▶ 0:18:27>> we have for consideration this morning five nominees. It has been requested we have a roll call vote on each. We will do that. We will start with monica crowley. Is there a motion to the floor with a confirmation? It has been moved and seconded. Is there debate?
▶ 0:18:58Clerk will call the roll call. >> aye by proxy. >> aye. >> [: rcalling roll] >> no. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy.
▶ 0:19:28No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. [laughter]
▶ 0:19:43Chair Risch: Does that count for two? The clerk will report. >> yays are 12.
▶ 0:19:52Chair Risch: The motion is passed. The next is Mr. warren stephens. Is there a motion? Motion and seconded that warren stephens he be confirmed. Senator shaheen.
▶ 0:20:09Sen. Shaheen: Thank you. I intend to vote for Mr. stephens. I want to put into the record the concerns I have regarding both the appointment of a special envoy and ambassador to the united kingdom. I think it's a recipe for confusion, especially given the importance of -- the role of the united kingdom and the united states.
▶ 0:20:36Sen. Shaheen: I hoped this committee will ensure the roles and responsibility of the ambassador and special envoy are clearly delineated and once the special envoy's temporary appointment concludes, the committee will have the opportunity to consider his nomination pursuant to the bipartisan law that requires senate confirmation of special envoys.
▶ 0:20:56Chair Risch: Thank you. That is a legitimate request. We will have senator rubio. For the debate. -- further debate? You want to call roll call? The clerk will call the roll. Aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye I proxy.
▶ 0:21:28Chair Risch: -- by roxie. -- aye by proxy. >> no by proxy. No by proxy. Aye. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. >> no.
▶ 0:21:56Chair Risch: Aye. The clerk will report. >> [inaudible]
▶ 0:22:06Chair Risch: The motion is passed. We will now have consideration for Mr. thomas barrack. Is there a motion? Is there a second? It has been moved and seconded. Mr. thomas barrack be sent to the floor. Debate?
▶ 0:22:28Sen. Shaheen: I want to put into the record I think is very important we get a U.S. ambassador quickly. I appreciate Mr. barrack stands for human rights and advancing our security relationship with turkiye. As we look at was happening in syria and throughout the rest of the middle east, I think it's important that given the importance of turkiye as an ally we have in ambassador there as soon as possible. I intend the vote for Mr. barrack.
▶ 0:22:58Chair Risch: Well said. Further debate? The clerk will call the roll. >> aye.
▶ 0:23:06Chair Risch: Aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye.
▶ 0:23:16Chair Risch: Aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye by proxy.
▶ 0:23:28Sen. Shaheen: No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. Aye by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy.
▶ 0:23:48Chair Risch: Aye. The clerk will report. The motion is passed. Now before us the appointment of Mr. tilman fertitta to the italian republic. Is there a second? It has been moved and seconded. Mr. fertitta be reported to the fourth recommendation he be confirmed. The clerk will call the roll.
▶ 0:24:19Chair Risch: >> aye.
▶ 0:24:22Chair Risch: Aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye.
▶ 0:24:31Chair Risch: Aye by proxy. >> aye.
▶ 0:24:38Sen. Shaheen: Aye. Aye by proxy. No I proxy. Aye by proxy. No by proxy. Aye by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. Aye by proxy. >> aye.
▶ 0:25:04Chair Risch: Aye. The clerk will report. The motion has passed. Mr. fertitta will be referred to the floor for confirmation consideration. Lastly, david perdue. Is there a motion? It has been moved and seconded.
▶ 0:25:28Chair Risch: David perdue be sent to the floor with a recommendation he confirmed as ambassador to china. The clerk will call the roll. >> aye. >> aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye. >> aye.
▶ 0:25:52Chair Risch: Aye by proxy. >> aye. >> aye.
▶ 0:26:01Sen. Shaheen: Aye by proxy. No by proxy. Aye by proxy. No by proxy. Eaye by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. Aye by proxy. Aye.
▶ 0:26:24Chair Risch: Aye. The clerk will report. The motion has passed. David perdue will be referred to the floor for possible confirmation. That concludes the business before the business meeting. The business meeting will be adjourned. And, remove now to a hearing for three the president's nominees. The committee will come to order. We have before us thomas dinanno .
▶ 0:26:56Chair Risch: Until you can pronounce it either way. Is that correct?
▶ 0:27:00Mr. Dinanno: Yes sir.
▶ 0:27:04Chair Risch: I had that same problem in my family. It was quite a bit different than that from what my mother called me about my father called me. Sarah rogers to be under secretary of state. With that, usually what we do is we have an opening statement I make, and all too long opening statement. Senator shaheen is usually more reserved.
▶ 0:27:33Chair Risch: We move to each of you to make your opening statements and we go to a five round question. We are moving a little quickly today. We are heading into a recess and there are numerous committees that have overlapping responsibilities. The opening statement I usually make I will put in the record and senator shaheen can do the same.
▶ 0:27:58Sen. Shaheen: I'm happy to put my opening statement of the record as well.
▶ 0:28:02Chair Risch: We will do that and move directly to you. We want to hear what you have to say. You have everyone on the committee that is appreciative of your willingness to step forward to serve your country. We will give you five minutes each if you are longer than that, we will put anything you want in the record. With that, Mr. dinanno, we will start with you. Please try to keep the five minutes.
▶ 0:28:32Chair Risch: We appreciate your cooperation.
▶ 0:28:33Mr. Dinanno: Chairman, ranking member, this stingless of this committee, thank you for the opportunity. I want to thank president trump for nominating me. I would think secretary rubio for his support. It's a tremendous honor to be nominated in appear before this committee. I will be an unwavering voice for the american people in the national security policies.
▶ 0:29:02Mr. Dinanno: I commit I will work closely with this committee and congress to drive forward shared visions and values. I want to thank my family, friends, and colleagues. Without them I would not be here today. I was the think my mother and father for the love and support they have given me throughout my life. How to thank my wife darlene and daughter who were here with me today.
▶ 0:29:23Mr. Dinanno: I have spent nearly 25 years doing national and homeland security, including serving at the state department arms control their vacation and compliance bureau during president trump's first administration. Many members of this committee have expressed concern we are in perhaps the most dangerous time to the world has faced since world war ii. Those concerns are not unfounded.
▶ 0:29:49Mr. Dinanno: We can point to the war ukraine, china's rapid expansion of its nuclear programs, the middle east perpetually on edge, iran's nuclear ambition, north korean wmd missile programs and terrace to seek used wmd against united states. Despite the challenge, I'm cautiously optimistic. President trump is the right person at the right time to stem and reverse this tide.
▶ 0:30:16Mr. Dinanno: President trump has said it would be a great achievement to reduce number of nuclear weapons in the world. I wholeheartedly agree. This is part of his agenda during his first administration. The president recognized and unconstrained chinese nuclear program would be a threat not from the abstract someday but in the near term. In 2020, china was estimated to have roughly 200 nuclear warheads. Then never expected to double in the decade.
▶ 0:30:43Mr. Dinanno: Here we are not even five years later in the new estimates put the chinese stockpile and over 600, growing to 1000 by 2030. China's long-standing excuses for refusing to engage in arms-control can no longer be allowed to go unanswered.
▶ 0:30:58Mr. Dinanno: If confirmed, I would pursue meaningful and effective policies to strengthen america's nuclear deterrence umbrella, enhance chemical and biological weapon deterrence, and seek verifiable and enforceable arms-control agreements that enhance american national security. Arms-control agreements without strong and effective verification regimes and the will to address noncompliance serve only one purpose, to give the illusion of security. They do nothing to actually enhance global security.
▶ 0:31:28Mr. Dinanno: One neatly look at the imf treaty. Russia illegally developed systems now used for nuclear coercion and intimidation. If confirmed, I will only advance agreements that prioritize U.S. national security, strengthen those that don't, and reassess our participation in any agreement that constrains the united states and our interests. As secretary rubio underscored, state department policies need to make a stronger and more prosperous.
