking moment, but for it to take off, we need partisanship between industry or partnership between industry and government. Thank you. I look forward to your questions. Thank you. I appreciate all of the opening statements and under committee rule nine, we will now ask questions of the witnesses and that'll be under the five-minute rule and I will recognize chairman of the full committee Mr. Walberg from Michigan first. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and thanks to the panel for being here.
▶ 0:40:54Uh Mr. Buckowitz, um industry work, to say the least, is filled and fraught with all sorts of challenges to keep workers and healthy uh and on the job. Uh what are some of the major challenges uh the construction industry's workforce is facing?
▶ 0:41:18So, the we we are have we do have a aging workforce and some of the things that AI and some of the the technology has produced is is is things that actually help us to prolong the careers and to keep them safer. Um one such uh So, not to take away their job, but to prolong it. To prolong it, yes, and to make and to make it easier and and not be such a long and a wear and tear on bodies in the construction industry.
▶ 0:41:42Um one such such a technology that's that's being created is something called the mule and it's a work assist apparatus that actually attaches to scaffold and will help you with heavier block and heavier stone uh and will take a lot of that weight and the lifting away. So, it does help prolong it. It makes it easier for for folks in the industry to to last a little longer.
▶ 0:42:06could you suggest for us or inform us even further on some of the technologies that help worker retention because that is a concern that AI would take away Yeah. The mule is one. Are there any others? Absolutely. There's a There's another product that's been developed. It's called an exoskeleton. You might be aware of them. They use them a lot in the in the healthcare industry.
▶ 0:42:28Again, this this the exoskeleton actually helps take away that weight and that lifting which obviously can extend careers and and and limit injuries. So, they're still working on on some some things to tweak it, but but the exoskeleton I think you'll see that down the road helping extend careers and and helping folks that might not traditionally work in the masonry industry actually work in Okay. Thank you. Mr.
▶ 0:42:53Lan, introducing new technology in workplace can be met with resistance, to say the least. It's change and change is Uh especially when it requires experienced workers to start over and relearn how to do their jobs in unique How are frontline workers generally responding to the introduction of your company's products? Yeah. Thank you so much for that question.
▶ 0:43:18And workers and drivers and they're instrumental to to the success of driving more safety. So, we work very closely to them and their response is overwhelmingly positive. In fact, retention is up by 50% from some of our customers and in in many cases, drivers get so attached to the the the safety that comes with the cameras that we introduced that they refuse to go back in the vehicles after having had an accident cuz they don't feel safe without it. It's instrumental.
▶ 0:43:49What are some of the the successful strategies that you've used to uh uh to get buy-in? Um as you said, they don't even want to go into another truck if it doesn't have On other issues, how do you get that buy-in? Yeah. Um thank you so much for that. A key thing is to really understand the drivers. What do every individual driver need coaching on and provide them with balanced coaching. Positive reinforcement.
▶ 0:44:14Figure out what are the things that they're doing right, highlighting them and balancing that with constructive improvements. That's a key thing to bring buy-in. Okay. Thank Mr. Haplin, um your written testimony mentioned several types of AI-powered technology such as disembodied AI, predictive analytics, and human-centered AI. How do these technologies work together to improve workforce safety in in your industry? Uh thank you for the question, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 0:44:44They work in unison. They work together because they address different parts of potential workplace safety risks. And so, what it ultimately creates is a layered approach to safety. So, for example, with the disembodied AI, it's monitoring the environment. As it's monitoring the environment in real time, can spot if there's an abnormality and if if we need to alert somebody that there's an immediate safety risk. With the predictive AI, it's monitoring it's uh tracking data. And so, the data is going to predict when something might happen so we can we can get ahead of that and and prevent that from happening.
