▶ 0:26:28Chair Crapo: The committee will come to order. We need to vote on the nomination of frank bisignano, to be commissioner of the social security administration. As we have done with other nominees, the meeting will provide members with the opportunity to make remarks on his nomination. And we will notify members of a time and location later today to conduct the committee vote.
▶ 0:26:55Chair Crapo: He has more than 30 years of executive leadership experience in banks and financial institutions. He serves as the chairman of the board and chief executive officer of fiserv. A leader in payments and financial technology. At his nomination hearing, Mr.
▶ 0:27:13Chair Crapo: Bisignano discussed his vision for improving the social security administration service to the public, including bringing down the wait times for the national 800-number and claims decisions. While he has extensive experience using information technology to improve the organizational performance, he also understands the importance of meeting customers where they are.
▶ 0:27:40Chair Crapo: He committed to ensuring that individuals can interact with the ssa and the way they prefer whether in person, iphone, or online. He would also draw his decades of experience to improving ssa's payment accuracy. When ssa issues and in correct payment it puts a burden on the affected beneficiaries, employees, and taxpayers.
▶ 0:28:07Chair Crapo: I look forward to working with him to achieve these important goals. Before moving on, let me address the allegations made during his nomination hearing that he lied about his connections to doge and its efforts to break social security. I remind his colleagues that Mr. bisignano does not currently hold a position at the social security administration let alone a decision-making position. Mr.
▶ 0:28:31Chair Crapo: Bisignano's nomination was first announced in december, 2024 and he has been going through the finance committee's rigorous due diligence process for months. Yet the allegations against Mr. bisignano made in an anonymous letter were not shared with me or my staff until after his hearing commenced. The anonymous letter claims that Mr.
▶ 0:28:52Chair Crapo: Bisignano insisted on personally approving several key doge hires and getting frequent briefings. Mr. bisignano responded to these allegations in writing this weekend as a part of the questions for the record.
▶ 0:29:11Chair Crapo: He stated that he does not have a role at ssa and was not part of the decision-making process led by the current acting commissioner about ssa operations, personnel or management. He stated that he communicated with the former acting commissioner multiple times and she -- and had brief introductory phone calls with individuals chosen from various active roles. Mr.
▶ 0:29:37Chair Crapo: Bisignano said that he has not spoken with acting commit -- the acting commissioner beyond a short, introductory -- introductory phone call. The anonymous letter mentioned four individuals that he has been in contact with were pushed ssa to on board. Mr.
▶ 0:29:56Chair Crapo: Bisignano reiterated in writing that he has a 20 year professional relationship with one contact, periodic contact with another on general matters related to the agency, was referred to another to help him with preparation for his confirmation hearing, and the last individual he does not know at all.
▶ 0:30:18Chair Crapo: Even though the timing of the anonymous letter suggests a political effort to delay the committee vote, my staff have told seven -- senator wyden's staff and we have discussed this that we are open to meeting with the author of the letter and keeping the individual anonymous. However, any information provided by the individual must be thoroughly vetted allowing the nominee the opportunity to respond. A process for vetting the allegations has not been agreed to.
▶ 0:30:49Chair Crapo: The issue here, as I understand it is the frequency and details of communications between the nominee and ssa officials. The nominee responded in writing to these allegations. The ssa needs study, senate confirmed leadership. Mr. bisignano would bring his decades long focus on strong customer service and operational excellence to the ssa. Irish my colleagues to support his nomination. I recognize the ranking member.
▶ 0:31:18Sen. Wyden: Thank you very much. Today the finance committee is going to vote on the nomination of frank bisignano to be the commissioner of the social security administration. My most important point this morning is the finance committee should not be holding this votes today.
▶ 0:31:37Sen. Wyden: This nominee lied multiple times to every member of this committee including the bipartisan finance staff and the nominee's actions and communications with doge remain very much at the heart of my objection here. My office received an account from a whistleblower about the ways the nominee was deeply involved in and aware of doge's activities at the agency. Mr.
