▶ 0:20:34Warning and welcome to the senate natural resources and energy committing. -- committee. This is the hearing for the honorable doug burgum. To be secretary of interior. This is a pivotal moment for our nation surrounding its energy needs and land management policies. I want to extend a warm welcome to the governor and his wife, thank you for being here and for joining us today.
▶ 0:21:06You will have a chance in a moment to introduce anyone in the audience who is here with you if you would like to. Governor, your nomination to lead the department of the interior comes out an urgent time as americans under the policies of the biden administration are suffering from skyrocketing energy prices that drive up the cost of everything from gas and groceries, housing, health care and restrictive land-use policies that tend to stifle growth generally.
▶ 0:21:35The challenging is -- the challenges facing american families are mounting and staggering. The past november voters decided to send a clear message. They demanded a break from the status quo and take a fresh approach, one less likely to result in this awful pattern of inflation, which we have found ourselves over the last four years.
▶ 0:22:01Your nomination has garnered remarkable support from tribes, organization, businesses and people of all stripes and backgrounds. Particularly those who are most uniquely and directly affected at the U.S. department of interior and its policies.
▶ 0:22:17With dozens of letters of support nationwide further underscore your reputation as a leader, one who is committed to change and fostering relationships and reflects pretty widespread confidence in your vision and readiness to lead this organization.
▶ 0:22:37The department of the interior plays a central role in addressing many challenges, particularly in states like utah , my state, where federal land management shapes nearly every aspect of our day-to-day life because the federal government owns two thirds of the land, about 67%.
▶ 0:22:59There are other members that represent other public land states who understand the relationship between the department you have been called to lead and their day-to-day lives. Nearly 1/5 of the land of the united states is under the jurisdiction of the U.S. department of the interior. My state has much higher than that, of course. This influences everything from energy development to public land access, tribal relations and wildlife management.
▶ 0:23:29In utah, the impact of these policies are profound. The decisions made in washington ripple through our economy and communities in ways that are unmistakable and not always positive.
▶ 0:23:42Unfortunately these policies have taken a troubling term -- turn during the biden administration, expanding national monuments without meaningful input from local communities and it has jeopardize access and harmed the locals who call these places home. The public lands rule and restrictive management plans have placed unnecessary and often insurmountable barriers in the way of responsible resource development and land access.
▶ 0:24:13On his first day in office resident biden issued a moratorium on oil and gas leasing, severely damaging the resources that we need to power our homes and economy. Over time these decisions have revealed a pattern of disregard for the multiple use land date that federal land management use is supposed uphold and has been subject to 50 years.
▶ 0:24:40The consequences extend far beyond utah. As wildfires devastate california, it is clear that mismanagement of public lands has consequences that often reach far beyond rural areas. Federal agencies must reevaluate their approach to wildfire prevention, prioritizing management strategies that mitigate the risk of catastrophic blazes. Utah and other western states know the devastation that these fires cause.
▶ 0:25:11Addressing this crisis must be a very key priority for the department. Reversing course will of course require bold leadership and a willingness to embrace innovative solutions. The department of the interior must look at leasing restrictions of the last two years which have steer development towards low potential areas while blocking access to high value resources like wrinkle minerals -- minerals.
▶ 0:25:39These are the building blocks for our economy and national defense and we cannot afford to let bureaucratic delays jeopardize our future. Housing shortages across the west present another daunting challenge that we have to face.
▶ 0:25:56By working with state and local governments to identify underutilized land, the department could finally meaningfully alleviate the housing crisis in places like utah, where the demand for affordable homes far exceed supply. Bills like my houses act would provide a long-term strategy and a strong framework for such partnerships, showing that federal land policy can drive solutions rather than create obstacles.
▶ 0:26:25The colorado river, a lifeline for millions faces rowing threats, effective communication and support from the department of the interior as states negotiate its future will be critical to safeguarding that resource. Our national parks require renewed attention. These iconic landscapes are a source of pride and major economic driver for the gateway community surrounding them.
▶ 0:26:52According to some polls, they are one of the few features of the federal government that people like so we have to take care of them. The department must work to balance accessibility with conservation ensuring that visitors can enjoy the treasures without compromising the future. This requires stronger partnerships with local stakeholders to address infrastructure needs and manage visitor impacts.
▶ 0:27:16On the regulatory front, the misuse of the endangered species act has cause significant harm by halting developing projects and undermining state authority. While the esa is an essential tool it must be applied judiciously and in coordination with local governments to avoid unnecessary conflict. Governor, your attack -- a track record positions you to lead the department of the interior during this challenging time.
▶ 0:27:46Your vision and leadership will be instrumental to restoring balance to federal policies and ensuring that public lands are managed with accountability and care. Utah stands ready to work with you in tackling these challenges and charting a new course that reflects the principles of federalism and respect for local communities.
▶ 0:28:10Utah stands ready for -- to work with you and I invite you to visit utah as soon as you have the chance and see firsthand the opportunities and challenges that we face. The hearing that we are having today marks the beginning of an essential conversation about the future of the department of the interior. I look forward to hearing your perspective and exploring ways to work together and address these pricing issues.
▶ 0:28:38Thank you for your willingness to serve and I look forward to your discussions. I will turn it over to our ranking member from new mexico.
▶ 0:28:45Sen. Heinrich: Thank you chairman and governor burgum, welcome to the energy and natural resources committee. We had a great conversation and I am looking forward to hearing your answers to the questions today. I want to begin by acknowledging the horrific wildfires in california over the last couple of weeks.
▶ 0:29:08Sen. Heinrich: And, having spoken to many of my members I know that you are going to get some questions about that and in particular about firefighters and how we make sure that they are supported. The department of interior has responsibility for an incredibly brought away -- array of issues from conserving the places that americans love to spend time with their families to protecting and recovering our most iconic wildlife species, to
▶ 0:29:40Sen. Heinrich: Delivering water to cities and farms across the west, and fulfilling our nation's trust responsibilities to tribal nations. Pretty much any job that involves responsibilities that range from elementary school students and health care to bison is a big job. Public lands are where we go to camp and hike and hunt and fish and spend time with our families.
▶ 0:30:07Sen. Heinrich: That is where the veterans go to seek the peace and solitude that the service to our country could not provide. While there are some that argue the very existence of public lands like yosemite or the inter-root national for -- bitteroot national forest are unconstitutional most americans know that the idf lands that belong to everyone no matter where they live, who their parents are or how thick or thin their wallets all -- wallets are are one of the most democratic
▶ 0:30:37Sen. Heinrich: Ideas. I hope that you join me in keeping public lands in public hands. The interior department is also the leader of meeting the trust responsibility to tribal nations and upholding the treaty commitments that we as a nation made to tribes and their members. As a nation as we discussed, we routinely fall short of meeting those commitments. We can and must do better.
▶ 0:31:05Sen. Heinrich: As the relentless pace of climate change rings figure floods, hotter summers, higher wind as we have seen in california and diminish no pack which we are experiencing in new mexico, it is driving the long-term aridification of the western united states. It is expected that new mexico will have 25% less water than we have had historically, and we are not alone.
▶ 0:31:32Sen. Heinrich: The colorado river which provides drinking water for 40 million people and irrigates billions of dollars worth of crops and provides essential habitat for fish and wildlife and will likely never return to those early 20th century flows that we used to be able to expect. Through the bureau of reclamation the department of the interior must play an active role in helping the west transition to the new water reality.
▶ 0:32:00Sen. Heinrich: As you know the interior department is also in energy department. As we make the transition to a cleaner energy economy the land and water managed by the department will play an indispensable role in producing the energy that we need. As well as facilitating the ability to move that energy around the country. From geothermal and hydrogen to solar and wind, the department's work is at the center of the energy future.
▶ 0:32:30Sen. Heinrich: I look forward to hearing your plans on all of these topics and more. I think we will have active questions from all of our members today.
▶ 0:32:37Chair Lee: Thank you. We are now going to hear introductions from the north dakota delegation. First of all we will hear from senator holborn and senator trey -- senator cramer.
▶ 0:32:51Sen. Hawley: Burn thank you for thank you for holding this hearing. It is great to see you guys and thanks for your incredible service on behalf of north dakota, and it really is an honor to introduce to our energy and national resources committee. Welcome to you as well and good to have you here. I am not sure where to start.
▶ 0:33:18Sen. Hawley: I have known doug for more than 30 years and we have been working in various capacities for the duration as well as just being a very good friend. Doug and catherine to myself and my wife. On behalf of her as well, greetings and thank you for your willingness to serve. Of course, I grew up in arthur, north dakota.
▶ 0:33:44Sen. Hawley: And then went to school at ndsu state university home of the bison, the mighty bison. And then I went to a lesser-known school, stand firm for an nba, right? But after that went to work for mckenzie, lewis -- consulting. My staff wrote up this beautiful introduction that I will talk a little bit about our shared time together and friendship.
▶ 0:34:13Sen. Hawley: Came back, and actually there was this nascent software company, great plains software. He along with some of his relatives more engaged the family farm to buy it and went to work and started hiring these kids and young people from across north dakota to develop this software company.
▶ 0:34:38Sen. Hawley: I went into his office I do not know, over 30 years ago, and he was in there and just putting these eight by eight floppy disks into sleeves and then he would put them in the boxes and then putting them into larger boxes and then shipping and I said what is this and what are you doing? I then learned all about and if you know doug you know what I mean, all about pc software, and he built that company up, went public in 1997 with it.
▶ 0:35:08Sen. Hawley: Sold it to microsoft in 2001 and that became microsoft business solutions. So microsoft business solutions had its genesis in great plains software. Doug ran microsoft business solutions and kept it in fargo. It was the largest location for microsoft outside of washington. It had 2000 north dakotans.
▶ 0:35:38Sen. Hawley: Left that out -- after a while, started companies, went into the -- philanthropy including great things for north dakota state university. Revitalized in many respects downtown fargo with his real estate development. In 1997 when I was governor I gave him the theodore roosevelt award which is our highest award. I remember him looking at me and saying john, I hope that I am not done accomplishing things.
▶ 0:36:10Sen. Hawley: And obviously were not. Ran for governor in 2016 won and ran again in won overwhelmingly mostly because of catherine, we think. Won as -- for a great majority. Ran for president and was a first of the candidates when he left the race to endorse president trump.
▶ 0:36:36Sen. Hawley: And president trump, right from the get-go and kevin will say the same thing. He was really excited about doug from the job and this was a guy who ran against you. He never had anything but great things to say which we all understand. He endorsed president trump, and what trump saw was somebody who truly understands energy.
▶ 0:37:03Sen. Hawley: And the trump administration has such a big energy agenda that he knew this was the guy to lead it. It was not about leaving the department of the interior leading the national energy council. That being said because there is a lot of things that interior touches. This is a guy who loves the outdoors. He has a ranch and loves to be outside riding horses and riding -- rounding up cattle. He loves to hunt. He loves the national park system and is a historian.
▶ 0:37:35Sen. Hawley: Angus king, he would challenge you for trivial and important knowledge of history. Any detail, head-to-head you guys going in to detail would be fun to listen to. For a while. He loves the outdoors, and park system. And talk to folks that he has worked with in indian country. Every single tribe in north dakota, we have five reservations and more tribes than that. Every single tribe has endorsed him. Mr.
▶ 0:38:05Sen. Hawley: Chairman I ask that these letters be introduced into the record.
▶ 0:38:08Chair Lee: Without objection.
▶ 0:38:09Sen. Hoeven: More than 180 different tribes have endorsed him too which says something, something about a guy who is willing to sit down and talk to folks. And this is a guy that fits this job. He really does and covers all of the bases. I hope everybody in this committee will take the time and visit with him. And understand where he is coming from and understand that he will take the time to understand your issues and work with you.
▶ 0:38:39Sen. Hoeven: I think you will find that this is the right man in the right fit for this job. Thank you.
▶ 0:38:46Chair Lee: Senator graham and. -- >> thanks to the both of you. It was great to listen to john and let me just start off by doing what I always do best and that is agreeing with john. It has worked very well for me in my career.
▶ 0:39:10Chair Lee: But, what struck me right away as he starts talking like a governor and as I look around the room and he brings up the angus thing, I am a -- I am in a former governors club, you will have a lot of great things to talk about. There is so much to be said and john has done it well. I will just highlight a couple of things.
▶ 0:39:33Chair Lee: John's point about president trump's confidence in doug burgum, he called me a lot and even when he was his opponent and said that he liked that doug burgum dialogue. He is so smart and understands everything and I said he does and he will be very valuable to you in your service.
▶ 0:39:57Chair Lee: And I think as a consumer, as governor burgum and first lady catherine are consumers of these incredible federal assets of ours, these great rich properties as creators understanding -- recreators, agriculture and responsible extraction of minerals something that does not get talked about is he is not an oil man from an oil and gas producing state.
▶ 0:40:28Chair Lee: He is first and foremost a conservationist. He is from the land of roosevelt. And he absolutely and relentlessly carried the ball to ensure that the theodore roosevelt presidential library gets built and in north dakota, at the gateway to theodore roosevelt national park so it could become the symbol of responsible extraction of minerals and production of federal assets in a way that exercises great care for the
▶ 0:40:59Chair Lee: Land and the water and the air as well as great economic opportunity for the people who own the assets. That is a remarkable balance that he brings to this. It is such a great honor for me to be here with him to talk about the multiple uses of federal assets and the ways that recognize their value. And then I will just wrap up with this because john did such a great job.
▶ 0:41:28Chair Lee: I want to read one short paragraph from one of the letters from one of our tribes. I know that many tribes throughout the country have written letters. Over my years of public service in north dakota, and working hard at relationships with tribal leaders and recognizing government to government relationships, the thing that has impressed me the most perhaps about doug burnham as a governor was that -- the respect
▶ 0:42:02Chair Lee: That he always showed for them. And it has been reciprocated because he did the hard thing, he earned the trust that had been lost. Not by former governors so much as much as history. It is hard work to do that. And so, I am just going to close, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:42:28Chair Lee: I just want to read a paragraph from standing rock sioux tribe in north and south dakota. Probably one of the more challenging relationships in recent years has been over the dakota access pipeline and that particular tribe, which could with different leadership could have divided people in a big way.
▶ 0:42:56Chair Lee: But, even through that, through all of that, he earned their support. I am going to read the short paragraph and end with that and my thanks to you for allowing me this and my thanks to doug for allowing me this blessing. "governor burgum understands the native american dynamic which, if you are non-native, can be difficult to maneuver. He does it well.
▶ 0:43:24Chair Lee: He understands the importance of honoring traditional values and culture, promoting family first, remembering who we are and where we came from, the struggles we endure and community wellness." and so it is my honor to introduce him today and look forward to a successful confirmation and working together. Thank you.
▶ 0:43:45Chair Lee: Thank you. Governor burgum, the rules of the committee require "that any hearing to confirm a presidential nomination the testimony of the nominee should be under oath." if you would please stand and raise your right hand I will administer the oath. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Thank you.
▶ 0:44:11Chair Lee: Before I have you begin your opening statement I will ask three questions that are addressed to each nominee who comes before the committee. First, will you be available to appear before the committee and other congressional committees to represent departmental positions and respond to issues of concern to the congress?
▶ 0:44:31Gov. Burgum: Yes.
▶ 0:44:33Chair Lee: Are you aware of any personal holdings or interests that could create the appearance or whole have a conflict of interest should you be confirmed and assume the office of which you have been nominated?
▶ 0:44:46Gov. Burgum: No.
▶ 0:44:50Chair Lee: Are you involved or do you have any assets that are held in a blind trust?
▶ 0:44:57Gov. Burgum: I do not.
▶ 0:44:59Chair Lee: I will invite you to introduce your family before you give your opening statement.
▶ 0:45:05Gov. Burgum: Good morning and thank you senator lee and senator heinrich, thank you for your leadership on this committee. I do want to begin with gratitude as I always do with a special thank you to my friend senator hoeven and cramer, not only for their kind words about their service to note dakota in their lifetimes -- north dakota in their lifetimes.
