▶ 0:16:01Chair Capito: Thank you for coming and welcome to administrator zeldin. It is good to see you again. I understand you have had several hearings over the past few days. I know you have been busy. I believe you are doing an excellent job in implement in your vision to return the epa to its core mission of protecting our air, land, and water, while eliminating wasteful spending.
▶ 0:16:27Chair Capito: To start, I applaud your impressive efforts to undo the previous administrations regulatory overreach. You will press I path to energy dominance with sound environmental procedures. Your efforts, like rescinding the bite and clean power plan 2.0 rule that was part of a comprehensive strategy intended to shut down fossil fuel generation will onshore american jobs.
▶ 0:16:55Chair Capito: President trump and his team are also putting west virginia first by announcing an agencywide pfa's -- pfbs strategy. I appreciate the structural changes you are bringing to the epa. Several weeks ago, the epa announced it would move more than 130 experts to assist with reviews of new chemicals and pesticides.
▶ 0:17:22Chair Capito: In 2016, the congress told the epa to accelerate the new chemical approval process. The agency has done little to comply with that direction. Reviews currently take months if not years, stifling innovation and leaving countries reliant on outdated chemicals. Addressing the pace of this process is critical to expanding our key industries and on showing critical supply chains.
▶ 0:17:51Chair Capito: I appreciate that you have taken into account my previous calls to provide more resources to address this issue. That leads us to the epa budget. I want to thank the administrator for acting on his pledge to prioritize being a good steward of taxpayer dollars. This will grant programs enacted through the partisan inflation reduction act.
▶ 0:18:15Chair Capito: For example, in february, the epa canceled a $50 million grant made to the climate justice alliance under the I.r.a.'s environmental justice grant program. The climate justice alliance is a nonprofit organization that I investigated and found explicitly engaged in pro-hamas, anti-israel, anti-semitic, anti-police, and empi military activities.
▶ 0:18:40Chair Capito: Some of these activities occurred while they were under consideration for an epa grant awarded by the last administration. The epa has taken immediate action to investigate and reclaim the billion dollars awarded under the greenbank program in the I.r.a.. This money was rushed out the door for the end of the last administration, under unprecedented and I would say suspicious terms. The epa has -- the epa' as proposed budget shows deep reductions for the agency.
▶ 0:19:10Chair Capito: Some of these cuts reflect the best interests of hard-working americans. For example, the budget proposes to cut $100 million from department of justice programs that were added under the biden administration and unnecessary -- unnecessarily imposed requirements for small entities.
▶ 0:19:30Chair Capito: This will reduce ready the tory client -- way to three compliance burdens and allow taxpayers to beneficially -- and allow tax dollars to beneficially impact more entities. There are bipartisan programs that would be impacted if the proposed budget is enacted.
▶ 0:19:48Chair Capito: Programs that have done much to help continuously clean up the air, water, and the proposed budget would reduce funding for the brownfields program, and includes an 89% cut to the clean water and drinking water revolving funds. I and many of my colleagues have long been vocal about the importance of federal assistance and water infrastructure.
▶ 0:20:14Chair Capito: In 2021, fungus made the largest bipartisan investment in revolving funds, delivering more than $50 billion for drinking water, wastewater, and stormwater programs. State funds of helped west virginians and many around the country get connected with water access resources that they need.
▶ 0:20:35Chair Capito: I hope we can work together through the appropriations process, as well as through the committee reauthorization efforts, to make sure that adequate resources remain available to support our water systems. I look forward to building to that future with a view over the next several years -- and I recognize ranking member white house for his opening statement.
▶ 0:20:58Sen. Whitehouse: We are here to discuss the 2026 budget for the environmental protection agency. Thank you for being here today. You pledge during your confirmation process that you would respond substantively to congressional requests from both sides of the aisle. You said, and I quote, I want every member of this committee to have the ability to contact me, to be able to share directly your concerns and your ideas. I want to be responsive to all the members of this committee.
▶ 0:21:28Sen. Whitehouse: Lastly, you told a senate appropriations subcommittee you thought you had responded to all the congressional letters you received. That was not quite accurate. Since your confirmation, I have sent you 12 letters as ranking member, many signed by all the democrats on the dais. Until this week, I have received responses to only two of those 12 letters, and only vague nonresponses at that.
▶ 0:21:52Sen. Whitehouse: On monday of this week, I received another response, reported to answer three separate letters. As for the remaining seven letters, your seven responses came in yesterday, all between 4:53 p.m. And 7:01 p.m., with six of them arriving after the close of business.
▶ 0:22:17Sen. Whitehouse: So thank you, chairman, for this hearing, which seems to have provoked some last-minute responsiveness. Of course, real responses would be challenging. Epa's actions have made families worse off, ignored science, and eroded america's trust in your agency, and all for the benefit of polluters.
▶ 0:22:40Sen. Whitehouse: The ongoing destruction at epa violates legal contracts, violates the constitution, violates the rule of law, and flouts many court orders -- again, all for the benefit of polluters. Thousands of epa grantees at this point have received strikingly similar letters informing them that their work no longer aligns with administration priorities.
▶ 0:23:05Sen. Whitehouse: I don't recall you ever saying that administration priorities oppose clean drinking water, child health research, home renovations that reduce household energy bills, flood mitigation projects, safer schoolhouses, or community centers for seniors -- were seniors and family can retreat during heat waves and dangerous storms. If that is what you tell grantees.
▶ 0:23:34Sen. Whitehouse: One flagrant action is freezing and attempting to terminate the greenhouse gas emission fund. I know you don't like it, but it was created and appropriated by congress to fund community clean energy and disaster resilience activities across the country. President trump claims falsely that climate change is a host. So these funds became a target.
▶ 0:23:59Sen. Whitehouse: The president lacks the constitutional authority to cancel this already authorized and appropriated spending, absent some showing of wrongdoing. So you had to invent wrongdoing. How so? Well, enter trump's corrupt justice department. Ed martin had publicly criticized the grf even before he came to the department. He put career staff at the U.S.
▶ 0:24:31Sen. Whitehouse: Attorney's office to open a criminal investigation so they could assert the investigation justified the phrase. The problem? They could not find any evidence of any crime. Criminal division chief, pointed out that launching a investigation without evidence of a crime, what prosecutors would call predication, is a violation of prosecutor ethics and department of justice policy.
▶ 0:25:01Sen. Whitehouse: That warning from a career prosecutor was red flagged one. Your colleague, martin, responded forcing her resignation. With the criminal division chief, he could not find one staff prosecutor in his office to pursue the matter -- not one. Red flag three. Martin then proceeded in his own name -- red flag for. -- four.
▶ 0:25:31Sen. Whitehouse: That extremely rarely happens with U.S. attorneys going forward with no prosecutor on the plating. When martin then prove it -- then presented this request to the federal magistrate judge, the judge denied the petition, red flag five. Prosecutors, a massive flapping red flag. Federal prosecutors never want this to happen. The triple check and backstop every application to ensure they are ironclad. In my U.S.
▶ 0:25:56Sen. Whitehouse: Attorney's office, a federal judge shooting down one of our applications would have started internal reviews. That disaster did not stop this scheme. Some but he started shopping the case to other U.S. attorneys offices, hoping that some other office would try again in a different strict. Shopping a case around the U.S. attorney's office after the matter had been shot down in court -- red flag six. It seems no other U.S.
▶ 0:26:23Sen. Whitehouse: Attorneys office had been willing to go before any court with this hot mess. But somehow, a federal prosecutor down in florida seems to have ordered washington-based fbi agents to question fbi employees about the grant program. We will discover more about that. Secondly, they suit about your freeze, which you defended with the same pretext of fraud, even citing that sham investigation.
▶ 0:26:54Sen. Whitehouse: The federal judge asked epa or evidence of fraud. The agency was unable to produce any. The judge noted in her decision in favor of the grantees that epa could produce, her words, no evidence to support that claim. So a second federal judge shoots down the scheme. We are now to red flag seven.
▶ 0:27:17Sen. Whitehouse: Compounding this prosecutorial fiasco, martin and you simultaneously unleashed a barrage of misleading public comments, flooding the information zone with public accusations of fraud that career prosecutors, a magistrate judge, and a federal district judge would determine to be unfounded.
▶ 0:27:37Sen. Whitehouse: Unfounded accusations of fraud are called "defamatory per se." fraud toward officials who stood up for the rule of law. Proceeding without a single career attorney. Any shot down by a magistrate judge. Deploying fbi agencies to harass agents. Having no evid inving no evid in ing no evid in courto evid in court. Evid this is welsewhere,a r tha I a n false claims of individualized review are made. Grant programs cannot make -- cannot get straight answers. All this deception and the relentless focus on mega forbidden words like climate and equity, and ongoing here he hunt. Enough is enough. The constitution demands faithful execution of the laws, and that fundamentally means a willingness to take direction from congress. One in this kitty to do big, bipartisan things.
▶ 0:28:07Sen. Whitehouse: -- we want in this committee to do big bipartisan things. That campen -- cannot happen as long as this administration continues to ignore congress's article one powers.
▶ 0:28:14Chair Capito: This morning, we are joined by the honorable lee zeldin of the environmental protection agency. Since being confirmed on january 9, administrator seldom has restored the agency to its core mission of supporting human health and the environment. I look forward to hearing women ministers eldon on the agencies proposed multibillion-dollar budget. Thank you for being here. Before we move forward, I will administer the oath. Please before we move forward, please rise. Raise your right hand.
