▶ 0:22:25She found him. Uh, Alison found. Well, good morning. Committee on Financial Services will come to order. Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare recess the committee at any time. Today's hearing is entitled the semiannual report of the Bureau of Consumer Financial Protection. Without objection, all members will have five legislative days within which to submit extraneous materials to the chair for inclusion in the record. I now recognize myself for a four-minute opening statement.
▶ 0:22:53I want to thank acting director for consumer financial protection Russ Bolt for being with us today. Today's hearing will gives us an opportunity to review the CFPB's semiannual report and examine the significant changes underway at the CFPB under President Trump and acting director Volt leadership.
▶ 0:23:12The question that we should keep at the forefront of today's conversation is what can Congress do to ensure that the CFPB remains accountable, transparent, and faithful to its mission of consumer Since its creation under the DoddFrank Act, the CFPB has too often operated as an overreaching regulator.
▶ 0:23:35Partisan priorities have driven burdensome regulations and duplicative supervision that fail to account for their impact on the consumer's access to credit and discourage innovation. Rather than acting as a fair and transparent regulator, too frequently the CFPB has often allowed ideology to drive its policym resulting in overly burdensome regulatory overreach.
▶ 0:24:02Financial institutions, particularly smaller banks and credit unions, have reported increased compliance burdens that make their operations unnecessarily The result was not more protection for consumers, but more paperwork for the community banking industry, fewer choices for working families in product design, and restrictions on innovation in everything from small dollar credit access to
▶ 0:24:32digital payments. Under President Trump's leadership, the CFPB has begun to pull back from being an unaccountable super regulator and toward being a more focused agency that focuses on protecting consumers from actual genuine harm. The CFPB has stopped regulating by informal guidance and back towards a more disciplined approach grounded in clear rules.
▶ 0:24:59It has moved to stop or undo the worst excesses of prior years, including rules and enforcement strategies that punished lawful business models, second-guess market prices, and tried to micromanage the terms and products that consumers use every day. These administrative actions are an important first step, but in my view, these alone are not enough.
▶ 0:25:25A future director could reverse these actions and this muchneeded direction with the stroke of a pen, creating wild swings in policy that are bad for bad for the financial services industry, trying to serve those consumers and then the economy at large. That's why this committee is advancing a comprehensive set of CFPB reforms.
▶ 0:25:50These legislative reforms establish the durable guard rails that would outlast any single director of the agency by clarifying the CFPB's statutory authorities, strengthen the due process, restoring transparency, promoting a coordinated and riskbased supervision, and preventing regulation by enforcement.
▶ 0:26:16Congress has the responsibility to create that more durable framework for the CFPB and provide the oversight necessary to ensure it stays true to its These reforms are designed to ensure adequate consumer protection while also giving financial institutions and firms certainty they need to compete, innovate, and expand access to affordable financial products and services.
▶ 0:26:40I look forward to hearing from acting director vault today about the realworld consequences of the CFPB's past policies and how his work to correct that and set forward this more permanent durable framework can uh move forward. And so I thank him for being here. I yield back and I recognize the ranking member of our committee, Mrs. Waters from California for a four-minute opening statement.
▶ 0:27:04Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Mr. vote. For a year and a half, committee Democrats have demanded answers while you have refused to provide them. We sent you letters, requested briefings, and repeatedly called for this hearing. Instead of being proud of your work, you've been hiding while unlawfully trying and thankfully failing uh to dismantle the nation's top consumer watchdog.
▶ 0:27:34I've never delighted in someone's failure more than I have delighted in yours. Next week marks the 15th anniversary of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau opening its doors. It was created after the 2008 financial crisis when millions of Americans were scammed out of their homes. Congress wanted working families to have someone on their side.
▶ 0:28:03And until you showed up, the bureau was on their side. CFPB returned $21 billion to millions of consumers cheated by banks, mortgage services, payday lenders, credit reporting companies, debt collectors, and others.
▶ 0:28:24So because of CFPB's hardworking public servants, some of them are in the audience, the agency had bad actors. He held them accountable and got justice for Americans. But not under your watch, Mr. Vote. You have directed CFPB to drop enforcement actions even when they had bad actors offered to compensate the victims.
▶ 0:28:54You've blocked billions of dollars from being returned to harmed American consumers. You have even been terrible for the financial services industry, denying, throwing out basic guidance and safeguards industry had asked for. And your message to Wall Street is clear. You're defunding the police and you're breaking the law to do it.
▶ 0:29:21Consumer complaints about financial practices have exploded with more companies filed under your watch than cumulatively filed since 2011. That is not a coincidence. It's because of you. What is astounding is that many of my Republican colleagues continue attacking the CFPB even as they tell their constituents to ask the agency to resolve disputes with companies.
▶ 0:29:51Republicans secretly know the CFPB works because their constituents have benefited from it, but they're too scared to admit it. But Americans know the truth. Recent polling shows that 80% of midterm voters support the CFPB. If going after consumers were not bad enough at the White House, you've also gone after community development financial institutions.
▶ 0:30:22I'm talking about CDFIS and you know what I'm talking about. Including hundreds of community banks and credit unions. And after the courts rejected your blatantly illegal attempt to cancel grants, Congress authorized for nonprofit organization. You are again violating the law with your new rule proposal committee. Democrats refused to stand by.
▶ 0:30:48We've led multiple AMA's briefs defending the CFPB and Congress's con constitutional authority to create it. helping secure numerous court victories that stopped your efforts to dismantle the agency, starve it of its funding, and carry out unlawful mass violence.
▶ 0:31:09Victories have kept the bureau opening. So, let me be clear today is about holding you accountable for ignoring the law. And don't look surprised. You know what I'm talking about. I now recognize chair of our subcommittee on financial institutions who's worked hard in this arena, Mr. Bar from Kentucky for a one minute opening statement.
▶ 0:31:32Director vote, thank you for appearing before the committee today and thank you for the outstanding job you've done as acting director. Since its creation, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau has exceeded its statutory authority, relied on regulation by enforcement, and created unnecessary uncertainty for consumers and the financial institutions that serve them. Luckily, under your leadership, the CFPB has taken important steps to reduce this regulatory overreach and get back to the core mission of protecting consumers.
▶ 0:31:59To ensure this change in direction is viable over the long term, Congress must establish durable guard rails that provide regulatory certainty. The CFPB reform package accompanying today's hearing reflects an effort to refocus the CFPB on its core statutory mission by improving accountability, increasing transparency, providing greater regulatory certainty, and ensuring that enforcement and supervision are exercised in a fair and consistent manner.
▶ 0:32:23We look forward to discussing those proposals today, and identifying additional opportunities to protect consumers while promoting a stable, competitive, and innovative financial marketplace. Thank you, and I yield Today we welcome the testimony of the honorable Russ Bolt, acting director of the CFPB. Acting director vote, we thank you for taking time to be with us. You'll be recognized for five minutes to give an oral presentation of your written testimony.
▶ 0:32:54And without objection, your written testimony will be made part of the record record. I now recognize you for five minutes. Chairman Hill, Ranking Member Waters, and members of the committee. Thank you for the invitation to appear before you today as I reach the end of my tenure at CFPB. I am pleased to present the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau's semiannual report to Congress, as well as to provide you an update on the activities of the bureau during my tenure.
▶ 0:33:19After being appointed acting director of the bureau, our team took a look under the hood and found an agency that was weaponized, out of control, and had gone far beyond its statutory mandate. Under previous administrations, this agency actually imposed huge costs on the American people and stifled the innovation and resourcefulness that is necessary for a strong economy.
▶ 0:33:41Consumers paid the price literally in the form of higher prices, reduced product offerings, increased borrowing expenses, and the misuse of their taxpayer dollars. In fact, the Council of Economic Advisors found that the CFPP has cost consumers between 237 to 370 billion since 2011. Instead of going down this destructive path, we have steered the bureau towards operating with humility, accountability, and fiscal responsibility.
▶ 0:34:10Regulation should be justified by the statute, not the whims of ideologues at the bureau. Supervision should be precisely targeted to avoid stifling economic growth and innovation and disproportionately increasing compliance costs.
▶ 0:34:26And enforcement should be based on clear violations of law, not in advancing a political agenda outside the accountability and oversight from elected officials and the American The bureau's express purpose is to implement and enforce federal consumer financial law consistently so that all consumers have access to markets and that such markets are fair, transparent, and competitive.
▶ 0:34:50While we have sought to downsize this agency to the maximum extent possible and reign in its abuses, we have continued to operate it in accordance with that purpose. The bureau's enforcement actions are now focused on addressing actual harm to consumers and ensuring due process. President Trump ensured that the bureau along with other so-called independent regulatory agencies are accountable to leaders elected by the American people and no longer operate with impunity.
▶ 0:35:19Recently, the Supreme Court confirmed that no such independent agencies exist in slaughter. The bureau's regulatory actions are no longer developed in isolation and the rest of the government works to improve its proposals through the office of information and regulatory affairs. I have also reoriented our internal processes in supervision. The bureau focuses its resources on pressing threats to consumers and in the areas that are clearly within the bureau's statutory authority.
▶ 0:35:48In the past, the supervision program pushed well past the limits of statutory authority under the guise of consumer protection. The bureau also now avoids duplication of supervision by other regulators. Supervision is conducted with transparency and respect, and our examiners announce it through the humility pledge that they read at the beginning of all examinations.
▶ 0:36:11Enforcement is also guided by a new set of principles so that the CFP focuses on addressing actual harms to consumers, ensuring due process, and seeking collaboration when appropriate. Under President Trump, there has been a paradigm shift in the way that the CFPB regulates, supervises, and enforces the law as required by DoddFrank. And though we have improved a great deal about how to operate, the bureau remains structurally defective and I do not believe it should exist in its current form.
▶ 0:36:40I have been committed to running it in a responsible manner and addressing real harms instead of remaking financial markets in service of a political agenda. If confirmed, I know that President Trump's nominee, Brian Johnson, will do a great job in continuing to stir to steer CFPB in an appropriate manner. Ultimately, however, CFPB must be subject to Congress's most basic function, the appropriations process to ensure accountability and legitimize an otherwise unserious agency.
▶ 0:37:11Thank you, and I look forward to answering your questions. Thank you, director. We'll now turn to member questions. And given our limited time today, I'm going to strictly enforce the fiveminut rule. Hope everybody will help achieve that. I now recognize myself for five minutes for questioning. The CFPB's core mission is to protect consumers, but there's serious questions about whether some actions under the previous administrations advanced the goal, that goal, or instead imposed cost ultimately harmed consumers.
▶ 0:37:42The Council of Economic Adviserss estimated that since 2011, the CFPB policies have cost consumers between 237 and 369 billion dollars through higher borrowing costs, reduced credit availability and other compliance related expenses that have been passed on in the financial system.
▶ 0:38:05So my first question, acting director, is how did the prior regulatory approach negatively impact consumers in practice and why is it necessary to move quickly to unwind that approach and recalibrate directly to consumer benefit?
▶ 0:38:22Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think it's an important uh note to remind u this committee and the country of the impact of the last 15 years of the CFPB before we came into office. uh with nearly $360 billion in added consumer costs because of the work of the CFPB and I hear often uh the $21 billion figure of that is often cited by the defenders and then you put it in comparison to the $370 billion and it's quite stark and
▶ 0:38:53and much of that is on the regulatory front but it's also by uh regulating through enforcement uh and to go beyond a statutory or regulatory uh and to expand and to use the other tools that CFPB has uh to effectively regulate by sending a very serious signal to those uh who are in a particular line of work.
▶ 0:39:16Um but there has been a u uh a concern uh that we've had with the ability to innovate uh to have financial products that meet real needs that real people have uh and to have innovation in those marketplaces. and unfortunately CFPB has not been a part of providing such a landscape.
▶ 0:39:37I appreciate that answer. And one thing that that I've seen as a as a former community bank uh chief executive in the environment, I can remember distinctly in 2009 before DoddFrank was enacted. I participated in a roundt in Little Rock with then uh assistant to the president Elizabeth Warren working for President Obama outlining her vision for what a CFPB would do.
▶ 0:40:01and her uh principal mission was actually consolidating the consumer rule book making it clear making it easier for consumers and reducing regulatory burden uh on the financial services industry both I would say bank and non-bank was her pitch in that roundt that I listened to but the but what we've seen in practice over the 15 years has been it seems to me the reverse which is a duplicative nature For
▶ 0:40:31example, members of Congress at the time of DoddFrank said they I think they thought they were assigning CFPB to look at big banks at the time over $10 billion. But when you talk to bankers now and non-banks, they show a much more heavy compliance burden that's been pushed down and that is duplicative. Um, consistent with that, the CFPB has tried to move towards fewer exams and more targeting. Is that your been your approach and you've been focused on those institutions over 10 billion for example? talk about that for a minute.
▶ 0:41:01Well, we've had a very active super supervision agenda. Uh and many people have have not noticed that uh who are uh supporters of the agency in general. Um we have scaled certain aspects of it down that were largely junkets.
▶ 0:41:17So they had a a a culture of sending eight uh examiners for eight hours a day for eight weeks uh to visit on this on the job on the on on the scene uh each of these financial institutions. Uh we've taken the approach that we can do far more uh by having it remote by uh ensuring that if we need to convene we will convene.
▶ 0:41:44uh but we have we have made it so that it is a much more rational. We'll do about 70 exams this year but again the 70 exams uh is not something that uh is there's a far greater amount of work that's being done in behind the scenes in the supervision department. Uh so we have tried to rationalize it. Uh we've tried to bring um humility to it.
▶ 0:42:06We would dismiss cases that we thought uh had no basis in statute and then we would find that the the the career individuals were treating those indiv those entities with uh disrespect with roughness with arbitrary deadlines and it's one of the reasons we put into place uh the pledge to make sure that our employees were operating with the
▶ 0:42:28our time has expired.
▶ 0:42:29I thank you and I now ask the ranking member to address her questions. You have five minutes ranking member. Thank
▶ 0:42:42director. Vote. Let's turn to a problematic period of your tenure. Last February, at least three at least three of Elon Musk's employees from the so-called Department of Government Efficiency, Doge, entered the CFPB headquarters and requested access to sensitive CFPB headquarters and requested access to sensitive CFPB
▶ 0:43:13information, including internal staff records, competitive competitive industry data and personally identifiable consumer information. The release of this data to inexperienced, untrained, and unvetted individuals raises serious concerns about his impact on law enforcement, consumer privacy, and the protection of confidential supervisory information.
▶ 0:43:41Furthermore, the trillionaire Elon Musk who led Doge may have gained access to this data and could use it to inform his own payment app and other companies. I asked the Government Accountability Office to investigate, but you stonewalled them too.
▶ 0:44:01However, they found that other agencies like Treasury did not use safeguards to prevent Doge employees transmitting the sensitive data outside of the agency. A whistleblower also noted that a Doge team inappropriately handled sensitive data at the National Labor Relations Board and that DOE's records were destroyed before investigators could audit them.
▶ 0:44:30so direct to vote because you never responded to a letter that I, Senator Warren, and nearly 200 members of Congress sent you last year. Tell me simply, yes or no. Do you even know the the extent of the data held by the CFPB that Elon Musk and anyone else associated with Doge had access to?
▶ 0:44:58Do you have a record of all the data that was accessed? Have you done any investigation into whether CFPB's data is secure? Yes or no?
▶ 0:45:09Congressman, we at a department efficiency is something we're very proud of as an
▶ 0:45:14reclaiming my time.
▶ 0:45:18No, you don't know. direct to vote. Doge had unfeted access to all information held by CFPB and it was given administrative privileges that allowed Doge employees to delete all records of what they did. So, let me ask you again. Did anyone from Doge unlawfully share this data with third parties?
▶ 0:45:47Have any records and account access about DOA's work at the CFPB been deleted? Yes or no?
▶ 0:45:57The Department of Government Efficiency was part of the administration. So when they came on board or no
▶ 0:46:04at the CFPB? Yes or no?
▶ 0:46:06We they were a part of getting a
▶ 0:46:07reclaiming my time agency.
▶ 0:46:09The gentleman refuses to answer. Just last May, the CFPB under your leadership deleted its institutional records from the AY's website. This include press releases, consumer advisories, supervisory highlights, reports, and enforcement action summaries from prior administrations and translations into other languages also were disabled.
▶ 0:46:37Are you aware that a district court ordered you and CFPB to maintain and not delete, destroy, remove, or impair any agency data? Yes or no?
▶ 0:46:50You're totally your your question is totally inaccurate.
▶ 0:46:52Yes or no?
▶ 0:46:53Your your question is inaccurate. Do not remove those documents.
▶ 0:46:56You're claiming my time. It did. And your last action to hide the truth is in clear violation of the court injunction. Director vote. You should preserve all of your emails, text messages, and other forms of communication with respect to your CFPB work while you may also wish to be done if a new director is confirmed to the CFPB. Let me be clear, you're not done with we are not done with you.
▶ 0:47:24And so, despite your boss calling it a hoax, affordability is a big problem for consumers. Groceries and gas cost much more today than when Trump came into office. In fact, one in 10 families have to skip a meal just to get by. Consumers are upset.
