▶ 0:18:48Chair Cruz: Today we will hear from four nominees. David fink for administrator of the federal railroad administration. David fogel for assistant secretary of commerce and director general of the U.S. and foreign commercial service. Pierre gentin, general counsel of the department of commerce. Robert gleason for the amtrak board of directors. Congratulations to each of you for your nomination.
▶ 0:19:17Chair Cruz: I am eager to hear more about your qualifications for your respective roles. Let's start with the department of commerce. As general counsel, Mr. gentin: as general counsel, Mr. gentin will draw on his experience as an in-house attorney to provide legal advice to the secretary. He is a former assistant U.S. attorney for the southern district of new york who has held legal and management roles at major companies, including most recently as the chief legal officer at mckinsey.
▶ 0:19:47Chair Cruz: He has lectured at yale law school, columbia law school, and the wharton school of business, which I will try not to hold against you. A favorite of the president's wharton, as we all know. Mr. gentin will provide strategic legal counsel in secretary let nick's efforts to address critical policy challenges like reallocating spectrum, advancing ai, and building the national manufacturing base.
▶ 0:20:16Chair Cruz: David fogel is well versed in international economic diplomacy. As the director general of the U.S. foreign commercial service, he will strive to increase foreign investment in the united states and remove trade barriers on american exports. During the first trump administration he served as chief of staff at export import bank and as a senior advisor to the undersecretary of economic growth of the state department.
▶ 0:20:47Chair Cruz: If confirmed, he will work to counterbalance the ccp expanding footprint in global markets and to encourage our allies to purchase more products and services made in america. Let me now turn to david fink, the nominee for the administrator of the federal railroad administration. As a fifth generation railroader , he knows the ins and outs of the industry.
▶ 0:21:12Chair Cruz: He led pan am railways when it was the largest regional railroad in the country and he helped negotiate the sale of the company to csx in 2022. Pan am's employee injury rate was consistently lower than the class to railroad industry average for the decade concluding his tenure as ceo.
▶ 0:21:36Chair Cruz: He is deeply can -- committed to the fra core mission of safety and he will make sure it remains top of mind in all regulatory actions.
▶ 0:21:51Chair Cruz: Finally, robert gleason will draw on his time working on transportation commissions in pennsylvania to enhance passenger experiences across the amtrak network and I look forward to hearing how he will expand their rail service to underserved areas, improve the safety record, and insist on transparency regarding executive compensation.
▶ 0:22:14Chair Cruz: The nominees before us will champion regulatory clarity and strategic investment in american industries. The rail nominees in particular will take practical steps to improve the reliability, efficiency, and safety of moving people and goods across the country. Let's hear more about how they will help to build a stronger and more prosperous america. With that, I turned to senator peters for his opening.
▶ 0:22:43Senator Peters: Thank you and welcome to our four nominees here today. I also want to welcome your family and friends, who are here to support you through this process. Our first nominee this morning is david fink for the federal railroad administration. Americans rely on the U.S. rail network to move roughly more than 28 million passengers and one point 6 billion tons of goods each and every year.
▶ 0:23:12Senator Peters: When things don't go well, entire communities suffer. We saw this in east palestine in 2023. Yesterday was the 10 year anniversary of the deadly amtrak 188 derailment in philadelphia, an accident that is very personal to me, the day that we lost rachel jacobs, a family friend of mine with deep roots in the detroit area. Rail safety is certainly not something to take lightly. Mr.
▶ 0:23:42Senator Peters: Fink, it will be up to you to make sure passengers and community members are safe throughout the rail system. That is why I have concerns about your safety record running pan am railways 2006 to 2022, which under your leadership at a higher than average mainline track derailment rate and series of documented safety issues. We need fra leadership that will put accountability and safety first and I hope to hear how you plan to address that here today.
▶ 0:24:12Senator Peters: We are also considering robert gleason to serve as the director of the amtrak board. In my home state of michigan, we are working to improve and expand our rail service to our three lines and bring back amtrak service to the historic michigan central station in downtown detroit, as well as cross-border service to canada. That is something that we cannot do without, the cooperation of both of our rail nominees, Mr.
▶ 0:24:44Senator Peters: Fink and Mr. gleason. I hope you will agree with me today that infrastructure investments are not optional for the future of amtrak, they will be essential going forward. The next nominee, pierre gentin, nominated to be general counsel of the commerce department, responsible for providing legal guidance to the secretary and across the department. Since february, he has been serving as a senior advisor in the office of secretary.
▶ 0:25:13Senator Peters: Unfortunately, in only a few months we have seen the lasting damage that can happen when there isn't responsible leadership at the helm, from dismantling know to cutting support for manufacturers and entrepreneur is here in the country. I expect you to answer questions about these disruptive actions at the department. I will note concerned that you haven't provided full information specified in the committee questionnaire, which is expected of all nominees.
▶ 0:25:42Senator Peters: Staff advised me that you abruptly left your staff interview early. I hope that your testimony here today shows more regard for this committee, constitutional duty, advise, and consent. The final nominee is david fogel, nominated to be the assistant secretary of commerce and director general of the united states in foreign commercial service.
▶ 0:26:06Senator Peters: If confirmed, you will direct the global markets unit of the international trade administration and be responsible for assisting and advocating for U.S. businesses in international markets. Stated plainly, that will be a difficult task given the destabilizing tariff agenda of the president.
▶ 0:26:23Senator Peters: The tariffs will raise prices and provoke retaliation, making it harder for american businesses to export their goods and services and harder to work with our allies to counter chinese influence. I look forward to your answers on how we plan to keep these departments focused in the middle of the chaos created by the president. Thank you.
▶ 0:26:46Chair Cruz: Thank you, senator peters. For the record as chairman I have endeavored to give the minority full opportunity to bet nominees and consider their qualifications and backgrounds. I would point out that the minority has had significant time to review the nominees before us today. The nominees committee questionnaires have been submitted for weeks, two of them since late march. Mr.
▶ 0:27:11Chair Cruz: Gentin's committee questionnaire has been submitted since march 24. On may 2, the minority emailed his team and ask him to clarify a few items. He met with the minority for over an hour and a half last thursday. He submitted and -- an addendum and will produce anything outstanding by the end of the week. Yesterday, the ranking member had the opportunity to review fbi background investigation reports for all the nominees before us today.
▶ 0:27:43Chair Cruz: Unfortunately, she had to cancel because of a scheduling issue. My team and I remain committed to a bipartisan, careful, and thorough vetting process. Ranking member cantwell like all members will have ample opportunity to question the nominees and submit questions for the record. I am happy to continue working with her and her team throughout this process. So, I trust, are the nominees.
▶ 0:28:08Chair Cruz: With that, I want to recognize senator mccormick from the commonwealth of pennsylvania.
▶ 0:28:15Senator Mccormick: Thank you, chairman, senate colleagues on the committee. Thank you for having me, I'm honored to introduce a fine pennsylvanian and good friend, robert gleason, to be a member of the amtrak board of directors. He is a proud son of johnstown in cambria county, where his family lived for generations.
▶ 0:28:40Senator Mccormick: After graduating from the university of pennsylvania, rob went to officer training and served in active duty from 62 to 65, eventually retiring from the reserves as a captain. He's a highly successful businessman who took over his families storied insurance based business in 1970 and continues to serve as president of the organization. He is an experienced public servant who has served the commonwealth under governors of both parties.
▶ 0:29:09Senator Mccormick: Under deck ford merck he served as secretary of the commonwealth, worked with and got to know my dad, placing him in charge of pennsylvania department of state. Governor bob casey appointed him to the pennsylvania turnpike commission, overseeing one of their most important highways in the commonwealth. Because of his service they are and on the state transportation commission, he will bring to amtrak significant experience in overseeing major transportation networks.
▶ 0:29:38Senator Mccormick: From johnstown, he knows firsthand better than anyone the importance of rail service to rural communities and he will be strong and independent. As an air force veteran and community leader, he represents the mantra of duty and honoring country and is exactly the kind of public servant we should call upon to serve. I'm honored to be here today, rob.
▶ 0:30:03Senator Mccormick: Thank you for the opportunity to introduce him this morning and I urge all members of the committee to support the nomination.
▶ 0:30:09Chair Cruz: Thank you, senator. For the record, I will note that we have seen the miracle of a west point graduate praising an air man on the record. I suppose it could be worse, you could be praising a sailor and that might be a bridge too far. I assume that senator sullivan will ask your view on the marines any minute now.
▶ 0:30:37Chair Cruz: [inaudible] [laughter] well, you are welcome to stay, but I know you have a busy schedule, thank you for being here. We now turn to opening statements and I recognize Mr. fink.
▶ 0:30:51Mr. Fink: Chairman cruz, ranking member cantwell, theaters, members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to be here today. This is the honor of the light -- of a lifetime. I'm grateful to the president for placing his trust in me and I'm deeply grateful to secretary duffy and his confidence in my abilities to be the fra.
▶ 0:31:17Mr. Fink: I'm joined by my wife, my son, and my daughter who is unable to travel as she is eight months pregnant. My wife and family have been forever supportive of my career and I'm grateful for that support. I sit here today before the committee and think back to my first trip to washington in 1966. I was five years old. My grandfather and I hopped on a pennsylvania railroad clock or from 30th street station and spent the day touring the ceric -- the city.
▶ 0:31:46Mr. Fink: I most remember my visit to the smithsonian. It's a very large -- it has a very large green southern railway will locomotive. I still like to visit that spot and see that locomotive. Little did I know at that time I would be a fifth generation railroader. I got my start as a conrail track worker in 1976. I had to co-op jobs at northeastern university.
▶ 0:32:17Mr. Fink: I worked for general motors and was able to see the transportation user side of the business and I worked in the railroad supply business. In 1998i joined the guilford rail system as the executive vice president. 2000 six, pan am railways. -- 2006, I became president of pan am railways. We move what the nation needs for energy and move with the population needs.
▶ 0:32:46Mr. Fink: It moves the parts to the automobile assembly lines and it takes the finished vehicles to the final distribution. It moves containers from our ports and more importantly, it does it safely. Over the course of the fra's existence, safety has been on a property -- positive trajectory. If confirmed, fre -- fra will be dedicated to continuing that safety trend. The national ray network moves millions across our great country.
▶ 0:33:16Mr. Fink: Amtrak, the national passenger rail system, provides intercity systems while commuters and locals provide continued service. We are focused on a primary mission of safety first. We also need to refresh government regulations, innovating when possible, removing outdated roadblocks.