▶ 0:32:06Sen. Wyden: Bisignano lied in meetings with bipartisan finance committee staff. He lied in a meeting with me in my office down the hall. And he lied before the committee a week ago.
▶ 0:32:21Sen. Wyden: I asked the nominee for example if he had a part in speeding up the hiring for a doge acolyte who was rushed into the agency after other members of doge had trouble telling career officials to ignore privacy laws. Mr. bisignano told me he was not involved. The whistleblower statement says that is not true. That Mr.
▶ 0:32:50Sen. Wyden: Bisignano personally intervened to get boba immediate access to social security systems. I asked the nominee if he was involved in any discussions about personnel or operations at social security. Again, the transcript says the nominee said no.
▶ 0:33:13Sen. Wyden: The whistleblower statement says that he spoke frequently with michael russo, one of doge's chief operators. He also requested that senior social security staff not hire any new personnel without his explicit approval. You -- the account of the whistleblower, I would say to my colleagues was confirmed independently by a veteran reporter at "the washington post" newspaper.
▶ 0:33:44Sen. Wyden: With respect to the committee I asked the chairman to work with me to verify the disturbing account on a bipartisan basis. And, up until a few minutes ago, it was not to be a topic of conversation. Now we are going to explore this. We have to have a process that protects the whistleblower's identity and gives the whistleblower a chance to lay out for the bipartisan group at the committee, you know what happened.
▶ 0:34:14Sen. Wyden: And it needs to be done before this nominee goes to the floor of the united states senate. And I think that is reasonable. We talked about getting something that would allow the majority to later on schedule a vote.
▶ 0:34:31Sen. Wyden: But I insist, insist, that in the name of basic fairness that there is a chance to have a bipartisan inquiry into exactly what the whistleblower said and the nominee's response and it take place before there is a final vote on the floor of the senate. I will yield. Did my colleague wish? Great. I would include this part of my remarks.
▶ 0:34:57Sen. Wyden: I think it will be a dark day in the history of the finance committee if we surrender our ability to hold truth to power. The chairman and I have worked together on a lot of issues and have had plenty of disagreements that we have never gone to basically ignoring whistleblowers who are well-regarded in terms of the substance of an issue to have a chance to speak truth to power.
▶ 0:35:21Sen. Wyden: Let me just close by way of saying that this may sound like some inside baseball, but to me if you lie to all these people, all of the staff and me and others, you light to the american people once you were on the job.
▶ 0:35:41Sen. Wyden: My final remark is that seniors and families have tremendous concern about what is going on at social security and their earned social benefits. Over the last several weeks what has been happening -- happening at the agency has been bedlam. Radical changes, website connectivity problems and dozens of field office closure announcements. The whiplash is confusing and discouraging americans from getting their benefits.
▶ 0:36:10Sen. Wyden: And if a senior someone with a disability cannot access social security, that is doge stealing their money. The nominee today is going to be a person who has come from business and has made a career of swooping in, firing workers, selling off pieces of a company emerging with a competitor. It might be good for shareholders but they hurt american families.
▶ 0:36:38Sen. Wyden: So we senate democrats are not going to stand by idly while trump's cronies take a sledgehammer to social security and deprive seniors of their earned benefits under the false banner of fighting fraud. As I reminded the committee the amount of fraud taking place in the retirement and disability benefits is 0.009%. The whistleblower summed it up to me.
▶ 0:37:04Sen. Wyden: This whistleblower who has expertise in the field and bravely provided the finance committee with their testimony said the nominee to run sessa -- social security will not temple or -- temper the chaos but bolster it.
▶ 0:37:18Chair Crapo: Thank you. I will just comment briefly in response and we will move onto any senator who wishes to make a statement. It was my understanding that and, it is my understanding, we have been very willing to meet with the whistleblower and protect his or her anonymity and get the information that the whistleblower wants to bring to us.