▶ 0:31:56Mr. Dinanno: If confirmed, I will do my policy decisions through that guidance. Particularly when it comes to foreign military sales. Those are a critical part of U.S. security partnerships. I view this committee as a critical partner. It will be one of my top priorities to ensure all U.S. security assistance programs are thoroughly and echo dishes the reviewed, transparent to congress and the american people, and efficient for U.S. industry and america's partners.
▶ 0:32:28Mr. Dinanno: Another important way to establish long-term partnerships is the promotion of civil nuclear energy. President trump seeks to unleash american energy. United states has the most advanced nuclear technology on offer today. If confirmed, I will work to use nuclear energy to establish long-term relationships with partners around the world, strengthen supply chains, and offer alternatives to russia and china.
▶ 0:32:52Mr. Dinanno: We must also strengthen efforts to combat poor for asian threats, including the proliferation of chemical and biological weapons and missile delivery systems. And dual use technology second threaten the united states. If confirmed, I will focus on ensuring our competitive advantage in emerging technologies such as ai, biotech, and quantum. We must deny adversaries any advantage, preserve america's technological edge while also helping american business not just grow but thrive.
▶ 0:33:24Mr. Dinanno: If confirmed, I will insist our partners step up to do more to prevent western technologies from handing up in the hands of our adversaries -- ending up in the hands of her adversaries. We must stop chinese expectation of our technological base. I believe there is consensus around the need to address international security threats we face today. We may differ on approach but the national imperative is clear.
▶ 0:33:50Mr. Dinanno: This is reflected in bipartisan efforts to modernize a nuclear deterrent and recommendations on the strategic posture commission. I look forward to engaging this committee, consulting with you and your staff on these, and working together to advance the priorities. Thank you.
▶ 0:34:06Chair Risch: Thank you, Mr. dinanno. What you are undertaking is important for all of america. I'm sure we will have a number of questions for you only get to the round of questions. Sarah rogers to be undersecretary for public diplomacy. The floor is yours.
▶ 0:34:25Ms. Rogers: Mr. chairman, ranking never shaheen, distinct members of the committee, it is an honor to appear for today as president trump's nominee for under secretary of state for public diplomacy. I want to thank president trump and secretary rubio for their trust and confidence. Thank you members and staff of this committee for meeting with me this past few weeks. If confirmed, I look forward to working closely with this committee to communicate america's interests and values across the globe.
▶ 0:34:55Ms. Rogers: I want to thank my parents sally and jeff who journeyed here from south carolina, and my husband jeff for their loving patience and support. I could not have done any of this without each of you. Public diplomacy is the soul of soft power. It comprises the voice and vision that america presents to the world. For billions of people our state department is the closest encounter they ever have with the U.S. government as an institution.
▶ 0:35:24Ms. Rogers: The things our diplomats say and the things our government funds tell the people of the world what america's values and priorities are. In the past we prioritized suppressing so-called disinformation. That term can target foreign propaganda worth fighting. These efforts lost the purpose. If I'm confirmed, I will bring clarity of purpose and transparency in our efforts.
▶ 0:35:53Ms. Rogers: We have heard the ceo of npr, which is funded in part by the united states, describe the first amendment as the number one challenge the setting american journalism. -- besetting american journalism. But free speech is america's number one strength. That the rights of free speech protect inconvenient speech is not a weakness. It is the whole point.
▶ 0:36:20Ms. Rogers: Free speech also furnishes our best response to arrivals like iran and the chinese communist party who want to replace the free exchange of ideas with distortions scripted by the state. China in particular spends roughly $11 billion annually on propaganda, more than 10 times what we spend on public diplomacy.
▶ 0:36:39Ms. Rogers: Having dedicated minds inside and outside of the courtroom, including for the first amendment, I'm confident we can make each american dollar count more. We are privileged to tell the american story. American excellent and innovation sell themselves. If confirmed, I committed to appropriately stewarding the public resources, equipping practitioners with the skills and resources to conduct pragmatic forward policy that advances our national interests.
▶ 0:37:10Ms. Rogers: President trump has presented a clear foreign policy objective for the american people in the lodestar is america first. We must prioritize america's security, strength, and prosperity. Each dollar we allocate and decision we affect. If confirmed, U.S. public diplomacy will be well-positioned to deliver these results for the american people. By leveraging advanced messaging keep abilities to speak directly to those who seek to enter the united states illegally, the department can address the crisis at our border.
▶ 0:37:42Ms. Rogers: Using sophisticated technology and target audience analysis we can ensure the message lands with clarity, candor, enforce. The state department -- and force. If confirmed, it will be my honor to steward educational and cultural affairs which include the fulbright, gilman, and other change programs in sports and music diplomacy and the shared safeguarding of antiquities and cultural heritage sites.
▶ 0:38:08Ms. Rogers: I will ensure we take advantage of opportunities afforded by public diplomacy to advance opportunity for the american people and american businesses. Just next week the state department's public diplomacy team will lead our engagement of expo osaka, the largest public economic diplomacy event in the indo pacific region in 15 years. With projected attendance of 28 million, the expo could generate an audience exceeding the olympics and world cup.
▶ 0:38:36Ms. Rogers: This is an incredible chance to build commercial partnerships while showcasing american excellence. Mindful of our imperative to efficiently deploy and never waste taxpayer dollars, the department must harvest the power of ai to increase effectiveness of public diplomacy. Ai has the ability to process a normative amounts of data and deliver insights and a -- in a fraction of the time.
▶ 0:39:01Ms. Rogers: To can help us understand evolving narratives, identify trends among key audiences, and automate routine administrative tasks. All this frees up time for state department professionals to focus on higher value work, including person-to-person diplomacy. Thank you for inviting me today. I welcome the committee's questions.
▶ 0:39:19Chair Risch: Thank you very much. We will not hear from allison hooker to be undersecretary of state for political affairs. Welcome.
▶ 0:39:28Ms. Hooker: Thank you. Chairman, ranking member, this english senators, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you. I'm honored to be nominated by the president to service under secretary of state for political affairs and grateful for the secretary's support for that. If confirmed, I pledged to uphold the constitution, serve the american people with integrity and purpose, and advance our nation's interests across the globe.
▶ 0:39:55Ms. Hooker: I would not be here today without the love and support of my family who inspired public service. I would like to honor my father, who served in the U.S. navy and then as a civil servant at robins air force base next door to my hometown of macon, georgia. My father passed more than 30 years ago and served our country in the american people his entire life. He was my first inspiration to enter public service.
▶ 0:40:19Ms. Hooker: My mother instilled in me her powerful faith and has been my biggest cheerleader and reminding me that god that -- with god all things are possible. My sister charlene attended college and set a high bar for me with their own achievements. I'm grateful for the love and support as I am for my friends who have joined me here today to support me in person.
▶ 0:40:44Ms. Hooker: Since the first day I walked into the department of state as a civil service new hire, I have devoted my career to advancing national security. I have immense respect for the strong dynamic teams I have worked with over the years. Both at the state department and at the white house. If confirmed, I commit to work with this committee. I would also be honored to serve in that position that the president has placed his faith in me for.
▶ 0:41:11Ms. Hooker: What a critical time it is, from great power competition around the world and conflicts in europe in the least to flows of illegal migrants and drugs across our borders, to china seeking to reshape the global order. We live in the time of historic change. We need a proactive foreign policy that serves america and its citizens by making our country safer, stronger and more prosperous. I believe president trump's foreign policies will achieve these objectives in a meager to work to support them -- I am eager to support them.
▶ 0:41:42Ms. Hooker: I have served in a variety of roles across the U.S. government, most recently I was honored to serve as director for korea and later a senior director for asia on the national security council during president trump's first term where I helped shape U.S. policy towards the indo pacific. In those positions I saw the indispensable tool that diplomacy can be when it is firm, clear, and rooted in american strength.