▶ 0:33:40Mr. Fink: The railroad industry in the united states has been developing state-of-the-art technology to make the safe system even safer and most of it is ready to be deployed. I look forward to making sure that fra is a partner and not a hindrance. If confirmed, one of my first jobs will be to get that technology in the field to make the rail system safer. Another way I want to make sure we are focused on safety and efficiency is through grant programs that have grown significantly over the past four years.
▶ 0:34:11Mr. Fink: I know firsthand how the consolidated rail infrastructure program can support critical rail safety projects. I can also imagine that there is room for improvement in the way they select and deliver taxpayer projects and I look forward to working with the many dedicated professionals at the fra. They have an extremely important job regulating the national railways. I look forward to working with management and labor.
▶ 0:34:40Mr. Fink: If I am fortunate to be confirmed as the administrator of the federal railroad administration, I will dedicate myself to safe and efficient transportation. This concludes my statement and I'm happy to answer questions.
▶ 0:34:55Chair Cruz: I know recognize Mr. vogel for his opening statement.
▶ 0:34:59Mr. Fogel: Thank you. Chairman, senator peters, members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today for what is my second senate confirmation hearing for the position of assistant secretary of commerce for global markets and the director general of the U.S. foreign commission service. I am honored to be dominated by the president for this position and I want to thank secretary let nick for his support of my nomination.
▶ 0:35:29Mr. Fogel: I also want to thank the committee for the opportunity to meet with many of you and your staff members leading up to the hearing. Unfortunately, my family is not able to be with me, given that my three daughters have exams back in connecticut this week and they already missed two days of high school to attend my first confirmation. I do however want to thank my sister, linda, for joining us today.
▶ 0:35:55Mr. Fogel: Global markets division of the department of commerce is a key role in implementing the priorities of the president, supporting administrative goals, strengthening the american economy, supporting and creating american jobs, and boosting our economic and national security. The global markets team works with foreign governments to make sure we have their access to U.S. companies, promotes the export of goods answer for U.S.
▶ 0:36:24Mr. Fogel: Companies of all sizes, facilitates foreign and direct investment into the united states. In many respects, my private and public sector experience in my educational background prepared me well for this important responsibility. From a young age, my father instilled in me a strong sense of public service. His regiment led me to attend the georgetown school of foreign service.
▶ 0:36:50Mr. Fogel: I stayed at georgetown for four more years to get my jd and mba degrees. I interned for all three branches of the federal government while in school. In the white house, tap -- capitol hill for two senators, and a federal judge, as well as for former u.n. Ambassador rice jeanne kirkpatrick. My professional career began at sullivan cromwell in new york city as a corporate attorney focused on domestic and international transactions.
▶ 0:37:19Mr. Fogel: From there I went on to build three companies and three -- in three innovative sectors, continuing to negotiate cross-border transactions, managing large teams. I also had the privilege of serving under the first trump administration. Initially I was chief of staff at the export import, where I helped to oversee a team of professionals who executed billions of dollars of transactions or small, medium, and large U.S. companies.
▶ 0:37:50Mr. Fogel: I also helped to establish the new financing program at the bank to compete with china, which the U.S. congress had just wisely mandated. Subsequently, I moved over to the state department where I served as senior advisor in chief business development officer for the undersecretary of economic growth where I continued my work helping U.S. companies compete with china and win deals abroad.
▶ 0:38:18Mr. Fogel: I hope to leverage all of my experience to help execute the trump strategy of expanding exports abroad, increasing investments here at home. Our great american businesses produce the best goods answer isn't the world. You just need a level playing field to compete and succeed in the global marketplace.
▶ 0:38:40Mr. Fogel: If confirmed I will work closely with members of the committee and with congress to make sure that the global market unit of the national trade administration is as effective and successful as possible. Thank you again for your consideration for my nomination and I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:39:03Chair Cruz: Thank you, Mr. vogel. I now recognize Mr. gentin.
▶ 0:39:08Mr. Gentin: It is a great honor to testify before you this morning as nominee for general counsel of the commerce department. I am deeply grateful to the president for nominating me. To sec. Let nick for his leadership in the department. Into this committee for considering my nomination. I am grateful to family and friends who are joining me today.
▶ 0:39:34Mr. Gentin: My wonderful wife, my son, my siblings, my mother and my daughter are watching on livestream. My father and teacher passed away last year, Dr. benjamin gentin, and he is here with me in spirit.
▶ 0:39:55Mr. Gentin: We moved our family from south africa to the united states nearly 50 years ago so that my siblings and I could live as free, proud, productive citizens . It was the american bicentennial. I was nine years old.
▶ 0:40:10Mr. Gentin: My parents lost no time taking us to boston, philadelphia, washington, fostering in us a deep love of american history and culture and make sure that we internalize the great american ideas of freedom, faith, and responsibility. My parents work hard and overcome any obstacles to become respected professionals in american medicine and law and equally respected members of their community.
▶ 0:40:37Mr. Gentin: I have tried to emulate my parents personally and professionally. As a lawyer myself, I have been fortunate to work in government and private sector, and academia . My life is a testament to the power of opportunity. I served the department of justice as an assistant united states attorney in the district of mover.
▶ 0:41:02Mr. Gentin: I came away from that experience with deep respect for the authority that government lawyers exercise and the responsibility that comes with that power. After government service I spent nearly 20 years in one of the world's largest financial services companies, advising on significant legal and regulatory matters in the banking sector. As a business lawyer, I saw firsthand the importance of intelligent and effective governmental oversight of industry.
▶ 0:41:31Mr. Gentin: Equally, I learned the importance of respecting and empowering innovation, hard work, and the spirit of entrepreneurial inertia that enabled us to secure a leading position in global commerce. I drew my same conclusions during my years as a partner at a leading U.S. law firm. For the past six years I served as chief legal officer at mckinsey, an american company that pioneered the profession of management consulting nearly a century ago.
▶ 0:42:00Mr. Gentin: As the first lawyer elected to senior partner at mckinsey in the first to serve on the management team, the council defers leadership on legal risk and business and cultural issues. Over the past three decades, I have been active in the academic and nonprofit arenas, serving multiple times as a visiting professor of law, lecturer in ethics, and editor of a book on negotiating the resolution of business disputes.
▶ 0:42:28Mr. Gentin: I have been a trustee on many nonprofit boards, including the practicing law institute, a nearly century old legal education organization, and the touro synagogue foundation preserving an 18th-century synagogue in rhode island symbolizing our national commitment to religious freedom.
▶ 0:42:47Mr. Gentin: I believe that my public, private, and academic experience, my commitment to the rule of law, and my desire to help safeguard the well-being of our country, equip me well to serve proudly as general counsel of the department of commerce. I am -- if I am honored to be confirmed, I look forward to working with this committee and stakeholders inside of and outside of government to augur an era of greatness for american commerce and prosperity for our nation. Thank you.
▶ 0:43:17Chair Cruz: Thank you. I now recognize Mr. gleason.
▶ 0:43:22Mr. Gleason: [no audio]
▶ 0:43:25Chair Cruz: Can you turn on the volume on your microphone?
▶ 0:43:29Mr. Gleason: Thank you, chairman cruz and senator peters, and the rest of the committee, for allowing me to come before you today. I want to thank senator david mccormick for introducing me here today. I'm pleased that my wife, my grandson, and my sister here supporting me today.
▶ 0:43:49Mr. Gleason: My passion for transportation and community development has been a lifelong journey, deeply rooted in my experience working in government at the county, state, city, and national levels. In johnstown, pennsylvania I saw firsthand how transportation systems can isolate or connect communities. This personal understanding drives my commitment to better passenger rail service across america.
▶ 0:44:17Mr. Gleason: For the first half of my 20th century my home town was connected to the rest of the world by the pennsylvania railroad. Trains with iconic names like the broadway limited, the red arrow, fort pitt, and the clevelander. I was a regular rail passenger, traveling back and forth to philadelphia to attend the university of pennsylvania horton school. There you are, another wharton school guy.
▶ 0:44:43Mr. Gleason: Our town was bypassed by the interstate highway system, one of only seven cities in the united states of over 100,000 to miss the interstate and most airlines overflow us. We begin a downhill slide and today we are only served by two passengers -- passenger trains.
▶ 0:45:04Mr. Gleason: In addition to my experience with rail connections in the potentially devastating effects of a community not being on the main transportation grid, I am honored to be nominated to join the amtrak board to continue public service. My civilian experience made me well-qualified for the role and I proudly served our country as a captain in the U.S. air force with four years of active duty. I currently serve my community as president of the local board of education and served 10 years as a councilmember.
▶ 0:45:34Mr. Gleason: I have served as secretary of the commonwealth of, a member of the pennsylvania state transportation advisory committee, pennsylvania state transportation committee, four years as a member of the pennsylvania turnpike commission, and sam skinner pointed me to the national literature advisory committee. In 1982i was appointed to one of the first state government committees in the nation to study high-speed rail.
▶ 0:46:00Mr. Gleason: The nine-member committee was appointed by tik thornburgh, where they look at the feasibility of high-speed passenger rail route -- rail lines between philadelphia and pittsburgh. A wonderful experience that will help me here. Passenger rail can be a powerful engine for growth, with thousands of construction, engineering, and operational jobs.
▶ 0:46:27Mr. Gleason: Trains attract writers who spend money in the local economies, especially near stations. Communities can be revitalized by the presence of a reliable service. When done right, passenger rail doesn't mean people, it lives prosperity. If confirmed I will work diligently to improve service across america in a fiscally responsible manner.
▶ 0:46:53Mr. Gleason: Amtrak benefits greatly from taxpayer dollars and I will make sure that money is spent in a efficient manner as well as productive. I've spent time living with pennsylvania sunshine laws, I'm proud to support more board transparency. In conclusion I hope to gain the approval of joining the amtrak board from this committee as I firmly believe the U.S. needs passenger rail service that can be delivered in an efficient and responsible way. Thank you.
▶ 0:47:21Chair Cruz: Thank you, Mr. gleason. All right, Mr. fink, we will start with you. You served as the head of the largest class to railroad in the united states. Like all rail executives you faced safety challenges. I imagine that you learned a great deal. In your opening statement you made a point of describing the primary mission is safety first.
▶ 0:47:45Chair Cruz: How does your professional experience shape your perspective on rail safety and what should the fra be doing to improve the safety of the rail system?