▶ 0:37:45Chair Crapo: At this point it is simply an anonymous letter and we have not been able to meet with the person to confirm anything different. We insist that if there is information presented that the information presented needs to be made available to the nominee so that he can response to the allegations. If we could work that out, we will do so.
▶ 0:38:09Sen. Wyden: Let me just repeat what our understanding is and we have come to progress. One, protect the whistleblower's identity. Two, an independent process. And three, before the nominee is on the floor of the united states senate before our colleagues?
▶ 0:38:25Chair Crapo: I cannot make the commitment on when it goes to the floor and that is a decision to be made by the majority leader. But we will work from today forward to do an expeditious review if the whistleblower, the anonymous person, will come forward and meet with us and present that information so we can then present that same information to the nominee and get the nominee's response.
▶ 0:38:52Sen. Wyden: I just think that it is so important that this get done before this goes to the floor of the united states senate. Social security is the connective tissue for the american people between young workers and retired people. And when you have someone who sits at the witness table where our wonderful staff is today and lives up to their eyeballs to this committee, we have to get this right. I look forward to further discussions.
▶ 0:39:21Chair Crapo: Thank you. I will turn to any other senator wanting to make a statement. Next on my list is senator cantwell.
▶ 0:39:30Sen. Cantwell: Thank you and I am speaking against this nomination. I do share my colleague and the ranking member's concerns that we need to understand Mr. bisignano's past statements. And, I think the context here is that we have seen cuts in staffing. We have seen threatens of closures of office.
▶ 0:39:58Sen. Cantwell: We have seen the request for reregistration, and so we are seeing and undermining of the services at social security right now. And Mr. bisignano has made a name for himself in coming in and slashing and burning to find efficiencies. Social security has no place to slash and burn. It is a contract with the american people that should be kept and we should improve the service.
▶ 0:40:29Sen. Cantwell: The taxpayers that pay into the program do so throughout their lives and they want the government to live up to that obligation and take care of them. Overwhelmingly, american support social security. A recent aarp poll said that 85% of americans want social security benefits maintained or increased. And that shows that is everybody, not just democrats or people who remember house so -- how social security got created. This is everybody.
▶ 0:41:01Sen. Cantwell: But, we have an administration represented with doge who think that they are going to come in here and find aliens of dollars that they can take out and give to tax breaks to billionaires and corporations. I think it is fair to understand whether Mr. bisignano did participate in that process, and he has a background of that is why he is being hired.
▶ 0:41:24Sen. Cantwell: Not because he is an expert on social security, but because somebody thinks he will come in here and get billions of dollars out of social security to give to a tax bill. I just want to say I need to tell the committee how important it is that the administration actions are leaving office is overcrowded and phone calls, as my colleague from antenna mentioned are 1.5 hours or longer.
▶ 0:41:51Sen. Cantwell: We had a constituent that shared that she was unable to log into our account due to new verification changes. She has nearly 80 years old. It is not like she has a smart phone or a computer or a webcam or is going to drive herself to the social security office. I have 1.4 million constituents who deserve social security and we are making it harder on them. The instance that I mentioned at Mr.
▶ 0:42:16Sen. Cantwell: Bisignano's hearing is that social security wrongfully declared one of my constituents said. His monthly benefit was withheld and thousands of dollars were clawback out of his joint account that he shares with his wife. The determination set off a bureaucratic nightmare. Ultimately he had to wait in line at the federal building. Guess what? They are still withholding his money. His most recent check, they are still withholding the payment.
▶ 0:42:47Sen. Cantwell: Why does he have to wage a war to get his social security benefits? We cannot afford more of this thinking in this position. We need to make sure we know the answers and I do not believe we have them today. Thank you.
▶ 0:42:59Chair Crapo: Let me just say before moving forward, no one on our side including the nominee has said that they are going to cut social security benefits. The president made it clear that he will not support cutting social security benefits. And the bottom line is the nominee is not even at the social security administration yet.
▶ 0:43:25Sen. Cantwell: My constituent would like to know out of all these years he has to wage a war just to get a benefit. That has been because there is a chilling effect. The issue is that is he being hired and did he participate in the doge discussion. I am against his nomination but we deserve to know the answers to the question that the ranking member is asking.