▶ 0:45:15The human-centered AI is the wearables that that that employees are using. So, in that moment, they can find out if they if they're not using an exoskeleton, if something's going to be too heavy or if they're moving in in a way that ergonomically can can harm them. And so, they're addressing different parts of the risk and together they create a layered approach that makes ultimately the environment safer. Can the employee override some of these if they choose to for whatever reason? I believe that they do have those options to do that, but as as Mr.
▶ 0:45:42Parker pointed out, is those systems will be designed you working with the workforce of how should we implement them in in the distribution center and and so the employees will have a say in as before they deploy that technology. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Thank you. Next we'll go to ranking member Omar from Minnesota. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um in recent
▶ 0:46:07we have seen troubling examples of AI-enabled surveillance harming workers. Whole Foods reportedly used an internal heat map that ranked stores by uni- uni- union- unionization risk. And many warehouse um workers have criticized Amazon's use of invasive monitoring software putting their health, safety, and privacy at risk.
▶ 0:46:32A [snorts] 2023 study found that 53% of always pressured Amazon workers were injured compared to 28% of those rarely pressured. Mr. Parker, you noted in your testimony that these automated management tools can create fear of surveillance and job loss. Can you explain how AI-enabled monitoring could lead to real health and safety risk for Thank you, ranking ranking member Omar. Yeah, I'd be happy to.
▶ 0:47:04Let me first begin with the um mental health implications of some of the more aggressive kind of surveillance methods that you are referring to. Um I think that anybody who um you know, has has had experience with um you know, working on the job you know, working on the job understands that that even though they're in an employer setting, there is some level of privacy that intuitively they inspect they expect.
▶ 0:47:33And they certainly do not expect constant surveillance and so uh these kinds of methods can have a kind of damaging and draining effect on a worker. They can create stress and anxiety. If it's directly related to performance, then they can um certainly have greater anxiety about job loss because they fear that these levels of performance measures are are putting their job at risk.
▶ 0:47:56I um when I was at OSHA, I spoke to an Amazon worker who showed me a little laminated card that showed each of the steps in the packaging process that they were to use when they uh were sending out you know, packing a package and sending it on for delivery from their work station. And it showed a 37-second period of time in which they were required to um to complete their job. Now, Amazon denied that this was their policy and that they denied that there was a quota.
▶ 0:48:25Uh but it almost doesn't matter because if the employer believes that they're under that kind of pressure based on the tools that are being used, they're going to work faster. They're going to be a greater risk of injury because um you know, you're you're introducing strains and um the possibility of working to failure um but you know, biomechanically uh when when a worker's under those kinds of And Mr.
▶ 0:48:51Parker, you have the unique perspective as someone um who ran both uh federal OSHA and state OSHA agency. Can you start by briefly reminding the committee about what uh the OSHA state plan program is? Yes, the state plan program is uh in the OSHA Act.
▶ 0:49:10It permits a state that wishes to have its own OSHA program to apply and if it meets certain conditions, then um federal OSHA will delegate its authority to that state and the state uh agency becomes responsible for uh enforcing and regulating health and safety laws on the job in that in that And what would happen if states were prevented from regulating any workplace safety hazards related to AI and how long could workers have to wait before any protections were in place?
▶ 0:49:41Well, I think that it's kind of it's almost impossible to to answer it's inevitable that that the things that states and federal government currently regulate are going to be impacted by AI and they can't meaningfully do their jobs and carry out their mission without understanding AI and being able to um you know do regulation in ways that are necessarily going to implicate these these tools that have have been integrated into um their work.
▶ 0:50:11I mean, if the if the if OSHA can regulate a conveyor system, but that conveyor system is is um is algorithmically managed by AI, they can't separate those two out in their in their thinking about the system. Thank you. I yield back, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Next we'll go to Mr. Grothman from Wisconsin. Thank you. Um Mr. Hoplin a a common concern about AI is that it could make important decisions without human input.
▶ 0:50:41In your written testimony, you emphasized the importance of human judgment in the decision-making process. How should human judgment be included in workplace safety monitoring and decision-making? Thank you for the question and it's very important to have a human in the loop through the entire process and as we're designing our safety systems using AI, we we ensure that that that's the case. It starts with the architecture.
