▶ 0:00:01E the subcommittee to share your concerns and perspectives on these important topics. I will call each panel of witnesses to the table, one panel at a time. I would like to ask everyone to please keep your testimony to five minutes. I understand the need in indian country is great and I don't want to disrespect anyone, but I have to gavel folks if they run over so that we can hear from all of our witnesses. Just as a reminder, your full written testimony will be included in the record. We will be using a timer to track the progress of each witness.
▶ 0:00:30When the time when the light turns yellow, the witness will have one minute to remaining to conclude the remarks when the light turns red. I will have to ask the witness to stop so that we can remain on schedule. We'll hear from every witness on each panel before members will be provided an opportunity to ask questions. I request that we try to keep things moving so that we can stay on schedule and respect each other's time. If we have votes after later this afternoon, we will briefly recess to allow members to vote and then resume the panels when members return.
▶ 0:01:00I also want to note that committee rules prohibit the use of outside cameras and audio equipment during these hearings. The hearings can be viewed in its entirety on the committee's website, and an official hearing transcript will be available at g o.gov. I'm now happy to yield to our distinguished ranking member who is not here, but her substitute, who was the former chairman of this committee. Uh, miss mcclellan from minnesota. >> thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 0:01:27As a former substitute teacher, it's always great to. >> so. >> um, I want to thank all the witnesses for coming. And, uh, I explained earlier, you're going to see us come in and out due to unfortunate conflicts of interest. I want you to know that all of your written testimony. We have it. Um, we read it. My staff will tell you. I read it because I give her homework to do. Afterwards, sometimes if I if I wasn't here to ask a question. So it's important to hear your concerns. I want to commend the chair for doing this. Again.
▶ 0:01:56There's been talk on and off over the years about not doing this. And, Mr. chair, once again, you do a great job in a nonpartisan way. Thank you, Mr. chair. >> thank you. And it is true. We do actually read all testimony. In fact, when I was in the state legislature and I was a speaker, when they would when someone would go on a trip, they would have to write a report and they would come. And I, in one of the reports, one of my majority leaders wrote in there, a line halfway through said, I'll bet you don't read this stupid damn report.
▶ 0:02:25And of course I read it. And so I called him and said, yes, I did read this report. And so we do actually read the, the testimony because it, uh, it influences the appropriation process as we go through. So anyway, our first panel, I understand doreen levitt is not going to be here. Didn't make it, uh, or something. So cynthia, you are the panel, uh, this afternoon floor is yours.
▶ 0:02:58>> uh, hold it down. And the little light turns red, but you can't see it. Okay. >> I got it. There you go. Perfect. So, miss quiche. Thank you. Chairman simpson and members of the subcommittee for this opportunity. My name is cynthia peterson. That is my government name. My given name is charlotte, and I serve as the president of the yakutat tlingit tribe. For over 34 years, we have provided services for our tribal citizens while uplifting our community's cultural, social and economic well-being.
▶ 0:03:27We have approximately 820 citizens and our traditional territory in the yakutat borough encompasses nearly 10,000mi. We sincerely appreciate your recent historic investments in indian country in recent fiscal years, and your efforts to protect indian country programs, broader budget cuts to further congress's goal of fulfilling its trust and treaty obligation to our people.
▶ 0:03:56I offer the following recommendations for fy 26. First, protect the eye and bia budget. The ihs and bia have long been severely underfunded, yet their budget continues to be at risk. We respect the efforts of congress to curb government spending. However, the tribal budget is so small that any cuts will not result in federal savings, but it will devastate our citizens.
▶ 0:04:26We urge congress to permanently exempt the ihs and bia from cuts. Sequestration's, rescissions and funding freezes. The next one is 105 leases and joint venture programs. Our tribe was fortunate enough to benefit from the ihs joint venture program.
▶ 0:04:45Through this program, tribes like ours build a health care facility with non ihs funds and ihs commits to fund the additional operational costs. Unfortunately, current law makes joint venture facilities ineligible for section 105 l leases, leaving us with virtually no funding to complete needed repairs and improvements. This makes no sense.
▶ 0:05:12Our tribe and congress have invested significant resources into the facility, and all of that is at risk because there's no funding for maintenance. We are asking you to protect our joint investment by investing, by making joint venture programs eligible for section 105 l leases, co stewardship.
▶ 0:05:33Much of our traditional territory is managed by the forest service or the national park service, a reminder that the act bureau encompasses nearly 10,000mi. The maintenance of these lands is essential because they hold many of our subsistence trails. We welcome any opportunity to have these lands returned to us, but in the meantime, tribal stewardship ensures that these lands can be best protected.
▶ 0:06:01We have a strong relationship with the local forest service district, and we know both agencies need more funding. We ask that you appropriate enough to support both existing and new tribal co stewardship agreements. Long term care the ihs receives no funding dedicated to long term care.
▶ 0:06:25This presents huge challenges in rural alaska because existing facilities are extremely limited and far from home. Our elders deserve to age in place and we are ready to step up to the plate if we have to do if if only we have the proper funding. We are extremely grateful that the ihs opened a special joint venture application specifically dedicated to long term care.
▶ 0:06:51But this one time opportunity is not enough to fill the vast need. Even in alaska, we are asking you to dedicate permanent funding for long term care. Advance appropriations. We continue to advocate for advanced appropriations and support your proposal to expand it to health care and sanitation facilities, construction, mandatory funding for csc and section 105 leases.
▶ 0:07:20We appreciate the subcommittee's commitment to fully funding csc and section 105 leases, but we are concerned that they are still within discretionary appropriations despite their obligatory nature here, they continue to take up a larger percentage of overall ihs spending, and we're very worried that congress will cut into other tribal programs to pay for these increases, especially after the recent supreme court ruling, recent
▶ 0:07:51Supreme court ruling to protect all ihs funding, we urge you to enact mandatory appropriations for csc and 105 l leases. Addressing patient travel in alaska in recent years, the cost of the air travel in alaska has skyrocketed to unsustainable levels. Given how often our patients must fly to receive any type of hospital care.
▶ 0:08:15Indeed, in fy 23, the alaska tribal health system overspent its prc allocation by $44 million. We therefore urge you to allocate an additional 50 million to the alaska area for prc. Over the last 60 years, community health aides have provided critical health care to rural communities in alaska.
▶ 0:08:40The ihs insufficiently funds the alaska area to operate community health aid, including for training and certification. We are. We ask for recurring operational funds for this program. Sheesh. Thank you so much for your consideration. I look forward to our continued partnership. >> thank you for your testimony and thank you for being here today.
▶ 0:09:09You guys have unique, uh, challenges I guess is the best word to put in alaska. Uh, I never really thought about the amount of that you have to spend on, uh, air getting people places and stuff because it's a big state and, uh, it's hard to get around, don't have a lot of highways to, to drive on and stuff. So those are unique challenges that face alaska and stuff. Uh, you mentioned sustenance trails.
▶ 0:09:42Subsistence trails, subsistence trails. What exactly are those? >> those are trails to our ancestral lands that provide us food. Subsistence is our way of life. That is how we survive. Without access to these areas, we can't survive. >> and what's the challenge that we have with them? Right now? >> it's in forest service hands. It's in park service hands. Those agencies are underfunded and cannot keep those trails open. >> okay.
▶ 0:10:09>> so with a co-management co stewardship agreements with the tribe, we can partner and make sure that they stay open, that our communities, the people within our communities are fed. >> interesting. Yeah. I hadn't had that subject raised before, but yeah, uh, the other thing that, uh. I can't remember what I was going to say. I'm old. Miss mccallum.
▶ 0:10:43>> just take a second. I'll jog your memory. >> yeah, that's what I was thinking. >> so, um. Yeah, co-managing the trails. I mean, we do that in forest service land, so that sounds like something that we'd be happy to work with, probably authorizers with, but we can give them a nudge, um, to do that. Um, the repairs on the hospitals that I've been in, some of the facilities, it was, uh, and uh, it's great that tribes are doing it.
▶ 0:11:06Um, but the agreement, the way it was always kind of described to us, meaning the congress was that you'd be able to hospital with staff, the hospital, the supplies, and that inside of it, no one's ever talked about the repairs. So now these hospitals are kind of new at the time. They're starting to get age and get and age. So I don't know how things are written into contracts. We have to figure that out. We have a hard time, I'm going to be honest.
▶ 0:11:34Keeping up with hospital, the hospitals, the schools and that we do have. So if this is something that this committee is going to take on, or it was part of our responsibility in the way this is done, I guess we need to know this sooner than later. So thank you for bringing that up. You're the first. I, I, we do read the testimony. You're the first person I've heard say it, but I think you're the first person I've even encountered saying that about. And we need to figure that out, Mr. chair, what our responsibilities were, what the tribes.
▶ 0:12:04And they might be different contracts with different hospitals too. Who knows? Thank you. Thank you for making the trip all the way here. Yes. >> thank you. Yes, thank you very much. We appreciate it. Thank you. Yep. Okay. Uh, jared, michael, erickson and jeremy takala, is that right? All right. I'm getting better at this. Yeah.
▶ 0:12:42>> thank you. >> michael, your first. >> is this on? All right. I also halt. Uh, good afternoon, chair simpson, ranking member or excuse me, miss mccollum. Uh, members of the committee. My name is jared mike lawler, and I'm the chairman of the confederated tribes of the colville reservation. Thank you. Opportunity to testify today.
▶ 0:13:11The colville tribe is a confederation of 12 aboriginal tribes and bands from across eastern washington state, northeastern oregon and idaho and british columbia. Present day colville reservation is in the north central washington state and was established by executive order in 1872. The colville reservation covers almost 1.4 million acres and is the largest indian reservation in the pacific northwest. There's a constant need for additional funding for tribal law enforcement and detention operations. The tribes understands and appreciates the need for increased law enforcement personnel in the aftermath of the supreme court decision in mcgirt versus oklahoma.
▶ 0:13:39We are concerned, however, that the increases that go solely to oklahoma will result in funding levels to indian tribes outside of the oklahoma withering and remaining flat going forward. If the committee intends to continue funding funneling large increases, oklahoma must also provide. Increases the risk of indian country. The tribes requested. The committee provided a $100 million increase for the criminal investigation and police services account to enable the tribes in all regions to hire more police officers and retain their existing police officers.
▶ 0:14:10In 2020, the ihs ihs awarded the prize was one of the joint venture facility construction projects for new clinic in omak, washington. The clinic is scheduled to open this november. The tribes had unsuccessfully applied for the joint venture in 27 in 2007 and 2014, demonstrating how competitive it is under the joint venture program, indian tribe pays to build and equip a new health facility, and ihs provides 80% of the recurring staffing costs for the facility for at least 20 years.
▶ 0:14:35Section 105 l lease, which was talked about earlier, uh, of the indian self-determination education assistance act, requires ihs to pay indian tribes for market rental when the tribe carries out the 6 or 8 functions that are tribally owned facility, even though the indian tribes construct and own the facilities and joint venture projects, ihs is not allowed joint venture projects like the clinic to be eligible for reimbursement under section 105 o, the facilities appropriations advisory board and advisory committee to ihs on facility issues has twice
▶ 0:15:05Recommended ihs take steps to make joint venture facilities eligible for section 105 l reimbursements, most recently in december 3rd, 2025 ihs. Congress authorized joint venture program 1992, long before modern utilization of section 105 program. And there's no legitimate reason to exclude joint venture facilities from section 105 program. Our written testimony recommends report language that would. We would like the committee to include.
▶ 0:15:32That would direct ihs to consult with those indian tribes with joint venture projects or report back to the committee on options for joint venture project eligibility for the 105 program. Finally, the colville tribe joins intertribal tim moore council's request that the committee set aside 20 million in its bill to be distributed by the secretaries of agriculture and interior to agencies on a competitive basis on their on their assessment of where timber sales could be generated the fastest at the lowest cost to the federal government and best utilized by the forest products manufacturing sector. I want to thank you all for the opportunity to testify today.
▶ 0:16:02I be happy to have. Excuse me. Happy to answer any questions the subcommittee may have. >> thank you. Jeremy. >> all. Tom kean. Chief. Systolic and shivanip. Yakama nation, uh, chair simpson and of course, ranking member, miss pancreas. Miss column had to step away. But thank you for having us today. And my name is jeremy tom cole.
▶ 0:16:32And I currently serve on the yakama nation tribal council that covers 14 tribes and bands of the yakama nation. Uh, specifically, I serve as chair in the fish and wildlife legislative law and order and our new energy committee. Um, we're the largest treaty tribe in the pacific northwest. We cover about 10 million acres that we have access to or more. So a third of washington state, uh, with the current, uh, 1.4 million acre reservation. I have submitted a detailed statement for the record, which I will summarize.
▶ 0:17:02But first I want to thank you, chairman simpson, specifically ranking member pingree, uh, and the members of this committee for continuing to hold these hearings year after year. Uh, I know they take up a lot, you know, of time, staff time, but, you know, it's very important and valuable, uh, given the nature of the federal and tribal relationship, um, yakama nation views this as a priority. And we do, you know, hope to have this, uh, continuation, uh, year after year.
▶ 0:17:27Uh, I appreciate the statements I've heard from you, chairman simpson, uh, as our northwest neighbor who has often said that the government is not going to balance the federal budget on the backs of native americans or indian people with whom the united states has a fiduciary trust relationship. Uh, as my people say, you know, those are good words. And with those words, you know, action will happen.
▶ 0:17:48Uh, when contemplating the cuts that have been recommended by the this administration, I respectfully ask that you consider whether any tribes have parity with non-tribal governments in their constituents. I ask you to consider existing studies such as the quiet crisis 22,003, uh, and broken promises 2018, both undertaken by the U.S. commission on civil rights.
▶ 0:18:10Those studies show that areas ranging from public safety to health care education to housing to economic development and beyond that, funding to tribes is not on a parity with the larger society. Perhaps someday we will get there, but until then, it's simply unfair to cut funding for indian programs, not to mention a violation of federal government's treaty commitments and trust obligations. Uh, we think most of your colleagues would understand this fundamental parity argument and agree that tribes should not bear the brunt of budget cuts for yakama nation.
▶ 0:18:38Our lands, you know, appraisals have been very, very critical for many federal functions, including leasing and federal trust transaction transactions. The yakama nation performed a federal trust function by administering our appraisals program under public law 93 638. Uh, contract. Current fund appropriate under under this security contract for yakama nation appraisal services only allows for one full time appraiser.
▶ 0:19:03Uh, the single appraiser workload is driven by requests directly from bia's realty services section, with only one single appraiser, the yakama nation lacks sufficient resources to address a heavy federally driven appraisal workload, so the nation respectfully requests, you know, around $120,000 under our 630 contract to hire a second full time appraiser.
▶ 0:19:26Uh, but we've also we're still continuing with our appraisal evaluation services office on a government to government basis. Uh, we've been successful in developing a model to standardize a mass appraisals, uh, using this model. Over a thousand cases have been accelerated and completed.
▶ 0:19:43Uh, continued success depends not only on implementing this mass appraisal model, but also on sufficient staffing within the office of hearing adjustments and the realty service section of the bia process, which is incredible model, uh, related to land management, the accommodations, written testimony, details the crisis we have in our 650,000 acre forest.
▶ 0:20:03Uh, the bia's inability to fill positions at our bia agency needed to oversee timber sales has resulted in our forestry program, once the pride of department of interior to come to a standstill, we're cutting the, uh, the vicinity of 20 million board feet. When the last forest management plan the bia adopted called for 143 million board feet of timber, sales were approved by the bia last year. Our timber.
▶ 0:20:27Timber has insects, insect infestations, disease outbreaks, catastrophic wildfires that are, you know, more frequent, uh, the lost revenue of jobs, um, economic damage to our reservation and a larger region are profound. Uh, the yakama nation is the best manager of our forests. So we are going to 630 contract the entirety of the forestry program on our lands.
▶ 0:20:49We would ask that this committee provide the direction to the bia to ensure that there is sufficient funding to fill all vacant positions bia has allowed to lapse and then include funding for transition under the six year contract for yakama nation to take on our own forest in the area of law enforcement. Our written testimony details the fact that we have one quarter of the officers needed to protect our communities.
▶ 0:21:11Uh, we have the highest rate of missing and murdered indigenous women in our region, a surge of violent and property crimes that arise, you know, with different drug, drug trafficking, cartel related drug activity, including fentanyl. An increase in law enforcement funds is very much needed for the safety of our people and our lands. And I'm very sure you guys hear that over and over again from many tribal leaders. Uh, finally, simpson, you very well know the yakama nation and the four treaty tribes. We are efficient people. Uh, we've always relied on salmon.