▶ 0:45:33Gov. Burgum: I am greatly thankful for the support of my friends and family including my three kids and my wife who is joining me here today. It is certainly an honor to be nominated by president trump to serve as the 55th secretary of the interior. I grew up in arthur, north dakota. It is a tiny town of 400 people and we did not have paved streets when I grew up.
▶ 0:46:02Gov. Burgum: It was 400 who counted everybody and the good samaritan home. My father was a world war ii navy officer who served in the pacific. He died when I was a freshman in high school and my mom went back to work in higher education. I learned from them about service, either ship, sacrifice and from both of them a love of the outdoors. Growing up I worked in the grain elevator. Every job I had through jr.
▶ 0:46:29Gov. Burgum: High school was one that required showering at the end of the day and not at the beginning. I worked my way through undergrad at north dakota state as a chimney sweep. I loved that job because it was one that you could move up fast and always stay in the black. I thought it was a perfect career.
▶ 0:46:53Gov. Burgum: After grad school as john mentioned, I had the opportunity to go from undergrad to stanford for mba. I was working in ship that chicago and I saw my first apple computer and that was the moment where I said I needed to get into the software business and I had inherited 160 acres of farm and I bet this denied -- and I literally bet it on great plains software.
▶ 0:47:23Gov. Burgum: We grew to over 2000 team members serving 140,000 businesses in 100 countries around the world. I spent my professional career in the private sector before I was elected governor. For the last eight years I have been blessed with the privilege of starting the -- of serving the citizens of north dakota.
▶ 0:47:43Gov. Burgum: My time has been preparation for the opportunity and privilege to serve as the role of secretary of interior as our state and my duties put me in contact with many of the bureau's inside of the department. In north dakota we share geography with five sovereign tribal nations. State and tribal relationships have sometimes been challenged.
▶ 0:48:05Gov. Burgum: The current partnership is historically prong -- strong because we encourage mutual respect, open communication, collaboration and a sincere willingness to listen. I am grateful for the many tribal nations for expressing their support for my nomination.
▶ 0:48:25Gov. Burgum: As governor I served as chairman for the north dakota land board which manages the state's land and minerals with the goal of yielding a return for a state endowment fund that funds public education. I chaired the north dakota industrial commission that oversees 16 agencies related to a variety of things including energy research, into geologic resources, energy production and transmission.
▶ 0:48:51Gov. Burgum: It also serves as a chair of the state water commission overseeing billions of dollars of water resources and projects. All of these are parallel responsibilities to interior and often reacted -- acted with interior basis -- interior department. We have the majesty of the theodore roosevelt park and is a home of the elkhorn ranch which is considered to be the cradle of modern conservation.
▶ 0:49:22Gov. Burgum: I would like to note that the badlands are significantly badder than the south dakota badlands. Tremendously, not even close. In addition we have great prairies and world-renowned agriculture, amazing hunting and fishing. Four season outdoor recreation and much more. In north dakota we created a prosperous economy by sustainably helping natural resources along with our respect for the land and wildlife.
▶ 0:49:52Gov. Burgum: And at the same time having among the cleanest air and water in the country. North dakota experienced the lowest unemployment in the nation and the highest real gdp growth. Demographically the statement from one of the oldest states to one of the youngest. We attracted record levels of talent and investment capital.
▶ 0:50:13Gov. Burgum: I say this because his success was underpinned in the understanding we live in a time of abundance and we can access that as americans by prioritizing innovation overregulation. If given the opportunity to serve, I will bring those experiences and lessons to the leadership of the tens of thousands of dedicated professionals within the department of the interior. That brings us to president trump's vision for a vibrant future that we can achieve together.
▶ 0:50:43Gov. Burgum: The american people have placed their confidence in president trump to achieve energy dominance. By that that is the foundation of american prosperity, affordability for american families and unrivaled national security. Today america produces energy cleaner, smarter, and safer than anywhere in the world.
▶ 0:51:05Gov. Burgum: When energy production is restricted in america it does not reduce demand it just shifts productions to countries like russia and iran whose autocratic leaders do not care at all about the environment, but use the revenues from energy sales to fund wars against us and our allies.
▶ 0:51:22Gov. Burgum: President trump's vision will end those wars abroad and make life more affordable for every family by driving down inflation and president trump will achieve those goals while championing clean air, water and protecting our lands. Next to tr national park we are building the presidential library and museum to honor the leader to advise america to walk -- to speak softly and carry a big spit -- a big stick.
▶ 0:51:51Gov. Burgum: In our time the energy dominance can be our big stick that can be leveraged to achieve historic prosperity and world peace. The department of interior, in cooperation with the U.S. congress, this committee, and the states will play a pivotal role in achieving the outcomes to make the world safer and america better for our children, grandchildren and generations to come. I thank you for inviting me and I look forward to our questions and discussion.
▶ 0:52:21Chair Lee: Thank you. We will now begin our first round of five-minute christians. We will alternate back and forth between republicans and democrats. I will go first and then senator heinrich in order of seniority and arrival. I want to start by talking about the antiquities act, a law passed over a century ago by congress that gives the president the power unilaterally to declare national monuments.
▶ 0:52:51Chair Lee: There is a restriction that requires nationalonuments occupy no more land than is compatible to the smallest area compatible. With the interest to beacon -- protected by the monument. These have become a political football in parts of the country especially in my state. In utah president clinton designated the grand staircase monument and president obama added the bears ears monument shortly before he left office.
▶ 0:53:21Chair Lee: Both of these objections -- both of these designations were made over the objection of the people of utah and their elected representatives. President trump produced the size of both monuments -- reduced the size of both monuments to bring them more into conformity with the antiquities act requirement for minimal boundaries.
▶ 0:53:45Chair Lee: In 2021 president biden expanded them and exceeded the scope of the law and disregarding local input. As I explained to president biden at the time it is the size of two delawares in my state that have been moved into this very restricted use classification.
▶ 0:54:03Chair Lee: The point is not that they are not beautiful things to protect but the line was drawn so big and the monument was made so expansive in part because local leaders were not consulted and to the extent that they were heard, their counsel was ignored. I would like to invite you when you visit utah to meet with those whose voices were ignored during those monument re-expansions.
▶ 0:54:31Chair Lee: Will you work with me to fix that and figure out how best to proceed and to make sure that the antiquities act designated monuments do not exceed the restriction within the statute itself?
▶ 0:54:44Gov. Burgum: Thank you for that important question. The 1905 antiquities act was signed into law by president roosevelt himself and as you stated multiple times, it states clearly that it is the smallest possible area to protect those objects. The original intention was to protect as it says, antiquities. Areas like indiana jones type archaeological protections.
▶ 0:55:16Gov. Burgum: These are essential that we protect the areas and that is what the law was intended. I look forward to working with you particularly in the area of local concentration because when the federal government overreaches into a state like yours which already has over 60% of its lands and public lands and restricts use it has tremendous impact on tribes and the local communities and all of those around.
▶ 0:55:42Gov. Burgum: It is important that we strike the right balance and I look forward to working with you on this issue.
▶ 0:55:46Chair Lee: Thank you. Housing is another area I would like to address briefly. There is an acute housing shortage in the west where the presence of federal land, not just the presence but the predominance available for housing frequently results in shortages and makes a lot of things difficult. It is not as though we have one part of a state that is all federal and another part that is nonfederal.
▶ 0:56:16Chair Lee: It is intermingled and as a result it impacts things. Many of our communities in states like utah and nevada among others find ourselves feeling sort of like we are islands, floating islands with any se -- within a sea of federal land, which constrains growth and makes our housing supply more dire.
▶ 0:56:45Chair Lee: I would love to work with you on a bill that I have introduced and worked on for several years called the houses act. In addition to looking for and developing other creative ways to address housing affordability crisis in the west, in your view, how can the department of the interior address the housing crisis in areas like as is the case in my state where the presence of federal land often inhibits community needs?
▶ 0:57:15Gov. Burgum: One of the great challenges we are facing is housing affordability. My discussion and friendship with governor spencer cox of your state, I know it is a high priority. There are opportunities for us to accomplish both. We are in a time of abundance.
▶ 0:57:36Gov. Burgum: We have federal lands abutting urban areas and we have other areas that need to be protected, like we have done in north dakota. Sometimes we have done land swaps. We trade state land for private land to provide better outcomes. There are certainly opportunities here. Public lands in general, some like the national parks, absolutely we need to protect every inch of those.
▶ 0:58:05Gov. Burgum: In other cases we have a multiple use scenario for the land and I believe that there are pathways that we can find particularly in your states like yourself and others that have 50 or 60% more of the land held by federal government that we can find appropriate solutions to address the housing.
▶ 0:58:21Chair Lee: Thank you. My time has expired. We will turn the time over to senator heinrich.
▶ 0:58:27Sen. Heinrich: Governor, I want to actually continue on that same vein. I had a very long and detailed question written by my staff that I am going to depart from. I am just going to the heart of the issue which is I think what people are concerned about, and this was a very hot issue this year because of legal action, is the idea that we would somehow in a wholesale way divest of
▶ 0:58:59Sen. Heinrich: Public lands. Talk a little bit about that and how we can stay true to our conservation history, and make sure that the things that we do on public land especially -- not especially but economically and recreationally and as they play such an essential cultural role in states like mine, can be supported while making smart decisions about individual portions?
▶ 0:59:24Gov. Burgum: Thank you. I think we have to look no further than new mexico for the answer to the fact that we can find the balance. As I know and senator hoeven and I hate to acknowledge new mexico passed north dakota as the number two oil and gas producer of the state and yet your state has a tremendous record of protecting cultural and historical lands and providing that balance.
▶ 0:59:54Gov. Burgum: I think there is certainly the opportunity to find that balance going forward where we can protect the land we need to protect but also solve issues whether it is housing or resource development that might be of interest of the tribal or local communities.
▶ 1:00:09Sen. Heinrich: That is something we really pride ourselves on in new mexico. We have been able to strike a balance. That we have been able to be an energy leader on many fronts, and at the same time the number of national monuments even that are not controversial and are deeply supported by local leaders and veterans groups and by tribes and hunters and
▶ 1:00:39Sen. Heinrich: Fishermen alike. So, I would just simply ask that before the department makes wholesale changes to conservation designations in the state of new mexico at least that you would meet with myself and any local leaders who have helped to create those designations in the first place.
▶ 1:01:00Gov. Burgum: Yes, absolutely. We look forward to those discussions with you and I think, again, as you have described, the key is local consultation as senator lee and other states have experienced, there have been incidents where there has been complete opposition and no consultation.
▶ 1:01:24Gov. Burgum: My experience with governor and -- as governor and my experience in north dakota whether it is grazing associations, rural residentss, the consultation is key.
▶ 1:01:36Sen. Heinrich: Part of that is also those tribes that have both current and historic connections to those places as well, right?
▶ 1:01:45Gov. Burgum: Absolutely.
▶ 1:01:47Sen. Heinrich: As a former guide, I am quite excited that this senate and this body just past the explorer act. It is the first major piece of outdoor recreation legislation. Senator barrasso was incredibly involved as well as senator manchin, and permitting reform was something I worked on in that.
▶ 1:02:16Sen. Heinrich: It is a recognition of the big economic driver of the public lands that does not get the same attention that energy and other uses get. Outdoor recreation in new mexico is responsible for something like 29,000 jobs and billions of dollars of impact. On a national scale it is over a $1 trillion economy.
▶ 1:02:39Sen. Heinrich: Talk a little bit about how we can balance those competing issues as you did as governor, and support that outdoor recreation economy because it is growing and particularly critical to the rural gateway communities.
▶ 1:02:55Gov. Burgum: Well, first I would like to say this is a really important topic, but also a passion of mine as someone who spent my life as an avid outdoorsman. I was pleased to get the full endorsement for the recreation roundtable for this job which represents that trillion dollar industry.
▶ 1:03:17Sen. Heinrich: I think that is where we met.
▶ 1:03:19Gov. Burgum: And it represents all of these aspects. The opportunity in most states I recognize this as governor. I created an office of outdoor recreation and continue to invest in that weather that is access to fishing and hug -- and hunting public access on public lands and a number of great things going on in north dakota that we have done that have been an -- that have been helpful including using technology.
▶ 1:03:50Gov. Burgum: We got all of the landowners and the pheasant hunters and all of the waterfowl hunters, they got ready to agree on that and we created a tool for hunting. You can look on your phone and find out if the land is posted or not posted. It might be posted no for dear but -- deer, and yes for pheasant. And there might be a phone number where if you call you might be let on.
▶ 1:04:19Gov. Burgum: We have had tools for landowners and sportsmen for public and private lands to keep that outdoor economy rolling.
▶ 1:04:29Sen. Heinrich: Thank you.
▶ 1:04:31Chair Lee: Senator daines.
▶ 1:04:34Sen. Daines: Welcome to you and the first lady of north dakota. If confirmed he will be a thin line to succession for the president of the united states and that goes in line with when these departments became part of the united states government. The interior goes back to 1849. The oldest agency within the interior is the bureau of indian affairs.
▶ 1:05:04Sen. Daines: It is only fitting before I get to my questions and my remarks if I might submit a letter for the record from the coalition of large tribes of which some of my -- three of my 12 recognize tribes in montana are part of that. You have five recognize tribes and members. If I read the letter that they wrote in your support that says "it has been incredible for tribes to have such a close supporter nominated to the secretary's office.
▶ 1:05:35Sen. Daines: He is someone we have deep trust and confidence. We have come to him with complex issues over the years. He is exactly the kind of leader that tribes need in the interior department." they close by saying "governor burgum has c.o.l.t's highest recommendation service department -- as head of the department of interior." I would like to submit this
▶ 1:06:06Sen. Daines: Record.
▶ 1:06:06Chair Lee: Without objection.
▶ 1:06:08Sen. Daines: Last week they -- the interior turned down the idea to divide -- two move the populations of grizzly bears that have exceeded targets by so much that they believe that these populations are even distinct.
▶ 1:06:32Sen. Daines: We should be celebrating the fact that the grizzly bear has recovered as the example of a great species that has recovered. Sadly this ruling coming out of fws punishes montana's successful as a bear recovery efforts. It is completely backwards. We should be celebrating the recovery.
▶ 1:06:58Sen. Daines: Instead, we are now having to sacrifice to adjust living with the bears, whether it is predation losses and human safety. Sadly, many montanans have been killed or mauled by grizzly bears. The people back home take it seriously.
▶ 1:07:18Sen. Daines: It has got to the point along the rocky mountain front and west of great falls where the playgrounds and one of the schools have a high fence to protect the children from grizzly bears when they go out for recess. The service keeps moving these goalposts for delisting and returning them to state management where it absolutely belongs like they have done with the wolves.
▶ 1:07:41Sen. Daines: The service at recovery numbers at 500 and 800 respectively for the greater yellowstone ecosystem and the northern continental divine ecosystem. The most recent estimate is 2100 bears in these two ecosystems. Governor, would you acknowledge that the data shows that the recovery of these two populations and commit to working with me to delist them.
▶ 1:08:09Gov. Burgum: I am aware of the data and this is a super important issue I know to montanans and people also in wyoming and idaho. I am with you. We should be celebrating when species come off of the endangered species list as opposed to fighting every way we can to try and keep them on the list. As you say, the complications.
▶ 1:08:36Gov. Burgum: The other thing you mentioned is the state, having been a governor I understand how dedicated the state fish and wildlife representatives are from montana, wyoming, north and south dakota. As the chair of western governors I came to understand how dedicated those state officials are. There is a belief when they come out of federal protection layer unprotected. -- they are unprotected.
▶ 1:09:05Gov. Burgum: They are managed by the locals who have the closest data. I pledge to work with you on this issue.
▶ 1:09:10Sen. Daines: The biden administration has been slow walking three permits for coal mines in montana. The bull mountain mine, the rosebud and the spring crate mine are in desperate need to finalize permits. Bull mountain has had to layoff hard-working montanans because the office of surface mining has refused to finish reviews.