▶ 0:47:53Mr. Fink: Thank you for the question, senator. In my career I wanted to work towards zero injuries in zero accidents, that was the push at pan am. I also wanted to work on a cooperative and collaborative relationship and in that area I worked closely with our operating labor unions and would have 16 meetings per year in the field with my staff meeting with the general and local chairman as well as any people with safety issues.
▶ 0:48:24Mr. Fink: We first started doing that about 10 years ago. There was a lot of friction between the parties. We fixed a lot of the safety related issues. As we came towards the csx merger, we were down to a handful of issues. Working collaboratively and cooperatively was important. As railroad management it is important to use the tools available to us.
▶ 0:48:45Mr. Fink: Our railroad volunteer did a two-time safety project pilot where the institute came in to help us see if we had a safety culture. When they came in in 2015 they said that our safety culture was a work in progress. We had another one in 2018.
▶ 0:49:05Mr. Fink: We had work to do, but the things that needed to be discussed and worked on was senior management engaged in safe workplaces and they found we had that. Giving people the tools that they need to do their work. They found we did. We were one of the only railroads to do two of these assessments, while many of the large ones have not done any.
▶ 0:49:32Mr. Fink: If something goes wrong it can lead to fatalities or catastrophic injuries. Every day we need to be out there stretching for zero injuries in zero accidents.
▶ 0:49:40Chair Cruz: Thank you. Mr. fogel, you have extensive experience in international trade. What are some of the nontariff barriers to trade that limit our exports and how do you plan to address that?
▶ 0:49:54Mr. Fogel: Thank you, senator. This is something that is very eye-opening to me. I have learned quite a bit about it. It would surprise some people to know that we are importing $3 billion in beef from australia, at least last year, exporting zero dollars of american beef to australia.
▶ 0:50:13Chair Cruz: As a texan, that pisses me off.
▶ 0:50:21Mr. Fogel: Argentina, same problem, mad cow disease rules in argentina, we cannot export beef there. Cars to japan, south korea, germany, we are not selling american cars there due to various import requirements. These are more insidious. Nontariff barriers are more insidious. Tears are easy to understand, difficult to deal with.
▶ 0:50:48Mr. Fogel: Nontariff barriers are more challenging. Professional teams with years of experience dealing with this, I look forward to working with them to break down the barriers trump leadership.
▶ 0:50:59Chair Cruz: Thank. Mr. gentin, the department of commerce manages spectrum allocation for the -- through the end tia. As general counsel you might be asked to advise on the wreath -- legal authority to reallocate for commercial use. I'm hoping that you can address the legal safeguards in place now to mitigate suppose it national security risks due to reallocation.
▶ 0:51:28Chair Cruz: One key authority is the commercial spectrum enhancement act, which is 47 usc section 920 eight, establishing a spectrum relocation fund to compensate agencies for relocating or upgrading systems for spectrum sharing. No federal user, including the department of defense, can be displaced without a fully funded omb approved transition plan.
▶ 0:51:53Chair Cruz: Similarly, according to statute, dod shall not surrender frequencies unless and until ntia identifies alternative bands with comparable technical characteristics. They must be jointly certified by the secretary of defense and the chairman of the joint chiefs. Mr. gentin, do you agree that these legal requirements mitigate national security risks due to the reallocation of spectrum?
▶ 0:52:20Mr. Gentin: Yes, I very much do agree. There's no question that the statutory protections for spectrum associated with national security are very robust and strong. If I'm honored to be confirmed, I will certainly focus on making sure those structures are observed.
▶ 0:52:38Chair Cruz: Great. Final question for you, Mr. gleason, amtrak currently receives between $1 million and $3 million in government subsidies but the 2021 infrastructure investment jobs act provided up to 66 million in additional funding. Congress wants to make sure the money is being well spent, especially now that certain projects like the baltimore tunnel and gateway program have ballooned in costs.
▶ 0:53:06Chair Cruz: Last week an internal investigation by the officer of the inspector general at amtrak uncovered a 12 million-dollar health care fraud scheme involving 119 employees, the largest criminal conspiracy in the history of amtrak. Will you commit to vigilantly insuring amtrak funds are used efficiently and in accordance with the law?
▶ 0:53:28Mr. Gleason: Absolutely.
▶ 0:53:31Chair Cruz: Do you commit to making sure that bonuses and benefits for executive compensation are appropriate and a based on measurable metrics like ridership, revenues, and safety?
▶ 0:53:42Mr. Gleason: I would have it no other way.
▶ 0:53:44Chair Cruz: Thank. Senator peters?
▶ 0:53:48Sen. Cantwell: Thank you. -- Sen. peters: thank. Mr. gentin, last week I raise concerns over the administration attempt to find a backdoor to abolish the manufacturing extension partnership program. On top of that, friday the high-speed office heard from the department of commerce that they were terminating funding for the digital equity grant program.
▶ 0:54:15Sen. Cantwell: That formula funding has already been awarded to local communities and has already been spent by those communities in the state of michigan. What it basically does is it increases adoption of high-speed internet, raises awareness about cyber security groups like our seniors, digital skills workshop training, as well as educating consumers on online privacy, just to name a few.
▶ 0:54:40Sen. Cantwell: The federal government in my view and in the view of the courts as well cannot promise funding to a community and then simply refuse to pay when the bill shows up. Both of these programs, the manufacturing extension partnership and digital equity grant program are authorized and fully funded, clearly and specifically, by congress. You have been nominated to fill the role of top legal advisor to the department of commerce.
▶ 0:55:07Sen. Cantwell: My question is simple and straightforward, think. Without input from congress, is it legal for the administration to cancel funding for authorized and fully appropriated programs that were put into law by the U.S. congress?
▶ 0:55:23Mr. Gentin: Thank you very much, senator. I am not yet confirmed as general counsel of the department of commerce. I certainly recognize the importance of the issues you have raised, you raise them in prior hearings. I have not been involved in advising or implementing the actions you described.
▶ 0:55:45Mr. Gentin: I would certainly prioritize, if I am honored to be confirmed, looking into those issues and working with relevant bureau leadership and the council at the department of commerce.
▶ 0:55:55Sen. Peters: I'm trying to highlight these issues and understand you are not there now, but this is basically a legal question. If congress authorized funding by law, can the administration say sorry, we are not going to do it? Are they not supposed to faithfully execute the laws of the U.S.
▶ 0:56:12Mr. Gentin: I hear you loud and clear. I think that if I am confirmed, I will make it a priority to look into those issues. I have not, as I say, advise on or been a part of implementing the actions you described.
▶ 0:56:27Sen. Peters: If confirmed, we will reach out and have that conversation. We are committed to doing that.
▶ 0:56:33Mr. Gentin: Thank you.
▶ 0:56:34Sen. : Mr. fink, -- Sen. peters: Mr. fink, before pan am railways became a part of csx, the railway audit found significant safety issues are not receiving the serious and thoughtful consideration by railroad leadership that the employees of pan am and the public deserve. That was 20. You left shortly after their from the railroad.
▶ 0:57:01Sen. : This was on top of court cases that occurred during your time there that found "a culture of intimidating employees." that as of 2017, "99% of injuries at pan am that were reportable to the fra triggered formal charges against injured employees." it's a concerning record from these audits and I have a couple of questions.
▶ 0:57:28Sen. : Do you accept the fra findings about the pan am railroad safety failings?
▶ 0:57:34Mr. Fink: I don't, thank you for the question. The audit was done in 22 and there were issues that I took with it. First off, I would say there was a statement about the lack of safety culture. We are the only railroad that has done two safety culture audits of the country. We took that information and improved it on the safety. Without a safety culture, I disagree, it's not true.
▶ 0:58:03Mr. Fink: We have worked closely with organized labor, going out into the field, meeting with the people in figuring out the issues that would be out there. Walking, tripping part -- hazards, locomotives, situations in the shop to make things safety -- saver. Employees came with union representatives and you talked about what made it better.
▶ 0:58:27Sen. Peters: You have the audit and do you believe that if you get an audit like that, you should respect it and answer it and show exactly in a concrete way as to how you are addressing it?
▶ 0:58:39Mr. Fink: Yes, our folks did that and wrote a letter back to the fra and was working with them on these issues. The one that popped up was because of the awful, tragic accident with a 41 your long-term employee who lost his life working for our company. That trigger the audit. It went through a lot of items and I took exception to lack of safety culture. They came in and looked at things.
▶ 0:59:09Mr. Fink: There were defects. It was a 49 page audit. After that they came up with two violations. As you know, to have for the fra, we cannot have a culture where -- it's a bad audit and I just disagree with it, forget it. We cannot have that when it comes to safety. You heard my opening remarks. Personal.
▶ 0:59:36Mr. Fink: People that seriously get injured or die. Someone who dismisses audits on a regular basis, I have concerns about. Please share with me and the committee that the audits are something you will aggressively enforce when it comes to talking to the railroads.
▶ 0:59:55Mr. Fink: Absolutely. I didn't want to talk about that lightly. I took exception with a few of the items in the audit. Safety is the most important and I will not waver from that at all as administrator.
▶ 1:00:09Sen. Peters: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:00:12Chair Cruz: Mr. fink, I agree with you and senator peters, safety has to be first. What was the object of record of your railroad when it came to safety and accidents compared to your peers? In my last 10 years that I was -- Mr. fink: my last 10 years I was there, with the class to railroads, there were 11 and we came in third. That's a bronze medal in the olympics.
▶ 1:00:40Chair Cruz: I want gold, but ron's isn't bad and we are working to do things better.
▶ 1:00:45Chair Cruz: Your safety record was significantly better than a majority of your peers, is that accurate?
▶ 1:00:55Mr. Fink: Incredibly accurate.
▶ 1:00:58Sen. Peters: I want to continue in the reign of safety. Fridley rail has always had a high safety record and we know that improvements to be made. In my view, one of the simplest and easiest ways would be to modernize the fra regulatory approach and allow railroads to innovate with safety technologies across the network.
▶ 1:01:24Sen. Peters: If confirmed, will you commit to making sure that fra becomes a partner with the roadways in terms of -- railways in terms of integrating new technology processes into the system?
▶ 1:01:34Mr. Fink: Thank you, it was nice bumping into you this morning at the cafeteria. Absolutely, technology is important. A lot of items out there could make things safer. When those who work in the party continue to gather data and make sure that the technology we put out there will be 6 -- failsafe and better than what we have today.
▶ 1:01:59Senator: We have developed a program to examine and develop passenger plate -- passenger rail planning to assess new routes for underserved communities. It's that program of a year-long effort of extended amtrak, heartland flyer.