▶ 0:51:05Uh and it and it starts with the common safety practices that we've established over many years and and so we'll work with the workforce and with the leaders there to talk about well, what sort of AI technology can we use to enhance those already existing procedures and processes and so it's designed with with with with humans involved from the beginning and then as the AI is deployed and and it's it's giving us data or insights or ideas, the humans are ultimately making the decisions about what we're going to do
▶ 0:51:35with that data information. Having humans involved in the entire loop is important in how we deploy it in distribution centers. Can you give me an example of a bad thing that would happen if humans weren't in the loop? Well, a lot of bad things could happen if humans weren't in a loop, but we're not deploying agentic AI that's making its own decisions. The the AI in in our distribution centers can't can't override the humans and and so we we we have that loop system where where humans are are in charge. Yeah, you can't you can't give me an example. Well, okay.
▶ 0:52:03We we we don't deploy it that way.
▶ 0:52:04Okay. Uh Mr. Land, one of the biggest concerns I have over adopting this innovative technology is the upfront capital needed leaving small and midsize businesses behind the curve. Will these technologies become more affordable and available over time, you think? Yeah, I I thank you so much for the question. Yeah, I absolutely think so. There's a set of costs driving this. One is of course the hardware cost that's likely to come out down over time.
▶ 0:52:32There is cloud cost compute to deploy the AI that is rapidly decreasing right now, probably about the factor of 10 per year. So, yeah, this will absolutely come down and become more affordable. What must happen for technology to become affordable? Is there other than the fact this is what always happens with new technology. We still don't know that, but they want me to ask what must happen for technology to become more affordable and available?
▶ 0:52:58I think it's a set of things like companies like like like mine and and together with policy makers, we need to the market and and companies and employees to really embrace this. I think that's a key thing to to ensure that this has the impact that we're already seeing. Broad deployment and adoptment adoption is a is a key element. I'm going to ask the question I asked Mr. Hoplin of you. Can you think of bad things that happen if too much AI and not enough human? Yeah, so thank you so much for the question.
▶ 0:53:27I I agree with with with Mr. Mr. Hoplin that human in the loop is absolutely instrumental and that's also how we do it and without that yes, bad things could potentially happen. Now, it's worth noting that in our case, we're not doing self-driving cars or anything like that. We're purely analyzing data, informing employers and employees about that to help them improve and stay safer. We're not taking any actions.
▶ 0:53:50Could could you give me an example of a bad thing that has even you're aware of outside of your own company that has happened because we have a lack of human supervision over the AI? Yeah, I I I don't want to speak to what has happened in other places, but in but in our other company in in my company, I have no no examples of that because we are so rigorous in our human in the loop and our monitoring of what the AI does.
▶ 0:54:14Okay, we'll give it to you guys on the right. Do you have any examples, scare stories that you can give us that either your or somebody else's company did not provide human human supervision here and a bad thing happened and you thought, "Geez, how do we let this happen?" I can't think of anything nor would we ever advocate for AI to be implemented implemented without any type of human oversight.
▶ 0:54:40I think it's critical that you have that, otherwise you will have errors and you will have problems and and you'll see it more often than No examples, not even Go ahead. I can give you an example of a of a of a technology causing harm. There was an investigation uh when I was at OSHA a worker in Ohio was working in a manufacturing plant. He was working alongside of a robotics device.
▶ 0:55:05Uh there'd been a um some maintenance to the robotics device and its base had been pivoted. It had been trained to work within a certain zone and unbeknownst to the worker because the device had been moved and there'd been a failure to reprogram the device um it engaged it um crushed him against um a wall and he was he was killed.
▶ 0:55:30So, that that's an example of humans being in charge, but also being complacent about ensuring that they are actually actively engaged in in engineering out Thank you and I guess I'm out of time. Thank you. Next we'll go to Mr. Casar from Texas. Thank you. Mr.