▶ 0:42:07Ms. Hooker: My experience in northeast asia on the korean peninsula has taught me the hardest problems in foreign are rarely solved overnight. Progress requires strategy, discipline, strength, and consistency. It demands diplomacy grounded in realities of the world as it is, not simply as we wish it to be. While my professional roots are in asia, I recognize if confirmed my charge will be global. Hi eager for the challenge.
▶ 0:42:37Ms. Hooker: If confirmed, my priorities would include strengthening our diplomatic workforce. The department of state's greatest asset is its people. When you do modern diplomatic corps ready to meet the challenges of a complex world. Our diplomatic statecraft must reflect american interests and ingenuity and take advantage of both diplomatic and economic opportunities around the world.
▶ 0:43:00Ms. Hooker: To achieve these objectives we must work to recruit top talent using technology to make our work more efficient, impactful, and ensuring our diplomats around the world are safe. Second, reinforcing our relationships with partners bilaterally and in multilateral flora. Even as we correct trade and security imbalances between united states and the rest of the world, we must together with allies and partners work to address shared challenges.
▶ 0:43:29Ms. Hooker: We will work to ensure any multilateral flora have objectives that are consistent with U.S. interests and values. Third, confronting our adversaries with strength and resolve. Diplomacy is not the absence of disagreements. It is how we manage them. That means defending american interests and applying pressure were needed while always leaving the door open to engagement when it can advance and achieve american goals. Mr.
▶ 0:43:54Ms. Hooker: Chairman, ranking member, members of this committee, I approach this role with gratitude, humility, realism, and resolve. I will dedicate myself to leading with integrity, listening to our allies and adversaries alike, and doing everything in my power to ensure the american people are served well and that diplomacy remains the cornerstone of our national security. Thank you for your time and for the opportunity to appear before you today.
▶ 0:44:24Ms. Hooker: I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:44:28Sen. Hagerty: I would like to put chairman risch's opening statement in the record. Thank you. Congratulations to all of you. It is an honor to be here today. Dragon -- rather than go through an opening statement, I would like to go directly to questioning if I might. I would like to start with you, Mr.
▶ 0:44:55Sen. Hagerty: Dinanno, to talk about foreign military sales. We discussed this before. I served as U.S. ambassador to japan. I realized the sales process was rigid. The backlogs were unacceptable. I went to the president about this. He empowered me to create tiger teams with the department of defense and state department and commerce department. We made significant progress in whittling down the extensive timelines. They is still much work to be done.
▶ 0:45:26Sen. Hagerty: I would like to get your perspective in terms of the risks that a long timeline poses when you think about competitors like russia and china and what you might consider doing about that.
▶ 0:45:38Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question, senator. I enjoyed our visit. I have given this a lot of thought. Members on both sides have expressed concerns this is a priority. It will be a priority if confirmed. I would like to maybe give a couple of broadbrush strokes. In a nutshell, we need more capability and less bureaucracy when it comes to fms.
▶ 0:46:06Mr. Dinanno: There's been tremendous interest in the body in the senate and the house. I have heard -- I'm a private citizen and I'm not engaged day-to-day with the administration and working with the congress. If confirmed, it would be my highest priority. To your question about how this impacts alliances, foreign military sales are the cornerstone of our extended deterrence and allied assurance. A critical part of moving the process forward.
▶ 0:46:38Mr. Dinanno: More capability, less bureaucracy.
▶ 0:46:39Sen. Hagerty: I hope you will commit to working with me and this committee as you advance progress in the foreign military sales process. Ms. hooker, let's talk about the U.S.-south korea-japan by letter relationship. You have extensive experience in the area.
▶ 0:47:00Sen. Hagerty: We would be fortunate to see an emerging strength in terms of the bilateral relationship between japan and south korea, as well as the trilateral relationship we enjoy with both nations. You and I have discussed this before but I have been pleased to lead the delegations from here to our second annual trilateral executive dialogue and s -- in seoul. I hope we will do the third in tokyo this fall.
▶ 0:47:31Sen. Hagerty: The dialogue has been productive in terms of deepening economic ties, security ties with chief executives, with leaders of various governments involved, and also members of this body. I would like to get your perspective on where you would like to see from the trilateral relationship.
▶ 0:47:52Ms. Hooker: I would like to thank you both for your time this week in meeting with me so we can have these discussions. Senator, thank you for your service as ambassador to japan previously in the work you did on the trilateral letter relationship -- trilateral relationship there as well.
▶ 0:48:08Ms. Hooker: This relationship between the united states, japan, and korea is critically important not only to the safety and security of the northeast asian region but also to the united states and our allies and the rest of the indo pacific. We have made incredible gains thanks to president trump and his first administration. We worked largely behind the scenes and under the radar to maintain the engagement between the two allies of japan and south korea.
▶ 0:48:39Ms. Hooker: To increase our trilateral engagement their frequency of it -- engagement, their frequency and breadth of it so it is not just about safety and security against north korea, to the region and us, but two other issues --to other issues. Health and economic security as well. If confirmed, I look forward to continuing to advance this relationship.
▶ 0:49:07Ms. Hooker: As you know, in the republic of korea we've had a time where there has not been a -- there has been an interim government. We are coming up on a period where an election will take place in a couple of months. We will have a sitting president. We will be able to advance the relationship with south korea and japan more effectively once that takes place.
▶ 0:49:30Sen. Hagerty: I look forward to working with you. One other area quickly. China's presence in latin america. The facilities they are building in countries like chile, argentina, how do you see that as a potential threat to our safety and security here?
▶ 0:49:47Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that question. As I noted, great power competition is one of the biggest challenges we have in the moment. China is working to change the global order around the world, including in latin america where it seeks to have great influence. As you know, the president and the secretary have placed this as a priority.
▶ 0:50:17Ms. Hooker: Secretary rubio made numerous trips to the region are ready to speak to governments in latin america about this and other issues. We look forward, if confirmed, to working with the secretary to ensure not only we worked bilaterally with those government and across the region to ensure we counter china's influence in latin america.
▶ 0:50:34Sen. Hagerty: Thank you for making that a priority.
▶ 0:50:37Sen. Shaheen: Thank you. Welcome to all of our nominees this morning and to your family and friends who are here with you. Ms. hooker, I want to follow-up on that a little bit. I appreciated your comment about the importance of allies and partners in your opening statement.
▶ 0:50:58Sen. Shaheen: However, you talked about -- you inferred that tariffs -- we can get past the tariff issue and address the concerns of our allies and partners. Yet as we think about the trilateral relationship, what we have seen since the announcement of the tariffs this past week is that japan and south korea are meeting with china because they are so concerned about our tariffs.
▶ 0:51:27Sen. Shaheen: How do we address that kind of concern? It is pushing our allies toward china instead of away from them.
▶ 0:51:35Ms. Hooker: Thank you, senator. I want to thank your staff are meeting with me this weekend spending time sharing with me about your concerns. I look forward to working with the committee and your team on these issues going forward. As the president and secretary have said, tariffs are one tool in our economic and trade toolbox.
▶ 0:52:00Ms. Hooker: They are aimed at making our trade more reciprocal, not only with --
▶ 0:52:07Sen. Shaheen: I understand the talking points and I don't want to interrupt but when we see our allies moving towards china very directly, what is our best response to address that?
▶ 0:52:20Ms. Hooker: Thank you for the question and the follow-up. What I would like to point out is that japan will be entering a negotiation with the united states as a result of these tariffs. They are bringing japan to us. This will be a tool that will even out trade and make the united states more prosperous as a result.
▶ 0:52:46Sen. Shaheen: What I'm really asking is when we see that direction happening, what do we do? Would you call our contacts in japan and south korea and try to reassure them about the ability to negotiate, mediate an agreement? It seems to me that when we see that kind of action it demands a response from officials in the government.
▶ 0:53:10Sen. Shaheen: To go on to another topic, I also appreciated you talking about strengthening the diplomatic workforce in your opening statement, the importance of attracting the best and brightest people to the department of state. I agree with that. What I'm concerned about is what we have seen since the new administration took over is a great deal of uncertainty about what will happen at the state department.