▶ 1:02:28Senator: That would connect to oklahoma city, connecting then to fort worth. Not our entire state, but wichita and nguyen would become the significant beneficiaries. If confirmed, use of worthy work -- corridor id partners as they plan to advance to the second step of the effort?
▶ 1:02:50Mr. Fink: Thank you for the question. I'm not familiar with the corridor id program and I look forward to sitting down and learning about all the things. I have read about a lot of different programs. I have worked with amtrak over our career. The 12 trains a day on a local real. I look forward to working with amtrak management to look at how we will work on it in the national network for amtrak.
▶ 1:03:20Mr. Fink: You have my word on that, but I need to check the programs out and I will be happy to get back to you.
▶ 1:03:25Sen. Peters: I'm happy to highlight the program that will allow you to do that. Thank you.
▶ 1:03:29Mr. Fink: Sen. peters: thank you.
▶ 1:03:32Sen. Peters: Let me -- senator: let me ask Mr. gleason, supported passenger rail, I've had this conversation with every nominee since I've been in the senate and on this committee about their commitment to long distance passenger rail service. On occasion I have utilized in the northeast corridor when I want to make certain that the railroads that serve the past geography of the company -- country are not overlooked. Tell me about your commitment.
▶ 1:04:03Mr. Gentin: I'm committed. I have written long distance trains, including the california zephyr. I use the auto train on a regular basis. You know what your state needs and I look forward to working with you to provide the necessary passenger rail for your state. We need more in this country.
▶ 1:04:30Senator: Thank you. Mr. gentin, I have asked this question of nominees in the past, would you confirm to me that if asked, you will provide your client with advice requiring them to follow the law as defined in court orders and decisions?
▶ 1:04:59Senator: The point here is recognizing that those orders are required to be followed.
▶ 1:05:04Mr. Gentin: I would.
▶ 1:05:06Senator: Without exception?
▶ 1:05:08Mr. Gentin: Yes.
▶ 1:05:10Senator: Thank you.
▶ 1:05:11Chair Cruz: Senator klobuchar?
▶ 1:05:16Senator Klobuchar: Mr. vogel, let's start with you. -- Mr. fink: -- Mr. fink, let's start with you. Enjoyed our discussion yesterday. I've long done work with the foreign service and I believe it's an opportunity for small businesses without full-time trade experts to access markets. I have numerous examples from my own state that we discussed.
▶ 1:05:43Senator Klobuchar: The national numeral export center in fargo, you would think I would be asking about fargo, but it is right next to minnesota. I call it morehead, fargo. Senator hoeven may disagree. Senator hoeven and I have been leading efforts to permanently establish a rule export center within the U.S. commercial service to help rural businesses export. I suggest you talk to him about it some point.
▶ 1:06:13Senator Klobuchar: Can you talk about the importance of rural exports in the work done in the department in the U.S. and foreign commercial service when it comes to rural?
▶ 1:06:24Mr. Fogel: Thank you, senator. The foreign commercial service plays an essential role in trade. Rural export centers, agriculture is a key issue. It's a priority for the president. The agriculture trade deficit went up significantly in the last four years and he has worked on bringing it down and we have seen results from the u.k.
▶ 1:06:51Mr. Fogel: And I think we will see more from other trade framework deals. There is a big role for the foreign commercial and U.S. commercial service to play. What they do, as you alluded to, is help educate small businesses in particular, but all businesses, for exports. What markets to export to. How to deal with nontariff barriers, import restrictions, etc..
▶ 1:07:16Mr. Fogel: If you are a small business owner and have never exported before, you need the expertise to get you over the hump.
▶ 1:07:23Sen. Klobuchar: Of course, I'm very concerned about the effect of these tariffs. I'm not going to spend my precious five minutes on this. I might ask you more later about farming. Soybeans, especially, the market in china was down to only 20%. The rest went to brazil from the last trump administration. Now they are concerned they will lose it all. So, I hope that we can get in a better place, but it has been a real problem for farmers.
▶ 1:07:55Sen. Klobuchar: Next up, Mr. gleason: next up, Mr. gleason. Last year, amtrak launch the new -- don't know if you know about this -- the borealis line, running along the empire build route. They added a second daily train from st. Paul to chicago.
▶ 1:08:14Sen. Klobuchar: There was only one and it was always a problem when there was just one and interestingly enough there are 11 stops between and ridership exceeded expectations, it has reached 100,000 riders in the first five months. In your testimony you discussed the economic importance of passenger rail to the towns that they serve like in minnesota, st. Paul, redwing, and winona.
▶ 1:08:42Sen. Klobuchar: Will you commit to working to improve and maintain passenger rail on long-distance routes that connect rural areas to urban centers?
▶ 1:08:51Mr. Gleason: Absolutely. It's amazing. It just shows that people in the americas will ride the trains if they are there. I'm absolutely for that.
▶ 1:09:03Sen. Klobuchar: There's another train we are looking at, long in the making on an existing route that I ask you to look at if you are confirmed, northern lights express. It is an representative stopper's district, pretty much. It goes from the twin cities up to duluth.
▶ 1:09:24Sen. Klobuchar: It's not running yet, but it was one of the next up situations that would involve building a lot of track. There are many colleges up there. It is a growing area, big tourist area. Same thing, routes along the way . There's a lot of interest. So, if you could look at that, I would appreciate it.
▶ 1:09:52Mr. Gleason: Certainly.
▶ 1:09:54Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you. Last up, Mr. fink, block rail crossings have been one of my priorities because of all of the shipping in minnesota. We have tons of manufacturing things we are making. We go to ports. We go to the port of duluth a lot and then down the mississippi river commission. As you noted in your testimony, the fra grant programs are ways to ensure safety and efficiency.
▶ 1:10:26Sen. Klobuchar: The railroad crossing elimination grant does just that, supporting projects at the great crossing. We have had a number of really positive projects where we eliminated a rail crossing where there have been lots of deaths or accidents by going over or under overpasses. You name it. Do you commit to addressing block railways and addressing the funds as directed by congress?
▶ 1:10:48Mr. Fink: Thank you for the question. In my previous job, the majority of questions I got from congressional staff is -- why is your train blocking a crossing? I understand it from the railroad side, now I will learn it from the fra side. That was my second question from secretary duffy. We explained the video can sit -- some of the video sequence use.
▶ 1:11:17Mr. Fink: That will be important continued data-gathering. The grant programs are important. We have seen real progress. This technology is another piece that will help us with block crossings. We will be working on that right away.
▶ 1:11:30Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you very much. I will ask my questions to Mr. gentin in writing. Thank you.
▶ 1:11:37Chair Cruz: Senator capita?
▶ 1:11:42Senator Capita: Thank you for the visits to my office, I very much appreciate that. You said it is a hard g?
▶ 1:11:51Mr. Gentin: Gentin.
▶ 1:11:59Senator: Thank you. Given the increased use of third-party countries to circumvent trade laws, how will you make sure that the department of congress effectively enforces antidumping and countervailing duty orders to protect industries from unfair trade practices?
▶ 1:12:17Mr. Gentin: The president and secretary lot the cabin clear that one of their goals is to make sure that the U.S. is treated with fairness and respect in the global trade regime. If I'm honored to be confirmed by this body, I will work with the leadership along with counsel at the department of commerce to make sure the people of west virginia and other americans are treated fairly by foreign companies.
▶ 1:12:43Sen. Capito: Do you -- I don't know if you know this to the depth that you will if confirmed, but what legal standard need to be met by the department of commerce when initiating a trade investigation?
▶ 1:12:59Mr. Gentin: Senator, that is not something I have delved into, that I am happy to prioritize that if I am confirmed.
▶ 1:13:07Sen. Capito: Mr. vogel -- fogel, welcome. I know that you appreciate domestic investments on the tech side. Cutting edge technology requires infrastructure to support it. I will put a plug-in for my state to make excellent investments.
▶ 1:13:29Sen. Capito: Let stand -- what steps would you take to ensure that national security threats do not give a -- gain a foothold while ensuring that we are open for business. Otherwise the vetting process of figuring out where the investment is coming from?
▶ 1:13:45Mr. Fogel: It is nice meeting you. What you are talking about is really important. On the export side you are asking about investment. I am a huge advocate because the global market steam is responsible for exports. At the same time we need to be careful that we are not just exporting for exports a. We need to be mindful that we are not sharing proprietary technology with that actors particularly china.
▶ 1:14:13Mr. Fogel: On the investment side although it is not the responsibility of the global market steam, I would like to work with interagency colleagues as well as colleagues at commerce to make sure that the foreign investment coming in is not being used for any insidious purpose.
▶ 1:14:29Sen. Capito: Thank you. I think that is important as we look towards the future. On rail safety, Mr. fink, we talked about the accident that occurred just outside of the boundaries of west virginia and the one in ohio and what it had impacted and major railroad safety.
▶ 1:14:51Sen. Capito: What can we do to make sure that safety measures -- we did pass a rail safety bill but the lessons you have learned are quickly and effectively implemented by the railroads to prevent future accidents?
▶ 1:15:08Mr. Fink: Thank you. That was an awful tragedy that should not have happened and there was technology to stop it from happening, but it happened. The railroads have voluntarily put more sensors to see if certain bearings are heating up and stop the train so we do not have the same thing happen. There are other things that I look forward to. My job is the enforcer of the laws that you pass.
▶ 1:15:36Mr. Fink: When you pass a law we will look at it and we will enforce the law whatever you come down with on what we should be doing on different items on rail safety and I look forward to that happening if confirmed.
▶ 1:15:48Sen. Capito: Thank you for the visit and we talked about the lines going through west virginia and the cardinal, which only runs three days a week and we would like to have that service of going to chicago and the capital limited. They use that to commute into D.C. frequently.
▶ 1:16:07Sen. Capito: I did tell you this and I forgot about this but I want to thank amtrak because over the last several years they have improved the access into the boarding stations for folks with disabilities and modernized to, even in montgomery, west virginia. It is a smaller town but they made it so that people could easily access.
▶ 1:16:32Sen. Capito: That to me is extremely important as you look to get more people riding the rail. You need to get it accessible for all disabilities and ages. I did say to you that the last time I rode an amtrak train I found the -- it was not maintained to the standards of an american passenger service should be maintained to.
▶ 1:16:57Sen. Capito: And so I hope during your tenure on the amtrak board that you will put a heavy emphasis on that. I know there are new trains coming on board and I notice because of the old age of them and the particular cars and I think we can do better and we need to.