▶ 0:28:50Chair Capito: Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give to this committee is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
▶ 0:29:01Mr. Zeldin: I do.
▶ 0:29:05Chair Capito: Let the record show that the witnesses answered in the affirmative. We will now proceed. Administrators eldon, you are recognized for your opening statement.
▶ 0:29:29Mr. Zeldin: Thank you. It is an honor to appear before you today to discuss the president's budget request for the U.S. environmental protection agency.
▶ 0:29:56Mr. Zeldin: Since day one, epa has moved swiftly to advancing president trump's directive to deliver clean air, land, and water for all americans while restoring common sense, accountability, and cooperative federalism to environmental policy.
▶ 0:30:27Mr. Zeldin: We are fulfilling our core mission of protecting human health and the environment while powering the great american comeback, and we are removing unnecessary barriers that have burdened american families and businesses for far too long. Since being sworn in as administrator, my team has hit the ground running.
▶ 0:30:44Mr. Zeldin: I have traveled to 17 states across the country, engaging with our dedicated regional staff and scientists, visiting superfund sites and brownfields, and listening to farmers and business owners and community residents who have fantastic ideas how the epa can better work on their behalf. Immediately upon president's administration, epa completed the biggest wildfire cleanup in agency history.
▶ 0:31:11Mr. Zeldin: Less than 30 days after the catastrophic los angeles wildfires, we have taken bold steps to combat pfas contamination, redeveloped 21 superfund sites across 13 states, the listing all or parts of four sites from the national -- delig -- delisting all or parts of four site from the national priority list. With renewed focus and commitment, the epa is working for the american people.
▶ 0:31:41Mr. Zeldin: We are revising the definition of the orders of the united states to align with the supreme court decision and have issued immediate action items for mexico to urgently end the tijuana river sewage crisis that has plagued southern california for decades. On my trip to st. Louis, we cut nearly two years from the cleanup timeline at the westlake superfund site, which has been contaminated by new their waste from the manhattan project.
▶ 0:32:12Mr. Zeldin: Mark the 100th day of the trump presidency, the epa released a list of 100 environmental as -- actions we took during the first 100 days, a pace that motivates us every day. Together, these actions commit to environmental stewardship, cooperative federalism, and actions that make a real difference in people's lives.
▶ 0:32:37Mr. Zeldin: The epa is also helping to unleash american energy, pursue permitting reform, nick america the ai capital of the world, and bring back american auto companies. We have a limited waste and abuse in areas like the greenhouse gas reduction fund, reversed unlawful overreach like the so-called good neighbor rule , and regulation that threatened energy afford ability and consumer choice.
▶ 0:33:10Mr. Zeldin: I'm proud of the monumental steps we took towards energy dominance and expanding cooperative federalism. Giving west virginia and arizona the authority they have sought to protect groundwater and regulate themselves, as other states have had for years. It is no secret the best innovative solutions are often found by working with those most familiar with the challenges faced.
▶ 0:33:34Mr. Zeldin: These historic actions will reduce regular tory costs which act as invisible taxes on americans, making it more affordable to heat homes, operate a business, and bring manufacturing back to local communities. Reducing ep's budget by billions of dollars, the federal budget demands maximum efficiency from the epa. We continue to fulfill all of our statutory obligations.
▶ 0:34:02Mr. Zeldin: Also included in the president' is proposal is an additional $9 million to equip epa with funds to respond to freaking moderate disasters. There is a trace of million-dollar increase for tribes to address freaking water and wastewater info structure on their lands. The trump epa will not view the status quo as some sacred that is untouchable. We will not consider the bite in europe the deletions we inherited be etched in stone.
▶ 0:34:31Mr. Zeldin: And we refuse to waste even a penny of tax dollars. With president trump's leadership and partnership with congress, we will deliver measurable and real results, greater accountability, and a return on investment for dollars spent. I look forward to answering your questions. Thank you.
▶ 0:34:52Chair Capito: Thank you very much. My first question is -- I alluded to it in my opening statement on the state revolving funds. The dramatic cut that is proposed in the budget would mean that, for instance, in my state of west virginia, a decrease from $36 million to $4 million.
▶ 0:35:18Chair Capito: You know, being from new york, there are still a lot of places in rural america that are unserved or underserved in terms of healthy and clean water availabilities. Water systems are facing enormous pressures. We commit to working with the water sector to ensure the srs remains a reliable source of investment. What is the reasoning behind the dramatic cut there?
▶ 0:35:44Mr. Zeldin: To answer the first part of your question, absolute look forward to working with you and other murmurs of this committee. This moment presents an opportunity to talk about just how it has been. There have been good directed grants that have pulled money out of this source of funding. Towards house and senate districts across the country.
▶ 0:36:13Mr. Zeldin: Those particular grants in depth depleting funds from the account. I think there is an opportunity here to have a conversation about that which can strengthen the srf as we talk about fy 26 and beyond.
▶ 0:36:26Chair Capito: As an appropriator into that account, I understand the pushback that states have when they don't want a specific project that is counted against the revolving fund.
▶ 0:36:41Chair Capito: But it still does not answer how -- even if we have the dramatic cut that has been proposed, not only would there be no money for this congressional directed spend, there is not going to be enough money to sustain projects into the future. I hope we can work together on that one. I'm concerned about it. Let me ask you about the new chemical approval process.
▶ 0:37:04Chair Capito: We have had hearings in the committee over the last four years about the inertia of the agency to be able to license chemicals. A lot of times, these new chemicals -- I would not say every time, many times, the new chemicals are coming forward because they are safer. They are greener. They have new technologies. They are less wasteful, less potential for contaminations, because they are more advanced in technology.
▶ 0:37:34Chair Capito: At the past administration would never get these through. You made a pretty decisive move early on. Could you talk about that and what you think the results are going to be in terms of reviewing these new chemicals and making sure we get those cleaner, safer chemicals on the market, and the old ones off the market?
▶ 0:37:50Mr. Zeldin: German, when I was confirmed, I inherited a number of backlogs -- new chemicals, many hundreds. The pesticide review of 14,000. State implantation plans. Small refinery exemptions. The list goes on of all sorts of backlogs.
▶ 0:38:12Mr. Zeldin: As it relates to new chemicals, the feedback that I got from the career staff in the office of chemicals is that they would be able to reduce the backlog if they had two things. One, they were able to bring more scientists into their office to boost the amount of bandwidth that they have, which we had done. That is part of our reorg announcement from a couple weeks ago. And secondly, to bring their technology up-to-date, because it was very outdated.
▶ 0:38:42Mr. Zeldin: The system would crash and they would be locked out for days at a time. We have been pursuing both. With the pesticide review, we have been able to get through reducing that backlog and with the new chemicals review, we are looking forward to being able to eliminate that backlog as well. It is primarily increasing bandwidth, and improving technology, which we are also doing.
▶ 0:39:05Chair Capito: At the same time, you folded the office of science and technology. Is that correct? You folded that into the new chemicals office.
▶ 0:39:14Mr. Zeldin: The scientists are able to compete no matter what, from all sorts of different program offices inside of epa. The same goes with changes made inside the office of air and radiation, inside the office of water, and elsewhere.
▶ 0:39:33Mr. Zeldin: We are creating a new office of state air partnerships, to advance corporative federalism and get rid of one of the other backlogs in state and limitation plans. We are creating an office of applied sciences and environmental solutions. We are boosting that science and research mission inside of these program offices to better fulfill our statutory obligations.
▶ 0:39:57Chair Capito: Thank you.
▶ 0:40:01Sen. Whitehouse: Thanks very much. Administrator zeldin, on april 23, daniel coogan, for the epa, filed a sworn statement in court that said epa leadership conducted an individualized grant by grant review to determine which grants should continue.
▶ 0:40:29Sen. Whitehouse: He made that statement under oath. On the following page of his declaration, he said that there were approximately 377 grantees that had received cancellation notices, and another 100 four grantees who would receive notices within the next two weeks, for a total, by my math, a 781 total grantees.
▶ 0:40:57Sen. Whitehouse: Do you dispute his testimony that there were 781 individual grants at issue?
▶ 0:41:01Mr. Zeldin: The exact number, I don't have offhand.
▶ 0:41:07Sen. Whitehouse: So let's say it is 781 or there about. His testimony, under oath, was that that took place. Then -- and I would ask unanimous consent that the declaration of daniel coogan be placed in the record. -- be made an exhibit. Then travis. Of epa made another statement under oath in a court filing.
▶ 0:41:36Sen. Whitehouse: He set on fabry 25, 2025, I conducted an individualized review of epa grant programs. That day, I decided that certain grant programs should be terminated for policy reasons. There are three things about that statement that are noteworthy. First, the date. He said he did this all on fabry 25.
▶ 0:42:03Sen. Whitehouse: Which is interesting because if you put in a 10 hour day, that is 600 minutes of time for 781 grant applications, which means he would have had to conclude his review of each of them in 45 seconds without even a bathroom break. The second thing about the statement is that he said "I conducted," not you conducted, administer zeldin, not leadership conducted.
▶ 0:42:31Sen. Whitehouse: He said "I conducted," and he said that under oath. The third thing that was interesting was that he dropped in a weasel word, programs. He did not say individualized review grants. He said in default -- individualized review grant programs. Is there a difference between a grant and a grant program?
