▶ 0:00:10The Subcommittee on East Asia and the Pacific and the Subcommittee on South and Central Asia will come to order. This joint hearing will examine the division of labor between State and Commerce to determine if our commercial diplomacy enterprise is as effective and efficient as intended and to examine how these two agencies coordinate in the field. Let me now recognize myself for an opening statement.
▶ 0:00:39Good afternoon and welcome to today's joint hearing, more bang for the buck. Aligning commercial diplomacy between State and Commerce. Over the past year, our committee has examined commercial diplomacy and how it supports American businesses overseas, a capability that directly shapes our global competitiveness.
▶ 0:01:03While the United States possesses strong tools, they are spread across agencies and implemented unevenly at our posts. The Foreign Commercial Service delivers valuable private sector ex- expertise where present.
▶ 0:01:19However, with only about 200 personnel and coverage in roughly 1/3 of US posts, the burden of commercial diplomacy often falls on State Department economic officers who lack dedicated training. This produces gaps, unclear responsibilities, and missed opportunities for US companies.
▶ 0:01:43Congress must evaluate whether the current decades-old structure remains This hearing focuses on improving coordination, workforce expertise, and incentives so the right people with the right skills deliver results at post.
▶ 0:02:01In May, I introduced HR 962, the Boost American Business Act that provides targeted commercial diplomacy training to State Department personnel who are already performing this work where FCS is absent. It established a foreign service specialization to build portable expertise without duplicating FCS efforts or displacing commerce The aim is simple.
▶ 0:02:32Equip those doing the job today to do it better while respecting FCS State is already moving in this Department leadership has elevated commercial diplomacy as a priority. Under Secretary Jacob Helberg, he has stressed its centrality to US economic And Under Secretary Jason Evans outlined plans to retrain economic coned officers.
▶ 0:03:02And Assistant Secretary Orr launched the Commercial Diplomacy Enterprise to better support American businesses. Since the Department is advancing these efforts administratively, Congress should consider providing the necessary authorities and training to and strengthen them. So, I want to be very clear. This is not a criticism of the dedicated FCS officers whose accomplishments for American businesses are commendable.
▶ 0:03:34The challenges stem from systemic resourcing decisions that have created capacity gaps. We should celebrate what works while addressing shortcomings through better training, structure improvements, and alignment of authorities and resources.
▶ 0:03:51If we are serious helping American businesses succeed amid strategic competition, we need a coordinated, expert-driven commercial diplomacy So, I want to thank you, Assistant Secretary Orr and Assistant Secretary Fogel, for joining us today. And I look forward to a productive discussion on achieving that goal. Let me now recognize the ranking member from California, Representative Bera, for a statement.
▶ 0:04:20Thank you, Chairwoman Kim, Chairman Huizenga, and Ranking Member Connolly and for hosting this joint hearing this And thank you to Secretary Orr and Assistant Secretary Fogel for appearing before our subcommittees today. At a time of intensifying global competition, it is critical that the United States leverage every tool at our disposal to support American workers, innovators, and entrepreneurs while advancing our strategic interests.
▶ 0:04:47One of the most important and often overlooked tools we have is commercial diplomacy. Today's hearing is an opportunity to take a hard look at what is working and what is not and what Congress can do to ensure that both the State Department and Commerce Department are positioned to advance US strategic and private sector interests in the 21st century. In 2015, the State Department laid off about 1,300 employees.
▶ 0:05:12At the same time, staffing levels have at the Commerce Department's Foreign Commercial Service declined as a result of deferred retirements and hiring freezes. That means fewer experts on the ground in key markets, fewer advocates for American companies abroad, and fewer eyes and ears identifying opportunities and challenges in real time.
▶ 0:05:35Competitors like China are aggressively supporting their firms overseas with coordinated government backing, financing, and market access strategies. If we fail to match that level of commitment, we risk seeding both economic and strategic ground. Commercial diplomacy should lead efforts to promote emerging sectors like artificial intelligence.
▶ 0:05:56Um it should help American firms compete for major infrastructure and development projects financed by international And it should play a key role in strengthening vital supply chains, securing critical minerals, and reducing reliance on our strategic competitors. But to do that effectively, both State and Commerce need resources, staffing, and institutionalized coordination, and clear strategic direction.
▶ 0:06:23We also need to set up our officers overseas for success by adapting our institutions for the 21st century. We must leverage digital tools, improve coordination with other agencies, and strengthen communication between overseas officers and domestic offices. When American companies succeed abroad, they reinforcement reinforce our alliances, set global standards, and project American values. When they are absent, our competitors fill the void.
▶ 0:06:52I'm proud to have worked with Chairman Kim on the Dominance Act, which passed the House last month. The bill codifies Forge, formerly the Minerals Security Partnership, a commercial diplomacy initiative that allows the US to coordinate with partners and allies to diversify supply chains um from PRC control. The Dominance Act also strengthens interagency coordination through energy security pacts, and builds the workforce of the future through critical mineral exchange programs.
▶ 0:07:21I look forward to working with your departments to advance this bipartisan, bicameral legislation that ensures that your teams have the tools needed to secure supply chains vital to our national security. Thank you, and with that, I yield back.
▶ 0:07:35Thank you. The chair now recognizes the chairman of the South and Central Asia Subcommittee from Michigan, Representative Huizenga, for an opening
▶ 0:07:45Well, thank you, my fellow chair. Glad we could be doing this together. And as chairman of the subcommittee that oversees both BIS and ITA, I have sort of a unique perspective and jurisdiction over both export controls and export promotion within the Department of Commerce. This morning, our full committee had a hearing with Under Secretary Kestler on export controls.
▶ 0:08:11This afternoon, I'm pleased that we are joined by Assistant Secretary for Global Markets, Mr. Fogel, and Assistant Secretary for Economic Energy and Business Affairs, Mr. Ror, who are leading our export promotion efforts across the Departments of Commerce and State. America First means ensuring that America's economic interests are at the forefront of US foreign policy. Because, as we know, economic security is national security.
▶ 0:08:38This is critical for my home state of Michigan, which exports over $58 billion in goods to the world in 2025, including agricultural and manufactured products, automobiles and their components and chemicals, etc., etc. I'd be remiss, I have to throw in office furniture as well. We have the three largest office furniture makers in the world. All of which supports an estimated 230,000 Under President Trump's leadership, we're opening new markets for American businesses.
▶ 0:09:06The full potential of this new market access can only be realized if State and Commerce are in lockstep. Everyone from Fortune 100 companies to small and medium enterprises must get the resources, advocacy, and information they need to compete and capitalize on these global opportunities. In Michigan alone, 89% of the thousands of companies exporting from our state are those small and medium-sized companies with fewer than 500 employees.
▶ 0:09:34Foreign Commercial Service uh tasked with serving as America's business advocates on the ground, providing everything from business intelligence to ensuring that American businesses are fairly considered, and helping companies navigate the global regulatory landscape. It's essential for our commercial diplomacy efforts that the FCS and the State Department coordinate closely to ensure 24/7 around the world support for American businesses.
▶ 0:10:00A key pillar of our economic promotion strategy is the new American AI Export Program. The administration's AI action plan lays out a two-pronged approach to achieving American AI dominance. First, prevent American AI from fueling China's military modernization through export Second, promote global adaptation of American AI by making it as easy as possible for our partners, allies, and emerging markets to securely build uh their
▶ 0:10:30build using our AI technologies. The American AI Export Program is the landmark initiative to deliver on the promoting prong of the strategy, and I was proud to support uh the program's The Foreign Commercial Service is the lead agency implementing the American AI Export Program around the world, and this hearing provides an excellent opportunity to see how State and Commerce are working together to execute the mission.
▶ 0:10:58For from everything from AI models to Michigan blueberries, State and Commerce must be working together to help our businesses navigate and compete in global markets. I want to thank both of our witnesses for being here today, and I look forward to your testimony as you fight for American businesses. With that, I yield back.
▶ 0:11:16Thank you. Other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for the record. We're pleased to have a distinguished panel of witnesses before us today on this very important topic. The Honorable David Fogel, the Assistant Secretary of Commerce and Director General of the United States and Foreign Commercial Service with the International Trade Administration at the US Department of Commerce.