▶ 0:21:39So the columbia river has always had had 17 million return of salmon, steelhead a year. Now, we're lucky to get 2 million on a good year. So over 40 years ago, the northwest power and conservation council fish wildlife program, created by the northwest power act, uh, set a goal of 5 million returning adults to the columbia river. So we haven't come close. So further funding must be provided to help restore the fisheries that sustain our way, our region, and the economy.
▶ 0:22:07So I want to thank you guys for hearing my testimony. Again. We have written a more detailed testimony. So thank you, chair simpson and ranking member pingree. >> thank you. Thank you for being here. It's. We could have a discussion for a long time about salmon and restoring salmon runs in the pacific northwest and columbia and the lower snake river valley. Uh, lower snake river, river. Uh, it's something I've been involved in for a number of years of trying to figure out how we're going to do this.
▶ 0:22:35And we've tried almost everything to restore them. And, uh, it just hasn't worked. The fish that come back to idaho being from idaho, they're they're going to go extinct if we don't do something.
▶ 0:22:50And in fact, I was telling the, the, a group yesterday that, uh, if it wouldn't, if it hadn't been for the work of the tribes over the last 20 years or 30 years, those fish would be extinct today, but they've done it. You have done a tremendous job in, in, uh, making sure that we keep them alive. Now we've got to do more, uh, or they're going to go extinct. So I appreciate your work on that.
▶ 0:23:20And, uh, and, uh, trying to address that issue. Uh, let me add, uh, you mentioned some report language that you'd like to have us put in our, our bill. >> yes, sir. >> uh, do you have that language? Is that in your testimony or. >> we can. Yeah, we can get it to you. >> it's okay. Get it to us. I don't I don't have a problem putting report language in and asking the department to do something. So get us that language, if you would. >> appreciate that. >> miss pingree. >> yeah. I apologize for coming in late.
▶ 0:23:49I had to meet with the group, and so I won't have a lot of questions for you, but, um, do appreciate your testimony and certainly the concerns that you brought. And, um, it's really a dramatic decline when you talk about the salmon changes. And I know from the east coast, the challenges of keeping salmon in our rivers is a, is a really big issue. Um, and I also, uh, am really distressed to hear that because of staffing issues, the timber sales, um, have stopped. I know how important that is to you. I know how important it is to washington state.
▶ 0:24:17When, um, representative kilmer was on this committee, we talked about timber sales pretty much every committee. If you could find a way to work it in. So I just I just know it's critically important. Um, and so that's one of the things we'll follow up with the department because, um, you know, it was already challenging there with insufficient staff to do the work that had to be done in this last year. We've lost a lot more. So thank you for bringing that to our attention. >> thank you. >> are you anticipating a big fire year this year? >> yes most likely sir. Um chair system. Yeah.
▶ 0:24:46We are probably more likely to see a fourth year of a drought in washington state. So we're, you know, in preparation, uh, let's hope and pray that it doesn't happen because, you know, timber is something we heavily rely on. And of course, you know, just the, the access that our tribal members have and of course, the coordination, you know, with folks that we have back in the state of washington.
▶ 0:25:06>> so do you guys have concerns, uh, about the consolidation of the wildfire fighting bia, the park service, fish and wildlife service and the blm all together in one. And they also want to look at taking forest service wildfire fighting and put it into one agency and stuff. Do you guys have concerns about that? And what does that do to bia wildfire fighting? >> I think our more our concerns are just how that transition will look. I think overall that could be good.
▶ 0:25:33There could be some good that comes out of that as far as consolidating those and the funds that come with some of that. Um, it's just the matter of transition. I know they've been, we've been getting given input to our executive directors, also the president of itc. Let me give an input on how that could be structured. And look at. I know phil rigdon from yakima was also on itc, so we've been given input on how that could be structured and look. Um, but I think it's just going to be some, a learning curve and what that transition looks like from those different agencies combining. So I think it could be a good thing.
▶ 0:26:01We just got to make sure we do it right. >> yeah. I that's exactly the position I've had on it. Some people think I'm trying to stop it from happening and I'm not. I just had a lot of questions that I'd like answered. But before this, before this occurs. And so far we haven't got the answer from them, but we're starting to work on it and stuff. I went to a wildfire fighting conference in las vegas last week and, uh, talked to a lot of these people, and it may end up being the best idea we've ever had, but I don't know yet. We just. And it's, you're right.
▶ 0:26:30It's how is, how is this going to work? And how is it going to affect these different agencies? And we may, it may be a coordinated effort that that, uh, is the right thing to do. So, but we need your input on it and the impact that it's going to have. Uh, and the concerns that you might have on that as, uh, as we move forward with this. So anyway, thank you all for being here today and thank you for the work you've done. And I said, without, without your work, uh, salmon would be, it wouldn't be in the columbia and lower snake river anymore.
▶ 0:26:58And, uh, when you look at it, I think salmon have the most amazing life cycle of any species I've ever seen. And we need to make sure that they remain so. Yep. >> thank you. >> thank you all. >> appreciate it.
▶ 0:27:30Does she. >> before we begin our next panel, congressman randall of washington would like to introduce the constituent tribal leaders who are joining us today. >> hello. Thank you, chairman simpson and ranking member pingree and, um, subcommittee members, um, on behalf of the people of washington's sixth, I want to thank you for the opportunity to introduce four tribal nations from my district who are here to testify today.
▶ 0:27:57One of the real privileges of representing my community on the olympic peninsula is doing so alongside the leadership of 12 federally recognized indian nations. They lead extraordinary efforts in their communities in the areas of economic development, cultural and language restoration, land use programs, and environmental stewardship.
▶ 0:28:16And I am learning every day on this job alongside them, um, from the squaxin island tribe, we're pleased to welcome chairman christopher peters, known as the people of the water. The squaxin are the descendants of coast salish people, whose ancestral homelands span the inlets of the salish sea. Their leadership in fisheries management, environmental restoration and community centered economic development continues to strengthen both tribal and regional resilience.
▶ 0:28:47Vice chair loni greninger is here on behalf of the jamestown s'klallam tribe. They carry a powerful legacy of perseverance and self-determination. In 1874, tribal citizens purchased land near dungeness bay to establish the jamestown community. This was an extraordinary act of sovereignty during a time when native people were largely barred from owning land. Today, the tribe is a major partner in regional economic development and healthcare. And that's how I met vice chair greninger.
▶ 0:29:13Um, environmental stewardship on the olympic peninsula. The jamestown healing clinic is a model of how government can work for its people, and it's serving not only native people, but people of the entire region. President guy kappelman is here on behalf of the quinault indian nation. The quinault nation is a leader in natural resources management and climate resilience alongside washington's pacific coast.
▶ 0:29:40Their reservation includes more than 200,000 acres and miles of coastline. They lead one of the nation's most significant climate adaptation efforts as they relocate infrastructure to protect their community from rising seas and tsunami risks. And just over the last few years, we've seen the impact that rising seas have on these coastal communities.
▶ 0:30:03Councilwoman annette bryant is here on behalf of the puyallup tribe of indians, located along commencement bay in tacoma, the puyallup tribe represents one of the most dynamic urban tribal nations in the country through strong economic development, cultural leadership, and environmental restoration of the salish sea, the tribe continues to create opportunities and strengthen communities across the region. The tribe's elders wellness center showcases the tribe's cultural respect for elders, and is another model of how government can work for its people.
▶ 0:30:32These tribal nations are sovereign governments. They are essential partners to washington state and to the federal government in our government, to government relationships. As congress considers critical investments through the appropriations process the essential that we uphold our federal trust and treaty responsibilities, as I know, you know, and ensure that tribal communities have the resources necessary not just to survive, but to thrive. I look forward to hearing from these tribal leaders about their federal appropriations priorities, and I urge this committee to give their priorities strong consideration.
▶ 0:31:04As you start your work on fiscal year 2027 appropriations. Thank you so much. >> thank you, congresswoman, we appreciate that. Next panel is christopher peters, uh, lonnie greninger, I don't know if that's right. Quentin swanson and robert de los angeles, is that right? >> thank you miss. Oh, I don't know.
▶ 0:31:32>> do we sit in order or does it matter? >> uh, you can. I'll call you in the way. I've got it here. >> sounds good. How are you doing, christopher? >> you're first on my list. >> wonderful. Okay, so obviously, you're not saving the best for last. Yeah, I'm just kidding. That's okay. >> is this ready to. >> go here? Yes it is. All right. Well, helen, have a good day. And thank you.
▶ 0:31:56Uh, members of the committee, I really appreciate this time is, uh, my friend, uh, jeremy said it's meaningful that you hold this time for us every year. You're really appreciate it. You're busy people, and it's a hectic time, so appreciate it. Um, my name is chris peters. My indigenous name is klopka, and I'm a citizen of the island tribe. It's a small tribe in western washington. I have the honor of serving the squaxin as their council chair. I also serve as first vice president of the affiliated tribes of northwest indians.
▶ 0:32:23And I'm on the executive board of the national congress of american indians. Um, we do have a few asks. Um, our little tribe is also in a rural county called mason county in western washington. Um, it has long been underserved in regards to, uh, health, um, health clinics and health care, not only for us, but for the entire county.
▶ 0:32:46Many people who live within the county, including a lot of our tribal members, travel, uh, either east to the city of olympia, thurston county, or north to kitsap county in bremerton for health care. And sometimes it can be quite a drive. Um, we don't have a good urgent care facility. Uh, this island tribe has decided to step up to the plate on this, and we want to build a first class health, a regional health complex, uh, that will provide quality health care, uh, urgent care, pharmacy.
▶ 0:33:15It'll have a mental health wing. It'll have orthodontic and dental, dental, and it also have natural healing. We, this is essentially shovel ready. We've got the drawings, we've got everything ready to go, and we're missing the the first step is some infrastructure. We're asking for around 6 million to tie into current infrastructure. We need to water line septic power, a lift station and fire hydrants. We're kicking in roads.
▶ 0:33:43Uh, we just need that infrastructure to come in so we can build this health facility and create healthcare really for the entire area. We, we are truly strong partners with our local governments. Uh, we, that friendship is very important to us. And we also employ a lot of the community. So again, that health care is really important to us, to all of our employees and the people who live around us, not just for the squawks and people, but this will be important for our squawks and people as well.
▶ 0:34:11Our current health care facility is, uh, we're bursting at the seams. We have mental health working out of, uh, trailers, essentially. Um, it's not a good place. We have wonderful employees, but it's not a good facility for providing good health care. And we need to take that step. And our people are healing like everyone else. We've got generational trauma, which takes us to our next healing.
▶ 0:34:35We're asking for another 1.29, uh, to extend that same septic and water line and power and fire hydrants for a housing development that we're going to be putting in over the next few years. Um, we feel like this next housing development will provide homes, much needed homes for so many of our tribal members that are struggling, like a lot of people are. And we do have homeless problem like everyone else.
▶ 0:34:58And for us to take this next step in healing and building our culture, bringing back our language, um, in this era of self-determination, putting a, a healthy neighborhood with a health facility, um, where our people are proud to raise their families and, and participate in our culture is so important and vital coming into this next era.
▶ 0:35:25And like I said, we're partners with mason county and thurston county and kitsap, and we welcome them all to our lands, um, as partners. So those are our priorities. We are, we are also asking for, uh, about 900,000 to help with shellfish restoration. Um, if you know, puget sound is a hotbed for clams and oysters and geoduck and mussels and we participate in that.
▶ 0:35:50It's something we've been doing for 10,000 years, but harvesting shellfish isn't just going out and harvesting it. It's, um, like in forestry, it you can clear cut it. It takes management, it takes scientists, it takes restoration. It takes a lot of work. And for us to truly, um, do this in a good and responsible way. We need that. We need that management and we have wonderful people working for us, but we have a little less than $1 million shortfall every year to do this responsibly.
▶ 0:36:20So we're asking for that as well. Um, I will concede the rest of my time. Thank you. >> appreciate it. Thank you. Uh, lonnie. >> thank you so much. >> all right. I'm going to scoot closer. Oh good afternoon. Thank you for having us here. Chair simpson, ranking member pingree. Uh, my name is lonnie greninger from the jamestown s'klallam tribe, located in the beautiful sequim, washington. Uh, the olympic peninsula.
▶ 0:36:49I might be biased, but I also know I'm right. It's one of the most beautiful places out there. Uh, no shade to any other tribes here, but really glad to be here in washington, dc. Thank you for the opportunity and for hearing our tribes for the last two days. Uh, this is really important time for us. And I acknowledge that it takes a lot of time and effort to sit and listen with your ears and your heart for two days straight. So thank you again. Uh, I want to spend the next few minutes, the short time we have together, just bringing up two particular issues for jamestown.
▶ 0:37:18Um, I think the theme you're going to hear amongst all of us, washington tribes, including yakima and colville, is we do have strong partnerships across all of indian country in washington state, where I'm going to say that we we widen the longhouse. If you've heard the term before of widening the tent pegs, we widen our longhouses so that we include the rest of our non-native family members, friends and community members. So every decision that we're making is not just about our own people. Yes, we do have that priority, but we think about those that we're serving in that greater community. And it's no different for jamestown.
▶ 0:37:48And so I'm really excited to talk about two issues that we could use your help in partnership and from what we believe is a sacred duty for both of us as sovereigns. And so the first is, uh, through the amazing opportunity of co-management with fish and wildlife service, we are co-managing two national wildlife refuges in our area that are located in our ancestral territory, and that is the dungeness wildlife refuge and the protection island. And those were originally part of a six, uh, six member refuge complex.
▶ 0:38:16And so now we operate two of those of the six. And so we're really excited about that. And under our leadership, we have been able to leverage funds to boost our volunteerism by at least twice. We have reopened the public bathrooms there on the dungeness wildlife refuge, and we're continuing with habitat restoration on protection island, though it is historically has been closed to the public, it still is. We're still trying to figure out, uh, animal protections on there and as well as more habitat restoration.
▶ 0:38:45And we're looking at the green crab infestations as well. So we've been looking at a lot of other resources that we have not been able to obtain from the federal government. But I would like to note on that particular agreement of that six refuge maritime complex, 65% of that operating budget was for the dungeness wildlife refuge alone. We, through our negotiations, have been only able to obtain 33% of that funding to operate the two.
▶ 0:39:12So we are definitely putting in our resources, whether that's funding relationships, anything that we can to help meet that gap. But we could really use partnership in that. And so the ask there is requesting $800,000 annually to sustain that successful co-management agreement, and then also to boost that partnership that we have with you to be able to keep that sacred duty going. It's not just for our own people, but we open it to the public.
▶ 0:39:38And so there's so many people that come from across the nation to enjoy these, these spaces. And we want to be able to maintain it with the best success possible. The second ask for my remaining time here is we need to relocate our natural resources lab and office more inland. Right now it is sitting right on our shores, and that is designated by fema as a 100 year floodplain as and a tsunami zone. So we we want to move that upwind and we need help with that. We did manage to get an award for 3.9 million from the bia, which was amazing.
▶ 0:40:09But unfortunately, it was stalled through omb and an executive action. So we are asking for an immediate release of those funding dollars so that we can do this for the safety of not only our own people and our staff, but this also. I'm going to tie it back to the public. Our entire tribal campus is open to the public, and we love that. We want people to come to our campus, see our buildings, see the architecture, see the culture in action, see our government buildings in action. And so it is a free place for everyone to walk through. It has the olympic discovery trail.
▶ 0:40:40Through it. People can walk, bike, come and enjoy our christmas light show. I encourage you to come up at christmas time. It is a place to be. And so we love that about our land. And so when we have these buildings that are near floodplain, we the public is right there. So we want people to feel safe physically. And also these, these office spaces that host our staff. It's also about making sure that we are careful about shellfish toxin. And our lab space is right there in that building.
▶ 0:41:07And as we're putting shellfish into our local economy, people are there at the restaurants eating our gui duck and our clams and our crab, our fish. We want to make sure that everything is safe. So it's not only physical safety, it's food safety as well. And increasing that public trust when we are having them in having our public in and out of our campus spaces. So, um, with that, I will see the rest of my time, look forward to questions and look forward to further partnering. And really, again, thank you for the time. >> did you say gui duck? >> I did, yes, gui duck.
▶ 0:41:35>> we gotta change the name of that. I know. >> it's yeah, it's an interesting name. >> yeah. Quentin. Your next. >> chairman simpson, ranking member, pingree and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to speak today. My name is quentin swanson. I serve as chairman of the shorter bay indian tribe, located on the pacific coast of washington state along willapa bay. I come before you not just as a tribal leader, but as someone who has lived my entire life in my community.