▶ 1:09:37Sen. Daines: My question is when confirmed will you prioritize completing these permits so montana families do not lose their jobs?
▶ 1:09:45Gov. Burgum: This is part of a larger crisis that our nation is facing around electricity. We have a shortage and especially a shortage of baseload. We know we have the technology to deliver clean coal and we are doing that in north dakota. Senator hoeven began these efforts but we have the opportunity to produce clean coal and produce a reliable baseload for this country.
▶ 1:10:12Gov. Burgum: Again, we are absolutely wanting to work with you on this issue because this is something that is critical to our national security. Without baseload we will lose the arms race to china and if we do that, that will have direct impacts on national security to the future of the country.
▶ 1:10:33Sen. Daines: One more final statement and I will complete my questions. I want to close by highlighting the importance of a bill that I am working with senator king of maine. We cochair the national park subcommittee and we are proud of the fact that no matter which way the gavel goes it goes back and forth over time. Angus king and I are always cochairs as we work together on behalf of the national parks.
▶ 1:10:59Sen. Daines: I am working with him to reauthorize the national parks and public land legacy restoration fund to address the deferred maintenance challge that we face. President trump signed the greatest conservation work in 50 years when he signed the great american outdoors act. And I think the vice chairman for helping to get that across the finish line. He signed that in 2020 and I hope we have your support for reauthorizing.
▶ 1:11:28Gov. Burgum: Absolutely. The great american outdoors act was a great step forward. But I know from my own personal experience and working with the theodore roosevelt national park the amount of deferred maintenance is even greater today than it was when the bill was passed. And so we have to continue to invest in our national parks.
▶ 1:11:51Sen. Daines: Thank you.
▶ 1:11:53Chair Lee: Senator hirono.
▶ 1:11:55Sen. Hirono: Welcome. As part of my responsibilities to ensure the fitness of nominees before any of the committees, I asked the following two initial questions. Since you became a legal adult have you ever made unwanted requests for sexual favors or committed any verbal or physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature?
▶ 1:12:18Gov. Burgum: I have not.
▶ 1:12:19Sen. Hirono: Have you ever face discipline or entered into a settlement for this kind of misconduct?
▶ 1:12:26Gov. Burgum: I have not.
▶ 1:12:29Sen. Hirono: I received your testimony and you noted that " president trump's energy dominance vision will end wars abroad." president trump has directed you to expand oil and gas drilling on a massive scale, which will lead to increased burning of fossil fuels. Now, the scientific consensus is that burning fossil fuels is a primary human cause of climate change.
▶ 1:12:58Sen. Hirono: In 2017, then the secretary of defense james mattis appointed by president trump told the senate armed services committee that "climate change is impacting stability in areas of the world where our troops are operating." in 2014 the secretary of defense said that "climate change is a critical national security threat and a threat multiplier."
▶ 1:13:29Sen. Hirono: These are two secretaries of defense and they know something about war. Were you aware that they testified before the armed services committee a number of times that burning more fossil fuel is actually going to not result in the end of wars but could exacerbate and cause wars? Were you aware of this testimony?
▶ 1:13:53Gov. Burgum: I am not aware of that specific testimony. I do know that within fossil fuels the concern has been about emissions and we have the technology to do things like carbon capture to eliminate harbin -- harmful emissions.
▶ 1:14:10Sen. Hirono: The fact of the matter is that you have military leaders who acknowledge that climate change is a major issue. And for you to take the position that you are going to engage in actions that will result in the burning of more fossil fuelsec.f burning of more fossil fuelsec., burning of more fossil fuelsec.r duty to see the department carries out its mission.
▶ 1:14:41Sen. Hirono: To protect and banish our national -- nation's natural resource and cultural heritage. If you are ordered by the president to act in a manner that is counter to the departments mission or to the constitution such as drilling in a national monument, will you do as the president asks?
▶ 1:15:11Sen. Hirono: Because he wants to drill in that monument.
▶ 1:15:12Gov. Burgum: Senator, of course, as part of my sworn duty I will follow the law and follow the constitution, so you can count on that. I have not heard of anything about president trump wanting to do anything -- other than advancing energy production for the benefit of the american people.
▶ 1:15:36Sen. Hirono: We all know the president wants to drill, baby, drill. In your testimony you say he has energy dominance vision. So I would ask you that should you be confirmed that you will have these kinds of manners that you'll have to decide. Are you going to drill in a monument? Are you going to protect our natural resources? Or are you going to drill, they become a drill? I raise that as a concern with you going forward.
▶ 1:16:10Sen. Hirono: Last year congress renewed our compacts free association that comes within the purview of interior. It involves the marshall islands. I would like to get your commitment to implement the new compacts every association in accordance with the bill partisan law that was enacted -- bipartisan law that was enacted last year.
▶ 1:16:34Gov. Burgum: Senator, these pacific islands in addition to the three you mentioned that are part of the compact, also the others that are under the insularity's of interior, all critically important to national security for the united states of america. All of them have important military implications. All of these are places where U.S. sailors fought and died during world war ii.
▶ 1:17:02Gov. Burgum: And with the aggression china is showing in the pacific, it is more important we support them more than ever. I know hawaii plays an important role including and things like medical care for those residents of those islands. I think it is important in government does its share as opposed to putting the load --.
▶ 1:17:22Sen. Hirono: It sounds like you are familiar with the compacts. Thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:17:25Chair Lee: Senator justice. So but just as my questions are going to be short and sweet.
▶ 1:17:46Chair Lee: I can tell you this, I think we share in the fact energy is key -- I don't have my microphone on. Ok. Good enough. I am talking loud enough anyway. Nevertheless, energy is such a key that opens every door in my opinion. Every single door. And the world is starving for us , america, to lead the way.
▶ 1:18:17Chair Lee: I believe we share that thought. I believe we share the thought that electricity come if we don't watch out, will become a crisis like we can't imagine. We absolutely need to be prepared and move forward in that. We have a problem along the way. Permitting has gotten totally outrageous. An absolutely we all want it to be fair and proper and not endanger our environment. We all share in that.
▶ 1:18:47Chair Lee: Absolutely I ask you, governor, please, tell us your thoughts on how we are going to approach this. How we will approach the issues with fish and wildlife service and on and on and on. Please tell us.
▶ 1:19:04Gov. Burgum: So great you are here in the senate and what a fantastic job it is, governor, a pleasure serving alongside of you as another energy state. You've got everything -- you get we are in an energy crisis in our country in the first place is related to electricity. Electricity is at the brink. Our grid as a point where it could go completely unstable.
▶ 1:19:31Gov. Burgum: He could be months away from having skyrocketing prices for americans. And of course as we talked about in the ai arms race, we need electricity for manufacturing. Ai is manufacturing intelligence. If we don't manufacture more intelligence than our adversaries, it affects every job come every company, every industry. You can understand this and we have got to get to work. The permitting right now, seven years or longer.
▶ 1:20:03Gov. Burgum: It is a completely -- it is 95% intermittent sources and only 5% baseload. We need baseload to be able to allow the renewables to be part of the system. We've got to have the balance between those two of the grid, like a giant machine, it does not work. We have got to get to work and permitting reform and speeding permitting -- right now we have stacked the deck. We are creating roadblocks for people that want to do baseload.
▶ 1:20:35Gov. Burgum: And we have got massive tax incentives for people that want to do intermittent and unreliable when the balance is out of whack and lift or bring it back in line and we can do that and still achieve the objectives we want to have about having cleaner environment because the U.S. has done that. We are the one nation on the planet that has reduced co2 over the last 20 years. China has doubled their co2 emissions in the same timeframe.
▶ 1:21:02Sen. Justice: Thank you. And thank you for your kind comments. If I can ask one more question and shift a little bit, we all know the outdoors touches our soul. I am an outdoorsman like crazy. I have enjoyed hunting and fishing all across this nation come of especially in my home state of west virginia. I welcome you to come to west virginia to experience what I am speaking of.
▶ 1:21:30Sen. Justice: I would say this, we have an attack on our sport of hunting and fishing. Hunters absolutely do so much to contribute to all the goodness all across all of our lands, to all the wildlife, to all of the different things that happened within the sport of hunting. I know you share my love just as much as I know my love.
▶ 1:21:56Sen. Justice: With all that being said, what will you do to ensure that we will perpetuate this unbelievable tradition to our youth and all those to come?
▶ 1:22:07Gov. Burgum: Senator, in north dakota, we have taken steps as I know other states have done to create youth hunting seasons. Youth hunter education. Make it more available, create more opportunities as we have also done for disabled and wounded veterans.
▶ 1:22:26Gov. Burgum: But when we have public lands and public access, the greatest conservationists in our country -- and some are probably listening today whether it is the rocky mountain elk foundation, pheasants forever, ducks unlimited -- any of these organizations, they are the ones that raise the money that actually poor dollars into conservation in this country. Hunters, safari club, all of these different groups.
▶ 1:22:52Gov. Burgum: Of course president roosevelt, theodore roosevelt, one of the founders, he was a hunter who also set the ethic for conservation for our country. These two things go hand in hand. You cannot separate hunting from the love of outdoors, respect for wildlife, and dollars that flow back into habitat and making sure we have got a hunting -- we have the privilege of hunting for the public. It does not matter who you are.
▶ 1:23:18Gov. Burgum: In north dakota, you can get a $20 tag and go on a hunt it is just as amazing as if you are going to africa. It is a miracle that we have in this country, one of the few countries that has that, something that the fight to protect and preserve.
▶ 1:23:33Sen. Justice: I had just one other comment. President trump is bringing to us amazing nominees. But in my book, this man, just think for one second, he is supersmart. His track record is unbelievable. He has experience off the chart. If anybody is the pick of the litter, it has got to be this man.
▶ 1:24:00Sen. Justice: He has done an amazing job, but he's got courage like you can't imagine. Just think about this. He stood on one leg at the debate and absolutely with a torn achilles -- and I have been a coach forever in basketball and I have seen kids get a torn achilles and absolutely it is one serious injury. How you did this, I will never know. But nevertheless, I give him kudos for courage beyond belief.
▶ 1:24:30Sen. Justice: Thank you so much, sir.
▶ 1:24:31Gov. Burgum: Thank you, senator.
▶ 1:24:33Chair Lee: Maybe you will tell us that someday. Biting on a leather strap until moments he walked on the debate stand I imagine. Senator king?
▶ 1:24:45Sen. King: Thank you, associate myself with the comments about sportsmen. Several weeks ago I accepted the chairmanship of the congressional sportsmen's foundation which I am greatly honored to do and look forward to working with you on those issues. I have visited your wonderful state. Camped there. Visited with senator cramer. I must say mine is the flattest place I've been in my life. One of the local said if your dog runs away, you can still see them after three days.
▶ 1:25:20Sen. King: I also want to compliment you. A lot of people talk about and all of the above energy strategy. You did it. You implemented it in north dakota. Over 36% of your electricity comes from wind. I hope one of the projects you might undertake when and if you are confirmed is to convince your boss that wind power is not all bad.
▶ 1:25:45Sen. King: He is well-known for his opposition to wind power, but you know the benefits are there. Of course baseload is also important. Storage is important to balance the grid. I understand that. But coming from a state where 35%, 36% of your electricity came from wind, I hope you can talk to the president about the fact wind has its virtues and can contribute significantly because we are, as you note, facing a huge energy challenge over the next 15 to 20 years to
▶ 1:26:18Sen. King: Support the knowledge economy. Will you undertake that project?
▶ 1:26:22Gov. Burgum: Senator king, certainly, you have great wind resources in maine and we do in north dakota. Not every state is lucky to have that. The resources we do where the wind -- maybe that helps us. Very few trees to stop the wind. The key here, you mentioned, is baseload versus the intermittent. We have to have the right balance and maybe have tipped a little too far in one direction. I think that is the key piece.
▶ 1:26:56Gov. Burgum: Short-term emergency.
▶ 1:26:57Sen. King: But you do see the value of wind power. One third of your state's comes from that.
▶ 1:27:00Gov. Burgum: And most we so I think in beers -- neighbors are happy to have that. We need an all in above strategy .
▶ 1:27:13Sen. King: And a balanced grade.
▶ 1:27:14Gov. Burgum: It is a balance but we need more. The thing we are short of right now is baseload.
▶ 1:27:19Sen. King: Maine has an asset similar to yours offshore. The department of interior executed several leases recently. I hope I can have your commitment to continue with those leases. They will produce enough energy for all the homes in maine, new hampshire, and vermont. It is an enormous resource that can provide significant energy.
▶ 1:27:45Sen. King: As you may know, the capacity factor of offshore wind is significantly higher than terrestrial wind. I hope your department will continue with the projects that are already underway. Will you commit to that?
▶ 1:27:59Gov. Burgum: I'm not familiar with every project the interior has a new way but I will be taking a look at those and if they make sense and they are already in law, they will continue. I think the key is, and I think president trump has been clear in his statements that he is concerned about the significant amount of attacks from incentives that have gone toward some forms of energy that have helped exacerbate this imbalance we are seeing right now today.
▶ 1:28:26Sen. King: You talk briefly about permitting reform and I was involved in the discussion with senator barrasso and senator manchin. Unfortunately, we could not get across the goal in the end of last congress. I presume permitting reform not only this regeneration projects but transmission. Do you appreciate the difficulty of permitting transmission assets, particularly in the west?
▶ 1:28:52Gov. Burgum: Yes. I think this is one of the challenges of our time and one of the challenges we need to undertake is whether it is a transmission line, a pipeline, whatever it happens to be trying to get built, it just takes too long in our country. If we don't have -- it is one thing to be able to generate electricity but if we don't have the ability to transmit it to places where it is needed, it will be a problem.
▶ 1:29:20Sen. King: Exactly. Setor daines mentioned what we have introduced, refresh of the great american outdoor sect. One of the most successful of the trumpet administration. I remember working with secretary zinke on that project. I'm gratified to hear your support for that proposal. Final point is we talked about -- and that talks about the backlog of maintenance in the national parks and public lands.
▶ 1:29:49Sen. King: One of the problems is the department has chronically underfunded maintenance on an ongoing basis. In other words, we are being asked to fix a backlog that, frankly, should not have existed. I hope you will work with the national park service in the office of management and to be sure a sufficient fund is allocated to ongoing maintenance so we don't continue to take -- did the hole deeper.
▶ 1:30:14Gov. Burgum: I agree with you on that and this is one of the things when I came in as a business guy into government I was shocked to find in north dakota we did not have the appropriate formulas for funding deferred maintenance. Everybody was happy to approve appropriations to build new buildings, but it was tough to get a dime to take care of the ones we already had.
▶ 1:30:42Gov. Burgum: This is something we will look at procedurally with the interior. We have over 2400 locations I am told in terms of where we have people stationed. We just have to make sure not just the national parks, but across the whole department, we have to get the formulas right because we are creating liabilities for future generations.
▶ 1:31:05Sen. King: I can tell you the formula right now is not right so I encourage you to take that step. Thank you for joining us, governor. Look forward to hearing from you further.
▶ 1:31:14Chair Lee: Senator mccormick.
▶ 1:31:19Sen. Cornyn: Good to see you governor, catherine. We had a great meeting I guess a week or two ago and I promised to visit the baddest badlands in the dakotas and I'm looking forward to that. I know we have all of these energy state governors here but in pennsylvania we like to think dominance goes through the keystone state. I am glad to have you here before us today.
▶ 1:31:39Sen. Cornyn: When we met, we talked about in energy innovation summit that I am planning to do later this year when we bring in energy companies, ai companies, as well as big investors. An opportunity to really celebrate and also more progress on president trump's vision of energy dominance. I was happy to talk about that and look forward to working with you on that and hoping I can start with getting your support to work with me closely and make that a reality.
▶ 1:32:07Gov. Burgum: I think it is a great idea. It is absolutely true the keystone state is the key and there such a resource there. So if you americans understand pennsylvania is producing 20% of our nation's natural gas. The fact the innovators in the private sector invested the whole shale revolution that got in this country is a miracle.