▶ 0:11:41And the Honorable Caleb Olle, the Assistant Secretary for Economic Energy and Business Affairs at the US Department of State. This committee recognizes the importance of the issues before us and is grateful to have both of you here to speak with us today. Your full statements will be made part and I will ask each of you to keep your spoken remarks to 5 minutes to allow time for member questions. And let me now recognize Mr. Fogel for an opening
▶ 0:12:17Chairwoman Kim, Chairman Huizenga, and members of the thank you for the opportunity to come before you today. I consider it the honor of my life to be serving President Trump and Secretary Leutnick as the Assistant Secretary of Commerce for Global Markets and Director General of the US and Foreign Commercial This administration is determined to deliver concrete commercial outcomes that create opportunities for American
▶ 0:12:47support American workers, and strengthen communities across the country. The Global Markets business unit within the International Trade Administration advances these priorities by promoting US export growth, facilitating foreign direct investment, and driving commercial advocacy and diplomacy on behalf of American businesses and Global Markets has achieved historic results since the start of the second Trump administration, building on
▶ 0:13:17a record of success since it joined the Department of Commerce in 1981. Last year, Global Markets helped US businesses, communities, and workers win an incredible $428 in client-verified deals, and assisted US firms. This work supported 1.3 million American jobs, more than 2024 and 2023 combined.
▶ 0:13:48In May, we hosted the Select USA Investment Summit, where we welcomed over 5,500 attendees, a record level, from more than 100 international markets, and all 55 US states and The 2026 Summit alone generated a record $2.5 billion in on-site announcements.
▶ 0:14:13This is all possible due to the highly integrated nature of the different offices within Global Markets and ITA. As just one example, ITA's Advocacy Center, which secured a record $244 in wins for US companies in 2025, does not operate in a vacuum. It relies on the Foreign Commercial Service to amplify the US advocacy message in foreign countries.
▶ 0:14:43I also want to acknowledge the important partnership between the Commerce Department and the State Department when it comes to commercial activity abroad. Our commercial officers throughout the world work collaboratively with states' economic officers, each bringing distinct but complementary expertise and responsibilities to advance US commercial and economic interests.
▶ 0:15:07This model has proven extraordinarily successful under the leadership of President Trump, Secretary Ross and Secretary Rubio. In President Trump's first term, I worked as Chief of Staff at the Export-Import Bank, as well as senior uh for the Under Secretary of State for Economic Growth.
▶ 0:15:27I know from firsthand experience that what we do within Global Markets, including our successes from last year and throughout Global Markets history, reflects a distinctive combination of expertise, global reach, and commercial focus that would be difficult to replicate elsewhere in the federal government.
▶ 0:15:48Global Markets is moving quickly to strengthen our operations, modernize our approach, and better align resources with the administration's commercial priorities. Under my direction, Global Markets is concentrating its efforts where our expertise, global presence, and commercial tools can have the greatest impact on economic growth, job and economic security.
▶ 0:16:16In short, the Department of Commerce strongly values the Foreign Commercial Service and the vital role it plays in advancing America's commercial interests The Foreign Commercial Service and all of Global Markets is central to the federal government's ability to execute President Trump's America First Trade and Investment Agenda, supporting US businesses around the world and delivering results for American workers,
▶ 0:16:47manufacturers, and businesses of all sizes. Thank you again, and I look forward to our discussion and your
▶ 0:16:55Thank you, Mr. Fogo. Now, I recognize Mr. Ol for your statement.
▶ 0:17:05Well, thank you, Chairwoman Kim, uh and Chairman Huizenga for inviting me to this hearing today. And thank you to the subcommittee uh for your focus on commercial diplomacy. The State Department acknowledges and appreciates your ongoing support for the US government's commercial diplomacy President Trump's national security strategy articulates the fundamental relationship between economic security and national security, recognizing the United States economic strength as the foundation for our global
▶ 0:17:35leadership and military power, and our commercial presence in strategic infrastructure in key theaters as an important source of The State Department is focused on advancing the president's priorities of balancing trade, securing critical supply chains, reindustrializing the American economy, reviving our defense industrial base, establishing energy dominance, and preserving and growing our global economic leadership.
▶ 0:18:02Under Secretary Rubio's leadership, we are leveraging commercial diplomacy to drive this agenda. Commercial diplomacy helps the US forge and maintain strategic partnerships, secure critical supply chains, open foreign markets for American firms, and create opportunities for American Moreover, commercial diplomacy in the Trump administration is a key tool of diplomatic statecraft.
▶ 0:18:26For example, President Trump's leadership in securing peace between Armenia and Azerbaijan treated US economic engagement not only as a byproduct of successful diplomacy, but a catalyst for it. Similarly, in Venezuela, the Trump administration is focused on economic recovery as a key component of our which has become all the more urgent after the devastating June 24th In support of these objectives worldwide, earlier this year the State
▶ 0:18:56Department launched the Commercial Diplomacy Enterprise, or CDE, the most significant reorganization of State's economic statecraft capacity in years. The CDE has organized and systematized the State Department's commercial diplomacy work streams.
▶ 0:19:12We developed a single unified platform to centralize all economic and commercial cases that the department is including both Commerce's Advocacy Center cases that State supports and cases falling outside of Advocacy's Addressing previously debilitating data fragmentation problems and internal coordination challenges.
▶ 0:19:34We have also stood up new processes to consistently elevate commercial cases for the State Department leadership's engagement and a system to share strategic deal opportunities that we identify at post with interagency State has many tools that it uses to support US companies and trusted providers, ranging from visa issuances and denials, anti-corruption sanctions to foreign assistance.
▶ 0:19:59The CDE integrates commercial diplomacy into the department's core functions at post and our regional bureaus, identifying and developing strategic commercial opportunities using the full suite of State Department and interagency tools, ensuring the US competes where it matters most. As a result, since January 20th, 2025, the State Department has contributed to over $515 billion in wins for US companies, supporting an estimate of more than 1.4 million US jobs.
▶ 0:20:31To advance the administration's trade and investment agenda, Commerce and State brings distinct but complementary State leverages its global diplomatic presence, flexible diplomatic and foreign assistance tools, and regional expertise in nearly all overseas economies with over 1,500 economic officers stationed at US embassies and consulates worldwide across more than 170 countries.
▶ 0:20:55Our ambassadorial leadership, broad purview over US strategic interests and foreign policy, and contacts with foreign governments and ministries allow us to contribute to the efforts of the our interagency partners like Commerce. We work with Commerce's US and Foreign Commercial Service, which is focused on promoting US exports and inbound investment into the United States, as well as supporting US commercial interest overseas.
▶ 0:21:21State also works with the Department of Energy, leveraging its extensive technical expertise and attaches at more than 25 US embassies around the world. We work closely together on many initiatives, including deal teams, commercial advocacy through Commerce's advocacy center, and through the partner post program.
▶ 0:21:41In many foreign markets where the Commerce Department does not maintain a direct overseas presence, the State Department's economic officers help facilitate Commerce's services through the partner post program, which delivered 116 client verified commercial wins totaling more than 13.7 and assisted over 3,000 US companies uh in fiscal year 2025, a significant increase from the 2.98 billion in wins in fiscal 2024.
▶ 0:22:07Under Secretary Rubio's leadership, State will continue to leverage commercial diplomacy in coordination with our interagency partners to help American companies succeed around the world, delivering for American workers, and strengthening our economic and national security. Thank you for the opportunity to testify, and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:22:24Thank you, Mr. Ruelas. I now recognize myself for 5 minutes of questioning. Um let me start with a very short question, and hopefully it will be a very short answer. both uh secretaries, uh between State and Commerce, which is the lead agency when it comes to international commercial diplomacy?
▶ 0:22:48I'm happy to start. Um and I I don't believe you're going to hear an inconsistent answer here, and I appreciate that question, Congresswoman. Uh in markets where Commerce commercial staff and officers are present uh with obviously our state colleagues because they're in every market. The commercial team at Commerce does take the lead.
▶ 0:23:11Um meaning for the most part, they're the ones who maintain the deal list in country. They're the ones uh the first point of contact often. And they're the ones taking the lead, but it's a collaborative process where we involve the economic officers and the ambassador as appropriate.