▶ 0:47:44Time is expired. The chair recognizes the vice chairman for the full committee, Mr. Heiskin of Michigan, for five minutes.
▶ 0:47:51Thank you, director vote. I'm going to move quickly. Uh I'm fascinated by your your humility pledge. I would say other than Kathy Cranninger, uh, humility is not exactly a word associated with the director of the CFPB, uh, or frankly its creator. Um, I do think though that Brian Johnson would be an extension of this, uh, new spirit. I'm going to give you a few seconds though to respond to the ranking member who would not allow you to finish your sentence.
▶ 0:48:16When you have a new administration, I thank you, Congressman. When you have a new administration, they put the previous documents, press releases into an archived version of the website. That is exactly what we have done. It can be found on the website. It is all there. If people want to go back and and and look at what we think are flawed guidance documents from the CHOP directorship, it's all there under archive.
▶ 0:48:39but it is not going to be representative as our administration's view with regard to what the policies and rules and regulations are of this
▶ 0:48:48Okay, I'm I'm going to skip my setup and just get right to my question. How can the CFBB ensure it meets the statutory objective of protecting consumers from genuine misconduct while also ensuring that its supervisory and enforcement activities do not unnecessarily discourage responsible lending to the small businesses that drive local economies? You talked about the $360 billion in regulatory costs to consumers.
▶ 0:49:12Uh we know that uh that uh an unclear uh direction simply just causes uh people to say no on their lending.
▶ 0:49:21Well, I think we took a long time to work on our supervisory and enforcement guidelines. We're very proud of them. It focuses on uh actual victims, identifiable harm that has material and measurable damages.
▶ 0:49:34Yeah. Wouldn't the fishing expeditions of Rohit Chopra do the same thing?
▶ 0:49:38Yes. And so my my my view would be to turn those into law. And so everything that we've done, turn it into statutory uh requirements that build on the work that we've done.
▶ 0:49:50All right. Uh an effective regulatory system should motivate entities to detect and fix issues as you've been talking about. Um, and while working with regulators pre to prevent consumer harm, institutions are more likely to invest in compliance and even frankly self-report violations uh if cooperation is rewarded and not penalized. You talked a little bit about that. Um, some stakeholders have argued that CFPB's approach lacks incentives for self-reporting uh, which may actually reduce transparency and slow corrective actions.
▶ 0:50:20Uh, and I think frankly major reforms are needed. For that reason, I've introduced the Bureau of Consumer Financial Protection uh Commission Act uh to reform the CFPB structure from a single director uh to a bipartisan commission of five members, making it more accountable, consistent, transparent, and trustworthy. And frankly, this has been discussed for many, many years. Uh it was a good idea then, it's a good idea now, especially if one is concerned with the lack of oversight uh that we just heard from uh from the ranking member.
▶ 0:50:50So in the meantime, how is the CFBB working to encourage a supervisory culture that rewards self-identification, self-correction, and good faith Well, one of the things that we do is we reach out early and often if we see something that's either um predominant in the customer uh complaint portal or if we are seeing it in the news, we reached out to Built when we felt that they were not making payments uh on behalf of the as a new credit card.
▶ 0:51:16uh we we ensured that they were going to then uh work to fix the problem. They were working to fix the problem and there's examples like that. Congress,
▶ 0:51:24are are there some additional statutory reforms that you'd like to see that could further incentivize that?
▶ 0:51:29Well, again, I think to to the farthest extent possible, if you can write into the the law the notion that uh we're after self-reporting, we're after remediation and reconciliation, that that is better than waiting on enforcement for many many years. that that may not o occur. Uh that is a much better uh way of operating than to just assume that um it's as adversarial as it has been. Um we've got a minute here.
▶ 0:51:56Given the 2020 force uh uh Supreme Court ruling on Loperbrite, uh how is the CFPB approaching the exercise of its statutory authority? I mean that decision was very important and reminder that major policy decision should and frankly must come from Congress not just through uh not just through expansive uh agency interpretations.
▶ 0:52:17Well, it's obviously a very critical to our entire regulatory agenda as an administration. Uh we don't want to go beyond the authority that you've given us. Uh and that's one of the reasons why I think it's so important that you all are starting the the hearing in the legislative process on reforms um so that you can further u spell out what should be a larger participant for example those are the types of things that I think CFPB has way too much authority with regard to our ability to look at the law
▶ 0:52:46clarity I think there needs to be clarity transparency and understanding and predictability that's what we need to be doing and I yield back
▶ 0:52:53gentleman yields back chair recognizes the ranking member of our House Small Business Committee, Miss Velasquez of New York. Four or five minutes.
▶ 0:53:00Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, director Vogue, last month, the CFPB issued a statement suggesting creditors consider immigration status as a negative factor in an individual's ability to repay. It has been reported that the banking industry has expressed concerns about the burden of vetting customers for immigration status.
▶ 0:53:27Did the CFPV consult with creditors before issuing this statement? Yes or no?
▶ 0:53:32Uh, no. We have worked with them throughout the process.
▶ 0:53:36Okay. Your answer,
▶ 0:53:37we are looking at the law as we see it. And we
▶ 0:53:39Your answer is no. By the way, you know, Director Chopra when he issued the 1071 uh section 1071 rule, he held more than 100 outreach meetings with financial institutions, trade association, community groups and so on.
▶ 0:54:00And at the end the members of the other side in this committee continue to criticize uh the implication and the impact that it will have uh on bankers on creditors but not this time um the laws. So do you think yes uh how did CFPB consult with creditors?
▶ 0:54:29Well, it's interesting the 1071.
▶ 0:54:32No, no. I I don't want to hear about 1071. We discussed it too many times data field.
▶ 0:54:37Just answer my question. How many meetings did you hold with creditors?
▶ 0:54:43We reached out to the financials.
▶ 0:54:45How many times?
▶ 0:54:47I don't have that at my fingers, but suffice it to say, we do our work. We we take input, but we're gonna we're going to regulate based on what the law is, and that's what we're doing with the ability to pay with regard to illegal
▶ 0:54:58Okay. What is the estimated cost of implementing this rule for the
▶ 0:55:05There there is there's not a rule out there that has gone through a cost. I know I'm going to get to to that
▶ 0:55:11because it's already the law. It's already the law. It's already the standard and we were simply uh overriding the the policy proc uh the policy guidance from the previous director that conflicted with the
▶ 0:55:23The loss of an employment situation is more likely to be a risk to a credit application than the risk of being an unauthorized immigrant.
▶ 0:55:42Do you think creditors should include whether an ICE agent that has shot an unarmed civilian on the street and therefore is likely to be charged with murder and the loss of employment as a factor in determining whether they have the ability to repay.
▶ 0:56:04We believe that illegal immigration is a serious problem in this country. I understand it's not a bipartisan an on the book shot an unarmed civilian if that should be counted as a determining factor of being having the ability to repay. Yes, we have said that as a as a matter of our guidance that it is an important factor in the ability to repay.
▶ 0:56:33If you are no longer in this country because of the illegal steps that you took to get
▶ 0:56:38reclaiming my time, Mr. Chairman, I am making an outrageous statement to make the point that the CSPB statement on consideration on of immigration status as a negative factor in an individual's ability to repay is equally outrageous and insulting.
▶ 0:57:01Director Bout vote, the statement you put out is not guidance nor is a rule. And I just heard the chairman when he was making his opening remark saying that the CFPB is moving away from informal guidance unless you want to make a point maybe instructed by Steven Miller.
▶ 0:57:29So the statement at the end even clarifies that this statement does not have the force or effect of law. It has no legally binding effect. I found it nothing more than another racist trope coming from this administration that seeks to threaten creditors and intimidate lenders and borrowers alike. You know what is the point? Cruelty.
▶ 0:58:01I yield back.
▶ 0:58:04Gentlewoman's time is expired. The chair recognizes the chair of our task force on monetary policy, Mr. Lucas of Oklahoma. You're recognized for five
▶ 0:58:12Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for being here, director. I know many in this committee are heartened by your leadership at the bureau and the progress that we've made particularly after your president focused your predecessor pro focused on the Bureau of Regulation by enforcement and advisory opinions rather than notice and comment with the robust public feedback. Can you explain what the bureau is doing to permanently resend some of the harmful rules of the past administration?
▶ 0:58:39Well, there's not a lot that we can do on a permanent basis without your help. And so I I think that's a really important uh aspect of the humility that we're trying to bring to the conversation is we need Congress not unlike what you did with the size of the agency to come along and restrict our authorities. Uh but we have changed the culture. Uh we are dramatically lower. We're about half of what we were uh when we came into into office.
▶ 0:59:06And so we are we are taking cultural seriously so that u there is nothing that has to swing back as a seessaw by virtue of it not being done right the first time.
▶ 0:59:17Continuing that line of thought sometimes I hear often from the financial services industry is the need for durable and consistent regulations to avoid dramatic policy shifts from year to year. Can you describe how the committee could partner with you to support those efforts and ensure progress? Uh the progress that your leadership has made is truly lasting.
▶ 0:59:37Well, my theme here, I want to fix the
▶ 0:59:40I mean, we've put forward two big deregulatory initiatives that we hopefully are are are the type of things that are so credible and we believe they are that they last. uh there's obviously jump balls within a statutory framework and where there are those jump balls of discretion that is where the most danger is. Obviously uh we would have concerns with the definition of abusiveness under UDAP that would be an example where I think that you would want to codify a better definition of it.
▶ 1:00:09I think you'd want to codify what is larger larger participant. I think you'd want to cottify what consumer risk that is so significant that the CFPB should ex should extend its authority and so I would remove those discretionary jump balls as much as possible.
▶ 1:00:26Director, on a similar topic, past abuses have made clear the need for increased congressional accountability and oversight over the bureau's actions. What structural forms would be helpful to ensure that in the future the bureau stays within its statutory mandate and is not moving beyond congressional
▶ 1:00:44I think the biggest thing that you can do is put uh the agency uh under the appropriations process. Uh the the degree to which it doesn't have to come to Congress and have its budget approved and dispensed to is a massive massive problem. And I think it's the number one thing that I would I would point the committee to.
▶ 1:01:06The bill we've noticed today would include an adjustment to the supervision threshold to 21 billion dollars to account for economic growth. What would that adjustment mean for the bureau's ability to focus its supervisory function on larger institutions?
▶ 1:01:21I think it would help for sure. uh I think it would align with the risk uh basis of which we endeavor our super supervision and enforcement activities and so I think it's the kind of common sense reform uh that you know would would hopefully ride on a on a reform
▶ 1:01:39Thank you director for being here and thank you chairman for having this hearing and I yield back.
▶ 1:01:44Gentleman from Oklahoma yields back. Chair now recognizes the ranking member of our subcommittee on capital markets Mr. Sherman from California for 5 minutes. It's incredibly refreshing to have someone from the Trump administration come here and talk about the role of Congress and congressional oversight. Uh in so many other areas, this administration just flouts the law. Uh the greatest of course being the War Powers Act.
▶ 1:02:10So in this one narrow area, we've got an administration uh that believes Congress should exist. Uh and that is indeed refreshing. Uh I want to focus on uh an issue I think is of concern to both sides of the aisle and that is these quote credit report repair agencies. Uh they have a tendency to overwhelm your agency with bot created complaints by the literally millions.
▶ 1:02:39In 2024 your agency announced uh of course under prior administration that it distributed 1.8 8 billion to uh dollars to 4.3 million consumers hurt by credit repair scams. What actions have you taken in your tenure uh to track down on these companies and and also to prevent them from overwhelming your website?
▶ 1:03:02Well, I I I thank you for the question. Uh we have tried to build on some of the reforms uh that were previously put into place. For instance, creating an account with a password uh having a verified email. We've taken the next step of verifying a mobile phone number. We've taken the next step of making sure that you can't have the same uh phone number for multiple different individuals. Uh and we've tried to to to remind people that they have to go to the credit reporting agency first.
▶ 1:03:32They have 30 days. They can get an extension for another 15 days, but that's the basis of the process. Um and hopefully that will be a major demand signal to the
▶ 1:03:42Thank you. I need to to move on. Uh, Mr. Vod, and wearing your other hats, and you've worn many in this administration, you've presided over the cuts to our foreign aid program that will result in 3 million deaths during this administration, mostly from health and uh not providing malaria and AIDS treatments uh and tuberculosis treatments, also food aid.
▶ 1:04:09Uh we see a defunding of the council of inspectors uh general on integrity and efficiency and we've seen illegal cuts uh where you just freeze the money for Alzheimer's research, women's health, cancer research uh etc.
▶ 1:04:28Now, in your opening statement, you tell us that uh I think you come up with a figure as high as $370 billion that the CFPB has imposed in uh costs to That's really just the banks saying, "Oh my god, we don't like the CFPB and we'll attribute all of our price increases to their existence." uh the uh council of economic adviserss does nothing to prove that these are real
▶ 1:04:58dollars not imaginary dollars. In uh, as you know, uh, the prior the CFPB prior to you had returned 21 billion to uh, and five, correct? 21 billion. Yeah. Back to consumers in monetary compensation, principal reductions, canceled debt.
▶ 1:05:21Um, and uh, what's more important, as long as your testimony is based on estimates, it must be tens or hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars that the CFPB has saved consumers by deterring fraud, by deterring abusive practices. U, you know, there were some who wanted to defund the police.
▶ 1:05:50They were unsuccessful, but they would point to, well, how much did the police actually recover for the from the victims of crime? How many wallets were returned? That isn't the issue. If you're going to defund the police, you look at what crimes are prevented and the only person successful in defunding the police, sir, is you.
▶ 1:06:19You've defunded the police that protect us from crime in the streets uh while railing against crime in the streets. And the fact is Americans need to be protected uh from Um you have slashed your agency without any input from Congress. Congress envisioned because we were here, we wrote this bill, uh a robust agency. You've cut it by a third.
▶ 1:06:47You're in the process of trying to cut it by more than a third. You've cut enforcement by 80%.
▶ 1:06:52Gentleman's time has expired and I invite the director to respond to that question in writing. Thank you. Chair recognizes the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Sessions, for five minutes.
▶ 1:07:02Thank you very much, chairman. Director, welcome. Uh, I in fact find your leadership refreshing. I find your leadership balanced. I find your leadership addressing the overregulation, overpowering by government. You've brought up several examples of uh things that that happen when when uh oversight when you come into banks or you come into areas uh about their oversight.
▶ 1:07:30Uh I want to talk with you about some of the civil money penalties that have really taken place. It happened more before you got there. Talk to me about these civil penalties and the use of those civil penalties. I've been looking on the website about how the the CFPB does have discretion in these areas. And what what is this? Is it a weapon? Is it there to stop bad behavior?
▶ 1:08:00Is it there to uh create something new? And correspondently once those penalties were uh made money civil penalties was action taken that corre that changed uh results or procedures.
▶ 1:08:18One of the tools, Congressman, that CFPB has is administrative consent orders, which is essentially a way that CFPB can sue and settle uh over and over with entities and can bring in additional contributions into the civil civil penalty fund, which has a use.
▶ 1:08:37Uh we we had at least one or two examples where uh a company that had done wrongdoing that we thought was valid did not have any money left and we put money out from the civil penalty fund so we could provide redress to consumers. But the extent to which the combination of the fund and the sue and settle uh authorities that CFPB has is one of those things that I would take a look at if I was in Congress.
▶ 1:09:03So in other words, you believe that there may be a better balance if we look at that and and and and see where we actually direct the CFPB on on that.
▶ 1:09:15I do.
▶ 1:09:15Okay. Well, I think it's important for us to and you to look at overregulation. Uh the our friends on the other side didn't want to talk about 1071. 1071 is something that we became aware of early on. the uh uh banking industry became aware of it.
▶ 1:09:38It took what was originally about 14 or 15 pages of regulation and moved it to a thousand pages. It required banks or any lenders where they were dealing with minorities uh to reassess and and to ask all sorts of questions.
▶ 1:09:56I found that what it did is it by and large meant that banks did not want to offer loans anymore because of the extensive and rigorous process that it required rather than some review stating the facts about where they believed uh there may be frailties in the marketplace. I note that you have now changed those rules and regulations.
▶ 1:10:18Have you had a chance to do any evaluation where you did a look back compared to what might be the current uh results that are happening that making it better for banks, financial institutions to lend to minority or other types of businesses or people?
▶ 1:10:36Thank you, Congressman. When the when the rule went through OIRA review, which is obviously a new feature under this administration, uh it had a costbenefit analysis. Um the the benefits $2 billion and lower regulatory costs were obviously substantial. Um it's too soon to be able to see the on the ground impact, but I heard the same thing that you did with regard to the the potential that we'd have fewer lending as a result of it.
▶ 1:11:02And just to to put a fine point on the statutory basis for it, the statute required 13 data fields. the choper directorship put forward a rule that had in the neighborhood of 80 plus direct uh field data fields. Uh we came up with a rule that did 16 and we believe for good reasons because those extra three were tied into the underlying 13.
▶ 1:11:24Right. And as a matter of fact it would have put the person who was asking the loan put them in jeopardy also.
▶ 1:11:32Of how they complied. Another another fact is 29 million uh paper hours of paperwork as a result of the last 15 years of CFPB that the 1071 rule that Chopra had done it would have added much more paperwork many more employees that these entities would have to do to do that paperwork.