▶ 1:32:37Gov. Burgum: We went from being one of the largest importers of energy to one of the largest exporters. Russia, they ran a campaign with all of the psi ops they have. We can't be naive. They pounded europe for 10 years , getting everybody in europe and germany to shut down all their baseload so they could buy natural gas from russia.
▶ 1:32:58Gov. Burgum: In the invaded -- russia invades ukraine and the price goes up, russia makes bank like they've never made before and they are funding a war against us most of germany then rushes to reopen their baseload power plants. If america had not come to the rescue with lng exports from our country to western europe, this thing could have escalated even beyond the tragedy we see today in ukraine.
▶ 1:33:23Sen. Mccormick: And that really relates to my second question which is, pennsylvania as you mentioned is the second-largest natural gas producer and yet america's allies, even states across our great country, can't get access to lng. We need to expand lng exports. It would be a huge win and create a lot of great jobs for americans and pennsylvanians.
▶ 1:33:51Sen. Mccormick: As chair, how you work with the administration to increase natural gas production and new export terminals in places like pennsylvania as quickly as possible?
▶ 1:34:04Gov. Burgum: I learned in their private sector in public companies you only make forward-looking statements. The energy council has yet to be created, hopefully, early in this administration. At one thing I would say that is not a forward-looking statement, just a fact, and I talked about it was senator king, we have 80% of the homes in maine are heating their homes with heating oil.
▶ 1:34:35Gov. Burgum: We can't get a pipeline with clean U.S. natural gas into new england? At the time of the russian invasion, not only western europe had become dependent, we are offloading hundreds of thousands of barrels of dirty russian heating oil.
▶ 1:34:51Sen. Mccormick: Boston harbor, right?
▶ 1:34:55Gov. Burgum: We have to be able to get clean U.S. energy to every state. We need the transportation networks whether it is pipelines or transmission lines to do that. We can't be at a time of risk, global risk like we are now in global national security, 10 b in a position where -- to be in a position where we are exposed to supply chains that depend on our adversaries, whether it is critical minerals with china or heating oil from russia or uranium from russia. We could not be dependent on them.
▶ 1:35:25Gov. Burgum: We have the resources and need to develop them.
▶ 1:35:26Sen. Mccormick: Like many energy producing states, pennsylvania has thousands of wells that need to be plugged. Many states have programs to plug these wells that have worked pretty well for many years. I am concerned the federal funding available for that is being held for a number of these projects because of red tape. As secretary, we streamline these requirements so states like mine can quickly access the much-needed funding to plug these wells?
▶ 1:35:54Gov. Burgum: I don't want to say this is a passion project because I'm passionate about a lot of things, but the federal legislation which was put in place during -- after the pandemic was modeled after something we created in north dakota and I want to thank senator hoeven and senator cramer further work on that. Pennsylvania, have been producing and drilling oil well since the 1880's. North dakota's first one was not until 1951.
▶ 1:36:24Gov. Burgum: We have hours down now in north dakota to under 200. There are other states that have tens of thousands of abandoned /orphaned wells. This is something from an environmental standpoint we have to take care of. The technology is there. We can clean it up. There are ways to do it. It could be great for the local economy, great reclamation. There is a way to do it. You have a lot of knowledge in this area and you can count on my support.
▶ 1:36:52Sen. Mccormick: Look forward to working with you.
▶ 1:36:55Gov. Burgum: The U.S. can be energy dominant but we have to maintain the path we are on. Cleaner, safer, smarter than anyone else in the world.
▶ 1:37:04Chair Lee: Senator cortez masto.
▶ 1:37:09Sen. Cortez Masto: Governor, good to see you again. Welcome to your wife, catherine. Good name. We talked a little bit about this but I went to bring this to the public as well because senator lee and I do have a lot in common when it comes to our public lands and most of the lens in the state of nevada, 85%, are with the federal government.
▶ 1:37:34Sen. Cortez Masto: We have to manage not only our housing issues but economic development. Unlike some of the states, your state, where you own most of the land. We are always looking for that partnership with our federal partners.
▶ 1:37:47Sen. Cortez Masto: Nevada has a successful track record when it comes to bringing different parties together to create that balance of releasing public land for that needed development, conserving land, addressing land management needs , and an example of that collaboration is my southern nevada lands bill.
▶ 1:38:09Sen. Cortez Masto: I am hopeful that based on your comments are ready to my colleagues that you believe in a balanced land use that the key to that is local consultation and state consultation. I agree. So I am hoping you will be willing to work with us as we address in nevada our housing needs, which is an issue as well as economic development and work with me on my southern nevada lands bill and other lands bills in the state of nevada. Would you commit to doing that?
▶ 1:38:34Gov. Burgum: Absolutely. I know other than alaska come you guys are at the top of the list in terms of having the most amount of federal land. You have some of the same challenges around affordable housing that senator lee and utah and with the great success of population and southern nevada, and I think there is some creative ideas about land exchanges. You have thought through it I can tell. Look forward to working with you.
▶ 1:39:04Sen. Cortez Masto: I also want to touch on a comment you made contacts incentives going to some forms of energy creates an imbalance for baseload. That is what I have heard that she made that comment when we were together as well. Let me ask you this. In nevada, it is important for us to absolutely have an opportunity to support public/private partnerships in clean energy. I would imagine you support those.
▶ 1:39:31Gov. Burgum: It is great whenever we can get more market incentives built into programs, spin a textile or can match it with two dollars or three dollars from the private sector, that is one of the things we did in north dakota to grow our economy and extend the return on investment for every taxpayer dollar invested.
▶ 1:39:52Sen. Cortez Masto: I appreciate that. There is a role for the federal government to be a part of incentivizing and supporting those public/private partnerships. Would you agree?
▶ 1:40:00Gov. Burgum: Where appropriate, absolutely.
▶ 1:40:03Sen. Cortez Masto: In nevada, because of the inflation reduction act in a bipartisan infrastructure package, we have benefit not only in nevada with the jobs but in contributing to our national security and bringing back manufacturing to this country because we have critical mineral mining going on in nevada thanks to those pieces of legislation.
▶ 1:40:26Sen. Cortez Masto: We have the complete ecosystem for battery, not only manufacturing, but storage and recycling as well. Aunt are energy now is both -- and our energy now is both gas as solar. Solar is one of the number one areas that we have in the state for our energy needs. That is why battery storage is important.
▶ 1:40:52Sen. Cortez Masto: Let me ask you this, and maybe I'm wrong about this, but is it the combination of renewables plus battery storage baseload?
▶ 1:40:59Gov. Burgum: That is certainly the future. Like I said before, all of the above. We need all forms of electricity. We are short of electricity in this country. We have to make sure we have a balance. If we don't have the baseload, the intermittent -- I will call it unreliable because you can't -- the sun doesn't always shine in the wind doesn't always blow.
▶ 1:41:23Gov. Burgum: Until we get storage, until we get to that time, we have to have two systems.
▶ 1:41:31Sen. Cortez Masto: I agree that if we don't have the incentives to continue that research and make sure that is happening -- storage is happening in nevada right now. I have been to the facilities. If we don't have the incentives, then we are never going to get there. My concern is and what I am hearing is under this administration, a shift from those incentives for new renewables back to fossil fuels.
▶ 1:41:55Sen. Cortez Masto: And that is not going to do any of us really in this country a benefit at the end of the day leaning into clean energy, dominant in that space of clean energy, protecting our national security when it comes to that clean energy as well. I do think there is a balanced approach here, but not one at the expense of another.
▶ 1:42:19Sen. Cortez Masto: I am hopeful based on your experience as a governor, what I just heard and I know about your state because you found a balanced approach for energy in every state will be different based on the geography, that you will work with states as well and not take away an opportunity where they can have that balanced approach for energy.
▶ 1:42:36Sen. Cortez Masto: Would you be willing to do that can even stand up to the administration when it somehow is not a benefit what they are trying to do like the state of nevada, republican governor and I are in lockstep when it comes to moving forward in this space?
▶ 1:42:51Gov. Burgum: There are big opportunities in nevada whether it is solar, geothermal, critical minerals. I would say the benefit to every american is if we have baseload that is reliable that works, that is part of how we have a. Every american today is paying more for their electricity than before. Their current policy is hurting every american. It has not happened yet but it is coming soon.
▶ 1:43:20Gov. Burgum: More and more brownouts and blackouts because we aren't going to have the balance on the grade. I think every senator and governor is going to be hearing from every consumer. This is something we have to work on together as a priority to make sure we restore a balance to the grid, and that means -- like I said, you take a look at ferc queue, 95% unreliable, that tells us we are out of balance and we have to bring it back. Keep moving forward.
▶ 1:43:49Gov. Burgum: Great opportunities to work with you in nevada. You have some special opportunities and resources and I was a critical minerals -- I'm glad you brought that up. In the ira, we passed all kinds of incentives for electric vehicles at a time when china is controlling 85% of the critical minerals in the world. And sending something which increases our dependence on a major adversary because we are in a cold war with china, and a cyber war every day with them.
▶ 1:44:20Gov. Burgum: Right now we are in a cyber war with them, north korea, russia, iran.
▶ 1:44:25Sen. Cortez Masto: So you don't support it? Gov. Burgum: I support economics and markets. If you add up to ev totals, it is over $900 per ton of co2 avoided. In north dakota, we can give you a liquid fuel with zero carbon in it for $60. So we are doing that today with carbon sequestration for biofuels.
▶ 1:44:53Sen. Cortez Masto: I know my time is up and I look forward to talking about this. Thank you.
▶ 1:44:57Chair Lee: Senator hoeven.
▶ 1:45:00Sen. Hoeven: I think that demonstrates a high level discussion that governor burgum brings to these issues. He really will work through these issues and applies a real analytical approach to problem-solving. I think that it's important for both sides of the aisle. I think that is something people will appreciate about him. Federal law requires on public lands there be multiple use.
▶ 1:45:26Sen. Hoeven: Recently the bl men -- blm promulgated violations of that law. Do you support multiple use on federal lands? I know you do but I willing to express it for the record. Tell us why it is so important to have multiple use on public lands, not just our state, but across the country.
▶ 1:45:47Gov. Burgum: The answer is obviously yes but this is the public lands, particularly when talk about aspects of bom, this is essential for our economies and whether that is grazing rights that were part of this, whether it is recreation opportunities and access, whether it is timber or whether it is oil and gas and mineral production that supports local economies and supports our country, this is -- this land was put away for the benefit,
▶ 1:46:18Gov. Burgum: Use, and enjoyment of the american people. Not every acre of federal land is a national park or wilderness area. Some of those areas we have to absolutely protect your precious step with the rest of it this is america's. I think every american during the presidential campaign finds out, gets pounded into the head we have $36 trillion of debt.
▶ 1:46:49Gov. Burgum: We never talk about the assets. The assets are the land and minerals. The department of interior has got close to 500 million acres of surface, 700 million acres subsurface and over 2 billion acres of offshore. That is the balance sheet of america. If we were a company, they would look at us and say, you are really restricting our balance sheet and you know those assets are worth? We don't.
▶ 1:47:16Gov. Burgum: I believe we ought to have a deep inventory of all of the assets in america. We have to understand, assets, 100 trillion, 200 trillion? We could be in great shape as a country. If you said, we had 200 trillion in asset sitting there and restrict access, don't cut a tree, don't use it for recreation, and then we don't develop the minerals sustainably and -- in a smart way, we are getting the superlow return for americans.
▶ 1:47:45Gov. Burgum: It is our responsibility to get a return for the american people. In north dakota, you started as governor. In our little state, we have a $12 billion endowment for k-12 for about 125,000 kids. An endowment bigger than most universities in the country for our k-12 system because we learned how to utilize the stuff and guess what? We still have among the cleanest air, cleanest water coming greatest recreation in the nation. This is the time of abundance.
▶ 1:48:15Gov. Burgum: We can do all of it.
▶ 1:48:19Sen. Hoeven: It is about working with people in all these different uses. That is true in working with -- in indian country on the reservations as well. Powering the local tribe to decide, make those decisions about how they use the land and all the beneficial ways that they can, right?
▶ 1:48:36Gov. Burgum: In our state, the three affiliated tribes, one of the great energy tribes in our country, these guys -- I say the hardest job in america is not being a governor or senator, the hardest job is a tribal chairman because you have a whole another layer of federal bureaucracy on top of you. They show up at mha and say, you guys are doing too much flaring. Then they say, we would not be if you would give us a permit to do a gas gathering line.
▶ 1:49:05Gov. Burgum: The same government that tells them they are flaring too much won't give them the permit to do the thing that we can do with the rest of the state so they get constrained.
▶ 1:49:16Sen. Hoeven: In addition to serving as secretary of interior , there is also the role as the leader of the national energy council. Very important. Talk for a minute come, go over a little but the chairman is a good guy, talk about how you implement a game plan and achieve that goal of energy dominance that president trump wants for this nation.
▶ 1:49:40Gov. Burgum: I don't want to get caught in making forward-looking statements because the council will be formed by an eeo, but I think the intention you can read in president trump's public statements are very simple. He wants to cut red tape. He wants to have more affordable energy for us. He wants to sell energy to our friend and ally so they don't have to buy from our adversaries. That is how we reduce tensions in the world. You have to make sure we are doing it in a smart way.
▶ 1:50:10Gov. Burgum: He talks all the time about clean air and clean water. He is basically talking about the approach we are talking about in this committee. This committee will be deeply involved in helping set those policies. It is in all of above, go get it done and stop getting in the way of ourselves as particularly with this ai battle, people don't understand what is coming right now with ai revolution will happen during president trump's term where we have generalized intelligence that we can manufacture.
▶ 1:50:40Gov. Burgum: It will affect our ability to compete with every other power. China, they permitted more than two coal plants a week in the first half of 2023. They are already the world's largest emitter. So we are competing against someone who is going to trade more electricity, produce more ai, and this is going to be how we loose the cold war with them. We are a country that believes in reclamation, following labor laws.
▶ 1:51:09Gov. Burgum: China -- child labor, no reclamation, don't care about the environment. Very tough competitor right now in terms of their ability to produce electricity. We have got to get going and cut red tape. We have to realize if you shut down U.S. energy production here -- it does not help the global environment. Somebody else produces it someplace else less cleaner than we do.
▶ 1:51:31Sen. Hoeven: Thank you.
▶ 1:51:31Chair Lee: Senator cantwell.
▶ 1:51:35Sen. Cantwell: Governor burgum, congratulations on your nomination. I hope to run through a couple of questions here so help me out with brevity if possible. I know the ranking member and maybe even the chairman brought up our beautiful outdoor economy, which we have heard from your senator that apparently you are a big outdoorsman yourself.
▶ 1:52:01Sen. Cantwell: Not only will he become a steward of over 20 percent of the land in the united states, but some of the most beautiful, iconic places in america. And these are an economic juggernaut. They are in my state if you think about mount rainier or olympic national park or any other places. The outdoor wreck economy generates $1.2 trillion in economic output every year. $1.2 trillion. It accounts for 5 million jobs.
▶ 1:52:31Sen. Cantwell: I believe continues to grow at an incredible rate. Would think about economic development in some of our more rural communities, it does not take a lot at a little infrastructure in the next thing you are off to the races as to making a tourism and economic impact to this economy. I think in north dakota, it was your third largest industry, generating $1 billion and 14,000 jobs. You created an office of outdoor recreation. Good for you. I think you get it.
▶ 1:53:02Sen. Cantwell: But now when we talk about this -- first I want to make sure on the public lands, we support more input in outdoor recreation economies and gateway communities? Will you fully utilize the lw cf and support the conservation legacies bills we have passed?
▶ 1:53:23Gov. Burgum: Of course, first of all on your comment on outdoor recreation, I agree completely on the importance of this. It is also good for the health of americans. One thing we understand this we just need more people to get off their devices and get outdoors, get engaged, understand the importance of our land, wildlife , all the aspects of it. Again, we are facing a mental health and addiction crisis in our country.