▶ 1:17:14Mr. Gleason: I agree.
▶ 1:17:16Chair Cruz: Thank you. Senator baldwin.
▶ 1:17:20Sen. Baldwin: . Thank you. I have been seriously concerned about the role that the department of government efficiency otherwise known as doge is playing in driving some of the chaos and upheaval in the commerce department. Including shutting down the minority business development agency.
▶ 1:17:45Sen. Baldwin: For example, as I raised in this committee last week, elon musk and doge are playing an outsized and highly questionable role at the department. So, Mr. gentin, since joining the department in february, have you ever met with elon musk?
▶ 1:18:04Mr. Gentin: Yes. I attended one meeting when he was also there.
▶ 1:18:09Sen. Baldwin: Who else was present?
▶ 1:18:12Mr. Gentin: I would say this was a casual meeting. People were walking in and out. It was also some time ago.
▶ 1:18:20Sen. Baldwin: Where was it?
▶ 1:18:22Mr. Gentin: In the white house.
▶ 1:18:24Sen. Baldwin: Did you discuss any of the plans that doge had for the commerce department?
▶ 1:18:31Mr. Gentin: No, it was a high-level casual discussion.
▶ 1:18:36Sen. Baldwin: Have you ever met any of the members of the department of government efficiency while working at the department of commerce?
▶ 1:18:45Mr. Gentin: Senator, I was introduced to two members that I understood was associated with doge in the hallway as a casual introduction, a few seconds?
▶ 1:18:56Sen. Baldwin: Was one of them nate cavanaugh?
▶ 1:18:59Mr. Gentin: No.
▶ 1:19:00Sen. Baldwin: Do you know who they were?
▶ 1:19:03Mr. Gentin: I do not recall their names but I know it was not Mr. cavanaugh.
▶ 1:19:09Sen. Baldwin: And are these members now department employees, the ones that you met?
▶ 1:19:16Mr. Gentin: I do not know.
▶ 1:19:17Sen. Baldwin: Ok. I want to register my serious concern about the role that doge played in dismantling the minority business development agency.
▶ 1:19:37Sen. Baldwin: I also believe that they played a significant role in creating instability in the manufacturing extension partnership. Are you familiar with that program?
▶ 1:19:51Mr. Gentin: I am not.
▶ 1:19:52Sen. Baldwin: Earlier this year the trump administration did not renew contracts for mep, the menuing -- the manufacturing extension project is partnership. They did not route new projects for 10 mep centers causing great alarm across the country and in wisconsin.
▶ 1:20:17Sen. Baldwin: While these contracts have now been restored until the end of the fiscal year, for a few more months, this jolt of instability for the manufacturing extension partnership is unwelcome and unnecessary. If congress does its job and appropriate funding for the mep centers, will you renew their contracts as is standard practicehile you are serving in this position?
▶ 1:20:44Mr. Gentin: Yes. , thank you. I recognize the importance of this issue for you in wisconsin. I am not familiar with it. If I am confirmed I will prioritize and look into it.
▶ 1:20:58Sen. Baldwin: Mr. fink, thank you for meeting with me. I was planning on asking some of the specific questions that senator peters just asked you on the audience and -- audit and critical safety concerns with panam long-term safety record and failure of leadership to take action to develop a positive safety culture.
▶ 1:21:27Sen. Baldwin: That is a readout on the february 2022 fra chief safety officer's letter. But, I wanted to just draw some attention to another aspect of leadership at panam. It wasc it was cited by the railroad that acquired them.
▶ 1:21:55Sen. Baldwin: When csx acquired their rare will -- your railroad their ceo testified that the tracking infrastructure in some cases was in such poor condition that "it was so overgrown with trees and weeds did not even know that there is a railroad there.
▶ 1:22:13Sen. Baldwin: Can you comment on what a commitment to safety could have led to the condition of rails as the acquiring ceo testified?
▶ 1:22:29Mr. Fink: Thank you for your question and I enjoyed our visit yesterday. As far as csx purchasing our railroad. I spent several days taking their chief operating officer over most of the railroad lines. His comments were on one specific piece of track in an area that was in overgrown wetlands. We strive every year to improve our capital and railroad.
▶ 1:22:59Mr. Fink: When we gave the railroad over it had been in the best shape in 20 years. And that is not just me talking, but what we were doing as far as safety and train accidents. Our record versus our connecting railroads were better. Our safety culture was there. We had done safety culture studies and we handed the railroad over to csx in good shape and they knew what they were getting. We cooperated with all of the states that we worked in.
▶ 1:23:31Mr. Fink: We did a lot of cooperative joint ventures, allowing passengers running on the frame railroad -- freight railroad. I am proud of the work that we did. There were some issues and they have been raised. I have talked about my thoughts. My job will be the chief person to enforce the laws, and that is what I will be doing. I will be working with you and the committee to make you happy about what we are doing at fra.
▶ 1:23:58Chair Cruz: Senator lujan.
▶ 1:24:08Sen. Lujan: General counsel for the department of commerce. I have a few quick questions for you, and I would appreciate a quick yes or no response. Are you familiar with the bipartisan infrastructure law from 2021? >> I am not sure I am, senator.
▶ 1:24:32Sen. Lujan: Oh boy, Mr. chairman. We have someone before us to go to the department of commerce that is not familiar with one of the biggest pieces of legislation that this congress enacted to build infrastructure in america, is that correct?
▶ 1:24:50Mr. Gentin: Maybe there is an aspect in one part of the law. I might not be familiar with the name.
▶ 1:24:58Sen. Lujan: It was called the by partisan infrastructure law and it was referred to by other names as well but it does not sound familiar? Are you familiar with the digital equity act?
▶ 1:25:11Mr. Gentin: I am aware that there is a grant program by that name.
▶ 1:25:17Sen. Lujan: Could you tell me what the name is?
▶ 1:25:21Mr. Gentin: That is a program that is designed to make the digital economy available to americans.
▶ 1:25:29Sen. Lujan: Is the purpose of the digital equity act to help close the act and broadband adoption and support programs to provide children and seniors with the skills that they need for the digital age?
▶ 1:25:41Mr. Gentin: I do not know the details of the program and I would defer to you.
▶ 1:25:46Sen. Lujan: I will stand by that description. Does article three of the constitution say that judicial power of the united states shall be invested in one supreme court?
▶ 1:25:56Mr. Gentin: Yes.
▶ 1:25:58Sen. Lujan: Did marbury versus madison from 1803 established judicial review?
▶ 1:26:04Mr. Gentin: You are taking me back to law school but that sounds correct.
▶ 1:26:08Sen. Lujan: Does the judicial branch have the sole power to declare a law unconstitutional?
▶ 1:26:14Mr. Gentin: Certainly the judicial authorities have the right to review laws for their constitutionality.
▶ 1:26:24Sen. Lujan: Did the president declare the digital equity act, a bipartisan law passed by congress unconstitutional and a true social post?
▶ 1:26:33Mr. Gentin: I am aware that the president issued a true social post regarding the digital equity act.
▶ 1:26:41Sen. Lujan: May 8, 2025. Does the constitution grant the president the power to nullify entire sections of laws passed by congress?
▶ 1:26:51Mr. Gentin: I have not looked into any way the constitutional issues that you have just flagged relating to this. I have not done so.
▶ 1:26:59Sen. Lujan: In law school that they take -- did they teach you that the president could nullify?
▶ 1:27:05Mr. Gentin: I do not recall that that was discussed.
▶ 1:27:08Sen. Lujan: Where did you go to law school?
▶ 1:27:11Mr. Gentin: Columbia.
▶ 1:27:12Sen. Lujan: On friday this letter was sent out from the president of the united states to constituents in all of our states. It nullified this program based on what president trump said, secretary of commerce howard lutnick and he, we agree that this is totally unconstitutional. I hope -- I know that constituents are depending on the program just to get connected to the internet.
▶ 1:27:43Sen. Lujan: This is how it happened and I am hoping we can work together to reverse that. Under the leadership the railroad you had was found with "critical safety concerns, high accident rates and poor track conditions which increase the risk of derailments." the fra, the agency you are nominated to lead attributed these two "failure of leadership." how can we trust you to hold this position and to hold companies accountable to areas
▶ 1:28:15Sen. Lujan: That were not met when you were in leadership there?
▶ 1:28:16Mr. Fink: I would disagree and we did meet the standards and it was a dress agreement between our folks and fra. Any time we had issues with fra to fix things and argued about them later. They said something was not right and we fixed it. We had a safety audit and we disagreed. Our incidents and accidents were at or below industry standards.
▶ 1:28:41Sen. Lujan: Two of my colleagues ask you questions about the nature of the track covered in trees and all the rest. Your response was that you took the safety person out and did a walking out. My question is, are you contending that the ceo of csx lied?
▶ 1:29:00Mr. Gentin: No --
▶ 1:29:01Mr. Fink: No.
▶ 1:29:03Sen. Lujan: Every time amtrak employees have come in front of this committee I have pushed for more pull funding to expand the long-term rail network. You might have heard from senator moran but kansas, colorado and new mexico get together when we start seeing attacks on the southwest chief. Are you committed to advocating for increased funding for the long network to address maintenance issues?
▶ 1:29:30Mr. Fink: I am for amtrak being a national network and for us supporting amtrak.
▶ 1:29:35Sen. Lujan: What about southwest chief?
▶ 1:29:38Mr. Fink: I do not have any information. I am not sure where it goes. I will certainly work with the committee on specific amtrak issues. I am for the amtrak national and for -- effort.
▶ 1:29:52Sen. Lujan: Before senator moran calls us. She went to the office I would ask you to learn about the southwest chief.
▶ 1:30:02Sen. Lujan: I am telling you there will be a meeting and it happens every year. The ceo's come in and the person in your permit -- position comes in. I hope we can find commonality. I have other questions for the record and I will submit them for response. Thank you.
▶ 1:30:19Chair Cruz: Thank you. I see this worked out well. I get asked questions from the nam cheap seats. I can see you face-to-face. Thank you for your willingness to serve and all four of you. Thank you for your willingness. I am sure there are a lot of other things you could be doing in your lives at this stage but signing up to serve your country has to be up there as one of the greatest honors, especially given your qualifications and what it means to your family.
▶ 1:30:51Chair Cruz: We talked about the east palestine trained a rail meant. What do you think went wrong? >> an overheated bearing burned off and allowed the train to derail, releasing chloride and other chemicals into the air.