▶ 1:11:53Well, it came directly from the Texas bankers association who talked with all the members up here and they felt like it was not wise. You have made it uh more reasonable. Mr. Mr Chairman, I yield back my time.
▶ 1:12:04Gentleman yields back. I want to recognize the ranking member of our House Foreign Affairs Committee, Mr. Meeks of New York, for 5 minutes.
▶ 1:12:10Thank you, Mr. V. You've never been a member of Congress, have you?
▶ 1:12:13I have not.
▶ 1:12:14And you were not a member of Congress at the time that Congress created the CFPB, were you?
▶ 1:12:20I was not. and Congress uh then made and gave CFPB a statutory responsibilities to protect consumers from unfair, deceptive, and abusive financial practices. So, I don't know if you know that, but I was here when it was created.
▶ 1:12:38That's the congressional Now, you took an office or oath, I guess, as acting because you you not you have not been or ever been confirmed to be the director. Is that correct?
▶ 1:12:51I have not. And I'm looking forward to being up with my time on
▶ 1:12:54You have not. And I'm looking for I'm looking forward to that, too.
▶ 1:12:57Um [laughter] uh but you took an oath of office to faithfully execute the laws that Congress enacted. Is that not correct?
▶ 1:13:09And we've done that. not that you've enacted, but that Congress have enacted. And in your testimony, you've said, "We've sought to downscale this agency to the maximum extent possible." and I quote, "Then you said you don't believe that the CFPB should exist in its current form, which is the form of which Congress created, not you, or the DoddFrank Act, which is
▶ 1:13:40still the law. You may not like it, but it is what Congress set forth. Congress has never relieved the bureau of its statutory So Mr. Vote, let me the first thing is your job isn't to run on a temporary basis as you have the CFPB as you wish.
▶ 1:14:08It is as the Congress has set out statutoily for it to be done. Your job is to be faithful to administer the CFPB that Congress created. But that's not what you've done, sir. You've accused the CFPB of, and I quote, advancing a radical political agenda. But Mr.
▶ 1:14:34Vote, aren't you the creator of Project 2026, and you're trying to put that in place here, which is a radical political Aren't you doing the exact same things? Is that what you're doing? You are putting forward project 2026, a radical political agenda and trying to utilize it in the CFPB which is not authorized by the United States Congress.
▶ 1:15:04Sir, under your leadership, the CFPB has dropped enforcement actions, cut its workforce, and made major operational Mr. to vote.
▶ 1:15:16Your lawyers, I mean, and you've done this being a nonconfirmed person, and your lawyers have even argued in court that major decisions about the bureau's workforce and operations should wait shouldn't be on you temporarily, but your lawyers said should wait for a Senate confirmed director because they carry greater I mean your lawyers are actually that you don't
▶ 1:15:47have that legitimacy. That's their case. That's what they said in court. It says it's not legitimate when they are made by someone con not confirmed by the Senate. So your conduct sir is directly inconsistent with the position of your own lawyers or what they took in court.
▶ 1:16:13So, you described the CFPB as an unserious agency in your testimony. Do you believe that what you and Elon Musk did with Doge at the CFPB reflected So, that was unserious and not what the American people would expect from their Congress never authorized Doge to carry out the CFPB's mission.
▶ 1:16:44Congress never gave Doge authority over consumer financial protection. Yet under your watch, sir, Doge gained access to some of the CFPB's most sensitive consumer and supervisory information that I call unserious and that reckless. Sir, your testimony mentioned several things. I'm out of time, but sir, I'm glad you're leaving. I yield back.
▶ 1:17:12Gentleman [clears throat] yields back. Chair now recognizes the chair of the subcommittee on financial institutions, Mr. Bar of Kentucky, for five minutes.
▶ 1:17:19Director vote, let me offer an alternative perspective from uh my friend, the gentleman from New York. Um I wasn't a member when Congress passed the DoddFrank Act. C candidly, everyone knows I would have voted against the DoddFrank Act had I been here at the time, but I am a member of Congress today and the fact of the matter is um you're not disregarding the statute. The statute gave you as the acting director and any director enormous enormous power unaccountable from Congress.
▶ 1:17:50That was the precise design of the DoddFrank law in creating this bureau. And so to the extent my friend from New York has a problem with you exercising the enormous discretion that Congress conferred upon you, it's his fault. It's the fault of the authors of the DoddFrank law.
▶ 1:18:10That is precisely why we have attached to this hearing a reform package that should be If anyone wants to provide accountability to the bureau, if anyone wants to rein in your discretion that you have exercised lawfully, it should be the Congress on a bipartisan basis.
▶ 1:18:31So whether it's Richard Cordray or Kathy Cranigger or Chopra or you sir, we have given to you, my predecessors have given to you in THE DODDFRANK LAW ALL THE POWERS that you are now exercising. So if my friends on the other side of the aisle have anyone to blame for the actions that you have taken, they need to look in the mirror because they have given you the power that you have exercised here today. That is the gentleman been confirmed by
▶ 1:18:59that is precisely why we have offered this reform package today. Director vote. Over the years, many stakeholders have expressed concern that the CFPB's civil investigative demand authority has been exercised with limited transparency and few meaningful procedural safeguards, making it difficult for recipients to understand the basis for an investigation or to challenge overly broad requests before incurring significant costs. Those concerns undermine confidence in what should be a fair and objective investigative process.
▶ 1:19:29It's why I introduced HR1653, which would strengthen the procedural protection surrounding the CFPB's use of civil investigative demands while preserving the bureau's ability to investigate legitimate misconduct. Could you discuss how the CI process was abused under your predecessor and how greater transparency and due process in the bureau's CI process can strengthen both public confidence in the agency and the effectiveness of enforcement
▶ 1:19:55Thank you, Congressman. And I mean, when you have a a a financial regulatory uh entity that views themselves as a prosecutor, an advocate, and they have the tools of the civil investigative demands to be able to open up and get any information they want and go on factf finding missions, which is what the supervision u uh aspects of the job often look like.
▶ 1:20:17um you have great opportunities for uh uh mischief and I think your bill is the kind of thing that needs to be done to bind the agency and and rarely do you have an agency head that comes to you and says please bind our agency in as many ways as you possibly can because of the the degree to which uh it has it has acted abnormally.
▶ 1:20:39Well, under your predecessor, the C process uh was a fishing expedition that there was no requirement that they had to actually identify suspected illegal conduct. They just went in and they harassed law-abiding American companies and bankrupted them with this Gestapo tactics. That's why we need my bill and this and to reform C and put some modicum of due process into the system.
▶ 1:21:01Um, I I invite my my friend from New York to consider my legislation that would subject the bureau to the congressional appropriations process to the extent he thinks you're doing a bad job. Again, it's the authors of the DoddFrank's law fault because they they put you beyond the congressional appropriations process.
▶ 1:21:21Could you discuss how bringing the CFPB into the annual appropriations process would strengthen the bureau's stewardship of taxpayer resources, improve accountability to Congress, and frankly give my friend, the gentleman from New York, more authority over you. It's the most important reform that you can do. Full stop. Uh the extent to which an agency has to come to Congress and justify the activities that it does in conjunction with the resources that is requesting from the appropriations process.
▶ 1:21:50I do not believe I do not understand why Congress would ever provide funding to an agency outside of that process. Um and and so it has led to I think a cavalier attitude and and a swagger on behalf on behalf of the CFPB. That is ultimately what we've been trying to wind down.
▶ 1:22:08Well, I understand that my friends on the other side of the aisle are disappointed in your leadership. I was disappointed with the pre my your predecessor's leadership. If we care about making this agency accountable and less partisan, let's join together in a bipartisan manner and reclaim the power of gentleman's time is expired over this agency. I yield back.
▶ 1:22:25Chair recognizes the ranking member of our subcommittee of on digital assets, Mr. Lynch of Massachusetts. You're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 1:22:32Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Directive vote. In 2023, the Department of Justice and Treasury uh reached a $4 billion settlement with Binance after the company willfully violated US anti-money laundering and sanctions laws.
▶ 1:22:48Uh Binance had failed to safeguard its platform against terrorist ransomware attackers, and sanctioned actors in in Iran, uh North Korea, and In uh in March 2025, Binance wrote the code behind World Liberty Financial USD1 stable coin. That's the crypto com cryptocurrency company predominantly owned by President Trump and his family, his sons.
▶ 1:23:17Uh now, Binance also promoted the product to 275 million customers and uh recent financial disclosures by the president uh indicate that he personally made $263 million on on that deal. Two months later, the UAE, United Arab Emirates, a state stateowned investment firm MGX issued USD1.
▶ 1:23:41This is that sta the promp stablecoin to make a $2 billion investment in Binance uh giving President Trump a direct financial stake in the very exchange Binance that he had responsibility for monitoring from for the previous money laundering. In November 2025, President Trump pardoned the CEO, Changpang Jiao, who was the CEO of of Binance.
▶ 1:24:15Again, with the recent disclosures that we've received and and also supported by blockchain analytics data shows that over 1 million investors, these are consumers, these are the folks that you're supposed to be protecting, lost over $3.8 8 billion on the Trump memecoin which has lost 90% of its value while Trump has reaped over 1.4 billion dollars in personal gain.
▶ 1:24:45All of that has raised massive legal issues for for those consumers who you're supposed to be protecting and and those are matters well within your Uh in addition there are issues of abuse of power, improper imalments under the constitution, self-deing, conflict of interest.
▶ 1:25:08So given your responsibility for protecting consumer, is any of that worthy of an by your agency?
▶ 1:25:19This administration has the highest ethical standards. I would refer you to the statements made by the Trump Organization that all investments are made by third party financial
▶ 1:25:30I'm asking you if if if any of that any of that, you know, the the president getting $1.4 billion. The consumers that you're supposed to be protecting lose $3.8 billion. 90% of the value is gone. The president obviously promoted this meme coin as he was coming into office. None of that none of that warrants an investigation. Is that what you're telling this committee this morning?
▶ 1:25:58No. There is nothing that we have done that is a conflict of interest. This administration has the highest who prior to that. You're you're talking like we is you and the president. You're you're supposed to be the cop on the beat at CFPB. You're supposed to be pro. It's it should be we the consumers feel or we the consu we the consumers see this not you and the president.
▶ 1:26:24He you know he he he has scammed these the $3.8 billion that that that these consumers lost. That that's what you should be policing. That's where you should be investigating. You shouldn't be defending the president's deal. You got a responsibility to investigate. That's that's what we we all did uh when we created the CFPB. So So you're saying there's nothing here, none of that.
▶ 1:26:52the the gain of the president, the pardoning of of Changpang Jiao, the fact that that the UAE has used the Trump stable coin to to invest in Binance, giving the president, you know, billions of dollars in in personal financial gain. You don't think there's anything and and and the harm to the consumers. That's the key here.
▶ 1:27:18Consumers lost $3.8 8 billion and you sir are responsible for protecting them and you don't think there's any any need for an investigation. Is that what you're telling me?
▶ 1:27:29I'm not going to rely on the extent to which fake newspapers portray the events that you're describing.
▶ 1:27:36That's what investigations are for.
▶ 1:27:38Gentlemen's time is expired. Uh just a reminder to both sides of the aisle. All members of the committee reminded to observe the principles of decorum and courtesy and debate. House of Representatives and its committees. Members are reminded to direct their remarks to the chair and not to speak unless properly recognized and avoid engaging personalities or imputing the motives of another member or of the president. Chair now recognizes the chair of the House Small Business Committee, Mr. Williams of Texas for five minutes
▶ 1:28:04just identified.
▶ 1:28:05Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for being here today. I'm I happen to be a car leader back home and our industry got sucked into this by cordre when we weren't even supposed to be in it. So your testimonies personal to our industry. Uh consumers deserve a clear information about the financial products they use and at the same time the businesses that uh serve them deserve a clear rule so that they can comply with the law. As a small business owner myself, I understand how important regulatory certainty is.
▶ 1:28:34When the agencies rely on enforcement action instead of clear publicly available guidance becomes much harder for responsible businesses to understand their legal obligations under entering the marketplace. So, director vote, uh, how's the CFPB working to promote greater clarity and transparency regarding federal consumer financial laws, particularly its UDAP authority, and so that responsible businesses understand that compliance obligations and consumers continue to receive meaningful uh protections.
▶ 1:29:04Thank you, Congressman. We've been very clear in putting out our guidance uh for supervision and enforcement on how we want to prioritize our tools. Uh we want to find actual uh victims. We want to provide identifiable consumer harm which we view as material and measurable.
▶ 1:29:24Um and we want to make sure that those are where we put all of our resources as opposed to u some process that didn't get um adhered to in which the company came forward and self-directed it. uh that is where we believe we can put as much uh lead on the target on behalf of consumers on behalf of the consumer protection laws that we have on this on the books in this country. Uh thank you for that.
▶ 1:29:47And as chairman of the small business committee, I hear every day from entrepreneurs who rely on loans to hire employees, purchase equipment, and grow their businesses that many of these small businesses raised concerns about uh the previous administration's implementation of section 1071. We've talked about that small business lending rule uh would impose significant compliance costs and ultimately make it difficult for lenders to simply extend credit.
▶ 1:30:11So recognizing these concerns, the Trump administration CFPB revised the section 1071 rule by naring it its scope, modifying certain data collection requirements and extending compliment compliance deadlines to reduce unnecessary regulatory burdens on lenders and small businesses. So, director, can you explain how these revisions help rightsize compliance requirements, improve access to credit for America's small business, and still ensure the CFPB fulfills its statutory
▶ 1:30:40Sure, Congressman. I mean, I think if you load up the regulatory burdens on lending and require for every small business loan, 80 data fields to be filled in, none of which is relevant uh for the purposes of providing those kinds of loans, you're you've increased the cost of doing business and you're going to end up having fewer small business loans, which I don't think anyone in this this room wants.
▶ 1:31:06So that is the reason why we prioritize that rule um with you all and we're very proud of our final product.
▶ 1:31:13Should be uh the rule of the CFPB is to enforce federal law not to delay the work of financial institutions with burdensome mandates. Currently we're fixing a disjointed framework where multiple agencies have overlapping jurisdiction overseeing the same institutions. This often creates excessive regulatory demands and conflicting obligations for financial institutions. So, director, in closing, can you please tell me what the CFPB is doing to improve inter agency coordination and minimize redundant oversight that burdens our financial
▶ 1:31:44Sure. We've tried to uh not get in the way of the credential regulators. Uh we've tried to be very u insistent that we stick to our portfolio and to acknowledge that u the regulated entities have many different regulators. Um, and we've tried to take that approach and provide clarity on that. On that front,
▶ 1:32:05I would just like to close by saying the cost of regulation is destroying can destroy Main Street America, small businesses. Uh, and the less we can regulate some of these businesses, the better better off we are. So, thank you for being here today. Appreciate it.
▶ 1:32:20Gentleman yields back. Chair recognizes our ranking member of our subcommittee on financial institutions, Dr. Foster of Illinois. You're recognized for five
▶ 1:32:28Yeah. Well, thank you. I wear several hats around here. Among them, uh, one, an actual manufacturer in this thing, who started a company that manufactures big part of the theater lighting equipment and I could talk for a long while about how destructive this administration has been towards US manufacturing, but I'm also a PhD physicist. Okay. In your spare time, between destroying federal regul regulators, you're al also pretty far along in destroying the federal science enterprise. Are you familiar with Omar Yagi?
▶ 1:32:58Am I familiar with what
▶ 1:32:59Omar Yagi? He's a Palestinian refugee. He grew up in Jordan, came to the United States, won a Nobel Prize and he's brilliant, charismatic guy and he announced a few days ago that he is leaving the United States and you know where he's going China where he will be leading the material science labs at one of their top universities. So I my question is this. Could you please tell your boss that the his current score on Nobel prizes is negative one. Could you tell him that?
▶ 1:33:28No, I'm not going to tell him that because I think it's an inappropriate comment from you.
▶ 1:33:32I think it's a factual comment. Um, okay. No, I'm uh was one of the few members who's still on the committee who was around during the global financial crisis which was the result in large extent of abusive lending practices that caused dramatic failures in financial markets. Lenders made loans that were impossible to repay. They knew it. with hidden fees, exploding adjustable interest rates, little or no evaluation of a borrower's ability to repay.
▶ 1:33:57These practices contributed to widespread defaults and debt that resulted in a $700 billion taxpayer funded bailout of the US economy, which is where you're heading us back down that track the path you're heading us back down. So, this crisis caused Congress to create, among other things, the CFPB to address exactly the type of predatory lending practices that led to this crisis. the Congress giving it authority over non-bank mortgage lenders, credit cards, student loans, and other consumer lending products.
▶ 1:34:26Okay, maybe you think it's all fine now, but do you know how much debt the US households have to that how much debt they had um prior to the peak of the 2008 financial crisis total?
▶ 1:34:38Not the top of my head, no.
▶ 1:34:39Yeah. 12.68 trillion in 2008. Do you know how much debt the US households hold today?