▶ 0:42:49Mr. Zeldin: We have individualized grants inside a grant program.
▶ 0:42:54Sen. Whitehouse: You could have hundreds of grants inside a grant program, correct?
▶ 0:42:57Mr. Zeldin: Individually reviewed every grant individually. I reviewed every grant individually.
▶ 0:43:04Sen. Whitehouse: That is not what the sworn testimony indicates. Let me reclaim my time here. On may 15 --
▶ 0:43:10Mr. Zeldin: The fact is we both individually reviewed all of the grants and I know he was working on it every single day.
▶ 0:43:17Sen. Whitehouse: That is not what his sworn testimony was. On may 16, doj career lawyers who are under an obligation of candor to the tribunal upon which their right to practice law depends filed a pleading in federal court that conceded that you had not done individualized, grant by grant reviews. They were not contesting that the epa failed to do an individualized review.
▶ 0:43:47Sen. Whitehouse: In court, they admitted -- in fact, the language is defendants do not contest judgment on the merits of plaintiff's apa claims. I ask that that reply be put into the record, that the declaration be put into the record, and that the epa's report that discusses that court proceeding be put into the record. And then yesterday, you stated during your house hearing that you personally reviewed all of these grants.
▶ 0:44:18Sen. Whitehouse: Here is what you said. "I was the one who made the decision, and I made the decision after I individually, personally reviewed every single grant that I canceled." now, you guys are going to have to start getting your story straight, because there are three completely different statements, and they cannot all be true. It cannot beat that one man personally conducted the review of 781, and that it was individually done.
▶ 0:44:49Mr. Zeldin: It is a crazy concept, but maybe more than one person was individually reviewing these grants. How about that concept? What about the --
▶ 0:44:59Mr. Zeldin: There testimony is that they did it all on one day. I do not agree with that, administrator. He swore in court that he did it on one day. So you cannot now come in and say --
▶ 0:45:13Mr. Zeldin: You can make a decision on a day after you worked on it for a while to get all of your ducks lined up.
▶ 0:45:20Sen. Whitehouse: That is not what he said. None of that is what he said.
▶ 0:45:24Mr. Zeldin: Worried that there will be some ranking member --
▶ 0:45:28Sen. Whitehouse: None of that is what he said. None of that is what he said. I am using the facts as your employee stated them.
▶ 0:45:34Mr. Zeldin: That concept doesn't --
▶ 0:45:38Sen. Whitehouse: When? When did you conduct individualized review of 780 one grants? Can you show me your schedule? Will you --
▶ 0:45:47Mr. Zeldin: We inherit something. You don't care about wasting money. The trumpet ministration does, senator.
▶ 0:45:54Sen. Whitehouse: Will you show me our schedule?
▶ 0:45:55Mr. Zeldin: Our schedule is released. We don't put on the schedule every single --
▶ 0:46:02Sen. Whitehouse: Will you show me your schedule to prove your assertion that you did an individualized review of 700 --
▶ 0:46:07Mr. Zeldin: I was reviewing stuff and working on it almost every single day. This committee -- I was asked by senator ricketts, if confirmed, would I immediately make this a top priority to go through all the grant program going through epa, to make sure we are cracking down on every waste, every aspect of abuse, because I have to come back here in front of senator ricketts today. And even though you don't care about wasting tax dollars, senator ricketts does.
▶ 0:46:36Mr. Zeldin: I have to do my job because the american public cares about is not wasting tax dollars.
▶ 0:46:42Senator Whitehouse: And the problem with your assertion here today is that it is belied by your own employees' sworn statements in court and by the decisions the department of justice to admit that what you are saying is not --
▶ 0:46:54Mr. Zeldin: You would have multiple employees looking at these grants. That concept escapes you as a possibility.
▶ 0:47:02Sen. Whitehouse: The only thing about that is that it is not true. It is not true according to your own employees. Their testimony.
▶ 0:47:09Mr. Zeldin: I don't know what to say to you. You are insisting on the fact --
▶ 0:47:15Sen. Whitehouse: I am insisting on the facts. That is exactly what I'm insisting on. I am insisting on the facts. And I now have alternate versions of the facts, including department of justice lawyers who put forth that what you are saying now is not true.
▶ 0:47:29Mr. Zeldin: Just because you insist on epa lighting taxpayer dollars on fire -- the american taxpayers -- they put president trump in office because of people like you. They have republicans in charge of the house and senate because of people like you, because you don't care about 99% of the story. You don't want me to go through the list of all the evidence of waste and abuse. And conflict of interest. You don't care about qualified recipients.
▶ 0:47:56Sen. Whitehouse: What I want you to do is explain why the department of justice lawyers representing epa in court, under a duty of candor, has said that everything you just said is not true. That is what I want. Give me that answer. I will let my chairman take back the devil. -- gavel. >> well, we seem to have a little bit of a disagreement.
▶ 0:48:23Sen. Whitehouse: Perhaps we can work on this in the future, about the difference between the discrepancies. Is that fair?
▶ 0:48:30Sen. Whitehouse: That is fair. I think getting to the basis and bottom of this dispute is very important, under the facts actually matter here.
▶ 0:48:40Sen. Ricketts: With that, we will move on. Administrators zeldin, thank you for being here today. In your 112 days since her confirmation, you have taken steps to address biden's unconstitutional -- thank you very much. That is going back for years. You issued waivers to allow the summertime sale. You empowered states to enact rules about programming. And before I start my questioning today, I want to thank you for that.
▶ 0:49:13Sen. Ricketts: Thank you for supporting rural american farmers and providing regulatory certainty. Thank you for taking steps to clean up the mess that you inherited. On that vein, I am encouraged by the epa's transmission of standard rulemaking to the office of management and budget. I know everybody here knows that I love this committee because we talk about biofuels. That is what we will do for a little while.
▶ 0:49:42Sen. Ricketts: We had earlier conversations -- it drives the markets in real ways that benefit nebraskans. This creates strong markets that producers need in today's farm economy.
▶ 0:50:02Sen. Ricketts: Last week, based on rumors of d4 rvo's being set, soybean basis dropped. It has a big impact on the market. We see biomass-based diesel target set at 5.20 5 billion gallons. Nebraska's farmers and biofuel stakeholders rely on this.
▶ 0:50:29Sen. Ricketts: The biden administration failed to -- filled constituents with late and under protected rvo's. You have the opportunity to affect that. To bring back into compliance, what is your timeline for a final?
▶ 0:50:46Mr. Zeldin: The draft proposed rule is at omb. We expect that to be finalized and released very soon. That includes the public comment period. We will finalize this as soon as we can. Senator ricketts, your advocacy is very well noted at epa. You have been a passionate, tireless advocate for your constituents on this topic. We know how important it is to you.
▶ 0:51:15Mr. Zeldin: We will get it done as fast as humanly possible.
▶ 0:51:18Sen. Ricketts: Are you thinking the summer, the fall? What do you think?
▶ 0:51:20Mr. Zeldin: Much, much faster.
▶ 0:51:25Sen. Ricketts: Supporting biofuels is consistent with president trump's mandate to unleash american energy. This is a no-brainer in my humble opinion. This drives farm profit and lessons reliance on adversaries for energy. Thank you for your administration action to allow summertime sales. Industries rely on certainty throughout the year.
▶ 0:51:52Sen. Ricketts: Do you think enacting the nationwide retailer choice act is the best way to get this authorized year-round?
▶ 0:52:04Mr. Zeldin: If congress was to do this statutorily, it would be the fastest, easiest, most durable solution.
▶ 0:52:15Sen. Ricketts: Protection tools -- the chairman was talking about this earlier. Last month, I sent you a letter with 79 bicameral signatures, calling for use of sound science and risk-based analysis. As the administration considers actions to address chronic illness. I will do it without objection. I'm encouraged by what you said at your hearing.
▶ 0:52:46Sen. Ricketts: Radical environmentalists try to push forward this legislation. Do I have your commitment to ensure the executive action relating to the safe, critical protection tools and agreements you take will be based on sound science and risk-based analysis? You very much. I urge you to use the resource provided to the epa by congress in ways that are consistent with our intent.
▶ 0:53:17Sen. Ricketts: Thank you for the work you have already done. The epa protects human health and the environment by maximizing every dollar to provide clean and safe drinking water, an amazing exposure to forever chemicals, bringing regulatory certainty to nebraska producers, supplying with the statutory mandate. I look forward to working to ensure you have robust funding to be able to do this. Thank you for your work and for being here today.
▶ 0:53:44Sen. Ricketts: With that, I will go to senator alsobrooks.
▶ 0:53:48Sen. Alsobrooks: Good morning. The bipartisan infrastructure law, a designated total of $238 million to be disturbed in over five years for the chesapeake bay program -- this funding, as you might imagine, is going to be critical to supporting the mission of federal, state, and local efforts to restore the health of the chesapeake bay.
▶ 0:54:12Sen. Alsobrooks: Last time you were here, I know you stated it is up to congress to decide on funding levels, and that it would be your obligation to make sure that money will be spent to congress's intent. Yet in spite of that, I understand now that some program funds have recently been halted. To date, I'm not seeing confirmation that the full fy 25 allocation will be delivered to the program.
▶ 0:54:38Sen. Alsobrooks: I would like for you to please provide some clarity on the ministration plans for the fy 25-26 and for structure funding law allocations for the chesapeake bay program.