▶ 1:53:53Gov. Burgum: Part of the answer is, for many people, getting that connection to outdoors. I will support that completely and look forward to working with you on your other issues as well.
▶ 1:54:05Sen. Cantwell: So you support the lwcf.
▶ 1:54:07Gov. Burgum: Some of those acronyms I am less familiar with so I look forward to learning more about them.
▶ 1:54:16Sen. Cantwell: We will get you a question for the record because it is vitally important. We think we have broke through finally. I am asking this as a lead up to the next question. You are for this aggressive oil and lease strategy I think, or maybe you're going to take this helm with a group of people and say we need to do more on the oil and gas. Part of our efforts have been to show these federal lands are very important in an outdoor economy.
▶ 1:54:43Sen. Cantwell: How many areas that we have already leased for oil and gas that aren't being used, why don't we start there? Why don't we start with those? The lease is already there?
▶ 1:54:54Gov. Burgum: I would use the term I was for aggressive, I am for following the law. The current administration in north dakota for the first time since harry truman, the quarterly these sales were not held as required by law. Did not happen for two years. We ended up having to sue the federal government just to follow the law. I think the starting places for us to go back -- follow the law.
▶ 1:55:24Gov. Burgum: And then we always would you prioritize those areas that have the most resource opportunity with the least impact on lanes that are important. I think that is pretty simple formula to figure that out given the scale of the amount of public lands we have. We can do a lot more without touching or even being visible to any of the people that are concerned --.
▶ 1:55:54Sen. Cantwell: So you would prioritize existing leases.
▶ 1:55:57Gov. Burgum: Not sure I understand.
▶ 1:56:01Sen. Cantwell: , "oh, let's expend more leases that we don't have right now." I'm sure we can get into a very long discussion here about -- I was in for expanding oil and gas leasing into bear's ears. It is a beautiful protected area. I personally think the outdoor economy as a juggernaut. I don't want to -- I don't want offshore drilling off the coast of washington.
▶ 1:56:27Sen. Cantwell: Why in god's name would I -- cascadia fault line. I could have devastation to an economy that is paying dividends. Why would I want to do that? I'm saying one of the things that would be helpful to hear from you is that you believe in prioritizing on federal land the leases that are already there as a poster now going and saying, ok, let's look at a big map and open up all federal land to new leasing. Your point about a fish eggs -- your point about efficiency, go after what you already have.
▶ 1:56:57Gov. Burgum: Before I can make an affirmative statement I agree with you, have to understand. What I've seen is my time as governor is not that we have existing but we are restricting legal access for development or oil and gas or whatever on public lands today by illegally not holding the leases that should have been held.
▶ 1:57:21Sen. Cantwell: My time is up and I'm in the red so I will get cut off. We will submit something for you and for the record on that. I'm sure I will submit something on fire and clt that may be you and I can have a discussion about what I think really would help us move forward on some of those issues. For the record come on tribal sovereignty, you believe in tribal sovereignty, tribal consultation which does not mean you just pick up the phone and have one conversation.
▶ 1:57:50Sen. Cantwell: Tribal confrontation means you, and the federal government says, so much money needs -- tribal consultation means you figure out the plan for that to happen.
▶ 1:57:57Gov. Burgum: Tribal consultation to be as governor of north dakota has meant spending time going to the tribes, listening -- sometimes for hours -- to really understand what the issues are and getting to people ahead of time and then working on things that are important. Law enforcement. Some of the scarcest and most devastating law enforcement in this country right now is the lack of agents on federal land.
▶ 1:58:28Gov. Burgum: Some of the tribal reservations have become harbors for criminal organizations because they know we don't have enough resource there and then our local county sheriff's and a state police in many cases did not have jurisdiction. Health care is another.
▶ 1:58:41Sen. Cantwell: Thank you so much for that answer. I appreciate that. That is the kind of stewardship we need with our partnership between us in indian country. Thank you.
▶ 1:58:52Chair Lee: Senator murkowski now. I want to interject, there is no significant oil in the beer's ears. There is no plan to drill for oil in the beer's ears. I'm not aware of any significant will reserves. There are cattle that graze in that area for recreational purposes, the things that go on. I don't know who came up with this idea that somebody's getting ready to drill in the beer's ears national monument. It is paranoid fantasy. It is not anything.
▶ 1:59:23Chair Lee: The dispute here is about the process by which it was designated. Unilateral presidential action taken without consultation and to the extent there was any input, it was negative input. In a way that affects their access to recreation, their ability to continue to graze their cattle as they have. Let's keep the facts straight.
▶ 1:59:47Sen. Cantwell: Happiness you don't want to drill there.
▶ 1:59:50Chair Lee: There is no oil, so.
▶ 1:59:57Sen. Murkowski: We have oil. It is good to see you and it is good to have these robust conversations. As you and I discussed part of our challenge in alaska is not lack of resource. Whether it is oil or gas, coal. Whether it is our renewables with everything from wind, geothermal, even solar, tidal power. We have it all.
▶ 2:00:28Sen. Murkowski: Our big challenge as you know is access. It has been noted there are several states that the department of interior has probably a disproportionate impact. It does not to my heart any good to oftentimes refer to the secretary of interior as alaska's landlord. But we pretty much have to go to interior to ask for permission to do anything. And this is regardless of what our statehood compact says.
▶ 2:00:57Sen. Murkowski: Regardless of what the laws that have direct impact to us. It is good to be able to have a conversation with you as the nominee for the department of interior and knowing you have the scope of knowledge and experience you bring to these issues.
▶ 2:01:21Sen. Murkowski: I love the fact you are talking about america's balance sheet, including assets that we have such as lands and minerals. Part of the challenge we have in alaska is often times when we talk about our nation's inventory of assets, we are not on the map. We are not included in the surveys. And we are told, well, it is going to be hard to assess that.
▶ 2:01:50Sen. Murkowski: Well, yes, but look at it from the business perspective. Just because it is hard to assess your assets, you think you're going to get them off of that ledger come off of that balance sheet? As we are talking about these, recognize we not only have what we know we have, we probably have three and four and five and 10 times more, we just need to be able to do that assessment. So looking forward to that kind of engagement with you.
▶ 2:02:20Sen. Murkowski: We have a lot of work to do with -- at the department of interior. You and I have had a chance to go over many of these issues. ,, but again so much of it is about access. The first question that I'm going to ask where the first commitment I'm going to ask of you is one that I can guarantee that nobody around this panel has mentioned, and this has to do with polar bears.
▶ 2:02:48Sen. Murkowski: The biden administration has done a lot of things that most alaskans don't appreciate. Last week, we added another thing to the list. We learned interior is not going to finish its revised incidental regulations, trs. Going to leave this very routine renewal of current letters of authorization as unfinished business.
▶ 2:03:15Sen. Murkowski: When you leave those authorizations as unfinished business, it means the business of what is going on in the north slope is put on hold. I need your commitment that you will work with alaskans, particularly the north slope borough, basically all things polar bear.
▶ 2:03:37Gov. Burgum: I will be happy to do that. As you know better than anyone, senator, I think close to have the land and subsurface and offshore that interior controls is in alaska. Interior, you may view as a landlord, I would view alaska is one of the biggest assets this country has and one of the biggest responsibility of interior and look forward to working with you.
▶ 2:04:05Sen. Murkowski: That is what I was hoping you would say, recognizing the significance there. I don't want the department of interior to be a landlord. I want you to be a partner. I want you to be a partner with us as we determine how we achieve a balance that we talked about in this committee. Because we are just as proud of our outdoor activities. You had an opportunity firsthand. I love your story about the time you spent in alaska.
▶ 2:04:33Sen. Murkowski: We welcome you back anytime, all the time. We have been able to access our resources whether it is timber or oil and still provide for a place that most would say, this is where I want to go before I die type of location. I think we are doing something right.
▶ 2:04:57Sen. Murkowski: I need to alert you as well as my colleagues, when we talk about abundance, we have it in alaska. But when you cannot access it, we are now in a situation in my state where in the south-central portion, we are pretty much 75%, 80% of the people are living in this region where the energy -- the natural gas we have been relying on his dwindling in its supply.
▶ 2:05:27Sen. Murkowski: We are talking as we speak about building import terminal to import liquefied natural gas from canada to keep the lights on and to keep homes warm in alaska. Where we have unquantifiable reserves of natural gas. We just need to figure out how we're going to be able to commercialize this.
▶ 2:05:51Sen. Murkowski: We need the help to unleash the opportunities that we have to not only allow alaska to have that energy independence that we so rightfully should have, but also to be able to help not only our country but our friends and allies. We have had plenty of time to talk about it.
▶ 2:06:16Sen. Murkowski: I'm hoping we will have another round because I don't want to submit questions to the record for you, I want the opportunity to be able to put it out on the record. Good to be able to welcome you here. You did not have to answer any of that. I just need you to come back to alaska soon. >> I'm going to yield to the senior senator of california.
▶ 2:06:38Sen. Padilla: Governor, good to see you. Greetings to your wife. We can't do the jobs we do without the support of our spouses. My time is limited. Not sure if we have a second round as there are number of issues I'm going to try to get to. If I don't, I will be submitting questions for the record come issues like travel sovereignty -- tribal sovereignty that is come up before. Public lands, we have had recent progress.
▶ 2:07:17Sen. Padilla: Let me begin with some of the more urgent questions and issues. Los angeles specifically. As we have all seen the devastation of recent fires in southern california, as we speak today, more than 40,000 acres burned. 12,000 structures plus destroyed with more than two dozen people who have perished will stop that number is probably going to grow.
▶ 2:07:46Sen. Padilla: It is been one of the most destructive natural disasters in los angeles history. As governor, had an experience, not at this scale, but 2024 you requested for the assist students for the historic wild -- assistance for the historic wildfires. President bynum as I understand approved it quickly and without conditions. Is that correct?
▶ 2:08:09Gov. Burgum: Yes.
▶ 2:08:12Sen. Padilla: Of jubilee federal disaster aid should come without conditions? -- do you believe federal disaster aid should come without conditions?
▶ 2:08:20Gov. Burgum: First of all, let me say I want to extend on behalf of catherine and I come our empathy and sympathy to anybody who has lost her home, lost their lives, lost a loved one. We have friends that have lived in the area that have lost their homes, homes they raised her kids in for 30 years. Every piece of memorabilia, memory that they had is gone. Only getting out with their shirt on their back.
▶ 2:08:50Gov. Burgum: Talking to those individuals directly. As it happens, our daughter was in l.a. For an event. The event was canceled. Catherine had flown out. They had to evacuate as the fires were approaching that part of the city. Our family, part of our family saw it firsthand. Again, it is -- bourbon wildfire is something we as a country -- in each situation is different.
▶ 2:09:18Gov. Burgum: North dakota was largely rural grasslands.
▶ 2:09:22Sen. Padilla: Please comment my constituents, friends and relatives of your family. For the record, strings attached to disaster relief and I certainly hope this is not the first case -- no strings attached to disaster relief and I certainly hope this is not the first case.
▶ 2:09:44Sen. Padilla: As this plays out in congress, if you're fortunate enough to be confirmed as interior secretary, you would not be the one deciding whether or not to grant disaster declarations but the department, particularly wildfire response, would you commit to responding to every disaster with his mentor support and resources possible regardless of which state or jurisdiction the disaster is in?
▶ 2:10:12Gov. Burgum: Absolutely. We have got to commit, maybe it will take apparently the fire in maui was a big enough, and that was horrible, lives lost and devastation, it did not create a national federal response or collaboration of states with this incredible -- the largest ever went dollars come up come this could be the most expensive wildfire, bourbon wildfire in the history of the country.
▶ 2:10:43Gov. Burgum: Probably a time for all of us to say what can we be doing differently? I'm excited that tim sheehy come the first that I know of that has worked as a professional firefighter on wildfire. I know he and others are working to come up with a solution.
▶ 2:11:02Sen. Padilla: They are already working on some proposals on a bipartisan basis to improve to help them and in situations like these.
▶ 2:11:12Gov. Burgum: We also have to look -- it goes back to the grid. Wildfire, you need oxygen, fuel load, a spark. In both cases in north dakota and whatever when you have high winds, sparks can come from above line parlance coming in contact with vegetation. We have to think about the grid.
▶ 2:11:37Sen. Padilla: And you have to have appreciation, knowledge, and experience. Red flag conditions is something new to people across the country but not new to those in the very dry west. I want to get at least one other issue and on the record. Last session I began another bipartisan effort was senator daines to permanently protect the pay increases for federal firefighters that congress previously approved.
▶ 2:12:07Sen. Padilla: Side note, currently about 1000 brave federal firefighters that are part of the tremendous response, not just locals come not just state firefighters, but a number of jurisdictions including federal firefighters. If confirmed, are you committed to supporting wildland firefighters? Recruitment and retention challenges a number of reasons, but compensation has been one of them.
▶ 2:12:33Gov. Burgum: It is a dangerous and very hard job but it is an essential job. I know from my own recent experience, this was just october, first week of october, we lost two lives in north dakota as part of these raging wildfires that were tearing across the prairie. I had a chance immediately after that to meet with local volunteers and local firefighter units. Our national guard that was out.
▶ 2:13:05Gov. Burgum: Including a lot of citizens that jumped in as they did in california to try to save their own homes. I think we all have a greater appreciation for that role. I think we need to have a better, more sophisticated response than we have right now because, again, this is a thing we need to recognize that there is rural firefighting and then there is urban. I think the l.a. Example shows there are things we have to do differently going forward.
▶ 2:13:31Sen. Padilla: In closing, a number of issues will follow up with questions unless we do get a second round, but senator hickenlooper, thank you for a long way to jump the line, we will introduce important negotiations with colorado river that need to stay consensus driven in the years ahead and recognition.
▶ 2:13:59Sen. Padilla: We need federal and state agencies working collaboratively to tackle resource issues, especially water will stop in california, we have the central valley project, a federal system, state water project -- interconnected.
▶ 2:14:17Sen. Padilla: I introduced that to you and look forward to working with you on the water management challenges that we will have to address together going forward, particularly the federal biological opinions that have been carefully corrected -- crafted and aim to be maintained.
▶ 2:14:37Chair Lee: Senator cassidy.
▶ 2:14:39Sen. Cassidy: Thank you for doing the job. We come from oil and gas producing states. One of my top priorities has been to use federal state ready -- revenue sharing on oil and gas lands to help rebuild louisiana's coastline. During this time of this hearing we would have lost several football fields worth of coastline which makes us more vulnerable to a hurricane hitting.
▶ 2:15:09Sen. Cassidy: Last congress I am pleased to say the rise act passed by voice vote. I am hoping we do that again. Can you briefly speak to the importance of revenue-sharing to north dakota knowing that on the federal lands of north dakota there is revenue that helps mitigate whatever negative impact that might have?
▶ 2:15:27Gov. Burgum: Absolutely and federal revenue goes two ways. We have a portion of the lease coming back to the state and then a portion goes back to the federal treasury and the federal treasury we talked earlier about the depth that we have in the responsible, sustainable and smart development whether onshore or offshore is a great benefit to conservation and in your case, the coastline.
▶ 2:15:56Gov. Burgum: It could also help pay for other things. In our state the revenues coming in are helping pay for education, health care and roads.
▶ 2:16:03Sen. Cassidy: It is kind of a middle-class, if you well and lower economic class beneficial -- benefit program because those things are touching services directly. Asides from the jobs being created to impact their lives.
▶ 2:16:19Gov. Burgum: And then when done effectively and appropriately it lowers the burden of sales tax and property tax and income tax.
▶ 2:16:28Sen. Cassidy: Music to my ears. I will say that when I speak to the folks who do these developments one fellow said when they had a lease sale I could plan a fishing trip with my son at the same time because it was so regular. It was going to be on the state -- this date at this time.
▶ 2:16:48Sen. Cassidy: So I want to say that now, there has been practices instituted, not for the sake of anything other than dilatory and to increase the cost of development. Can I get a commitment from you as much as you possibly do that when you have lease sales they will be scheduled so that the people making these decisions have certainty to them?