▶ 1:34:47How many? $18.8 trillion. There's more debt piled up uh and stress American households than there was before the crisis. And we're unfortunately just as naked against the same sort of abuse that we had as we had back then. We're facing American families are facing significant economic challenges. All the while this administration and you specifically are attempting to cut 95% of the staff of the one agency empowered by Congress to protect them from abusive loans and and predatory lenders.
▶ 1:35:16This is not to mention that the mess that you and the president have gotten us into with tariffs and the conflict in Iran, you know, both of which are increasing cost and the economic stress on Americans and your administration has presented no intelligible strategy to end either one of these. And so one of the underappreciated aspects of the pre 2008 economy was the lack of supervision over non-bank financial institutions.
▶ 1:35:39Before the crisis, many mortgages were issued by non-bank lenders and that percentage increased from roughly 40% in 2008 to around 65% today. Pre 2008, no agency had authority to oversee non-bank mortgage lenders. This is the mortgage market that led to the financial crisis. Congress then gave the CFPB authority to oversee non-bank mortgage lenders, an authority that was not previously held by any financial agency.
▶ 1:36:08Uh so do you know how many examinations the CFPB carried out on entities under its supervision since you've taken over as
▶ 1:36:15We have continued our supervision enforcement activities and I would just say with regard to the non-banks many of the the legal theories that were used to uh supervise and enforce on non-banks were extrapolations that were quite novel from anything that you had ever passed. So our issue is not whether we're willing to regulate non-banks.
▶ 1:36:39The issue is the extent to which the legal theories and the statutes do not allow and that need to go through Congress as the extent to which uh we need to have that debate here in in the people's
▶ 1:36:50We did have that debate. We passed I voted for and we passed the DoddFrank Wall Street reform bill that gave you authority to deal with non-bank lenders. All right. And and when you've got the administration, you're heading us down a path that that is, I'm afraid, just going to send us right back. Now, it know you made it abundantly clear. You don't much care about ordinary Americans getting ripped off, but maybe you care about rich people. You remember Mie Bernie Maidolf, okay?
▶ 1:37:19He scammed, you know, many, many very wealthy people, Republican donors that your boss cares about, okay? And it and when we had hearing after hearing on how did that happen, it was because of underfunded
▶ 1:37:31Time has expired.
▶ 1:37:32Go back.
▶ 1:37:33Chair now recognizes the chair of our subcommittee on national security, Mr. Davidson of Ohio for five minutes.
▶ 1:37:39Thank you, chairman. And chairman vote, thank you for your multiple hats, but uh thank you for your work here at C CFPB and answering our questions today. And I have a new plan for some of my time. I want to mention as a former manufacturing company owner uh growing businesses in Ohio, we're very thankful for President Trump's leadership and that extends broadly across the administration because for the first time somebody intends to do something about China's failure to comply with their commitment to be a market economy.
▶ 1:38:09They've weaponized uh the rules of trade against the United States and President Trump has made it a priority to grow jobs here in America. Uh we've done that with the working family tax cuts act. We've encouraged incentivized investments in America. We've done that with tariff and trade policy. And we've seen overwhelming commitments by countries and companies around the world to make bigger foreign direct investments in the United States of America than ever before.
▶ 1:38:36So far from u the narrow experience of my colleague from Illinois, uh the broad market says that cash is flowing into the United States. And the reality is one of the Nobel Prize laurettes that he has uh despite their narrative that America is some insufferable, you know, terrible place. Uh everyone in the world wants to be here. Uh we let a million people in legally every year and u but we've we've cracked down on illegal immigration. They said we need to pass laws to do that.
▶ 1:39:07We had laws. We didn't apply them. Now bring that over into the financial sector and foreign investment. We've got uh Nobel Prize laurettes who would rather help China than the United States of America. That might be a sign we didn't get the immigration thing right. If you want to be part of helping China advance in a competition against the United States, good riddens. Enjoy your time in China. Please don't come back. I hope Secretary Rubio makes sure you can't.
▶ 1:39:30So, um those are the kinds of things that, you know, America's policies advance America's interests that are ch across the board. And when uh I think about you know consistent consistency there I think about woke and weaponized government and you certainly walked into an agency where that was off the charts.
▶ 1:39:48You were pushing initiatives through or you weren't uh your predecessor was pushing initiatives and predecessors uh going back to Richard Cordray uh were pushing initiatives that were at odds with not just law but the interest of the United States. So could you highlight maybe some of the highlights of your experience there of how the agency was being abused from its proper
▶ 1:40:11Well, let me give you the example of Townstone, which is a small mortgage lending company in Chicago that was only 31 mortgages short out of about 879 of violating some arbitrary threshold under disparit impact standard, which we have now gotten away from and and gotten rid of. And that began over a series of time.
▶ 1:40:36They used software to to mine all of the public comments of this president of this of Barry Sterner, the head of Townstone, and they found out a small portion that he crit criticized crime in Chicago, which were the very same statements that the Democrat mayor of Chicago had said. Well, they went after him for six to seven years, harassed him into paying a $100,000 fine. All wrong. No one ever accused him of of in discrimination.
▶ 1:41:04They in fact did a survey of all of the people in the area that uh that that Townstone served and not one person said that they believe that discrimination was occurring. All of that was done at the CFPB over a series of years. And when we went behind the the the curtain, we found that it escalated at key points about what different debates that we were having in this country, not unlike the George Floyd situation.
▶ 1:41:32So they were taking out frustration on Barry Sterner and his company because they could. And that is what we mean by a weaponized agency against the American people. And I can point to Cordova and I can point to other examples of that. But that is what we found when we took control of the agency and what we've tried to put an end to.
▶ 1:41:51Yeah. Thank you. And sadly that's been true across the whole spectrum and I think you know in every committee of jurisdiction we could have you know hours of testimony talking about how that's changed and so thank you for you know being at the hub there. in your role, I guess, just could you give us a little clarity on where we're we're going on open banking because there was, you know, some effort there, some lack of statutory guidance, but there's clearly a role for calling balls and strikes there for whose property is is whose in the in the realm of banking.
▶ 1:42:21We are very close to having a proposed rule. It is one of those things that I would like a newly confirmed director to be able to finalize. Uh, but we are very close. Uh we will take our timing from the Senate as to the confirmation of of hopefully Brian Johnson. Uh but we are supportive of open banking as a concept and we're we're working hard on that
▶ 1:42:42Gentleman's time is expired. Chair now recognizes the ranking member of our subcommittee on national security, Miss Batty of Ohio for five minutes.
▶ 1:42:51Thank you, Mr. Chairman and ranking member. Director vote. Section 1071 of the Dodfrank requires the collection of small business lending data to identify disparities in access to credit and enforce fair lending laws for small businesses. Yet, under your leadership, the CFPB has sought to delay and significantly scale back implementation of this statutory requirement.
▶ 1:43:16Even though womenowned businesses and minorityowned businesses have faced long doumented barriers to accessing capital. Director vote section 342 of the DoddFrank Act requires the CFPB to maintain an AMWI office to promote diversity in the bureau's workforce, increase opportunities for minority and womenowned businesses and contracting and access to diversity policies and practices of regulated financial institutions.
▶ 1:43:45However, multiple news reports have indicated that under your leadership, the CFPB has dramatically reduced the Amway Office as part of a broader workforce cuts, raising questions about whether the bureau can still carry out these statutory Director vote.
▶ 1:44:05I have heard directly from community development financial institutions in my state that they have experienced month-long delays in receiving funding that Congress had already appropriated through the CDFI funds. Those delays created uncertainty for lenders that finance affordable housing, small businesses, and underserved communities, even though Congress had already approved the funding. Director vote.
▶ 1:44:34The recently re released comprehensive housing council notice of funding opportunities is a drastic change from previous years. The comprehensive funding is supposed to help families meet their housing needs whether they are renters, homeowners, or homeless.
▶ 1:44:51Instead, under the notice of funding opportunity, none of the CHC fundings allowed by Congress can be used for pre-purchasing housing counseling at a time when there is a national crisis for firsttime home owners. In case you aren't aware, we passed a bipartisan housing bill because of this director uh vote.
▶ 1:45:16The Small Business Regulatory Enforcement Fairness Act requires the bureau to consult a small business panel. A small I am a small business owner for more than 30 years and to conduct a costbenefit analysis before imposing rules with a significant economic impact. Director Vote, can you uh tell me who uh is your AmI director?
▶ 1:45:42Well, we have that office.
▶ 1:45:43Give me a name. We have that office. Uh-uh. Wait a minute. Because of time, I'm a respected chairman. I need a name or a yes or no. Do you know who your Yes or no? Do you know who your Amway director is?
▶ 1:45:56Sorry. What office are you referring to?
▶ 1:45:59The office of Amway
▶ 1:46:02which was which was put in by DoddFrank section 342 of Amway.
▶ 1:46:07What is the non acronym?
▶ 1:46:08So that that means you don't know. That's quite embarrassing. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to take my time back. Let me tell you something. I'm happy to answer. No, you're not answering it because either you know the director and you know the person's name. I've had Democrat and Republicans over your department to come in here. Since someone mentioned Kathy Cranninger, she came, she testified, she supported Amwi. When we had Mick Melaney, he came and and testified. Rich Cordray did, Chopen did.
▶ 1:46:36Everyone before you, it's embarrassing and insulting. This was created through DoddFrank. So, let me ask you this. What is your justification for efforts to halt on the small business lending data on the collection which Congress explicitly requires?
▶ 1:46:52We're not halting it. We just did a rule on 1071 to make sure we go forward and and implement the statute as you spelled it out in Congress.
▶ 1:47:00Well, that's not the information we had. So, let me move on. What role what role did your what role did you or officials at OM play in delaying the CDFI fund
▶ 1:47:14We didn't delay it. We just authorized it to go out and aortion the funds to Treasury. They are 25 and 26 funds which means they do not expire until the end of this year fiscally. [clears throat] But we have concerns with regard to that program. LGBT clinics that go to my next gender affirming therapy and serve clientele of any
▶ 1:47:34I reclaim my time. You're not going to do this. You're not going to do this with me.
▶ 1:47:38Okay? I'm going to respect you and you're going to respect me. So, I'll go back to Omi. It is my suggestion that you send to me in writing who your director is and what are your plans to comply with section 342 of Amway. And I yield back. [clears throat] Gentleman's time is expired and I appreciate the director's response to that question in writing. Chair chair now recognizes the gentleman from South Carolina, Mr. Timmons, for five minutes.
▶ 1:48:05Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, acting director vote for being with us today and for your leadership in returning the CFPB to its statutory mission. This was a really good contrast because I I think back to June 13 of 2024. I sat in this hearing with director Chopra and we debated the proper role and scope of the CFPB.
▶ 1:48:27He repeatedly invoked quote the democratic rule of law while arguing against Andy Cong Congressman Andy Bar's tabs act and other carefully considered legislative proposals designed to provide greater accountability and stability for the bureau. He opposed efforts to curb the CFPB's dramatic policy swings even though those swings have created uncertainty and imposed real costs on American businesses.
▶ 1:48:51At the time I told him, quote, "Come January, whoever is sitting in your seat will have a very, very different view of the CFPB's role." My concern was that lasting policy should come from Congress, not from an agency whose priorities can shift dramatically from one administration to the next. Um, acting director vote, would you agree that your approach reflects a fundamentally different view of the CFPB's role?
▶ 1:49:16And can you explain to my colleagues across the aisle and to the American people why you believe this approach better serves American businesses? We believe this is the most democratic approach to how to ensure that we're going to be a good steward of the agency. Congress passed the law with regard to the CFPB and we are doing our duties under the law uh with regard to supervision enforcement regulation when we tie very closely to the law and so often we we we wish that Congress had given more detail when they wrote those law but we're certainly not going to take novel
▶ 1:49:46theories that the law does not countenance I couldn't agree with you more as I said then the wild swings in how the CFPB carries out its mission are not conducive to American competitiveness on the global stage Businesses and consumers alike benefit when regulators provide consistency, predictability, and clear rules rather than frequent shifts in policy. I told Director Chopra that when the administration changed, he and many of his Democrat colleagues would likely oppose the bureau's new direction, as we can see in this hearing.
▶ 1:50:17That's why durable policy should come from Congress, not changing regulatory priorities. I appreciate the work you and your team are doing to return the CFPB to its statutory mission and provide a more transparent, consistent, and accountable approach that benefits both consumers and the businesses in my district. Now, let's turn to what comes next. One of the recurring concerns we've heard from banks and credit unions is the amount of duplication between CFPB examinations and those already conducted by the credential regulators.
▶ 1:50:45The discussion draft before us would encourage a more tailored supervisory framework that relies on the expertise of those regulators while preserving the CFPB's authority to step in when real consumer risks emerge. From your perspective, how would a more coordinated supervisory approach reduce unnecessary duplication and allow the CFPB to better focus its resources on protecting consumers? Well, I think it's a vital piece of it.
▶ 1:51:09If you look on the back side of our uh work, you will see a calendar that is uh open to all of the regulators including the state regulators so that when we have an interest in asking questions of a particular entity, we can align those with the u the event uh uh calendar of other regulators and we think it's a really important part part of the process to make this as easy on them as possible.
▶ 1:51:35Thank you for that. Do you believe that reducing overlapping examinations would free examiners to spend more time identifying bad actors instead of repeatedly reviewing institutions with established compliance programs?
▶ 1:51:48The same principle applies to the bureau's supervision of non-bank financial companies. The CFPB's resources should be focused where the risks to consumers are greatest, not spread so broadly that responsible companies face unnecessary uncertainty while bad actors receive less attention. Um, how would the reforms in this discussion draft help the bureau better prioritize its resources while giving responsible businesses greater regulatory certainty? We want to know where their actual problems in our consumer financial markets.
▶ 1:52:18Um, that takes examiners being freed up to focus on it to to look at trends and we want to make sure they have the ability to do that and I think the extent to which you're freeing us up to do that would be helpful. One question. How often do employees at the CAPB work at 6:30 on a Friday afternoon? Is that a regular thing or is it more business hour, bank hours, 9 to5?
▶ 1:52:40I doubt they're working that late on that on that particular
▶ 1:52:42I just want to point out that the last thing Director Chopra did before he left um was send out a number of CIDs at 6:30 p.m. on a Friday. And that's the kind of it really just defines his legacy of using the CFPB in ways it was not intended to do. That's not consumer protection. That's just retaliation and it's a good thing that we are moving in a much better direction.
▶ 1:53:03You just gave a great data point for why we did the humility pledge.
▶ 1:53:07Thank you. I yel back, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:53:09Thank you, sir. Chairman, now recognize the ranking member on our task force of monetary policy. The gentleman from California, Mr. Vargas, you're recognized for five
▶ 1:53:18Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Ranking member, well, I guess we can all agree on one We're all going to be happy when you're gone, including yourself. And the reason for that, I think that there's been a title wave of harm to consumers since you've been at the CFPB. A title wave.
▶ 1:53:40Special interests are being protected and supported just like you involved yourself in that getting that big one big ugly bill passed. And you said you were going to be draining the swamp. That's what you said. You sounded here earlier too. They said we when you talk either you're the royal we or you and the president are the same. You're going to be draining the swamp. Well, what's really happening? It's And it really is unfortunate.
▶ 1:54:10And you see this humility pledge. It's not a humility pledge. It's a surrender And that's what you're doing. You're surrendering to large businesses. You don't have the consumers in mind at all anymore. And you make up numbers. You make up numbers. It's cost $300 billion dollar. No, real numbers is the money that went back to consumers that were getting ripped off previously under the other administration.
▶ 1:54:37When you actually got money back when you were defrauded, instead you have this humility pledge. You go in with your examiners and say, "We're here kneeling before you, big business. We're here for you, not for the consumers." That's what you're doing today. And again, you said yourself, you're not going to be unhappy when you're not here. You're ready to leave. We're all ready to see you leave, too. This this bureau was created to protect consumers. And that's not what you're doing at all.
▶ 1:55:06In fact, quite the opposite. You're protecting big That's what you're doing. And I and I was kind of curious. You throw out words like cavalier and swagger, the whims of an ideologue at the bureau. I'm I did want to I was going to ask you if you didn't bite your tongue when you said that. I mean, I don't know of a person who is more cavalier that has come before us, more swagger or bigger ideologue.
▶ 1:55:38I mean, you seem to describe yourself well. I don't know if you were attempting to do that. And with that, I'm just saying I'm I'll be very happy when you're gone. But unfortunately, I think we're going to find a bunch of crap happen. You're going to see redlinining happen. You're going to see discrimination. You're going to see fraud. You're going to see that businesses got away with a lot of things because you weren't the cop on the beat. You weren't at all.
▶ 1:56:04In fact, you were there for the businesses, for the big businesses, for the big special interests. You weren't there for the consumers. Well, that Mr. Um, unless the ranking member wants me to yield some time. That's what I wanted to say.
▶ 1:56:17No, keep it going. I like what you're
▶ 1:56:19No, I I think I said what I meant and I think I said enough. With that, Mr. Chair, I yield back.
▶ 1:56:26Gentleman from California yields back and the chair recognizes the gentleman from Georgia, Mr. Louderdermilk, for five minutes.
▶ 1:56:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Vote. We appreciate you being here today. Um, you know, the CFPB was designed, no matter how flawed that design was, was to protect consumers.