▶ 0:23:29Let me ask you why I asked the question. You know, when I look at the uh State Department's uh social media posts, I see Assistant Secretary Oval's work at the FedEx Global Legal and Security Conference touting, quote, market access wins, and also, quoting on quote, defending US businesses.
▶ 0:23:51The quote in one State Department social media post, which is attributed to Assistant Secretary Oval, was, in quoting on quote, "The State Department sees its role not as a regulator of American enterprise, but as its advocate." Good. Under Secretary Helberg's social media, routinely spotlights his meetings with foreign dignitaries and business leaders, where he uses the term, quote unquote, commercial diplomacy to describe the work he's doing.
▶ 0:24:21And the department even uses the hashtag commercial diplomacy in many of his social media posts regarding the work of Under Secretary Helberg. So, you can understand why it might be a little bit confusing if Commerce is supposedly the lead agency here, but State Department is doing the most visible work.
▶ 0:24:41So, let me ask you, uh Assistant Secretary Fogle, over the last decade, Commerce's overseas commercial workforce has steadily declined, and under FY 2027 budget proposals, those reductions would accelerate even further. So, let me point to the chart that I'm showing here. This chart shows that global market staffing is now at its lowest level since 2007.
▶ 0:25:09I believe it's 2007 2017. Given these sustained personnel losses, how can Commerce credibly argue that it has the capacity to meet the growing demand for commercial diplomacy and effectively support American businesses
▶ 0:25:27Sure. Thank you for that question. Uh first of all, it sounds like I should hire the marketing team from the State Department at Commerce. But seriously, uh Congresswoman, thank you for that. Let me just say uh it starts with how we're already being.
▶ 0:25:43Look at the first year and a half of the Trump So, with the reductions that you mentioned, which are fairly modest, especially on the foreign commercial service team, you know, frankly, we've delivered record results. And that's I I give a lot of the credit to President Trump, Secretary Loudner, Secretary Rubio, um because they've really led the way in emphasizing commercial diplomacy. And we welcome State's participation. I welcome those posts.
▶ 0:26:12I follow both of the um uh leaders that you mentioned, my colleague here and Under Secretary Halbert. And we welcome them. By the way, we put out a lot of posts as well. Um and that's okay. I don't think the fact that they're posting about the same thing that we are make means that there's that much confusion. I think it's pretty clear in at the post. If you ask the economic officers, if you ask the ambassadors, I talk to US ambassadors all the time.
▶ 0:26:42They know who's leading the way, um and that's the Commerce team. Now, um to your point about personnel, uh the fact that we delivered 428 billion last year in overall client verified wins, the fact that the advocacy center hit a record number of 244 billion, uh, the fact that we assisted 76,400 companies last year, I think all reinforce that we're still being very effective notwithstanding whatever uh, budget
▶ 0:27:12limitations exist.
▶ 0:27:13Like I said, this is in no way criticism of the work that you are doing which I believe it's doing a great, great job, but I just wanted to make sure that, um, you know, you are supporting our efforts to strengthen the commercial diplomacy training that state is already doing where the FCS uh, is not present. So, just wanted to clarify that.
▶ 0:27:37Assistant Secretary Ord, uh, quickly, I was really excited to see last week's announcement that the US will now chair Forge, um, the to secure our critical mineral supply chain with allies. So, do you support Congress trying to codify Forge?
▶ 0:27:56Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. And and let me just start by saying that we work very closely with the Department of Commerce. And I think the the challenge is mainly jurisdictional. The State Department is in over 170 countries in the world, Commerce is at over 80. And so, the State Department will do commercial advocacy for US companies no matter where we are. Some subset of those cases where Commerce is present come through the Department of Commerce in the advocacy process. And the State Department lends our support to those cases whenever it's available.
▶ 0:28:26But but State will take commercial advocacy for US companies as it comes in from whatever source, um, from from Commerce, which is a very well-established process, or from other sources as well. With respect to Forge, uh, thank you very much for your focus, Madam Chairwoman, on the the the essential problem of resolving our critical minerals uh, choke points around the world.
▶ 0:28:47Secretary Rubio uh hosted the largest ministerial in the State Department's history back in February with 55 delegations uh from around the world uh to focus on the issue of critical mineral supply chain bottlenecks and our access as a country for our manufacturing jobs, for our consumers to the essential critical minerals derivative products that power the 21st century economy.
▶ 0:29:09And Secretary Rubio uh has taken over the chairmanship of Forge, as you mentioned, and we very much appreciate Congress's uh support and efforts to codify the United States membership in that body.
▶ 0:29:21Thank you very much. Let me now recognize the gentle lady from Washington, Representative Jayapal.
▶ 0:29:27Thank you so much, Madam Chair, uh and welcome to both of you. Um Assistant Secretary, or in your role, you cover a portfolio that includes US sanctions tied to US policy goals, and so I want to talk about Cuba. Um this June, the State Department imposed sanctions on Cuba's state-owned oil company, um while also blocking the delivery of fuel to the island.
▶ 0:29:52This was on top of a crushing decades-long embargo that has made food scarce on the island and made it difficult to import medicines, medical equipment, a host of other civilian goods. Are you aware that Cuba only produces about 20% of its food needs on the island? You can just answer yes or no, it's
▶ 0:30:11Congresswoman, President Trump and Secretary Rubio have been very clear that it is not acceptable for American national security interests
▶ 0:30:18I'm asking you about Are you aware that Cuba only produces 20% of its food needs on the island?
▶ 0:30:24The The national security interests of the United States will not tolerate
▶ 0:30:2890 miles off the coast of our shores.
▶ 0:30:30Under Secretary, so did Are you aware that Cuba only produces 20% of its food
▶ 0:30:36Cuba is governed by a corrupt elite
▶ 0:30:39Okay. Are you aware that since 2018, following an increase of sanctions under the first Trump administration, infant mortality increased by 148%?
▶ 0:30:50Congresswoman, the the the the fault
▶ 0:30:53not going to answer the questions, I'll just go through them, but I'm asking you specific questions about the conditions of the Cuban people.
▶ 0:31:00Secretary Rubio has been very clear that the fault lies with the Cuban elite who waste resources and squander them.
▶ 0:31:05High Commissioner for Human Rights is is my time, Mr. Orr.
▶ 0:31:09Are you aware that in June the High Commissioner for Human Rights at the United Nations, Volker Turk, pointed to statistics that showed infant mortality nearly doubled in recent months, and because you're probably not going to answer that, let me also tell you that there are Cuban nurses in maternity wards that are hand pumping ventilators due to a lack of fuel.
▶ 0:31:30I delivered my baby, she was 1 lb 14 oz, 26 and 1/2 weeks, and I went into that maternity hospital where they had four [snorts] working incubators. So, these are Cuban civilians who have no access to any of that. Are you aware that Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention prohibits collective punishment?
▶ 0:31:52President Trump has clearly stated he stands with the Cuban people and against the regime that steals the fuel that powers the hospitals and schools.
▶ 0:31:58to answer any of my questions? Otherwise, I can just make a speech. Are you aware of Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention that prohibits collective punishment? It's a yes or no
▶ 0:32:09The collective punishment is being imposed by the Cuban regime.
▶ 0:32:12you know what collective What is the definition of collective punishment? Do you know? In the Geneva Convention?
▶ 0:32:18The the Cuban regime is the one that is punishing its
▶ 0:32:21the definition Obviously, you don't know, so let me tell you what it is. No protected person may be punished for an offense he or she has not personally committed. And Mr. Orr, that is exactly what this embargo is intended to be. It's a form of collective punishment.
▶ 0:32:35Ahead of the United States placing its embargo on Cuba in 1962, a classified State Department memo stated that the goals of broad-based US sanctions should be to quote, "Deny money and supplies to Cuba, to decrease monetary and real wages, and bring about hunger, desperation, and overthrow of the government." We are 60 years later now, and none of the goals that you are talking about have been realized.
▶ 0:33:05But, what has been realized is the Cuban people have been essentially destroyed. Infant mortality up, no food, no water, no medical supplies. Since the imposition of the embargo on has Cuba held fully democratic
▶ 0:33:21The Cuban people have been deprived the access to democratic
▶ 0:33:24answer is no. Have they ceased the detention of political prisoners? The answer is no. And is the same regime from the 1960s still in place? The answer is no. So, Mr. Orr, maybe it is time for the United States to think about another way of addressing the policy goals that we have other than punishing the entire Cuban people. That is what I saw. I don't know if you've been there recently. I was there just a few months ago. I could not believe what I saw. And I got to tell you, Mr.
