▶ 0:18:50>> it is my privilege to call this hearing to order. Today, we will consider the nominations of stephen vaden to be the deputy secretary of the department of agriculture and tyler clarkson to be general counsel of the department of agriculture. We welcome both of you to the committee and congratulate you on your nominations.
▶ 0:19:15You have been nominated at a very challenging time for rural america. This committee has examined the challenges facing our country's hard-working farmers, ranchers, and rural businesses and how they are struggling to keep up let alone make a profit. In this current economic climate, farmers everywhere are losing money on every acre that they cultivate.
▶ 0:19:39Furthermore, while the president has imposed tariffs designed to address unfair practices and market manipulation by our trading partners to level the training field, it remains to be seen how these will impact agriculture, causing much unease. Economic uncertainty farmers and ranchers are experiencing, they want to know that usta is in their corner advocating for their needs.
▶ 0:20:05I was pleased to see usda quickly distribute the economic assistance approved at the end of last year, and while implementation has gone relatively smoothly, we continue to be in contact with the department to make sure that implementation of the emergency commodity assistance program follows congressional intent. We are pleased to have the secretary with us today. Thank you so much for being here .
▶ 0:20:30We do appreciate your hard work and doing a good job of getting the economic assistance out. I am confident judge vaden and Mr. clarkson will help ensure that deliberate decisions are made regarding vital usda programs. They both bring impressive legal backgrounds and usda experience that will serve the secretary and our farmers and ranchers in rural communities well.
▶ 0:20:59Judge vaden's family has farmed in tennessee and kentucky since the 1800s.his understanding of agriculture, the law, and usda will serve him well as he is tasked with managing the day-to-day operations of the department. Mr.
▶ 0:21:18Clarkson having previously served as deputy general counsel, principal deputy general counsel and acting general council is well prepared from all of that to serve as the departments general counsel. Mr. clarkson will be tasked with providing legal advice to secretary rawlins and all other officials and agencies and usda.
▶ 0:21:44This will lean on the statutory interpretations and legal expertise to develop policies to be considered by congress. While the roles of deputy secretary and general counsel are not always public facing they are essential to making sure the department remains focused on the mission and complies with laws and regulations. I am thankful for Mr.
▶ 0:22:09Vaden and clarkson being willing to serve and I'm confident both nominees will perform their roles well. I look forward to hearing your testimony and answers to questions. I turned to ranking member klobuchar for her opening statement.
▶ 0:22:25Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you, chairman bozeman, for holding this hearing today to consider nominees for two critical positions of the department of agriculture. Thank you, judge vaden and Mr. clarkson for being with us today. I want to welcome your wife kristin and soon to be new baby. Congratulations to your family. It is good to see secretary rollins tear as well as well as senators blackburn and senator hagerty.
▶ 0:23:00Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you. The past few months, I don't think I'm telling anyone anything that is breaking news, but it has been a turbulent time, minnesota euphemism, for farmers, ranchers, and rural americans.
▶ 0:23:15Sen. Klobuchar: As expected, key trading partners have announced retaliatory tariffs following president trump's tariff rollout last week, and that is a huge headwind already for soybean future prices and the like in addition to the headwinds of input costs, weather, avian flu, and other things that our farmers and ranchers had to deal with.
▶ 0:23:45Sen. Klobuchar: For some of my smaller farmers and ranchers, this is may be the thing that puts them over. It is easier for bigger operations to absorb things. This has been hard for them, so I hope that we will get some change there. American farmers and ranchers need certainty, and that means a leadership at the usda, of course including who gets placed in the roles of the deputy secretary and general counsel.
▶ 0:24:15Sen. Klobuchar: The deputy secretary is the second highest ranking official at usda, traditionally acting as the coo of the department. It requires a deep commitment to ensuring that the department fulfills its important missions and conserves the farmers, ranchers, and rural americans across the country that look to the usda. Judge, you've been nominated for this critical position and I'm looking forward to hearing more about how your experiences would influence your approach to serving as deputy secretary. We met in my office.
▶ 0:24:46Sen. Klobuchar: I appreciate that. As you and I discussed, concerns have been raised about your past record at usda, including the work affecting the farm loan programs, tag research, nutrition programs, and I hope to learn more, as do other members, about how you will defend the critical programs at usda and work collaboratively with usda unions and be responsive to congress. Mr.
▶ 0:25:16Sen. Klobuchar: Clarkson, you previously served as judge vaden's deputy general counsel and are nominated to be the general counsel. That is the chief legal officer of the usda overseeing 200 50 attorneys in the office of the general counsel. The general counsel also supervises the office of ethics and office of information affairs, which is responsible for the usda's freedom of information act and programs.
▶ 0:25:44Sen. Klobuchar: This job involves advising the secretary and deputy secretary on rulemaking processes and compliance and enforcement of the law. Given your familiarity with the department I hope to learn more today about what you will do as general counsel is confirmed to uphold the rule of law at usda, implement usda programs fairly for all americans, and ensure that the department is responsive to congress.
▶ 0:26:10Sen. Klobuchar: Across the country, farmers, families, and rural communities are concerned about the policies that are currently being put into place by the trump administration, whether it is cutting funding to emergency food providers or trade chaos or across-the-board firings of usda employees.
▶ 0:26:29Sen. Klobuchar: In these uncertain times, it's absolutely necessary that we have individuals in these important positions that we are considering today who understand the critical services that usda provides to americans and will do all that they can to be a voice for the farmers and ranchers and those getting the snap benefits and those using the conservation programs and the people of america who benefit from those programs.
▶ 0:26:59Sen. Klobuchar: My point is that it is more important than ever that the agriculture department is standing up for the people it looks out for. Thank you.
▶ 0:27:09Chair Boozman: Today, we will be joined by our colleagues from tennessee, senator blackburn and senator hagerty. Thank you for taking the time to come over. They will be introducing judge stephen vaden. We will begin with you, marcia.
▶ 0:27:29Sen. Blackburn: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Since the secretary is with us, I want to take a moment to publicly thank her for the response usda has had to flood victims in tennessee. Upper east tennessee has been devastated. She has had her team on the ground, responsive to the agriculture community there. Tennesseens are grateful that we thank her.
▶ 0:27:59Sen. Blackburn: Today, it is such a pleasure to introduce stephen vaden. This is the second time that I've had the opportunity to do this, because when president trump nominated him for the U.S. court of international trade I had the opportunity to shepherd him through judiciary committee. I will remind my colleagues, he was very successful. He sailed through, and we got him right to work, and he has done a great job.
▶ 0:28:29Sen. Blackburn: I'm depending on the ag committee to do the exact same thing today. I will admit that I am a little bit biased to judge vaden, because he is a tennessean and someone that I've gotten to know fairly well.
▶ 0:28:46Sen. Blackburn: Seeing him at home in tennessee and seeing him around his friends, colleagues, and knowing what he has done to continue to support our great state is really quite remarkable. I know that he will bring all of this background and be a superb U.S. agriculture deputy secretary. We are thrilled that he is here.
▶ 0:29:15Sen. Blackburn: By way of his background, he is a native of union city, tennessee where he grew up working with his father on his family's growth crop farm. This really instilled in him the passion for agriculture. So many of us who grow up on farms, 4-h clubs, we carry that with us.
▶ 0:29:40Sen. Blackburn: During his tenure as general counsel of the department of agriculture, from 2017-2020, he supervised over 250 legal professionals across 13 offices, and provided the guidance on matters vital to the ag community. His accomplishments included successfully litigating two cases before the U.S.
▶ 0:30:04Sen. Blackburn: Supreme court, implementing key provisions of the 2018 farm bill, and leading the development of critical regulations for the sell of hemp and bioengineered product. As a judge, judge vaden brings a unique understanding of agriculture's role in international markets and marketplace.
▶ 0:30:33Sen. Blackburn: His work addressing federal trade issues including those involving ag commodities will be indispensable as usda continues to navigate global trade challenges and create a level playing field and expanded opportunities and expanded markets for U.S. farmers, ranchers, and agribusinesses.
▶ 0:31:00Sen. Blackburn: Judge vaden is uniquely prepared and situated for this position, and I look forward to his swift confirmation. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:31:08Chair Boozman: Senator hagerty.
▶ 0:31:12Sen. Hagerty: Chair boozman, ranking member klobuchar, thank you for holding this hearing. Secretary rollins, thank you for your friendship and support of tennessee in our time of need. It is a pleasure to introduce stephen vaden, nominated by president trump to serve as the deputy secretary of the department of agriculture.
▶ 0:31:42Sen. Hagerty: His career has been distinguished by his legal expertise, deep commitment to our nation's agricultural and trade policy, and steadfast dedication to supporting rural america. During the first trump administration he served as the general counsel for the usda and in that capacity provided legal counsel across all of the departments ranging from agricultural policy and rural development to food stamps and trade. His leadership demonstrated not only his legal acumen, but his unwavering commitment to advancing the interest of american farmers and ranchers.
▶ 0:32:06Sen. Hagerty: Following his tenure at usda, he continued his public service as a judge on the united states court of international trade starting in 2021. Stephen vaden worked at the crossroads of law, global commerce, and economic security. The experience gave him a nuanced, copperheads of understanding of the complexities of agricultural trade law, challenges of supply chains, and broader economic forces that affect our rural communities.
▶ 0:32:33Sen. Hagerty: Stephen vaden's judicial service strengthen his robust understanding of how agricultural policy intersects with trade law and international economics. He has seen firsthand how policy decisions on a global scale can directly impact our farmers, ranchers, and rural communities. This unique perspective is invaluable, especially as american agriculture faces increasing international pressures and challenges. It is clear that stephen vaden's experience will serve him well as he returns to usda at a pivotal time.
▶ 0:33:03Sen. Hagerty: He was raised on a family farm with deep ties to the land and a profound respect for rural america. His family's farm in west tennessee was not only foundational to his upbringing, but also shaped his perspective on the values of hard work, integrity, and importance of supporting communities that make up the backbone of our nation's agricultural sector. If confirmed as deputy secretary, stephen vaden will bring integrity, wealth of experience, and results-oriented mindset.