▶ 0:54:53Mr. Zeldin: First off, senator, I'm not aware of any funds as part of this program in program -- being frozen. I have had the opportunity since confirmation to visit the chesapeake bay for the first time as an administrator, which is, for any other member of congress, especially the newer members, should know this is a beautiful, amazing they. This program is important.
▶ 0:55:23Mr. Zeldin: The work that epa does there is critical. Senator, you have been a strong champion for the chesapeake bay program. It is a partnership between you, your constituents, and epa, to make sure it is fully funded, going forward, and continuing to achieve great progress.
▶ 0:55:47Sen. Alsobrooks: We had an opportunity to discuss the bay at the meeting prior to your confirmation. We agree it is not only a treasure for maryland, that it is a national treasure. Would you commit to looking forward to this particular issue? You said you are unaware of the fact that the funds have been halted. Can you look into them being halted, and we can ensure that those congressionally appropriate funds get to where they should be?
▶ 0:56:16Mr. Zeldin: I can triple check as soon as the hearing is over. We can have a note passed to me while we are here.
▶ 0:56:31Sen. Alsobrooks: The ministration has recently announced the illumination of the office of research and development. This is also a concern to us. It plays an essential role in advancing science-based policy and protecting communities from toxic exposures, including air pollutants. This provides vital expertise in areas such as drinking water protection.
▶ 0:56:57Sen. Alsobrooks: The idea that this particular program is laying off scientists is deeply troubling. I know you said you were interested in increasing accountability, transparency. I'm just wondering, can you share the criteria and decision-making process that was used to shutdown the office of research and development? Is it based on performance data? Was it just driven by an external directive from dozier?
▶ 0:57:31Sen. Alsobrooks: -- doge?
▶ 0:57:32Mr. Zeldin: All decisions are made by me at the agency. That is an important part of going through this process. There has not been a reduction in force for that office decided and announced. I and my team were soliciting feedback from staff that has been at the agency for a long time across all the program offices.
▶ 0:58:02Mr. Zeldin: That is why the reorganization includes the office of air and aviation, the office of chemical safety, and more. As we are creating the new office of applied science and environmental solutions -- we are adding scientists to the office of chemicals. We will add more inside the office of water. All the best ideas came directly from the feedback that we received.
▶ 0:58:33Sen. Alsobrooks: There have been 1500 staff members who had important public health responsibilities who were terminated. In terms of how that decision was made, was it based on performance?
▶ 0:58:45Mr. Zeldin: I have not terminated 1500, senator. There are discussions of, if we were to move forward with a reduction in force, depending on how that reorg is featured -- what we are doing right now is we are allowing, across the agency -- you do not have to be in the office of research and development.
▶ 0:59:12Mr. Zeldin: There is an active process where they are applying for these positions inside of the office of water,, air and radiation, and elsewhere. The research in science inside.
▶ 0:59:30Chair Capito: Senator curtis --
▶ 0:59:35Sen. Ricketts: Senator curtis, are you ready to go?
▶ 0:59:39Sen. Curtis: Thank you for being here today. It is great to be with you. Utahns are already with your approach of the clean but thoughtful. I think you for your time. I would be remiss if I did not highlight utah's unique ozone situation and geography. Thank you for that.
▶ 1:00:08Sen. Curtis: I would highlight that you tons are very committed to clean air, clean water. It is no small amount of effort to do so. Thank you for that. I also want to recognize the critical uses of your work on pfas and your recent announcement concerning the comprehensive approach to managing pfas.
▶ 1:00:38Sen. Curtis: Last month, there was a drinking water regulation that expanded the level for pfas that would be externally challenging for compliance. We have also been told that the standards for the maximum -- maximum containment level has been scrutinized. Can you give us the best way to work with you to be clean, to do what people expect, but also comply?
▶ 1:01:10Mr. Zeldin: Over the course of the last few months, there has been a lot of research to epa -- outreach to epa from individuals and countries that are heavily leading into trying to innovate and find more efficient ways to treat contamination from pfas, which would allow drinking water systems hopefully to be able to remediate these concerns more efficiently than in the past.
▶ 1:01:44Mr. Zeldin: For pfoa and pfos -- those are chemical forms of pfas where the research and data seem to be most advanced. That is where the mcl was set at four parts per trillion.
▶ 1:02:00Mr. Zeldin: We have heard from drinking water systems, and for members of this committee as I was going through the confirmation process, or drinking water systems were concerned about their ability to come up with the funds to come into compliance by the date set by that regulation. We want to work with them to be able to hit those target goals. And hopefully, these new regulations will allow them to do that.
▶ 1:02:34Sen. Curtis: A lot of my callings will continue to talk about the pace of getting rid of those chemicals. It is a problem because many of these new chemicals can replace these, and yet we cannot get rid of them. Thank you. I want to touch on task improvements.
▶ 1:02:59Sen. Curtis: This is not only important for protecting human health and the environment, but also for pillars including energy dominance. Chemical regulations must be based on sound science. We must make sure we do not disrupt key supply chains.
▶ 1:03:16Sen. Curtis: What can we do to make sure the risk evaluations are truly risk-based and based on assumptions of how chemicals are used in the real world, not theoretically?
▶ 1:03:30Mr. Zeldin: It is important to consider the science, to use the best available science, to have the bandwidth inside the office to get through the office, which we have been improving, to improve the technology inside the office.
▶ 1:03:50Mr. Zeldin: Congress added to recent -- to a recently -- a recent congressional funding bill to allow us to get through this backlog. It is a massive backlog with new chemicals and the pesticide reduction.
▶ 1:04:09Sen. Curtis: I have been vocal about ensuring access to natural gas, reliable and clean energy. Can you speak to how the biden era rule -- how we have to keep focused on the reliable thing?
▶ 1:04:28Mr. Zeldin: We announced on march 12 a lot of different regulations that we are reconsidering. I'm not going to prejudge the outcome of the rulemaking. There will be public comment involved. We will follow our obligations under the law. We will follow the admin strata procedures act. And we will make sure we are heeding calls from you, senator, which have been important in your efforts to fight for utah. It was great to be on the ground in utah a few weeks back.
▶ 1:04:59Mr. Zeldin: And to be part of meetings that you led with key officials and community leaders together. I look forward to doing it again.
▶ 1:05:09Sen. Curtis: I would be remiss if I did not thank you for that cooperation. Appreciate it.
▶ 1:05:17Chair Capito: Senator blunt rochester is recognized.
▶ 1:05:22Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you, madam chair, and thank you to the ranking member. Welcome back, administrator zeldin. Your attendance is truly crucial. I want to start by talking about three letters -- a letter I sent with questions regarding the decision to close the office of environmental justice and external civil rights. Number two, your response to the letter.
▶ 1:05:47Sen. Blunt Rochester: And a letter of response from epa region three regarding an air monitoring grant in delaware. I ask unanimous consent to submit all three letters into the record. Thank you. I want to start again by talking about just a the sick question which -- I think I know the answer. But do you believe people have a right to live in an environment free from harmful pollutants? Thank you.
▶ 1:06:19Sen. Blunt Rochester: This brings me to my first letter on the closure of the office of environmental justice and external civil rights. You recall reading that letter?
▶ 1:06:30Mr. Zeldin: I have read every single letter that every member of congress has sent me.
▶ 1:06:38Sen. Blunt Rochester: That brings me to the second letter, the agency response that terminating this office was necessary -- this is the quote -- necessary to align epa's with the agency's current and future needs. This office oversaw a grant that helped constituents in my home state of delaware monitor and assess air toxics from a nearby industrial facility.
▶ 1:07:05Sen. Blunt Rochester: This new castle county community relies on the state to let them know when they need to possibly shut their doors or windows to protect themselves. And to protect their health. Which brings me to the third letter. Apparently, this grant was terminated because it is no longer consistent with the agency's funding priorities, or priorities in general.
▶ 1:07:32Sen. Blunt Rochester: The epa's mission, as you have stated, is to protect human health and the environment. This giving people access to accurate air toxic measurement protect human health, in your opinion?
▶ 1:07:49Mr. Zeldin: Senator, first off, this applies to all grants that are canceled. There was something inside of each grant. That does not mean that -- it was some aspect of the grant that was an issue. That does not mean that for every grant, the entire grant was an issue. We are in the middle of a fiscal year, having a conversation. Any grant that was canceled, I welcome the opportunity to be able to sit with you. I will go through each grant.
▶ 1:08:19Mr. Zeldin: I will tell you exactly what the issue was. As we go through the rest of the fiscal year, we can see what we are able to get out the door with the money that is appropriated by congress. That I know for a fact that every single grant that we canceled, there was something in it that because that grant to be canceled.
▶ 1:08:39Sen. Blunt Rochester: I would welcome the opportunity to sit down and specifically go through these grants. You know, when we met, I expressed concern that there were communities that for decades may be lived on a highway corridor, or maybe next to a facility, that they did not even know the impact on their health.
▶ 1:09:02Sen. Blunt Rochester: A program that actually helps people measure and monitor and be able to protect themselves -- we need to be doing more of that, not less of it. So I think it makes sense. I think it is shortsighted. Ultimately, we are going to pay with sicker people. We are going to end up paying more money. I look forward to following up with you on that grant.
▶ 1:09:25Sen. Blunt Rochester: I also understand that you have been sharing and sort of tallying the first 100 days and 100 environmental accomplishments. I would like to discuss a couple of those items from the list. Item 48, blocked illegal pesticide imports totaling over 200,000 pounds across multiple regions. Item 71, work with U.S. customs to stop illegal pesticide imports at multiple ports.