▶ 0:53:38Sen. Shaheen: All the personnel, virtually over 10,000 people at usaid have been fired. That bureau has been eliminated that provides important foreign assistance throughout the world. How do we attract the best and brightest when there is that kind of uncertainty around what is happening at the state department?
▶ 0:54:01Ms. Hooker: Thank you for the question. It is my view that the president and secretary of state are taking a close look and how we manage workforce going forward and how we streamline government and streamline our budget. Hi support that. I'm not privy to the conversations internally and how those decisions are being made. If confirmed, I look forward to returning and speaking to you about this. If you have further questions.
▶ 0:54:29Sen. Shaheen: Thank you. I would hope you would because it will be hard to attract the people we will need when there is so much uncertainty about what is happening within the department. Mr. dinanno, you talked about the importance of addressing our nuclear stockpiles.
▶ 0:54:54Sen. Shaheen: I know the president has publicly said he wants to see if we can denuclearize and expressed support for launching nuclear talks with china and russia. In 20, you wrote an article that called the biden administration's arms control policy diluted for pursuing nuclear arms control with russia and china. Given that, do you have reservations about the president's objective?
▶ 0:55:22Sen. Shaheen: Is it just because he's the president who's nominated you who shares your political philosophy that now you feel like that's an appropriate path to move down?
▶ 0:55:34Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question. I differed from the prior administration's arms control. This administration would pursue arms control that is enforceable and verifiable. The article you referred to, the extension of the new start treaty with no strings attached and no further negotiations, that was the wrong thing to do. We gave away our leverage. That is what I was referring to.
▶ 0:56:02Sen. Shaheen: Thank you for the verification.
▶ 0:56:13Sen. Cornyn: Congratulations for being here. Mr. dinanno, I wanted to ask about nuclear proliferation specifically. One of the things that president trump has made clear is he expects our nato allies in europe to do more for their own self defense. I agree with that wholeheartedly.
▶ 0:56:37Sen. Cornyn: But it is going to take a while for them to step up and create the industrial base to reduce weapons to and the like. In the meantime, we are seeing concerning announcements from everybody from president zelenskyy to the new chancellor of germany to the president of poland talking about maybe they need to acquire nuclear weapons in order to defend themselves
▶ 0:57:08Sen. Cornyn: Against the existential threat of russia. What do you think the right answer is for preventing proliferation? You know when I know it will not stop there. Other countries around the world, if they have concerns about whether the united states will come to their aid, they figure they better do whatever they need to do to survive.
▶ 0:57:36Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question. I think the best answer to those concerns -- I have seen the press reports -- is a robust extended deterrence and allied insurance policy. During my service of the previous trump administration we did exactly that. There is no substitute for diplomacy. If I am confirmed, that's a top priority of mine.
▶ 0:58:03Mr. Dinanno: To reassure allies and partners that the united states will stand shoulder to shoulder with them. I watched secretary rubio, ambassador whitaker at nato this past week giving strong support to the alliance while calling on them to do more.
▶ 0:58:20Mr. Dinanno: I would note in my preparation for the hearing I noticed the dutch -- the danish navy announced procuring 25 new naval ships and platforms and underwater and unmanned systems. That is in two months since president trump has been elected. He is working and I look forward to doing more.
▶ 0:58:41Sen. Cornyn: I'm encouraged when I see our nato allies stepping up and doing more. I'm also worried when we hear them talk about maybe the new chancellor of germany says we have to share our nuclear weapons with ukraine. Ms. hooker, the role of soft power -- actually, Ms.
▶ 0:59:11Sen. Cornyn: Rogers, you are the one who was talking about the importance of soft power. One of the things I noticed when I traveled with senator shaheen and senator kaine in central and south america is obviously china is on the march in south and central america.
▶ 0:59:33Sen. Cornyn: One way we have -- it was interesting the contrast between my most recent visit and previous visits is in many instances the heads of state of many of these countries had studied in the united states. They learned about us. They learned about our values. They were our friend.
▶ 0:59:55Sen. Cornyn: It seems like over the last recent years we have had as many as 300,000 chinese students in the united states, which is a cause for concern when they are studying things like nuclear physics, like. -- and the like. What can we do to encourage more foreign students from key allies and developing nations come to the united states to learn about us and for us to win more about them?
▶ 1:00:24Ms. Rogers: Thank you for that question. As I noted, these foreign-exchange programs are really some of our strongest soft power assets. They are great human capital investments. I think by this administration's attentiveness to the vetting process for student visas and other visas we ensure the quality of every single person we let in, which bolsters the quality of the success of these programs.
▶ 1:00:51Ms. Rogers: I think telling the american story, highlighting american excellence, highlighting innovation, creating a strong, prosperous america will be the city on a hill others will want to visit and learn from and be part of. I think we will see those fruits manifest in our exchange programs and elsewhere.
▶ 1:01:10Sen. Cornyn: Ms. hooker, how would you deal with mexico?
▶ 1:01:14Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that question. The president and the secretary have begun to take great -- do a lot of work on mexico with the upcoming usmca review work that's being done to secure our borders. Mexico is an incredibly important partner for the united states.
▶ 1:01:37Ms. Hooker: If confirmed I look forward to ensuring the diplomacy that needs to be done to secure our southern border is done in the trade relationship is balanced and even and reciprocal. I look forward to communicating with you on that. If you have other issues for me to look into -- thank you for the question.
▶ 1:02:04Sen. Kaine: I will begin with you, Ms. hooker. He described tariffs as an effort to address trade imbalances and I want to give you a perspective from the side of the dais. Iv the president's announcement as a strict telling dollar tax increase on american families -- I view the president's announcement as a $6 trillion tax increase on american families.
▶ 1:02:35Sen. Kaine: Virginia families and businesses are going to pay for it. That is why the markets are in turmoil. That is why my virginia farmers are worried. They use fertilizer with potash and 80% of it comes from canada. Shipbuilders and sub builders with 35% of aluminum from canada. They view it as a tax increase. You assert it's designed to address trade imbalances.
▶ 1:03:03Sen. Kaine: If that's the case, what is the president post tariffs on nations like brazil where we have a trade surplus and don't have a deficit? If it is designed to address trade imbalances, why did he impose terraces on israel and singapore who have no tariffs on U.S. products? Maybe it's about adversaries over allies. Why put a 17% tariff on israel and 10% tariff on iran? Why put a higher tariff on taiwan than on canada?
▶ 1:03:38Sen. Kaine: This is justified as an effort to address trade imbalances. If you just good down the list of countries and you look at the tariffs imposed, theand the nume countries suggest something else is going on. I think it is a $6 trillion tax increase. The administration and the leaders, many made plain that the goal is use that tax increase to than fund a tax cut for the wealthiest.
▶ 1:04:07Sen. Kaine: I hope you are right in that this is going to help us on the trade imbalance side. If that was the goal, why go after australia and brazil and the u.k. In the netherlands? Why go after singapore we have a trade surplus with those nations? I don't really have a question about tariffs.
▶ 1:04:28Sen. Kaine: I want to challenge an assertion that it's about trade imbalance won so many of the nations getting socked by tariffs, that is not really a challenge we have with them. To both Ms. rogers and Ms. hooker, let me ask about the president dismantling the U.S. agency for global media. I appreciated Ms. rogers saying we have to be for the first amendment.
▶ 1:04:53Sen. Kaine: I'm glad the court ruled that the associative press cannot be kicked out of the press pool because they will not use the phrase gulf of america. That was standing up for the first amendment. I am pleased to see the progress of cases in courts where people are challenging being deported for making statements that are politically unpopular but not committing criminal activity. How are we benefiting by dismantling the agency that funds radio martine?
▶ 1:05:26Sen. Kaine: It transmits pro-democracy and good solid information into the repressive cuban regime where people cannot get access information. Ms. hooker, I think you are on the board of radio free asia. One of the component programs. How do we benefit public diplomacy or the broader political goals by dismantling the agency that is giving people who are oppressed information that they can rely on and be inspired by?