▶ 0:33:32Sen. Hagerty: He understands the mission of usda not only in theory but in practice. He has lived it and is deeply committed to ensuring that the department supports and strengthens american agriculture. He will work closely with congress, state and local governments, and american people to ensure that usda delivers on its promise to serve farmers, ranchers, and rural communities.
▶ 0:33:54Sen. Hagerty: There are real, significant challenges facing american agriculture, including the need to equip farmers and ranchers with tools to succeed in an increasingly complex global marketplace. I have full confidence in stephen vaden's ability to meet these challenges head-on as he has done throughout his career. In closing, I am proud to support judge stephen vaden for the position of deputy secretary of the united states department of agriculture. His qualifications, integrity, and commitment to public him an outstanding candidate.
▶ 0:34:24Sen. Hagerty: I look forward with -- look for to working with my colleagues.
▶ 0:34:30Chair Boozman: Thank you for being here. I know you are incredibly busy, as all of us are. It highlights how important this hearing is. Again, thank you very much for taking your time. I would like to introduce Mr. tyler clarkson, the president's nominee to be general counsel for the department of agriculture. Mr.
▶ 0:34:52Chair Boozman: Clarkson currently serves as the vice president and deputy general counsel of ginkgo biloba works. He was previously the general counsel principal deputy and deputy general counsel at usda. Mr. clarkson worked on regulatory enforcement at the office of information and regulatory affairs and is a graduate of the university of virginia.
▶ 0:35:18Chair Boozman: Today, we are pleased to have senator justice's wife and daughter. Thank you all. I think that baby dog is here, the key to the west virginia senator's success. It highlights the importance of this hearing today. >> Mr. chairman, I have a question for the record.
▶ 0:35:45Chair Boozman: Does baby dog qualify as livestock?
▶ 0:35:49Chair Boozman: Some would say. >> I was going to say, governor, it is a risk bringing livestock to an ag committee because we do livestock, but we love babydog so we welcome the visit. >> babydog will say hi to everybody. Thank y'all so much.
▶ 0:36:23Chair Boozman: She is special because she makes you smile. She loves everybody. [indiscernible] black or white or god forbid them a credit or republican, she loves everybody. That is good stuff in my book.
▶ 0:36:50Chair Boozman: Nevertheless, she will say bye, because she is heavy. [laughter]
▶ 0:36:55Chair Boozman: Very good. We have to get back to business. I will now administer the oath and begin with witness testimonies. Each witness will have five minutes. If you would stand and raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm that the statements you are about to provide are the truth, whole truth, nothing but the truth, so help you god?
▶ 0:37:22Chair Boozman: Do you agree that if confirmed you will respond to requests to appear and testify before any duly constitutional committee of the senate? Very good, thank you. Judge vaden, you are recognized for five minutes. Mr. vaden thank you, Mr. chairman, ranking member klobuchar members of the committee.
▶ 0:37:48Chair Boozman: It is an honor to come before you as the president's nominee to serve as deputy secretary of the united states department of agriculture. Before I have an opportunity to answer your questions, I wish to spend a few moments to tell you about my background and why the president's nomination and a secretary's competence are personally meaningful to me. I come from a farming family.
▶ 0:38:12Chair Boozman: My father, john marshall vaden, was born on a farm in rural tennessee in 1918 and he engaged in farming his entire life. Following his death, my brother and I learned that one of the family farms that we had inherited has been in the family since the early 1800s, as it appears it's exact current dimensions on the original map of fulton county kentucky with the name of my ancestor handwritten across the plot.
▶ 0:38:44Chair Boozman: It was the profits that my father reaped the pave the way for me to come before you today. Those profits wisely invested paid for the exorbitant tuition at vanderbilt university and yield law school. They made it possible for me to delay entering the private practice of law in order to clerk for two of our nation's finest federal judges. They supported the move to the more expensive washington, D.C.
▶ 0:39:10Chair Boozman: Area, where I entered the private practice of law, first at the form of patton boggs, and then at jones day. I need no refresher course on why low commodity prices are harmful to the futures of rural communities.it has been my reality since birth. Should I be confirmed, I would be entering the department at a time of uncertainty for the producers that the department serves. Agriculture is, for the first time in living memory, dealing with a structural trade deficit.
▶ 0:39:43Chair Boozman: The only way out is to open new markets for american producers to sell their crops. As a judge who served the past four years on a court possessing exclusive jurisdiction over most of the united states's trade matters, I hope to bring this experience to bear in advising the secretary and her team on opportunities to remove trade barriers hindering market access for america's farmers, foresters, and ranchers.
▶ 0:40:12Chair Boozman: America's producers are the most efficient for a reason. They are not afraid of technological progress that has allowed them to produce more food and fiber from a shrinking agricultural footprint. We must ensure their productivity is not turned into a weapon against them that harms their financial futures. I would be remiss if I did not mention that for nearly the entirety of the first trump administration I served in the office of general counsel.
▶ 0:40:41Chair Boozman: I have told each of my crops of new law clerks that it remains my favorite job I've ever had to this day. It is a high honor to work with the team dedicated to allowing rural america to thrive once again. I am grateful that the president and secretary have chosen my friend, tyler clarkson, to serve as general counsel counsel in his second administration.I know that he will ensure that all usda does remains on the right side of the law.
▶ 0:41:11Chair Boozman: It is the opportunity to work with tyler and many of the other -- with tyler and many of the other wonderful people I served with in the first term that leads me here today to ask you to let me serve once again. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, my father was a farmer. Throughout his life he was a grocer, investor, and real estate developer. It was the title of farmer of which he was the most proud.
▶ 0:41:40Chair Boozman: I know that because he placed that title, farmer, below his name on every check I ever saw him sign. The last three checks that he ever signed hang on my judicial chamber's wall, framed, as a reminder of the responsibilities that I bear as a federal judge to ensure that all who come before the department, before me, are treated fairly, equitably, in accordance with
▶ 0:42:10Chair Boozman: The law. Should the senate confirm me as deputy secretary, I commit to you to carry out the responsibilities of that office with this very same personal commitment. Thank you once again for the opportunity to come before you, and I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:42:26Chair Boozman: Thank you, judge vaden. Mr. clarkson.
▶ 0:42:30Mr. Clarkson: Chairman boozman, ranking member klobuchar, distinguished senators of the committee, I want to thank president trump for the nomination to serve as general counsel at the united states department of agriculture. I had the great privilege to serve during the president's first term. It would be an honor to work on the president's behalf a second time. I want to thank secretary rollins for her confidence in my ability to work as the agency's lead attorney.
▶ 0:42:58Mr. Clarkson: Secretary rollins laid out an ambitious agenda for usd and I hope to have the chance to help the secretary implement her vision. Thank you to this committee for its consideration of my nomination. I'm grateful for the opportunity to have met with several members of this committee. During those discussions, I heard firsthand about this committee's priorities and uncertainties facing U.S. agriculture and what usda might do to mitigate such uncertainties.
▶ 0:43:26Mr. Clarkson: If I have the fortune to be confirmed, I look forward to working alongside the men and women at usda who were each and every day on behalf of our nation's farmers, producers, and the broader american public. I would also like to take this opportunity to pay special thanks to my wife, kristen, my mom and dad, sister, and wider family.
▶ 0:43:49Mr. Clarkson: I am indebted to each of them and deeply appreciative of their unending support and love.the chance to return to usda and lead presents an opportunity to help this nation's farmers and producers. Prior to serving in the president's first term, I would not have characterize myself as an ag person, but having spent three years at the department I learned about agriculture and the great sacrifice that many of our farmers and producers make to feed this country.
▶ 0:44:17Mr. Clarkson: Farmers, ranchers, producers not only create a great bounty for this country, but also these individuals establish a stability and rootedness in the body politic. It is our farms that offer a glimpse of american life across generations.it is our farms that promise a just reward for hard days work. It is our farms that preserve a rural way of life in this country. These are all things worth protecting.
▶ 0:44:44Mr. Clarkson: Too often, many take this country' is healthy, abundant food supply for granted. In this moment that blessing faces many challenges. Dynamic consumer preferences, foreign market access, regulatory uncertainty, access to credit and the weather are a few of the many challenges. Farmers equipped usda with tools alongside farmers and producers in such turbulence.
▶ 0:45:10Mr. Clarkson: While the office of general counsel doesn't set policy, oh gc can play a substantial role in advising the secretary and usda missionaries on available legal authorities to respond to these adversities. In my first stent at the department, I saw firsthand how much ogc can contribute to regulatory certainty.
▶ 0:45:34Mr. Clarkson: Achieving that in the first term was thanks to judge vaden, the sharpest attorney with which I've ever worked and the department would be lucky to have him as deputy secretary. I aspire to counsel the secretary, deputy secretary, and under secretaries on how to execute the president's policy agenda while fortifying final rulemakings against inevitable challenges.
▶ 0:46:01Mr. Clarkson: Ogc's -- the president's agenda will free our farmers from unnecessary or anachronistic regulatory burdens are the president's agenda will incentivize advances in agricultural technology including precision ag and biotechnology. The president's agenda will best position our farmers and producers to compete. The president's agenda is an ogc that does justice for farmers and producers.
▶ 0:46:32Mr. Clarkson: If I'm confirmed, I will work each day on behalf of the president and secretary for the betterment of our farmers and producers. Again, I think this committee for its consideration of my nomination and I look forward to your questions today.
▶ 0:46:44Chair Boozman: Thank you both for your testimonies. Before I ask my questions, I would like to add letters of support from various farm groups for judge vaden and Mr. clarkson's nomination into the record. Without objection, so ordered. Ok.
▶ 0:47:09Chair Boozman: Judge vaden, if confirmed, you would be the second ranking official at the department of agriculture. How are your previous experiences in the private sector, the department and federal bench, serving you in this new role?