▶ 1:56:50But I think it's been clear to many of us who have sat at least in the DAS and on this side of the room that uh for many years that was not what the CFPB was doing but it was a name and shame organization against businesses and industries that it determined or its director determined they did not like. That is not the design.
▶ 1:57:14that is not the constitutional design nor the uh design of what any government agency should be. And so our constitutional system entrusts Congress with writing the laws in the executive branch with faithfully executing them.
▶ 1:57:30That distinction is fundamental to ensuring that significant policy decisions are made by the people's elected representatives rather than by administrative agencies which is what we've seen within CFPB for many years is writing their own rules and proceeding with their own agenda.
▶ 1:57:50Many have questions whether the CFPB under the Biden administration at times interpreted broadly worded statutes in way that effectively created new legal obligations beyond those Congress expressly enacted. Mr. Vote, do you agree that whether intended or not, that sort of behavior can erode confidence in both the agency and the regulatory process?
▶ 1:58:13I do.
▶ 1:58:14Thank you. Uh, could you discuss how the CFPB is approaching its statutory authorities today and what principles guide your efforts to ensure that the CFPB faithfully executes the laws Congress has written without expanding its authority beyond those statutory
▶ 1:58:31Well, we imposed a clear bar on doing any enforcement that is really a back-end way to do regulation. Uh, we dismissed those cases. Um and as a result uh we are very much in line with our priorities that are looking for consumer fraud that's identifiable and measurable uh but not to do it in a way uh that we're using a novel legal theory to interrupt federal bankruptcy laws or some other aspect
▶ 1:59:01of statute that was never given to the CFPB.
▶ 1:59:05Well, thank you for that. And um I think what I hear especially from the other side is that operating within the the scope of what the agency was legally authorized to do is somehow abandoning uh consumer protection.
▶ 1:59:27We have seen, many of us who have been here for a while have seen how the CFPB continually uh I wouldn't even call it mission creep, but mission advancement would start regulating areas they were specifically prohibited from being into. One hallmark of good government is that agencies fully consider both the benefits and the cost of their regulatory actions before imposing new requirements on the American people. Consumer protection and economic opportunity are not mutually exclusive.
▶ 1:59:57In fact, regulations are most effective when they are carefully tailored to address demon demonstrable consumer harm while avoiding unnecessary costs that may ultimately be borne by consumers through higher prices, reduced access to credit or fewer financial products. That principle is reflected in the transparency and costbenefit analysis.
▶ 2:00:18My legislation to require CFPB to conduct more robust economic analysis and publicly evaluate the expected costs and benefits of his significant regulatory actions. Greater transparency not only improves the quality of an agency decision-making, but also allows Congress, regulated entities, consumers, and the public to better understand the rationale underlying the CFPB's action. Mr. Mr.
▶ 2:00:43Vo, from your perspective, how would you how would you require more rigorous cost benefit analysis and greater transparency in the rulemaking process to improve CFPB's uh ability to create effective regulation?
▶ 2:00:56Great question. First of all, we're already doing it because we have brought in so-called independent agency regulations into the ORS structure. So we are already doing that now but it would be very valuable to have that be a requirement uh so that uh you would force the agency to do that even if there was a different administration that doesn't have the same view as it regards to independent agencies.
▶ 2:01:18All right as I'm running short on time I just want to say thank you for the job you're doing. I hope that you continue uh leading this direction to where it will truly uh represent consumers. With that Mr. Chairman I yield back. I thank the gentleman from Georgia. Chair recognizes the gentleman from Noah, Illinois, Mr. Castton. You're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 2:01:38Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for being here today. Um, I want to just first flag that there's an intellectual consistent inconsistency at the heart of your testimony today. You've said multiple times that the CFPB under your predecessor was a political agency and you've opposed the fact that Congress specifically made CFPB independent to isolate it from political pressures. You can choose one, but not the other. Don't I'm not asking for your opinion on that because your opinion is wrong.
▶ 2:02:04The we chose to isolate it from political pressures and we chose that in a political process in the best sense of the word. The job we have is political because balancing equities in a democracy is a political choice. When you drive home today and you fill your car with gas, you will pay the listed price for gasoline, not the price that the gas station thinks you can afford to pay. because we passed a law that protects consumers against the political interests of a more powerful agent set of players in our economy.
▶ 2:02:35You you may politically believe that you should stand with bullies against the bullied. You may politically believe that you should favor the powerful over the weak and the merciless over the meek. Those are political choices that you make.
▶ 2:02:49We made the CFPB independent to protect us from that.
▶ 2:02:53That's funny. And I want and I want I'm not asking for I will let you know when I'd like you to speak.
▶ 2:02:57Let's quantify some of the pain you have created on our society because since you have come in the CFPB has voluntarily dismissed more than 20 enforcement cases that would have returned three and a half billion dollars to consumers who were ripped off or defrauded. Examples of a couple of those. These are all from the CFPB websites. The uh you abandon a lawsuit against a bank that mistreated seniors and disabled customers. um a disabled woman who had tried to get a replacement card on the CFPB website that this left her unable to pay her rent and forced her to take out an $800 loan.
▶ 2:03:28You eliminated again an order against a credit union that had charged service members, veterans, people who've served our country, who've risked their life for our country, Department of Defense employees with $80 million in illegal fees. One service member said those undisclosed charges were a huge part as to why I had to file for So my question right now for you as the director of the consumer financial protection bureau, what is your message today to the active duty service members, the veterans, the disabled folks, the senior citizens, the consumers
▶ 2:04:00who do not believe they have an advocate in your office anymore? Why should they trust you?
▶ 2:04:05I don't agree with your
▶ 2:04:07I'm asking what your message is to the people who wrote those messages on the CFPB website and said, "I need help."
▶ 2:04:12I don't agree.
▶ 2:04:13Do you not care about them? We go around to military bases. We do this the financial industry all over the time.
▶ 2:04:20Anecdotes are not data. Three and a half billion dollars is data.
▶ 2:04:25You claimed a moment ago that the CFP has been cost you against me and now you're saying the anecdotes are not
▶ 2:04:32Three half billion dollars is data. All of those cases that were dropped were You said a moment ago that the CFPB is a net cost to society, but you know that for every dollar that the CFPB spent, it returned $3 to consumers. You claim to be a fiscally responsible guy. How does abandoning efforts to provide billions of dollars in financial remedies and just turning this agency into a net cost consumer? How does that help consumers? How does that help America?
▶ 2:05:02We cut the agency in half and returned $400 million that we didn't need to draw from the treasur from the Federal Reserve. You
▶ 2:05:09sir, you understand that the United States economy actually has a private sector. When you take $3 from consumers to save a dollar in the federal government, I'll give you a second. The math don't math.
▶ 2:05:20I'm not going to concede the framework that suggests that all of the costs being put on by the
▶ 2:05:24That's because you are lying. You you have you my goodness. You are smarter than this. You've said previously that uh that the CFPB is a victory for the little guy. All your cuts. Is it your position that the majority of these terminated settlements were initially brought by mom and pop against mom and pop companies that you've protected small businesses through your actions?
▶ 2:05:49The majority of these were based on uh enforcement actions that we did not have the authority or were inconsistent with our guidelines that we have put forward.
▶ 2:05:56Okay. So, the beneficiaries, according to Bloomberg, 70% of the beneficiaries from your canceled settlements were firms that had more than $500 million in annual revenue listed on the S&P 500. That's who you've That's a choice. Last question. The the ranking member had talked about some of what happened with Doge.
▶ 2:06:19According to court filings, you sent an email granting Doge employees unfettered access to 40 different CFPB systems containing PIA data that's in the court filings. Um, what role did you play in enabling people to illegally access confidential information of people social security numbers who were in the CFPB system?
▶ 2:06:37I will say generally as the director of the I was in charge of the administration being able to do its job at the at the CFPB. Feel free to uh answer that question in writing in detail. Gentleman's time's expired. Chair now recognize the gentleman from Indiana, Mr. Stzman, for five minutes. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman, and and thank you,
▶ 2:06:59director vote for being here. And I want to say thank you for your humility today. um you're taking a lot from the other side which I think has been quite um quite disturbing especially my friend from California who's now left um I know him and I know you and I believe you both are are good strong honest people who could probably work a lot of these things out rather than making a wild accusation from the dis uh
▶ 2:07:30I'm going to miss seeing you Um, the other thing and and I'm kind of curious if anybody on the other side of the aisle has actually read the CFPB humility and supervisions pledge.
▶ 2:07:45I looked it up and I think if uh if they were on the other side of the desk, if CFPB walked in to see them, they would be happy to hear the pledge that uh is made because just just a couple of these points, the upcoming supervision examination cycle is going to be fundamentally different from the prior ones under the former director Choper, which bringing up uh Mr.
▶ 2:08:15Chopra, former director Chopra made the agency political, pretending otherwise. It is a classic attempt by the so the other side of the aisle is trying to rewrite the history. And so I find it pretty rich coming from the people who defended Chopra constantly that he was at the White House every other week pushing the Biden political agenda. Would you agree with that?
▶ 2:08:34I believe he certainly was a political appointee. Uh he was nominated by the Biden administration. Uh he was a policy official for that for that administration. And honestly, that's what democracy is about is policy officials that come in with an administration doing the work of the executive branch based on an election. Well, I want to go on back to the supervisions pledge uh for this round of examinations.
▶ 2:09:00There will be greater transparency regarding the process and clarity regarding expectations. I think that's what we're all concerned have been concerned about from CFPB from the very beginning that this is a little empire under itself that has uh very little accountability that with the right person to accomplish an agenda without accountability is what the other side of the aisle wanted rather than actually holding them accountable to be sure
▶ 2:09:30that the people that it it regulated were protected And um and so it's easy for them to make out uh you know these those who were regulated by the CFPB as the boogeyman when actually they made life more difficult for those who they were saying they were trying to protect. Um I I think one of the most um troubling examples of the CFPB overreach under prior leadership was the Townstone case.
▶ 2:09:57In this case, CFPB uh advanced a novel legal theory that sought to expand the Equal Credit Opportunity Act beyond its traditional purview to regulate speech and marketing directed at prospective customers. Many view that move as another example of the bureau attempting to rewrite the law through enforcement. I was very pleased to see the CFPB under your leadership seek to vacate the final judgment citing infringement on the defendants first amendment rights.
▶ 2:10:26Looking back on the Townstone case, what do you believe it says about the enforcement philosophy of the previous leadership and how has your approach differed? Uh, it had differed starkly.
▶ 2:10:39Townstone was one of the the the best examples, not the only example of the extent to which uh we saw direct evidence, particularly when we did the oversight within the agency of the way that they were uh ratcheting up the pressure on this particular mortgage lender because he had a podcast that was concerned with crime and he had made comments that were the basically the exact same thing that a Democratic mayor of Chicago had made and yet they went after him for six to seven years in an attempt to ruin him.
▶ 2:11:08uh he ultimately settled for $100,000. We tried to overturn it. We were unable to in court uh but I was very proud to try and to call on behalf of the agency and to apologize to Mr. Sterner.
▶ 2:11:20Thank you. And then finally, do you share our concerns that the current DoddFrank era statute and structure make the CFBB more susceptible to being weaponized again?
▶ 2:11:29Yes, because you do not have to come and ask for the resources from Congress each and every year to remain accountable to the American people. All right. Thank you. You think we should take action? Yes. Thank you. I'll yield back.
▶ 2:11:42Gentleman yields back. The chair recognizes the gentle woman from Massachusetts, Miss Presley, for five
▶ 2:11:49Uh, director Voda, I I too am I'm glad uh that you're leaving. Uh, sadly, your harm will remain uh for generations uh to come. I have every reason to believe that uh history will judge you harshly uh especially in that you were a key author of project 2025 again implications that we'll be feeling for like this $500 billion
▶ 2:12:20Dr. vote. That's how much medical debt Americans hold. In fact, many families have medical debt over $50,000. Now, that may not be a lot of money to Republicans like Trump who quote don't think about Americans financial situation, but that is a lot of money for most people. This is debt people accumulated during the most challenging times in their lives, like battling cancer or recovering from an accident.
▶ 2:12:44The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau under Biden issued rules making sure that medical debt would not be reported on credit reports and put guard rails around how that debt can be collected. Common sense things like companies not being able to come after you for bills you've already paid. Now, to be clear, these kinds of protections were supported by families throughout the country. Director Vote in rural communities, in urban communities, in suburban communities, and in Democratic and Republican districts.
▶ 2:13:15But Director Vote, you took that away when you rescended those rules. Director Vote, give me one reason why companies should be able to harass cancer survivors to collect more than they owe for a medical
▶ 2:13:28Well, they shouldn't be able to harass, and we have laws on the books that, but the rules that we changed were specific.
▶ 2:13:33Give me one good reason. You receive that specific where medical debt would not have been reported because the statute on credit report. Give me one. You don't have one good reason. Moving on. Statute literally said not one good reason. You claim you you avow that you are a self-proclaimed Christian nationalist. So I'm sure you spent some time in Sunday school.
▶ 2:13:54That's a pjorative.
▶ 2:13:55I'm sorry. Did you happen upon a scripture that said, "Thou shalt make their neighbor poorer, hungrier, sicker, and less safe." That's actually what you've done. I didn't ask you to speak. This makes no sense. You are as incompetent as you are cruel and callous. Seriously, there are millions of families who have had to deal with an unexpected medical crisis. Including yours, I'm sure, because cancer and illness do not discriminate.
▶ 2:14:25They don't care how fat your wallet is or what your zip code is. Everyone has been faced with some unexpected crisis that interrupted their life and destabilized their financial future. Carrying the burden of caregiving, carrying the burden of sleepless nights, carrying the burden of debt unpaid medical bills. But what upsets me most, please look at me. What upsets me most is the shame that people carry about that debt. So let me be clear to families throughout THE COUNTRY.
▶ 2:14:55THE ONLY people who should be ashamed of medical debt is the Republican party because they have obstructed progress for affordable health care at every turn. And then they rescended the rule that would have given yield. Would the gentle lady yield?
▶ 2:15:11I will not. This is my time. The gentle lady yield.
▶ 2:15:13I will not yield. This is my time.
▶ 2:15:16And he's on his way out the door and he needs to know exactly the harm he has caused. But the American people deserve to talk about Obamacare. I will not
▶ 2:15:27Why are you speaking to me when I didn't yield to you? Director vote. You have gutted the CFPB. You have dropped settlements the CFPB brought against predatory companies that were supposed to provide relief to customers. $360 million to help people gone. Americans are in dire need of financial relief. But Trump and his his cult of co-conspirators are making life worse for everyday people.
▶ 2:15:54And I mean everyone, women, the disabled, young people, seniors, veterans, immigrants, and especially people of color who are most burdened by debt and predatory collection reporting practices. That is exactly why I introduced legislation to stop you from hurting people, like getting rid of consumer protections related to medical debt. The American public deserves better. They deserve better than you.
▶ 2:16:21They deserve a CFPB director who puts the consumer protection in this, who actually gives a damn instead of attacking hardworking families who are financially trapped by Trump's reckless policies. Consumer protection should not be a partisan issue or a political game.
▶ 2:16:45You have dedicated your career to helping corporations get richer, making families sicker, gentleoman, and less safe. And there is chair recognizes the gentleman from Tennessee Rose for five minutes. Mr. Rose, you're recognized.
▶ 2:16:59Uh, thank you, Chairman Hill, and thank you uh, Ranking Member Waters for holding this important hearing. And director Vote, thank you for being with us today. Uh, director vote, if you'd like, I'd like to give you a little bit of time to respond to the attack on your Christian faith.
▶ 2:17:15No need to. She's using pjoratives that the other side is continues to use. That's okay.
▶ 2:17:20Well, thank you and again, thank you for being here with us today. the director vote. One of the recurring concerns surrounding the CFPB small business lending rule implementing section 1071 of the DoddFrank Act has been the privacy implications associated with collecting and publishing detailed information regarding small business credit applicants.
▶ 2:17:41While Congress directed the CFPB to to collect certain information, it did not adequately protect against the unnecessary public disclosure of information that could reveal sensitive details about individual businesses or their owners. Small businesses deserve confidence that proprietary financial information submitted to comply with federal law will be appropriately safeguarded and that transparency does not come at the expense of privacy.
▶ 2:18:09That is the reason I introduced the Bank Loan Privacy Act to require the CFPB to clarify through notice and comment rulemaking how this information will be published while better protecting confidential information. Could you discuss how the CFPB can fulfill its statutory obligations under section 1071 while ensuring that sensitive information regarding small businesses is protected from unnecessary public disclosure? We agree.
▶ 2:18:36We are going to in the absence of your bill, we're going to put it through notice and comment to make sure the public has a chance to comment on it. Thank you. I appreciate that greatly. Effective regulation requires agencies to prioritize finite supervisory resources and you've talked about that today where they are most needed.
▶ 2:18:54Frankly, institutions with strong compliance management systems, histories of cooperation, and low-risk business models should not necessarily be subject to the same supervisory intensity as firms with repeated compliance failures or evidence of consumer harm. at a riskbased supervisory framework not only allows the CFPB to focus on its greatest threats to consumers.