▶ 0:33:53Orr, the American people are incredibly generous. To create that kind of collective punishment on a nation of 9 million people that is just 90 miles south of our border, I think Americans would be horrified. I think they would be absolutely horrified that young premature babies in a maternity hospital cannot get an incubator, can't get a ventilator.
▶ 0:34:18Doctors and nurses are holding up cell phones and using the light of their cell phones as they perform major surgeries. This is not the way to go about diplomacy. There should be a negotiated agreement between the United States and the Cuban government. And I have met with dissidents. I have met with the president. I have met with people across the political spectrum. What everyone agrees on is that the collective punishment of the Cuban people is wrong.
▶ 0:34:45And the United States should lift the embargo, allow fuel to get to Cuba, and we should make sure that we actually invest in a relationship that helps the American people. Do you know that the Cuban Health Department has actually developed a treatment for Alzheimer's that 11 million people here in the United States could have access to if we had any kind of a relationship. My time is expired, Madam Chair. I appreciate this, and I yield back.
▶ 0:35:12Thank you. I now recognize the gentleman from Missouri, Chairman Huizenga, for 5
▶ 0:35:17Uh it's Michigan, Madam Chair, but that's okay. Uh by definition, in international humanitarian law, protected persons primarily refer to civilians, wounded or sick combatants, prisoners of war, and medical or religious personnel who fall into the hands of an enemy party during an international armed conflict. They are entitled to humane treatment and immunity from deliberate attack. She's gone. Okay.
▶ 0:35:42Well, apparently she didn't want to know what a protected persons was and what Article 4 actually Um and uh that is uh it's a it's a joke to think that Cuba is some sort of nirvana that we can go visit. It has been a failed state. I had a concentration in Latin American history and Latin American politics back in my day in college, and I did many a paper on what was happening in Central America and in Latin America uh with uh with armed conflict at the time.
▶ 0:36:12So, uh you're Mr. Ore, you're absolutely right. Uh Cuba uh is a problem not because of the people, but because of the leadership. And that is absolutely what this administration needs to be doing, continuing to put pressure on the Cuban leadership, which has failed its people repeatedly for decades.
▶ 0:36:37And in a country like Cuba that has to ration sugar, it's ridiculous uh to think that their system of government or their system of economics is in any way, shape, or or form successful. So, now I want to get back to my actual questioning to you all. I have uh oversight of both BIS and ITA in the H-VAC, as we as we had discussed.
▶ 0:37:01I'm also a member of the Development Finance Corporation's Congressional Strategic Advisory Group and Vice Chair of the Financial Services Committee, where I oversee the EXIM Bank. Um so, I may actually have probably one of the largest oversight interests in making sure that all of American AI Export program and other programs is successful. I want to talk about AI Um we stand roughly a year after the AI Action Plan release. Um Mr. Fogel, can you provide an update on the program?
▶ 0:37:29What are the program's key goals to hit at the end of the year, the metrics of success, and priority regions?
▶ 0:37:36Absolutely. Um Let me for 1 second just go back to Madam Chairwoman Kim. Uh I just want to point out that the US and foreign the foreign commercial service uh covers 95% of global GDP in terms of where it's represented. So, you would cited uh the number of embassies that we were located in, and I respect that.
▶ 0:37:59Um and I respect what you're doing to try to improve coordination between State and Commerce, but I just want to point out that statistic because I think it's very relevant. Um I'm sorry, uh back to you, Mr. Chairman. Um There's a lot of exciting things happening with the AI Exports program. Um we just announced publicly that we received our first wave of applications, 78 applications for the preset consortium program.
▶ 0:38:28That is significantly more, probably three times the number of applications that we were estimating internally. Those applications span the gamut of large a USAI companies as well as some small and mid-size companies as well. But we're very excited about that and the goal of the program, as you know, because it was indicated in President Trump's executive order, is that this is a race America has to win.
▶ 0:38:57Second place, failure is not an option. We have to come in first vis-à-vis China. And so we're working on that aggressively. There's a interagency team
▶ 0:39:08and you say vis-à-vis China, I'm assuming that means you believe that there are proper controls that need to be put in place to make sure that China and the CCP and others that are affiliated with that are not able to gain some of that technology, correct?
▶ 0:39:21Yes, and I'm sure Mr. Kessler testified to that earlier today.
▶ 0:39:26would be surprised, maybe it wasn't quite as strong as we would have hoped.
▶ 0:39:28Okay. Well, let me just say, of course that is part of it. That's handled by BIS. It's not my So as you understand well, it's a That's fine. I'm just saying and I respect what they're doing, too, cuz it is a balance. Look, we want to promote exports, but we also need to balance
▶ 0:39:44I I've got a couple of other questions that I may have to put in writing. I got pulled off by the by the Geneva Convention there at the beginning. Sorry about that. when um Here, let me let me finish with this, my last remaining seconds. You know, I I'm I'm proud of the fact that Michigan is a major exporter. in fact, we ranked 10th among the states as as an exporter of all of our goods.
▶ 0:40:12And I want to know what are some of the most helpful resources the F FCS and the state are able to provide to those exporters and specifically can you explain how Michiganers and those businesses can get in touch with FCS and and State Department both in the United States and overseas. Sure.
▶ 0:40:36Well, the best first place to start is the US Export Assistance Center in the state of Michigan. That's often the first point of contact particularly for small businesses. They then put those companies in touch with the Foreign Commercial Service when needed the State Department to help if the issue is a State Department related issue. So US Export Assistance Center, it's on our website or our DC headquarters. Those are the best places.
▶ 0:41:01Very well.
▶ 0:41:03And that that website is?
▶ 0:41:06Uh trade.gov.
▶ 0:41:07There we go. Awesome. Great. We'll make sure we get that posted. Thank you. I now recognize gentleman from Maryland, Representative Ozizski for 5 minutes.
▶ 0:41:19Thank you Chair Kim to our witnesses for being here as well. You know, when we talk about helping US businesses succeed overseas, we often focus on trade agreements, export advocacy for international companies. And to be clear, I agree these tools absolutely matter and commercial diplomacy is essential if we want our private sector to compete and win But I also just want to make the point that commercial diplomacy does not operate in a vacuum.
▶ 0:41:50American businesses are far more likely to invest and succeed in countries with stable institutions, reliable infrastructure, a skilled workforce, transparent regulations, and the rule of law. We know such conditions do not emerge overnight. They are built over years through US development programs that strengthen market institutions, improve governance, expand access to education and health care, and that support economic reform.
▶ 0:42:17These conditions reduce risk and help create market conditions where American companies can compete on a level playing field. I appreciate the administration's trade over aid initiative, but I also want to make sure that we are not framing this as a false choice. The real question should not be trade versus aid, but what it takes to make trade possible. That's why it's concerning to me that this administration is not prioritizing the work that does just that.
▶ 0:42:43For the second consecutive year, it's proposed significant reductions in economic and development assistance, a proposed 25% We all want to transition countries off aid, but signing a critical minerals deal by itself will not get us there. Assistant Secretary Orr, I saw that you spoke at the trade over aid launch event back in April. Um can you talk to us a little bit about how these kinds of development assistance tools complement your bureau's work and objectives?
▶ 0:43:12Well, thank you for the question, Congressman. And I completely agree that our foreign assistance should be aimed at driving the kind of development that only commercial investment really can bring. And there are certain preconditions, obviously, for commercial investment to be something that can be durable, um you know, beyond any particular short-term period. And um we're we're absolutely at the State Department, we're focused on using the foreign assistance tools we have to drive commercial investment directly. You know, we we always talk about operating on Trump speed.
▶ 0:43:42We want to have outcomes uh that are very solid within the time horizons that we have uh at the department. And so, uh whether it's through institutions like the Millennium Challenge Corporation, which has a scorecard, as you know, that focuses on things like the rule of law and preventing expropriation. These are the kinds of basic building blocks that can drive commercial investment and help economic growth in the developing world. But but more than that, with you would mention because you mentioned critical minerals agreements, we've now signed over 28 bilateral critical minerals agreements.