▶ 0:42:04I've seen firsthand what is at stake for our people. For shoalwater, the threat isn't theoretical. It's immediate and it's ongoing. Our entire reservation sits in a tsunami zone. A single event would wipe out our homes, our government, our economy, the shoalwater way of life. At the same time, we're losing between 100 to 130ft of coastline each year, one of the worst eroding coastlines on the west coast. Over time, we've already lost over two miles of land.
▶ 0:42:34Right now, we're relying on aging berms and embankments as our only line of defense. One of those berms is currently in critical condition, and the most concerning part is where that failure is happening. The most vulnerable section sits directly adjacent to tokeland road, which is the only road in and out of our community. It's all. It also runs right alongside residential homes. If that berm fails at that location, which the army corps says that it could, it would not mean just flooding.
▶ 0:43:02It would immediately cut off access to our entire community. That means no emergency services in or out, no evacuation route, no way for our kids to get to school, or for our elders to get access to critical medical care. Families living right next to that failure point would be put at immediate risk. This isn't a distant possibility. This is a known weak point, and it's getting worse.
▶ 0:43:26We are grateful for the previous investments by the army corps of engineers to repair one embankment, but without urgent funding to reinforce and repair this remaining berm, we are one major storm or one bad season away from a serious failure that could isolate and endanger our tribe. This is why short term investment in berm repair is just as critical as our long term relocation efforts. Our long term solution is clear we must relocate our community to higher ground.
▶ 0:43:54We've already taken action. We've purchased almost 4000 acres of upland property and began the early stages of development. But this isn't a small project. It requires building an entirely new community from the ground up, including roads, utilities, housing, a school and essential services. We're doing everything we can with the resources available to us, but we're reaching our limits. At the same time, we're facing declining gaming revenue, which further reduces our ability to fund this effort ourselves.
▶ 0:44:25This is why federal partnership isn't just helpful, it's a necessity. One of the biggest challenges we face isn't just funding, but how that funding is delivered. Right now, federal programs operate in silos. We've received support from agencies like dot and hud. Those funds come with different timelines, different requirements, different restrictions, and no coordination. For example, we received housing funding before transportation funding, but without roads we cannot build homes. So we're left waiting.
▶ 0:44:56While costs rise and risks continue to grow. This is why the terror act is so important. The terror act would create a coordinated interagency approach that allows tribes like ours to access and align federal resources efficiently. It reduces duplication, streamlines reporting, and most importantly, allows us to move at the pace that our situation demands. This isn't about new funding. It's about making existing funding actually work. We strongly urge the subcommittee to support and advance the terror act.
▶ 0:45:26We thank chairman simpson and representative ellzey for already supporting this legislation. In addition, we're asking for increased investment in tribal disaster resilience programs and, critically, funding for the army corps of engineers to repair and reinforce the failing berm protecting our community, especially at the tokeland road corridor, where failure would have immediate and severe consequences. We also want to highlight an urgent economic issue.
▶ 0:45:53The tokeland marina sediment buildup has made the marina dangerously shallow. At low tide, vessels are stranded. This impacts our shellfish operations, which hold over 3 million oysters and are valued at over $1 million. It also affects commercial fishing, recreational use and the broader regional community. Without immediate dredging, we risk losing a critical economic driver for our tribe in the surrounding community. At its core, this is about responsibility.
▶ 0:46:21The federal government has a trust obligation to protect tribal lands and tribal people. Right now, we're doing everything we can to protect our community, but we can't do it alone. We're not asking for a handout. We're asking for partnership. We're asking for coordination and tools to build a safe and sustainable future for our people. Shoalwater has always been resilient, and with your support, we'll continue to be. Thank you for your time, and I welcome you to visit our community and see this work firsthand. Thank you. Marcy.
▶ 0:46:52>> thank you. Robert. >> thank you. Um, good afternoon, chairman simpson and ranking member pedigree and the members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. My name is robert de los angeles. I'm a long standing council member of the snoqualmie indian tribe and my fifth term on the council. I'm currently serving as chairman. I was born in washington state and raised on a small farm in woodinville, washington.
▶ 0:47:20After graduating high school, I served in the us army from 1972 1976, including a year in korea. Following my military service, I worked in steel trades for 30 years, including 17 years as a superintendent.
▶ 0:47:36I was part of the tribe's effort to successfully regain federal recognition in 1999, and as a member of the tribal council, my focus has been on protecting the snoqualmie tribe's irreplaceable cultural heritage and sovereignty. It is honored to speak to you here today on behalf of the people and share the pressing issues confronting our tribe. Snoqualmie falls is a majestic 268 foot waterfall located in the heart of western washington state.
▶ 0:48:06The falls is surrounded by lands and waters that are rooted in historical, ancestral snoqualmie indian tribe and holding deep sacred significance to our people. The falls are one of the most sacred places within our lands, central to our history, spirituality and identity since time immemorial. In our creation story, the mist from the falls connects worlds. Prayers are offered and blessings are delivered.
▶ 0:48:37Snoqualmie falls continues to be desecrated by puget sound energy hydroelectric plant, which has been in operation since 1898. Psc controls the river flow by diverting water, interrupting the sacred site of water, completing its journey over the falls to the plunge pool below, where it transform into sacred myths. This desecration blocks the creation of the base that carries our prayers to the creator. In 2020.
▶ 0:49:08Low altitude helicopter and fixed wing flights began increasing over the snoqualmie falls. These flights are desecrating our sacred site, interrupting our religious ceremonies, and adversely impacts our cultural resource and adjacent trust land. Despite over the three years of engagement and meetings with the faa and the department of transportation, we take. They take no action to protect our sacred site.
▶ 0:49:36Unfortunately, the faa is the only federal entity with the authority to regulate airspace and protect these nick langworthy falls from this desecration. First, we ask the subcommittee to include funding in the fy 2027 budget to. For the sacred site protection that would give the bia the ability to assist tribes in defending and preserving their sacred sites.
▶ 0:50:03Second, we also request the subcommittee to support the establishment of a pilot program and urgency federal task force, including the doi, the d o t and the faa to study airspace threats to tribal sacred sites and work collaboratively with tribal nations to implement protections for these irreplaceable places. Third.
▶ 0:50:29Lastly, I encourage every member of the subcommittee to visit the sacred snoqualmie falls to experience its majesty and to understand the gravity of what the snoqualmie tribe is fighting to protect. There are three more important issues to our tribe, and that I've included in my written testimony that I regret. I won't have time to discuss in detail during our oral testimony. Um.
▶ 0:50:55They are first the environmental protection agency's february 12th, 2026. The final rule rescinding the 2009 greenhouse gas engagement, endangerment, finding and repealing the greenhouse gas emission standards for light, medium and heavy duty on highway vehicles and engines. Uh, second, the advanced appropriations for indian health services.
▶ 0:51:23And third, recent medicaid reforms to the one big, beautiful bill act that will impact tribes. Uh, in closing, I want to thank you again for the opportunity to testify today. The issues I have outlined are critical importance to the snoqualmie tribe and the tribes across the nation. I'm happy to answer any questions the subcommittee may have. Thank you for. >> thank you. Uh, I saw a program on tv not too long ago.
▶ 0:51:53It seemed like I was just. I think it was on public television on the falls. Beautiful area. You all come from beautiful part of this country. Uh, let me ask you a couple questions. Uh, you co-manage wildlife refuges. How does that work? Co-manage is a word that kind of. I don't know what it means. Who's in charge? >> his question is this. Okay. Great question.
▶ 0:52:23So co-management it it is that we are co-managing together. So we have staff from fish and wildlife and staff from jamestown in the same building at the wildlife refuge site. And we co-manage through biologists. So we have folks studying the animal life and the plant life, making sure that we're doing the right restoration efforts, management efforts, and then also the recreation impacts. So we work on those things together.
▶ 0:52:48Um, but I would say that jamestown takes the lead in public education, uh, giving tours. We're the ones that have taken over the volunteer programs now, and they're the ones that help with education on site and providing just anything from like animal or plant life history could be even some tribal histories that folks know the land because this refuge is actually on one of our graveyard sites. >> mhm.
▶ 0:53:12>> um, but signage, so educational signage that was from the, the previous signage was from fish and wildlife, but we are taking it over and putting our own spin on it. And, um, I would say that the overall care now we are taking the lead. So that would be the best way that I would describe it is we, yes, we are partners and equal, but we are stepping forward to say we're taking more ownership of this because it's our land. And it makes sense that we would have have that particular value system attached. >> to it.
▶ 0:53:39Do you ever run into differences of opinion on what ought to be done on something? And if you do, who makes the final decision? >> that's a great question. Yes we do, yes we do. Um, really, it comes down to fish and wildlife. If I'm speaking correctly, I could follow up on that question. But normally when we are wanting like for example, the signage project, it's fish and wildlife who is saying, okay, we're, we're good with this or here's our input.
▶ 0:54:04Um, so I think ultimately there is some decision making that still leans heavily on fish and wildlife, but they are needing to take they're needing to take our input into. >> the reason I ask these questions on that is that there's a camas prairie wildlife refuge in idaho in the state of idaho. Said they'd kind of like to take it over, or they'd like to get it from the federal government. And I've been kind of saying, well, you know, the shobhan tribe, this is their traditional lands and stuff. Why not let them manage it? And they'd like to and stuff.
▶ 0:54:33So I think it'd be a great idea to give it to the management of it, to the, to the chauvins. >> I would definitely encourage. >> any job then. Yeah. In the state of idaho or the fish and wildlife service. >> so absolutely. If there's an opportunity for a tribe to co-manage I, we would say yes. And if tribes or states want to come take a look at our model, we're happy to talk folks through that. >> good. >> yeah.
▶ 0:54:54>> uh, dredging the marina is where is that on the list of the army corps of I mean, they have a plan, you know, of what they do and when they do it and stuff like that. Uh, I serve on the energy and water subcommittee too, and was chairman of that for a number of years. But where's the list? Where's it on the list of stuff and where is it? Uh, the berm that you need repaired. Is that on a list somewhere that we.
▶ 0:55:26>> yeah. So, um, so the seawall, which the which the army corps has rebuilt three separate times since 2012. Um, they've invested a considerable amount this, this most recent investment was through the bipartisan infrastructure law, and it was $41 million that they invested back in 2022. That berm has been holding up very well. But there's a separate berm that's directly adjacent to tokeland road, which hasn't nearly got as much attention. From my understanding, there hasn't been any any work on it done within my lifetime.
▶ 0:55:53Um, and so we have had a large section of that berm which has failed. Uh, army corps came and assessed it about three weeks ago. They determined that they could do a temporary band-aid fix through emergency funds, but that a long term fix to the 103 l program could take 3 to 5 years. So on one hand, they're telling us this isn't, you know, the next king tide could breach this, but, you know, you're going to have to wait 3 to 5 years for an actual fix. So I don't know where it's at on their priority list, but it is on their radar.
▶ 0:56:21Um, and in terms of dredging, um, they've been dredging every year, but this last year, I'm not sure the exact, um, why, but this last year they weren't able to secure a permit. I believe it had something to do with funding limitations. Um, I can, I can look more into that and get back to you. >> okay. Um, yeah, it is, uh, getting things done sometimes through the army corps of engineers. Some kind of takes takes some time sometimes. What district is this in? >> uh, district 19, the 19th.
▶ 0:56:54>> okay, okay. I'll check on it when we. Thank you. Do our funding for the army corps of engineers and stuff. >> I appreciate it. >> miss pingree. >> thank you all. Really lots of interesting testimony, and I appreciate having you all here. Um, chair peters, uh, hopefully we can help a little bit with the infrastructure. It sounds very good that you're doing that, um, healthcare complex that would serve the whole region.
▶ 0:57:22We know when we've heard about that from other tribes, it's so beneficial in rural communities. So really seems like an important thing to be able to do. Um, and I appreciate hearing from some of you in your tribe in particular, chair swenson, about the relocation efforts. I know we've heard about some of that before and it's sort of fallen off our radar screen. You're the first group to really talk about that today. But I know with a lot of the alaska tribes, that's really a pressing issue.
▶ 0:57:49I represent maine, and so we have one tribe, the passamaquoddy, that's already dealing with a couple of challenges to their source system and, um, an elder care center. And so it's just a really big pressing issue that I think we need more focus on. Um, and I was trying under the last administration to get them. I know you talked about the terror act.
▶ 0:58:09I'll make sure I look into that, but just sort of this comprehensive approach to it, because the idea of moving a community, which some have had to be moved in alaska already is obviously very expensive, but it requires a lot of coordination. So everything that you had to say about that was really helpful. And I think we have to push on that again, and maybe we can get some language into the appropriations bill that really specifies that the, um, that we have to have this more comprehensive approach on it because it's out of our control and it's happening, and we can pretend it's not, but it is, and you're already in the middle of experiencing it.
▶ 0:58:39And, uh, vice chair geringer greninger um, yeah. Um, so we have a green crab problem too. If you, if you solve it, let us know. People are always trying to cook it up and figure out some way, like maybe we can eat them out of here. But you know, it's just there's an awful lot of them. They're just nasty little things. So we, uh, we need to get rid of them. Uh, yeah, I want to get us talking about green crabs. >> trying to be creative. >> yeah.
▶ 0:59:07But, um, that that money that you're looking for the $3.9 million that you need to relocate your, your lab. Um, were you asked by the department to rewrite your application and change some of the language in it or what, what's been the hold up that you know of? I mean, we'd love to try to free that money because it's terrible that it's already meant to be with you and it's not there. >> I will follow up specifically from just the general understanding was an executive action and then the omb memorandum that followed. >> okay. And so, so far, as far as you know, it's just blocked. No one said. >> it's just blocked.
▶ 0:59:37>> just rewrite your application. Okay. Well, we can we can look into that and see if we can't free it up because, you know, it's hard enough to get funds, but once they're already promised to you when they get stuck somewhere, that's just an outrage. And I'm sure you're, um, increasing, you know, the costs are increasing the longer you wait for it. Um, thank you very much for, for your testimony. Appreciate it. I don't know much about that question you brought up about the regulated airspace, but it certainly seems like a reasonable concern. It would be interesting if we did a little bit of work on that. And, uh, um, I too am worried about the endangerment.
▶ 1:00:08And so I appreciate hearing that from a, a tribe because I think you are really thinking about the front lines of how this will impact all of us. Um, and also worried about the medicaid impact on all tribes because, uh, we're going to experience some cuts at the end of the year. And so many of the indian health service funding, you know, pools come from medicaid as well. And so if we see some cuts there, that's going to be a problem for everybody. So just really appreciate all the things you brought to us today.
▶ 1:00:36And thank you for coming all the way across the country. >> thank you. >> thank you for your time. Thank you. >> let me just say before you go, I, I agree with representative is frustrating to all of us when we have appropriated funds that are held up by omb. Uh, it is a challenge. Uh, I've had that happen in idaho. The nez perce had a fish hatchery and they like withheld like half the funds. So what, you operate a fish hatchery for half a year? It just stupid. Uh, and we were able to free that up.
▶ 1:01:05That's certainly something that I know the appropriations committee is working on and trying to, trying to address that issue. You, uh, in your testimony wanted money for the infrastructure. >> yes, sir. >> do you have plans? If you get the infrastructure in place, what are the plans to build the facility? Yeah, yeah. >> wonderful. We, we are putting together a capital stack for it.
▶ 1:01:30We've already got the drawings, um, everything in place, but it's going to be a mix of funding, uh, through, um, some capital that we already have have grown, uh, we're working with our banks to get loans and some grants. And so we have put the money together to, to build the health center. And just to note, um, there is a great success story at jamestown. They're the ones who were the first ones I think that did this. And it's doing a wonderful job.
▶ 1:01:57And it's, uh, something that we're hoping to model the work that chairwoman greninger and her chair, ron allen, did so great. >> and I'm going to get up and see the falls. I really want to see it. >> let us know. We'll go ahead and yeah, make sure we have room for you. >> I would think I would have spent a lot more time up on the peninsula because it's one of the beautiful parts of the country. But I'll get there and. >> maybe see our christmas. >> maybe we'll bring. Yeah. Okay. Thank you all. I appreciate your testimony.
▶ 1:02:27Thanks for being here today. You bet. >> thank you. >> guy copeman. Copeman. Uh, william eliel and louis garrel. Is that right? That's a pullman. It's what? It's a pullman. Pullman. Okay. There you go.