▶ 2:19:18U it also reduces unnecessary regulatory burdens on responsible institutions that are making goodfaith efforts to comply with the law. Director vote, how is the CFPB ensuring that its supervisory program is appropriately riskfocused and what factors does it consider in determining where its examination and enforcement resources can have the greatest impact on protecting consumers?
▶ 2:19:44Uh, thank you for the question. We've done a lot of work to free up examiners by not requiring them to be in uh person for eight hours a day, eight examiners uh for eight weeks that we believe based on the travel budgets of the agency were basically junkets. Um so we have both freed up examiners and then we've been very clear about our priorities. We want to find uh identifiable victims with measurable and material consumer damages um as opposed to just paperwork
▶ 2:20:13Thank you. um you've you've had an opportunity to see up close and personal how CFPB has worked and how it has failed and I so I'd like your your insights about how ambiguous regulatory standards coupled with an independent funding source and a single director structure uniquely insulate the bureau from standard checks and balances and why is comprehensive reform necessary to protect both consumers and the broader financial industry?
▶ 2:20:43Well, I mean, it's vital. This has been a a an agency that has had an edge to it, as I've said. Um, it it has been unaccountable to Congress and to the administration, and we have taken steps to deal with that. Um, I think it's important that appropriations be uh a part of that reform.
▶ 2:21:02Uh I think a single director uh is is important because uh they all of these agency heads work for the president of the United States and some of these uh kind of bipartisan panels are a little bit more of a feature uh prior to some of the recent Supreme Court decisions. So these are all really important reforms and I really hope that you're able to pass some of them.
▶ 2:21:24Thank you. Director vote. What is the purpose of the Administrative Procedure Act and how does adhering to its requirements benefit consumers?
▶ 2:21:32The bottom line is that the APA allows the public to know the extent to which Congress or that the administration will be doing the law makingaking that you've delegated essentially us by virtues of the statute that you've given us. And and there's all manner of detail that goes into rule making that the public needs to be able to say, hey, this is going to have real costs. This part could have real benefits and we need to know that before we make final decisions why we do a proposed stage. It's why we do a final stage.
▶ 2:22:03Thank you, director vote. We appreciate your service to the nation.
▶ 2:22:06Chair now recognizes the gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. Godheimer, for five Sorry. Okay. Okay. Sorry. Thank you, Mr. Mr. Chairman, director vote, in your capacity as the director of OM, you impounded numerous grant programs that directly impacted residents of New Jersey, including 16 billion in funds for the Gateway Train Project. I was proud to help pass the bipartisan infrastructure bill, which helped fund the most important infrastructure project in our nation.
▶ 2:22:34The empoundment of these funds put more than 95,000 jobs and 20 billion at risk for our economy. Can you explain to me why you felt it was necessary to impound the funds that have had a direct impact on the lives of people in my home state? and and I'd really curious to to hear that
▶ 2:22:48they were not empoundments. They were going through a policy review as to the degree to which those contracts had been based on DEI preferences. The DOT has has um been in charge of that review um and I believe is moving forward on the
▶ 2:23:02Yeah, everyone had signed off on it. There wasn't a DEI issue.
▶ 2:23:06What's that?
▶ 2:23:06You had everyone sign off on it. It just held up the project and
▶ 2:23:09No, there was a review. There was a review that could not occur in the middle of that shutdown, but there was a review done. Uh, director, there are concerns with the rapid rise in children accessing prediction markets and sports books. It's why I'm taking action introducing legislation that requires prediction markets and online sports books to use facial recognition technology to verify users age before they place a wager or make a trade. Director, shouldn't we be doing more to ensure that our children are not placing bets and gambling
▶ 2:23:36That's not something we've taken a look at, but we're happy to take a look at any of the legislation that Congress has before it.
▶ 2:23:41What do you think of the idea about? Are you concerned?
▶ 2:23:43I'm not going to speak to things that are outside my portfolio.
▶ 2:23:46Okay. According to 2025 Internet Crime Complaint C Center's elder fraud report, the FBI received more than 200,000 complaints from victims over the age of 60, totaling approximately 7.7 billion dollars in losses. This is an egregious number, and financial scams that target our seniors need to be addressed. The ethos of the Trump administration has been fraud and abuse. Director, is the CFPB doing anything to crack down on this staggering fraud?
▶ 2:24:10We we believe that there is fraud in the consumer financial protection markets and that's what our enforcement and supervision work is aimed at countering. Uh we reject the the characterization or I reject the characterization that of how you describe the administration.
▶ 2:24:24How do you feel about but elder fraud overall you think is an issue we should be spending more time on?
▶ 2:24:28Of course.
▶ 2:24:29And has been something that you've made progress on during your period of time?
▶ 2:24:33It's certainly within the degree of of of things that we worked at at the CFPB. I think I, you know, Representative Wagner and I are working on a piece of legislation called the uh Financial Exploitation and Prevention Act, which uh passed the House Representatives in in June of uh 2026. I I'd really love you to take a look at it if you would.
▶ 2:24:52Sure. Thank you. The government, in my opinion, should responsibly and transparency put AI to work by cutting red tape. This includes speeding up permits, translating public meetings, and shortening the time Americans wait on services they need. It also remains important in my opinion that AI is utilized as a tool to ensure the United States remains economically strong in our ongoing competition with China while of course protecting Americans in every which way. Director, in your capacity as the director of OM, you were responsible for managing how the federal government uses AI.
▶ 2:25:21Do you mind talking a little bit about how you were directing federal agencies to responsibly integrate AI to ensure that Americans receive better services from their government?
▶ 2:25:29Well, we're encouraging them to use AI uh to do important work that they might uh be underway. We're sharing best practices with them from other parts of the agencies that uh we we get a bird's eye view of. Uh we're pioneering it ourselves with regard to uh ways that we can assess uh what spending is consistent with the administration's policy agenda. So from a wide degree uh perspective, we're trying to use AI and encourage it. Are you putting any guardrails in place as you do it?
▶ 2:25:57Like how are you to make sure that it's used the right way or that there's not threats to our critical infrastructure? And have you have you looked at that
▶ 2:26:05We have put out guidance u over the course of this last year and a half and I'm happy to share some of those guidances with you.
▶ 2:26:12I'd love to learn more about best practices where where in government you see it working well, how it's made government more efficient, how it's cut bureaucracy. Uh that'd be really helpful if that's something that we could follow up on with you. Be happy to. Thanks so much. I yield back.
▶ 2:26:26Gentlemen y
▶ 2:26:28Mr. Chair,
▶ 2:26:30I ask unanimous consent.
▶ 2:26:31Yes. What does the gentleoman seek recognition for?
▶ 2:26:34Thank you, Mr. Chair. I ask unanimous consent to include an investigative report from July 2026 by Protect Borrowers entitled a loan in every cart.
▶ 2:26:44Without objection be included in the record, chair recognizes the chair of our subcommittee on digital assets. Mr. Style, you're recognized for five
▶ 2:26:51Thank you very much, uh, Mr. Chairman, Director Vote, thank you for being with us, uh, today. I want to start with a thank you. This committee passed uh legislation to provide consumer protection uh in the earned wage access space. Uh passing my bill, the earn wage access consumer protection act. Uh you and your staff provided helpful technical assistance. I just want to say thank you. Um we've talked a little bit about the structure of the CFPB.
▶ 2:27:17Uh and as you serve on this committee, uh the sway of how much uh individuals agree or disagree with the director of the CFPB uh seems to go with the political persuasion and their alignment with the administration. I think you're doing a great job. May the record reflect. Uh but I think there are structural deficiencies of the CFPB. Uh you spoke to this in particular the ability uh to sue and settle uh to try to drive uh political agenda but also uh to fund the CFPB.
▶ 2:27:43uh you spoke on this a little bit before but in your position also is the chair of the full uh is as director of OM at large uh could you just comment a little further as to what the risks are of having agencies uh that have their own self-funding structure uh and can make make decisions that impact the funding not just in this administration but at large on the structure Congress
▶ 2:28:04I think those I think it's a profound issue. I think it's very important to not have the seessaw impact with regard to the extent to which you have such uncertainty with regard to a a new administration coming on board and how it approaches some of these discretionary jump balls. So subjecting it to appropriations is is massively important and I just also want to say thank you for your work on earned wage access products. They're very innovative. Um and we were happy to to put out guidance along those lines.
▶ 2:28:34Uh thank you. To to follow up on on the risk of of the uh the swings, uh we have seen attacks on our state-based insurance regulations. Um the the CFPB, I think, has the opportunity to continue to build clear jurisdictional boundaries uh in this space. Is that something you're thinking about or looking at at the CFPB?
▶ 2:28:54Uh we are not looking to invade uh the uh the regulatory space of the insurance markets. That's something that is very entirely not ours.
▶ 2:29:02I I appreciate that. I think that's right. I think we're well served uh by our statebased insurance program. Um there's a lot of talk earlier uh about the actions to continue to root out waste, fraud, and abuse uh inside and the great work that's being done inside this administration. Vice President JD Vance, chair of the president's fraud task force, uh was in Wisconsin recently, joined by Dr. Oz. Um there are big opportunities uh to continue to root out waste, fraud, and abuse. We heard some comments from some of my colleagues.
▶ 2:29:32Can you just comment broadly about the successful work that we are doing and that in particular the Trump administration is doing in rooting out waste, fraud, and abuse in some of our uh federal programs? Well, the president has made it an all of government effort.
▶ 2:29:45Uh, and certainly the vice president is running the task force in ensuring that there are no bureaucratic hurdles to ensuring that we have the resources to go after it uh with investigations and CMS to pull the IG community to make sure that we're enforcing uh even if there might be a reluctance on some fraud cases to not uh take it because it's it might be viewed in in small amounts. But we've taken the reverse view.
▶ 2:30:11We've taken that kind of a broken windows approach to fraud that I think is going to pay huge dividends and we're learning what statutory reforms are going to be needed for you all to come along and give us additional tools.
▶ 2:30:22I I appreciate that because I think that's really significant. It's actually it makes me reflect back on the vice president's visit uh to Milwaukee. We were highlighting a specific case of $15 million of fraud. Uh and one of the reporters asked u you know it's a it's a drop in the bucket is just $15 million.
▶ 2:30:39Uh and that is a really dangerous approach uh that we have seen some of our federal agencies historically take in particular under the Biden administration uh and appreciate you and the administration uh the approach of making sure that we're actually holding people accountable for wasting taxpayer dollars.
▶ 2:30:54There's significant waste, fraud, and abuse uh in a lot of these programs and holding individuals accountable and making sure that individuals know that they're going to be actually held to account that they're going to actually have to pay a price for stealing from taxpayers, but also from stealing from the individuals who these programs were designed to help. And so, I appreciate all of your work, not only at the CFPB, but at the OMB, uh at large. Appreciate you, uh being here and testifying today. And Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
▶ 2:31:20Gentleman yields back. Chair recognizes the gentleoman from Michigan, Miss Talib, you're recognized for five
▶ 2:31:26Uh, thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Director Vote, is it true or false that, uh, your agency has dismissed and terminated more than 40 lawsuits and settlements against predatory companies?
▶ 2:31:38These were not predatory companies.
▶ 2:31:41Are you friends with Capital One?
▶ 2:31:42With Capital One? No. I don't know.
▶ 2:31:47No. reversed even settlements against Toyota, Navy, Federal, Bank of America.
▶ 2:31:52Would you like to know why?
▶ 2:31:54Oh, sure. Cuz it looks like the past directors, you're getting so defensive. You're not friends with them. I wanted to make sure it wasn't personal. You're not friends with them, right? It's a It's a direct question. Who do you work for? Director
▶ 2:32:06President of the United States.
▶ 2:32:07No, you work for the people of the United States. You do not work for the president. You have legislation and laws that we pass as elected body members here. You do not work for the president. You take an oath to the people of this country and we pass laws that you are supposed to enforce. You do not work for the president.
▶ 2:32:35So I think I think the founding fathers would have a different view.
▶ 2:32:39I I am so glad this is on record. You should be fired because you work for the people, not not the president. None of us work for the president.
▶ 2:32:49The president won an election Democrat.
▶ 2:32:51I understand. I'm not Hey, I'm not put I actually don't contest that like you all do. Now, is it true these cases and others dropped lawsuits could have returned hundreds of millions of dollars to consumers.
▶ 2:33:02They could have also set terrible regulatory initiative and enforcement. into the record. Director vote um a memo chairman uh from the protect borrowers the consumer federation of America and Americans for financial reform education fund because I want the American people to see all the lawsuits you filed without you decided you didn't file you actually decided not to pursue those lawsuits and Mr. Chair, it's important for the American people to know this. Is it true or false?
▶ 2:33:30Before 2005, CFPB only dropped one enforcement action and never terminated a settlement.
▶ 2:33:37I actually don't know what's
▶ 2:33:38Yeah, you don't know because you think that you work for the president. You actually don't see what the agency was created for. Why do you think the agency was created because of the president? because Congress created the agency because of the awful financial distress that had happened on our American people. You can blink your eyes all you want. Last year, Americans lost roughly 16 billion dollars to fraud. 25% increase from 2024 on your watch. The highest level on record on your watch.
▶ 2:34:08In fact, CFBB has received more consumer complaints in 14 months than in the first 14 years of its existence. your watch. Director V. Do you think it's it's just a coincidence that consumer complaints have reached an all-time high at the same very t same time that your agency has pulled back enforcement and dropped cases, cut staff, and revoked guidance?
▶ 2:34:30There's a market reason for what is going on that we
▶ 2:34:32because you're friends with Bank of America, Walmart, Zel, are you friends with them? Do you work for them?
▶ 2:34:37I'm saying this because you dropped all these lawsuits. These lawsuits didn't come out in thin air. It's because they did wrong. They were novel legal theories that were not based.
▶ 2:34:45Oh, novelty. So all those complaints from our residents are novelty. They're not real.
▶ 2:34:50No, that's the consumer portal of which we look at very closely and have take steps to make sure we know.
▶ 2:34:55I know you're not going to take responsibilities cuz look, the lone sharks, Wall Street, mega banks and and I'm telling you, it is killing all of our residents because they are you've basically sent a a note, you know, like a a signal out there. Go ahead. You're undermining. They're like, "You signal to scammers and fudsters out there, you know, the fraudsters, open season for our residents. Go for it.
▶ 2:35:17Go ahead and violate their consumer protections that we, the Congress, passed, not the president, the Congress passed and created this agency." In May, CFPB deleted more than 2,000 pages from its website. These include consumer advisories, blog post. You didn't do it.
▶ 2:35:35You didn't do it. Nope.
▶ 2:35:36We overhauled our website.
▶ 2:35:38Okay. Russell, how is CFPB adhering to congressionalmandated consumer protection mission by removing consumer education and other materials from its
▶ 2:35:47We did not remove materials from the website. We put it in an archive.
▶ 2:35:51No, you didn't remove the know your right. You archived the know your rights for veterans. You archived it.
▶ 2:35:55We archived the
▶ 2:35:56You archived the know your rights, Russell, for veterans. You guys can get all upset all you want. He doesn't work for the president. He doesn't work for Zel or Walmart. He works for the people of the United States. Romance fraud is up there. You can laugh all you want, but that targets our seniors. Shame on Really? On your watch, complaints are up. You literally took money away from pockets of our residents. You can blink all you want.
▶ 2:36:23You're going to your legacy will be the fact that people got hurt under your watch because you think you were gentleoman's time.
▶ 2:36:29And the chair recognizes the chair of our subcommittee on oversight and investigations, Mr. Muer of Pennsylvania. You're recognized for five
▶ 2:36:37Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, director. And, you know, some apologies for the projoratives, the um uh the hysteria uh when when when there's no evidence or facts, very often people resort to name calling and they will fight like hell, as we know, for their big government unrestricted one party socialist plan. But we have laws, we have the constitution, and I think the uh we and the American people are going to stop them.
▶ 2:37:03Uh CFPB had gross under under Chopra under the previous administration gross and illegal I believe illegal overreach. Um I'd like to enter in the record an article from the ABA president titled the CFPB a regulator gone rogue. In it he states the Biden Chopra CFPB promoted a red tape laced regulatory nanny state that threatened to debank millions of hardworking Americans by pushing them out of the banking system. without objection that would be included in the
▶ 2:37:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And you know, no matter how much you look for evidence for promotion of the previous CFPB, you can't find any. The only ones you can find is when you have the hysteria and the hostility of stating how how wonderful they are when meanwhile it was all about overreach, which was well beyond uh what their jurisdiction was.
▶ 2:37:55So um when they is issued and you revoked uh under this administration 67 guidance documents, eight policy statements, seven interpretive rules, 13 advisory opinions which community banks large and small and big banks thought were outrageous but tended to follow thinking they they'd get in trouble from that previous Biden administration um and the previous CFPB. when you revoked all of those uh those compliance burdens, why was this uh action absolutely necessary?
▶ 2:38:26Well, we believe deregulation uh where it is good for the the country, for the economy, for consumers, uh where it can lead to innovation is the right policy uh direction to pursue. Um and we were very proud to be able to uh president given a goal of 10 for one deregulatory initiatives to everyone. uh and we were able to hit 67 and we're very thrilled with that and um and that was one of the the key parts of the first year.