▶ 0:44:13And those critical minerals agreements form a foundation on which we can provide foreign assistance. We are providing in several countries, including some we recently provided a congressional notification to the Hill for, uh mapping resources to countries that have previously never known even uh the amount of critical minerals reserves they have in their countries. And we can do that precisely because we agreed to do so in these critical minerals agreements that uh President Trump and Secretary Rubio are pursuing.
▶ 0:44:38And so, those agreements, uh which include, by the way, commitments to, you know, protect the rule of law for US companies, protect uh US investors, give us the comfort we need to go in and help open up resources for US companies to invest in.
▶ 0:44:51Great. Thank you. Um Mr. Fogle, I'll follow up with a written question about the relationship between commercial diplomacy and the development assistance programs, um just cuz I have limited time. So, I apologize I won't have time for that. But, just because it came up again on on the critical minerals, I I had this as a a separate topic. Um last November, the US sealed a mining agreement with Kazakhstan with direct involvement of President Trump and Secretary Lutnick.
▶ 0:45:15Around the time that deal was finalized, Dominari Securities, partly owned by the president's sons, and Cantor Fitzgerald, overseen by Secretary Lutnick's sons, got involved in the project. Uh the Kazakh deal was ultimately signed after the Trump administration approved 1.6 billion in federal financing for Kaz Resources and after an investment in the same company by Trump's sons and their partners. The Trump family investment was not disclosed to the public until it a New York Times story just over 2 weeks ago.
▶ 0:45:44Um for either of you, can you just walk us through the guardrails that State and Commerce have to ensure commercial diplomacy is not being used to enrich any member of uh the family member of anyone in power, including the president.
▶ 0:46:00Well, thank you for the question. Let me just say that deal is an incredibly important deal for the United States. It involves the largest undeveloped deposit of tungsten in the world. And tungsten, as you probably know, is critical for manufacturing aerospace defense. So, very important deal. That was has been the focus throughout in terms of my knowledge of it and my team's knowledge has been just focused on the strategic benefits.
▶ 0:46:30We vet every deal. We do that that goes through the advocacy center, which is this deal is an example of that. So, we vet it in terms of ownership and other factors.
▶ 0:46:43Yes, and Congressman, we we focus very intensely on ethics compliance. We rely on the advocacy center's certification process, and the State Department has its own certification process to ensure that nobody who's working on the cases has any conflicts of interest.
▶ 0:46:58So, so you were aware of of the relationships as the deal was, because I agree it's an important deal, but I just think that it could have been done without necessarily benefiting people who are directly in power, and would love to continue that conversation given the opportunity. I'm passing my time. I yield back. Thank you, Madam Chair.
▶ 0:47:13Thank you. The gentleman from Guam, Mr. Moylan, is now recognized.
▶ 0:47:16Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm proud to have introduced the U.S. TDA Modernization Act of 2026, which recognizes the agency's critical role in advancing United States commercial infrastructure interests in priority emerging markets, like those in the Pacific Islands. However, outdated policies could restrict U.S. commercial diplomacy in nations classified as high-income due to their small So, Mr.
▶ 0:47:44Orr, how can we how can the future of commercial diplomacy assist countries with small population to obtain early-stage project project preparation and technical assistance to strengthen American interests abroad.
▶ 0:48:02Well, thank you for the question, Congressman, and thank you for your work in ensuring that our trade and development assistance agencies have the flexibility and the discretion that they need to make investments consistent with our foreign policy and national security priorities.
▶ 0:48:16I think that that was one of the greatest advantages of the recent DFC authorization that this committee worked on and passed in the NDAA last year, which is to give the DFC the ability and the flexibility to invest in countries that were previously considered high income uh by by the World Bank, so that the United States is not handicapped by some income classification by uh international uh organizations.
▶ 0:48:39At the end of the day, uh Secretary Rubio and under President Trump, we are focusing our foreign assistance, including investment supports, to countries where we have a foreign policy interest uh in protecting our national security and helping uh them develop and creating opportunities for US firms.
▶ 0:48:55And um the Pacific Islands is certainly one of those theaters where we have immense strategic interests um that really, I think, are are much bigger than the current GDPs of of those countries uh may suggest when it comes to to infrastructure, uh the availability of shipping lanes, the availability of energy, um fishing.
▶ 0:49:16There are lots of great resources for the United States and for our companies to tap into, and so we we thank you for your work uh with the US TDA authorization language and with the DFC, so that we can invest in those priorities in those countries.
▶ 0:49:31Uh thank you. Uh Mr. Portell, uh how can we encourage commercial diplomacy to become more competitive in exports, investment attractions, supply chain resilience, technological leadership, and geopolitical influence, considering our adversarial actors and their investments str- in strategics uh strategies aboard.
▶ 0:49:54Thank you for the question, Congressman. And we're doing exactly that. I mean, if you look at the priorities that I set forth for the entire global markets team, almost 1,100 in my first four to six weeks on the it was exactly that, to take into account economic security in everything we do.
▶ 0:50:15So, we're constantly on the lookout for what are economic competitors are involved in, where they're bidding, how we can outbid them if it's strategically important to the United States. Um one of the things we're trying to do is make sure that the bidding processes are fair and that we participate earlier in the bidding processes.
▶ 0:50:40That has been a problem in the past where we've lost out because either the bidding processes were tainted or the American companies just didn't know about the opportunities. And that's something that we've worked with State on as well is to try to learn of the opportunities or the pending opportunities earlier so we can get American companies participating and beat out our economic competitors.
▶ 0:51:05Thank you. Along that line, what are critical steps that small islands can take to ensure that upstream and downstream value chain chain actors, incubators, and accelerators or technology hubs and facilitators are prioritized to encourage local economic development?
▶ 0:51:27Well, thank you, Congressman. Look, I I I think that's a great question and that's something that we've been looking at at the State Department because small island countries have some unique opportunities to drive forward innovations that could redound to the benefit of the United States here at home.
▶ 0:51:43And I think one of the key areas that we're looking at is when it comes to geothermal technology because of the access that the small island countries have to to achievable geothermal, it can really be a frontier market for the development of geothermal technology that we can then deploy both in the United States and in some of our neighboring markets.
▶ 0:52:02Thank you very much. I appreciate your comments. Looking forward to seeing you both in Guam soon. It'll be nice. Thank you, Madam Chair.
▶ 0:52:09Thank you. Let me now recognize the gentleman from California, Representative Gallego.
▶ 0:52:16Yes, thank you, Madam Chairwoman. Um gentlemen, I wanted to focus on agriculture here for a second. Uh you know, in my northern California district, we uh grow many many crops, uh rice, walnuts, almonds, um all that you know, are facing trade pressures uh right now. We're obviously working on new trade deals with with India and Japan and others.
▶ 0:52:37Um but we often, you know, these are small medium-sized businesses, uh producers who are often uh you know, having to navigate against foreign governments who heavily subsidize uh you know, their uh their growers and have many trade barriers that have been imposed. So, my question to you, maybe starting with uh Mr.
▶ 0:52:56Orr is like, what in what ways can we use commercial diplomacy uh and what are maybe some of the strategies that you guys are working on to to battle against some of those trade barriers that we're experiencing right now and you know, an uneven playing field, you know, for many of our growers here in in America.
▶ 0:53:14Absolutely, Congressman. Well, as you know, President Trump has been laser-focused on addressing these trade barriers to American farmers uh in key markets abroad. Um at the State Department for for our part, I think this is a great illustration of some of the division of labor between State and Commerce. Our economic officers are focused on changing some of these policies that put up barriers to American agricultural exports. So, while Commerce has the tools and the advocacy center to work on individual uh business transactions.
▶ 0:53:45The State Department, in addition to lending support to those transactions where it's in our foreign policy interests to do so, the State Department also focuses our economic officers on addressing and changing the policies of foreign governments so that they can are more conducive to American exports and helping foreign governments really understand the benefits of changing those policies so that they can have more affordable food, which is a key foreign policy priority that affects the stability of the governments that we work with around the world. So, so we view agriculture as a key priority.