▶ 0:55:50Land, it says on your corporation's website that you have a live in-cab monitor feed of truck drivers and that employers who use your product can access months of footage and I just want to understand specifically what that means. So, I have two yes or no questions.
▶ 0:56:09For the entire time an employee is driving a truck if their company is using your your technology, those drivers are recorded from head to knee level. Is that correct? Thank you for the question. That is that is not connect correct. Depends on the installation of the camera. It it depends on the settings of the customer, both the employer and and the driver on how the privacy is handled inside the vehicle.
▶ 0:56:37Privacy is designed into the system to protect for those types of situations. To protect for what kinds of situations? I'm just asking, are you recording Are you recording the You're recording the driver. When the camera is turned on, then yes, we're recording the driver in accordance to the settings that the driver and the employee have have have have set set forth.
▶ 0:56:59Got it. And so, do any companies set it so that they're being recorded for the entire time they drive? It is it is um it is possible
▶ 0:57:08that they could record them the whole time they drive. It it is possible to to to do that. I would say that it's a it's very uncommon. It's it's cost prohibitive to do that.
▶ 0:57:17Got it, but a corporation could monitor them the entire time they drive. And then the second question, according to a Canadian arbitrator, those recordings don't just capture the drive itself but in at least some cases could capture 15 minutes after the vehicle has stopped. Is that correct?
▶ 0:57:35Um also here, this depends on the setting, but we do enable recording a little bit after the vehicle has come to stop because often safety is particularly important as the worker leaves the vehicle and does work in the job site. So, we do enable behind settings that the employer and and driver So, so so the employer could record continuously for the full drive and there are instances as you've mentioned of recording afterwards. So, I just want to ask about a couple of potential examples.
▶ 0:58:06again, I understand that this I want want AI to help us be more safe. But what I want to understand is in an example of a driver driving for hours, misses a call from his doctor, stops his truck and immediately returns that call could a employer's settings record that conversation with the If they're in the cab they parked the car they call their doctor.
▶ 0:58:37depending on the settings It sounds like the answer is that it is very much possible, right? The the aim of the technology is really to improve safety and that's
▶ 0:58:46the aim. I'm asking about a very quick question, which is can you say here that they would record the doctor's call if the settings are that the recording happens even when the the the truck is turned off? Yeah, I understand the question. None of our customers are using the technology in that way. I've never heard of any Are you saying right now under oath to us that that you know that there have never been a recording of a doctor's phone call in any of these trucks?
▶ 0:59:16I said something different. I said, "I am not aware of that and I'm not aware of any of our customers using the technology in that
▶ 0:59:22know that it's possible but it's certainly possible.
▶ 0:59:24It is theoretically possible, yes. And also, if somebody called their union rep or their spouse or their child that's also possible. I have never heard or had any indication of anyone using the technology in that way. Here's my concern. I know that this is not what you say your software is for.
▶ 0:59:44But isn't it true that an employer who wanted to find out who's trying to organize a union or wanted to find out who has a health condition or who is about to have a kid, that it would be much easier to do if they had continuous AI-powered monitoring accessible to them? Wouldn't it be easier to do? I I don't I don't see I I don't see that being the case. You You need to remember like these are These are extremely dangerous jobs and workplaces.
▶ 1:00:13I I I want AI to make it our jobs safer. Let me ask you this question. How many AI-powered continuous monitoring cameras do you have in your office? Um For yourself? For myself in my office where where I work um I I am actually not aware. I hope that we have many cameras to keep the workplace safe.
▶ 1:00:33I'm saying do you have AI- powered cameras in your office? I don't. I believe we do, yes. I believe we use our own products in our own office. I'm not completely sure, but I believe that's the case and I hope that's the case to keep us safe.