▶ 0:47:27Mr. Vaden: When it comes to my private sector experience, we have to remember that people engage in farming to make a profit. In order for them to feed their families, the profits that they make feed the businesses and help others feed their families in rural communities.when I think of my home county, it is the farmers who spur the economic development that exists there.
▶ 0:47:53Mr. Vaden: It will allow me to keep in mind that when we are considering rules and regulations these will have an effect on real people trying to make a living. Those people, their experiences, their needs will be first and foremost in their mind. As a judge, I have to keep in mind the questions that you, the congress, charge us with answering and we have to remain faithful to the text of the law as you have passed it.
▶ 0:48:19Chair Boozman: Mr. clarkson, as the committee continues drafting legislation like the farm bill, you rely on technical assistance from the department and ogc. How do you view ogc's role in providing technical assistance and will you commit to providing timely technical assistance to all members of the committee?
▶ 0:48:41Mr. Clarkson: Thank you for the question. I pledge to provide prompt ta in all instances. Providing technical assistance to this committee particularly in a farm bill year is of importance and something that I think is one of the most valuable contributions that the office of general counsel can make. I stand ready in the event that I am confirmed to make sure that technical assistance is timely and responsive.
▶ 0:49:07Chair Boozman: Judge vaden, given your previous experience with internal reorganizations while at usda, do you anticipate any future reorganizations that might be necessary to maximize the efficiency of the department? If so, will you commit to working with and communicating with congress if any such actions are contemplated?
▶ 0:49:40Mr. Vaden: When it comes to the actions of the department we need to communicate with you on a regular basis, whether it is reorganizations, policy matters, or anything else. Ultimately all the department does is carry out the will of congress. The united states department of agriculture has no independent authority separate from congress. It is not established I the constitution, it is a creature of statute. You have my word we will be in constant communication. My office in particular will be in constant communication about the department's initiatives.
▶ 0:50:10Chair Boozman: Mr. clarkson, how do you foresee the supreme court's decision impacting the work of the department, including technical assistance provided the congress as we work to draft a farm bill?
▶ 0:50:18Mr. Clarkson: I think loper bright puts additional stress on the words that you put on a page. It is agencies will have less deference from the judiciary with respect to agency expertise. That means that in the event we are proceeding with the rulemaking, we have to be all the more exacting in hewing closely to the statutory text.
▶ 0:50:44Mr. Clarkson: With respect to ta it is all the more important we provide responsive ta to equip you all to write clear, intelligible statutes that give us the proper guidance and direct us in a way that is sustainable in court.
▶ 0:51:00Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you very much. Thank you both for your willingness to serve. My hope is that if confirmed you will be using your experience and intelligence for good. We have a lot of headwinds, as I just explained. I also appreciated the answers on technical assistance, including if I hope we can move forward on a farm bill and both sides of the I'll need that help -- of the aisle need that help.
▶ 0:51:33Sen. Klobuchar: Since I met with both of you, things in my mind have gotten worse for farmers and ranchers. Judge vaden, in your testimony you said that you are looking forward to working on opportunities to remove trade barriers for farmers. I think about many times under presidents of both parties where we have done this. Frozen turkey during the last administration got tariffs reduced, a great help to the turkey producers in my state.
▶ 0:52:03Sen. Klobuchar: I remember trade battles that we've had with south korea over beef, we have been able to resolve it. What I'm concerned about now is that we are going in the opposite direction. That the administration's tariff policy is leading to retaliatory tariffs, fewer markets for farmers, not greater trade. I'm sure that you've heard yourself, they want trade, not aid.
▶ 0:52:28Sen. Klobuchar: Can you talk about the president's current tariffs and what you think of them. Are they harmful for farmers? Do you have any ideas of how we will get out of this mess?
▶ 0:52:40Mr. Vaden: Senator, I have to be careful with what I say in regard to tariff matters. I sit on a court that has exclusive jurisdiction to hear legal complaints that might be brought about the president's tariff actions. I hope you understand by talking a more general nature. Obviously, farmers face a number of trade barriers. Historically, we talk about trade policy people thought about manufacturing.
▶ 0:53:06Mr. Vaden: If we are going to be throwing punches on the behalf of america's economy, there are punches that need to be thrown on the behalf of american farmers, too. While tariffs are the headlines, what blocks so many american cultural products from other countries are phony sanitary concerns supposedly raising health or welfare concerns about american products.we in this room know that america's farmers
▶ 0:53:37Mr. Vaden: Produce the finest that is available in the world, and produce it in a quantity that no one else can match. This is protectionism by another name. What I hope to bring should I be confirmed as deputy of the department of agriculture is a constant reminder that we need to be on offense when it comes to american agriculture, because ultimately what we are going to be judged on is how many new markets that we've opened up for our producers where they couldn't previously sell.
▶ 0:54:06Sen. Klobuchar: I do think that you are aware, 20% of production now is exported. I feel like we are not on offense when it comes to farming. We are on defense because what I've heard from our own farmers is that they are literally getting calls that no, we don't want to buy your stuff anymore. If you are confirmed in this job, I think that the only way we go on offense is having sanity restored with respect to these tariffs.
▶ 0:54:37Sen. Klobuchar: The other thing that I continue to hear from farmer and rural leaders in my state, 14 rural county tour that I just did, is the unprecedented freeze and cancellation of agreements that create uncertainty. Last week, the department indicated that it would be providing this committee with an updated status of the programs and activities affected by the funding freeze. This morning, they sent a list that included 15 programs affected by the funding freeze.
▶ 0:55:06Sen. Klobuchar: We are currently reviewing the list. If confirmed will you commit to ensuring that the department follows through with providing a complete, accurate list and update the committee every other week? These are farmers who have no political bent, but there was a program, maybe they would do cover crops or something else, they buy something, including the precision ag that you referenced, and suddenly they find out that they are not going to get the money.
▶ 0:55:35Sen. Klobuchar: May be farmer down the street gets the money. I wonder if y would commit to that?
▶ 0:55:40Mr. Vaden: I make the same commitment to you that I did to the chairman. We need to be in communication with both sides of the aisle. Ag is historically bipartisan and I want that to continue. We will get you the information that you need.
▶ 0:55:53Sen. Klobuchar: Mr. clarkson, thank you for being here. If confirmed, will you commit to advising the secretary to comply with existing contracts and grants and un-freeze funds owed under existing contracts and grants?
▶ 0:56:15Mr. Clarkson: I pledge that I will absolutely follow the law and ensure that that is the advice that the secretary receives.
▶ 0:56:17Sen. Klobuchar: Recently, a leaked email from an employee at the agriculture research service included a long list of terms that researchers were directed to avoid. I don't want to get into the legality. We try to check if it was real or not. In a statement a ust spokesperson blamed the list on employees but did not dispute its validity. Usda is getting back to work on putting farmers first not woke ideology.
▶ 0:56:49Sen. Klobuchar: I have one focus question. The words ethanol, biofuel, and aviation fuel were included on the list. Judge vaden, do you believe that research on biofuels, ethanol, and aviation fuel is woke ideology?
▶ 0:57:09Mr. Vaden: Senator, I do not. Although it did not come up in my meeting with you, I discussed the department's support for biofuels and sustainable or synthetic, whichever term you prefer, aviation fuel, and I look forward to working with this committee on that.
▶ 0:57:26Sen. Klobuchar: I appreciate that. Judge vaden, Mr. clarkson, during your previous tent at usda, there were issues with collective bargaining agreements covering attorneys. I won't go over the whole thing. I think that the committee has been briefed on it. Mr. clarkson, if confirmed as general counsel, will you commit to work with the union in honoring the existing ogc union contract?
▶ 0:57:52Mr. Clarkson: I am aware that the union achieved a collective bargaining agreement sometime in the late 2023, I believe. The point is, there is a standing agreement and I look forward to working with the union, if I am confirmed, and appreciate at the moment that the agreement is not open for negotiation.
▶ 0:58:16Sen. Klobuchar: Do you have anything you want to add?
▶ 0:58:18Mr. Vaden: No, I think that tyler said it well.
▶ 0:58:22Sen. Klobuchar: If confirmed, we look forward to working with you and really appreciated our long discussions in my office. Thank you.
▶ 0:58:32Chair Boozman: Senator mcconnell.
▶ 0:58:35Sen. Mcconnell: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Judge, I think that your most important qualification for this job is that you are a fan of the tennessee walking horses, as we are in kentucky. Believe it or not, you know where the banana festival is in fulton county. Having checked those two boxes, you are obviously totally qualified for this job.
▶ 0:59:05Sen. Mcconnell: Look, I think that you know we are all concerned about the tariff issue. I don't know what kind of impact the agriculture department will have on the administration's tariff policy, but it is quite concerning to kentucky farmers. We are the 13th largest exporter of agricultural goods.
▶ 0:59:32Sen. Mcconnell: Believe it or not, even bourbon is considered agriculture because it is made from a whole lot of corn. Largely grown in kentucky. The canadians have taken the bourbon off the shelves. Just, taken it off the shelves. That was the first blow that they landed on us.
▶ 1:00:04Sen. Mcconnell: Give me your thoughts about where this all ends for american agriculture.
▶ 1:00:12Mr. Vaden: Senator, I appreciate the commentary, and I hope that I can see you at a future tennessee walking horse national celebration or banana festival in the years to come.
▶ 1:00:27Mr. Vaden: When it comes to your poin fears -- your fears of trade, congress has charge the secretary of agriculture and the department as a whole with not only informing the president, but informing the rest of the cabinet about the effect of items under consideration on the economy of rural america. That's what we've got to be.
▶ 1:00:53Mr. Vaden: We have got to be a voice to let all of the policymakers know what the policies they are considering will do in rural america and suggest ways that those policies can better help rural america. When it comes to my role in that, I have been called many things throughout my career. Quiet has never been one of them .
▶ 1:01:15Mr. Vaden: You can rest assured that I will be a voice within the administration letting them know where there are opportunities that they can do more for rural america and america's farmers.