▶ 0:54:14One of the things that that we have developed with the commercial diplomacy enterprise at the State Department, which is our centralized tool for tracking all commercial cases we are working on, is we have the ability to identify cases by sector so that we can identify agricultural cases or communications, telecommunications technology cases, whatever the case may be. And so, if there are particular agriculture cases where you think that foreign governments are denying, you know, businesses and farmers in your district to sell, then please let us know and we'd love to work on those with those governments.
▶ 0:54:46Yeah, and probably the biggest one is China. And so, maybe like a follow-up, like what are we doing kind of to vis-a-vis China, you know, where I mean, they they tend to flood markets, you know, to undermine our our exports, um and and otherwise, you know, throw up trade barriers. We're not, you know, I can't sell rice into China, right? For example. Uh so, you know, what are what are ways that we can combat China vis-a-vis some of these things that I'd also open it up to the under secretary as well.
▶ 0:55:15Let me just say, Congressman, on the China question, obviously President Trump is treating the China relationship as the most important relationship that we have structurally in our geopolitics. And he's making agriculture commitments a huge part of the relationship. I mean, China, ever since the phase one trade deal in 2019, has not lived up to its commitments to purchase American agricultural products. And so, President Trump has made China living up to those commitments a key part of our priorities for the China relationship.
▶ 0:55:43And in establishing this kind of managed trade relationship where we focus on outcomes rather than rather than processes is a a new way of thinking about trade policy that is I think uniquely conducive to the the Chinese system and how they
▶ 0:55:57Assistant Secretary.
▶ 0:55:59Sure. Uh first on the China question, I'll start there. Uh the US Trade Rep's office and uh Treasury Department have really taken the lead on China. Um and so in particular with respect to agriculture, we tend to stay away from that at Commerce. So I'm just trying to keep the lines straight on that. Um but back to your original point about uh non-tariff barriers, I just want to point out they are incredibly important and, you know, often overlooked.
▶ 0:56:29Uh people tend to focus on tariff rates, but the reality is these non-tariff barriers are very insidious and they're impeding market access and you're facing it with your constituents. I will say Commerce does play a also a leading role in combating these non-tariff barriers. It's one of the key functions that we play. Uh we have a another division within Commerce, the Enforcement and Compliance Division, that's cons- consistently analyzing these trade deals and the enforcement of them to make sure that they're being adhered to.
▶ 0:56:59We're the team on the ground in those markets that are uh you know, educated and in this area and able to track these commitments and make sure that they're adhered adhered to. Now, we also work with State on this as the Assistant Secretary said. So it's a team
▶ 0:57:18Yeah, and uh I'll just end with this as my time is up, but uh you know, I'll add to the, you know, the very the big focus on rare earth minerals. Uh you know, my district's also home to Beale Air Force Base, you know, which is now has the Collaborative Compact aircraft program, uh which is going to be very reliant on rare earth minerals. Uh so, it ensuring that we have a strategy uh between both both departments uh to really combat China on that. I mean, they right now they have control about 90%.
▶ 0:57:49Uh you know, and so we need to be very vigilant on that front. And so, I'll just maybe add my admonition that we really work on having a whole you know, complex uh strategy to address that issue. Thank you. Representative Biggs from South Carolina, you're now recognized.
▶ 0:58:07Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you to our witnesses for your testimony this afternoon. Just a few weeks ago, the House Judiciary Committee completed a lengthy investigation and issued a report entitled Closed for Competition, South Korea's Discriminatory Attacks on an American-Owned Businesses. That report goes into great detail about how the South Korean government has discriminated against American companies operating there.
▶ 0:58:37Madam Chair, I'd also like to ask unanimous consent to enter the Judiciary Committee's report into the record.
▶ 0:58:45Thank you. This is of particular concern to me because South Carolina is known as the tire capital of the United States, and South Korea has long been an export market for our tires. But, we stand to lose access to that market if South Korea is successful in pushing American companies out of their domestic market altogether.
▶ 0:59:08As we think about commercial diplomacy, I'd like to ask each of you, what role do your agencies play in pushing back against this kind of unfair playing field when it's imposed by a foreign
▶ 0:59:24Well, thank you for the question, Congresswoman. And let me just start by saying that we're at the State Department we are tracking very closely those allegations against the South Korean government and we've met with some of the companies involved in the in those cases. And technology and fair competition is one of the key components of the US-Korea trade agreement that was signed last year.
▶ 0:59:44And so as we go through the trade implementation process with our embassy you know being one of the key sources of reporting for how South Korea is doing with respect to living up to those trade commitments, that is a key component. we're tracking that very closely and we want to see progress on those cases or else there will have to be you know trade remedial action that's reserved to us under the trade agreement.
▶ 1:00:04Thank you.
▶ 1:00:06Yeah, I would just echo what the Assistant Secretary said. We have a team, a pretty large team on the ground in South Korea. We're tracking this issue as well. And you know we see this in in a number of countries. We Again, signing an agreement is just the first step and this is kind of what we were saying earlier. You we need to monitor, we need to enforce, we need to push. We're not America isn't just about signing agreements.
▶ 1:00:29We are about implementation under President Trump and we need to see these things through and when a country isn't acting fair fairly and consistent with what they've agreed to, we need to take action. I'm not saying specifically here that that is the case. I don't know yet, but that's our philosophy and how we approach it.
▶ 1:00:48Well, thank you very much. It certainly is important to our state and my district and my constituents. So this is an area I'll be keeping my eye on and with that Madam Chair I yield back.
▶ 1:01:08Thank you. Uh gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Burchett. You are now recognized.
▶ 1:01:14Thank you Chairlady. Thank you gentlemen. you all think that having multiple commercial diplomacy initiatives and um that they've resulted in overlapping efforts or a duplication.
▶ 1:01:31I'll start. Uh Congressman, thank you for that. Uh no, we're not concerned about that at all. Um we support the CDE initiative by State. By the way, it's been collaborative. Uh I've met with numerous numerous times with the Assistant Secretary, the Deputy Secretary. Our staffs have met uh about this and actually they asked for our feedback and it's going well.
▶ 1:01:54If as Assistant Secretary Orr mentioned, the main purpose of CDE is really to narrow down the set of cases that can be used by leadership at State to advocate more forcefully for American business. We're all for that, so there's no issue.
▶ 1:02:13Okay, would you say that's um that's how y'all made sure that you aren't spending time and taxpayer dollars on the same
▶ 1:02:21Agree. Yes.
▶ 1:02:23Absolutely, Congressman. And and I'll I'll I'll just add my voice uh to the Assistant Secretary's as well. When the State Department reviews cases, um you know, we we like to add our voice, Secretary Rubio's voice to cases that Commerce is already advocating on and it is helpful to the State Department to know, you know, that a case has been approved for advocacy by the Advocacy Center, to know that Secretary Lutnick has advocated for the case, and um in general we find that uh foreign governments like to have the State Department also advocating
▶ 1:02:53uh for those cases and so we do find a lot of value. Um I'll also add that the State Department also has a a broader aperture. Um you know, there are some cases where there is not a US company that's in a position to provide the services requested by the foreign government. I think a a common one that you may be familiar with, Congressman, is in telecommunications where oftentimes you the competition boils down to Huawei or Ericsson or Nokia.
▶ 1:03:19And obviously none of those are, you know, US companies um by their nature. And then hope hopefully we can get to a position where we have a US competitor to compete in that situation. But in a situation like that where there is no US company, the State Department, you know, as a matter of foreign policy, will still in some cases do advocacy for the foreign company in order to block out, you know, an adversary from attaining that contract.
▶ 1:03:43That's interesting. Never heard that before. Um what's your plan to ensure that the taxpayers' dollars are used responsibly in our commercial diplomacy
▶ 1:03:55Well, I will say that under this administration there's a laser focus on budget and being parsimonious with taxpayer funds and it's constantly in our mind. Frankly, you know, I look at the amount of travel, for example, that I have done in this job and and others. You know, it's been more limited than in the past. We're very sensitive to. Of course, you know, travel is very important as well. I mean, we need to go to some of these countries and interact with them.
▶ 1:04:23Showing up is part of diplomacy and commercial diplomacy. But we're always mindful of budget dollars and we want to be careful where we spend the money.