▶ 2:17:11Gov. Burgum: As someone who is participating in a lawsuit suing the federal government to try and get them to hold the lease sales when they were supposed to be held by law, you can count that as head of interior we will be following the law when it comes to lease sales.
▶ 2:17:27Sen. Cassidy: The operative statement is following the law and that is a good thing. On that, some federal lands from before modern environmental standards those have abandoned oil and gas wells leaking methane. I am interested in working on a bicameral basis on how we can have a federal program that is taking to cap these wells and louisiana has about 1500.
▶ 2:17:58Sen. Cassidy: Any thoughts on that because I am sure that north dakota had to address this issue as well?
▶ 2:18:01Gov. Burgum: In north dakota we took part of the revenues coming in from the oil and gas tax and created an abandoned well wreck remain -- reclamation fund. That is replenished and goes back in. We are also making sure that the private sector is going to do their fair share.
▶ 2:18:21Sen. Cassidy: One thing I hear is the issue of liability protection. Will they be sued if something goes bad about this remediation of the abandoned oil and gas well? And I do not know the answer and we are trying to explore that. There are the abandoned mine provisions that we looked at. How did you manage that in north dakota?
▶ 2:18:46Gov. Burgum: We were looking for incentives to make sure that the private sector was willing to participate as opposed to afraid. You are describing this thing where if you get unlimited liability it might want to run the way -- run the other way and lawyer up as opposed to getting the appropriate bond levels that are economic they pay those upfront and we exhaust those and figure out the other payments.
▶ 2:19:13Gov. Burgum: We have been able to work collaboratively in a way to make sure that the private sector is doing their share. And doing a part of the share. If they were not investing in creating the well and putting in the people and doing the development and taking the risk we would not have the revenue to split up.
▶ 2:19:30Sen. Cassidy: We are going to look at what we did in north dakota. One more thing, you will be in charge of this how do we do energy with sort of thing. One thing I'm concerned about is countries like china do not enforce international standards on controlling pollution which lowers the cost of manufacturing as low as 20%, incentivizing manufacturers to move there. That then you get the loss of the jobs but all of the air pollution that then blows over to the west coast.
▶ 2:20:00Sen. Cassidy: I think I read when he percent of the socks in california are related to emissions from china. One of the things I have been proposing with senator graham as my cosponsor as a foreign pollution fee that would put a fee on products from china equal to the voided costs of not complying with environmental regulations. As a president speaks about tariffs, this would be thoroughly defensible as we discussed something called externalities.
▶ 2:20:32Sen. Cassidy: I slept in a holiday inn last night, I know that word. I would go through that making sure that our industry is competitive in terms of controlling emissions in accordance with the law, which then gives us the advantage relative to the competitors. Any quick comment because the chair is being generous and allowing me extra time.
▶ 2:20:52Gov. Burgum: You are spot on to recognize president trump with a willingness to use tariffs. His principle is reciprocity. If you have access to our markets and we do not have access to yours or if you are dumping in this case or not doing reclamation or using child labor and doing all of the things that lower their cost that is the kind of place that he had spoken about that he would want reciprocity with tariffs.
▶ 2:21:22Sen. Cassidy: Thank you.
▶ 2:21:23Chair Lee: Senator hickenlooper.
▶ 2:21:26Sen. Hickenlooper: Thank you for this and it is good to have other governors in the room or former governors at this point. I will have three questions and I'll be quick and I will try to be polite that if I override you it is because I want to get to all three. I worked on methane regulations when I was governor. We were the first province anywhere in the world to regulate methane but we did it by working with the industry. They help create the regulations that were going to guide them.
▶ 2:21:58Sen. Hickenlooper: Senator cassidy was talking about abandoned wells and it is part of the same problem. As secretary of the interior how do you think you could use your authority to advance rules that will boost innovation in the energy sector to, let's reduce methane is one thing but what about the question getting to a better and cleaner energy at the same time reliable at a low cost?
▶ 2:22:20Gov. Burgum: Mayor, governor, senator, I love this question because the focus on innovation. We have seen in north dakota, again federal regulation comes in and it is proposed and goes to the real changing and it takes years to get it finalized and then it gets finalized and all of a sudden you have a federal employee in a white pickup with a clipboard driving around that the taxpayers are paying for trying to find out if
▶ 2:22:51Gov. Burgum: We have emissions. Meanwhile if that 68 years from the beginning of the problem to when the rule gets finalized and is enforced we have gone through four or five cycles.
▶ 2:22:58Sen. Cassidy: Skip to the innovation.
▶ 2:23:01Gov. Burgum: We have gone through four or five cycles and then we have a solution saying we can do methane capture cheaply and they implement it and they can capture it and turn it into electricity and do power generation for a data center on-site on a well site. The amount of innovation that is incur -- that is occurring is unbelievable. It is exciting as anything going on and that is why a say innovation overregulation.
▶ 2:23:29Gov. Burgum: We can solve them cheaper, faster, quicker than through outdated regulations.
▶ 2:23:33Sen. Hickenlooper: We never needed more innovation in such a short time as right now. As the energies are on the others, there are reports on tariffs on minerals and everything from -- and a lot of people are saying different things.
▶ 2:23:49Sen. Hickenlooper: In terms of imposing tariffs without having a clear strategy on how to secure supply chains for these critical minerals essential to our defense and aerospace industry, what is your plan to collaborate with our allies to make sure that we can ensure a reliable supply chain?
▶ 2:24:06Gov. Burgum: I think the key is allies because, we need to -- we have to have our sick -- a security network of people who are truly allies and buy and sell from each other around critical minerals. Over the last 20 years, as a nation, we were one of the great mining economies in the world 20 years ago and it became a dirty world -- dirty word and you can hardly find a kid that wants to go into geology.
▶ 2:24:35Sen. Hickenlooper: You are hurting me.
▶ 2:24:37Gov. Burgum: You were there.
▶ 2:24:38Sen. Hickenlooper: I am a geologist.
▶ 2:24:42Gov. Burgum: But you understand how that has shifted in your lifetime and we have to bring it back because it is critical to our nation's future. When we can do it better, cleaner and safer we are helping the world environment when we do it in the united states.
▶ 2:24:57Sen. Hickenlooper: I agree completely that we are the ones that are going to create a better way to extract minerals with less pollution and risk. Last question. Obviously public lands are a key part of colorado just like north dakota. I commend you and I think what you did as I governor, you took a lot of what we did and did it better. It is frustrating but we give credit when credit is due.
▶ 2:25:25Sen. Hickenlooper: We have certain places in colorado and we discussed this in my office last week and I appreciate you taking the time to spend an hour with us. We had some places where local government and the local community and the ranchers have joined side-by-side to protect lands. We have one part of land, a piece of land called the thompson divide. It has been somewhat controversial.
▶ 2:25:50Sen. Hickenlooper: There is one oil company that felt like there was potential and I took a deep look and could not see much source or potential. But it has been controversial. I want to make sure to extend the invitation that you come to colorado which I'm sure everyone else have said that they are looking forward to it but to walk the landscape with the local ranchers and farmers to get a sense that this is not a partisan issue but a piece of land that pretty much everybody
▶ 2:26:21Sen. Hickenlooper: In the community has decided needed to be protected.
▶ 2:26:23Gov. Burgum: I appreciate the invitation and I would look forward to it. Thank you.
▶ 2:26:28Sen. Hickenlooper: I yield the floor.
▶ 2:26:30Chair Lee: Senator risch.
▶ 2:26:32Sen. Risch: I cannot tell you how glad it is to see a governor for this position. We and particularly, coming from western mississippi, if you look at this committee it is a former governors club and there are a lot of us on here.
▶ 2:26:51Sen. Risch: We have meetings time to time and hoeven takes up most of time trying to commence is that there is a z in bizon, and we cannot find it. Because of the fact that most of our western states are so -- have so much federal land, it is important that we have somebody who understands those issues. Thank you for that and thank you for the job. They had a discussion about grizzly bears. They kill people.
▶ 2:27:21Sen. Risch: The federal government already gave us wolves and they -- we had them all off kille -- all of them killed off and some decided to have -- bring them back and they brought us 30 wolves and suddenly they were almost 200 and five the time I became governor there were at least 1500 wolves. Nobody knows how many reading pears and we cannot get them delisted until I got back here and I was able to put together a coalition.
▶ 2:27:49Sen. Risch: Grizzly bears are so far much over the top kill people. They really do. And they do not mesh with society. In any event, we will look forward to working with you on those issues.
▶ 2:28:06Sen. Risch: One of the most important decisions that you will make in the immediate future is I know how the transition team is working and you and the transition team will pick a blm director and that is important because all of us who are western states have a tremendous amount of blm land and we had a problem with them and fortunately she has 95 hours left. She was an eco terrorist and engaged in the work that was done in idaho spiking trees.
▶ 2:28:37Sen. Risch: You probably know about spiking trees. Since she has been bml director she has been up here once in the four years. It divided this committee deeply and we had a huge fight and it was a straight party-line vote. She got confirmed. We do not want somebody like that running the blm and someday we cannot find. I urge you to use your best decision-making ability when you choose that person.
▶ 2:29:03Sen. Risch: On another important issue, the issue for us in idaho right now is the lava reach windmill project and my good friend and I have different views on windmills and bless you for taking the windmills, you can have them all. We hate them. They are a tremendous blight on our view scape. We do not like them.
▶ 2:29:29Sen. Risch: And the new green deal that this administration has put together is trying to settle us with 100,000 acres, 100,000 acres with 241 windmills on them that are a little higher than the space needle. And the good news is I appreciate you meeting with me and listening to how wrong this project is on so many different levels.
▶ 2:29:58Sen. Risch: The good news is, and you do not know this yet, I do not think. It only has about 95 hours left on the table and that will go by the by. Believe me, in idaho this is a 99-1% issue. And we will be so glad to see it gone and you will not have to be worrying about it anymore. Let me just close with this.
▶ 2:30:25Sen. Risch: I am so glad you hear that the president will put you in this position on energy. That is incredible. We needed and we all know -- need it, and we all know the vision of making america independent. One word we have not used is nuclear. Idaho was the first place of nuclear energy in the universe and we have the first light bulbs we lit by generating nuclear energy. We built about 52 reactors at the site.
▶ 2:30:57Sen. Risch: I do not know if you have been to the national laboratory or not, what if you are in the energy business you need to. There is a tremendous, tremendous resurgence of interest in nuclear. The thing kind of went by the wayside after we had the unfortunate three mile island incident. But the renaissance of nuclear not just in america but around the world is staggering.
▶ 2:31:24Sen. Risch: Coming off the drawing boards at inl and in the very lire future are the more module -- and the near future are the modular followed by the micro reactors. That will change the world and I am glad that you talk about baseload. You talk about nuclear you are talking about baseload and I suspect the world going to the centrally -- through the century will rely as nuclear.
▶ 2:31:51Sen. Risch: My other hat, I deal with the eastern european countries that are entering contracts and view it as a national security issue because we compete with china, and russia and to a degree, france, when these new projects are coming on board. Thank you for what you are doing and god bless you. We welcome you.
▶ 2:32:15Chair Lee: Senator gallego.
▶ 2:32:19Sen. Kelly: ? -- Sen. gallege
▶ 2:32:26Sen. Kelly: ? -- Sen. galleggo: thank you for coming into my office. One of the biggest issues is a colorado writ of -- river and it is at the heart of our ship making, agriculture of safety and the home of the fifth-largest and best city in the country. In addition, 22 of the 30 basin tribes are in arizona.
▶ 2:32:46Sen. Kelly: So rules governing the reductions of the colorado river expire at the end of 2026 and post 2026 operation conversations are still ongoing. The river basin states have put forward a proposal for management that shares the risk among all states. No agreement has been reached and leading to potential conflicts within the basin, which we would like to avoid.
▶ 2:33:14Sen. Kelly: Would you work with arizona party is in my office so that any termination is not overly burdensome to any one state and is consistent with the colorado river compact?
▶ 2:33:24Gov. Burgum: Senator, you bring up an important issue and this is with the 2026 date looming coming forward and I will say that the interior has some specific authority is relative to helping with the lower and upper basin. I will say as a former chair of western governors this has been a battle going on as long as there have been people, fighting over water in the west.
▶ 2:33:52Gov. Burgum: My experience has been more on the missouri river basin but we have been in some battles with canada because we have two rivers that flow north into canada, the red river of the north and whether it is international or the complex areas -- complexities in the missouri I have good understanding and exposure. I think that you can count on that we will work on a collaborative solution that serves everyone.
▶ 2:34:19Gov. Burgum: We will also have to look for innovation on ways of the conservation side because we cannot make more water and if we use what we have wisely we will look at the best solutions for all. I appreciate you are engaged in this and I know how important it is for arizona and the economy.
▶ 2:34:34Sen. Gallego: We also discussed a lot about the tribal communities and nations and I am glad that you have good background and relationships with them. And we talk about tribal law enforcement and some of the bills I have put forward to increase tribal law enforcement but we see high rates of missing and murdered women as well as other violent crimes.
▶ 2:34:58Sen. Gallego: Whether this is due to a lack of tribal law enforcement and communications with agencies that are supposed to have oversight and collaboration. I have worked through my time to increase the funding for tribal law enforcement but the federal budget cuts put all that work at risk.
▶ 2:35:16Sen. Gallego: So, can you tell me or think about what is your plan to work collaboratively with congress and tribes across the country on tribal law enforcement and proven efforts and how do you plan to ensure to do this in a bipartisan manner?
▶ 2:35:29Gov. Burgum: There is nothing partisan about enforcing the law and protecting citizens of the united states. One of the great tragedy of our century is the lack of law enforcement and the fact we have organized crime preying on those -- on the gaps and they are aware that they are there. Whether it is the training senators, senator hoeven has been supportive along with senator cramer.
▶ 2:35:58Gov. Burgum: We do not have enough training centers for the northern and southern tribes. We need more recruiting and staffing and other things going on. But you mentioned the first time it has come up but the missing and murdered indigenous women. This is an unseen tragedy in america. The fbi list is over 6000 unsolved cases. And I believe again that it is a complete tragedy.
▶ 2:36:26Gov. Burgum: It seems like we lose a college do not spring break it is a netflix series and the whole nation knows their name. And then we have the same individual tragedies that happen in indian country and people are not aware that it is going on. We have to change our entire approach.
▶ 2:36:40Sen. Gallego: Unfortunately in the last four years and thank you again for that and I look forward for working with you on that and there is a lot of sense of history on the house side. The last four years we learned that glenn canyon dam has design flaws that limits its ability to pass water at lower elevations which means we have to fix that pretty soon so we need the ability to pass water around the dam if we cannot go through it.
▶ 2:37:09Sen. Gallego: Especially if the hydrology in the region gets worse. How would you make fixing a dam that delivers water to the grand canyon and the 3 million downstream from that basin and mexico as part of treaty obligations a priority?
▶ 2:37:23Gov. Burgum: I appreciate you bringing that to my attention. This was one issue I was not aware of about the glen canyon dam deficiencies. Obviously, with the bureau of reclamation being the second largest operator of hydroelectric dams behind the army corps of engineers I will be quickly meeting with the team five the privilege of being confirmed for this position about this issue because we have to have working facilities on
▶ 2:37:54Gov. Burgum: These critical rivers. As we know we have to have more reservoir capability because part of the issue we are facing is not only we need to fix but upgrade so that we can have more storage.
▶ 2:38:02Gov. Burgum: I would love to work with that --
▶ 2:38:04Sen. Gallego: I would love to work with that person.
▶ 2:38:07Chair Lee: Senator hyde-smith.
▶ 2:38:20Sen. Hyde-Smith: I am probably the last person. I enjoy the sincerity that you had most of all your capabilities. You are so capable for this position and I am very thankful to you and your family that you are willing to do this. I am going to be brief, but one of the things that we talked about in my office was the mississippi bank. To understand the rest of the world you must understand a place like mississippi.