▶ 1:01:28Chair Boozman: Senator smith.
▶ 1:01:32Sen. Smith: Thank you, Mr. chair. Welcome to both of you. Thank you for your willingness to serve our country. Mr. vaden, I want to start with a question for you about tribal relations.
▶ 1:01:50Sen. Smith: The united states has a legal trust and treaty obligations to tribal nations and federal agencies have a responsibility to uphold these government to government relationships with tribes. It is an important matter to usda and something that I think both republicans and democrats agree needs work and attention.
▶ 1:02:12Sen. Smith: Could you start by explaining your understanding of this trust and treaty obligation that the federal government has to tribal nations as you understand them and how you think that they should be applied in the usda?
▶ 1:02:26Mr. Vaden: As you noted, the relationship that the federal government has with indian tribes is very special. It is a creature of federal law and solely federal law. It represents commitments that the federal government has made frequently through treaties dating back centuries to commit to undertaking certain actions on the behalf of native americans. I certainly respect that.
▶ 1:02:53Mr. Vaden: I know the office of tribal relations helps us manage those relationships within the department of agriculture. We can't forget when we are dealing with native americans that we are upholding a legal responsibility that the federal government willingly took on, often through treaties, and our word needs to be our bond and we need to keep our word. It is that simple.
▶ 1:03:16Sen. Smith: Thank you for that. I think that there has been good work happening at the usda using 638 authorities to establish self-governance pilots for some of the ways that usda programs are implemented. Essentially treating tribal governments as governments who have the ability to govern how some of these programs work.
▶ 1:03:42Sen. Smith: Again, these have been broadly bipartisan, and I would hope to have an opportunity to work with you to expand some of those self-governance authorities as we look at, god willing, a farm bill at some point. I want to turn to a discussion of rural development and housing.
▶ 1:04:02Sen. Smith: I am very interested in the work that we need to do in small towns and rural communities to expand access to housing, especially affordable housing, and childcare. I hear from folks in minnesota that a shortage of housing and child care is a big limit on economic growth in small towns and rural places where there are not enough places for people to live and not enough places for child care for people -- safe places for people to take their children.
▶ 1:04:33Sen. Smith: There are good efforts in the usda on both of these issues. Could you talk a bit about how you see the issues of rural housing in particular?
▶ 1:04:43Mr. Vaden: Yes, senator. The work of the rural housing service within the mission is critical, and I only need to look out the front window of my own home to know that, because the home across the street from me was purchased with the help of a loan backed by the usda rural housing service.
▶ 1:05:03Mr. Vaden: It is active in my community and I know the vital role that it plays in ensuring that homeowners, frequently first-time homeowners, can live the american dream by purchasing a residence. I fully support that mission of rural development. I would like to also say something about your note on childcare. You are entirely correct that it is a challenge that working families across the country face.
▶ 1:05:28Mr. Vaden: I know that it has been noted before the committee that I serve in my church on the finance committee of first baptist church. One of the things that first baptist church does is provide childcare to members of the community. I can tell you from the oversight that we provide it is a struggle to make certain that we have the right employees who are paid properly and a director who meets all of the requirements of state law in order to provide this vital function to allow people to work.
▶ 1:05:59Mr. Vaden: I am familiar from my day-to-day life in union city with the problems that these areas face, and I look forward to working with you on them if confirmed.
▶ 1:06:07Sen. Smith: Last congress I worked with senator ernst and senator marshall to introduce legislation to improve the quality and availability and affordability of childcare in rural communities. President trump's secretary of labor was a leading sponsor when she was in the house, so I hope to have a chance to work with you on that piece of legislation going forward.
▶ 1:06:30Sen. Smith: Also, the rural housing services has been vitally important in rural america. This is a policy area that has not really had anybody take a hard look at it to see where there are needs for reforms and improvements for many years.
▶ 1:06:47Sen. Smith: I spent the last couple of years working with senator rounds on the rural housing service reform act to do that, support the work of the rural housing service come up date -- housing service, update it and modernize it so we can continue to provide affordable housing for working rural families and seniors. I'm excited to move this bill forward.
▶ 1:07:11Sen. Smith: My colleague, senator moran and senator fetterman, senator warnock, senator brown's are all partners -- senator rounds are all partners. Will you commit to working with me on that legislation to get it passed?
▶ 1:07:29Mr. Vaden: Absolutely.
▶ 1:07:30Sen. Smith: Mr. chair, I will seatback my time. -- cede back my time. >> thank you for being here today. Our farmers provide the highest quality and lowest cost food supply that benefits every american every day. We need to do our part to make sure that we don't take for granted this network of small family farms and ranches that we have providing that across this great nation.
▶ 1:08:01Sen. Smith: 60 million people are involved in agriculture directly or indirectly. At a time when many other industries have incredible concentration, so this is an important role that you play. I want to thank you for coming by the office and visiting with me. The first thing that I want to bring up is the section line issues in our state, which I brought up to you. It is important that our farmers and ranchers are able to utilize those sections lines. North dakota has the right to those section lines.
▶ 1:08:32Sen. Smith: Usda has the ability to make sure that we have the right to those section lines.
▶ 1:08:39Mr. Vaden: Thank you for giving me such a generous amount of your time. Like I told you at the meeting, I commit to working with you on this issue.
▶ 1:08:52Mr. Clarkson: Thank you, senator. I am very grateful for the time that you spent with me and I look forward to working with you and north dakota on the section line issue, absolutely.
▶ 1:09:04Sen. Hoeven: I appreciate that. The commodity credit corporation is under the purview of this committee but also under the ag appropriations committee as well, which I chair. That's a vital tool that we use to help our farmers, whether it is low prices, trade agreements, or even not having a farm bill with updated reference prices and the things that we need in the safety net. This is a vital tool.
▶ 1:09:34Sen. Hoeven: I want you each to please address -- will you speak to the importance of the sea in terms -- importance of the ccc in terms of having small family farms and ranches across the country that do not control their own destiny against all of these forces?
▶ 1:09:53Mr. Vaden: Senator, I served on the board of the commodity credit corporation during the president's first term and am familiar with this work and the import of every dollar that is spent through that unique vehicle of the department of agriculture. I know that there are many other agencies that would love to have a version of the commodity credit corporation. When I think about the important work that it does, I think about my fellow tennessee farmers back home.
▶ 1:10:20Mr. Vaden: Several of whom are here today, especially in the overflow room for today's hearing. When they go to their usda, fsa offices, they may not know it but there on the form it notes that many programs are funded by and under the auspices of the commodity credit corporation and it is those funds that make sure they remain on the farm and pass it to the next generation.
▶ 1:10:46Mr. Vaden: I'm aware of how important the funding mechanism is, the commodity credit corporation is as a whole to the usda, and if confirmed I look forward to getting involved in its efforts.
▶ 1:10:57Mr. Clarkson: Thank you for the question. I don't have much to add to what judge vaden has shared, but I would note that I appreciate ccc is an awesome tool for the secretary and with that power comes responsibility to open collaborative and openly with congress on substantial matters on which the ccc may take action.
▶ 1:11:17Sen. Hoeven: We used it when we set up the market facilitation program. You never know what will come along, but we need to be ready. That tool has to be there. Do you both agree?
▶ 1:11:29Mr. Vaden: 100%.
▶ 1:11:31Mr. Clarkson: Absolutely.
▶ 1:11:33Sen. Hoeven: In the farm bill, we have course -- I want to thank secretary rollins for standing up the emergency program in line with what we intended when we passed the emergency assistance at the end of the year, along with an extension on the farm bill. We asked that that be stood up in roughly three months. She has done that. I really want to commend her. That is how it is supposed to work.
▶ 1:12:03Sen. Hoeven: We appreciate you coming on board. She needs your assistance, more folks on board, so we need to get you confirmed, but we have to get the farm bill done. That will help, but we have to get the farm bill done. The keys to that farm bill in my opinion are enhancing crop insurance to make it more affordable, both at the enterprise level and with the supplemental coverage option, and updating reference prices in the countercyclical safety net.
▶ 1:12:31Sen. Hoeven: Do you agree and feel that those are key items to have in the farm bill and will you support the efforts to get that done, each of you?
▶ 1:12:40Mr. Vaden: The farm safety net needs to reflect the actual cost of production. It doesn't come anywhere close to that currently. I agree that it needs updating and I look forward, if confirmed, to working with you on that.
▶ 1:12:50Mr. Clarkson: I agree with your formulation and I look forward to leveraging the resources of ogc to ensure that you have all of the technical assistance needed.
▶ 1:13:01Sen. Hoeven: The last question for each of you is, in our state, and senator klobuchar and senator smith's state, the sugar beet industry is huge, not only in terms of the growers in both states but all of the processing that we do. It is a many billion dollar industry in the red river valley in the north. I understand how the sugar program works and the importance of it.will you continue to support and enforce it?
▶ 1:13:32Mr. Vaden: Answer to all of those questions is yes. I was involved when I was general counsel in the first term in managing that program, so I am familiar with it and I look forward to working with you on it to ensure that it is properly managed as congress has stipulated in statute.
▶ 1:13:50Mr. Clarkson: Yes, senator. I look forward to enforcing the law.
▶ 1:13:54Sen. Hoeven: Again, Mr. c1
▶ 1:14:02Sen. Hoeven : He recognize the importance of the program?
▶ 1:14:07Mr. Clarkson: I do.
▶ 1:14:10Sen. Hoeven : The secretary nees more of you on board to get these things done on behalf of farmers and ranchers. Thank you for being here today.
▶ 1:14:21Chair Boozman: Thank you. Senator lujan.
▶ 1:14:26Sen. Lujan: Thank you for holding this hearing. Welcome to both of you today as well. Mr. chairman, I have been chatting with constituents a bit at home, whether at the grocery store or in and around the communities I represent and live in. I have been hearing concern.