▶ 1:02:57That happens a lot, though. I got the first. I got the first names right, though. There you go. There you go. That's. That's good. Okay, guy. You're first. Uh. First off. Oh, no. Guido. Hench, no, toquinho. My name is guy pullman. I'm the president of the quinault indian nation.
▶ 1:03:25Chairman simpson and ranking member pingree and the members of the subcommittee. We know you've had a long sit these last few days, and we really appreciate all all the work that you do and all the decisions that you have to make. And we thank you for this opportunity to testify here today. I, like I said, I serve as the president of the quinault nation.
▶ 1:03:51I'm going on my second term, the last year of my my second term here, the quinault nation is a reservation located in the olympic peninsula, 220,000 acres of land and the olympic peninsula. And we have, uh, about 4676 tribal members. We have some important issues we wanted to, to discuss here today.
▶ 1:04:20Uh, first one is, um, we have frozen tribal electric electrification program funding in 2025. We received those funds, $7.6 million under the tribal electrification program to help us construct the hula village energy park. And it's shovel ready. All the infrastructure work has been done.
▶ 1:04:48We have blueprints for homes. We have put out bids for homes. And we we want to do this all, all simultaneously. And these these funds have been have been frozen since we since we've received those funds. So, um, we'd like some sort of, of review and release of those funds with clear guidance on, on, um, on how we go about using these funds.
▶ 1:05:17You know, it's, it's one of those things where, where other tribes talked about they've received funds as well. And you know, they've, they've been frozen by omb and, and they can't do their work. And it's a part of our relocation, uh, project as well. Um, uh, quinault has two villages, the village of taholah and quits, and both of them are in the tsunami zone.
▶ 1:05:41And we've worked for countless years to, to get funds and to plan and to work on moving our villages to higher ground. All the site work has been done. Uh, infrastructure work has been done. Um, um, bids have been put out. We're ready to contract with people to build homes.
▶ 1:06:02But at the same time, some of these, these funds are being held up or they, they got so much red tape behind them that we have to submit every plan to the bia for them to approve, which takes, you know, so much time. And the the time frame to build in the pacific northwest is small because it rains all the time. So we would need some sort of help to, to expedite that process.
▶ 1:06:27And, um, we received $25 million three years ago, uh, to, to help with our relocation in the village of taholah. But our, our main budget for both taholah and kits is about $400 million.
▶ 1:06:46And, uh, you know, if we can find some other funds to help move along our process, you know, we, we would appreciate that, uh, 50,000,027 would definitely help us secure a good position moving forward with these relocation projects.
▶ 1:07:04Um, tribal health care, of course, the recent policy change, um, to, to, uh, medicaid, which is going to go into place in 27, that's really going to impact our wellness center that we built in great grays harbor, uh, aberdeen, washington. We, we built a wellness center there to, to, to, to help not only tribal members, but nonmembers as well.
▶ 1:07:33And those medicaid impacts are, are really going to hit us hard, not only us, but other tribes. And I'm not sure how we remedy that, but I wanted to bring that up here. The other thing, um, health care service funding, uh, advanced appropriation for fiscal year 28, we're asking for, uh, that, uh, advance appropriations for that be a minimum of 5 billion for 28 to, to help tribes to, to plan ahead and, and take care of our
▶ 1:08:04Tribal members health care. I know my time is running out here, but, uh, you talked about, um, about, uh, harvest, uh, forestry and, and, um, harvest there. And what, what we're finding is section 106 guidelines are, are holding up a lot of tribes and, and the quinault tribe's only allocated, uh, $100,000 to take care of that need. And the estimated cost is $2 million per year.
▶ 1:08:36And, uh, to cover that. So it's holding up our revenue, our timber revenue, because our, our harvest is, is held back. And because of the section 106. And so if there's a way to help us out with, with funding there, uh, $2 million to help in that process, we would appreciate that. I know I'm running out of time here. So thank you for this opportunity to testify here today. And I'm open for questions as well. Thank you william.
▶ 1:09:10>> let's see here now it's on. Alright. Thank you, chair simpson, ranking member pingree and distinguished other distinguished members of the subcommittee. I'm bill, chairman of the cowlitz indian tribe in southwest washington. Uh, we have a small reservation 16 miles north of portland. Started out at 156 acres, now growing to 300 acres. We're in the process of nation building.
▶ 1:09:38We have our economic development base, but now we we need tribal governance, center, public safety, other other facilities. And I'm talking generally about four areas health care, public safety, road infrastructure and water infrastructure. And so, um, I do want to also thank our fellow leaders here to, for voicing their needs to it's universal across the, the country.
▶ 1:10:07We have self-governance compacts with ihs to provide health care from our four clinics in vancouver, longview, dupont and tukwila. That's our vast service area, 100 miles of I-5. Basically, um, we serve thousands of natives and non-natives as well.
▶ 1:10:26We provide basic health care, mental health, state of the art drug treatment, and our ability to privately provide these services depends upon the the medicaid as as chair coleman mentioned. But ihs and adequate, um, federal health care workforce. There's one person that does all of the 638 contracts for the, for the nation.
▶ 1:10:51And so, uh, appropriations for ihs falls short of the meeting the health care needs of native people and contribute to poor health for native americans. We urge the subcommittee to significantly increase ihs funding levels to provide mandatory funding for contract health support and to continue providing advance appropriations. All are essential to meet the federal trust obligation to provide health care for native americans.
▶ 1:11:20Next, it's critical that funding for law enforcement and public safety needs, uh, which exceeds now $3.5 billion on a need basis, which is it's, we're just far exceeds the current levels of funding. Our tribal police must patrol a large service area covering the reservation as well as our other non reservation properties. And several neighboring community communities were often the first one to respond.
▶ 1:11:50Calls increase every year, and we need to hire more officers and meet the need for that growth. Currently, public safety operates out of two modular trailers with 19 officers and the tribal court in those trailers. Um, tribal police do not have office space detention processing area, secure evidence storage or holding cells. Our cruisers are aging and need replacement.
▶ 1:12:20More federal funding is needed to help with these basic law enforcement needs and protect our members in the community we serve. We ask that you significantly increase 27 appropriations for bia public safety and funding for bia roads. Like many tribes, we face significant road safety issues on the reservation.
▶ 1:12:42We have major congestion, traffic challenges on our roadways that connect our local community, and as well as the reservation and interstate five that passes through our reservation. The northwest portion of our reservation lives lacks a safe route. When there is congestion for the needs of emergency responders and and others that are using the road.
▶ 1:13:09Bia roads have been underfunded for decades, and available funding is nowhere needed to meet the plan and the construction and improvements that we need for those roads. Uh, the same applies across indian country. Additional appropriations for bia are absolutely necessary to address safety and traffic challenges and support economic development on the reservation.
▶ 1:13:38And finally, uh, water infrastructure that our ability to engage in additional economic development on the reservation is limited by existing water and wastewater infrastructure. Our wastewater treatment facility is operating at full capacity and cannot support additional growth.
▶ 1:13:56Uh, more federal funding for water and wastewater infrastructure through ihs and epa programs would help protect water resources, ensure safe and sanitary water wastewater disposal, and facilitate our economic, economic development and growth. I appreciate your time today, and I I'll be happy to answer any questions, but, uh, thank you very much. >> thank you.
▶ 1:14:23Just push the button. Red light on. Okay. Yes. Thank you. Chairman simpson, ranking member pingree and the members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today. My name is louis ungaro. I serve on the muckleshoot tribal council. I also chair the tribe's school commission.
▶ 1:14:49The muckleshoot tribe signed the treaty of medicine creek in 1854 and the treaty of point elliott in 1855. Through these treaties, our tribe reserve the right to govern ourselves and manage our resources. These treaties are not just historical documents. They are binding federal law, and they carry ongoing responsibility for the united states. Today, I'd like to share the priorities for the fiscal year 27 interior appropriations bill.
▶ 1:15:17These priorities support native education and the protection of salmon in puget sound. First, I would like to talk about the tribal school we operate, the muckleshoot tribal school, which serves native students from kindergarten through through high school. The school combines strong academic instruction with muckleshoot culture, language, and history. Our goal is to prepare our students for success in today's world while helping them stay connected to who they are.
▶ 1:15:45As a muckleshoot people school opened in 2009 and now serve about 470 students. We are proud of the progress of our students have made. In 2017, our on time graduation rate was 42%. For the 2425 school year, the rate has grown more than 75%. That progress reflects the hard work of our students, our teachers, and our families. Our school also provides programs that support the whole child.
▶ 1:16:14Students learn muckleshoot language culture, take part in environmental education in the forest, participate in leadership development college readiness programs. These programs help prepare our young people to lead our tribe into the future. However, the school is already over capacity. When the school was designed, the bureau of indian education based. The size of the tribe's population. At that time, those estimates did not account for the projected growth. Today, our enrollment has already reached the building's capacity.
▶ 1:16:45Looking ahead, our projected school age population could grow more than 1000 students in the next ten years. That would be more than double the number in current facility was built to serve. For this reason, we urge the subcommittee to to prioritize funding for school construction and indian country. Tribal population growth must be properly considered when new schools are planned, so that our students have a safe, adequate learning space.
▶ 1:17:12Second, we ask for continued support for culturally rooted education programing through the bureau of indian education programs that support language revitalization, cultural learning, and essential to our students success at the muckleshoot tribal school. These programs help our young people strengthen their identity and stay connected to their community.
▶ 1:17:38We encourage continued investment in programs that support culture, language, locally directed education. And finally, I'd like to speak about puget sound for the muckleshoot people. Salmon are central to our culture, to our treaty rights, and to our way of life. When salmon decline, it affects our traditions, our health, and our communities.
▶ 1:18:00The puget sound ecosystem is also home to the southern resident killer whales, which depend on salmon for survival. These whales are now at risk of extinction. Through epa's puget sound program, the muckleshoot tribe receives federal support for the research and restoration projects that help rebuild salmon populations. Continued investment in this program is critical for protecting the ecosystems and the communities that rely on it.
▶ 1:18:29One final note I would like to ask the full committee for assistance with fisheries disaster funding. The muckleshoot tribe requested federal assistance for fishery disaster suffered by our fisheries in 2017 and 2019. The secretary of commerce approved the disaster in 2023, and the amount of 1.2 million.
▶ 1:18:49However, the spend plan has been stuck at the omb for almost two years until the omb releases the funds. Our fishers continue to suffer anything that the committee can do to help the release of the disaster funding forward would be greatly appreciated. My closing. Thank you for the opportunity to share the priorities of the muckleshoot tribe.
▶ 1:19:15We appreciate the subcommittee continued support for tribal education and for the protection of our natural resources. Thank you so much. >> thank you. Thank you all for your testimony. Thanks for being here today. Um, yeah, the issue of, uh, funds being withheld is, uh, is a challenge, uh, for sure. And, uh, it's a conversation that we've all had with, uh, omb over over the last year and stuff.
▶ 1:19:44Uh, and I'm sure it will continue, uh, that conversation, but we'll try to get appropriated funds released as they, as they should be. Uh, how many tribes are on the, on the peninsula? Olympic peninsula up there. There's a bunch of tribes there. 20, 29, 29 federally recognized tribes. Yeah. And the whole state in the whole state of washington, huh? Three state.
▶ 1:20:16Yeah. Uh, yeah, they're about right. That's about eight on the on the olympic peninsula there. I'm interested in your energy park. So what kind of energy are you doing? Well, we wanted to do a solar array. Okay. That would help offset costs for the homeowners. And we we had some plans developed and different studies done on the viability of it and, and all of that. And so, yeah, that's, that's what we're looking at.
▶ 1:20:43I know that the nez perce did a energy park, if you would, uh, on, uh, in, uh, lapwai idaho and stuff for, uh, I guess it's working great. I haven't talked to the chairman for a while, but they say it's working great up there, so. Yeah. Okay. Miss pingree. Yes. >> well, thank you all for your testimony. It's been fascinating to hear from the washington tribes. And I concur with the chair.
▶ 1:21:12We will do whatever we can to move forward. I don't know if that was, uh, if they made a decision because they didn't want to support solar or if it's just, you know, funding that's blocked because a lot of these funds get blocked. So certainly, um, given the challenges you have with relocation, um, and the huge needs you have for resources, um, we'll try to do whatever we can. We were talking to the last group of tribes. You probably were in the room.
▶ 1:21:37Um, I'm just deeply concerned that we're not doing enough comprehensive kind of effort on how to help those tribes that do have to move from coastal communities to make sure, you know, you're getting the resources that you need at the same time and able to really do this. It's such a huge endeavor and I appreciate all that you've got to go through. So, um, and, and, uh, appreciate the concerns that you brought up as well. And also that block funding that you said for disaster. That's a long time to wait for the fisheries that, um, suffered these disasters quite a long time ago.
▶ 1:22:06So yeah, so, um, I'll put those on my list and just see if we can push in any way possible. But thank you all for being here. >> thank you. One of the challenges is miss pingree just pointed out, is that oftentimes we don't know why the money is blocked and we can't get answers for it. And that's the that's the question, you know. So we'll keep digging and keep trying. >> making a list. >> yeah. Making a list I appreciate anyway. Thank you. Thanks. >> please come see us. >> we'll do that.
▶ 1:22:36>> thank you. >> so much. >> good to see you. And that brian. >> was chairman. Peters was here. You did save the best for last. >> that's exactly right. Yeah.
▶ 1:23:07>> um. >> you're up. >> it's ready. >> yep. >> hot as hell. C e up to annette bryan steil. Chad. Uh, chairman and members of the subcommittee, I want to. I'm annette brian. I'm a councilwoman for the puyallup tribe of indians, and I'm just six months into my fourth three year term, the, um, tribe. And we would like to thank you for taking two days of your busy schedules to meet with us.
▶ 1:23:36It's not lost on us tribal leaders, the time that it takes. And we do appreciate that. And I want to raise my hands to you guys for spending the time with us these last two days. The puyallup tribal council is responsible for providing services to more than 6000 enrolled tribal members, and we have over 25,000 members of 350, approximately 355 federally recognized tribes who utilize our services and are very urban area. Today I'm going to focus.
▶ 1:24:07I have a lot to say, and I have a written testimony that I've provided, but I wanted to focus on the four corners of our community, our health care programs, our public safety programs, our natural resource programs, and our educational programs, beginning with health care. We want to thank the committee for providing advance appropriations for the indian health service. The recent government shutdown underscores the continued need for this.
▶ 1:24:33With the advance appropriations, our health care systems was able to continue and operate uninterrupted to meet the needs of all of our patients. The tribe has long been a leader in health care. We had the first 638 contract in ihs in the nation in 1976. The tribe operates a comprehensive ambulatory care program providing care to native american population in pierce county, washington. The current patient load exceeds 9000 patients.
▶ 1:25:01There are no indian health service hospitals in the portland area, so all specialties and hospital care is paid for out of our purchased referred care or prc allocation to the puyallup tribal health authority. These allocations remain inadequate to meet the actual needs of our members. We urge the committee to provide increased funding for prc. A top priority of our tribe has long been public safety and justice.
▶ 1:25:29Um, we do have a jail that was funded with federal funds at successful. We invite you to come out and see the work that we were able to do with federal dollars anytime. Um, however, the lack of financial resources is a significant barrier for us to provide public safety and services in indian country. So I associate myself with the remarks of all the washington tribes that came before me. Uh, the bureau of indian affairs only provides 8% of our law enforcement programs funding.
▶ 1:26:00So we're lucky to have the resources to supplement. But most tribes do not. Moreover, we're like every law enforcement agency in the country are having a difficult time recruiting and retaining qualified law enforcement professionals. And we are working with the state of washington to try to pass some laws to get parity in, um, tribal police retirement. So it's in line with what the state gives. So we're trying to, to solve some of those issues through legislation.
▶ 1:26:29We need to be able to provide adequate, adequate, adequate compensation and ensure that they are properly equipped. So we urge funding in that area as well. Beyond the need to secure people's health and safety, the tribe has treaty responsibilities to manage its natural resources for use as beneficial to the tribal, tribal membership and the regional communities. We do have a puyallup river that runs, uh, we have the port of tacoma, we have I-5, we have very, very urban reservations.
▶ 1:26:59So our tasks here are are difficult and mighty. Despite our diligent program efforts, the fisheries resource is degrading and economic losses are incurred by native and non-native fishermen in the surrounding communities. And I did just want to add that I think the fish, the salmon are the new canaries in the coal mine. And, um, we really take it seriously. We are river people and we are salmon people.