▶ 2:38:50Sen. Hyde-Smith: We are blessed with the national park service is that we have and we have several sites that contribute to tourism, the economy of the state, and we work with them very closely with public-private partnerships and vicksburg now is working on a visitor center with the state of mississippi public-private partnerships and vicksburg national military park, friends of the park.
▶ 2:39:18Sen. Hyde-Smith: So we want to make sure that that continues and matches the two enhanced state own -- and to complement the natches state own site. And I would ask to commit to these particular projects and vicksburg and natchez.
▶ 2:39:43Gov. Burgum: Thank you and first of all I want to thank you for your capabilities. It is great to have a senator who grew up in agriculture and was the agriculture commissioner and that was fantastic. My family was involved in agriculture my entire life and many of my cousins are. It is such an important part of national security as well.
▶ 2:40:06Gov. Burgum: In terms of the national park thing, as we said earlier we have a big deferred maintenance issue and these are the pressure spots the billions of acres of surface and subsurface and offshore that we own. The national park is firm americans is a priority and we need to take care of the sites whether historic and others. We have to make sure they are capable of handling and supporting the visitors that want to see them. We know they are great for the local economy.
▶ 2:40:35Gov. Burgum: I appreciate the invitation and look forward.
▶ 2:40:37Sen. Hyde-Smith: I am going to go to the offshore oil and gas production in the gulf of mexico. Of course it plays a vital role in the gulf state economy. We call it the blue economy. The anchor platform, it has recently come online with the gulf of mexico but it will produce 75,000 barrels of oil per day, and this is refined in pascagoula.
▶ 2:41:06Sen. Hyde-Smith: And the jobs that it provides there and the benefits that we have, but it is important that the department maintain a steady leasing schedule to ensure that companies can continue the opportunities for exploration and production to support the affordable and reliable energy. The current national outer continental shelf oil and gas leasing plan or the five-year plan includes only three possible lease sales, a historic low.
▶ 2:41:36Sen. Hyde-Smith: Do you believe the current five-year plan is adequate to continue to meet the energy needs of the nation? If not, will it be a priority to develop or finalize a new five-year plan?
▶ 2:41:49Gov. Burgum: Senator, I think you know the long lead times it takes for the private sector to make the significant investments to do safe, secure and smart sophisticated offshore development. It is a really important part of our nation's economy and national security.
▶ 2:42:11Gov. Burgum: The fact that during the current administration they have been so unpredictable and disruptive and they are projecting forward to have the fewest we have ever had will almost guarantee that we will see a decline in energy production in offshore in the years ahead because of the lead times.
▶ 2:42:28Gov. Burgum: And knowing that we are in a national security battle in the way that we win and ensure america's future is that we have energy dominance, this is opposed to the president's direction. The president would be saying we have to be doing more smart development and not less. As I stated earlier with one of the questions we are suing the federal government because they were not holding the lawfully required sales.
▶ 2:42:59Gov. Burgum: Getting lease sales to be regular, predictable, and at a level that allows us to maintain energy production is a minimum standard.
▶ 2:43:07Sen. Hyde-Smith: Thank you for those answers and I cannot tell you how glad we are to have you. Thank you.
▶ 2:43:14Chair Lee: Senator wyden.
▶ 2:43:17Sen. Wyden: I look forward to working with you and senator heinrich and we always work on these issues in a bipartisan way and I look forward to doing it again. I think you know from our visit in the office how strongly I feel about these clean energy tax credits. I wrote this package, $400 billion or so, the biggest investment in fighting climate change in american history. It uses carrots, not sticks.
▶ 2:43:53Sen. Wyden: The more you reduce tart -- reduce carbon your biggest taxes -- the bigger your tax savings. It is carbon driven and we reward technological neutrality. The reason that that is so important is that nobody knows what the big carbon reducers are going to be 30 years from now.
▶ 2:44:16Sen. Wyden: And so the reason I insisted on that provision is that it creates what I call an innovation lane, an opportunity to send a message to people about every possible type of energy use that you are going to have a chance, if you innovate, to be part of a bright future.
▶ 2:44:37Sen. Wyden: Now I heard something and I am just counting on you to deny it, that maybe you were not as interested in this as I thought you were in the office. So, you seem kind of skeptical in some of the earlier discussion. I just hope, because you will be very influential in the whole administration on energy. I hope that we can work together on this.
▶ 2:45:06Sen. Wyden: As I believe that we will work together on a variety of other issues.
▶ 2:45:09Gov. Burgum: Senator, I enjoyed our discussion and then in the extra time we spent together. And as I said then and I restate now that I think your principles are sound about being technology neutral and having caret -- carrots vs sticks, and private sector versus just all government.
▶ 2:45:33Sen. Wyden: I should kick -- I should quit while I'm ahead.
▶ 2:45:36Gov. Burgum: That is good stuff. I do not specifically other comments that you have heard. I believe that these things might have been so successful as it relates to the electrical grid that we now have a significant imbalance in the amount of projects that are intermittent and not persistent that we need to make sure that for our country to be successful that we have to get back to making sure we have the appropriate amount of baseload to manage both beings.
▶ 2:46:05Gov. Burgum: If the sun is not shining and the wind is not blowing and we do not have baseload we have brownouts and back it -- and blackouts and higher electric prices. It is the balance of achieving that. And the other point which I might've said which I stand by is that it is great that people thought let us put massive incentives around ev's, electric vehicles, against fueled cars that have liquid fuels.
▶ 2:46:35Gov. Burgum: But in america if there is innovation neutrality, north dakota we are producing carbon negative oil and carbon neutral biofuels. Without -- america builds 200,000 gas stations without a dime of public money or taxpayer incentives because the market created that.
▶ 2:46:54Gov. Burgum: We have an opportunity to have innovation around decarbon icing liquid fuels -- decarbonizing liquid fuels. And then hopefully we will have enough to win.
▶ 2:47:10Sen. Wyden: I am of your view. There is a transmission issue and the two pieces left out is how to deal with electric and how to promote transmission. I am interested in working with you. I will take as I run back to the finance committee where we are talking about these issues, the view that you are open to continue working in this space rather than coming in and saying we are going to chuck it in the trashcan because I am always interested in improving on something.
▶ 2:47:41Sen. Wyden: The founding fathers said that a new congress is never bound by absolutely everything from a past congress. I am interested in improving it. But I'm going to take out of discussion that you are open to working with me and others in a bipartisan way. At one point this was a purely bipartisan effort and we can talk about what happened because I thought it was a question of who would get the credit. I'm going to take out of you that you will work with me.
▶ 2:48:08Gov. Burgum: You can count on that that I will and I will be anchored in two things, national security. We should not have incentives that enslave us from getting from dust critical minerals from a major power competitor like china and the other thing is that I will be focused on the economy and affordability because if we can do something for $60 a ton versus $900 a ton of avoided co2.
▶ 2:48:36Sen. Wyden: I am going to say that the idea of linking a lower carbon future with lower prices and the focus on national security is a kind of triangle with three sides and I can support and I would like to work with you. Thank you.
▶ 2:48:54Chair Lee: Senator barrasso.
▶ 2:48:57Sen. Barrasso: Congratulations and good to be with you again. As you know the federal government controls hundreds of millions of acres of land in the west and if you look at the committee in our home states and the well-being of my state relies on strong leadership at the department of the interior. It must work with states and local communities to manage the resources in a way that works for the people that live on the land.
▶ 2:49:22Sen. Barrasso: Over the last four years that has been a big problem as we see in administration that is just punishing the west. The will of the people who depend and live on the land and take care of the land has been ignored the last four years. There is a long list of things that I believe must be fixed and I will ask for your help. Barack swing -- the rock springs wyoming research management plan as you and I know and those will know about -- those who are watching will know about now.
▶ 2:49:51Sen. Barrasso: The bureau of land management finalized that in december, 2024. Not even a week after the governor submitted his appeal to the proposed plan but they rushed out the door. This will devastate the people of southwest wyoming. It will lock up millions of acres that local communities rely upon. The governor or state legislature and local communities all strongly opposed what the federal government is slamming down our throat.
▶ 2:50:20Sen. Barrasso: What you commit to working with my office to undo this plan?
▶ 2:50:22Gov. Burgum: Senator, I am familiar, having been governor until december 15 because we had a similar experience of having plans like this pushed on the state of north dakota. Absolutely, you can count on me working with you.
▶ 2:50:38Sen. Barrasso: In wyoming, two thirds of our minerals are owned by the federal government. Half of the surface land and two of the minerals under the land. That means like energy development depends on cooperation from the department of interior. The legislative leaders would benefit from meeting with you directly as I plan the energy future and I would ask you to commit to joining our wyoming delegation as well as the wyoming stakeholders to talk about the future.
▶ 2:51:06Gov. Burgum: I would enjoy that. I have enjoyed the relationship I have had with the wyoming governors where we have been in regular communication because there is a lot of shared challenges.
▶ 2:51:19Sen. Barrasso: Both of those current and former governors speak of you with great appreciation, admiration and respect. Buffalo, wyoming. The outgoing administration finalized a resource management plan for the field office. This would ban new coal leasing in the powder river basin which is the most energy rich area. We are america's energy breadbasket.
▶ 2:51:48Sen. Barrasso: This is an insult to the communities and harmful for american energy security. If confirmed would you work with me to reverse this plan.
▶ 2:51:54Gov. Burgum: Absolutely, and I know that when you talk about critical minerals that in that powder river coal include many critical minerals that we need for defense for technology and the future of this country. Rather than this blanket approach of trying to block that type of energy development, we need to be thinking about how innovation can help us solve problems at once.
▶ 2:52:19Sen. Barrasso: Oil and gas leases. The outgoing administration has a disgraceful record on oil and gas management. It blocked and locked our at every turn. It has not issued leases for a sale over -- held over four years ago and deferred over 600,000 acres from leasing that was previously cleared for oral and gas production. Would you work to quickly issue those leases and offer additional acres?
▶ 2:52:49Gov. Burgum: Absolutely and as I stated, north dakota has faced the same view of absolutely if there is a case in federal court which I am positive the ruling will be that the current administration did not follow the law relative to holding required to the sales.
▶ 2:53:05Sen. Barrasso: Sage grouse. We are the home to a large population of greater sage grouse and its habitat and for over 15 years it has been at the forefront of adopting new management approaches to protect the species. Our state has led successful efforts to balance conservation with economic develop men.
▶ 2:53:25Sen. Barrasso: The biden administration proposed to designate 600,000 acres in wyoming as "areas is critical environmental concern." that will hold production and develop mental cross the state. Be willing to reopen the greater sage grouse management?
▶ 2:53:42Gov. Burgum: I had been advised that the decision came out this morning and I do not want to put myself into making a statement that I would have to recuse. I would just say from my time as chairman of western governors I am familiar with the use of designations to try and restrict energy development, even when you might have a species that is neither on the endangered or threatened list.
▶ 2:54:09Sen. Barrasso: One you have finally done a lot on the grizzly bear so let us talk about federal grazing. The government is critical for managing federal land. Half of the land owned by the federal government is managed under multiple use and is required by law to be managed without impairment of the productivity of the land.
▶ 2:54:30Sen. Barrasso: These are public places that people depend on accessing for their livelihoods, agriculture and ranching activities and recreation and mineral development. Congress directed grazing, recreation and mineral production to take place on federal lands. Do you support the multiple use mandate, where the law mandates for federal land?
▶ 2:54:53Gov. Burgum: I do and since we have talked about wildfires today, raising reduces fuel load and timber management appropriately reduces fuel load. Service development can create roads paid for by the private sector that support firefighters. All of the multiple uses are part of a proponent of a comprehensive rethinking of how we thanks about fire management.
▶ 2:55:17Chair Lee: Senator cotton.
▶ 2:55:20Sen. Cotton: We reach the regrettable point that we often do where almost everything has been said but not everyone has said it. I will refrain from saying a lot of what has come before me but I will say I want to associate myself with the comments of my republican colleagues about the need for significantly increasing energy production while also being responsible stewards of our public lands and waters. There is one issue that I do not think has been discussed under the endangered species act.
▶ 2:55:52Sen. Cotton: And I think it is a scandal of the first-order and I'm surprised it has not gotten more attention. On january 3 the new york times published a story about the snail darter, a species designated by endangered back in the 1970's.
▶ 2:56:09Sen. Cotton: The entire thrust of the story is that age zoologist basically made up the species of snail darter all for the point of halting construction of the tellico dam on the lower tennessee river. After many years of delay it took an act of congress to build the dam.
▶ 2:56:28Sen. Cotton: An academic site said that this is a not uncommon practice, creating new species when there is no difference between other non-endangered species or what he called the downstream conservative -- conservation implications which is to say that activists creating species and calling them endangered to stop the construction of a dam or power generation plant or a housing development.
▶ 2:56:59Sen. Cotton: This was something that was admitted publicly in the new york times by some of the activists. I think it is a scandal of the first-order. Can I get your commitments in light of this to go back and re-examine endangered species act listings and identify other potential false designations?
▶ 2:57:17Gov. Burgum: You raise a very important issue which is the weaponize nation -- weaponization of federal rules but to do it in a way where it is being used not to protect wildlife that is being used to stop illegal activities like the multiple use scenario we were talking about.
▶ 2:57:39Gov. Burgum: It is just a legal weapon and it is used for fundraising and groups that are just trying to block our nation's progress. I agree with you completely. You mentioned "the new york times," if that article was someplace else at the fact that they wrote that is also remarkable admission of at least one case where there was abuse of the endangered species act relative to its intended use.
▶ 2:58:10Gov. Burgum: You can count on us.
▶ 2:58:10Sen. Cotton: I appreciate that but not in line with this public admission but also the west virginia case, there could be legal infirmity in a lot of federal bureaucracy past decisions. I appreciate your willingness to take a look at that once you are on the job. Thank you.
▶ 2:58:29Chair Lee: That concludes around one and we will do a quick round two with some follow-ups that a few members have asked. I want to talk to you briefly about the fact that public lands represent a massive public asset and yet a lack of inaccurate valuation is something -- the lack of a accurate valuation is something we do not have.
▶ 2:58:58Chair Lee: What steps would you take if confirmed as secretary to improve the transparency in this area and ensure federal land valuations reflect the value of the american people?
▶ 2:59:07Gov. Burgum: On the idea that we call america's balance sheet is something that the trump administration has quite a bit of enthusiasm and discussions with the treasury nominee, scott bessent and nominee howard love nick and even the speaker called me a few weeks ago and said what is this american balance sheet idea.
▶ 2:59:34Gov. Burgum: For our standing in the world and for us to talk nonstop about what our liabilities are, we should also be fluent as any business would be to talk about what the assets are. The assets of this country because of the care that we have given in particular to the public lands, the surface, subsurface and offshore and proven time and time again we can do it better, cleaner, and safer.
▶ 3:00:02Gov. Burgum: If I am a timber company and I own timberland and it has not been harvested I put that on my balance sheet. If I have planted young trees I put it at a different valuation. When we protect U.S. lands and then do not cut a tree and they burn down we not only produce enormous amounts of omissions and carbon, -- emissions and carbon but we wasted the asset.
▶ 3:00:30Gov. Burgum: It is part of our duty in the role if I am in the privilege of being nominated but all of us as elected officials to get a return on the nation's balance sheet for the benefit and use of the american people. So understanding that number is key. People say it will be really hard. It is hard to develop this. We did it in north dakota.
▶ 3:00:52Gov. Burgum: They said we had no way of knowing what the end development euros are and we found a young software company that figured out precisely what the future value of every one of the wells in north dakota public land would be worth. It has been used for estate planning. If grandma dies and she only has 10% of one well they can figure out the value. If we can do that there we can figure it out for the whole country. Just as I said, we are required as a nation to conduct a census within every 10 years.
▶ 3:01:24Gov. Burgum: That is hard work, but we figure out a way to do that. If congress that up and said every agency and bureau and every department of the united states government needs to figure out what the asset value is and then we get after it and we, with a number and then we can make these trade-offs.