▶ 1:14:55Sen. Lujan: Folks describing confusion around many of the programs they cannot from usda -- count on from usda. There was an effort to slash funding for food banks, the ongoing threat of layoffs.
▶ 1:15:16Sen. Lujan: Things are getting harder for folks back home, especially farmers and ranchers who depend on these programs, these food programs that were cut. No one should forget it is local food producers and farmers and ranchers that sell them the food. When you decide to plant the seed and you are a farmer, you don't just do it because you dream about it. You plant for a year. Last year these farmer started talking to the food banks saying, what are you going to buy?
▶ 1:15:48Sen. Lujan: If I'm going to sell, I have to make sure my crops will be in place. You will know this. At the 11th hour, for the road to be pulled from them, are they supposed to find other buyers? What is it mean to the family? To the farm? That is no way to do things. Giving them time to plant, the programs that will be cut, tell them it will be cut in three months or six month for nine months. Not two days. There is a better day to do this.
▶ 1:16:17Sen. Lujan: Folks at home are not happy, including people that tell me they voted for this president. Dear concerned. -- they are concerned. I hope we can take this to everyone who will listen. Mr. chairman, I have talked a lot about these than ditches -- earthen ditches. I still dig mine. You have to get a shovel and make it look nice.
▶ 1:16:48Sen. Lujan: Mom will come look at it the way that dad taught me. There was an effort going back to my time in the house, a previous farm bill we were able to get support for these irrigation systems in new mexico. I think usd announced a $50 million grant last year to help conserve much needed water.
▶ 1:17:13Sen. Lujan: It is dirt from where the mountains are, the snow, and it gets to the farmers and the rest. It was signed last december, yet the administration refused to honor that grant award for these folks. These are all volunteers. Farmers that want to plant. They don't want paperwork. Vaden --Mr.
▶ 1:17:38Sen. Lujan: Vaden, should us da honor those granted medially?
▶ 1:17:48Mr. Vaden: I believe usda should follow the law. I'm not familiar with the particular provisions of the grants but usda should follow the law.
▶ 1:18:00Sen. Lujan: Are you familiar with the executive orders?
▶ 1:18:04Mr. Vaden: As they have been publicly reported.
▶ 1:18:07Sen. Lujan: Do you feel water conservation would be in violation of any of the executive orders you are familiar with that have been publicly made available?
▶ 1:18:17Mr. Vaden: I have visited new mexico many times, including when I was general counsel. The office of general counsel has an office in albuquerque. Whenever I took a trip as general counsel and made certain to visit a national forest nearby. During my time in new mexico, one of the national foresters took me and showed me the water conservation measures you have been talking about. I have seen them firsthand.
▶ 1:18:46Mr. Vaden: I'm aware of how important they are in that section of the country. Water conservation is an issue we need to pay attention to if the west is to continue to grow. I agree that it is an important priority.
▶ 1:18:58Sen. Lujan: Amen to that. You said that better than I could. I appreciate that, Mr. vaden. One other concern I've heard from folks back home as it pertains to the executive orders. Over 60% of the population and over 40% of the farmers and ranchers identify a hispanic, native american, or another community in new mexico.
▶ 1:19:24Sen. Lujan: The concerns I'm hearing based on these executive orders targeting diversity initiatives is how it might impact farmers and ranchers in the programs they rely on. One concern is will usda meet with these farmers and ranchers who make up new mexico? Yes or no, under president trump's executive order with staff attend a meeting with hispanic farmers be in violation of usda's policy?
▶ 1:19:50Mr. Vaden: Merely attending a meeting, no. Usda should interact with a farmer regardless of what color their skin is or anything else. What a person's braces should have no bearing on the degree or ability of them to receive services from any federal agency.
▶ 1:20:07Sen. Lujan: Another amen, sir.
▶ 1:20:09Mr. Clarkson: Panel think I can save much better than the judge.
▶ 1:20:13Sen. Lujan: I appreciate that very much. I hope that is shared, just getting to sit down and ask questions, things of that nature. There should not be a concern about that. I appreciate the clarity in your responses. Woodworking with awarding funds or engaging with one of those executive associations, beer geisha and associations be in violation -- the irrigation associations be in violation of the policy?
▶ 1:20:41Mr. Vaden: As you have described it, working on water conservation measures, we have an entire agency that does nothing but that in the natural resources conservation service. I can't imagine interactions echo one on on a day-to-day basis would violate the executive order.
▶ 1:20:57Sen. Lujan: Anything you want to add, sir?
▶ 1:21:00Mr. Clarkson: I'm not familiar with all the details. At the level of generality you have used to describe it, I don't for see an issue.
▶ 1:21:10Sen. Lujan: I have many other questions but I will set them into the record. Thank you for being here. Thank you for your clarity on your responses. I think a lot of people at home will appreciate that when they see this. Thank you.
▶ 1:21:23Chair Boozman: Senator justice.
▶ 1:21:28Sen. Justice: Thank you, Mr. chairman and ranking member's. I would like to start off by saying my family has been in the farming business for a long time. We are still in the farming business. You would be surprised to think I myself have probably planted and harvested hundreds of thousands of acres of crops. I know a little about this.
▶ 1:22:01Sen. Justice: We farm in multiple states. I know about what goes on in multiple states. I thank you for welcoming my family. My bride kathy of 700 years ago and our wonderful daughter and even little babydog. I would like to talk with you at a level of 100,000 feet just for this moment. Let me say a few things.
▶ 1:22:32Sen. Justice: Our farmers in this country today, are ranchers, our -- our ranchers and our foresters, so many people are hurting. Really hurting. To say they are challenged today, to say that there is uncertainty around them today is such an understatement that it is ridiculous. It is totally ridiculous.
▶ 1:23:00Sen. Justice: Now if we could step back from it and say, what is he really talking about? Think about it. Think about this. Whether they be trade barriers, tariffs, input costs, machinery costs, nitrogen costs, natural gas and how it influences everything, your fuel costs. After you go through all that, what is a farmer do at night?
▶ 1:23:32Sen. Justice: He may worry about bugs or disease or dry weather or terrible rains. Absolutely, you cannot imagine what these people do for all of us every single day. Every day. I have been there this before but all of us, you open the doors to kroger and food as far as you can possibly see.
▶ 1:24:00Sen. Justice: Let's just step back and think for one second about the american farmer and what they give. Can you imagine on every american farmer's doorstep today there is a bad actor that is trying to buy that land? What if they sell it? What if they do that? What is it leave all of us?
▶ 1:24:31Sen. Justice: -- where does it leave all of us? In a tough spot. You better awaken to that. Whether it be -- that american farmer sitting out there getting a return on he's of almost nothing and driving a 12-year-old pickup truck and he loves what he's doing so much that he doesn't want to leave for nothing. He doesn't want to leave that farm for nothing. Absolutely.
▶ 1:25:02Sen. Justice: It has been in his family for generation after generation. They love it beyond good sense. Way beyond good financial sense. The bad actors are standing there. All of us have got so much at stake here stake her, stake here, it is unbelievable. We have to have a farm bill. We have to all of us say we are all in. We are all in and we have to do something about it.
▶ 1:25:33Sen. Justice: Look, there's a great coach right here. Coach says there are two great coaches, the best two coaches on the planet and the senate. -- in the senate. Where the only two. Maybe we are the best two. I'm telling you, these two men right here are the real deal. I know it. I have researched it. I am all in. The last thing I would say is this.
▶ 1:26:04Sen. Justice: Doug burgum called me the the day. We were talking. Here is what he said. I have got tens of thousands of employees at interior. Tens and tens of thousands. Brooke rollins is trying to do a great job. Our chairman here is trying to do a great job. You have got to have the people. They have to have them confirmed. They have to have them confirmed now.
▶ 1:26:35Sen. Justice: Let me end by saying this again. Thank you for being kind to my family. I absolutely mean this with all my soul. We have got to do any and everything we possibly can to help our farmers. To help our ranchers. We have got to step up. If we don't step up, america, we are going to regret it like you can't imagine.
▶ 1:27:03Sen. Justice: All we have got to do is have those bad actors have enough control and we will pay like you can't imagine. It is time for us to step up, america. I don't have any questions. I know they are the best, Mr. chairman. I think you so much for allowing me the time to talk.
▶ 1:27:28Sen. Justice: Now I will go on to another committee meeting and I will take baby dog after that and get chicken nuggets. God bless each and everyone of you.
▶ 1:27:38Chair Boozman: Senator tuberville.
▶ 1:27:41Sen. Tuberville: Thank you. I just had my first picture taken with baby dog so I'm excited. Glad you brought him today.
▶ 1:27:56Sen. Justice: It's a girl.
▶ 1:27:58Sen. Tuberville: Thank you for being here. As senator justice said, I've had to put in a new phone line to the farmers. It is almost over. They can't even see the light at the end of the tunnel. We need a farm bill. We need to help them. We need to understand the situation. Thank god for the tariffs. President trump is trying to right the ship. We have to help our farmers.
▶ 1:28:28Sen. Tuberville: Mr. vaden, domestic peanut growers in my state and across the country have been at a competitive disadvantage due to nontariff trade barriers on peanuts from aflatoxin in the european union. Would you commit to ensuring usda and ustr would work together on president trump's agenda to reduce trade barriers and prioritize market access for our farmers?
▶ 1:28:58Mr. Vaden: Absolutely. I know you just doing this but earlier in response to a question from one of your colleagues I noted when it comes to american agriculture, often times the barriers that are keeping us out of the market are not formal tariffs, not taxes. You noted with regard to your peanut farmers in alabama, they are phony side of sanitary concerns. They cannot be allowed --
▶ 1:29:26Sen. Tuberville: What is that mean?
▶ 1:29:28Mr. Vaden: A phony concern about a health issue. Whether it is human or animal or plant. They use it as a barrier to keep our products out. Our, products grown by american farmers are grown with the best technology the best scientific advancement, and there should be no concern from any international purchaser that if they are buying american they are getting anything other than the best. I have no problem voicing this to the president's trade team.