▶ 1:05:57Sen. Kaine: Either one of you is fine.
▶ 1:06:01Ms. Rogers: Accu for that question. If confirmed as the undersecretary for public diplomacy, I would not under the current configuration oversee any of the components of agm. If any of those were placed in my purview I would commit to analyzing and getting readd in on each cut and program.
▶ 1:06:25Ms. Rogers: I agree that the messaging, that is a value and we would want to make sure every dollar we spend is making america safer and stronger and more prosperous. I would be happy to report to the committee on that once I am in there to the extent they are under my purview. If confirmed, in the event I were the secretary's designee to the board of agm, I would be fulfilling all my duties and steward the mission of that entity and each dollar it spends any channel it runs.
▶ 1:06:57Sen. Kaine: About your work on the board of radio free asia, that is a very valuable program in terms of promoting a good image of the net states and giving hope to people who may live under oppressive regimes. How does it survived if a medic interest to shutter that? -- how does it serve our diplomatic interest to shutter that?
▶ 1:07:20Ms. Hooker: I appreciate you sharing your views. I was on the board of radio free asia. I was invited to be on the board because of my background on north korea and the work I had done on the korean peninsula for more than two decades.
▶ 1:07:36Ms. Hooker: As my colleague said, the review underway that is aimed at looking at how we present american messages about the american values and our interests, the review is underway to make sure the audiences is we are trying to reach are being reached. If I'm confirmed, I look forward to working with my colleague on these issues and I'm happy to work with the committee on that as well.
▶ 1:08:03Sen. Kaine: Can I just say when you are on the board of radio free asia, were you trying to do messaging that would help inspire north koreans who were living under a very oppressive government?
▶ 1:08:14Ms. Hooker: Yes. The messaging aimed at north korea was to let them see the outside world.
▶ 1:08:21Sen. Kaine: North korea, cuba. These are populations that need to hear from the united states. As that review was done I hope we reached a conclusion that we are not just going to be silent and failed to communicate with people who really need a pro-democracy message.
▶ 1:08:41Sen. Ricketts: Thank you to each of the nominees for your willingness to serve our great nation stopped I want to thank your families as well because this is a sacrifice for them as well as you work on behalf of our country. Thank you for being here. A recent u.n. Report reveals iran holds enough enriched uranium to produce six nuclear weapons. Iran has no plans to slow production.
▶ 1:09:13Sen. Ricketts: It threatens global security a large. Three years, ron has been in can -- iran has been a continuous violation of a you insecure to council resolution. I commend president for reinstating maximum pressure on iran which directed the next u.n. Ambassador to work with the e3 on the snapback u.n. Sanctions on iran.
▶ 1:09:45Sen. Ricketts: All u.n. Member states would be required to implement the sanctions. While the authority to snap back expires on october 18, the real deadline is sooner due to the length of time for the process to play out. The need to conduct the snapback under favorable human security council leadership and the role of the snapback in the upcoming negotiations with iran. Ms. hooker, I introduced a resolution calling for the e3 to initiate snapback as soon as possible.
▶ 1:10:14Sen. Ricketts: Rather than waiting until june to snapback as the e3 indicated it will do, snapping back now will allow the west to deal with iran from the strongest possible position. Do you agree with that?
▶ 1:10:28Ms. Hooker: Thank you for your question interest in the matter. I look forward to learning more about where the administration is in implementing maximum pressure the president stated will be necessary to, mentors iran. I look forward to using diplomacy to ensure our allies and partners around the world will be implement and maximum pressure as well. -- implementing maximum pressure as well.
▶ 1:10:55Sen. Ricketts: If we want the U.S. to be committed to europe, we need to realize the U.S. has another concern as well. Ms. hooker, -- against the iranian regime which sent the president trump? Will it strengthen transit medic ties? -- transatlantic ties?
▶ 1:11:21Ms. Hooker: Thank you for the question. Maximum pressure will be necessary on iran going forward. Not being in the seat yet I don't have privy to where we are in those discussions. If I am confirmed, I look forward to learning more about that and ensuring we are doing what we can to get our european allies and partners to do their part.
▶ 1:11:50Sen. Reicketts: Given that you are not in the seat and given your feel, if we see our european allies actually showing great resolve to do their parts like places like iran that would help the transatlantic alliance? .
▶ 1:12:07Ms. Hooker: Thank you. I think cooperation from our european allies would be helpful in signaling and I look forward to, if confirmed, to having those conversations.
▶ 1:12:20Sen. Ricketts: To the topic of maximum pressure. Under the last trump administration the foreign reserves fell from -- fell to less than $14 billion for those sanctions. That is the cut -- that is a type of results we need to see this time around from the maximum pressure by making sure that iran's does not have the money to support the terrorism they have done around the world.
▶ 1:12:49Sen. Ricketts: In 2016 under the revival under president trump, china's foreign minister dismissed it as a sea of in the ocean. And then eight days later he met with the counterparts illustrating the continued importance. Under the biden administration it grew from senior level security dialog to leader level summits. Summit agenda -- some agendas grew with an ever-expanding list of initiatives and working groups but not priorities.
▶ 1:13:19Sen. Ricketts: So, as cochair of the senate quad caucus I was pleased with the january joint statement emphasizing security cooperation while also indirectly calling on communist china's malign aggression. This bold posture is critical. It also proves that the quad is a force for good instability.
▶ 1:13:44Sen. Ricketts: Do you believe that the quad can and should place a greater emphasis on hard security cooperation?
▶ 1:13:51Ms. Hooker: Thank you. As you noted it was revived under president trump during his first term. And I see it as one of the greatest successes of his first term, reviving that relationship. If confirmed, I look forward to supporting the president and secretary and advancing the work of the quad across a broad area. I am not privy to exactly what we will be -- what is being discussed right now.
▶ 1:14:21Ms. Hooker: Going forward if confirmed, I look forward to doing that and happy to be back in touch with the committee on that. >> I would like another round. I will recognize senator shaheen.
▶ 1:14:44Sen. Shaheen: I want to go back to your conversation about soft power and you quoted the npr ceo , and I am a big fan of npr. I think it does wonderful work, and I think you neglected to provide the context for the quote.
▶ 1:15:10Sen. Shaheen: It was actually at the atlantic council's 360 open summit which was a conference about tackling foreign disinformation. She was not the ceo of npr but she was a ceo of another media company.
▶ 1:15:26Sen. Shaheen: She discussed efforts to push back against disinformation and direct quote about how to distant -- how to address foreign disinformation was "the number one challenge that we see was, of course, the first amendment of the united states.
▶ 1:15:41Sen. Shaheen: It is a robust protection of rights and that is a rights both for platforms which I actually think it is very important that platforms have that right -- those rights to regulate the kind of content that they want on the -- on their sites." she then said "this makes it a little tricky to address the challenges of where bad information comes from." I think it is important to correct the record on that issue.
▶ 1:16:06Sen. Shaheen: But I also want to ask you about the role of the state department and the role that you would assume if confirmed to address inner inner -- interagency coordination on disinformation. I share your double leaf -- your belief that it is a critical tool of our soft power. I also agree with you about american access and innovation.
▶ 1:16:31Sen. Shaheen: When people have a chance to partner with the united states versus partnering with china, they are going to choose america every time. But, if we do not have an apparatus that we can use to show what america's access and innervation is all about, it will be hard to get that message across to foreign governments.
▶ 1:16:58Sen. Shaheen: And that is, sadly, where we are as senator kaine pointed out. The dismantling of the U.S. agency for global media, of the global engagement center at the state department put us at a disadvantage when it comes to foreign governments.
▶ 1:17:17Sen. Shaheen: We had a hearing at the beginning of the year where the experts testified that china is spending over $1 billion, with a b a year with disinformation and misinformation campaigns across the world. We no longer have an apparatus to address that.