▶ 1:00:45So So you hope that you have a camera with AI AI-powered in your own office at all
▶ 1:00:51Absolutely, yes. It did You need to understand this is reversing trends when it comes to safety in a more impactful way than we have seen since the seat belts or the airbags. This is transformative technology. Well, I I will I will yield back with after one more sentence, Chairman.
▶ 1:01:09I think that the vast majority of Americans would not tolerate having, especially folks that are CEOs or higher-powered folks, 24/7 monitoring with AI capabilities. Um we I want AI to be able to keep us safer, but I I have not heard in this conversation any clear guardrails to keep it from being invasive. Thank you. I yield back. Thank you.
▶ 1:01:36And next I will turn to myself for 5 minutes of questioning and would actually like to continue with Mr. Land. So you have talked about how including sensors and AI-powered video analysis in your written testimony can turn real-time data into practical actions to improve safety. Can you please expand on the actual use of the products that you have and and how that's improving safety? Thank you so much. I would love to. This is This is something that is absolutely transformative as said. So the way it works is that we install cameras in the vehicles.
▶ 1:02:06These vehicles record what is happening and locally on the vehicle run models to identify unsafe situations to help the driver. This could be too too close following distance or the driver about to fall asleep and we wake them up. And this saves lives on an un- unparalleled basis. Now then we analyze this data also with larger models in the cloud to spot patterns. Example of that would be spotting continuously drowsiness and we can actually detect sleep apnea from this.
▶ 1:02:37These are transformative situations for these employees to stay help them stay safe. And that is why they absolutely want the cameras and as I said earlier refuse to go back in the vehicles without it. Thank you. Next I'm going to go to Mr. Buckwitz. During our series of AI hearings, we have heard about the potential for AI to reduce costs and make products and services more affordable.
▶ 1:03:00How can AI, when applied to improving workplace safety efforts, actually help reduce the costs in that space? Sure. No, I thank you for the question. Yes, it it can do it in a variety of different ways. Our Our wall wall bracing program itself has two different components to it. One is an internal bracing monitor that will look at at some criteria that you enter into the program and it will tell you if your wall can be internally braced versus externally braced.
▶ 1:03:31Um A lot of walls do have the steel and and grout in them now which which makes them not need external bracing. So if you don't need that external bracing, you're going to save a lot of time and a lot of cost by only using the internal bracing.
▶ 1:03:47And controversially or conversely, if you do need the external bracing, it'll let you know quickly that you need the external bracing and move to the to the to the external bracing and you'll you'll enter the same criteria and a little few more details and it will tell you exactly where you brace it.
▶ 1:04:02So instead of having the field guys have to go through our our book on wall bracing standards that has a lot of engineering formulas in it that are are not the easiest to understand and try to calculate that formula and find out where the best place to to to brace their wall is, the program will tell them where to brace the wall. They can go out and brace that wall. They can take a picture of it as soon as they're done with their phone and upload it right away and and the program will verify that that that wall was braced properly.
▶ 1:04:30If that wall happens to fall during a windstorm when nobody's on the property, thank hopefully, that wall falling over will be very costly. It'll be hundreds of thousands of dollars to replace it. So that's just one example of how it can can save costs. Sure. Well, I appreciate both of sharing your experiences about how we can improve health outcomes for workers and improve workplace safety.
▶ 1:04:55I've seen in our local community our health network is utilizing this in radiology and oncology when they were doing cancer screenings. They were having AI run applications in the background. About 10 to 11 different AI programs were running. And while I was sitting there, they actually detected that somebody had come through for a screening on a kidney or liver issue actually had a blocked artery in their heart and they said we need to call this person back immediately.
▶ 1:05:23The doctor didn't even actually do that screening himself, but it was picked up by AI in a bigger screening application. And she said ultimately that person is probably going to have their life saved because otherwise they would have had a heart attack offsite. May have been rushed here from a rural area. May or may not have been actually been able to be saved. So I think we're seeing great applications. Not to dismiss anybody else's concerns about privacy. I think we obviously want to make sure that that is maintained as well.