▶ 1:29:58Sen. Tuberville: The biden administration made individuals reliant on the snap program. The federal government -- and the federal government to provide snap. When need to get americans back to work. I think we all agree with that. Due to the biden administration's 21% increase in snap benefits through a thrifty food plan update amounting to over $250 billion in spending without congressional authority.
▶ 1:30:28Sen. Tuberville: Do either of you have ideas on how to enforce existing work requirements for snap recipients?
▶ 1:30:34Mr. Vaden: Senator, I think your question points out something important. The work requirement that is contained within snap is not voluntary. It is a statutory mandate passed by the congress. Failing to enforce the work requirement is not a policy choice. It is a choice not to enforce the plain text of a law that congress has passed.
▶ 1:31:00Mr. Vaden: I appreciate you pointing out the purpose of snap should be gauged not on how any people are on it at any given time, but rather, as you pointed out, how successful the program is at giving people a helping hand when they need it and then working to transition them to self-sufficiency and entering the workforce so they can become self-sustaining members of society. That is how we ought to be judging the success of snap.
▶ 1:31:31Mr. Vaden: How successful it is in helping people make the transition in the work requirement is an important part of that.
▶ 1:31:37Sen. Tuberville: Thank you.
▶ 1:31:39Mr. Clarkson: Thank you for the question. There are work requirements associated with snap. I would note on my wife's behalf who was in auburn a graduate -- an auburn graduate.
▶ 1:31:56Sen. Tuberville: We want to take care of people. Everybody. But we are like a business. We run this thintoo far, there will not be money for anyone. We are heading in that direction. We need to be a precursor for what is going on in the country and watch what is happening and understand we need to help people but we can't help everybody because they don't what to do anything.
▶ 1:32:24Sen. Tuberville: We have got to understand the significance of our debt and the direction all these entitlements give out to. We are a generous country. We always have been. I know you guys will do a great job. We are looking forward to voting for you. I turn it over to my colleague. I can see him coming and he's ready to go.
▶ 1:32:53Chair Boozman: Senator welch.
▶ 1:32:56Sen. Welch: I appreciate that, coach. Thank you very much. One question I have, you indicated you were proud to outsource some of the ogc work on the farm loans so usda could foreclose on defaulted loans. Describe that.
▶ 1:33:23Sen. Welch: Three your previous tenure in the general counsel's office, did you privatize or streamline how farm loans were handled in the office? Can you explain what changes you made and how you saw the changes as beneficial?
▶ 1:33:38Mr. Vaden: Senator, obviously during my previous time as general counsel we didn't want anyone to default on their loan. When the federal government gives a loan, we want them to pay it back with interest. That doesn't happen every time. We have a duty to the taxpayer to ensure --
▶ 1:34:01Sen. Welch: I know all that. I'm asking about the process. If you lend money, we would like to have it repaid. You don't need to explain that. The process is what I'm asking about.
▶ 1:34:14Mr. Vaden: It took the office of general counsel far longer to resolve a loan that I gone into default than it did the private sector. In the private sector, resolving defaulted loans are handled by law firms that specialize largely in nothing but that. They are expert in doing it. It is all they do.
▶ 1:34:37Mr. Vaden: I thought it would be a good idea to take that loan resolution effort, do with the private sector does, and have a contract process whereby people could put in proposals to serve as usda's agents to do this.
▶ 1:34:54Sen. Welch: I get that. It is efficiency. There is an issue with private debt collectors. Overly aggressive tactics. Is that something you are concerned about?
▶ 1:35:07Mr. Vaden: Senator, this was not debt collection in the sense that these weren't people calling up harassing. It was in instances -- these were instances where usda must claim the collateral and sell it to preserve the principal that it loaned.
▶ 1:35:27Sen. Welch: Maybe I'm not clear. You make a loan, you want it repaid. Some farmers have through circumstances beyond their control have trouble sometimes repaying those. A bank will often times -- a private-sector entity -- work with the debtor, understanding they have an obligation but work with them.
▶ 1:35:54Sen. Welch: Judgments have to be made about it is feasible to work something out that allows the debtor to keep the farm and repay the loan. The concern I have is that the private sector generally -- collect the loan so that they make money as opposed to in many cases a private bank that both
▶ 1:36:25Sen. Welch: Wants to collect the loan because they have a duty to their shareholders, their depositors but also want to keep the farm going if at all possible. I'm asking you to tell me what kind of steps you will take to give the opportunity for someone, former, blue through no fault of his or her own has default it but wants to get back on track.
▶ 1:36:51Mr. Vaden: I think you for the clarification. The office of general counsel only takes over when the agency, usually the farm services agency, has determined efforts of the like you have described either would not be successful or have not been successful. It's not the office of general counsel that makes the initial determination to go to resolve the defaulted loan.
▶ 1:37:18Mr. Vaden: It is instead referred to the office of general counsel once the agency makes a determination the steps you suggest either have not worked or will not work.
▶ 1:37:26Sen. Welch: There is no capacity in the office of general counsel in the process of working with the debtor, the farmer, to go back to usda and say we have a situation here?
▶ 1:37:42Mr. Vaden: The relationship is held between the county office and the farmer. They are the experts when it comes to servicing the loan, the longtime relationship they have with the loan holder in many cases. They are the front-line people who service the loan.
▶ 1:38:05Mr. Vaden: It's only turned over to general counsel if there's a question in terms what the loan allows or doesn't, poor decision that further efforts would be made futile.
▶ 1:38:15Sen. Welch: So, you are hands off is what I'm hearing on this question of whether some kind of workout arrangement would be accomplished. I'm in favor of workout arrangements.
▶ 1:38:28Mr. Vaden: That is not handled by the office of general counsel. That is handled by the farm services agency.
▶ 1:38:35Sen. Welch: Ok. Mr. chairman, I think that that's have to be repaid and nobody more than farmers understands that. They have to borrow money. They are good on their word. If they are unable to repay it, it is through circumstances beyond their control.
▶ 1:38:56Sen. Welch: I'm not asking for a ride off but I'm asking for serious efforts to work with farmers in tough situations maybe because of the weather events or commodity price collapse. My hope is somehow that would be part of the equation. Thank you. I yield back.
▶ 1:39:17Chair Boozman: Senator marshall.
▶ 1:39:19Sen. Marshall: Welcome to our nominees. Judge, my family goes back a hundred years and I think yours are 100 years older than my family's. I would like to think my great-grandfather, your great, great con great c grandfather were the original conservationists.
▶ 1:39:46Sen. Marshall: They want to leave a cleaner, healthier, safer than we found it. I will note my farmers and ranchers depend upon certain pesticides and fertilizers. There's a great opportunity for rescission agriculture. We are growing more with less. How can you help defend the crop protection rescission act tools that farmers rely upon?
▶ 1:40:12Mr. Vaden: I think you for the question. I appreciate how you have linked -- the linkages proper -- conservation with the scientific advancements and chemicals that make that possible. No tlil agriculture -- no till agriculture was launched in tennessee.
▶ 1:40:40Mr. Vaden: An initial effort at evangelizing this notion you do not have to plow a field every year, which is bad for soil health. That only becomes possible if you have in your toolkit as a former the amazing chemicals that are provided in order to clear the land so you can plant.
▶ 1:41:01Mr. Vaden: If you take the chemicals away, you are taking a tool out of the toolkit of the farmer and requiring him to revert, in my view, to somewhat antiquated plow. That is bad for soil health and quite frankly it threatens a lot of the work done by the old soil conservation service and the national resources conservation service to instill best practices in farms.
▶ 1:41:26Mr. Vaden: As you know, if you destroy the soil, it's eating into your principal to pay living expenses. It is going to bite you very quickly with time. You are destroying your most valuable --
▶ 1:41:38Sen. Marshall: Are you committed to protect -- making sure the guard rails our loose enough to have access that they need with an eye towards conservation?
▶ 1:41:51Mr. Vaden: What impressed me is how thorough the environ mental protection agency is when they study these tools -- environmental protection agency is when they study these tools. We care about the environment and we don't want to do undue harm to it. If confirmed, I look forward to continuing work with other agencies to ensure farmers have the tools they need.
▶ 1:42:13Sen. Marshall: Mr. clarkson, my next question. Let's talk about the ccc. It has been used for different purposes. I was concerned with the last administration, the secretary of agriculture used it to promote green new deal type initiatives. It feels like it was outside the intention of the ccc.
▶ 1:42:41Sen. Marshall: Is the use of the ccc by the previous administration was legal? How do we ensure the ccc is used for its intended use of supporting farmers and not backing special-interest?
▶ 1:42:50Mr. Clarkson: I think the prior administration's use of ccc required quite a bit of legal creativity that strained statutory text and practice in a manner I don't think I anticipate if I am confirmed as general counsel.
▶ 1:43:09Sen. Marshall: Lesko back to judge vaden and talk about proposition 12. It dictates, in my humble opinion and tries to tell kansas farmers how to grow pigs. It is hard for that small producer -- if california has a way, texas has away -- a way, it is hard for my small producers.
▶ 1:43:36Sen. Marshall: Is there anything usda can do to ensure that certain states are not able to dictate production standards for livestock producers nationwide?
▶ 1:43:45Mr. Vaden: I'm well aware of the challenge such state propositions provide farmers who have to operate in a national market. When I was general counsel we were very active in supporting the efforts of those who challenged the proposition. Those efforts ended up to be bipartisan.
▶ 1:44:04Mr. Vaden: Although it is not frequent noted, both first trump administration and biden administration opposed in the federal courts proposition 12 on the grounds of their believeth e and violated the dormant clause. In the opinion written by the supreme court, they basically put it in congress's hands and said that congress has the power under the commerce clause to stop this if it wants.
▶ 1:44:36Mr. Vaden: When it comes to administrative authorities usda might have, if any are in existence they would have to be given by congress.
▶ 1:44:43Sen. Marshall: Ok. Mr. clarkson, anything to add on the proposition 12 issue?