▶ 1:04:32Do you think we ought to consolidate our commercial diplomacy under one
▶ 1:04:39I do not believe so. I think it's working well, Congressman. Now, I mentioned earlier in my statement that we had record numbers since President Trump took office under the current system where we have Commerce in the lead in the markets where we overlap with State and we work collaboratively with the State Department. And then in markets where we don't have a physical presence, we coordinate with State, but State takes the lead. And that is delivering record results for the President and American people.
▶ 1:05:09So, we don't think there's a need to to combine and and that would just lead to overlap and and not something we want to do.
▶ 1:05:19We work well with the Department of Commerce and coordinating on commercial diplomacy cases. Thank you. I yield back, Chairwoman. Thank you, ma'am.
▶ 1:05:29Let me now recognize Representative Salazar from Florida. Are you ready?
▶ 1:05:34Yes, thank you very much, Madam Chairwoman. And wonderful to be here. I'm Maria Salazar from the state of Florida, District 27. And thank you for participating. Um I would like to talk about Venezuela a little bit. And um I'm not sure if you are familiar and I would that's the first thing that I would like to ask you.
▶ 1:05:54Do you know that Delcy Rodriguez, the the president of interim president of Venezuela, recently sent a letter Prince Charles in England asking him uh to release to the Venezuelan Central Bank 31 tons of gold equivalent to 4 billion dollars. Were you aware of that?
▶ 1:06:22Uh Congresswoman, we work very closely with the interim authorities in Venezuela to ensure
▶ 1:06:26asking you if you knew that they did
▶ 1:06:29I I did
▶ 1:06:29Did you know that Delcy sent a letter to King Charles? Yes or no?
▶ 1:06:32As a part of our overall oversight of their fiscal processes and budgets, we we did see the letter that she sent.
▶ 1:06:38You saw it. All right. So, do you know what the letter said
▶ 1:06:45I I I don't recall the specific language of the letter, Congresswoman.
▶ 1:06:49All right. So, but you saw the letter, but you don't remember. You don't remember what the letter said.
▶ 1:06:57Uh Congresswoman, I believe that the interim authorities in Venezuela are seeking access to available sources of
▶ 1:07:05But specifically, did you know that she sent a letter to King Charles in England to release those uh tons of uh 31 tons of gold?
▶ 1:07:13The The interim authorities in Venezuela are um facing severe budgetary stress.
▶ 1:07:18what I'm asking you. Is the State Department No. Okay. Listen, I understand that you work for Marco Rubio and we love him, but there has to be I would like some accountability. So, you're telling me that you're not aware of very familiar. The State Department knew that Delcy was putting forth this request. You're telling me that you did know. Did she uh consult with you before she sent that letter to King Charles?
▶ 1:07:42Uh Congresswoman, we again, we work very closely with the interim authorities to ensure that they have the budgetary resources they need to recover from the
▶ 1:07:51No, that's not what I'm asking you. Did she consult with you and what did you guys say? because of the earthquake, the the government in Venezuela is seeking additional financial resources in order undertake the expenditures necessary to do the reconstruction, to clear rubble, to build temporary housing.
▶ 1:08:11And I agree with that and we're helping her. The problem is that we know that Delcy belongs to the Maduro regime. And I understand that she's working with the State Department. I get that. But, I also know her nature. And how do we, the United States, is going to make sure that she is not going to steal that
▶ 1:08:30Co- Congresswoman, the
▶ 1:08:31That's what they did before, right?
▶ 1:08:33That's why we took them out.
▶ 1:08:35Well, Congresswoman, Secretary Rubio has been working, as you know, on these issues for many years.
▶ 1:08:39And that's precisely why we have established a very strong uh financial monitoring mechanism over the funds.
▶ 1:08:47this for- specifically. is the accounting firm that makes every 3 months reports, stating where the money that we're sending to the interim president Delcy is going to. We have never seen a re- one of those reports. Could you show Congress one of those audits?
▶ 1:09:16Thank you for the question, Congresswoman. And I'd like to add too, it's a dual layer of protection. So, not only do we have KPMG as the financial monitor over the treasury account funds, the Central Bank of Venezuela has retained BDO, its own independent
▶ 1:09:30you something [clears throat] very simple. We have never seen those reports produced by KPMG, which is the one that is responsible to make sure that whatever money we send to Delcy's interim government goes to the to the schools and the roads and the hospitals that she's supposedly claiming that that money's going to, right? It's our money going to her hands.
▶ 1:09:54So, can we see their report because KPMG is responsible to make sure that that money gets to the right place.
▶ 1:10:02Yeah, Congresswoman, as as Secretary Rubio said, we we will produce for Congress you know, appropriate
▶ 1:10:07So, could you could you that would love to see? It's been 6 months. I would like to see two reports because it's every 3 months. So, can you show us Congress where that money is going to? And provide the K- the KPMG report to us. Can you commit to that?
▶ 1:10:24Yeah, Congresswoman, we we will produce to Congress appropriate reports that that we can that protect you know, relevant information that's um you know, part of our foreign policy. Um at the same time, there's been an earthquake. There's a big change in how um the the
▶ 1:10:38But there is no earthquake in the KPMG accounting firm offices. So, we can definitely access those papers.
▶ 1:10:45Congresswoman, KPMG is on the ground in Caracas. They they were affected by the earthquake as well because of their local affiliate in Caracas. Um and again, the the needs and the expenses, you know, have really grown significantly because of the earthquake and so
▶ 1:10:58We understand. Listen, I'm on your side. I just want to make sure that Daisy's interim government it does not keep the oil proceeds that we are giving to her
▶ 1:11:07General ladies, time's up.
▶ 1:11:08Thank you. So, I thank you that you commit and I will reach out to your office so we can have access to those reports and thanks again.
▶ 1:11:15Thank you. Gentleman from Kentucky, Representative Barr is now recognized.
▶ 1:11:22Well, it's great to see you all. Um Assistant Secretary Fogel, good to see you. I'm glad glad that you're doing such a great job for our country and come visit us in Kentucky anytime. You One of the best decisions you made was to marry a Kentuckian. So, well well done, sir. Well done.
▶ 1:11:42Uh the Foreign Commercial Service is one of the best tools that we have at our disposal to boost American businesses Uh however, um this service is present in less than half of the embassies Uh Assistant Secretary Fogel, at a time when China is right on our heels in AI development, how should Commerce prioritize personnel and resources across strategic sectors such as critical minerals, energy, semiconductors, and emerging
▶ 1:12:10Thank you, Congressman, and good to see you. Um look, the uh let me mention one statistic that I mentioned earlier in this hearing. Uh it is true that our physical presence uh is more limited, but in terms of global GDP, the Foreign Commercial Service is represented in roughly 95% of the world's GDP in terms of our offices. So, we have presence where it matters. That's the most important thing.
▶ 1:12:40However, to your point, the philosophy that I brought into this job, coming from the private sector, is we need to prioritize. And so, exactly what you're saying, one of the first things I did was put out a priorities memo to the entire team saying we need to prioritize certain sectors. We call them the STREAM sectors, strategic exports of American-made goods and services, STREAM.
▶ 1:13:06And that includes strategic technologies including AI, which we're very aggressively pursuing right now. Uh it includes energy and critical minerals, which as you know we've uh administration-wide been very aggressive in. And then finally US manufacturing. So we're doing exactly what you said. We can't be all things to all people, all things to all companies. We need to focus our efforts and focus on these priority sectors.
▶ 1:13:30How do you collaborate with USTR? Uh I am interested in that because there's you know you're promoting uh American businesses abroad. Um the the administration's trade policies are seeking to use various tools of economic statecraft to open up those markets. Is it is it close collaboration? Is it complementary? Uh how important is it to make sure you're you're working in in lockstep and not uh stepping on each other's toes?
▶ 1:14:00Well, it's close collaboration. So the leadership of the International Trade Administration is in constant communication with the USTR office. Uh the big thing you got to remember about Commerce and particularly ITA is we're we have the connectivity to US companies, right? We have uh USEACs, US export assistance centers throughout the country. and that keeps us in touch with American business. So uh USTR does not have that.
▶ 1:14:30Um and so what that's one way we're able to sort of relay the concerns of American business. So in other words, when we meet with companies and they tell us they have trade issues that might not be on the radar of USTR, we bring those to USTR.