▶ 1:17:41Sen. Shaheen: You also, your role is, historically, the under secretary for public the fair -- affairs has represented the secretary of state on the international broadcasting board which has been a body committed to protecting the editorial independence of U.S. agency for global media networks and entities.
▶ 1:18:06Sen. Shaheen: So if we do not have that apparatus, how do you address that soft power need that I think we have in the united states to let the rest of the world to know why it is important to partner with us?
▶ 1:18:22Ms. Rogers: Thank you and for supplementing the record regarding the purported challenge to countering disinformation. I just want to make clear that the first amendment should not be a challenge to date -- to countering disinformation. I draw here --
▶ 1:18:42Sen. Shaheen: I do not see that she was a challenge. She said there was a robust challenge of rights that makes it -- as we are thinking about addressing disinformation we have to do it within the context of the first amendment.
▶ 1:18:59Ms. Rogers: And if confirmed that will be my approach. I was quoting brandeis who had the best result -- best response and this is a paraphrase about fraudulent and fallacious information. That will be the approach of public diplomacy. I thank the senator to upper -- to address with the global engagement center did. It did foster interagency coordination. Interagency that was good. If I'm confirmed I will do that.
▶ 1:19:29Sen. Shaheen: That is my question really. How will you do it if it has been dismantled? How will you do it if we no longer have radio free asia or radio marte? The infrastructure to get out information to combat our adversaries?
▶ 1:19:47Ms. Rogers: Just to distinguish briefly, if I were confirmed my function never had agm under it but I could serve on a board and a special agency. We have thousands of social media channels and assets in every original bureau of the state department and partnerships with influencers and creators.
▶ 1:20:15Ms. Rogers: There are many outlets and I think the media ran -- media landscape has changed seismically. Two hours on a podcast might reach more people than a week of appearances on legacy cable shows. We need to be agile and creative.
▶ 1:20:32Ms. Rogers: To the extent that we are spending money on this media outreach, we need to make sure, and I think the department is developing great metrics to make sure that every dollar we spend has an impact on the target audience and we have metrics that we can use to measure these things to stay accountable to the american taxpayer and the imperative that each dollar we spend makes america safer and more prosperous.
▶ 1:20:56Ms. Rogers: The fact that the global engagement center engaged with other agencies was great and I will engage with other agencies. But the fact that the global engagement center purported to address foreign propaganda and lies, that was meritorious and I do not need that to do it.
▶ 1:21:16Sen. Shaheen: You need an apparatus to do that and your role did have the global engagement center and all public diplomacy over -- under it. I appreciate your intent and I agree with that. I think it shows a tremendous amount of naivete to think that we can do that without having an apparatus to actually get the information out there. Thank you Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:21:46Chair Risch: I would like to return to mexico, the current U.S.-mexico security operations guided by the bicentennial framework negotiated by the biden administration in 2021. But to show that these frameworks do not mean much if you do not have cooperation with our friends and allies like mexico.
▶ 1:22:12Chair Risch: President emmanuel lopez obrador was notorious for spurning increased security cooperation with the united states. The current president, claudia sheinbaum has appeared to be at least more amenable to working with the united states. I am looking forward to having ambassador johnson show up in mexico city. I know he was confirmed last night. Hopefully he will help address many of these issues.
▶ 1:22:43Chair Risch: But, do you think the administration should negotiate a new security framework with mexico?
▶ 1:22:49Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question. That is a question I will have to take back and come back to you on. I know the united states and mexico have a complex security arrangement. In 2023 in a prior job I went to mexico and we had discussions on how to protect infrastructure and shared interests on the border.
▶ 1:23:16Mr. Dinanno: But the specifics of that security cooperation, I would have to look into it and come back.
▶ 1:23:22Sen. Cornyn: We talked about this briefly, but we ran out of time. How would you deal with mexico? Mexico is obviously connected to the united states. We cannot get a divorce.
▶ 1:23:38Sen. Cornyn: We have to make it work, although it has been notoriously difficult for the united states to get the cooperation of the mexican government from everything on immigration to dealing with drug flows across the border and particularly the fentanyl challenges that we face now, which is now the leading cause of death of young people between the age of 18 and 45.
▶ 1:24:05Sen. Cornyn: From your perspective and if confirmed, how would you approach improving that relationship with mexico so that we can gain great -- greater cooperation and improve safety for the american people?
▶ 1:24:20Ms. Hooker: Thank you for returning to the issue so we can talk more about it. As we have seen from the secretary's engagement from the very start of his time, the secretary of state's engagement with mexico and latin america is a high priority. And the reasons you have just stated illuminate why.
▶ 1:24:43Ms. Hooker: Our border is being used to have drugs and cartels and it has become a dangerous situation in the united states because of the border and illegal immigration.
▶ 1:24:59Ms. Hooker: If confirmed, I would work with the secretary to engage with mexico, diplomatically to make sure that the president is able to achieve his goals with regard to mexico, not just on security issues but on trade as well. Mr. chairman, I am going to turn the gavel back over to you.
▶ 1:25:22Chair Risch: Let me talk with Mr. dinanno for a minute. When I first got here some years back I was enlisted by one of the more senior members to help him engage as they were wrestling with the start and new start treaty. It needed to be refreshed, I guess, or reauthorized.
▶ 1:25:52Chair Risch: And I was shocked frankly by how badly that agreement had worked between us and russia. And worked is a euphemism. It did not work at all. The russians lies, cheated, and they would tell you black was white. And yet the senate reauthorized the treaty, which again, I was shocked that.
▶ 1:26:17Chair Risch: Of course, things did not get better, they got worse until finally we got out of it. Things cannot be looking good for you as far as getting some kind of agreement with them. And then between then and now, one of the big actors here will be china. There is not much of -- much use of an agreement between us and russia if it is not a three-way agreement. China will surpass us by numbers before very long.
▶ 1:26:47Chair Risch: Give me your thoughts on how you will approach this. It seems to me, and I am not criticizing you. It is a heavy lift. First of all, tell me your thoughts on russia, any chance at all of getting them to change their ways? It does not seem like it to me. Secondly, we have invited the chinese and they have spurned us a number of times. What are your thoughts?
▶ 1:27:12Mr. Dinanno: Thanks for the question. In my opening testimony I referenced the inf treaty, and that is the poster child for arms-control violations and the danger of not having a treaty that is verifiable and enforceable. The nuclear threats that we see daily and the threats that russia threatens to use those systems that the U.S. and the united states did not produce.
▶ 1:27:41Mr. Dinanno: The real life the grounds dangers of having a treaty that is not verifiable and enforceable we can see them today. With respect to new start, a couple of things briefly. Number one, the existing limits are inadequate in a world of tri-polarity. I do not think necessarily we need to address the chinese and the russians one-to-one, but the existing numbers are not adequate.
▶ 1:28:10Mr. Dinanno: Number two, new start expires in 2026 and the time is short. The third point I would make an president trump asked the team at the state department that I was a part of in 2019 in 2020 two engage the russians and improve on new start.
▶ 1:28:30Mr. Dinanno: And as I referenced earlier, the treaty makes no provision for getting at what we could call nonstrategic or tactical nuclear weapons. Earlier testimony a couple of weeks ago in the senate and in front of the armed services committee used the 2000 number as an open public number of the number of warheads that the russians possess in their nonstrategic stockpile.
▶ 1:28:59Mr. Dinanno: I think in a private setting the numbers that we would see are significantly worse than that. And I look forward to having that discussion with you and the committee. To your point, quickly about whether this is a fools errand, it is never not in our interest to engage our adversaries.
▶ 1:29:24Mr. Dinanno: The other point here that is very important, and as I said in my opening statement, president trump has taken on this issue and has talked to -- talked at length at denuclearization. When they agree that they want something to move, they do. Obviously, that would take commitments from the other side. We would not have negotiations just to talk.
▶ 1:29:48Mr. Dinanno: But with the president's commitment and if confirmed I am cautiously optimistic that we could move some things forward.