▶ 1:09:54Sen. Blunt Rochester: Item 72, walked over 56,000 pounds of unregistered pesticide products entering through region for ports. These kind of all sound like the same thing. But I would like to give you an opportunity to share how these accomplishments differ, especially since this is one of the things that you have been really vocal about sharing.
▶ 1:10:14Mr. Zeldin: The way that the list was compiled was from feedback inside of headquarters as well as each of the regions, so all 10 regions submitted a list inside of their region. There might be a win that was submitted from region for that might be similar to what another region had felt was an important win for their region.
▶ 1:10:43Mr. Zeldin: The challenge for our team was that we wanted to release 100, and the person who was running point had 1500 to work with. Part of that included the same win referenced more than once. And we worked on getting it down to a top 100 list. But that is the process of how we got to the list.
▶ 1:11:11Sen. Blunt Rochester: So it is maybe more like 98 wins in 100 days?
▶ 1:11:15Mr. Zeldin: I could add another 100 if you want.
▶ 1:11:18Sen. Blunt Rochester: Could you do this? As a follow-up, how many of these accomplishments were initiated or substantially underway during the previous administration? I would appreciate that.
▶ 1:11:31Mr. Zeldin: The first example that comes to mind is the l.a. Wildfires. President trump came in and signed the executive order saying that we needed to complete hazardous one phase one material within 30 days, and come in and do basic debris removal. The wildfire response started a few days before inauguration day. We took great efforts to make sure that was no longer than three days.
▶ 1:12:02Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you. I am out of time, if I could request a hundred -- you can share with us those same examples, in addition to the other 96. In terms of -- item 48, 71, 72.
▶ 1:12:24Sen. Blunt Rochester: What as a follow-up, if you could just submit for the record how many of the 100 accomplishments were initiated in the prior administration. Thank you so much, and I yield back.
▶ 1:12:36Chair Capito: Mr. husted is recognized. Sen. husted thank you, madam chair. We were talking about the first hundred days. I would ask you and miss consent that those 100 accomplishments be submitted for the record.
▶ 1:12:52Chair Capito: Without objection, so ordered. Sen. husted thank you, administrator, for joining us today. I appreciate the fact that your very first trip as administrator was to east palestine, ohio. Because it was very important to that community.
▶ 1:13:14Chair Capito: Many of you know, if you recall, they experienced a devastating trail -- train derailment and chemical fire several years ago, and that derailment was devastating for the community, and many of those individuals in the community felt like they were not getting proper attention over time.
▶ 1:13:38Chair Capito: The fact that you made your first trip as administrator to east palestine -- it meant a lot to those folks as they continue to recover and show the resiliency that that community certainly has. I am also a proud representative of ohio, and a great lakes state. I recognize that I am the only member of this committee who actually represents a great lakes state.
▶ 1:14:06Chair Capito: And since it is 20% of the world's usable freshwater, I'm going to take pride in that, and spend a little time on that today, although I could talk to you about how some of the environmental rules that we have in this country are actually harming the environment rather than benefiting it, and I would love to update those things. I will spend a little time on the great lakes, if I could, particularly as it relates to w.
▶ 1:14:35Chair Capito: Particularly as it relates to we particularly as it relates to wg particularly as it relates to we algae blooms. We have invasive species that threaten the quality of those great lakes. It has been an issue for many years. And the asian carp is one of those threats that I know many people in those great fisheries are concerned about.
▶ 1:14:57Chair Capito: And president trump issued an executive order directly -- directing agencies to curb the spread of the asian carp in our waterways. Even the economic cost of this to lake erie, which is on the northern border of ohio, I want to just ask you to talk about how the epa will use the gl ri dollars to mitigate this issue and give us insight. I know it matters to all of the great lakes states. Yes, -- Mr.
▶ 1:15:25Chair Capito: Zeldin: yes, senator. This has been appointed president has personally reached out to me on multiple occasions. I think that having a vice president now who has previously and still takes great pride in the great lakes will make sure it stays on the top of the agenda for the entirety of the administration.
▶ 1:15:51Chair Capito: The great lakes program is one that epa takes great pride in and has done important work and that work needs to continue working with congress, hopefully that is fully funded to continue that work to be able to address this issue. Grateful for your advocacy.
▶ 1:16:10Chair Capito: As soon as I was sworn in the vice president called immediately, saying, we are going right away to east palestine, ohio, where you were on the ground and that it was the first visit with urgency from the vice president.
▶ 1:16:26Chair Capito: So, I'm sure, and unconfident without risking speaking for you am sure that you are also confident that this vice president and team will make sure you have that voice that we are meeting with you as much as you want. We are hearing from you as much as you want on behalf of your constituents.
▶ 1:16:45Sen. Husted: I know we have more work to do there, but on the great lakes restoration initiative, I just want your assurance that you are going to be transparent about how those dollars are spent. People will be able to track them and we will be able to come up with one of those great lists of things we were able to do with great lakes funding.
▶ 1:17:05Mr. Zeldin: I want to be transparent on every dollar spent by the agency.
▶ 1:17:09Sen. Husted: Thank you. Finally, I will give you a chance to, the epa learned a lot. What takeaways do you have from the east palestine situation with the -- you know, we had rail corridor's, chemical fires, things like that. I know there is still work to do there. What lessons learned have been communicated to you from the team that was working on that?
▶ 1:17:35Mr. Zeldin: We have to do more faster. We have to ensure that we are present on the ground instantly and when I say we I'm talking about any agency that has any jurisdiction whenever a disaster strikes. Delays of just a few days when disaster strikes could end up being critical lost time that ends up compounding the amount of cost it is going to take.
▶ 1:18:02Mr. Zeldin: Evidence can get lost and a community's voicemail feel like it is not being heard. Then-junior senator jd vance was on the ground instantly, and the residents of ohio are highly confident that they have not missed a beat being able to see you now fill that position. We look forward to working with you want to.
▶ 1:18:24Mr. Zeldin: As far as lessons learned, it is a lesson in leadership in taking sure that when disaster strikes all agencies with any equities are instantly present on the ground and acting not just reacting, but ensuring that we are heeding those calls instantly.
▶ 1:18:42Sen. Husted: I will share one last point on that because we were on the ground. Governor dewine had to make decisions about how to respond to that derailment and I could tell you, he did not get access to timely information to make the very difficult decisions he needed to make and I just encourage you to work with your agency to make sure that in the case that something like that happens again that governors of whatever state that might happen
▶ 1:19:12Sen. Husted: In do not have to fly blind because the epa was not there to give them the information when they needed it.
▶ 1:19:17Mr. Zeldin: I would also that -- add that an important lesson learned is that there are many others around east palestine used to go to east palestine and the message needs to go out to them just how much each -- east palestine has rebounded under your leadership, and it is time to reinvigorate that local economy inside of east palestine.
▶ 1:19:44Mr. Zeldin: At just the residents in that community, but the residents around the community. It is time to go back and help them recover.
▶ 1:19:50Sen. Husted: I look forward to the time that we can get you back and tie this one up and help east palestine recover to even higher better status than it was before. Thank you, madam chair.
▶ 1:20:02Chair Capito: The gentleman from california, Mr. schiff is recognized.
▶ 1:20:08Sen. Schiff: You have only been at the epa for a few months, but in that time you have done more to dismantle this agency then probably all of your predecessors put together. That may be a source of pride for you, but it is not for the american people. You have unlawfully terminated grants without justification, you have fired and pushed out some of the best scientists that inform epa's decision-making.
▶ 1:20:35Sen. Schiff: Refused to spend money that congress has appropriated and you have launched a pro-polluter effort to undo dozens of environmental protections. You have launched an effort to overturn california's clean air act waivers that improve the quality of the air we breathe, by 40,000 -- 40 million californians, and other states that have adopted california's high standards.
▶ 1:21:02Sen. Schiff: That effort, for which my colleagues have decided to eliminate the filibuster to achieve, is not what anyone would call cooperative federalism. But it is your budget that is the ultimate proof of your priorities. You propose cutting america's environmental agency by 55%.
▶ 1:21:22Sen. Schiff: Meaning that in your view and that of president trump, more than half of the environmental efforts of the epa, more than half of the efforts to make sure americans have clean air and water are just a waste. They are just a waste.
▶ 1:21:44Sen. Schiff: Meaning that californians and people all over the country, when they breathe the air, thanks to your good work, it will mean there is more diesel and other particulate matter in the air. When they drink a glass of water they may not be able to see it, but this water that americans drink is going to have more chemicals like fast -- like pfas. This will be your good work.
▶ 1:22:13Sen. Schiff: I want to be very specific about the legacy you are going to leave if you are successful. In eliminating half of our efforts to clean our water and air. Your legacy will be more lung cancer. It will be more bladder cancer. It will be more head and neck cancer. It will be more breast cancer. It will be more leukemia and pancreatic cancer. Or liver cancer. More skin cancer. More testicular cancer. More colorectal cancer.
▶ 1:22:44Sen. Schiff: More rare cancers of innumerable varieties. That will be your legacy. I don't know that that is a legacy anyone should want to have. My kids are going to be breathing that air, just like yours. I families going to be drinking the water, just like yours.