▶ 1:44:55Mr. Clarkson: Nothing substantively. The office of general counsel stands ready to help this committee in the event it wants additional linkage or technical assistance on a potential fix.
▶ 1:45:07Sen. Marshall: Dealing with the trade deficit. 1.2 trillion dollars trade deficit for the first time in my lifetime. And agriculture deficit. We are importing more food than exporting. You probably are as knowledgeable as anybody in the room is on international trade policies. In your new role what can you do to decrease the international trade deficit? How will you promote strengthening domestic demand for agriculture products?
▶ 1:45:35Mr. Vaden: I think you hit on it in your questions. We have to promote, and that involves salesmanship. The secretary committed to visiting six countries this year in terms of promoting more ag exports. No one else is going to sell our stuff. We have to sell it. Secondly, we have to keep track of foreign trade barriers, whether they are tariff or nontariff related.
▶ 1:46:01Mr. Vaden: We have to remind the trade team as they are looking for new trade deals, standing up for other american industries, they need to stand for american echo culture and oppose these efforts that are trying to keep our wonderful farmers' products out of the international market.
▶ 1:46:14Sen. Marshall: I look forward to discussing the canadian milk policy. You can that to me someday. I appreciate it.
▶ 1:46:23Chair Boozman: Probably along with me for the cup of coffee. Senator fischer.
▶ 1:46:33Sen. Fischer: --
▶ 1:46:35Chair Boozman: I apologize.
▶ 1:46:41Sen. Warnock: I'm happy to have you follow canadian milk policy. Usda has a long and unfortunate history of racial discrimination against minority farmers. This has been well documented. In fact, usda has been sued a number of times over claims of discrimination by minority farmers and farm lending programs. Mr. vaden, you are nominated to be the number two senior official.
▶ 1:47:12Sen. Warnock: As the number two official, are you familiar with the lawsuits?
▶ 1:47:16Mr. Vaden: Yes, I am.
▶ 1:47:17Sen. Warnock: Mr. clarkson, you have been dominant -- nominated to be the top lawyer. Are you familiar with the lawsuits?
▶ 1:47:24Mr. Clarkson: I am.
▶ 1:47:28Sen. Warnock: Mr. vaden, do you agree that usda has a well-documented record of racial discrimination against minority farmers?
▶ 1:47:37Mr. Vaden: I do agree there are court rulings who have found that, yes.
▶ 1:47:42Sen. Warnock: Do you agree there's a well-documented record of racial discrimination against minority farmers?
▶ 1:47:48Mr. Vaden: Yes, senator.
▶ 1:47:50Sen. Warnock: It has been made clear that usda has in fact is committed against minority farmers. This disparity did not just happen decades ago. As recently as 2022, black farmers were denied usda direct loans more than any other racial group.
▶ 1:48:12Sen. Warnock: That is why today's efforts to increase equitable participation in the farm lending program of farmers who historically experience discrimination is so important. The 2501 program, which receives mandatory funding from congress helps maximize usda's outreach efforts to help ensure underserved farmers can equitably participate in usda's programs.
▶ 1:48:38Sen. Warnock: Congress put in place mandatory set-asides, cost sharees, and fee waivers. Mr. vaden, will you follow congressional mandates to ensure these programs are implemented as required by law and at the funding levels appropriate by congress?
▶ 1:48:57Mr. Vaden: I will follow the law.
▶ 1:49:00Sen. Warnock: Mr. clarkson, if confirmed as usda's top lawyer, would you advise usda to follow current law?
▶ 1:49:10Mr. Clarkson: In all instances I will advise the secretary to follow the law.
▶ 1:49:16Sen. Warnock: Moving on to the next topic, tariffs. Last week president trump launched a trade war and imposed heavy tariffs on our trading partners and closes allies, which is in my view a tax paid by americans. Since then, the markets have seen a massive drop. Investors are losing confidence. You have been working as a judge on the court of international trade, correct?
▶ 1:49:47Sen. Warnock: Is market uncertainty brought about by tariffs helpful or hurtful for farmers?
▶ 1:49:51Mr. Vaden: Senator, I don't think market uncertainty is helpful for anyone. The question is how long he goes on.
▶ 1:50:00Sen. Warnock: Do you care to say more about that?
▶ 1:50:03Mr. Vaden: The market is adjusting to the current situation. I have to be careful what I say with regard to the presidents trade actions. For any market participant, what you want is to know the price you are going toet at the time you wish to sell. That is what makes agriculture unique.
▶ 1:50:24Mr. Vaden: When the farmer plants his crop in the field, he does not know what price he's going to get and he's making a bet on the future the likes of which most other industries don't have to engage in. That's why the committee's work is important providing help to farmers so they can continue to provide food.
▶ 1:50:40Sen. Warnock: Farmers on the ground in georgia now are very worried. I'm talking to them all the time . The american farm bureau spoke to us. Folks are very concerned about uncertainty around their business. It is a very difficult business. The margins of profitability are very narrow. There's a lot you do not control. The weather, that kind of thing. We have seen this before.
▶ 1:51:11Sen. Warnock: It happened during the first trump administration. There was an effort to provide some relief to farmers at the amount of $28 billion of taxpayer money that had to go to help farmers out of the trade war. You said it depends on how long they are dealing with the issue.
▶ 1:51:34Sen. Warnock: Can you say anything in terms of your role there at usda if confirmed that would give farmers in georgia some assurance this will not go on?
▶ 1:51:44Mr. Vaden: My role as stephanie secretary of agriculture -- deputy secretary of agriculture is to be a voice within the administration so they know what is going on and transmit the farmers' concerns to policymakers so they can take them into account and make the policies that will hopefully lead to real prosperity.
▶ 1:52:04Sen. Warnock: What will you do to make sure the farmers in georgia are not heard by the trade war?
▶ 1:52:09Mr. Vaden: The secretary will watch the situation. She's cognizant of the programs which you have referenced, which were run through the commodity credit corporation and the president -- in the president's first term. She has committed to stepping in. I take the secretary at her word. It's important that we watch, wait, and see what happens. You have to measure twice before you cut. I think that is what she is wisely doing.
▶ 1:52:37Sen. Warnock: You say measure once before you cut. Twice before you cut once. I'm not sure that's what farmers felt last week when they heard these announcements. I think it felt certain, very sudden, and erratic. Farmers are already operating on very narrow margins. They have been hard hit by recent disasters, that kind of thing.
▶ 1:53:08Sen. Warnock: Again, what assurances can you give me that I can pass on to the farmers in georgia that you are paying attention to what they are dealing with now on the ground? They are deeply concerned.
▶ 1:53:18Mr. Vaden: Senator, I have been a farmer myself. I live in a community that is full of farmers. The concerns your farmers are sharing with you, I have little doubt they are not much different than what I'm hearing when I'm at home in rural tennessee. You can rest assured those concerns --
▶ 1:53:38Sen. Warnock: Do you think trade wars are good for farmers or bad for farmers?
▶ 1:53:42Mr. Vaden: It's difficult is a federal judge to opine on whether I think a particular policy that might come before me as a judge is good or bad. I can say as a judge I definitely see both sides of the equation.
▶ 1:53:55Sen. Warnock: I will opine. I think trade wars are better farmers. Thank you.
▶ 1:54:02Chair Boozman: Senator fischer.
▶ 1:54:05Sen. Fischer: Thank you for putting yourselves forward to serve your country. Thank you for taking time to visit with me last week. I appreciated it. If confirmed, one of your roles as being in abbasid or for agriculture and rural america -- an ambassador for agriculture and rural america throughout the government.
▶ 1:54:29Sen. Fischer: We talked about nebraska's ag economy in the impact retaliatory tariffs can have on our state. How would you advise the secretary and work with the rest of the administration to protect our ag producers from negative impacts of retaliation? Importantly, what steps would you advise to help our ag producers that access to new markets?
▶ 1:54:57Sen. Fischer: We remember the previous administration left this country with a huge trade deficit, $49 billion. We want to change the course there. How are we going to deal with the tariffs that we are hearing a lot about?
▶ 1:55:19Sen. Fischer: How do we work together across government again as we talked about in my office to be able to promote access to new markets and develop the new trade we so desperately need with agriculture but also with manufacturing?
▶ 1:55:35Mr. Vaden: I appreciate the time you kindly gave me to sit and talk about these concerns as they affect the farmers in nebraska. When it comes to the role of the department of agriculture, you hit on the word that is correct. The ambassadorial role. Thanks to this committee we now have a mission area and undersecretary that has as his full-time job trying to open up markets for trade.
▶ 1:56:09Mr. Vaden: When I served in the first trump administration, one of the first things I did when I came into the department was help the secretary stand of the area. We have an outstanding nominee for that position. I know he will soon be performed this committee. I hope this committee will confirm him quickly as well so he can aid secretary rawlins as she announced six visits to international markets and it's vital we open them up to more american agricultural production.
▶ 1:56:38Mr. Vaden: The ambassadorial role is not limited to going and visiting foreign partners. As you quite rightly noted, it's important we act as an ambassador to our fellow agencies and remind them that the policies they are considering have effects in rural america that may differ from those that they have in metropolitan areas of the country and work with them to ensure the policies they seek to enact do not have unforeseen negative consequences in rural america.
▶ 1:57:08Mr. Vaden: I never had a problem picking up the phone and calling a friend at another cabinet agency. If confirmed, I will be working those phones once again.
▶ 1:57:15Sen. Fischer: Thank you. We talked about the importance of ag research. Making sure that research will be aligned with the producers' needs. The focus should be on producers' needs. We have been working on an ag research service facility located at the university of nebraska lincoln.
▶ 1:57:42Sen. Fischer: I look forward to working with you on that so we can get that completed. This is a facility that can really highlight how usda works in collaboration with our land-grant universities and private industry to drive that innovative research that is needed.
▶ 1:58:02Sen. Fischer: Could you talk a little about usda's role in agri-search -- ag research ecosystem and improving ars?