▶ 3:01:42Gov. Burgum: When you do by executive order and take hundreds of millions of offshore subsurface out of leasing and then that is viewed as a costless event, at least we could have the trade-off of saying yes, some people thought it was important to take it off the table. But what did it mean for the american people? Should we take trillions of dollars of future revenue out of the pockets of future generations?
▶ 3:02:09Gov. Burgum: Creating a financial understanding where we could have an honest discussion about some of these executive actions that are happening at the end of this term would be useful for all americans to understand.
▶ 3:02:22Chair Lee: I appreciate that and I have another question that I was going to ask but in the interest of time I will just conclude with a very brief statement. The federal government came up with is about 50 years ago to help offset the burden that states carry it, states with a lot of public land because they do not get tax revenue from it.
▶ 3:02:43Chair Lee: In some parts of the country where there is a lot of public land this worked out ok and in other parts it is pennies on the dollar compared to what they would get if they could tax the land even at its lowest valuation and rate. I would love to talk to you about these reforms and making it a priority because any communities rely on it for fire, search and safety. Senator heinrich.
▶ 3:03:09Sen. Heinrich: Senator daines mentioned a very specific challenge with the endangered species act. As governor, you know that one of the best ways to head off those conflicts is to prevent species from ever being listed by recovering them through react -- proactive and voluntary conservation at the state level.
▶ 3:03:32Sen. Heinrich: Senator tillis and nine of his republican colleagues and I have a highly bipartisan bill called the recovering america's wildlife act that helps states do that. In fact, north dakota's former game and fish director was one of the architects of that legislation.
▶ 3:03:54Sen. Heinrich: It has strong support from the association of fish and wildlife agencies and from any of the conservation groups that you mentioned in your exchanged with senator justice. Does that sound like the kind of approach that you could work with senator tillis and I on?
▶ 3:04:09Gov. Burgum: Absolutely. I think that again, super sound principle. That is to do the work to keep it off of any kind of federal designation. Working collaboratively with the states. I had the pleasure of working with our game and fish conditioner for six of my eight years as governor. He had almost a 40 year career in wildlife management. It is people like that that I know and respect.
▶ 3:04:38Gov. Burgum: I know you have him in new mexico -- you have them in mexico -- in new mexico and utah. The people that work in game and fish at the state level that are working on these things, I have not met somebody from the federal level that flies into north dakota that cares more about the soil, air, fish and wildlife than the people at the state level. It sounds like you are entrusting it to the states where it belongs.
▶ 3:05:03Sen. Heinrich: It grew out of the idea of asking all of the agencies what is the right way to approach it. And they said instead of just having an emergency room which is what the endangered species act effectively is, let's try to give wildlife primary care and intervene when it is much cheaper and much more effective and you can really move the needle. You and I talked about tribal water settlements.
▶ 3:05:30Sen. Heinrich: Those are incredibly important for water certainty in the west, especially with all of the conflicts we have not just in the colorado basin but the rio grande and other western basins. If you are confirmed would you commit to continuing the department's work to both resolve legal claims around tribal water settlements, but also just implement the existing water settlements that have already been made?
▶ 3:05:59Gov. Burgum: You have my commitment to work on those. I am going to make one other quick statement. I know that you heard from my friend and colleague from idaho and we have done some great work on cleaning up abandoned mines.
▶ 3:06:17Gov. Burgum: We do not necessarily agree on when generation that I would sibley remind you that onshore wind is in the basket of multiple use so you can always hold it to the same standard as oil and gas, but you cannot legally at least unilaterally deny legally permitted -- permitted wind generation. With that, thank you for all of your answers today.
▶ 3:06:39Chair Lee: Senator king.
▶ 3:06:42Sen. King: First, I want to associate yourself with your comments on determining the asset value of what we own. It is astounding that does not exist. One of the things that we would contribute to is adequate maintenance budgets. If you know the asset value, there are standard industry percentages that should be applied in order to determine a maintenance budget. I believe that is an important step.
▶ 3:07:12Sen. King: I presume you believe that climate change is a problem, is that correct?
▶ 3:07:17Gov. Burgum: I believe it is a global phenomenon for sure.
▶ 3:07:21Sen. King: And I noticed in the biographical material in 2021 as governor you set a goal for carbon neutrality by 2030 to be achieved in a variety of ways. As you mentioned you worked hard on the carbon neutrality of fossil fuel extraction and use. I am a little worried today though that you keep distinguishing between intermittent and baseload.
▶ 3:07:50Sen. King: Would you agree that renewable resources, solar and wind for example can be developed if they are adequately -- if they can be integrated into the grid in a safe and reliable way?
▶ 3:08:03Gov. Burgum: They can. And it is not for me personally for any political reasons that I distinguish, it is just because of physics. The physics of the grid. If we do not have enough baseload and it is the baseload that we have that has allowed our nation to make the investments.
▶ 3:08:23Sen. King: In a former life I developed baseload and intermittent resources. I just do not want it to be code for nova nobles. That is not what you are saying?
▶ 3:08:34Gov. Burgum: We need a balance. But the intermittent, if you want to call them renewables to use a positive world but it is a -- word but it is a fact of life it is intermittent. Until we have storage solutions and we are years away from significant cost effect storage we need to have the baseload or intermittent does not have a life.
▶ 3:08:56Sen. Cotton: But it can be integrated. 35% of your electricity comes from wind power. I presume that your grid works.
▶ 3:09:07Gov. Burgum: It is super stressed as it is around the country. We are in part of two grids, one going east and one going west. You can have days where the rated capacity is 30 but you have a day when the wind is blowing it is blowing so hard it drives baseload offer production in the next day there is 20 below and no wind blowing and we have no brand and you have to crank up the baseload again.
▶ 3:09:33Sen. King: That is the most important reasons we talked about innovation. We need to work on storage. You would agree, I think that nobles or intermittent -- renewables or intermittents plus storage equals baseload?
▶ 3:09:48Gov. Burgum: Yes. But right now at a higher cost. Of course we wanted not only to be reliable but affordable. That is what we have to look at as a nation I is what cost are we willing to take on to try and achieve those goals.
▶ 3:10:06Gov. Burgum: And I believe that if it is all of the above, if we can de carbonized cheaper fuels cheaper than we could subsidize renewables that should be looked at fairly and economically because that is a better path forward for every citizen.
▶ 3:10:24Sen. King: I would not disagree with that. I am a great believer in american innovation and the cost of solar panels has gone from I do not know $70 a kilowatt down to $.70. Battery storage for example and in maine there is a project for a 100 hour grid scale score storage at a reasonable cost because it is not based on lithium and ion but iron.
▶ 3:10:54Sen. King: We are moving into a period where innovation will bring storage down. Of course, as you know, wind and solar are the cheapest forms of energy on a levelized basis, understanding that storage and backup as part of that calculation. But, I hope that you will work with the department of energy. Mr. wright was here yesterday and one of his business interests wasn't in geothermal and batteries.
▶ 3:11:21Sen. King: So -- was in geothermal and batteries. When I hear baseload use sometimes it sounds like no more renewables. I do not think that is a sustainable path for this country and certainly not a way of meeting the challenge of climate change, which you have acknowledged as serious.
▶ 3:11:43Gov. Burgum: We need all forms of electricity and we need more of it in the very near term. And so this is not about one versus the other but how do we drive forward and increase the amount of electricity we have. I am a both, and all of the above in terms of our approach but we have to do it no way where we have affordability or reliability. On the storage side there is a future.
▶ 3:12:09Gov. Burgum: Having been in tech, batteries get better at 2% a year and that is what it has been. There has been no breakthrough coming. It is improving but not like the microchip, which doubles in power.
▶ 3:12:23Sen. King: I think the amount of resources going into this research at the department of energy and other places and the development of this iron-based grid scale school -- storage, there are opportunities for significant baseload spirit I like your answer when you said we needed all and I appreciate having that on the record. Thank you very much and we appreciate you.
▶ 3:12:47Chair Lee: Senator hickenlooper.
▶ 3:12:51Sen. Hickenlooper: I ran down the hall to get here and I did not want to miss my chance for a second round of questions. Thank you for your service as a governor all the way through your career. You have shown a real inclination for both your government service and philanthropy to engage in the community to go to the community.
▶ 3:13:15Sen. Hickenlooper: From the letters and the tribes, I have heard that you are held in very high esteem. That will be a powerful thing. I have one question with the western governors association do they still meet with the secretary of interior in december?
▶ 3:13:40Gov. Burgum: There has been a tradition to meet when they have their annual meeting in washington, D.C. and that is usually in late january and early february and I would look forward to having that invitation if you know anybody that could send me one.
▶ 3:13:57Sen. Hickenlooper: I know that other governors are watching our discussion.
▶ 3:14:02Gov. Burgum: I think your own governor might be the current chair.
▶ 3:14:09Sen. Hickenlooper: This governor thing is getting pretty thick. It is just down to us less. -- left. I want to talk about the colorado river and it is at least a 25 year drought but also a longer-term drought. This is a geologist and me, and this appears to be the worst drought in 10,000 years.
▶ 3:14:34Sen. Hickenlooper: This is a serious drought and you have 40 million people that depend on this and we have been working aggressively with the lower and upper basin states. And one of the things that even before you began running for the highest office, the work that you did around water in north dakota where we have the largest investments in water infrastructure and half of it was for clean water and half of
▶ 3:15:06Sen. Hickenlooper: It was to protect against flood. I think that was a great model for what the department of the interior would have and you have to look at the colorado river in that sense. I think the bureau recommend -- I think the bureau of reclamation plays a sick control but a strong leader being able to find and incentivize those innovations of how do we make sure that we are receiving water and doing more with the water that we have rather than
▶ 3:15:38Sen. Hickenlooper: Fighting over it. And there is a long tradition in the west of whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting as we said last week. And talk about how you look at working with the colorado river but there is a whole number of river basins in drought right now.
▶ 3:15:56Gov. Burgum: Yes, and we have a tremendous water resource in this country when you think about the great lakes, columbia, and yukon, the mississippi is sometimes flooding when the colorado is in drought. We just do not have it in the right place at the right time where you have population centers.
▶ 3:16:17Gov. Burgum: I think again with smart planning, collaboration and when we have been successful in north dakota with private and part -- private and public partnerships it has been included with great help from senator hoeven. One of the projects is with the local, a huge buy it locally and in the state stepping up and participating.
▶ 3:16:43Gov. Burgum: And when we did that together, this project will get done in 6.5 or seven years as opposed to 20, 25 or never. We had that experience in north dakota. We have water projects at the federal level that were started in the 1960's that still have not fulfilled their full mission. Anyway, I think there is no opportunity to work together to come up with solutions.
▶ 3:17:09Sen. Hickenlooper: And that magnifies what can get done. The bureau of reclamation has done a lot of work in colorado and across the west and I am universal in that I have not heard a single senator republican or democrat complain about how they have approached this. They have a bunch of projects midway and I am hopeful that there is a lot of talk about a tax cut and how will they pay for that.
▶ 3:17:37Sen. Hickenlooper: Hopefully we can protect the funds committed to various water projects because the worst thing you can have and this is happened colorado two or three times where you get halfway and you are building zoning -- something in all of us on the support goes away.
▶ 3:17:51Gov. Burgum: Agreed. Having a secure and predictable form of capital for these projects, when you have the instability and uncertainty than the people bidding have to take more risk. There are insurgents companies that -- insurance companies that say do not do this.
▶ 3:18:16Gov. Burgum: When we were able to create certainty, that lowered the cost dramatically and not only the time to get it done but it lowered the cost.
▶ 3:18:31Sen. Hickenlooper: Who knows what the future will bring but I appreciate the commitment to the long-term >> thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 3:18:49Holcomb: I passed legislation to keep horses in the theater roosevelt national park. >> for the record, people should know, the horses in the national park have even more followers. [laughter]
▶ 3:19:14Senator Holcomb: I think you have demonstrated to both sides of the aisle your absolute willingness to work with everybody to achieve good outcomes. And a good outcome for this country. That is exactly what we want and it is something that goes into these important positions. So, thank you. Thank you to catherine.
▶ 3:19:35Senator Holcomb: If there is anything to the record that you want to add to the record, I would give you this opportunity before turning things back to the chairman and the ranking member.
▶ 3:19:48Gov. Burgum: I would like to close with gratitude to the chairman and the ranking member. Thank you for your time ahead of time, thank you for making your members available to me ahead of time you and thank you for this great dialogue and discussion today. I have received a lot of invitations from members to come to visit.
▶ 3:20:07Gov. Burgum: I would be remiss if I didn't before I leave extend an invitation on behalf of senators hogan, kramer, and myself to come to the, come to the theater opening of the theater roosevelt grand museum currently scheduled for july 4, 2026. It is an official usa 250 event.
▶ 3:20:31Gov. Burgum: It will of course have the opportunity to tell the story of leadership and citizenship and conservation that really began during the time when theodore roosevelt spent time in north dakota. His wife and mother tragically died in the same day, same house, valentine's day of 1884. He had a newborn infant daughter that was two days old. He handed that off to his sister, got on the train, was deeply despondent.
▶ 3:21:02Gov. Burgum: He went west and remade himself. He had had a childhood that was full of sickness and he went from a sickly eastern her and became a rough-and-tumble westerner, cowboy, learned the hard way out there. Built the alcorn ranch.
▶ 3:21:20Gov. Burgum: From there he developed his cooked thoughts on conservation in this country and we know the story that went from there, it led him to become the rough rider that he was, propelling him into becoming governor, forming the national governors association. Saved of football.
▶ 3:21:37Gov. Burgum: Now the largest youth sport in the ncaa was formed because theater roosevelt was listed in the concerns from others who were dying of -- the sons were dying without head protection and he said let's come up with some standard safety protection. There are many stories about him that having been told, like that. The only president to receive a medal of honor for his time in the military. One of his sons also received a medal of honor.
▶ 3:22:08Gov. Burgum: They were there at normandy in world war ii. Incredible story. And a nobel peace prize that he received for negotiating the settlement between russia and japan. And he wrote more books than all of the other presidents combined. More letters than jefferson and washington. We are in the process of digitizing all of that. It'll be one of the most sustainable buildings in north america.
▶ 3:22:37Gov. Burgum: It is in the heart of the badlands that he loved and the gateway community that goes to the theater roosevelt national park. In closing, I would say that if someone asks this fourth of july, are you going to have fireworks further tradition of opening a presidential library, all living presidents are invited. If they all show up, we may not need additional fireworks.
▶ 3:23:01Gov. Burgum: It'll be, it'll be great, because there is a lot of what we know about theodore roosevelt that still lives on today. Thinking about the discussions that we are having, the panama canal wouldn't have happened.
▶ 3:23:24Gov. Burgum: Some of the original systems in arizona, they were dedicated by theodore roosevelt, one of the first wildlife refugees he made was at stump lake. He sent us on a way to build out the national parks system as we know it right now. It's with a bit of serendipity and a great amount of excitement as the secretary of interior that I look forward to being at that opening along with all of you as committees are all officially invited as of right now.
▶ 3:23:53Gov. Burgum: We would be grateful to have you all there and with that, thank you, senators, hogan and kramer, for your support, your friendship and mentorship for all of these years.
▶ 3:24:08Chair Lee: I appreciate the members of the staff, the committee, and our capitol police force for keeping us safe today. Given all the time that you spent in north dakota, theater roosevelt I'm sure learned to correctly pronounce the animal called the bison.
▶ 3:24:26Gov. Burgum: I agree, it has a z.
▶ 3:24:30Chair Lee: It has a z that isn't silent, it's just invisible. >> do you know what the lady buffalo said to her little boy when he was going to school?
▶ 3:24:40Chair Lee: I don't. What did she say? >> bye, son. [laughter]
▶ 3:24:47Gov. Burgum: I love it. >> I just love it.
▶ 3:24:51Gov. Burgum: He coined the term malefactors of great wealth.
▶ 3:24:55Chair Lee: Going to be telling that one for weeks. The record will stand open until 6 p.m. Today for questions for the record. We stand adjourned.