▶ 2:38:53Okay. And you're you're aware we we issued the Safe Guidance Act to assure banks that such guidance letters from a rogue CFPB director uh are not law. Do you think that was helpful will be
▶ 2:39:07We should not be uh regulating them with guidance. uh guidance is something that agencies have long used to avoid notice and comment and as a result the country doesn't have a chance to participate in articulating their concerns. The previous CFBB was sued by eight different trade groups, banks, credit unions, online lenders, small businesses represent the entirety of the financial service industry. That's quite a pattern of of evidence showing that they're they were beyond their statutory authority. Wouldn't you agree?
▶ 2:39:38Um the resource and employees under um CFPB have shrunk since January 2025. It's close 76% of its open supervisory actions and resolved to dismiss the large majority of its enforcement cases. What has a smaller, more disciplined bureau been able to get done compared to what the prior larger very broad scoped bureau actually produced?
▶ 2:40:03Well, we're both continuing our supervision and enforcement and we've been very set on not doing uh regulation by enforcement and dismissing cases that were either duplicative of a state regulator or there was not a ground in the statute to be for us to have taken the original action as an agency. And CFPB was not alone.
▶ 2:40:25Um uh the SBA for instance, you know, a tidy tight organization advocating for small businesses with immense uh doubled in size during the course of of the uh of the Biden administration. And I bring that up because just to show the bloatedness of where our government was going to go and where it would go again. It went from uh 1,700 employees basically to almost 5,000. Now we brought it back to 2200 under secretary Leler.
▶ 2:40:56Um are you are you seeing uh such efficiencies that that have occurred there? And by the way the number of business loans have doubled since uh the last year of the Biden administration of 2024 and into 2025 2026 just over a year's period. So, at the CFPB, we have gone from about $800 million spent in in 2024 uh to right now we're about $465 million. We could go lower, but we're under a court order that does not allow us to go under.
▶ 2:41:26So, our view is that the the long-term steady state should be uh million per year. Um and then you've certainly helped that by passing um legislation to lower our cap.
▶ 2:41:40Gentleman's time is expired. I yield, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 2:41:42Chair recognizes the gentleman from New York, Mr. Torres, you're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 2:41:47Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Vote, you have repeatedly asserted that the president has the constitutional authority to impound funds appropriated by Congress. And so, I have a few questions about your theory of presidential empoundment. Under your theory, could the president refuse to spend 100% of the funds Congress appropriates for the Department of Defense? I don't engage in hypotheticals, congressman.
▶ 2:42:11The president has articulated a view that I agree with that for 200 years, presidents had the ability to spend less than the appropriation. And none of
▶ 2:42:20I'm going to move on to my next question. Could could the president refuse to spend 100% of the funds Congress appropriates for the Supreme
▶ 2:42:28And again, in those 200 years of presidents using those schools, uh, none of those presidents did what you just said.
▶ 2:42:35Is that a yes? No. I'm asking if the president could do it. I'm not answering your question.
▶ 2:42:39Could the president refuse to make 100% of the entitlement payments Congress has mandated under programs like Social Security and and Medicaid? Could he impound those?
▶ 2:42:47Authorities are not relevant in the in the entitlement category.
▶ 2:42:51Does the word empoundment appear anywhere in the Constitution?
▶ 2:42:55Uh no, it does not.
▶ 2:42:56Yeah. The founding fathers were familiar with the concept of empowerment and if the founders had intended to give the president the power of empowerment, they would have said so explicitly. These were not shy men. Can you cite a Supreme Court case in which the court held that the president has the constitutional authority to impound funds?
▶ 2:43:14The Supreme Court has actually never spoken on this matter.
▶ 2:43:17You're wrong. In Kendall versus United States, 1838, here's an exact quote. To contend that the obligation imposed on the president to see the laws faithfully executed implies a power to forbid their execution is a novel construction of the Constitution and entirely admissible. inadmissible. So it looks like the Supreme Court did speak on the topic long 187 years before project 2025. In the spirit of originalism, I want to share some history with you.
▶ 2:43:47The British monarchy once had a version of the power of empalment. It was called the suspending power. But the crown lost the power to suspend laws, including spending laws under the English bill of rights in 1689. The American Revolution, as you know, was fought to overthrow the tyranny of the British monarchy.
▶ 2:44:06Is it seriously your position that the founding fathers intended to grant a president like Donald Trump empelment powers that the British monarch himself did not possess when the American people overthrew him 250 years ago? Is that your position?
▶ 2:44:22The founding fathers themselves spent less than the appropriations that they were given for 200.
▶ 2:44:27I'm asking about empowerment. You have a theory of presidential empowerment that would make Donald Trump more powerful than the 18th century British monarch that we overthrew.
▶ 2:44:37That's not true. It was absolutely true. What I would suggest is that you study the theund years of experience under presidents who had the ability to not shove the money out the door at the end of the fiscal year just because it had to be spent. And therefore,
▶ 2:44:52I want to move on. Like many in your party, you suffer from CFPB derangement syndrome. and having you serve as the director of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau is a bit like having a pope who doesn't believe in Catholicism. It's an absurdity. And let's be honest, Mr. Vote, you weren't appointed by Donald Trump to run the CFPB. You were appointed to sabotage it in lock step with Project 2025.
▶ 2:45:15During the first term of the Trump administration, the CFPB undertook 12 enforcement actions in 2018, 21 actions in 2019, and 62 actions in 2020. By contrast, the CFPB in 2025 has undertaken almost no enforcement actions. And so, even by the standards of the first Trump administration, enforcement has all but collapsed. and the CFPB under your leadership has been an absentee regulator.
▶ 2:45:48I want to move on to cyber security. We live in a world where the Chinese Communist Party could develop an open- source equivalent of mythos which has been portrayed as a cyber weapon of mass destruction. A CCP equivalent of Mythos would pose an existential threat to the cyber security of the federal government. Would you agree with that?
▶ 2:46:07Uh I'm going to let someone else comment on those matters. So, you're not aware of current events like I mean it's pretty important.
▶ 2:46:13So, in October 2025, the Office of Inspector General issued a scathing assessment downgrading the CFPB's information security maturity from level four to level two from effective to ineffective. And so, not only are you failing to deliver dollars to American consumers, you are endangering the sensitive information of the American people to the benefits of foreign adversaries like the CCP, the inspector general gave you a level two for cyber security. I give you an F for failing the American people.
▶ 2:46:43I yield back. Gentleman yields back. Chair now recognizes the gentleoman from California. Miss Kim, you're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 2:46:51Thank you, chairman and ranking member for hosting today's hearing. And thank you, Mr. vote for joining us. Uh, as you know, I've long been supporting and championing the uh, community development financial institution fund and in my district California 48 in Southern California, I saw firsthand the impact of CDFI fund when I visited Vera Sanctuary.
▶ 2:47:15This is a licensed residential treatment center uh that dedicate to helping the victims of human trafficking and they tell us that they would not exist without the uh funds from CDFI financial institutions. Um and this is the same thing that I'm hearing over and over across Orange, Riverside, and San Bernardino counties that I'm privileged to represent.
▶ 2:47:40And I heard countless stories like that about the valuable impact CDFI fund has in lifting uh or lifting up the American uh families. So I want to thank you for working with me and Treasury Secretary Scott Basson to secure the release of some of the funds to the Treasury so that CDFI Fund can distribute them before the expir expiration uh date that's fast coming up.
▶ 2:48:08But uh as we continue to build on the um the 21st century road to housing act and work on housing affordability, there is still considerable amount of housing construction funds that is available under the capital magnet fund. I'm sure you're aware of that. So can you provide any details as to when the recipients can expect those funds to be distributed? Uh
▶ 2:48:33I'm happy to go back to you come back to you on that matter. Uh, as you know, we've aortioned all the CDFI funds that will expire in 26. Uh, but we'll give you more detail below that.
▶ 2:48:44Well, I hope we can continue to work together on seeking reforms uh at the CDF fund so we can ensure that those funds can be released in a timely and efficient manner so we can um allow the financial institutions to be able to utilize those funds and uplift the American working families. As we mentioned, uh, another avenue that I've been working to uplift American families is through the small dollar credit.
▶ 2:49:10Millions of Americans rely on those products to bridge the temporary financial shortfalls or cover the unexpected expenses or avoid more costly alternatives. So, while that's important that consumers are protected from their unfair or abusive practices, it is equally important that responsible lenders have a clear and consistent regulatory framework that enables them to continue offering lawful affordable credit products.
▶ 2:49:39Um so to that end as you know we uh I introduced the uh small dollar loan certainty act to seek the uh greater certainty regarding the legal standards governing these products so that responsible providers can continue serving consumers who are maintaining strong consumer protections.
▶ 2:49:57So can you discuss how greater regulatory certainty for responsible small dollar lending can improve consumer access to affordable credit while we are still um identifying and addressing the genuinely harmful practices uh that the C CFP CFPB can
▶ 2:50:16Well, Congressman, I think these can be very innovative tools that meet people where they are in in need for financing. Um, we have u a small dollar rule on our regulatory agenda. Uh, we look to get to that. We hope to get to that as soon as possible. And I'm happy to look at your legislation as to better understand what it might do.
▶ 2:50:35Thank you. Uh, one of the most effective ways to protect consumers is to prevent harm before it occurs. Where enforcement plays an important role, consumers also benefit when they receive clear information that helps them make informed decisions to avoid fraud in the first place. So, director vote, how is the CFPB balancing enforcement with efforts to improve consumer financial education and prevent consumer fraud or harm?
▶ 2:51:02Well, we have a very active uh financial literacy program. Uh we're going across the country having webinars pretty much constantly. Uh we've had a an emphasis in our supervision and enforcement for self-reporting, for remediation, for reconciliation before we get to the adversarial part of the process. So we believe that from the education all throughout uh is a is an important cycle to to have properly gone through so that we limit fraud in the future. Thank you.
▶ 2:51:31Thank you for saying that because I serve as co-chair of the financial literacy and wealth creation caucus and uh we need to do everything we can. So I want to partner with you and uh CFPB so we can focus on consumer education in the remaining time. I'm not sure if we have but uh could you share the work you're doing to combat fraud and scams and how you have worked with financial institutions to that end.
▶ 2:51:53I'd invite you to submit that in writing, Mr. Director.
▶ 2:51:56Thank you.
▶ 2:51:57Chair recognizes the gentleman from California, Mr. Licardo, for five
▶ 2:52:02Thank you. [clears throat] Good morning, Mr. Vote. uh during your uh you testified and I'm just quoting here from your written statement uh that the purpose of the bureau is to implement enforce federal consumer financial law consistently so that all consumers have access to markets and that such markets are fair, transparent and competitive. That fair?
▶ 2:52:25Yes. [clears throat] So are all financial markets currently fair, transparent and competitive? We believe that it's important to make them more fair. I mean, that's why you have laws on the books. And so, if you see something, say something. Uh, we take the portal very seriously. We look for things uh as part of supervision to identify and and do our our job to make things uh more transparent, more fair wherever we can.
▶ 2:52:51Do you think it's likely that markets are less than fair, less than transparent, less than competitive as we think about, for example, payday Well, I think that the industry is an important one and I think it's important for consumers to have the access to products that uh are not predatory uh that allow people to get uh loans when they need to get those loans and I think it should be cheap to do that and to have good rules of of the road so that industry abides
▶ 2:53:21by them.
▶ 2:53:22Do you think there are some scams in payday lending in that industry?
▶ 2:53:25I think there's scams in many different
▶ 2:53:27Are there scams in the title loan Uh perhaps.
▶ 2:53:32Are there scams in the private student lender industry?
▶ 2:53:37Uh you think there might be scammers in the debt collection industry?
▶ 2:53:42And what about the credit repair
▶ 2:53:46And digital wallets and payment apps. You think there's some scams there?
▶ 2:53:50Uh I think it remains to be clear, but So it seems like in a a nation of more than 300 million people with massive number of actors in these financial industries that there might be a target-rich environment for enforcement to uphold the bureau's role to ensure that markets are quote fair, transparent, and competitive. Is that fair?
▶ 2:54:14I think a view of a target-rich environment assumes that consumers don't make decisions in their best interests and assumes that all businesses are predatory. We're going to look for opportunities to enforce the law and supervise companies.
▶ 2:54:28And since the time you took over CFPB, there's been exactly one enforcement
▶ 2:54:35We are engaged in five enforcement
▶ 2:54:38You filed only one. There are others that you continued from the prior administration.
▶ 2:54:46And you've indicated an intent to continue the enforcement of only single digits, less than 10 of those. Is that
▶ 2:54:55We are continuing those cases. They remain priorities. We feel think there are good reasons for them and we're And so among all the industries I name plus many others that CFPB might have jurisdiction over given the jurisdiction provided under federal statute. Your agency has initiated exactly one enforcement action in your tenure.
▶ 2:55:20Well, we had a enormous uh pileup of cases that we thought were inappropriate that we had to work through. We've set forward new enforcement and uh supervision guidance and we are now hard at work uh in that in that area. But if you're saying we would prefer a less adversarial process, you're right. So when we see
▶ 2:55:39you have hundreds of millions of consumers in all these industries that you need to protect and you filed exactly one enforcement action under your tenure
▶ 2:55:48that doesn't mean that we are not taking steps to work with a company that we see evidence in the in the newspaper to decide what what's going on with that company. We reach out to them.
▶ 2:55:58Your written testimony indicates that you condemn a bureau driven by quote whims of ideologues. You've been in charge of this agency for more than a year, nearly a year and a half, and exactly one enforcement action has been brought against all these actors across all these financial Aren't you an ideologue?
▶ 2:56:25Absolutely not, sir.
▶ 2:56:27I think the American people would disagree as I would. Thank you.
▶ 2:56:32Gentleman, yield back. Gentlemen yields back. Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Wisconsin, Mr. Fitzgerald, for five minutes.
▶ 2:56:41Director, thanks for being here this morning. Appreciate it. Um, I think one of the concerns that many members have is, uh, now that we've kind of watched the actions that you've taken to clean up the CFPB, complete disaster.
▶ 2:56:56Um, that they often relied on kind of vague statutory authority regulation by um and these large expansive of the powers instead of actually having some clear um rules and and limits uh in So, uh, I think my concern is moving forward that restoring kind of the legal clarity and the procedural fairness means
▶ 2:57:26not only kind of defining the authorities more clearly, it also means making sure that they were within the proper jurisdiction. Right? So uh I have a bill uh toot my own horn here but restoring court authority over litigation act uh it reflects that the principles by clarifying that conduct of attorneys in litigation is regulated by the courts and not the CFPB.
▶ 2:57:51I mean it seems it seems very obvious I think when you look at it from the perspective of the actions that you guys have already taken to fix things over there. Um, but just just one question then. How important is it for Congress to establish kind of the clear jurisdictional boundaries so that in the future I'm I'm worried about the future. I'm worried about us sliding back to this ownorous ridiculous agency.
▶ 2:58:19um we've got to do something to put something a little bit more clear when it comes to enforcement authority and and effectively so you can regulate the practice of law outside of the judicial system. So I'm just wondering kind of your overall comments on on that topic.
▶ 2:58:38I think clear boundaries need to be set by Congress to ensure that in a future administration the CFPB can't grow and be in the novel statutory theory space which is one of the main areas that it was doing with regard to its enforcement
▶ 2:58:54Yeah. And so you as you work through this um again which I said I appreciate somebody's cleaning up this mess but as you work through this I think it would be something at least to keep in mind that in the future u that Congress have at least some direction on here's the things we need to do to make sure that this doesn't happen again. So, and with that, I'll yield I yield back. Chairman
▶ 2:59:19chairman yields back. Chair now recognizes the gentleoman from Texas. Miss Garcia, you're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 2:59:27Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I apologize for having to step out, but I've been dealing with issues related to an ICE shooting uh in my district last week in Houston. Uh so actor director acting director Voit, you have sent out a letter um notices to members of your staff uh at the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau directing them to either relocate to DC or lose their jobs.
▶ 2:59:55They have until July 21st next week to decide. How many bureau employees do you currently have?
▶ 3:00:02We have 1071. Interestingly enough,
▶ 3:00:051071. And how many employees can be accommodated in your new headquarters?
▶ 3:00:11Uh about 500.
▶ 3:00:13So do you expect to have two or three people on top of each other or how are you going to accommodate 1071 in a space that holds roughly two 550?
▶ 3:00:25Well, there may be some rotational uh assignments as to uh how the uh space is allocated. But to answer your question, I think more fundamentally, uh, we have put that on pause to wait for the Senate to confirm hopefully the nominee so that they can make that determination. It will also come in conjunction with the court proceedings with regard to our reductions in force.
▶ 3:00:48Is that is that something you're acting on as acting director of CFPB or was that your head as um head of OMB?
▶ 3:00:58Early acting director of CFPB,
▶ 3:01:01sir. seems to me, you know, I don't see how you can wear two hats um and separate some of these issues. But so roughly half of your employees may not be able to be accommodated in new headquarters. How many have responded to your letter?