▶ 1:05:49But I think the applications for improving health outcomes and work work safety are really incredible with this AI technology and so we want to figure out how to responsibly advance that as we continue to move forward in the technology improves. Next I'm going to turn to Mr. Fine from Florida for 5 minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'd like to move in a little different direction. We've heard a lot of concerns about the idea of AI being used in trucking, I guess because of some hypothetical doctor's visit.
▶ 1:06:17I'd posit that Democrats are concerned about AI in trucking for for other reasons. I want to talk about where AI might have been useful. Perhaps had we had AI in trucking, an illegal immigrant from Kyrgyzstan who failed to brake and swerve to semi-truck into a van might not have killed four people. I suspect that wasn't the first time he drove and he didn't know what he was doing.
▶ 1:06:40Perhaps if we had AI in a truck in October of last year, an illegal immigrant from India would not have killed three people on the road. Perhaps if we had AI in trucks, an illegal immigrant from Serbia in October would not have killed one person in in Indiana. And in my own state in August of last year, perhaps had AI been involved, an illegal immigrant from India would not have made an illegal U-turn in the middle of the highway and killed three people.
▶ 1:07:09I suspect in all of these instances, it wasn't the first time they drove inappropriately. Now I understand that Democrats care more about illegal immigrants than they do about Americans, but I would suspect that the use of AI would help with safety. Now I've driven a Tesla for the last 10 years. Um and I've taken advantage of the driving features that it offers. In fact, now I can drive hours and never touch the steering wheel and that's largely because of AI technology.
▶ 1:07:38I can only imagine if it can be used for me, what it could be what could be done for other people. It's got collision warning, lane keeping, driver monitoring. These all help accidents in real time. Even when I want to drive myself, having these things on, it's like a second set of eyes to help make sure that people are safe. Um Mr. Land, you know, do you believe You discussed in your testimony AI-enabled coaching and training and you referenced reduction in crashes and distracted driving.
▶ 1:08:08How do workers respond to personalized training based on monitored events? Thank you so much for that question. And I I very much share the the the the sentiment around the power of AI in preventing accidents. It can truly be transformational and AI is core to this. We We have around 70 billion minutes of data to analyze and the patterns spotting through that is enormously hard to do in any other way than AI. And that is what leads to this more than 70% reduction in in crashes.
▶ 1:08:38So it's it's enormously powerful. Okay. You know, what How what lessons have you learned from the employers you've successfully implemented this stuff? Yeah. So So we we see drivers in particular embracing this and it is because it is tailored to to help them improve. It is spotting the things that they truly need help with rather than bringing drivers into classroom watching a mandatory 10-minute video. We tailor it to what they need, personalized, combined with positive reinforcement.
▶ 1:09:08So we see drivers vastly on board with this and passionate about it. So I want to turn my attention from driving to the warehouse issue with Mr. Hoff. I think some of the testimony you hear from people who've actually never had jobs in the real world. Like they pretend there are no cameras. So I worked in the casino business for more than 10 years. And by the way, I guarantee that just about everywhere there were cameras. Those cameras are there both to secure the validity of the games, make sure people don't get ripped off.
▶ 1:09:35They're there to look for health and safety, and they're there just for the security and safety of people. And you have armies of individuals who watch these cameras in large part because that was the only way it could be done. I'm sure a lot of things are missed, and frankly, there's going to be bias brought into it anytime that you use people. An example again of an industry. And by the way, I was a CEO, and there was a camera in my office. I'd like to ask how Mr.
▶ 1:10:02Hopland, how burdensome regulations would make this more difficult for you to do this. How do burdensome regulations make it harder for you to roll these things out in warehouses and other places?
▶ 1:10:12Thank you for the question, Mr. Fine. I think one of the important things to think about is wholesale distributors, 80% of the industry are small businesses. They have 20 employees or less. And so, they only have so much resources that they can employ deploy to new technology. So, they might pick one or maybe two that they they can deploy to enhance the safety of their warehouses cuz that that's important to them as well. But but as they're making those decisions, they got a lot of questions to ask. You know, what what rules are the government going to implement?