▶ 1:23:08Sen. Schiff: We may not be able to pinpoint just who gets cancer because you have done away with half the budget of those looking out for our clean water and air, but it is going to be somebody's kids. It's going to be somebody's family. To put this in more specific terms, there are 22 grants frozen by the apa focused on improving health and reducing pollution. Many of which directly impact children.
▶ 1:23:36Sen. Schiff: One project in santa ana provided funding to help detect and prevent lead poisoning in children. According to the census about 10% of the population in santa ana are under the age of nine. With a population of about 310,000 people that means 31,000 children are at risk of lead poisoning in santa ana without this funding.
▶ 1:24:00Sen. Schiff: What is it about this grant that you and epa believe is problematic enough to freeze this funding and put potentially 31,000 children at risk?
▶ 1:24:11Mr. Zeldin: Senator, who is the grant applicant?
▶ 1:24:15Sen. Schiff: This is to the city of santa ana.
▶ 1:24:21Mr. Zeldin: The biggest state. I understand you are an aspiring fiction writer. I see why.
▶ 1:24:32Sen. Schiff: Oh, I understand your view that you can cut half of the agency and it won't affect people's health or their water or air. That, to me is a big fiction, Mr. zeldin. I have to thank Mr. zeldin -- I think, Mr.
▶ 1:24:52Sen. Schiff: Zeldin, your children were drinking water and -- in santa ana, maybe you would not be so cavalier about whether there was lead in their water. Maybe you would give a damn, instead of coming in here and suggesting any grant that takes lead out of the water must be waste, fraud, or abuse.
▶ 1:25:14Chair Capito: The gentleman's time has expired.
▶ 1:25:18Sen. Schiff: Because you need the money for a tax cut for rich people because you are beholden to the oil industry. You could give a rat's ass about how much cancer your agency causes.
▶ 1:25:31Chair Capito: The gentlemen's time has expired. The chair recognizes herself. Mr. zeldin, welcome. I take a very different view of your conduct in office, since you took this office. From the previous member of the senate. Our nation is in a dire financial mess.
▶ 1:26:02Chair Capito: Our debt has once again downgraded. We are 37 trillion dollars in debt with no end in sight. Every epa budget I have seen in the 13 years I have been here, all of which prior to this president were under democrat presidents, proposed massive increases in new employees at epa. Thousands of dollars of increases. Thousands of employees.
▶ 1:26:33Chair Capito: The most I saw proposed under the previous president was 3000 employees. These are people we cannot afford. Every state has its own department of environmental quality, and that is where cooperative federalism begins. You make tough decisions. I applaud you for your proposed -- proposed reductions in the budget. The laws will still be responsibly administered under your leadership.
▶ 1:27:04Chair Capito: Broadly on the policy front I am pleased with your leadership. On the endangerment finding, on rolling back the power -- the power plant rule, lots of electric co-ops have told me how devastating that would be. Thank you for rolling that back. I myself belong to three rural electrics in wyoming, so I hear from them all the time.
▶ 1:27:32Chair Capito: You have redirected resources to the core epa mission of protecting human health and environment. So, you are delivering on our promises to americans. Epa does have an outsized influence on lives and livelihoods in wyoming.
▶ 1:27:50Chair Capito: And despite congress' clear statutory direction to epa requiring a decision in less than 180 days, wyoming and north dakota, as well as other states, have been held hostage by the previous administration's more than two years of inaction on state permit program approvals for coal combustion residuals.
▶ 1:28:17Chair Capito: On april 8 your office announced epa would take swift action to advance cooperative federalism and encourage states to pursue oversight and permitting of coal ash within their borders. And propose a determination for wyoming and north dakota's state permit program approved for the coal ash program.
▶ 1:28:39Chair Capito: Now, it was refreshing to learn a month later under your leadership and direction epa proposed approval of north dakota's ccr permit program. Well done. Thanks to president trump your leadership at epa, north dakota received a response, an answer. Wyoming is the nation's top coal producer.
▶ 1:29:05Chair Capito: Expediting epa action on wyoming ccr program would help ensure coal is available to meet our nations growing energy demand and the new uses of coal we found. We are making asphalt out of coal. We are making bricks out of coal. These new uses will extend the important life of this research source so it does not become a stranded asset.
▶ 1:29:30Chair Capito: Do I have your commitment that working through cooperative federalism you will expedite action on wyoming's coal program?
▶ 1:29:38Mr. Zeldin: Senator, I know how important it is to you and your state. We will work to get it done as fast as possible and we hear you. As I was going through the confirmation process you had a long list of priorities that you wanted epa to focus on. We are not going to pace ourselves. You had a great list and we want to work through all of it at once.
▶ 1:30:03Sen. Lummis: Those of us from research-producing states found that we were getting stonewalled under the last administration, so I appreciate your responsiveness to administering the loss, which is what you committed to when used to before us and we consider your nomination by the president for this job.
▶ 1:30:29Sen. Lummis: And, to my way of thinking you have delivered ever since you have gone in office, so I want to applaud you and thank you for your hard work and we will continue to work together to have a strong economy and a strong environment. I am out of time. I appreciate you very much being here today and appreciate the budget you have proposed.
▶ 1:30:49Mr. Zeldin: Thank you, senator.
▶ 1:30:54Sen. Lummis: Senator markey, you are recognized.
▶ 1:30:58Sen. Markey: Thank you, madam chair. I just want to get to this crocodile tear concern which the trump administration has. The oil and gas boys have. Of, about the greenhouse gas program the green bank and the solar bank.
▶ 1:31:23Sen. Markey: They are both programs that are very effective but are being stopped by this administration. I just wanted to point out the 170 billion dollars of fossil fuel giveaways that are already in the pipeline for the trump administration for the fossil fuel industry.
▶ 1:31:43Sen. Markey: Meanwhile, we had the greenbank han solo bank, which is $27 billion, which the mckinsey says is going to unleash $250 billion worth of private sector investment. Meanwhile the richest industries in the world are getting $170 billion of giveaways. Royalty relief, tax breaks over the same period of time.
▶ 1:32:09Sen. Markey: I don't hear anybody saying we should be taking those breaks away from the oil and gas and coal industry. They just want to kill the competition. Wind, solar, all electric vehicles. Anything that would be reducing the need for oil and gas in our country. So, that is unfortunately the state of affairs that we have with this administration at this point in time.
▶ 1:32:38Sen. Markey: They are terminating the very programs meant to face the challenges that are being presented on a nightly basis on every television station in america of these tornadoes, these violent storms that are intensifying. So, let me just move to the bank and what the administration has been saying and doing.
▶ 1:33:03Sen. Markey: In a recent study we can see that it is going to save a lot of money, a lot of funding for families across our country if we move in that direction. You have decided, Mr. administrator, to carry out a baseless witchhunt against the greenbank. And against the solar bank.
▶ 1:33:33Sen. Markey: These funds have been frozen now for months, and we already know what you are going to say. That there was rampant waste, fraud, and abuse. When the district court judge asked if epa could offer any evidence of a violation of a federal criminal law your lawyer responded, I cannot do so, your honor. Are you willing to admit here today, Mr. administrator, that you do not have any evidence of waste, fraud, and abuse?
▶ 1:34:02Mr. Zeldin: I'm happy to go through the list.
▶ 1:34:06Sen. Markey: Why was that evidence not presented in court?
▶ 1:34:09Mr. Zeldin: I will do it right now. I could go through the entire list right now.
▶ 1:34:14Sen. Markey: Why was it not presented?
▶ 1:34:16Mr. Zeldin: I will start. Let's see how far down the list you'll let me go.
▶ 1:34:21Sen. Markey: It was asked --
▶ 1:34:23Mr. Zeldin: Cut me off before the first example.
▶ 1:34:27Sen. Markey: He was asked in court yesterday --
▶ 1:34:30Mr. Zeldin: Do you want to know the evidence, Mr. senator? It is like we are on the titanic and throwing gold bars off of the edge. I will give you another example.
▶ 1:34:46Sen. Markey: I'm going to give you a tip. I'm going to reclaim my time. Chair, I'm going to reclaim my time. Chair, please bring this hearing toward her. You have said --
▶ 1:35:01Mr. Zeldin: You want to declare there is no evidence.
▶ 1:35:05Sen. Markey: You have said that there are grants that have on qualified recipients. Shady deals and gold bars, and yesterday in federal district court your lawyer, defending a lawsuit by groups that want access to their own funds, which is congress appropriated, said that the epa was not claiming there has been any violation by any of these groups. That is your lawyer. Yesterday, in court.
▶ 1:35:33Mr. Zeldin: I'm standing right in front of you. You have the epa administrator offering to go through a list of evidence. Sen. marke your lawyer was in court yesterday and your lawyer said -- here is what lawyer your your -- your lawyer said to a judge yesterday. I am not accusing anyone of fraud. You can filibuster this, Mr.
▶ 1:36:02Mr. Zeldin: Zeldin, but you cannot run from the truth. Your lawyer yesterday setting court, I am not accusing anyone of fraud.
▶ 1:36:09Chair Capito: The gentlemen's time has expired.
▶ 1:36:12Sen. Markey: Presented in court in order to defend these public accusations you are making.
▶ 1:36:20Sen. Lummis: Gentlemen. Time has expired. The chair recognizes Mr. sullivan.
▶ 1:36:28Sen. Sullivan: Administrator zeldin, good to see you. Really looking forward to you coming up to alaska in a couple of weeks, and I want to work with your team on your schedule. I want to put up a chart here. Senator markey, senator schiff. It is a chart that I like to trot out a lot, because it is really important. It gets to the key of so many issues.