▶ 3:01:17Well, we've had a number of requests to have an exemption to the policy. Uh some of them have good ideas. If you're working on a litigation in Denver, we're not going to ask you to come back to to DC. The question was how many have responded to your letter?
▶ 3:01:31Off the top of my head, I don't know. I know you're telling me you put put a pause, but obviously some people may have still responded to your letter
▶ 3:01:37and we have those uh in place and we're certainly can provide that.
▶ 3:01:41The question is how many people have responded to your letter?
▶ 3:01:43I said I don't know off the top of my head and I'm happy to provide that in a QFR. Well, because it seems clear to me that between this and the halt of certain enforcement activity, regulation and guidance roll backs, employee administrative leave, and the overall significant reduction in size of the workforce. You and and the White House are trying to close the only government agency intended to protect our consumers. And I disagree that the this bureau was a disaster.
▶ 3:02:13It's not a disaster. It is a lifeline. It is a lifeline for our seniors, our veterans, and people that have been that often are scammed either personally in writing and more importantly now through the internet and through uh emails. So, director Voit, a recent semiannual report published by the CFPB found that women employees of color remain under reppresented in key roles like economists and examiners.
▶ 3:02:40The recent actions taken at CFPB including leadership changes, hiring freezes and rollbacks of DEI initiatives are whole only as aspirating as. How do you respond to these concerns?
▶ 3:02:52We believe that our employees should be there on the basis of merit and we have a colorblind.
▶ 3:02:56Do you think that people of color have no merit? No, I said that we have a a an a employee process of hiring that is based on merit and ensuring that everyone uh regardless of who they are have an opportunity to come and work at
▶ 3:03:12Okay. And again,
▶ 3:03:12you don't subscribe to do
▶ 3:03:14you have any evidence or to convince me that the decisions that you're making at the bureau are really about things that are the better are good for the protection of the consumer rights of our citizens around the country and not solely influenced by you as OM director.
▶ 3:03:30Sorry, I'm not sure what you're getting at. I I take
▶ 3:03:33sir, you wear two hats.
▶ 3:03:34Okay. When when you make your statements that that about the staffing issues, are you speaking as the CFPB director or are you speaking as OM director?
▶ 3:03:44Yes, the CFPB FTEE level was bloated. Director Choper increased enforcement bloating sir. The question was about reductions reductions in the scope of work conducted in the workforce.
▶ 3:03:58Like I said, director Chopra increased the FTEES in enforcement alone by 100. Have you transferred any of the the bureau's work, roles, responsibilities, mission, any of it to any other agency in in in the government?
▶ 3:04:17No, we were in under uh discussions when it was clear we may go to operating at zero level because of the way the law was written in our ability to
▶ 3:04:27so nothing has been transferred.
▶ 3:04:28Gentleoman's time has expired. The general lady from California has the unanimous consent request.
▶ 3:04:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I ask unanimous uh consent to enter into the hearing record seven letters I've sent to the witness that have gone unanswered. Um
▶ 3:04:44without objection, they'll be included in the record. I would also ask consent to enter into the record statements and letters from dozens of organizations in strong support of the CFPB as well as those that highlight all the ways our witnesses our witness has unlawfully undermined the AY's ability to protect consumers including from Americans financial reform better markets consumer federation of America consumer action national
▶ 3:05:14association of consumer advocates and many other organizations including state and local groups across the country.
▶ 3:05:22Without objection, they'll all be made part of the record.
▶ 3:05:26The chair now recognizes the chairman of our comm subcommittee on housing and insurance, Mr. Flood. You're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 3:05:32Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Acting director vote, thank you for being here today. I had a lot of disagreements with your predecessor, Director Chopra. Among them was Director Troper's tendency to expand the CFPB's jurisdictional reach at every turn. For example, the CFPB issued a rulemaking in late 2024 defining digital consumer payment technology entities as quote unquote larger participants and therefore subject to CFPB supervision.
▶ 3:06:00I led a Congressional Review Act resolution overturning that move and I'm proud to say that it was signed by President Trump into law in May of 2025. That move was one of many that the former director made to try and expand his own authority, his own agency's reach, and the bureaucracy of the CFPB with it. By contrast, during this administration, the CFPB released proposals indicating they may redefine what constitutes a larger participant in several non-bank financial markets.
▶ 3:06:29I appreciate that CFBB is doing thoughtful work on which entities truly deserve to fall within their remit rather than instinctually pushing to expand its own authority. In most other areas of federal law, agencies evaluating market participants generally begin with a clearly defined relevant product market before determining whether a firm possesses sufficient market share to warrant heightened regulatory scrutiny. This is one of the issues that we uh attempt to address in a draft CFPB comprehensive reform package.
▶ 3:06:59Acting director vote, do you believe the CFPB's large market participant framework should seek to more precisely define relevant markets and ensure that only firms with a significant share of those markets are subject to heightened
▶ 3:07:14Yes. And I would encourage Congress to actually do the work to put it into statute. I think the your hard work on that CRA indicates the the degree of skepticism that I think that CFPB can do it well and I would certainly appreciate additional guidance from Congress.
▶ 3:07:30Thank you. Next, I'd like to uh run through some of the reforms proposed by the chairman of this committee uh to rightsize the agency. Director Vote, do you believe that the CFPB would receive better oversight if it were funded through the regular appropriations Acting director vote, do you believe the CFPB would generally undertake better, more defensible rulemaking if the bureau's statutory costbenefit analysis requirements were strengthened?
▶ 3:07:55Acting director vote, do you believe that the CFPB should have an independent inspector general, just like almost every other federal agency?
▶ 3:08:03Yes. Acting director vote, do you believe as the draft legislation calls for that there should be a rulemaking more firmly defining what an abusive act or practice is in order to provide greater clarity to market players on what rules they must abide by?
▶ 3:08:17Well, it's certainly a possible possibility to do it as a regulation. I would prefer Congress to spell it out more clearly. Acting Director Vote, do you believe the CFPB should be able to keep hundreds of millions of dollars in unallocated balances in their civil penalty fund to be used as a slush fund or do you believe those funds should be transferred back to the treasury once the victims of any wrongdoing are paid? once the victims of of wrongdoing.
▶ 3:08:41But I also think that there's a a role for there to be some balance to ensure that you have the fund to be able to pay when a particular entity has no more money and to be able to provide redress in that instance. So in terms of the timing, I'd want to look carefully on
▶ 3:08:57Thank you for your answers, acting director vote. I appreciate your time today and believe that together we can move towards a CFPB that is more accountable in the future and uh appreciate your service to our country. I yield back the balance of my time.
▶ 3:09:10Mr. Flood yields back. The chair now recognizes the ranking member of our subcommittee on oversight and investigations, Mr. Green of Texas. You're recognized for five minutes.
▶ 3:09:17Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank the witness for appearing today. Mr. Vote, I'm reviewing your website and there's an indication that you will receive complaints and if another agency is better suited to assist, you will send those complaints to this other agency. Is this a fair statement?
▶ 3:09:38I think that's fair.
▶ 3:09:40All right. And um do you maintain records on the complaints that you receive, sir?
▶ 3:09:45We we maintain all the records of the consumer portal. Uh we're taking great steps to rational
▶ 3:09:51I'll take that as a yes. And in so doing, um if you received a complaint about a Ponzi scheme, you would send that complaint to the appropriate if we did not have statutory authority.
▶ 3:10:07Okay. Well, let's just review what a Ponzi scheme is quickly. A Ponzi scheme, according to Wikah Investopedia, is a fraudulent investment scam that pays returns to earlier investors using capital collected from new investors rather than from any actual business profit.
▶ 3:10:26Named after 1920s swindler Charles Ponzi, the scheme creates a false illusion of a highly profitable enterprise to continuously lure in fresh A Ponzi scheme.
▶ 3:10:41Let's talk about a Ponzi scheme that has made the news as of Over a one-year period, President Trump's dollar sign Trump pump and dump memecoin has averaged about 1.7 million in profits per day. 1.74 million in profits per day. Over that same period of time, investors lost a combined $3.8 billion. 3.8 billion.
▶ 3:11:12uh this kind of Ponzi scheme uh has been reported to you. Can you give me at some point the number of complaints you've received about the president of the United States of America and his Ponzi scheme?
▶ 3:11:29Congressman, I'm not going to speak to the president's investments other than to say this administration has had the
▶ 3:11:35without going into his investments. I want to know about complaints that you've received. You said you received the complaints. Can you just give me information about the complaints you've received? That that is public information, isn't it?
▶ 3:11:47I don't have that at the my fingertips.
▶ 3:11:48I know you don't have it at your fingertips. The question is, will you give it to me now? That that is
▶ 3:11:53I said I'm happy to respond to QFRs on on on all matters.
▶ 3:11:57Okay. Well, I don't know what response means. Is that a yes, you'll give me the complaints? You'll let me know the
▶ 3:12:02I don't know what you're referring to. I'm referring to complaints about the president of the United States of America who made $1.74 million per day while other persons were losing billions of dollars, 3.8 billion over the same period of time that he was making 1.74 million per day. I'd like to know the number of complaints that you've received as they relate to, let's take out the term president, as they relate to Donald John Trump.
▶ 3:12:31I've said I would ref I would respond to any of the QFRs that you might have when I don't have the information in front of
▶ 3:12:38I I that would be unreasonable. I would not expect you to have it in front of you, sir. Now, before I conclude, I want to associate myself with the statements of the ranking member and also Mr. Vargas. I heard his statements. Uh and um I conclude with this um Charles um Charles I want to call him Swindle but Swindler but he was a predatory person who engaged in a Ponzi scheme.
▶ 3:13:06He's the first person that originated this whole concept of a Ponzi scheme. Charles Ponzi. Uh the president uh dear sir appears to be a person who has somehow legitimized a Ponzi scheme that would be called in a righteous world.
▶ 3:13:28I can but only conclude that the president of the United States in doing what he's doing to persons by pumping and dumping his Ponzi scheme memecoin, he's he's engaging in a swindle. And it it does not um in any way bring me joy to tell you that we have a swindler as a president.
▶ 3:13:51So now, if you receive these these um complaints about the swindler, I assume that you will take appropriate action and uh that you'll at least send me information concerning the number of complaints. But more than that, it would seem to me that this would be the kind of thing you would be interested in uh investigating if the president of the United States is engaged in a Ponzi scheme. Would you would you conclude,
▶ 3:14:19Mr. President? Thank you, Mr.
▶ 3:14:21Mr. Chairman. Just a moment,
▶ 3:14:23Mr. Chairman. I seek recogn I yield back. Mr. The time belongs to the chairman right this moment. I haven't recognized anybody. That gentleman's time has expired. And as I've done once before today, I want to remind all members of the committee to observe the principles of decorum and courtesy and debate in the House of Representatives and its committees. and once again remind members on both sides of the aisle to direct their remarks to the chair and do not speak into what's properly recognized and avoid engaging in personalities or imputing the motives of another member or the president.
▶ 3:14:53With that, uh, I recognize the gentleoman from California.
▶ 3:14:56Oh, thank you very much. Um, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Vot's testimony has been completely inadequate to say the least. This is the first and likely only time Mr. vote may testify before this committee uh this Congress despite being required by law to do so by annually.
▶ 3:15:16As a result, members of this committee are being deprived of the ability to examine the significant administrative, budgetary, regulatory, and enforcement changes the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau has implemented under the leadership of acting director vote.
▶ 3:15:36So pursuant to clause 2J1 of rule 11 of the rules of the house and clause DJ D5 of rule three of the rules of the committee on financial services. I and every Democratic member of the committee unanimously request to call additional witnesses selected by committee Democrats to testify uh in continuation of today's hearing.
▶ 3:16:06also known as minority day hearing. Continuing this hearing with a second panel will provide members of the committee and the American public the opportunity to examine the activities of the consumer financial protection bureau under the leadership of acting director vote and their impacts on consumer protection and the American financial system.
▶ 3:16:30I also request unanimous consent to enter our minority day hearing request letter into the record.
▶ 3:16:38I thank the gentleoman. Your uh letter will be entered in the record by unanimous consent and I appreciate your request on holding a majority day hearing. The committee will review this request pursuant to clause 2JL uh J1 of House Rule 11 and committee rule 3D5 and will work with the ranking member to determine a date for that requested hearing. We'll now proceed and the chair recognizes the gentleman from Florida, Mr. Herodopoulos for three minutes.
▶ 3:17:05I see.
▶ 3:17:06Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 3:17:07Okay. All right.
▶ 3:17:08Thank you very much. And M for first of all, thank you very much for your service. I know how dedicated you are to looking out for the taxpayer first and it is it's a welcome uh change we've seen from in the past. I also want to express my disappointment some of the unprofessional comments made towards you today. Every time you come here you always h yourself a class and dignity. I I very much appreciate that. I think we need to elevate the uh the conversation in Congress and and you've done that today.
▶ 3:17:34I also want to remind people that the Federal Trade Commission, the Federal Reserve, the Office of the Comproller of the Currency, FDIC, the National Credit Union Administration, HUD, the Department of Justice, the SEC, the Federal Housing Finance Agency, and every state attorney general has the ability to look out for the consumer. It's not just this one agency that you happen to chair at this point. And I I think that should be recognized. Also, some of the comments made today about fraud.
▶ 3:18:03This is a welcome conversation. I think that I saw today in the Senate that there's a hearing on fraud and not one member of the other side of the aisle showed up for the meeting and everyone is seeing these incredible reports about fraud in whether it be Minnesota, in California where people are are clearly just stealing money from the government and and some people just choose to turn a blind eye. And it's shocking considering some of the allegations that have been made today.
▶ 3:18:30And so I I I've heard some of the the disappointing comments today. So I I' I'd like to give you a little bit of time as we conclude today to address some of the things that you still want to address uh before you conclude your testimony today.
▶ 3:18:43No. Uh thanks for the comment. Um it's one of the approaches that we've tried to take with regard to uh utilizing the tools at the CFPB is to recognize that we're not the only cop on the beat. uh and to take our our responsibilities seriously, but also to work with our other regulators to figure out who's the best person uh who's the best agency with regard to congressional intent. And that's how we've designed our And with that, Mr. Chairman, I want to also applaud your efforts today to keep this as even as we can today. I appreciate that.
▶ 3:19:12And again, I I hope we can elevate the conversation because this is what really makes Congress a special place where we all serve and have the honor to serve. And I hope we can elevate the conversation as we move forward. With that, Mr. I yield back.
▶ 3:19:23I want to thank acting director vault for his testimony today. You are dismissed, sir. And thank you for being with us. Without objection, all members will have five legislative days to submit additional written questions for the chair. Questions will be forwarded to the witness for his response. Acting director vote. Please respond no later than August 19th, 2026. Uh let me recognize the ranking member.
▶ 3:19:43Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. DoddFrank requires that the director of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau testify semianually, meaning this should be at least the third time Mr. Vote testifies before this committee. Yet, contrary to the law, Mr.
▶ 3:20:00vote has successfully avoided accountability despite trying to gut the bureau's ability to go after bad actors and rolling bad consumer protections like those related uh to medical debt, student loans, overdraft protections, and veterans. To make matters worse, Mr.
▶ 3:20:21votes testimony today is restricted to just three hours, denying members of both parties and the Americans they represent to hold him and our government accountable. So, pursuant to clause 2 m of rule uh 11 and clause 2k 6 of house rule 11, I move that this committee issue a subpoena to compel the appearance of consumer financial protection
▶ 3:20:51bureau u acting director Russell vote to ensure uh that his testimony before this committee again this congress so that that he testify his testimony should come before this committee again this Congress so that we may do the job the American people sent us to do.
▶ 3:21:13The gentleoman has moved to authorize a subpoena. For what purpose does the gentleman from Georgia seek recognition?
▶ 3:21:19I move to table the motion.
▶ 3:21:21The gentleman has moved to table the motion. The motion is not debatable and the question now occurs on the motion to table. Those in favor shall signify by saying I.
▶ 3:21:29I. All those opposed signify by saying
▶ 3:21:34The chair. The eyes have it.
▶ 3:21:38I request a recorded vote.
▶ 3:21:39The ranking member requests a recorded vote. A recorded vote. So requested. We will now take that vote on the motion to table. We will suspend until the clerk is in place to call the vote. So just pause for a moment.
▶ 3:21:51Killed it. May ask if the clerk is prepared to open the vote.
▶ 3:22:22Just a moment. Very good. We're waiting for the screen. little patience. Thank you.
▶ 3:23:09Mr. Clerk, are you prepared to open the vote? Uh, the clerk will open the vote. Members will vote electronically. This is the motion to table. Aim down here towards
▶ 3:23:40There you go. You got it recorded.
▶ 3:23:53This is a motion to table Mrs. Waters subpoena resolution. Right on.
▶ 3:24:28Have all members voted? Is there any member like to change their vote? Hearing none, the clerk will close the vote and report. One more. Stand by. Just a moment. One more.
▶ 3:24:49Where are they?
▶ 3:24:50Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the eyes are 24 and the naysay are 13.
▶ 3:24:55The eyes have it. The motion table is agreed to. The hearing is adjourned.
▶ 3:25:05Keep it in mind.
▶ 3:25:06Thank you very much.
▶ 3:25:07Thank you, ma'am.