▶ 1:10:40Do I have to hire some attorneys and accountants to make sure I'm following all of those rules? You know, if if my distribution center is in Minneapolis, but Minnesota has a different rule than than Wisconsin, I got another one over in in Wisconsin. And so, as there's a patchwork of regulations, is it it increases the barrier to entry. And and so, what it does is it reduces innovation, and I think most of those smaller distributors, they're just going to kind of wait before they they deploy that.
▶ 1:11:04And I I would share your views I wrap up. AI will be a tool particularly as it scales and it can operate on easier and easier to access computers that will allow small businesses to do many of the things that larger businesses already do today. It's our job to make sure the government doesn't get in the way. With that, I yield back. Thank you. And with that, uh that concludes our questioning of the panelists today. And so, we will now turn to closing remarks. I will recognize the ranking member for her closing statement.
▶ 1:11:35Uh first, I just want to say um we insult the intelligence of people on on this committee by saying casinos have cameras. We know they're not voice enabled. Um and so, your privacy still remains if you were to call your doctor. And two, just because you are not a US citizen it doesn't mean you are undocumented illegally not in this Uh but thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to our witnesses uh for speaking with us today.
▶ 1:12:05As we close today, I want to emphasize a simple point. Automation and AI will shape the future of work whether we act or not. The question is whether we shape it intentionally and carefully or allow workers and communities to bear the risk by default. Technology itself is not the problem. The problem is deploying powerful tools without guardrails, transparency, and accountability. When that happens, safety becomes optional.
▶ 1:12:33Risks are shifted onto workers, and harm appears long before policy making makers respond. History shows that when government steps back and we do not get neutrality, we get rules written by those with the most power. Congress does not need to choose between innovation and worker protection. Strong safety standards have repeatedly driven smarter and more responsible innovation.
▶ 1:13:01Clear rules create certainty, reward good actors, and ensure new technology actually improve working conditions instead of making them worse. That is why federal leadership matters. Fully funding NIOSH, strengthening OSHA, and supporting state plan agencies are essential to keeping workers safe as technology evolves.
▶ 1:13:24These institutions help ensure that automation reduces injuries, protects privacy, and makes jobs more sustainable. Technological progress should not come at the expense of workers' livelihoods, health, and safety. We must also recognize AI's impact extends beyond the workplace.
▶ 1:13:44The rapid expansion of data centers cannot come at the expense of public health, environmental stability, and shared economic prosperity for all. AI should be a tool that works for people, not one that extracts value and burdens workers and communities with cost. Congress has a responsibility to act now before the harm becomes unavoidable and impossible to solve. Thank you, and I yield back.
▶ 1:14:12And I would also like to thank all of our witnesses for testifying today and discussing how AI and other advanced technologies are actually protecting workers in the current situation and about the future applications how we can do even better. There is a clear opportunity to create safer workplaces, prevent injuries, and enhance smarter decision-making. And we see that when employers act thoughtfully and collaboratively with workers.
▶ 1:14:39We also heard how AI-powered technology is most effective when paired with a strong safety culture, human judgment, and worker trust. These principles should work hand in hand with innovation, especially when lives are on the line. And again, I'd like to thank all of you as we came together to have this hearing because I think there are great opportunities as we move forward. We can do that in a collaborative fashion with industry and with Congress. But at the forefront of all of this is going to be worker safety from this subcommittee.
▶ 1:15:08And so again, we'd appreciate your continued involvement, and thank you for being here today as we continue our series on hearings about AI in the workplace and how we can actually continue to make America more prosperous and a better place for all of our workers to to grow and raise their families. Thank you again, and enjoy the day. With that, uh I would like to close the hearing without objection. There is no further business, and the subcommittee stands