▶ 1:29:56Chair Risch: I do not share your optimism, but I hope I am wrong and you are right. Surely, there is no sense moving forward on a strict -- strategic weapons if you do not talk about tactical weapons. This is nonsense letting them keep as many tactical weapons as they want while we agree to something on the other side. Do you agree with me that that has to me -- be in any kind of agreement with the russians?
▶ 1:30:24Mr. Dinanno: It was supposed to be a part of the new strike. -- treaty and we never enforced it. I agree wholeheartedly.
▶ 1:30:31Chair Risch: What about bringing the chinese into this? They have rebuffed us over and over again. But in a perfect world russia and the U.S. decide to reduce numbers and continue on down and china just sits there. That would make a difference, wouldn't it?
▶ 1:30:49Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question and follow-up. I agree with you that bringing china is a challenge. It was a challenge for us in 2020. I said before you as a state department -- sit before you as a state department nominee, we are in the diplomacy and talking business. There is a flipside, that it is a robust modernization program. The department of defense needs to and is a critical partner.
▶ 1:31:22Mr. Dinanno: Our modernization program and are exquisite be-21 is coming online. If the chinese refused to talk we have diplomatic leverage that I think we should use. But, the flipside of this is a robust and modernized extended deterrence.
▶ 1:31:42Chair Risch: You were around when new start was reauthorized. Do you remember the promises made to us when that past? -- passed? And those have not come anywhere near what was promised.
▶ 1:31:56Mr. Dinanno: I share your frustration. Again, in my opening testimony I talked about enforceable and verifiable treaties. It is critical that we stick to it and to what we said. We never enforced the provision on new start that required that we will eventually get to tactical weapons and we are in a situation where there are thousands on one side and a handful on the other.
▶ 1:32:21Chair Risch: Let me say in closing, I really admire your enthusiasm and optimism. I do not share the optimism, I am sorry. I hope I am wrong, and you are right. It is a big deal and really important. Senator rosen.
▶ 1:32:41Sen. Rosen: Thank you. This is an important hearing we are having today and I would like to thank our witnesses for testifying and it was a pleasure to meet you.
▶ 1:32:56Sen. Rosen: I want to talk a little bit about and I guess we will lighten it up from the chairman's questions first about exchange programs because international exchange programs not only create shared bonds, understanding, and innovation and support our national and economic security. University of nevada's northern novato center has hosted countless of students, scholars and professionals from multiple exchange programs.
▶ 1:33:24Sen. Rosen: But the trump administration has made sweeping cuts to international exchange and study abroad programs leaving the future of this work in question. So, if confirmed, the bureaus and offices that you are going to oversee will play a central role in facilitating these critically important soft diplomacy programs for our states, communities and the world.
▶ 1:33:48Sen. Rosen: With that in mind do you believe that shutting down international exchange and study abroad programs makes a stronger and helps us with soft diplomacy that is so important?
▶ 1:33:58Ms. Rogers: Thank you very much. As I noted, I would be privileged to steward these programs. I think some of them are great programs. One of my best friends in college was a fulbright and I learned a lot from her. With respect to the strategic review that the department has undertaken with respect to all educational and cultural affairs programs, I have not been read into that.
▶ 1:34:25Ms. Rogers: My understanding is that the department is going through program by program and line by line to make sure that each dollar we spend makes america safer and to ensure that every dollar allocated to these programs by this congress and department does these programs proud and is appropriately deployed and I can commit to working with this committee and reporting back to this committee on any specifics once I have access.
▶ 1:34:51Sen. Rosen: I appreciate that. I think they are critically important but I do not share your belief that they are going through it line by line and critically work -- looking at their validity. I will move over to a little bit more of a serious subject which is counterterrorism programs. This is for you. The state department plays a leader -- leading role in countering terrorism and violent extremism abroad.
▶ 1:35:19Sen. Rosen: This not only protects populations around the world but it prevents threats from reaching the homeland. Unfortunately, the administration again recently provided this committee with a list of terminated foreign assistance programs which include a significant number of counterterrorism efforts. Where would counter terrorism and violent extremism rank on your list of priorities?
▶ 1:35:48Sen. Rosen: And do you believe that the state department should continue to support programs as we see terrorism exploding around the world?
▶ 1:35:56Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that question. If confirmed, of course, countering terrorism around the world is fully one of my priorities. You do not want to see terrorism anywhere in the world.
▶ 1:36:10Sen. Rosen: To be sure what happened someplace else does not always stay there so we have to be mindful that it can come back to us.
▶ 1:36:17Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that clarification. As a private citizen I am not privy to the conversations and to the details of how these programs are being reviewed right now. If confirmed I will be pretty to those, -- privy to those conversations and happy to look into that.
▶ 1:36:40Ms. Hooker: I want to note that as the president and the secretary have said the review of these programs and foreign assistance programs around the world are consistent with making sure that every dollar spent that is coming from our taxpayers and those who voted for the president needs the american interests and the interests of national security. So if confirmed, I look forward to learning more about that in communicating with you.
▶ 1:37:07Sen. Rosen: I am concerned that they meet the security and national interest as well as terrorism anywhere can be exported here fairly quickly. And speaking of the leading state sponsor of terrorism, iran. I want to build on some of the previous questions, iran and its proxies continue to be number one stability to this threat. If coming to the -- if coming into this office the approach could be best described as chaotic.
▶ 1:37:36Sen. Rosen: I had initially -- they had initially announced a strategy of max pressure and also military aggression if there was not a deal, the president announced that they are entering into high-level direct talks over the weekend. So, I know you have significant national security and diplomatic experience. What do you think is the best approach for the U.S. to take to reduce the threats that iran poses to our allies and partners, knowing that some of those get exported here as well.
▶ 1:38:06Ms. Hooker: Thank you. Senator, what I would say is that the president as commander-in-chief and head of the executive is the best dealmaker and the best negotiator and he hit -- it is his decision to move forward in this direction. If confirmed, I look forward to supporting the president and secretary in achieving their objectives.
▶ 1:38:29Sen. Rosen: Thank you.
▶ 1:38:31Chair Risch: Senator scott.
▶ 1:38:33Sen. Scott: First off, congratulations each of you. You have great opportunities to have a big positive influence on what happens in the united states and I'm sure you will do a great job. As we know, the -- we have governments in the world that have chosen to be our enemies, russia, china, iran and others. North korea.
▶ 1:38:59Sen. Scott: Do you think that historically that our publicity has reflected the attitudes of governments that want to restore -- destroy our way of life?
▶ 1:39:08Ms. Rogers: Thank you. I had an earlier exchange with ranking member shaheen on the global engagement center. One thing that is striking is that some of the information that the global engagement center suppressed was information that china would have wanted us to suppress.
▶ 1:39:25Ms. Rogers: At the behest of the global engagement center we had american companies pressure to censor american speech broadcast to american audiences on american domestic issues like covid lockdowns and the 2020 election and speech was censored regarding whether the covid virus originated in a lab in wuhan. The idea that we need to censor american speech to counter disinformation from china does not stand up to scrutiny.
▶ 1:39:55Ms. Rogers: If we look at how these operated we were doing china a favor. If I am confirmed everything my office does will happen in the light of day. If we see foreign propaganda we will call it out and we will tag it for what it is. And if we look at the russian disinformation, the purported russian disinformation identified as part of the molar investigation this is not formidable content but $100,000 worth of instagram ads that we could have mocked or dismissed.
▶ 1:40:26Ms. Rogers: I think that a more transparent approach to countering disinformation would better serve american interest and pose a greater threat to adversaries then censoring what americans say that our inconvenient.
▶ 1:40:41Sen. Scott: Tell me what pressure can we put on china to come to the table to come to nuclear weapons.
▶ 1:40:51Mr. Dinanno: Thank you for the question, as I referenced earlier as diplomats we have fewer options than are partners in the military. Certainly when it comes to diplomacy. China has an obligation to negotiate arms control.