▶ 1:36:58Sen. Sullivan: Senator schiff was talking about legacy. This is the ultimate legacy. This is a study in the american medical association on life expect and see in america. Red, yellow, orange, that is people declining life expectancy. Light blue, blue, purple is life expectancy going up.
▶ 1:37:21Sen. Sullivan: My state, the north slope, aleutian island chain, actually increased the most of any state in the country. 13 years my constituents were living longer. So you want to talk about legacy? I ask my constituents, what is more important in terms of a policy outcome than, are your constituents living longer? I don't think there is an answer.
▶ 1:37:52Sen. Sullivan: I did that happen in alaska? Why? I will tell you why. These are almost all alaska native communities. First they started at very low life expectancy, and then responsible resource development happened. Yes. Oil and gas and mining. In these communities. Fisheries in these communities. That is what happened.
▶ 1:38:17Sen. Sullivan: My colleagues on the other side of the aisle and a joe biden and barack obama and every left-wing radical environmental group would do everything in their power to stop responsible resource development from happening. In my state this is a matter of life and death, which is why I'm excited that you're coming up with the sec.
▶ 1:38:35Sen. Sullivan: Of interior and secretary of energy, because you are coming to these places in america where people are living longer because of responsible resource development. My colleagues on the other set of the aisle are not supportive of this.
▶ 1:38:55Sen. Sullivan: And when they go to shut down all of the north slope where there is responsible resource development, where people live 13 years longer and they are starting to block it, that is all they do is blocking it, that is a matter of life and death. When people talk about legacy, when people talk about these issues I know what the legacy is. The people I represent are actually living longer and there is nothing more important.
▶ 1:39:23Sen. Sullivan: You are going to be part of that team when you come up to alaska, so I appreciate it. So, one issue I want to talk to you about is in your confirmation hearing you committed to me to work with me on clean water, drinking water, sanitation, flush toilets,
▶ 1:39:54Sen. Sullivan: Running water. I have thousands of constituents who do not have those things most americans take for granted. By the way, you are a veteran, I am a veteran. These are some of the most patriotic people in the country. Alaska natives serve at higher rates in the military than any other ethnic group. They bled for their country.
▶ 1:40:20Sen. Sullivan: I care a lot about this issue and I was glad to see that in your budget you increased your budget on drinking water and water infrastructure programs, which is great. So, thank you on that. I do want to ask about community change grants. I understand why you have looked at these grants in a problematic way. A lot of it is problematic.
▶ 1:40:45Sen. Sullivan: Some of those grants, as you know, have gone to clean water, drinking, sanitation, the village of housel you is one, can I get your commitment to continue to work with me on these issues with communities like housel yacht, who were applying for grants to get more sanitation? So people can live longer? Can I get your commitment on that?
▶ 1:41:10Mr. Zeldin: Enthusiastically, yes.
▶ 1:41:13Sen. Sullivan: Are you going to make sure the programs in terms of these critical investments will have an opportunity, if they were canceled during the community change grants program, can reapply or get directed funding -- again, $20 million to the village and others for the sanitation issues which are very important?
▶ 1:41:36Mr. Zeldin: Senator, you have previously reached out and you fight hard for the people of alaska, including outreach on these grants. I would look forward to an opportunity to work with you on each of them. As we are having this conversation in the middle of the fiscal year money is going to continue to get out the door, and I believe there will be many opportunities here for us to be able to work on these causes you are advocating for.
▶ 1:42:03Sen. Sullivan: Just to make that 100% clear, on the issue of clean water, flushing toilets, which, some in my communities, senator kelly deals with this on some of his native reservations -- that that continues to be a priority of yours, as you mentioned to me during your confirmation process and you will continue to work with me on those issues in alaska and see some of it when you are up there?
▶ 1:42:30Mr. Zeldin: Yes sir.
▶ 1:42:31Chair Capito: Senator kelly.
▶ 1:42:36Sen. Kelly: Administrator zeldin, good to see you again and thank you for taking the time to come out to arizona a few weeks ago -- maybe a couple of months ago now -- and appreciate the partnership with your team. And, you know, just thank you for working to improve arizona's air quality and support our continued economic growth.
▶ 1:42:58Sen. Kelly: As you heard during your visit, we need epa to work with maricopa county to provide new ways to generate emissions reductions credits. Later today the maricopa county board of supervisors is expected to vote to submit to epa the final version of rule 205 for final approval. We talked about these two rules. I will get to 204 in a second.
▶ 1:43:28Sen. Kelly: While I know you cannot pre-judge a regulatory decision, will you commit to having region nine process this application as quickly as possible?
▶ 1:43:38Mr. Zeldin: Yes, senator.
▶ 1:43:40Chair Capito: Thank you. We have heard it can take as long as six months for the regional office to conduct this review. You think there is any way to do this faster than six months?
▶ 1:43:50Mr. Zeldin: We will do it as fast as we possibly can.
▶ 1:43:53Sen. Kelly: The second rule should be completed and submitted for final approval by the county sometime this summer. And once rule 205 is completed could I get a commitment to quickly work on rule 204 as well?
▶ 1:44:10Mr. Zeldin: Absolutely, senator.
▶ 1:44:13Sen. Kelly: Another item we discussed was the need to understand the root cause of the ozone pollution that forms in the phoenix area. As we discussed, we have a mission -- emissions have gone down and ozone has gone up. So, specifically nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compounds.
▶ 1:44:41Sen. Kelly: Well, you know, ozone rising with the other, you know, the increasing doc's. We need scientific tools and models to help us understand what is going on here. We have not figured it out and we need help with this. And we have developed a partnership between the state, maricopa county, the university of arizona, and epa called a ground-level research project.
▶ 1:45:12Sen. Kelly: But the epa researchers who support this work are within epa's office of research and develop it. Ord is a congressionally-mandated entity established to operate independently and without political bias. To maintain its objectivity remains separate from the agency's regional offices and other components. The president's budget proposes a 56% cut to ord.
▶ 1:45:38Sen. Kelly: From what we can figure that will likely/75% of its staff many employees would be reassigned to offices. We were meant to stay independent from, exposing its scientists to institutional pressure. Mr. zeldin, I can only imagine that ord facilitates dozens of similar partnerships, like ours.
▶ 1:46:02Sen. Kelly: So, tell me, how can the epa produce unbiased science and data, including data we desperately need in arizona, if you fire most of the scientists at the epa's office of research and development?
▶ 1:46:16Mr. Zeldin: Senator, the reorg that was announced a couple of weeks ago increases the science and research effort inside of numerous program offices at epa. I want the scientists to be able to do the science and there not be any change from what the natural conclusions are of their good work.
▶ 1:46:42Sen. Kelly: Does that mean that awardee is not going to lose any scientists?
▶ 1:46:47Mr. Zeldin: Senator, the rio grande is a she creates -- we have scientists inside of the office of research and development applying for all sorts of positions inside the agency. We are creating a new office of partnerships, but inside the office of air and radiation. As a product of having communications with states to advance cooperative federalism we inherited a big backlog of state implementation plans and to help a state like arizona be able to come into compliance.
▶ 1:47:17Mr. Zeldin: Scientists who might be in the office of research and development might be in the state office of air and partnerships and the office of air and radiation. I want them to be doing amazing work that you and your constituents are entirely proud of. We are also creating an office of applied science and environmental solutions, which will include a lot of scientists who are currently inside the office of --
▶ 1:47:42Sen. Kelly: Do you have concern about their independence and their ability to do unbiased science if they are commingled with people working on policies?
▶ 1:47:51Mr. Zeldin: Not at all. I do not want there to be any biased science anywhere inside of this agency, ever. Leaning one way or another. We want the scientists to be able to do the science to get good research, good data to fulfill all statutory obligations and allow us to do a great responsive job for your constituents.
▶ 1:48:15Mr. Zeldin: When you gave us a very long list of to do items, if confirmed, we have been very proud to be able to work with your office and your constituents to get through that list as quickly as possible.
▶ 1:48:26Sen. Kelly: And I appreciate that.
▶ 1:48:29Mr. Zeldin: Getting rid of their guidance with ozone, that was one of the asks. Working to get one of the permits on tsmc. You had a long list and I appreciate the fact that you have a long list and I want you to give us the next list. What are 20 things the epa can do to help arizona?
▶ 1:48:47Sen. Kelly: As somebody who has always been driven by science and data I get concerned when I see 75% cuts in an organization that has a lot of scientists. What you are telling me is, these scientists are going to some other group with nepa to continue to do this important work, and I will look forward to seeing the results. Especially on our issue with rising ozone when admissions have actually been going down. Thank you.
▶ 1:49:17Chair Capito: Senator whitehouse and die are each going to do one of the round and then I think we will bring it down. We are on a vote and I appreciate your time and attention. I apologize for not being in the room, although I heard it was quite lively. That I was not in the room for the whole proceedings. I don't know if pfas was a major focus, because you and I have talked about this. This is a major focus for me.
▶ 1:49:49Chair Capito: You as a former member of the house were active in this arena, because of incidences in your home district that you had talked about. So, you put out a pfas plan, which I really commend you with a strategy early. At least we can see where we are going. And I would like to ask -- the question is a little nuanced for me.