▶ 1:31:11Sen. Moreno: And we talked about the norfolk southern and the commitment that they have made and I will give them accolades. A lot of times these companies get beat up a lot and they deserve a lot of the press that they have gotten. They have stepped up. One of the things they've done is created a training center for train derailments. It is a central -- center of excellence.
▶ 1:31:34Sen. Moreno: Do I have your commitment to support that training center with resources to make sure it actually becomes a world-class center?
▶ 1:31:41Mr. Fink: We had a great conversation and I am looking forward to that. Investing with your colleagues from pennsylvania and from west virginia, they also talked about the first responder situation and the center that you will be building. Some of those folks are sitting in the audience our first responders and railroad employees that I spoke with before starting this conversation and mentioned the center. I look forward to visiting it when it is open.
▶ 1:32:10Sen. Moreno: Thank you. Shifting over to you. The uaw, how do they feel about the tariffs? What is our viewpoint? The uaw supported joe biden in this election and supported my opponent in this election. What is their general view of tariffs?
▶ 1:32:30Mr. Fogel: What I hear in the media is they are supportive of the president's tariffs.
▶ 1:32:36Sen. Moreno: Why do you think a union that has a heavy democrat bias will be supportive of republicans' plans, which are to re-industrialize the country?
▶ 1:32:48Mr. Fogel: I do not look at the politics of it but I think that the pot -- the president is putting the working class first. That is probably why they like it. Specifically for the auto industry he is advocating for U.S. auto manufacturers.
▶ 1:33:04Sen. Moreno: Give me a sense of the scale the problem over the past 25 years, what happened to the industrial heartland as a result the presidents who have not stood up to make sure that we had a level playing field?
▶ 1:33:17Mr. Fogel: I will mention that I have first-hand experience with this. My current business is a datacenter business. We located in an old industrial area of northern new york. Like parts of ohio, it has been decimated by the off shoring of manufacturing. It has hurt the community and the population level is down to 1950's level.
▶ 1:33:44Mr. Fogel: Income levels are down and unemployment is high. I am very pleased to see the president prioritizing bringing back those types of communities by on showing manufacturing.
▶ 1:33:57Sen. Moreno: The current number is around $6 trillion and there is another 100 billion dollar deal signed with saudi arabia. $6 trillion and counting. What does that mean for places like ohio?
▶ 1:34:10Mr. Fogel: There will be a rejuvenation of america's heartland as a result of the president's policies. Trillions of dollars of new investment, and I am very optimistic.
▶ 1:34:22Sen. Moreno: I can count on you to make certain that ohio manufacturers have a level playing field when they export their goods around the world.
▶ 1:34:32Mr. Fogel: Ohio and all states.
▶ 1:34:35Sen. Moreno: I only care about ohio. You have to pay for these deals. What is the level of difficulty that some of these countries put on when making these trade deals? In other words, how tough of a negotiator are they the united states?
▶ 1:34:53Mr. Gentin: Thank you. The trade deals are really being handled by both united states trade representative and colleagues in the department of commerce. I personally am not in my current role involved in negotiated -- negotiating the trade deal.
▶ 1:35:12Mr. Gentin: Knowing secretary let knowing secretary leutnick these are difficult discussions and the administration is doing what is required to protect the american people so the outcomes are favorable.
▶ 1:35:25Sen. Moreno: 110 days, have you ever seen a president more committed to making certain that american companies and workers have a level playing field?
▶ 1:35:35Mr. Gentin: I have not and it is a source of great inspiration for us in the department of commerce.
▶ 1:35:41Sen. Moreno: It makes you wonder what happened with presidents before? Why weren't they making certain that american workers were on a level playing field? Does that cross your mind as well?
▶ 1:35:52Mr. Gentin: It doesn't it dovetails with what you said earlier. That is why many of us have decided to come into public service. See those of us on this panel and many others, it is a time where we feel that this is an opportunity to do something good for the american people, all-americans, and it is inspirational.
▶ 1:36:12Sen. Moreno: I am out of time, but thank you for being here as well and I recognize our senator from new jersey -- oh, from delaware. First state and closer. >> two of the nominees confirmed we will have a significant impact on freight and passenger rail development in the united states, which are vital to the economy.
▶ 1:36:43Sen. Moreno: A few if any rail core doors are as important are -- as the northeast one which includes delaware in the mid-atlantic region. Any disruptions would not only impact people, but it would cost millions of dollars a day. Before I get to addressing the future of rail travel in the united states, I need to address an issue that we have been experiencing with the department of commerce.
▶ 1:37:11Sen. Moreno: Since february, you have been his senior advisor, is that correct?
▶ 1:37:16Mr. Gentin: Mid february, yes.
▶ 1:37:18Sen. Blunt Rochester: As you might know, secretary lutnick told me directly when he was here having his hearing for his confirmation earlier that he would not dismantle the minority business development agency and turn back the clocks of progress. Bipartisan progress from many presidents before him, supporting these businesses.
▶ 1:37:47Sen. Blunt Rochester: My colleagues and I have sent multiple letters seeking answers about the reversal of his promise to protect the agency and dismantle it. Our first letter was march 24 and then another on april 17 and most recently we sent a letter on april 30, less than two weeks ago and we have not received any meaningful response. I would like to know is the secretary aware of our letters about dismantling that?
▶ 1:38:16Mr. Gentin: I am not where of those letters and I do not know what the secretary knows about those letters.
▶ 1:38:22Sen. Blunt Rochester: Again, you have been his senior advisor since february and I want to can room that.
▶ 1:38:28Mr. Gentin: I have been one of his senior advisors.
▶ 1:38:32Sen. Blunt Rochester: That is the question. Remind me, did you attend paul dauber's confirmation hearing to be deputy secretary?
▶ 1:38:42Mr. Gentin: I did.
▶ 1:38:43Sen. Blunt Rochester: Do you recall many members just like today raised his exact letters, are serious concerns about what is happening at mbda?
▶ 1:38:55Mr. Gentin: I recall the topic coming up at the secretary -- deputy secretary's nominee hearing.
▶ 1:39:02Sen. Blunt Rochester: So I know you said that you have a different role, they do not feel that this was important, even for this hearing, even in preparation for this hearing because it has come up before two even mention it to the secretary?
▶ 1:39:18Mr. Gentin: Senator, I am well aware of the importance of this topic to you and other members of the committee. My understanding is that this matter is in litigation.
▶ 1:39:29Sen. Blunt Rochester: It is my understanding that because of 21 attorneys general fighting it that it has been halted by a judge. But have you participated in any meeting or had any communication or anything regarding the letters at all?
▶ 1:39:45Mr. Gentin: I have not.
▶ 1:39:47Sen. Blunt Rochester: We have sent them in the past two weeks so it is hard to me to think that this is not something you would have prepared for. I assume that you do not know of any plans to even answer the letters. And I would assume that you would say, as you said before you might prioritize it. Who do we need to contact at the agency to get an answer to the letters?
▶ 1:40:12Mr. Gentin: Senator, coming out of this hearing I will go back to the department of commerce and try to follow-up and get those letters.
▶ 1:40:20Sen. Blunt Rochester: Since you are the third person my concern is I do not like to use the term gas lighting, but it is feeling like that. We just need answers to what is the priority. The secretary said it was not priority and past presidents have said it was a priority going all the way to richard nixon. I would like to get an answer and switch gears to amtrak and our stations in delaware. This is a vital area.
▶ 1:40:52Sen. Blunt Rochester: Our stations and train facilities. The operation centers and maintenance shops. Services to delaware alone have a combined yearly ridership of 650,000 passengers and growing. Amtrak employees over 1300 delawareans. We learned that amtrak will be cutting 334 management positions. Given the mass layoffs and reduction of force, I would like to ask Mr.
▶ 1:41:20Sen. Blunt Rochester: Lgeason, what is your plan to deal with expanding ridership when we are shrinking the number of folks working there?
▶ 1:41:30Mr. Gleason: I am not on the board now but I do not know anything about that. Certainly delaware has been wonderful as far as passenger rail. I would hope that would continue.
▶ 1:41:41Sen. Blunt Rochester: I would hope that I would have your commitment to a full transparency on the positions and rationale and any impacts to service that this might have on our constituents. I am all for government efficiency and I believe in it. But we do not make more things efficient by breaking them. I yield back.
▶ 1:42:08Sen. Blunt Rochester: Your ranking member -- >> your ranking member has been gracious and senator kim, you are next.
▶ 1:42:16Sen. Kim: I would like to start with you and I just wanted to get a sense from you how is amtrak doing, if you would give it a grade, how would you grade it?
▶ 1:42:26Mr. Gleason: I am not part of the organization.
▶ 1:42:29Sen. Kim: : I certainly have my opinions on how it is doing.
▶ 1:42:35Mr. Gleason: I recently took the train to florida and it went well. I have written that california zephyr. I have written the trains all over. They could probably do better and there is no question about it. I am a proponent of passenger rail.
▶ 1:42:52Sen. Kim: I read your testimony and I appreciated the sentiments so I am trying to get a sense of what you will be doing in this job. When you look at the budget, you think the budget is at the appropriate level? Too high or too low?
▶ 1:43:09Mr. Gleason: I will be one vote on the board, but a lot of that has to do with your support of amtrak. You are the ones who give us the money to operate amtrak.
▶ 1:43:20Sen. Kim: We do so in consultation with the board.
▶ 1:43:23Mr. Gleason: I think in the future we should look into more private-public partnerships to get more money into amtrak and expand it. There are a lot of ways to do it without just giving taxpayer money.
▶ 1:43:36Sen. Kim: You are not in the mindset that you want to come in and cut the budget 20 to 40%.
▶ 1:43:41Mr. Gleason: Absolutely not.
▶ 1:43:44Sen. Kim: Especially when it comes to the northeast corridor. We are continuing to struggle and there have been a lot of attacks and proposals by colleagues of mine as well as during the first trump administration to cut budget for the northeast corridor. That is not something on your mind?
▶ 1:44:01Mr. Gleason: No.
▶ 1:44:02Sen. Kim: I would be interested with a sense of your vision for amtrak. I will quote a couple of things. Improve and impale -- and expand passenger rail service across america. And passenger rail does not just move people, it drives prosperity. You agree with those statements?
▶ 1:44:21Mr. Gleason: Absolutely. And if you read my statement it has been desperate stating to lose passenger rail.