▶ 1:27:26We're doing everything we can to restore our natural resources and could use help in funding in those areas. We support the calls for increased funding for rights protection, implementation, funding to ensure compliance with federal court orders through effective tribal, self-regulatory and co-management systems. We co-manage a lot as well. This increased funding would provide additional money for harvest management, habitat protection, stock enforcement, shellfish enforcement, wildlife and other natural resource management needs.
▶ 1:27:54As the aboriginal owners and guardians of our homelands and waters, it's essential to adequate funding is provided to allow tribes to carry out our inherent stewardship of these resources. Related to this, the tribe continues to operate several salmon hatcheries that benefit fisheries to the whole pacific northwest and the puget sound. I want to thank the committee for its continued support on this program.
▶ 1:28:18Finally, the tribe operates a pre-k 12 to 12th grade chief leschi school, with a student enrollment of 773 students. The bia programs have not even had a cost of living in recent years. Thus, we are forced to do the same job with less money. This means less pay for our teachers, less fuel for our school busses, and less food to feed our students.
▶ 1:28:39We would ask that the subcommittee provide at least 10% increase in funding for the b I, b I e schools operation to meet this deficit should. >> thank you. Thanks for being here. We did say the best. It. Uh, yeah, it's a lot to cover.
▶ 1:29:03Uh, obviously I'm very interested in salmon and and what you're doing with salmon and you operate how many hatcheries? >> let me look. >> it was a few. >> uh. I don't want to say without. Sorry. I'm nervous. >> it was like four or something. Yes.
▶ 1:29:28Yeah, it was a few hatcheries, but they're obviously important that and you know, there's been some debate on how effective hatcheries are, whether they're, uh, damaging wild salmon or not because they have diseases and stuff like that when they're raised in it's a, it's challenging time. >> yeah. I think our biologists do a really good job.
▶ 1:29:50And we have shown that our efforts to put new salmon into the system provide returns after the years that they're they go up and spawn and come back. So we have some data that we could share. >> yeah. Miss pingree yeah. >> thank you very much for your testimony. Really interesting to hear the challenges that you're facing. And so similar to many of the tribes. Um, and I appreciate your thoughts that, you know, salmon are the canaries in the coal mine and we're just really trying hard to hang on to them.
▶ 1:30:20But there are so many factors, I think, at play here. And we have to deal with all of them, you know? Yeah. Temperature, water, you know, so many other things. >> so yeah. And the federal funding is critical for us to, you know, continue this, the work that we're doing, trying to do, trying to stay ahead of it. >> yeah. Well, thank you very much for being here. Really appreciate. >> you for your time. >> appreciate it. Thank you. Um.
▶ 1:30:52Are they here now? Okay. Derek bowman, joe davis. We're actually running a little ahead of time, which we never do. >> it means I get ten minutes. Yeah. >> oh, okay. Thank you. Okay.
▶ 1:31:35Derek. Your first. >> uh, chairman, ranking member, and members of the subcommittee. All right, start over. Chairman, ranking member, and members of the subcommittee. I'd like to thank you for the opportunity to testify today. My name is derek bowman, and I serve as an elected tribal council member for the bear river band of the rohnerville rancheria in humboldt county, california. I come here before you today in a good way. I'm here to speak about the critical appropriations issue affecting our tribe and many others across indian country.
▶ 1:32:05The urgent need for sustained, equitable funding for tribal law enforcement. This includes proposed legislation such as the parity for tribal law enforcement act, badges for native for native communities act, but mainly is focused on funding options that just do not exist for us. Federal funding has at times helped tribes establish or expand law enforcement programs, but most of these funding streams are competitive and short term. They may help start a department, but they do not sustain one. Public safety is not temporary. There's a permanent governmental response responsibility.
▶ 1:32:34Our tribe struggles to recruit and retain qualified officers because we cannot compete with state and local jurisdictions on salary, retirement and benefits. When neighboring agencies offer significantly higher compensation and long term stability, tribal departments become stepping stones instead of career destinations. The result is high turnover, staffing instability and difficulty managing experience. Maintaining experienced personnel. That instability affects response times.
▶ 1:33:00It affects investigative capacity, it affects officer morale, and most importantly, it affects the safety and trust of our community. These challenges are intensified by california's status as a pl two state under public law. 280 criminal jurisdiction in indian country was transferred from the federal government to the state. In theory, this means the state and local agencies share responsibility for public safety on tribal lands and practice. However, that shared responsibility often results in gaps in humboldt county. Our tribal communities frequently experience delayed response and limited proactive presence.
▶ 1:33:31When jurisdiction is shared accountable, accountability can become blurred, and when resources are stretched, tribal lands are too often treated as secondary. These gaps in public safety have real consequences. Across indian country, tribal communities continue to face the crisis of missing and murdered indigenous people. Too many native families live with the pain of loved ones who have disappeared or been taken by violence, limited law enforcement resources, jurisdictional confusion and delayed response can allow cases to go unresolved and families without answers.
▶ 1:33:59Strengthening tribal law enforcement capacity is one of the most important steps we can take to improve investigations, response times and coordination in these cases. Yet despite this structure, the responsibility for protecting our citizens ultimately falls back on us. It is important to recognize that public safety in indian country is also tied directly to the federal government's trust responsibility to tribal nations through treaties, federal laws and long standing policy.
▶ 1:34:20The united states has a legal and moral obligation to protect tribal sovereignty and support the safety and well-being of tribal citizens, ensuring that tribal governments have the resources necessary to provide effective law enforcement is a core component of fulfilling that responsibility, and a pl 280 state the need for strong, well funded tribal law enforcement is not diminished. It is amplified without sustained appropriations that allow tribes to build professional, stable departments capable of exercising concurrent jurisdiction.
▶ 1:34:47The structural gap created by pl 8280 remains unaddressed. Tribal citizens deserve the same level of protection as other communities in this country. I respectfully urge this subcommittee to expand base interior appropriations to support ongoing, ongoing tribal law enforcement operations, not just startup programs. Create funding mechanisms that allow tribes to achieve parity in compensation and benefits with state and local agencies, strengthen long term noncompetitive funding streams that provide operational stability and officer retention.
▶ 1:35:19Sustainable public safety funding is not discretionary in indian country. It is part of the federal trust responsibility. I would like to close with this. When a tribal member on our reservation calls for law enforcement help, they should never have to wonder whether help will come quickly, or whether their community is treated as less worthy of protection. Our people deserve safety, not in theory, but in practice. I thank you for your time and consideration in these matters, jo.
▶ 1:35:43>> first, again, thank the committee for taking time for us and also what you guys did with the funding last year to protect some of the tribal funding that has been available, and to fight to maintain those levels. Um, however, for us, I always like to share a little bit about our tribe first, uh, the hoopa valley tribe. We're located, um, probably about a two hour drive from the oregon border. We're about an hour from the coast. We, uh, occupy the largest reservation in california.
▶ 1:36:11However, we really only occupy about a third of our aboriginal territory. And, uh, we're on the trinity river, which is a tributary to the klamath river. So we're, we're a big part of the klamath basin. Um, good friend of mine, our, our long time self-governance, uh, coordinator for the hoopa valley tribe. He always talks about when the dams were put into place on the trinity river.
▶ 1:36:36Um, it represented a massive transfer of wealth to, from, from the reservation to the central valley. Um, ever since our lands were, were cut, our, our, our water was reduced and our, our salmon populations have suffered mightily. Um, it's put us in a position where we want to make sure that the trust responsibility is upheld because when these things were being done and our kids were being sent to boarding schools, um, we were losing our language.
▶ 1:37:07We were always guaranteed that, um, the trust responsibility would, would help make up for that. And, um, there's a lot of great work that's done on our reservation. We have an awesome forestry program. We have a great fisheries program, uh, an excellent fire program, a lot of hard working men and women that, that come through and are our tribal employees. And we want to maintain our way of life. We want to maintain our, our tribal sovereignty, our identity in our own lands.
▶ 1:37:38However, with, um, such great loss of, of resources over time, um, we do continue to struggle with, with poverty on our reservation, um, high rates of crime and drug abuse and, uh, by supporting these programs like our tribal law enforcement program, our office of emergency services, social services, icwa, uh, forestry, fire, fisheries, um, our irrigation system, our public utilities district, as well as
▶ 1:38:09Our medical center funded through indian health service. These are things that are great investments that will get our people more healthy, get us back to where, where we've always been, which was we never depended upon the government. We were self-sufficient.
▶ 1:38:23And, um, by investing in us, um, just providing, you know, making up for the losses that we've seen over time, um, we feel that we can get back to a thriving people and we're starting to see that we're making good progress. Um, as I mentioned, you know, a lot of great hard working people that I represent here today. I'm very inspired by all of them.
▶ 1:38:48And we have young people that are going to college, um, you know, graduating from stanford, stanford and ivy league schools. And so it shows that when the support is there for our people, we can do great things. Um, however, I, I wanted to mention that just last week, um, young man by the name of dylan moon, only 17 years old was was murdered on our reservation by, uh, some of his peers. And, um, these are all children that, that grew up in poverty.
▶ 1:39:16I'll be honest with you. Everyone that was involved. And, um, so the more we can support these types of programs, uh, the healthier our people will be. And we want to do good things. We want to, we want to be hard working. We want to continue to rely on our salmon fishery and, uh, have that see that fishery restored. We want to be able to continue to support our, our firefighters.
▶ 1:39:44So not only are we protecting our, our assets, like our timber, which we rely upon heavily, but also protecting homes and safety. And, uh, it provides for great careers. We saw, we see a lot of young men and women go into that program and, uh, they find their identity in that they become great role models in our community. They raise their families and, uh, sometimes they move on to other, other career opportunities because we can't afford to pay them what they're, what they're worth.
▶ 1:40:11Um, actually, our base fire funding has not increased in 24 years. So, you know, you can only imagine, you know, with inflation, how much the costs have risen over time. Um, you know, we basically our, our funding is being diminished year after year and our partners with the forest service, they don't have to wait around for reimbursements. You know, we, we have to front all this money and then wait around for reimbursements. It really puts us in a bind when we're not able to do that.
▶ 1:40:38Um, our engines, our equipment is aging, um, you know, being treated at, at the same level as our counterparts like the forest service and, uh, you know, being adequately funded because we're really, we're fighting a lot of the same fires. We help the forest service out a lot on their fires and protecting our own reservation as well. Um, if you look at the johnson o'malley program for education in the 1970s, we were getting around $2,500 per student.
▶ 1:41:08Um, today it's around $64 per student. And so just remembering that, you know, we're, we're running short and, uh, we appreciate the support. We, we want to do good things and, um, it'll make the country better to see, uh, healthier indian country. So we really appreciate any support we can get. And, uh, lots of hard working folks out here. >> thank you. Uh, thank you both for your testimony.
▶ 1:41:38And it's, uh, we've talked about this over the last couple of days. I mean, one of the real challenges is being able to pay. Policemen and firemen and stuff. You're effectively training grounds for communities surrounding you. Yeah. You know, I, I know I where I grew up, the southern border of my town is the fort hall indian reservation, and then pocatello is on the other side. And, uh.
▶ 1:42:10As soon as they, the, the officers on the reservation, as soon as they got trained, uh, yeah, they got paid so much more in blackfoot or in pocatello that they were gone. >> trust me. Same thing. Yeah. >> and I and you see that not only between tribes and, and communities around it, you see it between the town I grew up in was 10,000 in idaho falls. It was like 60,000. We trained officers for idaho falls and stuff.
▶ 1:42:37Somehow you gotta we gotta make sure that those people that there's, uh, that there's an incentive to stay where they are and, uh, and, uh, do the job there. And I, I don't know, I don't have the answer to that yet, but there's a, there's got to be a way to do it. >> right. And I would like to mention along those lines, um, I think it was around 2016, we had a, uh, what's called a cast, um, assessment by the bureau of indian affairs.
▶ 1:43:03It was the correction corrective action support team that came in and evaluated our police department. And they said in order for our police department to be at an adequate level to, um, really support the community and surrounding areas adequately, we would need 15 officers. And, uh, right now we only have about seven. And I think three of those are, um, young security guards that are getting ready to go into the police academy.
▶ 1:43:29So we're a long ways from being able to adequately monitor and police, uh, our neighborhoods. And, uh, I appreciate my neighbor here, bear river. He, he mentioned some of that. We, we, we deal with the same struggles. We're, we're in the same county. And so, um, that would be greatly appreciated. Um, any, any investment to, to help our tribal communities get back to better health and safety is greatly appreciated. >> yeah.
▶ 1:43:56We've got to do something about this issue of murdered, missing indigenous women. And. >> um. >> it is. Mind boggling. It is that goes on. Right. You know, and, and that frankly, nobody knows about it. And the general public generally does not know about that. Right. And, uh. It's something we're working on very seriously. >> yeah. >> we're not going to solve it. We're going to solve it with you. You know.
▶ 1:44:25>> and I encourage you, if you ever get a chance, uh, come out and visit us because we do have some, uh, there is a lot of good work going on around that to help prevent missing and murdered. And I try to actually solve some of our cases. Um, but we certainly have a long ways to go.
▶ 1:44:39Um, the good thing is, is that we're, we're partnering with, with our neighboring tribes, um, all throughout california, whether that be, uh, yurok or some of the tribes in southern california, we're all working together and we are making some progress there, but we definitely have a long ways to go. >> miss pingree. >> yeah. Um, thank you both for your testimony. And I do appreciate, um, I mean, the chair really reiterated the challenges you both brought up about law enforcement.
▶ 1:45:08And it's just such a huge issue. We go we don't come close to meeting the demand of what you and other tribes need. So it really has to be one of our emphasis this year. So I thank you for that. Um, and the work that you're, we're talking about doing, you know, I mean, it was a long list of things that really can challenge a tribe. Um, and I appreciate all of that. Do you have any active salmon fishery now or is it pretty much gone? >> we do. Um, it's, it's greatly diminished.
▶ 1:45:35Um, I think I mentioned I visited with you guys here in 2023 and um, for quite a while now we've been able to harvest less than one salmon per tribal member per year. Um, and so we have about, um, almost 4000 tribal members. And last year we harvested about 1000 salmon. Um, but it's, it's not nearly what it should be.
▶ 1:46:02And it's really taken a toll on us in a number of different ways. >> yeah. It's such a huge issue. And I know it's a big issue that year cares about. And certainly I represent maine. And we were always trying to restore our salmon fisheries. Um, did you actually say that johnson o'malley went from 2500 to 64? >> that was yeah, that's the information that came from our education department. >> um, I gotta, I have to better understand that myself, but that's kind of shocking. >> yeah. >> that there could have been that much money that long ago.
▶ 1:46:31And now 64 is completely inadequate. >> so it really is. And those, those types of programs do great work. Um, you know, I was a, I was a beneficiary of the program growing up. And I can tell you if it wasn't for the extra tutoring that I received, um, I probably would have never even graduated from high school. So it goes a long ways. >> well, thank you both for being here. Really appreciated your testimony. >> thank you.
▶ 1:46:54It's always interesting to have, uh, miss pingree from maine as my ranking member because maine has salmon. We're trying to make sure that we maintain salmon in idaho. We grow potatoes. They claim they grow potatoes in maine, but. >> not like you guys. >> thank you. >> thank you very much. >> we are running ahead. Are we ed johnston? Uh, john.
▶ 1:47:22Panama off. I don't know how you pronounce that. Okay. Uh, ervin carlson and cody cody. >> let's see, where do we go? Across my name first. >> you said any place you'd like up there. >> that's right. Your last name? >> I also go by that guy.
▶ 1:47:54>> okay. Say your name again. >> panamera. Okay. And, uh, cody. Desautel. Okay. Ah. Good editor. Your first. >> thank you. Chairman simpson, ranking member pingree, members of the committee. It's an honor to be before you.
▶ 1:48:17I walk in the pathway of my ancestors and my teachings, and I have that same regard to across the table from me. This committee has been very responsive to our needs since 1974, when we created the northwest indian fish commission. We'd won a case. The united states sued the state of washington, and we prevailed as the united states versus washington.
▶ 1:48:45Earlier, you had yakima nation here, which is a party to us v washington and oregon v washington. And you you read and see in our written testimony what those treaty rights mean to us. And, uh, the names of, of, uh, Mr. cole and Mr.
▶ 1:49:08Dicks and, and you folks are in our, our hearts and memory continually about what, what it means to us indian people to survive in these united states in these times. After all, that's storied history about when we first welcome you to our shores. And I speak for my grandchildren now I want to have them to hold the light, hold the life that I know as a salmon person.