▶ 1:50:14Chair Capito: I want to know, where do you think in the plan that you have put forward we are actually going to see action so that -- that would be different than what we would have seen the last four years? We kept pushing for minimum drinking levels and things of that nature. Now we have things like passive receivers in water systems and once you catch it, how do you destroy it?
▶ 1:50:40Chair Capito: There is so much in your tenure we could solve this problem. How do you cs proceeding from there and I hope you intend to be as aggressive as possible.
▶ 1:50:56Mr. Zeldin: Yes, chairman. With regards to the april 28 announcement, this was the first release we send out. We have sent out others since. I would point you to -- and there are a lot of different aspects of this announcement. One part says, develop limitation guidelines for pfas manufactures and evaluate others necessary for reduction of discharges. That is significant. I would encourage the public to read the april 28 release that went out.
▶ 1:51:25Mr. Zeldin: The release that one out last week tackles -- I understand this reality as a minister of the epa every decision I make, whether I say yes or no, someone is going to sue me. It is the reality with every decision. We also inherited some active litigation and some of that was in the pfas phase that is going through the courts.
▶ 1:51:50Mr. Zeldin: There are -- the announcement we made last week involving six chemicals, we are retaining the four parts per trillion on the two chemicals where the research and data has been the furthest along. There is a lot of research with regards to the other four chemicals at play.
▶ 1:52:13Mr. Zeldin: Procedural error that created a litigation issue was that with those four other chemicals they combined the preliminary -- the preliminary determination with the rule that meant the epa skipped a step in the rulemaking process by issuing the drinking water standard at the same time to formal decision to regulate pfas. The safe drinking water act does allow for certain steps to be combined, but what they did is not allowed under the act.
▶ 1:52:45Mr. Zeldin: I would point out that as we go through the process with those four at the end of the process you end up with a lower mcl. For those that want to take last months announcement meaning you are going to end up with lower, that is not accurate. There was one line of q&a with one of your colleagues. There has been a lot of outreach to epa over these last few months.
▶ 1:53:10Mr. Zeldin: Individuals and companies that are really leaning into investment and trying to come up with innovation for pfas treatment. What we are hoping for is that the cost to be able to come into compliance with these mcl's are going to come down in the months and years ahead. The innovations are clearly out there.
▶ 1:53:34Mr. Zeldin: The passive receiver concern I heard from members of this committee when I was going through the confirmation process, it is against the principle of polluter pays to make a consumer pay to clean up the contamination of their water supply. And that is something that we agree with and want to address.
▶ 1:53:52Chair Capito: Thank you. One of the other things that I think is very confusing to the general public, we had a chemical spill in my home system. And there were conflicting advice as to whether you could drink the water, a than in the water, cook with water, initially, you know, it was said, it was safe.
▶ 1:54:18Chair Capito: It had an odor, so he didn't want to drink it, but then the next day there is a letter issued by the cdc after they said it was safe they issued another letter that says, but if you are pregnant or expecting or elderly or have a health issue, you shouldn't drink it. There is nothing worse than an agency or administration can do then to give conflicting health advice. I think we learned that during covid, because it was all over the place.
▶ 1:54:46Chair Capito: For something as fundamental as drinking water that our children and my grandchildren are drinking, what a terrible legacy for us to leave. And so, we need to be really strong here. I'm going to support you every step of the way, but, you know, conflicting levels, you know, there is a safety level and then a drinking level. How do you interpret that if you are a mom deciding what to do? It is impossible.
▶ 1:55:13Chair Capito: I thank you for your attention to this and I really want to work with you on this and I appreciate the speed with which you came out with this. Whether anybody agrees with the advice or some of the advice or all of the advice, at least you are prioritizing this. Early on because you have to get to the process that takes years, and we are going to work hard to make sure that happens. Thank you. >> Mr. zeldin.
▶ 1:55:42Chair Capito: I hope you'll answer my questions. I would appreciate it. The first is, on february 17 the citibank to freeze funds. Did you have anything to do with that?
▶ 1:55:54Mr. Zeldin: No.
▶ 1:55:58Sen. Whitehouse: Were you aware of that?
▶ 1:56:01Mr. Zeldin: I was made aware of that.
▶ 1:56:03Sen. Whitehouse: Shortly after?
▶ 1:56:06Mr. Zeldin: I got my update after citibank instituted the freeze.
▶ 1:56:11Sen. Whitehouse: Do you know who the fbi was reporting to when it took that action?
▶ 1:56:18Mr. Zeldin: All the stuff -- you went through a lot earlier that we are not, you know, at the judiciary committee hearing. There are questions I just don't have the answer to as far as --
▶ 1:56:32Sen. Kelly: Just say you don't know. That is fine. Were you aware that on february 18 the criminal chief of the D.C. U.S. attorney's office resigned over this effort to get this freeze?
▶ 1:56:45Mr. Zeldin: I learned about that reading about it in the newspaper.
▶ 1:56:49Sen. Kelly: So shortly after that became news?
▶ 1:56:52Mr. Zeldin: Whenever it broke in the news.
▶ 1:56:55Sen. Kelly: Did you find out at some point that Mr. martin had failed to get his order from the magistrate judge?
▶ 1:57:07Mr. Zeldin: Ask the question again? Did I learn what?
▶ 1:57:09Sen. Kelly: U.S. attorney martin went to the magistrate judge seeking an order that would allow for the freeze of the citibank-held assets.
▶ 1:57:21Mr. Zeldin: I was aware of that after the fact.
▶ 1:57:25Sen. Kelly: Do you know when the order was denied?
▶ 1:57:28Mr. Zeldin: I don't have that date.
▶ 1:57:30Sen. Kelly: The reason I'm asking this is because on february 23, 2025, you said the entire scheme, in my opinion, is criminal, which is a pretty strong word to use. And I'm trying to figure out what you knew when you said it was criminal. So, you knew by then at least that the criminal chief had resigned over this issue.
▶ 1:57:59Sen. Kelly: It is not clear whether you knew at that time that martin's order had been rejected by the magistrate judge. Could you find that out for me? What was the timing of when you knew that martin's order had been rejected by the judge? In comparison to your statement that this was criminal?
▶ 1:58:21Mr. Zeldin: Would you like me to tell you everything I knew when I made that statement?
▶ 1:58:23Sen. Kelly: Sure. -- Sen. whitehouse: sure. Not right now. I would like to get through some other questions. Later on a march 6 you also said that this was either a kickback, theft, graft, or all of the above. On fox news.
▶ 1:58:50Sen. Kelly: And if you could also put into the timeline of what you knew and when you knew it, that march 6 statement? I would be grateful to that. About that. Somewhere between march 9 and 10th there was a series of emails between epa and doj in which the top career epa attorney warned that there was significant legal vulnerabilities with the citibank freeze.
▶ 1:59:20Sen. Kelly: You know what those significant legal vulnerabilities were that he was referring to?
▶ 1:59:24Mr. Zeldin: I could speculate that if you are going through what is claimed to be a breach of contract and court of federal claims, it is a court that would have jurisdiction over it, not a district court, inside there they would determine if there was a breach of contract and decide on damages.
▶ 1:59:41Sen. Whitehouse: So it could be not on the merits, but the venue, the appropriate court?
▶ 1:59:46Mr. Zeldin: I'm just saying, the weather process would go is $20 billion went to eight pass-through entities. A little over $3 billion of that was dispersed. Rest has been frozen. All of the grants had been terminated.
▶ 2:00:01Sen. Whitehouse: Let me ask you about that because my time is getting short here. I'm sorry to cut you off. The new york times has reported that one of the grantees has been told it no longer needs to comply with a february 20 subpoena, suggesting the investigation is closing. As the investigation closing?
▶ 2:00:18Mr. Zeldin: Any question you have as far as justice department as an agency should be directed to the justice department.
▶ 2:00:27Sen. Whitehouse: You were not involved in all of that?
▶ 2:00:31Mr. Zeldin: No, I'm focused on the epa.
▶ 2:00:35Sen. Whitehouse: So, doj lawyers representing epa admitted in the circuit court of appeals that they are not accusing anybody of fraud. That is their quote. Not accusing anybody of fraud. And epa in that courtroom specifically reiterated several times that no grantee had engaged in any fraud, waste, or abuse. Do you stand by the statements of your lawyers in the courtroom?
▶ 2:01:05Mr. Zeldin: I would love to be able to go through the list of all of the waste and abuse that I'm aware of but it seems like you and your colleagues want anything other than for me to go through the list of evidence.
▶ 2:01:16Sen. Kelly: You are more than welcome to submit the list. You don't want me to go through the list of evidence? You just want to say we don't have any.
▶ 2:01:27Sen. Whitehouse: Hold on. Hold on. Let me stop you right there. It's not me saying you don't have any. It is your lawyers in a court proceeding. I will take it as a question for the record because our time is up, but, please, give me your list.
▶ 2:01:46Mr. Zeldin: I guess you haven't read it. >> here we go. With no further questions I would like to thank administrator zeldin and all of my colleagues for their participation in today's hearing. It has been a busy morning. Senators who wish to submit written questions for the record have until 5:00 p.m. Wednesday, june fourth. The witness' response to these questions are due back to the committee no later than 5:00 p.m. June 18 and will be submitted for the record.
▶ 2:02:14Mr. Zeldin: With that, the hearing is adjourned, but before that I would like to make an announcement. I would ask the audience to stay in their seats at the conclusion of the hearing just while capital police clear the room. Thank you very much.