▶ 1:44:28Sen. Kim: I thought that was powerful.
▶ 1:44:30Mr. Gleason: And we have two trains a day and it is terrible. That is all we have coming through a town that is the main line of the norfolk and southern railroad. It has isolated our town. And I am sure that all over america there are time -- there are towns like that. Amtrak and rail can be expanded a lot easier than building highways and more expensive things.
▶ 1:44:55Mr. Gleason: I would like to hopefully have the support coming from the senate and the government to expand amtrak. We need to look at other ways to fund the expansion. Every senator so far has talked about trains that are running in their states and they are happy about it. I mentioned before, the younger people of america are riding trains a lot more. Ridership on amtrak is younger.
▶ 1:45:22Mr. Gleason: And many today do not have drivers licenses or cars but they want to use public transportation.
▶ 1:45:27Sen. Kim: I hope I can trap -- I can count on you to work with me. What happened so often is we are just trying to tread water and just trying to stop cuts from happening. I would like someone to work with where we can lay out a vision of this going forward looking like. I wanted to turn to you Mr. fink, and explain clearly and simply what is the main mission of fra?
▶ 1:45:53Mr. Fink: It is to make sure that the safety in railroads the public, freight and passenger, that is it, safety.
▶ 1:46:03Sen. Kim: That is something I share with you. We had a number of cases in new jersey where we had problems between the new jersey transit and amtrak. It was causing the entire system to short out. Does that sound like a safety concern to you?
▶ 1:46:21Mr. Fink: It does, and we had an excellent conversation about that in your office. Every day we are not having these issues is important. A lot of people are studying it and hopefully, getting to the bottom so we do not have folks including yourself at penn station.
▶ 1:46:39Sen. Kim: The reason people rely on these as they want something reliable and we did not see that. It was also a safety concern. The fra played an important role. Do you promise that you will work with me as well as so involved -- those involved to get the bottom. We cannot have another summer like we have last. I do not feel like I have the assurances to be able to look my constituents in the eye and tell them things will be better.
▶ 1:47:10Mr. Fink: I have always worked cooperatively and elaborately. Our partnership that we did in maine providing service and we were a preferred provider. The service was highly rated. How we did that was getting together and sitting in a room discussing the issues and getting to a place where amtrak and freight was able to run in a manner.
▶ 1:47:36Sen. Moreno: I recognize the senator from tennessee.
▶ 1:47:40Sen. Blackburn: Thank you for your nomination -- congratulations for your nominations and you are ready to get today overweight. I want to come to you. Memphis, it is one of our nation's logistic hubs. You have all of the railroads and you have fedex and the river, the port of memphis. And I have heard so much from people in memphis who work in the logistics arena.
▶ 1:48:11Sen. Blackburn: People that work with rail. They are very concerned about the intermodal rail yards in memphis. I have had a couple of businesses actually describe it saying that it looks like a war zone because of cargo theft. Which is a terrible problem and is increasing problem with the gangs that are there.
▶ 1:48:42Sen. Blackburn: As administrator, I would like to know how you are going to work with communities like memphis and how you are going to address what is a growing problem nationwide, cargo theft.
▶ 1:48:56Mr. Fink: Thank you. I had not heard of the issues in memphis but I have seen particularly out in southern california where trains were broken into where they were moving. It is an issue that we need to sit down and talk with. I think the security folks from the railroads are folks at fra that we can sit down and find out what is going on and talk to local communities. You have my word that if confirmed we will work on that.
▶ 1:49:24Sen. Blackburn: It is happening, and I would take the opportunity to highlight with you that this is happening and it is a significant problem. And, we would like to see some attention placed on solving this problem. Not a lot of time for talking, action is passed to. An appropriate and timely assessment and action would be appreciated.
▶ 1:49:52Mr. Fink: Yes.
▶ 1:49:53Sen. Blackburn: Mr. fogel, tennessee is a growing place. And I was just talking about what I call the trump bump that certainly has our state seeing it. We have had since the november election, 30 corporate announcements, companies that are landing their projects in tennessee.
▶ 1:50:20Sen. Blackburn: About 1900 new jobs and $1.2 billion in capital projects since the november election. And about half of that investment is direct foreign investment. So, it is importance so, it is importanct to our state that there be participation and awareness at the federal level.
▶ 1:50:48Sen. Blackburn: So, when you are looking at handling global markets, what I would like to know is how are you going to work with states like tennessee as they work to attract more direct foreign investment?
▶ 1:51:03Mr. Fogel: Senator, thank you for the question. The global markets division of department of commerce focus on foreign direct investment to the united states, primarily through select usa. There are conferences going on right now and unfortunately I cannot attend as a citizen because I am here.
▶ 1:51:29Mr. Fogel: That is the mission of that team is that every day to attract foreign direct investment and then help guide foreign investors to various states based on what the investors are looking for and what the states offer. I would be happy to work with you about tennessee specifically.
▶ 1:51:46Sen. Blackburn: We have a great story to tell. One area and senator cantwell and I were chatting about this. We have the american music tourism act and we are trying to get this run through the pipeline. Tennessee had 144 million visitors last year and 30.6 billion in direct spending.
▶ 1:52:11Sen. Blackburn: And the state, and of course music and entertainment is an enormous part of that. And, I would love for you to talk for just a moment how you can partner up on the entertainment industry as we look at this global marketplace in bringing the tourist to the U.S. quest -- tourism to the U.S..
▶ 1:52:39Mr. Fogel: Global markets does play a role in that. But separately there is an office of travel and tourism. I am sure that you are familiar, they are within the department of commerce. They are dedicated to interagency efforts and working with states to promote tourism. With the world cup, the olympics in the event you are talking about in tennessee, there is a lot to do and it is a big priority.
▶ 1:53:07Sen. Blackburn: Thank you.
▶ 1:53:09Sen. Moreno: I recognize the ranking member.
▶ 1:53:13Sen. Cantwell: I understand that you were asked about spectrum and I want to go back to that if I could, are you aware that the 2000 defense authorization act required that the joint chiefs and the secretary of commerce to work together to certify the spectrum launch and includes use by dod. Are you aware that no such certification was made and that never happened and nobody work together?
▶ 1:53:39Mr. Gentin: I was not aware of that and I am very happy to look into that.
▶ 1:53:44Sen. Moreno: The --
▶ 1:53:45Sen. Cantwell: The reason I am bringing it up is because what happened dod radar was auctioned and there was a lot of confusion and interference. We obviously think that in the spectrum world, you should have the test vetting of important issues of moving dod spectrum.
▶ 1:54:07Sen. Cantwell: Are you also aware that I think, senator cruz mentioned the relocation funds but claims that it would allow users to upgrade their capabilities and that is not true. It only allows federal users to maintain a comparable -- I am suggesting legislation that we had last congress that does give people the ability to operate -- upgrade because I think that is important.
▶ 1:54:34Sen. Cantwell: But I want to make sure that we have the record correct that mission-critical systems were turned off and no replacement was provided. That is a very important distinction in the debate because I want to make sure that this does not happen again. We do not want to be in a vague area where somebody thinks that the law exists to protect dod when in reality, during the last trump administration it did not and we had some confusion. Mr.
▶ 1:55:02Sen. Cantwell: Fink, I hear five or so of my colleagues asked me about -- asked you about mainline derailment issues and you were mentioning that you think there were some other statistics. We are talking about fra, the federal railroad administration numbers, which they say you had an 850% higher than the other class two railroads. Do you dispute the numbers?
▶ 1:55:30Mr. Fink: Our train records were in the middle of the peer group railroads. I do not know what the 850% higher. I do not know that number and it makes no sense to me.
▶ 1:55:43Sen. Cantwell: And every year in the decade before you before you sold the railroad the derailment was double the average. The reason the mainline is so important is because you're talking about east palestine and areas that we think are critical for safety. Also, do you think that norfolk southern's responsibility was to clean up the mess?
▶ 1:56:10Mr. Fink: Absolutely.
▶ 1:56:12Sen. Cantwell: Then your company was sentenced for trying to cover up 90,000 gallon fuel in massachusetts. It --
▶ 1:56:25Mr. Fink: It was 900.
▶ 1:56:28Sen. Cantwell: Should you have done it without the court decision?
▶ 1:56:32Mr. Fink: We were cleaning it up and did not properly report it. We were fined and found guilty.
▶ 1:56:39Sen. Cantwell: What should we be doing more -- moving forward to make sure that we have better alignment on product safety, cleanup and all of these responsibilities?
▶ 1:56:50Mr. Fink: In that instance we had an employee that did not follow the procedure they were supposed to follow. We were cleaning it up and did not reported. We were found guilty of not reporting and had a substantial fine.
▶ 1:57:05Sen. Cantwell: Do you remember what it was?
▶ 1:57:07Mr. Fink: Hundreds of thousands of dollars?
▶ 1:57:11Sen. Cantwell: Do you think that a substantial given that what these communities go through. We will do more for the record on this, but I represent a very big corn state and railroad state. We move a lot of product from the united states and often times it is through treacherous areas. The response could -- the response to this could take a lot of time, the columbia river gorge for example.
▶ 1:57:39Sen. Cantwell: We want to see someone who will be aggressive about the continued evolution of information, involvement, first responders, plans for communities, and responsibility is and certainly for a follow-up of the legislation. We have moved out of this committee that for very long trains, the staffing required to keep all of us safe. Thank you.
▶ 1:58:03Chair Cruz: Thank you. Senator duckworth.
▶ 1:58:06Sen. Duckworth: Thank you. The chicago hub improvement program is a once-in-a-lifetime and generation transformative part -- project that will enhance rail service across the midwest and nation. It will improve service in wisconsin, michigan, indiana and missouri, and that is why there is bipartisan support.
▶ 1:58:30Sen. Duckworth: It is making critical investments in rail infrastructure to enhance accessibility, reduce travel times and produce safety and provide good paying jobs. Chicago is amtrak's busiest station outside of the northeast region and more than 50% of its services travel through chicago union station. And trains that begin or end in that station make up more than 90% of services outside of the east and west coast.
▶ 1:58:58Sen. Duckworth: In 2023 the fra awarded amtrak $50 million for the partnership for intercity passenger rail to improve efficiency at chicago union station to benefit the national rail network. Will you commit to working with amtrak to ensure that all of those awarded funds get delivered without undue delay?
▶ 1:59:18Mr. Fink: I enjoyed going over many of the issues we talked about going on around chicago. I am not right now on -- up to speed on that. If confirmed when I hit the ground running and sit down and talk about these issues when I get to fra and we can get to the bottom of the issues that you came up.