▶ 1:58:14Mr. Vaden: Our missionary is vital to the future of agriculture. The work that is done there literally plants the seeds for profits that are to come in the future. As you noted, it is vital that research be laser focused on the needs of those who are engaged in production agriculture. That is the key constituency we serve at the department of agriculture. That is what our research should be focused on.
▶ 1:58:42Mr. Vaden: That goes not just for the agricultural research service, but for the economics research service and all the other agency components of the ree mission area.
▶ 1:58:52Sen. Fischer: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:58:58Chair Boozman: Thank you, senator fischer. I will go vote in a second. That is the only thing we have right here, the vote. I will turn things over to senator klobuchar and senator moran is coming back. He had to go vote. He's on his way back to ask questions. It should just be a minute or two. Again, I want to thank you all for being here.
▶ 1:59:27Chair Boozman: I think you did an excellent job today. I want to thank our staff and senator klobuchar's staff for the work of making all this happen. Again, thank you. Senator klobuchar.
▶ 1:59:47Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you. I want to talk a little about the rule of law that has been advanced in other committees before other nominees. I want to make very clear that if an executive order were directly opposed to binding supreme court precedent, do you believe usda can follow that executive order?
▶ 2:00:17Sen. Klobuchar: I guess I would start with you, Mr. clarkson.
▶ 2:00:19Mr. Clarkson: Thank you for the question. In the event there is precedent that is all in all fours with whatever the issue is, the supreme court precedent would likely control.
▶ 2:00:31Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you. Senator schiff has just arrived. Are we ready to go?
▶ 2:00:41Sen. Schiff: Yes, I am. I wanted to ask about the specialty crop challenges we face in california. In particular, if there is a relief fund that is established during the first trump administration when there was such a fund, a specialty crop farmers did not participate heavily and those in california
▶ 2:01:12Sen. Schiff: Participated less. Let me get your thoughts on how we can address that and if there is going to be another fund that is established, how do we make sure there is equitable distribution of resources so crop farmers can make use of it? What accounted for the desperate use -- disparate use of those funds previously?
▶ 2:01:35Sen. Schiff: Are there barriers to specialty crop farmers being able to access the program because of how it is structured or other reasons why there was relatively low participation?
▶ 2:01:45Mr. Vaden: I appreciate the question. Your staff are sparing time for me to talk with them late last week. Your state pose agricultural bounty is unique in our country. I saw that firsthand when I visited when I was general counsel and watched them put in the tomato crop. That is something you do not get in west tennessee. We got to keep in mind we are in favor of all farmers.
▶ 2:02:15Mr. Vaden: Regardless of what crop it is they are putting in the ground. Whether it is a traditional crop or a specialty crop, we need to be in favor of all of them because we want all of them to succeed. When it comes to your question about prior programs, anything would be speculation but one thing comes to mind in particular.
▶ 2:02:38Mr. Vaden: Because there are so many traditional agricultural programs available to crop farmers, they are very knowledgeable and used to interacting with usda and the fsa county offices. There are fewer such programs available for specialty crop farmers. They may not be as knowledgeable when it comes available as to how one signs up and how the farm process works.
▶ 2:03:06Mr. Vaden: That may indicate there is education that needs to be done when there are opportunities for money to go out. For me, when I think about american agriculture, it makes no difference whether it is one of your wonderful farmers in the central valley or it is someone growing row crops in the midwest or a livestock operation somewhere. They are all farmers and we should support them all.
▶ 2:03:29Sen. Schiff: I appreciate that. I would love to work to make sure if there is such a program established again we make sure the specialty crop farmers can participate. A number of them were deeply impacted by tariffs in the first trump administration. Depending on the longevity of these tariffs, they may be deeply impacted again. I would welcome the chance to work together to try to address the issue.
▶ 2:03:59Sen. Schiff: Frankly, even beyond the tariff issue, just to make sure specialty crop farmers get the attention that they need and deserve. A lot of the research efforts, the marketing programs that analyze new ways of preventing infestations and disease, but also that help specialty crop farmers around the world. I want to make sure the programs are robust and keep that industry. Healthy.
▶ 2:04:30Sen. Schiff: I think you and I will yield back.
▶ 2:04:32Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you very much. I appreciate this. I think we will take a little recess while we wait for senator moran. That is what we are going to do. We will wait a minute. Thank you.
▶ 2:06:58Sen. Klobuchar: >> the senate committee will come back to order. There is a lesson for me to be learned. I went from that end of the table to this end of the table. There is hope that you can arise to the occasion but hopefully longer term than that. I'm pleased to be back and sit or I am assigned to sit during the committee hearings and I thank both witnesses are being here. I want to ask a couple of questions and then I will check with senator klobuchar and we will conclude the hearing.
▶ 2:07:31Sen. Klobuchar: You and I, judge vaden, had a conversation I want to reiterate. You are engaged in efforts in the earlier trump administration in regard to location of department of agricultural agencies in places outside of washington, D.C. one place that occurred was kansas city. Kansas city, missouri. Perhaps a few miles off course but in our neighborhood.
▶ 2:08:01Sen. Klobuchar: What I discovered was while the biden administration's secretary vilsack did not overturn the decision, he really did not enforce it. Most of the employees who work in those two offices appear remotely. I would like to know your reaction and I would like to hear generally what plans you are aware of or would encourage or support that deal with other agencies and their location outside of the washington, D.C. metropolitan area.
▶ 2:08:31Mr. Vaden: You are correct. I was involved in providing legal advice which made the move for those agencies possible. To the kansas city area. Those two agencies, nifa and ers, are vital to the work of agriculture. It's a good thing they are located out in rural america, closer to the people whom they serve.
▶ 2:08:59Mr. Vaden: It has been publicly announced the national institute of new director, Dr. jay hamby. He's been on the job for a short period. As he's a proud tennessean, I have come to know him and I know what of the first things he did, he postponed one of his orientation sessions to do this, was fly out to kansas city and welcome the employees of his agency when they were brought
▶ 2:09:30Mr. Vaden: Back to the office in kansas city to let them know their work was valued and let them know they are a vital part of usda . That important first step bodes well for the agency's future in the kansas city area.
▶ 2:09:50Sen. Moran: I appreciate the answer and I look forward to working with you and him in that regard. And to the general counsel as well. Judge vaden, food aid is an important component and a moral response ability and economic benefit to farmers and ranchers.
▶ 2:10:15Sen. Moran: I met this weekend with a dozen agricultural groups, the leadership in kansas to talk about the circumstance we want to accomplish in regard to trade. I would highlight that they indicated the steps that need to be taken while we are imposing trade and perhaps using that as leverage is to rapidly begin the process of negotiating trade agreement, bilateral trade
▶ 2:10:46Sen. Moran: Agreements with countries around the world. Between now and then, if you would convey that, one of the things they indicated to me that is worthy of remembering, the agricultural economy is in more difficult circumstances today than it was in 2018. When the tariff battles occurred.
▶ 2:11:08Sen. Moran: While I know there is talk of compensating for the losses that farmers may undertake because of these tariff issues, we need to be reminded with drought and the circumstances in many places in the country, interest rates, import costs, the ability to borrow money, that farmers face serious challenges.
▶ 2:11:36Sen. Moran: I would highlight one of their suggestions is let's quickly begin looking for markets for our commodities. In some circumstances, using the trade -- I'm sorry, the tariffs as leverage to get those accomplished. I want to highlight food for peace.
▶ 2:11:59Sen. Moran: A farmer at a farm bureau meeting in cheyenne county was wondering why grain was stacked at his grain elevator that was going to waste and brought forth to the farm bureau county meeting the idea of finding a way to feed people who are hungry. Dwight eisenhower and others from kansas were leaders at the time. Food for peace came into play.
▶ 2:12:25Sen. Moran: Bob dole, a champion for food for peace, senator from kansas, reauthorized program. -- the program. You may wonder why I'm raising this to you. To the two of you. You are so influential now in the future that I would like your voice in this regard.
▶ 2:12:48Sen. Moran: The farmers and farm groups I visited with over the weekend indicated food aid is a component of their income as well. With food for peace, senator hoeven and I introduced legislation that would transfer.
▶ 2:13:05Sen. Moran: When the department of state indicated a pause or demise of usaid, senator hoeven and I introduced legislation to move food for peace to the department of agriculture where it used to be. I've had conversations with the secretary of agriculture, who seemed inclined to be supportive of that.
▶ 2:13:29Sen. Moran: We have had conversations with omb and the white house aides, which seemed sympathetic. It would be my understanding that secretary of state senator rubio,, indicated food for peace would remain at the state department unless there was an agency or department that was interested in managing the program.
▶ 2:13:57Sen. Moran: Everything I know about that from my conversations I indicated is that the department of agriculture is willing and in my view able to administer food for peace. If you would highlight for your future colleagues the importance of saying so publicly and within the administration that food for peace needs to have a future and it could very well be at usda.
▶ 2:14:24Sen. Moran: Let me ask general counsel, it has been my practice in a number of hearings to make certain that I have an appreciation and understanding of where those who are giving legal advice to a department would rest. We have had so many instances with when legal advice is provided, it touches on so many aspects of usda operations.
▶ 2:15:01Sen. Moran: That you would not want -- I would like for you to confirm to me that you are committed to following the letter of the law.
▶ 2:15:09Mr. Vaden: Thank you for the question. --Mr. clarkson: thank you for the question. In all instances I am committed to following the law.
▶ 2:15:19Sen. Moran: Would you revise then be to the department to follow the order or judicial decision of the court?
▶ 2:15:27Mr. Clarkson: Yes. .
▶ 2:15:29Chair Boozman: Mr. chairman --
▶ 2:15:33Sen. Moran: Mr. chairman. Senator boozman is letting me enjoy my chairmanship a moment longer. I think judge vaden and Mr. clarkson for appearing and members for participating in the important hearing. It will remain open for two business days and the committee is now adjourned.