▶ 0:43:48Chair Crapo: Mr. chairman? Very briefly.
▶ 0:43:52Sen. Wyden: You know that my background is working with the gray panthers. I was a director for a full seven years. I have really studied the issue of privatization. That is the issue that I have raised. When you hollow out a program like social security which is what is going on with the phones, personnel, and offices, you make the situation rip for privitization.
▶ 0:44:24Sen. Wyden: I call it a prelude, because you are stuck with having to get private contractors. I want my colleague to understand that I have been very specific about my concern with respect to the administration. And that these efforts with the phones, offices, and personnel are a prelude to privatization. My colleague is asking that you described this carefully.
▶ 0:44:49Chair Crapo: I will say again, no one has talked about privatization either. The president says he will not tamper with social security. In the law prohibits us within the tax bill that senator cantwell referenced, from looking at social security. Which we are not doing anyway. The point is that this is not something that this nominee is even involved in.
▶ 0:45:15Chair Crapo: Even if it were happening, the issue before us today is the nominee. And I see only one other senator president. Did you wish to speak?
▶ 0:45:27Sen. Warnock: Thank you brother chair. Since I was sworn into office over four years ago, I have received more than 32,000 messages from georgians about social security. I can tell you that folks all over my state are deeply concerned about social security.
▶ 0:45:56Sen. Warnock: One thing is undisputed, and that is that Mr. elon musk, who in effect is functioning as copresident said that social security is the biggest ponzi scheme ever. We know what he thinks about social security.
▶ 0:46:14Sen. Warnock: And, if he is heading this effort of supposedly going after the waste, fraud, and abuse and the guy in charge things that social security is a ponzi scheme, then I think folks in georgia have real reason to be concerned. And so, that is why I asked georgians to send me their questions.
▶ 0:46:36Sen. Warnock: I represent them and I wanted to know what the questions they thought the nominee to lead the social security administration should be presented with. And just two days I received over 500 responses, over 500, and 260 unique questions about social security. My office summarize the questions for the nominee, Mr. bisignano. And sent them directly to him to answer.
▶ 0:47:06Sen. Warnock: It is important to me that each of these questions is ultimately addressed by the trump administration. So without objection I would like to answer -- to enter these questions into the record.
▶ 0:47:16Chair Crapo: Without objection.
▶ 0:47:19Sen. Warnock: They asked about his plans about benefits not being interrupted by doge and elon musk access saying their personal data. They asked about disability wait times and approval backlogs. Most georgians had questions about the trump administration's overall disdain and callousness towards people who depend on their social security benefits to live. That is not in dispute.
▶ 0:47:47Sen. Warnock: The president stood there at his joint statement before the congress and named all of these dozens of dead people who said are getting social security. The head of the commerce department said well, if his mother-in-law misses a check, no big deal. It is that attitude that they are worried about. Part time, a retired teacher says her social security check is her only income. So let me be clear.
▶ 0:48:18Sen. Warnock: Reducing phone services and scaling back field offices and firing staff will make it harder for people to have questions answered and these are all cuts to services and therefore cuts to benefits. I hope that if he is confirmed then Mr. bisignano can do what he says and make social security work better for americans.
▶ 0:48:38Sen. Warnock: I am concerned based on what we are hearing and what we are seeing from the trump administration and from copresident elon musk that they will break up social security. I do not have confidence that this nominee can realistically be the backstop that we need against elon musk and doge at the social security administration to prevent my constituents from losing access to their hard earned benefits. And for that reason I will be voting no on Mr.
▶ 0:49:07Sen. Warnock: Bisignano's nomination. And I urge my colleagues to do the same.
▶ 0:49:13Chair Crapo: Thank you senator. We will now procedurally recess and reconvene for the committee vote on the nomination off of the senate floor. Members will be notified when that timing is confirmed. Without objection, and so ordered. The committee stands in recess.