▶ 1:41:14Mr. Dinanno: I have a hard time setting before you today granted I am not in the government but I am a nominee in any way shape or form having personally witnessed the stiff arming by the chinese and saying how they could be not in violation of article six. So that is a diplomatic leather and we need to move that and if confirmed I will look into the details of it. But that is on face value pretty obvious.
▶ 1:41:41Sen. Scott: How would you do that. What pressure and where did they get the pressure?
▶ 1:41:47Mr. Dinanno: The mpt requires meant -- requires a.
▶ 1:41:51Sen. Scott: What is the enforcement?
▶ 1:41:54Mr. Dinanno: There is no enforcement mechanism per se. I referenced some of the issues that we have with armed central and there is no enforcement per se or punishment for the chinese. If we are part of the mpt and will be part of the multilateral framework, we need to show up and use it. And that would be my intention.
▶ 1:42:19Mr. Dinanno: I did it in the prior administration being part of treaties that are not enforceable or verifiable where other partners cheat. I have a record and we withdrew from that treaty because the russians were cheating. And I spoke earlier about the implications of that. We withdrew from the open skies treaty because the russians were cheating and we were not. We should not be part of those agreements that are one-sided.
▶ 1:42:46Mr. Dinanno: To speak specifically about what we can do, diplomacy and deterrence work hand-in-hand. But exquisite literary hardware and the military has moved aggressively in the last four years since I left the government. It has been surprising to me and I am encouraged at some imf rain kate -- range capabilities are coming online.
▶ 1:43:11Mr. Dinanno: The army prison and hypersonic system platforms and critical partners and allies in the region are critical to deterring china.
▶ 1:43:22Sen. Scott: You have a significant background in government. How will this impact your ability to do it -- to do your job. What do you feel you want to get accomplished?
▶ 1:43:36Ms. Hooker: Thank you. If confirmed it would be a great honor to return to public service. As you noted I spent more than 20 years serving the american people and both the state department and the white house. It would be an honor to return to that. I look forward to supporting the president and secretary as they best see fit.
▶ 1:44:04Ms. Hooker: As I said in my opening statement, my background has been in asia, but this is a global position and I am very eager to the challenge and I look forward to serving the president and secretary and ensuring the american people are well served as well.
▶ 1:44:20Chair Risch: Thank you senator scott and asking that question. I have had the opportunity to work with her in previous administrations and we are well served by her service to america. Her knowledge and ability and negotiations that have taken place, serious negotiations have been nothing short of outstanding. Thank you so much. Senator van hollen.
▶ 1:44:47Sen. Van Hollen: , congratulations to both of you. It was great to meet with you yesterday in my office and again, thank you for all of your prior service including at the bureau of intelligence and research at the state department, which I think is an organization that punches above its weight. Do you agree that U.S. support for the U.S. food program is an important american priority?
▶ 1:45:18Ms. Hooker: Thank you senator and thank you for your time and sharing your family's legacy and serving the american people. Thank you for your service and for yours. As we talked about yesterday and discussed today. The administration, president trump and secretary rubio as --
▶ 1:45:38Sen. Van Hollen: I only have five minutes and it was a very simple question. Do you agree that U.S. support for the world food program is an important priority? It is a yes or no question.
▶ 1:45:51Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that question. And I agree that the american people's tax dollars should be used to support things that are in america's interest and international support purity.
▶ 1:46:06Sen. Van Hollen: Do you think the world food program is in our natural -- national interest?
▶ 1:46:12Ms. Hooker: Thank you for the follow-up and clarification. I am not privy to the details of the review underway. If confirmed, I expect to be. And if confirmed I look forward to working with this committee.
▶ 1:46:28Sen. Van Hollen: We have had a little good news since last night, right? Because the elon musk person who has been embedded at the state department said I made a big mistake. Yesterday and I do not know how close you are following this.
▶ 1:46:49Sen. Van Hollen: The united state cancels it support for a whole slew of world food programs and the world food program rightly said this will be a death sentence for millions of people, which it would be. So apparently there was at least a partial reversal and I am quoting from jeremy lewin who is the musk implant at the state department.
▶ 1:47:19Sen. Van Hollen: Sorry for all of the back and forth or -- on awards. There are a lot of stakeholders and we need to do better about balancing competing interests that is my fault and taking with josh and am taking responsibility. This is a symptom of a larger problem is -- which is that elon musk said that usaid is a criminal enterprise. Do you agree?
▶ 1:47:42Ms. Hooker: Thank you for the question. I look forward to being in the seat and being able to have --
▶ 1:47:49Sen. Van Hollen: Ok, these are really simple questions. As I have said before. If usaid the -- is a criminal enterprise we are all co-conspirators because we have supported this. Let me move on, because in addition to dismantling usaid which I believe has been done in an illegal fashion.
▶ 1:48:15Sen. Van Hollen: Because it is a congressionally, not just authorized in terms of funding but established in statute. So, yesterday all of the democrats on the committee wrote to secretary rubio expressing our concerns about that, and asking questions about reports of the upcoming restructuring. I ask unanimous consent to put this in the record. Thank you. So we lay out our concerns with what is happening.
▶ 1:48:45Sen. Van Hollen: By the way, and with respect Mr. chairman I really do think we need a hearing on this. Ranking member shaheen has heard -- has had two. She has had two rump earrings and one thing -- rump earrings. The people would know is when elon musk was at the white house , he canceled the ebola pope -- program temporarily. Did you see that video at the white house of elon musk?
▶ 1:49:14Ms. Hooker: I am aware of it.
▶ 1:49:17Sen. Van Hollen: He said whoops, like I just canceled the world food program. It turned out to be false in the case of elon musk because nick, who is now on administrative leave testified that in fact the ebola program has not been restored. Here is my question to you.
▶ 1:49:41Sen. Van Hollen: I am hearing from people at the state department feel like they are being asked to make statements that they believe are factually incorrect. In some cases people might be making legal determinations that they think are wrong but under threat of being fired. I have a simple question. If somebody asks you to do something that you believe is illegal, would you resign?
▶ 1:50:03Ms. Hooker: Thank you for that question. I have committed in my opening statement of following the constitution. I add to that all applicable law. I intend to do so. If I am confirmed, I look forward to working with this committee on all of these issues and the concerns that you have raised today, and I commit to doing that.
▶ 1:50:27Sen. Van Hollen: In addition to what happened with a id there is great restructuring going on. And I hope that this committee will, you know, uphold its responsibilities and require the administration to report and consult with us in the process. If you look at what is being reported we are talking about what would be grave damage to U.S. foreign policy.
▶ 1:50:52Chair Risch: Thank you for that engagement. And, first of all, we are being consulted in a general fashion at this point. Number one. Number two, I for one have been crying out for reform for usaid for years. I have said publicly and I will say it again here. I hope usaid does not survive.
▶ 1:51:19Chair Risch: I hope it is reformed and placed underneath the state department where we have a direct head appointed by the president and responsible to this committee. I look forward to working with the state department and I believe that others on this committee that they do intend to work together with the committee. We have a responsibility to oversee that. We are the number one agency. We created it, regulate it and funded it.
▶ 1:51:49Chair Risch: We have the duty to oversee it. I look forward to working with you. We will not agree on everything, but I think we will come away with a stronger enterprise. What usaid is important so forward U.S. policy on many fronts. We are a soft power committee. That is our job. We take it seriously. We look forward to this.
▶ 1:52:16Chair Risch: And, certainly there are things that will be corrected that have been done.
▶ 1:52:20Sen. Van Hollen: I would just say Mr. chairman, and a minimum it should be done in a lawful manner.
▶ 1:52:26Chair Risch: I agree with that and I am sure the courts will back us up on that. With that, there will be no further questions and I will close the hearing. And I will include letters of support, which we have for some of the nominees. I will include those in the record. And also information to the members, the record will remain open until close of business tomorrow at 5:00 p.m.
▶ 1:52:55Chair Risch: That will give them the opportunity to submit questions. I hope you respond quickly and it will help this committee move quickly on voting on your nomination. With that, the committee is adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap.org]