▶ 1:49:36The culture of the northwest is is around salmon, like my relative around salmon in buffalo from montana. And, um, we really take it to heart the hard work that's happened here. I want to just briefly speak about, uh, three in particular that you'll find in the, in the, the written testimony, the $66 million for bia rights protection.
▶ 1:50:05That's the, that's the base funding that came out of the first appropriations here for, um, the northwest indian fish commission. And, uh, was all the responsibilities that is to be a co-manager to, to have that sovereignty and that relationship with the state of washington, with that federal oversight tied to those treaties. So our request is $66 million.
▶ 1:50:34And also that's, that's, uh, comes through bia rights protection, western washington bowl, and we talk about the great lakes and the columbia river that are embedded in that same core funding. We do a lot of work with that money that comes through the bia, uh, rights protection. We work in all these places where we have to regulate these fisheries.
▶ 1:51:02The pacific fisheries management council, pacific salmon treaty, come into play, magnuson-stevens act, all of those rules and regulations. And so there's a lot of challenges in that because what was once in that era of collecting all that data is not accurate. It's been changed in so many ways because it impacts in the ocean and our natal streams. Survival rates.
▶ 1:51:30No, no cool, clean water for those adults. They're dying. Pre-spawn. That's just a little snapshot of the the situation that we find are in and how important these resources are. And as those that spoke before me that that talk about come and visit us.
▶ 1:51:50If you have the opportunity and you can see firsthand the challenges that we have and the successes that we continue to have, there's a real balance between, uh, you know, our esa listed stocks and those other stocks that are kind of falling in those kinds of categories. And so we're, we're, uh, we're talking about data that gets outdated.
▶ 1:52:15That's a relevancy to our civic salmon treaty funds or in the state comes through, um, commerce. So those, those are some of the issues that are front and center with us and we're really challenged, um, with, uh, the resources that we have. We have had great success here. We look forward to more and speak just a little bit about our wildlife, which is an unmet need.
▶ 1:52:45And you, you both are familiar with rawa because I believe you're both in on, on that challenge of getting that kind of funding that will give us all access to those dollars. So we have an unmet need in our appropriations request of $2 million for for that wildlife program. Little bit about our hatcheries there. That's a $15 million request.
▶ 1:53:12We, we, um, we, we release 44 million, uh, salmon a year out of those hatcheries. We have extensive network of tribal hatcheries. We're also tied in with us, fish and wildlife hatcheries. There's three of them. Those, those are, uh, highly successful.
▶ 1:53:33If you can work through the, uh, the ability to capture them, uh, in, in our fisheries, uh, through all of those regulations and encumbrances to conservation, which we adhere to.
▶ 1:53:47Um, and those are, those are the types of, uh, visits that we're prepared to have if you come out and discuss further our challenges in, in, uh, properly using these funds in our appropriations requests as, as salmon people, we face many challenges on a, on another plane, we have to discuss esa and, uh, marine mammal protection act predation is, uh,
▶ 1:54:17Really a problem in, in, uh, all over the west coast, actually, there's some conflicts there that we hope to resolve. Uh, you heard many testimony like annette, brian, that probably more eloquently than I speak about the challenges with, uh, and she mentioned our fisheries programs. That's who we work with, hand in hand with the puyallup tribe and the other 19 tribes. My chairman from the quinault nation.
▶ 1:54:45We're facing so many challenges and, uh, the lifeblood of the quinault in all of our, our streams are the salmon and what it means to our, to our, to our people. And when you lose your cultural identity, you start to have problems. Like you've heard from the chairman from hoopa valley. When we have a loss of a relative due to violence, and we want to give them hope.
▶ 1:55:13And I appreciate your your willingness to let me speak today. And, uh, we have lots of work to do. We embrace that. And, uh, thank you for your time. >> thanks, editor. John, you're next. >> chairman, ranking member, thank you for accepting my testimony today on this important at this important hearing and allowing me to highlight issues facing native communities and our economies.
▶ 1:55:38My name is john pan, and I'm testifying today in my capacity as co-chair of the native american contractors association, or naca. I'm a member of the native village of afognak and grew up in rural alaska. I serve in my day job as the ceo for command holdings, a section 17 holding company for the mashantucket pequot tribal nation. In 2003, as a national.
▶ 1:56:00Nato was formed as a national organization representing companies owned by tribes, alaska native corporations, and native hawaiian organizations, collectively known as native entity owned companies. Nasa's mission is to enhance native economic self-determination through conservation and advancement of government contracting to our communities. Based on the unique government to government relationship between native americans and the federal government.
▶ 1:56:24Naca represents 45 organizations across the country who in turn represent and serve more than 1 million tribal citizens, alaska native shareholders and native hawaiians. Native companies are fundamentally different than individually owned companies. They are not owned by a single entrepreneur or driven by a private sector. Shareholder returns. Instead, they are community based enterprises with direct relationships to reinvest profits into our people and into our community.
▶ 1:56:54Revenues generated through federal contracting support essential government services such as healthcare, education, public safety, housing, our fisheries and other areas, often in some of our most remote and logistically challenging places within the united states. Native american participation in the ada program, therefore, is part of the federal government fundamental trust and treaty obligations. The success of the ada program is clear.
▶ 1:57:19In 2024, native ada companies received $2.6 billion in federal contracting awards, representing about 4% of all federal contracting. Nearly 70% of those awards supported the department of war, where native contractors delivered mission critical capabilities, support readiness, enabled rapid response through streamlined procurement authorities.
▶ 1:57:42These tools reduce procurement timelines, lowered administrative burdens, which strengthen the lethality of our warfighter. Federal contracting programs that include native entity owned companies are narrowly tailored, tailored economic tools grounded in federal law, upheld repeatedly by congress and our courts, and and designed to address geographic, geographic isolation, marketing barriers, and historical federal obligations on behalf of the
▶ 1:58:13Small business native small business community. I want to sincerely thank the appropriations committee for your support in increasing the funding for the sba's office of native american affairs. The investment strengthens our resources and abilities for our tribes and native businesses to have the tools we need to grow, create jobs back home, and build long term economic prosperity for our communities. I would also like to thank the committee for your consistent funding of the indian incentive program, funded in the defense appropriation bill.
▶ 1:58:40The ipp provides a 5% rebate to prime contractors to subcontract to native owned businesses. This program is currently funded at $25 million, which promotes $500 million in native firm performance. Nafta does, however, request that the committee look to increase this to 35 million in fy 27. One area we are asking for the committee to reconsider is the 10% reduction in salary and expenses for the sba last year.
▶ 1:59:09While we appreciate the committee's and the administration's efforts to use american taxpayer dollars in a more efficient and effective manner, these workforce reductions have direct and negatively impacted operations for our tribal businesses. For example, sba has effectively paused the intake of new ada firms. The sba has not approved a new ada participant since august 15th of 2025.
▶ 1:59:31In the last year, the sba participation or last year, sba only approved 66 applications, which is down from 720 24. Meanwhile, 10 to 15% of the firms graduating from the program every year, effectively suspending approval of new ada applications has serious consequences for native owned entities.
▶ 1:59:56Because of this, we would recommend the committee approves successful funding for staffing to the sba to ensure agency is following congressional intent. In closing, until native economic opportunities improve dramatically, native access to the ada program must be protected until every native who wants to work has access to meaningful employment, this program must be protected and intel native children have. Quality of life compared to other americans.
▶ 2:00:24This program must be protected. The native ada program is working exactly as congress intended by strengthening native economies, by. By supporting the federal mission and fulfilling the federal government's trust responsibility to our people. And thank you for allowing me to testify and look forward to your questions. Only 12 seconds. >> so there you go. >> actually 15 seconds. >> oh dang it. >> I tried.
▶ 2:00:54>> hey. >> is it on where that one goes? I'll sit right next to it. Good afternoon, chairman simpson. And honorable members of the interior appropriations subcommittee. My name is ervin carlson, and I'm a member of the blackfeet nation and president of the intertribal buffalo council.
▶ 2:01:19Native populations existed in north america in a symbiotic relationship with buffalo. Tribal people had nomadic lifestyles as they followed buffalo across the landscape. The buffalo were revered and considered a relative as they provided food, shelter, clothing and essential tools for survival and were central to tribal spirituality and religious ceremonies.
▶ 2:01:47American indian tribes and buffalo also share the tragic history of near extermination in this country. Historians. They tell us that there were once between 30 and 60 million buffalo living in what is now north america due to wanton and unbridled overhunting by non-indian buffalo hunters. Millions and millions of buffalo were slaughtered.
▶ 2:02:13The destruction was so complete by the late 1800s, only a few of the buffalo remained. Indeed, the population of the indian people, once numbering in the millions, also dropped to an estimated 250,000. By the early 1900s.
▶ 2:02:33Simultaneously, indians were forced to live on reservations, which ended their nomadic lifestyles and subsistence hunting, and resulted in dependance on the federal government for survival. As tribes persevered and adapted to major lifestyle changes, the reestablishment of buffalo for tribal access remains limited due to scarce resources.
▶ 2:02:59Restoration of buffalo herds on our lands began in earnest in 1991, when a handful of tribes organized the intertribal bison cooperative, at the time now known as the intertribal buffalo council, our organization has grown significantly, significantly.
▶ 2:03:20And today I'm proud to tell you that we have 90 federally recognized tribes across 22 states, all dedicated to restoring herds on our lands. The indian population of our member tribes exceeds 1 million people. Itbc has received federal appropriations since 1992 in the form of earmarks or inclusion in the president's budgets, or through dui administrative action.
▶ 2:03:50However, despite the growth in our membership, appropriated funding has not increased to allow itbc to pass through sufficient funds to member tribes for meaningful buffalo restoration and management efforts.
▶ 2:04:07I do want to express my appreciation to the subcommittee as you increase our funding in fiscal year 26 from 1.5 million to 2.0 million, although the total funding remains far short to accommodate the needs of 90 tribes. And this. I want to say no to my brother here. Um, a fraction of what our fishing tribes get.
▶ 2:04:35Uh, maybe one day we'll get there and. Yeah, yeah. And but as we're all together on our food sources, so on behalf of the itbc tribes, I respectfully request 17 million for fiscal year 2027. When we asked our member tribes what they needed in the form of itb development grants, the cumulated response came back at 17 million.
▶ 2:05:03We continue to work on creating a statute, directing the secretary of the interior to work with tribes and the itbc to help tribes reestablish on reservation buffalo herds in the 117th congress.
▶ 2:05:19The late don young, who I hold dearly in my heart, together with the dozen bipartisan colleagues, introduced and secured passage to the house of the indian buffalo management act in the last congress, the late doug lamalfa and representative paul tola, together with a bipartisan group of members, introduced that legislation, and it was reported out of the house natural resources committee.
▶ 2:05:48Senators heinrich mullin, smith and sullivan have introduced it in the senate. And just yesterday, congressman hurd introduced it in the house honoring Mr. young and Mr. lamalfa in the name of the bill. We hope that we will see clear to fund our request at 17 million or as much funding as your budget will allow, which we hope is way up here. Uh.
▶ 2:06:15We are proud of our success to date, but much more is needed. We are regularly transporting surplus buffalo from our national parks to indian tribes wishing to create or diversify herds. And so in so doing, helping both the parks and our members, we do need your help to make this recovery possible. And with that, I thank you for listening to me today. Our request.
▶ 2:06:45>> great. Thank you. >> chair simpson, ranking member pingree. Um, cody, I'm the president of the intertribal timber council, and I also serve as the executive director for the colville tribe, where I'm also a member. Uh, my testimony today will focus on why forest and fire management funding is critical to tribal nations and their people. Tribal forests are managed for wildlife habitat, aquatic resources, and sources of food and medicine critical to the cultural identity of indian people.
▶ 2:07:11Management of indian forests also generates significant revenue for tribal governments, which supports essential governmental services such as education, social services and law enforcement. However, the 2023 indian forest management assessment team report or if met, identified disproportionate funding for tribal, forest and wildfire management, which is contributed to harvest levels dropping from 730 million board feet in 1991 to 342 million board feet in 2019, which was the lowest harvest level since
▶ 2:07:42The depression era. Based on the fmap report, findings by forestry is funded about one third per acre compared to the forest service, and receives 1/14 of what the blm in oregon receives via management. Funding for preparedness and fuels has similar discrepancies based on the fmi report. In addition to the funding shortfalls, tribes are also faced with the uncertainty associated with the reorganization of the fire functions within the department of interior. With the formation of the new wildland fire service.
▶ 2:08:10While we're optimistic the wildland fire service provides an opportunity to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of fire management within interior, we enter 2026 with a number of unknowns and light winters in the west, setting up for a potentially dangerous fire season this summer. The report also documents that bia forestry funding, when factoring in inflation, has declined by 21% over the last 30 years.
▶ 2:08:34During that same 30 year period, indian forest trust lands have increased from 15.6 to 19.3 million acres, meaning that on a per acre basis, funding in real terms has declined by almost 36% over the last 30 years. The result of this inequity is catastrophic for tribes. The report found.
▶ 2:08:52Reduced funding to bia for forest management resulted in 400 million in forgone timber revenue to tribes between 2010 and 2019, in addition to the forgone timber revenue, uncharacteristic wildfires have caused additional unquantified losses of timber, wildlife, habitat and aquatic and cultural resources. Those impacts and losses could have been mitigated or reduced, with fully funded and staffed programs for tribes.
▶ 2:09:18The tribe, for example, has lost over 1 billion board feet of timber since 2015, with 900,000 acres of our 1.4 million acre reservation burning just in the last ten years, the current day market value of that billion board feet of timber is about $500 million. To achieve budget parity between the bia, forest service and blm, if matt report found it would require an additional 96 million per year for bia forestry and 42 million in additional wildfire funding.
▶ 2:09:47Unfortunately, since the report was completed, funding for bia forestry has been reduced from 66,000,000 in 20 23 to 62 million in fy 25 and 26. Bia managed forests have historically produced more than 400 million board feet annually on 19.3 million acres, which is more volume than blm produced on three times as many acres. More than 50% of all timber produced from the department of interior lands comes from indian forests.
▶ 2:10:12Importantly, tribal forests achieve this productivity at a fraction of the cost by prioritizing funding for tribal forests, federal appropriations can be allocated where timber is produced most economically. You'll need the greatest return on investment for taxpayers while also supporting tribal self-determination and economic sovereignty. In light of the president's executive order on increased timber production and the proven efficiency of tribal forests, we ask congress to allocate additional appropriations to a pilot program.
▶ 2:10:41Specifically, we request that the committee set aside 20 million in appropriations bill to be distributed jointly by the secretaries of ag and interior agencies on a competitive basis, based on their assessment of where timber sales can be generated the fastest at the lowest cost to the federal government and best utilized by the forest products manufacturing sector, increasing by forestry funding and capacity, would also allow tribes to increase their use of cross boundary authorities, such as the tribal forest protection act, good neighbor
▶ 2:11:13Authority and shared stewardship agreements, which we've seen states start to enter into in the last year. Similarly, those included in the fix are for sites. The itc requests that congress prioritize funding for indian forests in its 2027 appropriations bill. We understand the important competing priorities that bia has, as you've heard from other testimony today, but we also want to recognize that part of the solution to the social issues that plague indian country can be addressed by providing indian people with the opportunity to practice their culture and traditions in the forest that we manage.
▶ 2:11:41And thank you. >> thank you. Thanks for all of your testimony. Uh, I could ask a lot of questions. Just out of curiosity, do you ever get consulted by the forest service and blm about forest management and yield management? >> yes, but that's a fairly recent revolution. The forest service has gotten quite good at it, but they've had a significant reduction in staffing.
▶ 2:12:06So if you look at the office of tribal relations within the forest service, they've lost about 75% of their staffing, largely to drp in the last year. But, um, we've actually had the new forest service chief visit the colville reservation in january of this year, and he attended our intertribal timber council board meeting in december. So he seems very engaged and interested in how tribes can be partners in increasing the pace and scale at which the forest service does management, but with limited resources. We'll see how that works out. Funding is always one of those. Yeah.
▶ 2:12:33>> 22 yeah, I think he is very interested in in that and not just consulting, but, uh, learning. Uh, you guys have been managing these forests for generations before we ever got here, you know, and you probably know a lot more buffalo. Interesting animals, aren't they? Yeah.
▶ 2:12:58It was, uh, well, you what you didn't mention, uh, or you did in more of a roundabout way. Is that the reason that, uh, they came out and slaughtered all these buffaloes is that that's how they were going to control the indians by taking away their food source. >> you know, that's one thing I didn't bring up. Yeah. But there's always that. Is that just reading some actually last night, just reading some articles on it. Um, you know, get rid of the buffalo consequently and get rid of the indians.
▶ 2:13:28>> yep. >> but the buffalo are resilient and so are the indian people. >> aren't they? >> and we're still here. >> you know, it's it's fascinating. It's amazing when you go look at some of the old pictures that were taken with the stacks of buffalo skulls. I mean, huge. It's almost unbelievable. There were that many buffalo. Uh, but it was, uh, you kind of long for the day. It's kind of like a salmon.
▶ 2:13:54They used to say you could walk across the columbia river on the backs of salmon and not get your feet wet. You know, there were so many salmon that came, uh, don't you kind of long for the days when you used to when you heard about the buffalo coming over the coming over the hillside and stuff, I it's amazing when you go out to, to places like, uh, north and south dakota and nebraska and the grasslands and, and those hillsides, you can, you can almost picture it in your mind as you, as you watch that, but it, uh, I'm glad we're
▶ 2:14:26Restoring them. >> it's I am too, you know, it's, uh, it's a real healing, you know, and I just was a different meeting earlier and with the interior and talking about how buffalo are healing, you know, for us. Oh, yeah. For our land. But it's also it's a healing for all of us here in the united states, part of our history. And so buffalo are very popular right today.
▶ 2:14:49And they brought a lot of people together and healing a lot of our, our past, um, traumas and histories that have happened to indian people and other people are realizing that. And that's all happening through that buffalo. >> I suspect, you know, that the national zoo started because the buffalo. Yep, yep. And a couple that were out here on the mall. Yeah. And that's on the buffalo head nickel. That's where that kind of started. And then they thought, well, we probably shouldn't keep these on the mall.
▶ 2:15:19And they started a zoo. And, and, uh, so they, they started a great, great institution out there. Yeah. >> there's going to be, um, in may, there's going to be two weeks of a big commemoration of we worked with the national bison association, uh, wildlife conservation society and the itbc to establish, uh, buffalo as a national mammal.
▶ 2:15:42And so there will be a ten year commemorative of that, uh, the week of the 14th, I think, but also there's an unveiling of some statues to buffalo that were just, uh, built and brought here, and they'll be unveiling them on the 2nd of april, and we're going to be at that. >> alright. >> so there's going to be a lot of, um, uh, commemorative, uh, things going on during those two weeks.
▶ 2:16:09And um, it would be good to see a lot, a lot of people there. >> yeah. >> a lot of people, you know, such as yourself there. Yeah. They've, they've become a very, very popular in our country. Yeah. >> very popular in yellowstone because when you drive through and you come to, uh, to buffalo jam and you go up there and all of a sudden somebody's got their grandkids out, go stand by the buffalo. And, you know, and all of a sudden park rangers are going crazy.
▶ 2:16:38You know, these are wild animals, you know. >> exactly. They don't realize, you know, they know it. >> I know. >> it might be, you know, slow and moving around, but that's because they're not scared, but they're wildlife and you just can't go up. >> and yep. >> can't go up and pet them and take a picture with them. >> and salmon are, as I said earlier, I think are one of the most incredible lifecycles of any, any animal I've ever seen it. And it is.
▶ 2:17:02I take my staff out in august and try to find some high altitude cool streams in idaho that they spawn in, and, uh, they're getting harder and harder to find any, uh, but, uh, we got to restore those. >> and we're learning. >> every day. We had a project on the fourth.
▶ 2:17:21Excuse me, we had a project, uh, northwestern fish commission, our office with the four coastal tribes and, uh, ecosystem based, um, edi and dna. That's the totality of everything from the water to the fish to the, to the plants and everything present really was extensive.
▶ 2:17:51And we spent, I think three years, I just had a presentation and that kind of data is going to be really valuable inside the streets and inside puget sound in other areas about, um, the, the whole complete ecosystem. And, um, we're excited about that. That's kind of work that we do. >> yeah.
▶ 2:18:16>> here's, I, I read an article the other day, it said, and if you look in the, at the bear, if you take dna of the bear hair, 90% of them have salmon dna in them. I mean, that's the food source. Yes.
▶ 2:18:29And, uh, the other thing I found amazing is that if you look at streams where that have salmon return versus streams that don't have salmon return in trees grow three times as fast in those streams that have salmon return as those that don't. So they are the food source. >> we're all tied together. >> yep.
▶ 2:18:55>> and obviously, uh, contracting with native american tribes is, uh, is vitally important to tribes. And as you're right, I mean, it is the, it is, uh, the ability to get out and get those jobs and get, I think it's a vital program that you guys have. >> thank you sir. Again, this is our way of hunting and gathering. Now, this is the modern way. >> of getting. >> hunting and gathering, right? >> no, seriously, this is a way for us to bring in.
▶ 2:19:20We don't have traditional areas of commerce where you can go out and create a municipality, create your local city there that's providing taxes. This is bringing in jobs. This is bringing in dollars again, for our government so we can stay sovereign to provide economic self-determination for our people. We're part of the solution, and it's working. And we ask that people to look at it from that lens. We are not just individual entrepreneurs trying to get contracts. We are part of the solution. And these dollars are coming back.
▶ 2:19:48We are for profit companies with a social mission giving back to our people. >> shall we? >> yeah. Well, the chair said it all very well and thank you all for your testimony. I appreciate it when I get to hear you come before us with salmon, buffalo, timber. It's just all so critical to the natural resources and really appreciate the work that you do and, uh, fully believe you all deserve more funding for this. I mean, it's just, it's such a critically important part of the resources.
▶ 2:20:16So thank you for that. And I was disturbed to hear about the, um, paused intake. And so I'll definitely put that on my list of things to look into. That's, I mean, pretty shocking to go from 66. We'll go from 700 applications down to 66. So when you talk about exactly what you did that this is job creating, we're always thinking about how to help the tribes to have more resources. Um, there's absolutely no argument for slowing that down or stopping it. So whatever we can. >> do.
▶ 2:20:44>> we haven't had one since august 15th of 2025. >> yeah. >> that's middle of march of 2020. >> that's just nuts. I mean, there's no argument for it. So, um, we'll find out what the problem is. >> and if. >> I could add one more comment to that. So I mean, you've heard some of the other people make comments about funding being paused in a lot of situations, tribes don't get frequent enough funding. It's typically competitive. So they don't have the capacity to go out and do that stuff with their own staff. So they're dependent on the contracting community. So it's again, all of these things are tied. >> yeah.
▶ 2:21:14And we had heard earlier that some of the timber harvests were slowed down too, because there's not enough people to process the information. >> and yeah, absolutely. >> I mean, on the budget side, we've seen drp have some pretty significant impacts to ba. They were already I mean, I think in my testimony last year, we looked at staffing levels and they dropped from 6400 just a few years ago to about 3000. And this was before the second round of erp. So, I mean, it's really critical now that we have adequate staffing to provide those trust services, provide their trustee responsibilities to tribes, but they're also the mechanism that gets funding to drive.
▶ 2:21:44So without funding for bia, it's really difficult for tribes to achieve what they want to. >> yeah, we'll definitely look at that. Thank you all. >> thank you all for being here. >> thank you, thank you. >> okay. Uh, mark macarro, I'm at and, uh, amy munir. How do you pronounce that?
▶ 2:22:16>> what? No. I'm fine. Thank you, thank you. >> I'm good. Made it this work. >> go ahead. I guess would be. I ended up in the morning. I'm a newbie. Okay.
▶ 2:22:40I don't know who goes first. >> mark, you're the man. >> I go first. All right. For better or worse, here we go. >> may you. Yeah. Thank you.
▶ 2:23:07Chairman simpson, ranking member pingree and other distinguished members of the subcommittee for allowing me to testify before this committee on ncis funding priorities for fiscal year 2027. I'm mark macarro. I'm the tribal chairman of the pechanga band of indians in california. And also I'm here as the president of the national congress of american indians.
▶ 2:23:28Founded in 1944, ncaa is the oldest, the largest, and most representative american, indian and alaska native organizations serving the broad interests of tribal governments and communities. In addition to the comments in my written testimony, I want to focus my remarks today on five key concepts. The federal government's relationship with tribal nations is rooted in trust and treaty obligations.
▶ 2:23:55Yet across indian country, those obligations remain critically and chronically underfunded and too often under implemented. We urge the committee to focus on a simple but critical principle. Funding must translate into real world outcomes in tribal nations and communities. First, we ask you to fully fund core federal trust responsibilities programs at the indian health service, the bia, and the bureau of indian education remains significantly below need.
▶ 2:24:25We support advance appropriations and long term mandatory funding approaches to ensure stability and certainty for tribal communities. During the recent government shutdown, we saw how advanced appropriations for indian health services ensured continuation of essential life giving, life saving programs for tribal nations and their citizens.
▶ 2:24:47While the lack of advance appropriation for bia programs, on the other hand, caused significant harm to tribal communities, tribal leaders had to face stark choices. For instance, whether to fund law enforcement or social services while furloughing or laying off other tribal government employees. Advanced appropriations would solve that. Second, we urge robust investments in public safety and justice.
▶ 2:25:13Tribal communities continue to face some of the highest rates of violent crime in the country, and yet remain the least resourced. Funding for law enforcement, courts and implementation of the violence against women act. Tribal provisions must match the scale of the need. We urge this committee to require the immediate release of the fiscal year 2022 and fiscal year 2023.
▶ 2:25:40Tribal law and order act reports by bia office of justice services. These reports provide essential data on the current funding levels for law enforcement, detention and courts in tribal nations, but more importantly, they document the unmet funding needs for all tribal nations, including those in public law, to 80 states. The fiscal year 2021 report noted that the unmet need was over $3 billion. So that's why we need these other reports.
▶ 2:26:08We believe that the fy 22 and 23 reports will show an even greater disparity between current funding levels and the actual funding needs to keep our communities safe. Third, infrastructure investments must meet basic standards of living in many tribal communities. Access to safe drinking water, reliable housing, passable roads and broadband remains limited.
▶ 2:26:33Continued investment through agencies like the department of housing and urban development and other federal partners is essential to closing these gaps. Fourth, we ask you to strengthen tribal self-governance by fully funding contracts and compacts, including contract support costs and administrative needs. Tribal nations consistently demonstrate that when resources are delivered directly, outcomes improve.
▶ 2:26:58And finally, and critically, fund the people who make these programs work. We appreciate increased investments in indian country, but without the workforce to implement them, those dollars don't reach our communities. We just heard an example from the previous panel with the forest service. I believe we urge the committee to fund not just the programs, but the people required to deliver them.
▶ 2:27:24Across indian country, programs are funded on paper but not fully operational due to staffing shortages. Federal agencies and tribal governments alike face persistent vacancies, limited hiring flexibility, and insufficient administrative funding without adequate personnel personnel capacity, even well-funded programs cannot be effectively implemented.
▶ 2:27:47Just this week, we learned that the bureau of indian affairs is planning on releasing and implementing a reorganization plan that will make significant cuts to the staff critical in administering programs and distributing funding to tribal nations.
▶ 2:28:03In january of this year, the gao found that the indian affairs workforce was reduced by 11% in 2025, and this caused delays in carrying out work, left regions and agencies with critical gaps and exacerbation of previously identified issues, with lack of sufficient lack of sufficient workforce capacity.
▶ 2:28:25This action has been done without consultation with tribal nations and without consideration of the impact it will have on the delivery of programs and services. Additionally, any reduction in force will impact the tribal share calculation used when tribe. When a tribe exercises self-governance through the.
▶ 2:28:45And isda agreement, we urge the committee to encourage indian affairs to reverse course and engage in robust and collaborative consultations with tribal nations, before taking any action that would imperil the already understaffed indian affairs workforce.
▶ 2:29:01Additionally, we urge the committee to ensure that appropriations include sufficient funding for staffing at federal agencies as well as direct tribal workforce capacity, grant management, financial oversight and program administration, expanding administrative cost coverage and supporting workforce development pipelines will ensure that federal investments are actually delivered on the ground.
▶ 2:29:24In closing, we ask you to view these requests not as discretionary spending, but as a fulfillment of legal and moral obligations with adequate funding, sufficient flexibility in the workforce to implement programs effectively. Tribal nations can continue to drive meaningful progress for their communities. I thank you for your time and your commitment to indian country, and look forward to any questions you may have. Thank you.
▶ 2:29:54>> chair simpson, ranking member pingree, members of the subcommittee, some of them. Thank you for this opportunity today. Uh, getting the opportunity to talk to you about fiscal year 2027 appropriations for tribal historic preservation officers. My name is ira matt. I'm a member of the confederated salish and kootenai tribes and the executive director for the national association of tribal historic preservation officers, or naspo naspo.
▶ 2:30:19We are the only nationwide nonprofit dedicated specifically to supporting tribal preservation programs and the tribal nations they serve. And I'm here today to urge the committee to provide $34 million in 2027 for tribal historic preservation fund line item administered by the national park service. This request is rooted in a straightforward concern.
▶ 2:30:42Tribal historic preservation officers, or tpos, are being asked to carry a growing workload of federal review, consultation, documentation and protection responsibilities, but the funding provided to support that work has not kept pace with either the number of typos or the complexity of the work itself. From fy 23 to fy 26, the number of tpo programs grew from 211 to 235.
▶ 2:31:04During that same period, the average amount available per tpo declined from roughly 108,000 to 101,000. And although there was an increase in fy 26, which was much appreciated, it was the first increase since fy 23 and it has not kept pace with the actual need for tribal nations. This is not simply an administrative funding issue. Tpo work is an exercise of tribal self-governance.
▶ 2:31:31Tipples help identify, document and protect burial sites, sacred places, historic properties, indigenous knowledge, and other cultural and historical information that tribal nations rely on to exercise their sovereignty. Their work also extends well beyond federal compliance. They often support repatriation efforts, protect treaty and reserve rights, informed land and water related matters, and engage federal agencies on undertakings that may affect places of religious and cultural importance, both on and off tribal lands.
▶ 2:32:01And they're often the first line of government response when agencies or applicants seek to move projects forward. At the $34 million level, the average amount available per tpo would raise to approximately $144,000. Napoles recommending this amount because it represents a practical and necessary improvement over current funding levels and it would help restore measure of capacity, stability and fairness to the tpo programs. Much like Mr.
▶ 2:32:30Mercado was talking about. Now, I do want to point out that even at that level, these tribal programs would still probably be operating below what is typically required to sustain professional capacity comparable to similarly skilled positions in the federal government, those that are gs 13 or ggs 14 level. I make that comparison for a reason.
▶ 2:32:50When tribal nations assume historic preservation funds under the national historic preservation act, the national park service requires the tribe to either employ or have access to individuals who meet the secretary of interior's professional qualification standards. Those standards establish degree and experience requirements for archeologists, historians, architectural historians and other qualified professionals.
▶ 2:33:16So, in other words, tribes are expected to secure professional expertise comparable to what the federal government itself recognizes as specialized it tribes are expected to do that with funding that, until recently, averaged close to $100,000 a year for their entire program. That's not only has the support professional capacity, but practical operation of the office as well. And the consequences of that underfunding are predictable.
▶ 2:33:44Tribal programs face greater difficulty recruiting and retaining qualified personnel. Federal agencies subsequently rely more on contractors and project review. Backlogs grow. Consultation becomes more reactive, less effective, and prone to delay. Now, tribal nations are not asking the committee to stop development. I think you're hearing a lot about how tribes need housing, energy, infrastructure, economic opportunity, more so than most tribal nations are asking for is fairness and functional capacity.
▶ 2:34:14They should not be expected to meet these expanding federal demands for projects, or provide expertise needed to make those processes work, without the resources to do so, and providing 34 million for the tribal historic preservation fund line item is a practical investment in better, better federal decision making, stronger tribal federal relations, and more consistent protections of the places, histories, and knowledge that cannot be restored once lost.
▶ 2:34:40I would also note that my submitted written testimony includes additional requests beyond the historic preservation fund. Nath bose urged support for the bureau of indian affairs, much like most of the speakers probably have the bureau of land management and other departments and agencies to bolster their cultural resource programs. Where experience has shown that federal capacity is limited.
▶ 2:35:03The submitted testimony also includes a request related to nagpra, which continues to require stronger support if its purposes are to be carried out in a meaningful and timely way. Thank you for your time and consideration. >> thank you amy. >> me you. Yun. Greetings. Chairman simpson, ranking member pingree and all of the other committee members.
▶ 2:35:26Thank you for the opportunity to testify today on behalf of nofo, which is the native american finance officers association. My name is amy munir. I am the treasurer of the pechanga band of indians, as well as the treasurer of the nofo board. Tribal nations are not peripheral to the national economy. We are essential contributors to it.
▶ 2:35:51The policies of this subcommittee that you oversee directly affects the capacity that tribal governments use. It directly affects the capacity of tribal governments to serve their citizens, develop our economies, and fulfill the promises embedded in federal trust and treaty obligations. Respecting tribal sovereignty is not just a legal obligation. Its sound economic policy.
▶ 2:36:17When tribal nations have the tools to build strong, self-determined economies, indian country and the nation will be stronger for it. Last month, the nofo board president, rodney butler, testified before the house natural resources subcommittee on indian and insular affairs regarding the federal economic development assistance programs.
▶ 2:36:45Nafo has been working on several recommendations, but I'd like to highlight three. First, all federal programs should be designed with tribal. With. In coordination with the tribes from the start, not at the end. We also need to provide comprehensive training and technical assistance. And lastly, we strongly encourage to collect tribal data that is so desperately needed in order to plan for the future.
▶ 2:37:14These are not abstract recommendations. They reflect lived experience with tribal financial officers, tribal leaders, and administrators who navigate this complex federal system daily.
▶ 2:37:28Congress has an not just an opportunity, but an obligation to act on them, and nofo looks forward to working with the administration and congress in order to continue to make corrections, to make improvements. Now, this is very exciting. Um, I'd like to talk about taxes.
▶ 2:37:49So last month, the bipartisan tax, excuse me, the bipartisan tribal tax and investment reform act of 2026 was entered. It's h.r. 7705. This was introduced by representative gwen moore and david schweikert. The thank you.
▶ 2:38:15Um, this legislation addresses long standing inequities in the federal tax code that put tribal nations at a strong disadvantage relative to state and local governments. This bill will address four critical areas tax exempt bond access, new markets, tax credit, low income housing tax credit and the general welfare exclusion of these.
▶ 2:38:42The bond gap is the most striking, so let's talk about that a moment. According to the brookings institute, from 2014 to 2020, state governments issued 47 billion annually and nontaxable municipal bonds. In that same time frame, tribal governments issued only $84 million in tax exempt bonds.
▶ 2:39:10This gap is not the result of a diminished need or the lack of economic ambition. It is the direct result of inequity and inequitable policy. A central driver of this inequity is the essential governmental function test, which limits tribal bond financing to the narrowest set of purposes available to any government.
▶ 2:39:37The irs interprets this standard as prohibiting tribal governments prohibiting tribal governments from financing commercial or industrial projects, including hotels, convention centers, golf course and golf courses that cities and counties finance regularly as part of their economic development. Thank you for that piece.
▶ 2:40:04Um, the next piece, can you tell it's my first time testifying? Um, the next piece is the cursory fix. I would like to talk briefly about that. The supreme court, um, the supreme court's decision of the jury decision has imposed high costs on tribal nations, costly litigation, restricting land antitrust processes, and has deterred investments in indian country today or recently. H.r.
▶ 2:40:375257, introduced last september by chairman cole, addresses this directly by reaffirming the status of all land taken into trust for any federally recognized tribal nation. Prior to the bill's enactment. Nfo supports this legislation and urges the subcommittee to do the same. Next, we'd like to talk about appropriations and reclassification, inconsistent federal cycles.
▶ 2:41:03Federal funding cycles imposes real costs on tribal governments when programs that carry legal obligations are funded through discretionary appropriations, tribes cannot reliably plan on services that their citizens depend on. This was mentioned before.
▶ 2:41:18Nafo recommends reclassifying tribal tribally directed programs, in particular contract support costs and payments for tribal leases under the indian self-determination and education assistance act as mandatory appropriations. Next, the indian loan guarantee program, nafo encourages congress to protect and expand availability.
▶ 2:41:43Available lending authority through the department of interior indian loan guarantee program. As the ilp is a critical tool for tribal capital assets, but as currently authorized tribes cannot combine the ilp financing with a new market tax credit. This is a significant limitation with and with a simple low cost legislative fix.
▶ 2:42:11Resolving it would be meaningful to tribes across the nation. In conclusion, we look forward to working with congress and the administration to ensure that the federal investments in tribal economies are commensurate with. With the federal government's trust and treaty obligations. The evidence is clear when tribal nations have the policy tools, capital access and institutional support to develop their economies, their communities thrive, and so does the national economy.
▶ 2:42:39Honoring tribal sovereignty and investing in tribal economic development is not charity. It's a. It is responsible governance. Thank you so much for your attention to these vital matters. And nfo stands ready to support. >> thank you. Uh, you did just fine. Thank you for being here. And thank you for all that you do for indian country. Uh.
▶ 2:43:04We heard over these last two days, probably more about law enforcement than I have in any previous hearings that I've had. I think that's probably true, wouldn't you say so. And we always hear about healthcare, and we know that that's one of the main issues and so forth and so on.
▶ 2:43:25We know that education is, uh, is a big issue, but, um, law enforcement, tribal justice has, I think, really stood out in all of these hearings because almost everybody has mentioned, uh, the need to address this has, uh, the, uh, the national congress, uh. Or at least let me put it this way.
▶ 2:43:52What I'm most confused about, and I think one of the biggest challenges is jurisdictional issues. And I'm not sure how that all works. Tell you, the more I, the more I look at it and the more I study it, the more confused I get. As the national congress. Uh, do they look, are they looking at this, trying to address what needs to be done to address the jurisdictional issues? Uh, with law enforcement?
▶ 2:44:25>> yes. In a short answer, um, the issue comes up, um, from a variety of, uh, of sources, but probably the one most familiar to, to people in the most present is, is with vawa, uh, and, and, uh, the ability for, uh, for instance, in violence against women trying to level the, the, the playing field, the jurisdictional field where, um, those who, who commit
▶ 2:44:55Crimes against women, uh, tribes are need to be able to prosecute those offenders. And, and the way things are constructed due to, uh, standing law called the oliphant case. Uh, we've long argued for an oliphant fix.
▶ 2:45:11Um, I know there in the last handful of years, there have been, um, some of your colleagues in the house that a few that have started to talk about the need for that, but and there's been some inroads made over, uh, I think the previous, um, reauthorization of vawa, but, um, there really does need to be a global fix.
▶ 2:45:34But even if, even if the law was perfect in terms of, um, jurisdictional issues in indian country said, yes, this is where things need to be. Uh, we would still have this massive crisis level. Um, under-resourcing underfunding. Uh, and so that's, you know, that's really where the focus really needs to be. You know, there's two, two classifications for law enforcement in the united states.
▶ 2:46:03Um, and the tribes that are two, eight public law to 80 tribes for the state response, uh, is, is what happens on indian lands. And then those tribes that are not 280 tribes. And, um, the, the funding is still an issue. It's an issue everywhere, but it's most critical. Uh, I mean, you're talking about, you're talking about triage, you're talking about everybody bleeding, right?
▶ 2:46:29So the worst, the worst are the, the massively large reservation tribe, you know, tribal lands where, you know, you have one, two, 3 million acres of land and you and there are calls for service and there are response times that are not only extended extended response time, uh, you're talking greater than one hour to get, uh, a first responder on the scene of a violent crime.
▶ 2:46:57And usually by the time they, they arrive out there, there's, uh, the crime scene is deteriorated. Uh, people have come and gone footsteps through, you know, things removed and disturbed and, and, and if the tribal law enforcement agency even has a detective, uh, division to come through and do the investigation and do the not just the field report, but then the follow on, you know, the investigation.
▶ 2:47:25And then maybe beyond that, the forensics, it's, it's just not there. And so there's, it's the underfunding just leads to all kinds of things. There's a, there's a badges act proposal. I think it's, uh, the initial author was, uh, is a colleague of yours from washington state, um, that is looking for parity in things like pension. And so that goes to the retention of those existing officers.
▶ 2:47:53They're just, but, you know, we're taking these little bits of pieces of trying to fix them on the margins. But the core, the core piece of, of the massive underfund and underspend, uh, is tragic. It has tragic consequences. Consequences. Let me just say that the, um, um.
▶ 2:48:11Even the badgers act, you know, the tribal agencies across indian country will train people to work in law enforcement on their tribal departments.
▶ 2:48:25And, uh, they end up being their short term, you know, they end up being trained, experienced once they get enough experience under their belt, there's a cycle where they will go on to other adjacent jurisdictions or adjacent agencies, counties and cities. Um, because they pay well, they've got all the benefits and everything to support a career. And so that kind of pass through cycling is, is also something that we're competing with.
▶ 2:48:52And again, it, you know, there are numerous reasons for it. Fundamentally the lack of resources, lack of funding. >> yeah. And I, and, and we all recognize that the lack of funding. I mean, I was out on some reservations where it's you get a domestic violence call, it's two hours before you get there. Well guess what, it's over by then. Um, and that's a problem. Yeah. Uh, we obviously need to increase the, the resources so that they can have the officers and also retain them. That's, that's an issue everywhere.
▶ 2:49:19Being able to retain them on the, uh, reservations or tribes should not be training grounds for the local communities to, to hire more. And that's what it is essentially, uh, I, I'm, and maybe I'm just too stupid to understand.
▶ 2:49:37And that's probably the case, but how you, how, uh, and someone that commits a crime on a reservation, if you're a member of that reservation, you're treated one way. If you are a member of another tribe from another reservation, it's differently. Or if you're a white guy on the reservation, I'm one who believes that reservations on it, they ought to run themselves. Able to do what?
▶ 2:50:03What, uh, is necessary on their commits, a crime on their reservation. They ought to be able to punish the damn crime. Uh, but it. And that's why that's what I say about in jurisdictions, what I'm talking about. And and I don't know how you, I don't know how we created this system that we got. I can see how it kind of came about because, uh, white guys didn't trust indians to treat them right on the reservation if they'd committed a crime, you know, and, oh, all this kind of stuff.
▶ 2:50:31And that's, I can see how it developed, but somehow we got to fix it. >> if I can give you just an additional example, um, where jurisdiction comes into play, where it's a problem is, uh, is with, um, drugs, drug trafficking term I was looking for. Yeah.
▶ 2:50:50Um, there are many reservations non usually non public law to 80 reservations that, uh, it's well known to drug traffickers that, uh, they can go into a reservation with relative impunity and do their drug deals and trafficking, um, tribal police agencies will interdict, they will arrest and, but the ability to hold them after 72 hours is not there and there's no ability to prosecute.
▶ 2:51:19So they typically will have to take the drug dealers to the, the reservation line. Yeah, it's catch and release literally. And they go away for a few hours in some cases and come back the same day and do it all over again because, because, uh, there's no ability to prosecute and I don't know, uh, the local jurisdictions don't want to prosecute and, uh, they can't, you know, the crime was committed on the reservation either.
▶ 2:51:44So, um, there's this catch 22 and certainly a loophole that that needs to be fixed now. Of jurisdiction will fix that. But then, you know, it'll need to be backed up by, by funding so that the officers are there to, to be able to prosecute the courts are there to be able to prosecute. >> so I agree, but it's something that that we've got to look into. It's and it's not really this committee's issue. We do appropriations and stuff. That part is ours.
▶ 2:52:13But, uh, we've got to get the rest of congress involved. We've got to get the natural resources committee and their, their, uh, that does indian affairs, uh, looking at this and stuff because I think it's a huge issue. And I last year when we held our hearing on, on, uh, murdered and missing indigenous women. We had a woman that testified it's the first time she'd ever told her story. She was a young girl. She was kidnaped, and she was held in a cabin.
▶ 2:52:43And she was held there for a week or I think it was about a week. And she was beaten and raped. And and, uh, then she was dumped and alive, but she was dumped off the reservation. She couldn't identify the cabin that she was held at. She knew the guy that did it. And she was. But when they found her, she was off the reservation. So whose jurisdiction is it? Is it the reservation? Police?
▶ 2:53:12Is it the county police? Is it the state police? Is the fbi. You know, today she's on the council. And the person that did this to her is one of her constituents. Oh, that should not happen. >> no, it should not. >> and we can fix it. But it's going to take all of us working together. It does. And it's going to take some trust. And I will tell you when I grew up.
▶ 2:53:42Sheriff's police officers in communities didn't trust, uh, tribal law enforcement. They weren't trained. Today, they go to the same schools, they get the same training, everything else. And you're seeing a lot more communication and a lot more mou between cross deputization, between counties and between, uh, local communities and between tribes and stuff. That's a huge step forward. We've got to do more of it.
▶ 2:54:08We still have some retrograde people who don't believe that the tribes can, can do a good job. But, uh. >> I know that's happened in the, that that kind of, uh, cross-jurisdictional, uh, relationship building, but operational. Um, I guess effectiveness has been on the landscape with, uh, fire departments. I know that's the case.
▶ 2:54:32It certainly in california where reservation and non-reservation tribal departments, um, you know, because a wildland fire doesn't know where the reservation stops and where the county or forest service land begins. And so the, the, over the last, uh, I will say generation for sure, the last 20 years, there have been inroads in that, but that's exactly what needs to happen once, uh, tribal law enforcement agencies get fully funded.
▶ 2:54:58Um, those, these reports getting released by, um, these reports, uh, by the office of justice services will help define the size of the problem, which will help you do the job that you need to do, uh, and certainly advance appropriations would go a long ways toward the year to year. Part of that until we get to the full funding part. >> so appreciate it. >> yeah, thanks for the question. >> it's very important they do.
▶ 2:55:25They do a really important job for historic preservation and stuff. And, and, uh, I, uh, we support them. That's why we put the funding in, uh, last year. And I, if I remember correctly, didn't the administration want to eliminate them or something? And all that stuff? Anyway, we'll see what we'll see what the president's budget comes out this year. It's supposed to be out in the next couple of weeks. We'll see what it is. But that's okay. We'll do it. Thank you. Anyway. I'm not uh.
▶ 2:55:59I didn't know that they had a financial officer's association. Does every tribe have a financial officer? >> oh, yes. >> they probably have to have, don't they? >> yes, I, I my tribe's financial officer. So I regularly I enjoy numbers very much, obviously. But yes. So every tribe must have some financial officer, some might just have a, a volunteer council person that is their treasurer or ideally a bookkeeper or cfo, like our tribe has, has a cfo.
▶ 2:56:27But it's extremely important because you can't get grant funding if you can't account for it. And so really, financial officers are really the key to success for a lot of tribes. And that's why there's so much training. Um, and we offer online training so that I'm hoping to get a lot more future tribal members that are the financial officers. So because we would be the greatest caretaker for our governments and our companies. >> thank you. Thank you all for being here, shelly.
▶ 2:57:00>> thank you. Thank you, Mr. chair. You covered it all pretty well. But, um, yes, thank you for your testimony. And that's certainly an important role. And I was interested to hear some of the things that you mentioned in that bill around the tax code, and I can see why that would be important, particularly to give some parity with the states and more economic power. So thank you. Thank you for that. I appreciate very much the work that you do and the people you work with do. And I know in my state, maine, there's been a lot of interest in, you know, the return of artifacts.
▶ 2:57:27And there's just a lot of complicated things that go along. And also having sufficient funding and staffing to really process all those things when there's exchanges made. So thank you for the work you're doing there. And of course, thank you for all the things that were on your list of agenda items. They're all so important and things we've been talking about over the last two days. And I wholeheartedly agree on the law enforcement piece. And we'll do whatever we can to push on getting those, um, 22 and 23 reports released.
▶ 2:57:55Um, I've been using that $3 billion number. And I think you're right. I didn't realize it was that old, but I'm sure it's much worse. Um, and I think we just need to be able to keep talking about those real numbers so people understand the, you know, the pitiful amount that we're actually providing, um, compared to the actual need. So we will push on that and. Appreciate it. Yeah, thank you all. Really appreciate your testimony. >> thank you.
▶ 2:58:20And again, I want to thank all the witnesses that have come over the last couple of days to discuss issues that are important to indian country. And I noticed a number of them thanked us for taking two days and, you know, said how important our schedule was and timely and stuff. This is important to us, uh, to hear from, from you all.
▶ 2:58:40And so I want to thank you for taking the time to travel across the country and, and to come here to, to, uh, tell us what's important in, in indian country because it really is it, I mean, we're just doing our job. This is what you say is important to us. So we appreciate it very much. Thank you all for coming today. With that subcommittee stands adjourned. Thank you. Thank you. >> yeah. Significant.