▶ 1:14:44you know from your family ties to Kentucky, one important export that we care a lot about is bourbon. And I recently had a a terrific conversation with both the US Ambassador to India, uh Sergio Gor, and um the Commerce Minister Goyal uh in India. India is a whiskey-drinking market.
▶ 1:15:05Um Tell me, does does your department have a a a role to play in promoting American products like whiskey in huge markets like India. I did have to tell the Minister of Commerce in India that remember that Scotch whiskey is the drink of the occupier, the imperial whiskey, and Kentucky bourbon is the drink of freedom.
▶ 1:15:33So, we want them to to to to import more Kentucky bourbon whiskey, and maybe less of that Scotch whiskey.
▶ 1:15:41Yeah, absolutely. So, two things here. One is that's what we do every day. I mean, I get again, the US Commercial Service in touch with American businesses like the bourbon producers in um helping them export, sometimes for the first time, or established companies helping them export and and break down non-tariff barriers in foreign markets. And that's sort of the second phase of what you're talking about.
▶ 1:16:05When there's an issue in that market, our team on the ground, the foreign commercial service, um will then meet with the relevant ministries and advocate to bring those non-tariff barriers down.
▶ 1:16:18Well, I've run out of time, but I do hope that you will address um the duplicities between the Foreign Commercial Service and the new commercial diplomacy enterprise at State, and and how how you're you're handling that.
▶ 1:16:31Will do. Thank you.
▶ 1:16:33You're welcome.
▶ 1:16:33I do wanted some I I I want to ask you a question for the purpose of clarification, because in both of your opening statements, Commerce cited $428 billion in investments 2025, correct? And State mentioned $505 billion in Similarly, Commerce created 1.3 million US jobs and State created 1.4 million jobs.
▶ 1:17:02Um are these metrics that I mentioned correct that was stated in your opening
▶ 1:17:09Yes, Chairwoman, they they are correct and the the reason is again the different jurisdictional basis on which Commerce and State operate. So, the State [snorts] Department has a broader aperture for companies that it can do advocacy for that is based on our foreign policy interests. So, not every case that the State Department does advocacy for has to go through the advocacy center.
▶ 1:17:32Of course, many of the cases, perhaps most of the cases that we do formal advocacy for have gone through the advocacy center process, but there's also a State Department process where we make a national interest determination based on foreign policy criteria in which the State Department can do advocacy. So, there's just a bigger pool of businesses and cases that the Department can do advocacy for and frankly our methodology also includes some specific regulatory changes. So, for example, there was a country
▶ 1:18:01in in the East Asia Pacific region last year that changed a regulation for a US company that would have caused the US company to lose its entire business in the country. And so, we did we put a dollar value on that and the State Department does advocacy with that government to convince them to stop the regulatory change to keep the US company doing business there. And so, we count, you know, that change as part of our total and that's how we have the number that we have.
▶ 1:18:23Got it.
▶ 1:18:24Yes, in our case we only publicly talk about client verified wins. So, on the export side, we go to the client, make sure that we can tie it back to our assistance and then on the foreign direct investment side, which would by the way be another distinction with state, I think from the numbers that he was quoting. Um, we also track only client verified wins on the foreign investment into the United States that SelectUSA helps facilitate.
▶ 1:18:54Got it. So, you can see why I'm asking. I know Commerce is the lead agency uh when it comes to utilizing our expertise of the uh foreign commercial service officers.
▶ 1:19:07But the point that we're trying to make today in this hearing is there are still over like 80 plus or more US posts where expertise of Commerce FCS is not present and then of course State Department's uh commercial officers step in and do the job.
▶ 1:19:27Obviously, there are differences, but if we were to consolidate all of our efforts and where Commerce FCS is not since State is already doing the work uh what we're trying to do is if we can provide the experience and the training that's needed where State is doing some of the work that Commerce's experts are not present.
▶ 1:19:54Wouldn't it be better because then you know what uh 828 billion from Commerce 500 billion from State and creating all these you know like combined 2.7 million jobs. This is amazing. We want to be able to do better and then we want to be able to strengthen commercial diplomacy uh training at the State. If we can do this if at the uh where Commerce FCS is not present.
▶ 1:20:23Do you understand what I'm trying to say because I understand you mentioned Secretary of State. There is no need to consolidate commercial diplomacy or move FCS to state. That's not what we're advocating for. What we're advocating for is to try to make sure there is an adequate training at the state where Commerce FCS is not present. Are we in agreement?
▶ 1:20:45Thank you, Chairman. Absolutely. The State Department fully supports increased training for for our economic to understand and provide more expertise when it comes to commercial matters. You know, Secretary Rubio under his reorganization that we executed last year, you know, the State Department really has doubled down and made the focus on our posts and our regional bureaus so that we can front load the regional expertise that really is the State Department's value add to the interagency process.
▶ 1:21:14And so we want those officers that have that regional expertise to also have some commercial expertise that they can bring to bear you know, in in in the relevant foreign foreign countries and regional theaters. So we absolutely support you more and as you mentioned Chairwoman, you know, there is a subset of countries where the Foreign Commercial Service is not directly present and so the State Department economic officers are performing the functions of the Foreign Commercial Service under the supervision of the Foreign Commercial
▶ 1:21:44And absolutely more training there would be welcome and that's something that we want to do more of. Would you like to add more?
▶ 1:21:53Sure. Well, thank you again for that and thank you to to the Assistant Secretary. You know, it's not that we're opposed to more training. We support more training. We work well with with our state colleagues and I'm not opposed to more training.
▶ 1:22:09I think it's more just awareness about you know, the situation because the numbers can be a little misleading when we say well, Commerce is only in 84 roughly markets and there's 174 I believe that state is in and well, there must be a big gap there. And my point is in terms of GDP that's covered, it the 84 markets covers over 90% of the global GDP. So, we're already in the important markets.
▶ 1:22:36The other point is, there is a uh, you know, knowledge that comes with and that's over time, decades of experience, with Commerce taking the lead since 1980-81. Um, that's not easily transferred through training. Now, of course, over time, that can change. So, it's not that we're opposed to training, it's just a matter of, of, you know, what is the problem and what's the right fix.
▶ 1:23:11And I do recognize the, uh, the expertise at the, uh, the Commerce and the FCS's officers. I There is no dispute there. I will not discounting the work that you are doing. We just want to make sure that where State is doing the work where FCS is not. I think we're saying the same thing. We just want to make sure that we lead and we succeed. So, with that, I know, um, I was told that, uh, another member is coming, but it's no longer. So, we I think we're ready to close our hearing.
▶ 1:23:41So, thank you. Do you Do you want to go first?
▶ 1:23:47Just for a a quick question with the, uh, Secretary Fogle. Could you follow up uh, how Commerce and State deconflict and the importance of, uh, of of deconflicting on on the with with the two services. Your time at the CDE, for example, or you mean in general? Yeah, deconflicting in general. and and collaborate in the embassies, of
▶ 1:24:15is collaboration. I mean, if you talk to people at post, and I travel the world, and I talk to uh my team, but I talk to state people, too. I know plenty of economic officers. As you know, I worked at State in the first Trump administration and at EXIM. So, there's great collaboration happening. That's the thing. In country, at post, every day, it's a relatively small group.
▶ 1:24:37You have a handful of economic uh officers and you have one or two or three commercial officers, and they work together with the ambassador to advance American business interests. And you sure, occasionally conflict or competition arises, but the overwhelming majority of cases, they work collaboratively together. So, you know, I don't see an issue, frankly.
▶ 1:25:03Um well, I I agree and I I do see the the the value in the great work that the Commerce Department does, the expertise that you have in in promoting American businesses, but also the the strategic role of uh you know, competing with uh China and other competitors uh and having that that forward-deployed presence uh to make sure that um American businesses are an an available alternative uh to some of the malign
▶ 1:25:33ties that are being pushed by China and others. I yield back.
▶ 1:25:39Thank you. And with that, I want to thank both of you for joining us today and for your testimony and answering all of our members' questions. The members of the subcommittee may have some additional questions, and we will ask you to respond to those in writing. Pursuant to committee rules, all members may have 5 days to submit statements, questions, and extraneous materials for the record, subject to the length limitations. So, without objection, the committee now stands adjourned.