▶ 1:59:38Sen. Duckworth: If you are no issues you confirm to a ensure that all of these funds will get delivered?
▶ 1:59:45Mr. Fink: If there are no issues, yes.
▶ 1:59:48Sen. Cantwell: Chicago is a -- Sen. duckworth: chicago is a freight and passenger rail hub. One out of four of U.S. freight trains passes through chicago, 500 per day. If you are moving anything, there is a good chance it will go through chicago we hitch has more tracks radiating and more directions.
▶ 2:00:11Sen. Cantwell: Bottlenecks cause delays and -- in the shipment of goods across the country, and that is why freight and passenger rail companies like the state of illinois and the city of chicago are partnering on the region environmental and transportation efficiency program. It is unclogging the rail network by building crucial underpasses and overpasses and upgrading tracks and signals.
▶ 2:00:37Sen. Cantwell: The first trump administration recognized its importance which is why president in his first term awarded $132 million to the program. If you are confirmed, will you commit to giving full and fair grant consideration for applications for projects like this?
▶ 2:00:55Mr. Fink: Thank you. If confirmed I will look and work towards making sure that these grants that are scored and for chicago or other places are put out. That is one of my goals. There are a lot of grants and things that have not gotten out. Let us get them out and build.
▶ 2:01:16Sen. Duckworth: Will you commit that you will not delay funding awarded to projects if there are no extenuating circumstances?
▶ 2:01:23Mr. Fink: I am not there yet. And when I am there I will sit down and see. I have heard that these grants have been released. By the time they get their these issues will be behind us and I will be working on sending out new programs if you authorize them in the future.
▶ 2:01:40Sen. Duckworth: Will you make yourself available to follow-up up on these questions?
▶ 2:01:45Mr. Fink: Absolutely.
▶ 2:01:46Sen. Duckworth: Thank you. I now recognize senator markey.
▶ 2:01:51Sen. Markey: I thank you for that recognition, and my first question is on the digital equity act grants. Last week the department of commerce terminated grants to states under the state digital equity capacity grant program. Congress specifically authorized and appropriated $1.4 billion in funds for this program.
▶ 2:02:16Sen. Markey: Were you involved in any meetings or conversations about terminating state digital equity grants? >> I was not.
▶ 2:02:27Sen. Markey: Let me ask you this then. In your opinion as a lawyer, is the decision to cancel and terminate state grant awards faithful execution of the law passed by congress?
▶ 2:02:46Mr. Gentin: Senator, I think senator lujan asked me about this. And I think it is important and we can all agree that everyone be able to participate in the internet economy. In my role as senior advisor at the department of commerce, I have had no role in the digital equity issue and the president issued a truth about it that I have not looked into the legal issues.
▶ 2:03:12Sen. Markey: We passed the digital equity act and directed the commerce department to issue grants to the states. And we appropriated money for it. And now the department is simply ignoring the law. And I'm going to give you a chance just answer, do you think the terminations of these grants are lawful?
▶ 2:03:36Mr. Gentin: It is something that I committed to look into if I am honored to be confirmed. I do not have a view on that sitting here today.
▶ 2:03:44Sen. Markey: Ok. In my administered -- in my opinion the administration must resend the termination notices immediately. It is completely unlawful what they have done. Mr. fink, I want to turn to a rule issued by the federal railroad administration last year requiring two crewmembers on class one freight trains.
▶ 2:04:07Sen. Markey: I have long supported this role and I was proud to work with the current vice president vance to be able to include a similar provision in the railway safety act. At his confirmation hearing this year, I act set -- I asked secretary duffy whether the -- whether he would stand by the federal railroad administration's regulation. He said yes.
▶ 2:04:34Sen. Markey: Do you agree with secretary duffy's position and intend to maintain this regulation?
▶ 2:04:41Mr. Fink: Yes.
▶ 2:04:42Sen. Markey: You well?
▶ 2:04:44Mr. Fink: Yes.
▶ 2:04:45Sen. Markey: Thank you. That is much appreciated. And now, I want to turn to you. I know this is an issue that senator peters raised. During your staff interview with committee staff, I understand you were asked whether joe biden lawfully won the 2020 presidential election. And so I am going to ask you the same question.
▶ 2:05:10Sen. Markey: Yes or no, joe biden dust joe biden lawfully win the 2020 presidential election?
▶ 2:05:18Mr. Gentin: As I expressed, president biden was the president for four years and certified as president and then president was elected and certified and he is our current president.
▶ 2:05:28Sen. Markey: So was joe biden lawfully elected as the president of the united states. Was he lawfully elected.
▶ 2:05:36Mr. Gentin: What I can say was that he was certified and served as president.
▶ 2:05:41Sen. Markey: In your opinion was he lawfully elected president of the united states. This is not about what happened about what you view as the legal status of biden in winning that election. Did he lawfully when or not?
▶ 2:06:00Mr. Gentin: I am not an investigator of elections. My understanding and my belief is that president biden was legally certified as president and certified -- and served as president.
▶ 2:06:12Sen. Markey: I know that, but you are nominated to be the general counsel of the department of commerce for the united states of america. The top lawyer and you are a seasoned attorney. So this is a yes or no question. Was he legally elected? As the president of the united states?
▶ 2:06:33Sen. Markey: Joe biden and your opinion on this is very important as a lawyer so we can understand how you will be looking at legal issues that will be presented to you.
▶ 2:06:44Mr. Gentin: Senator, again, I think I have tried to answer the question as best I can. I do not know if it makes a lot of sense to litigate the past. My purpose to be here today is to present my qualifications to serve as general counsel of the department of commerce.
▶ 2:07:01Sen. Markey: I do not know how we can trust you as a sound legal voice pushing back on this administration's lawlessness when you cannot answer a basic question onto whether joe biden was legally elected. We are 4.5 years since that day, and you have had plenty of time to reflect upon it. But you are still absolutely unwilling to say that joe biden was elected.
▶ 2:07:29Sen. Markey: And that, unfortunately is the position which donald trump is still taking. And that casts a very bad cloud over the electoral process in our country. He was the clear winner to the extent in which you are unwilling to say that that was absolutely legally accurate.
▶ 2:07:58Sen. Markey: That is a very dangerous place for our country to be. Especially given your legal background and the job you're are being asked to take witches as chief counsel for the department of commerce. So, we are waiting for the arrival of senator fetterman. And he will be here presently.
▶ 2:08:26Sen. Markey: We have a roll call which is on the floor of the senate right now. And I will have to go over to make that roll call. But, we will have at the same time and ability to have time for recognition for senator fetterman from pennsylvania so that he will be able to ask a round of questions of this
▶ 2:08:58Sen. Markey: Panel. And with that, I will recognize senator fetterman.
▶ 2:09:09Sen. Fetterman: Hello everybody. So, 100 amtrak trains run through pennsylvania every day, including may be 100 feet away from where I live in braddock. Serving almost 7 million total passengers in my state. I do not see passenger rail as a political issue.
▶ 2:09:33Sen. Fetterman: I mean, everybody rides them, red and blue. This is about getting people where they need to be. As a member of this committee I will fight to support and defend vital federal service, and I made it very clear that I will work with anyone as long as they are willing to do that. Since being sworn into the senate I am working to expand passenger rail service through and across communities across pennsylvania.
▶ 2:10:02Sen. Fetterman: One of the projects that I am pushing and want to expand is passenger rail to redding. So, you made clear in your testimony that you understand the importance of passenger rail for both big cities and small towns in our state of pennsylvania. Can you commit to working with my office and the passenger rail authority to get this service operational by 2029?
▶ 2:10:29Mr. Gleason: Absolutely. I have talked to those people in redding for years. They are just like johnstown. We lost our trains and now we have two a day. We need more train service and I appreciate your support for passenger rail. I understand the whole thing needs to be supported, absolutely.
▶ 2:10:52Sen. Fetterman: Does anyone else still have anything? We feel like sometimes it is under seizure right now. Is that accurate? Do you feel better after the new administration or what do you think?
▶ 2:11:06Mr. Gleason: You mean about passenger rail? Yes. I feel good about it. I think there seems to be a lot of support among the senators and a lot of people I talked to. The younger people want to ride the rail. Ridership of amtrak is younger and more and more people are looking forward to riding trains. The support of the senate is very important as we try to expand.
▶ 2:11:36Mr. Gleason: Pennsylvania, outside the philadelphia area, it needs more support. And I am looking forward to working with you for the support.
▶ 2:11:50Sen. Fetterman: Let's talk about safety. Over two years ago and we are aware of what happened in east palestine, ohio, close to our border. My colleagues and I got together and wrote the railway safety act to make sure tragedies does not happen again. This was a strong bill the vice president was one of the leads on it and president trump says he supports it.
▶ 2:12:22Sen. Fetterman: It might be the only thing we can all agree on. And now it is stalled and I do not know why that is the case. I think we should all be on the same direction. And now, I live 100 feet away from an active rail. I do not know why we want to prevent all these kinds of derailments. Mr.
▶ 2:12:46Sen. Fetterman: Fink, can you commit to helping get this across the line because all of america deserves this. And this is always a very bipartisan piece of legislation.
▶ 2:12:56Mr. Fink: Thank you for the question. We met with their staff on the issues that you talked about and they were also discussed with me. I heard that and I look forward to working on those issues. As far as legislation. My job is the person that executes the laws that you pass. If you pass the law, we are going to make sure that the laws are properly carried out. That is what I am looking forward to right now.
▶ 2:13:27Mr. Fink: I am waiting for folks to talk to me about the specific legislation, and talking with the fra safety people. Once you pass it, we will enforce it.
▶ 2:13:36Sen. Fetterman: We should all agree. And I asked even my friends on both sides, we are not sure why we still do not have that past. -- passed. Regardless, thank you for your time. Mr.
▶ 2:14:04Sen. Fetterman: Fink, fogel, and gleason, my firewood -- final questions required of all nominees, do you pledge to provide through the timely response to the community request and respond when requested? >> yes.
▶ 2:14:28Sen. Fetterman: Thank you, I have letters support for various organizations for Mr. fink and gentin's organizations to be entered into the hearing record without objection so ordered. Senators, they will have until close of business until thursday, may 15 to submit questions for the record. The nominees will have until the close of business may 19 to respond to the questions.
▶ 2:14:59Sen. Fetterman: That concludes the hearing. The committee stands adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit