▶ 0:15:45>> thank you for joining us this morning. Thank you to the great witnesses we have. This is the second in a two-part hearing season to guide the development of the next surface transportation reauthorization bill. Earlier in the spring we held a meeting with sean duffy where heat detail for the trump administration is administering the current law and priorities for the next bill.
▶ 0:16:14We'll hear about new stakeholders on their priorities. My vision is the simple but important. We want to improve the movement of people and goods. The roads and bridges are what connect us to the people and places of what affect us. To help businesses large and small, create jobs, economic activities and enable competitiveness in the global marketplace.
▶ 0:16:36My home state of west virginia is pursuing important projects to better link essential services and economic opportunity. This legislation will provide funding and established policies and programs that enable improvement in the service transportation network we all rely on. Since the enactment of the bipartisan infrastructure investment and jobs act, the committee has reviewed and conducted oversight on existing programs and policies. We have learned a lot about what is working and what isn't.
▶ 0:17:08A generational level of investment in the surface transportation network but there have been challenges. We know that the programs are producing results in communities across the state. We know there been issues getting discretionary grant awards out the door and producing tangible improvements to that network.
▶ 0:17:28When secretary duffy appeared before the committee he outlined the backlog of 3200 discretionary grant awards without the agreements that he had inherited from the prior administration. I appreciate the ongoing efforts to address the backlog and I know the department of transportation is making progress in getting these agreements in place. I believe they have done over a thousand of those already.
▶ 0:17:55We will apply the lessons to shape the next bill and the lessons have led me to three principles. I believe these principles -- discuss these principles at our hearing with the secretary but I believe it is important to reiterate them today. Principle one, improving the safety, and I want to emphasize safety and reliability of the surface transportation network with capital investments. We have seen an increase in the number and scope of federal transportation programs.
▶ 0:18:24These programs sometimes have duplicate purposes and project eligibility. This leads to expensive and time intensive process to get funding out the door and lessens the impact the legislation can make. As we craft the next bill we must prioritize investments that optimize federal funding and give state partners the confidence to invest over a longer period of time.
▶ 0:18:48We should focus on eliminated duplicate programs and increasing funding for the highway formula programs states rely on and have a proven track record of success. Principle two, reforming and modernizing policies to create efficiency. We all know that as currently instructions, federal requirements can at red tape increase costs and slow down the completion of projects.
▶ 0:19:13We all want to deliver transportation benefits faster and save money for the american taxpayer. To achieve this, we need to look at federal requirements and determine how we can create certainty for the partners who makes the projects happen and ensure the public receives the benefits of these and fits quickly. Principle three, addressing the variety of surface transportation needs across all states. Obviously, different needs. We will hear about that today.
▶ 0:19:40I wouldn't expect west virginia with the peaks and valleys and we will just say we are the mountain state to prioritize the same transportation projects as other states. We need to avoid top-down mandates from washington, D.C. and give states the flexibility to address the individual improvements their communities need.
▶ 0:20:03It will take collaboration from my senate colleagues, the trump administration and our stakeholders to complete this bill for it expires in september 20 26. We must be pragmatic, work in a bipartisan fashion to deliver a bill that gives productive conversation on this effort with colleagues in the house. I know many of you traveled far and to the witnesses who have joined us, I look forward to learning about these priorities.
▶ 0:20:32This is an opportunity to make a pivotal impact on the surface transportation network. Each of us knows how important it is in the role it plays in keeping the economy and people on move. I'm excited to get to work on the committee -- committees bipartisan legislation that delivers for the american people. Ranking member whitehouse, I now recognize you for your opening statements.
▶ 0:20:55Sen. Whitehouse: Thank you, chairman for the meeting and welcome to the guests. As we consider the next surface transportation reauthorization bill, I would be remiss not to remind everyone that democrats have no reason to do a bill if we have an administration that will not faithfully execute the laws, meaning both sides on any compromise we reach.
▶ 0:21:25Sen. Whitehouse: D.o.t. Has made substantial increase in unfreezing grants. The electric vehicle program was submitted to the office of information and regulatory affairs. This is progress but is still stalled in gaps continued to high-speed rail and congestion pricing. I want to get a bill done but I've given my team the green light to work on details.
▶ 0:21:57Sen. Whitehouse: D.o.t. Is will be in the right direction, took lily when compared to the dumpster fire of political corruption at the environmental protection agency. In congress there is bipartisan agreement about federal agreement on infrastructure. The american society of seville -- civil engineers gives our roads a d+. We have 40,000 bridges classified as deficient. 39% of public roads in poor or mediocre condition.
▶ 0:22:23Sen. Whitehouse: Close to 40,000 people still die each year on roadways in the wealthiest country in the world. Our directive is clear, work together to build on the early successes and further improve our transportation infrastructure. As we do this, prudent investments must account for investments. Annual costs for climate related damage to road and rail infrastructure are expected to reach 20 billion a year 2050 with approximately 1.5 billion in costs for bridges alone.
▶ 0:22:56Sen. Whitehouse: A recent report by the U.S. chamber of commerce and all stewart -- allstate fund every dollar invested in infrastructure, communities save $13 in post-disaster lawsuits. 1-13 is smart spending. I thank d.o.t. For finalizing the grant agreement for the historic and beautiful mount hope bridge in rhode island just last week.
▶ 0:23:21Sen. Whitehouse: That program recognizes that climate change is a real driver and that investments in resilience now save big money in the long run. Pollution driven climate change is costing lives and livelihoods. To prevent otherwise is to abdicate moral and physical responsibility. The next reauthorization bill must and will take climate change seriously. You may not have to say it but we have to do it.
▶ 0:23:48Sen. Whitehouse: Transportation is the largest source of greenhouse gas emissions paid 1.8 billion metric tons of carbon dioxide into our atmosphere, or than a quarter of total emissions. Just last week, four communities were ravaged by one in a thousand year rainstorm. Floods like those in texas, north carolina and illinois more intense, more deadly and more frequent.
▶ 0:24:12Sen. Whitehouse: Homeowners insurance in wildfire risk areas is collapsing, taking down real estate values and presenting a systemic financial danger to our economy. Our transportation system is driving the climate up people and that challenges the functionality of our transportation system. In addition to climate safety, the next reauthorization bill must prioritize road safety. The persistently high number of traffic fatalities in the immeasurable pain and suffering is unacceptable.
▶ 0:24:43Sen. Whitehouse: This is not just driver and passenger but those walking, biking and working on construction sites responding to emergencies. Many of the roads in poor condition are the local roads that carry a large share of vehicle miles traveled, exacerbating the safety risks.
▶ 0:25:00Sen. Whitehouse: As we put pen to paper on this next transportation package, let us be clear I do, let us follow the evidence, let us make the investments in our transportation systems that reduce emissions, prioritize safety, bolster resilience and that meet the real-life needs of the communities we serve. With that I look forward to working together with the chair and my republican colleagues on this bill and I look forward to hearing the perspectives of the witnesses.
▶ 0:25:27Chair Capito: Next I will turn to senator cramer to introduce our first witness for this meeting. You are not recognized.
▶ 0:25:37Sen. Cramer: Thank you chairman and ranking member whitehouse. Sharon, let me start off by promising you that unlike senator curtis, governor armstrong and I have no intention of breaking about how much bigger our mountains are than yours. We will yield to that.
▶ 0:25:56Sen. Cramer: It is a great honor for me to represent my governor and the former member of congress, kelly armstrong, years of service very similar to mine and that every time you won an election he improved the institution that he went to because you place me in the house of representatives included on the energy and commerce committee.
▶ 0:26:22Sen. Cramer: He also serves on the judiciary committee which is not a small task in the house of representatives. What is interesting about governor armstrong as he is not a politician but the opposite he is a lawyer not ashamed to say it. He is a graduate of university of north dakota where he got both of his degrees.
▶ 0:26:56Sen. Cramer: He served in the state senate which is in my mind where the rubber meets the road and then in congress is now a governor. Kelly it seems like you are a new governor and I don't know how you feel about it. But governor armstrong brings that perspective.
▶ 0:27:22Sen. Cramer: As I look forward to hearing from the mayor, for all of us here it is important to remember there is probably no better illustration of the juxtaposition of the federal and local and state governments and infrastructure.
▶ 0:27:37Sen. Cramer: It is legitimate in the constitution and so kelly brings that very important perspective from a rural state that produces a lot of things that we don't consume in our own state or nearly in the supply that we provide to our hungry world and growing economy, where is energy, food or how you get wheat to turn it into flour to
▶ 0:28:07Sen. Cramer: Get it to the pasta pot into the restaurant in new york. He understands it all and understands the relationship and I am grateful he is here. Beyond all of the other things that kelly has done, he is most of all and what he is really good at is he is a very experienced youth baseball coach that is where the meets the road.
▶ 0:28:33Sen. Cramer: And with that, and here come it is my honor to introduce governor kelly armstrong.
▶ 0:28:39Chair Capito: I would mention it governor armstrong is testifying this morning and I won't say to all of you that today is the congressional women's softball game. We are playing tonight at 7:30. It is going to be televised. I am the only senator playing so we better get to the vote so I can get there. But this is how I met governor armstrong.
▶ 0:29:09Chair Capito: He helped coach us on one of the baselines. It is great to see you and I welcome your custom -- your testimony, governor. >> thank you chairman, ranking member and senator cramer and members of the committee.
▶ 0:29:32Chair Capito: Before I get into my remarks, if we are going to talk that much about a small and softball, anyone who thinks being eight state senator or trial lawyer is the best preparation for congress is wrong. The best preparation for congress is dealing with the parents. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today and offered this perspective as the committee continues its work on surface transportation reauthorization.
▶ 0:29:59Chair Capito: I had the honor of serving as the third fourth governor of the state of north care -- north dakota. In our state, it isn't just about convenience, it is a pillar of communities and thriving local economies. Our highways, roads and bridges are essential life connecting our agricultural producers, energy, small businesses and families to markets, health care, education and emergency services. They drive 12,000 miles over the geographic center of north america.
▶ 0:30:28Chair Capito: As senator cramer mentioned, we produce a lot of things the world needs. We are very proud of the fact that we provide calories and energy to a world that continues to ask for more and more and more to continue what is the greatest economy in the history of the world. We put a lot of miles on it unlike D.C., where many people don't own a car or rely on public transit, are citizens depend heavily on personal vehicles to reach their destination.
▶ 0:30:57Chair Capito: We have teenagers driving farm trucks, senior citizens driving hundreds of miles to doctors appointments and students driving 20 miles one way for baseball arrestable practice. The roads in our state are not just fort worth dakotans, investment in rural highways many fish the entire nation. The movement of goods across north dakota and other rural states benefits people and businesses at both ends. Good roads in states like ours are essential to getting ag energy and other products to national world markets.
▶ 0:31:27Chair Capito: My request for the committee today is simple, continue providing robust funding giving maximum flexibility to states and watch us go to work. The key piece of ensuring states can successfully and efficiently build projects is a formula based funding. The next highway bill should maintain or increase the percentage of program dollars distributed along states to more quickly deliver critical transportation products.
▶ 0:31:52Chair Capito: This is especially important in states like north dakota that don't have that long of a construction season. Although discretionary grant programs play a role in the infrastructure program, the process is often inefficient, slow and costly. In some cases, it can take up to 18 months between an award and grant announcement. I can give you a specific example.
▶ 0:32:13Chair Capito: In june 2020 three, the north dakota department of transportation was awarded $30 million -- grant from the federal where wood administration. The grant will fund a long overdue separation project in grand forks, a city with nearly 60,000 residents and home to my alma mater, the university of north dakota. Secretary buttigieg came and we welcome him and we were excited about the project.
▶ 0:32:39Chair Capito: As of today, more than two years later, the north dakota dot is still awaiting execution of the grant. In our first legislative session, we had to appropriate $20 million in the state dot money because of the cost increase that is associated with that two-year delay. We are very appreciative of the money and the award, but the delay alone is an expense that was never anticipated and never dealt with. We will fix it and get it done. We are excited about it.
▶ 0:33:09Chair Capito: But it was unnecessary. Delays in discretionary grant programs are problematic, guard list of the geographic location. In a state with short construction window, the negative impacts of these delays are magnified. While discretionary grant programs serve an important purpose, encourage this committee to increase to the extent possible the percentage dollars delivered by our formula.
▶ 0:33:33Chair Capito: I ask you to consider including provision that give states more flexibility to apply funds they need the most. The bipartisan highway funding transportation improvement act from senator cramer will do just that by increasing the percentage of funds department of transportation can transfer between accounts. States know their needs and this legislation will enhance our ability to make the best decisions for our unique situation.
▶ 0:34:01Chair Capito: Robust funding is important all the money in the world and quite frankly we could appropriate less money if we streamline the permitting process. We would take less money from the federal government every single day if we could get a shovel in the ground faster. So I appreciate the opportunity to be here but I would end with thank you so much for having us and thank you for all you have done to help us build infrastructure in north dakota and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:34:30Chair Capito: I am sure your voice is loud and clear for all the other 49 governors and others. Our next witness is austin ramirez, the ceo of husco international, inc.. He became ceo in 2011, taking over from his father, gus ramirez.
▶ 0:34:54Chair Capito: He had -- two has 5 million in annual sales and has a global footprint. They specialize in high performance hydraulic and electromechanical components. Mr. ramirez will share his component as a user of the transportation network that relies on safe roads and bridges to get people to work and products to market. I would note in his bio was an all-american swimmer at the university of virginia.
▶ 0:35:24Chair Capito: You are recognized for five minutes.
▶ 0:35:25Mr. Ramirez: Thank you chairman for the generous introduction. Good morning ranking member whitehouse and members of the committee. I'm proud to serve as the president of husco. Thank you for allowing me to testify and to provide views on surface transportation reauthorization. It is a family owned business in wisconsin. We make vital components used in the cars you drive and the equipment that powers construction.
▶ 0:35:54Mr. Ramirez: For nearly 80 years have been an economic driver in our local community, providing thousands of families with careers. We are also a business with a purpose, guided by the values of opportunity and service. Husco is a top philanthropic business. The values reflect my family story my dad was born in puerto rico and came to this country at the age of six and pursue the american dream, graduated from our nation's top university.
▶ 0:36:26Mr. Ramirez: Over several decades, gus went from working at husco to leading it. Revenue has grown to over 5 million today. Husco is an american success story. We were present the possibility and prosperity created by strong manufacturing sector come in industry that employs 13 million people and contributes $2.9 trillion to the U.S. economy when manufacturing wins, america wins.
▶ 0:36:56Mr. Ramirez: Our competitiveness depends on decisions made here in washington. We need policymakers to promote a company has a strategy to grow U.S. manufacturing. Such a strategy must include continuing investments in the service transportation infrastructure. Modern, dependable transportation helps manufacturers make and move products.
▶ 0:37:16Mr. Ramirez: The projects generate productivity and reduce demand for manufactured goods, stimulating the economy and bolstering american competitiveness. At husco, we see the spirit art families drive over the roads and bridges improved by -- we see the families driving over the roads and bridges.
▶ 0:37:47Mr. Ramirez: Permitting reform must be a part of any manufacturing strategy. Congress should seize the opportunity to support manufacturers like husco through continued investment. You cannot go back to the fits and starts of highway bill extensions. Our industry needs certainty to invest, plan and higher in america. Manufacturers are ready to do our part.
▶ 0:38:09Mr. Ramirez: We championed the infrastructure investment and jobs act, and at historic effort made possible by the leadership of this community could we commend your leadership now as we look to drive the next highway bill. As we begin the work, manufacturers respectfully encourage you to consider several policy proposals that will support our success. First, we ask that you continued to make robust investments in the service transportation infrastructure.
▶ 0:38:36Mr. Ramirez: We recognize that it is important and support long-term solutions. Congress should strengthen supply chains and manufacturers depend on it. Industry surveys have shown repeated supply chain and challenges for service transportation legislation should continue to expand highway capacity, conductivity, and support our freight network and improvements.
▶ 0:39:02Mr. Ramirez: Finally, congress must make the reforms necessary to make proper -- projects completed. The vast majority of manufacturers say are complex permitting laws impact investment decisions. You need to fix this broken system and stop and list. Doing so will unlock potential of cross manufacturing and empower infrastructure investments that help companies like husco compete.
▶ 0:39:28Mr. Ramirez: As a small manufacturer in the heartland of america, we appreciate the committees work on manufacturing. Manufacturers like us who strongly support your efforts to advance bipartisan surface transportation reauthorization. To put it simply, investments in infrastructure our investments in manufacturing. Our industry depends on the robust, modern, efficient transportation system. You can promote domestic manufacturing by getting the bill done in this congress.
▶ 0:39:56Mr. Ramirez: Thank you for inviting me to testify today to share our story. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:40:02Chair Capito: Now I want to turn to senator kelly, who will introduce our final witness.
▶ 0:40:10Senator Kelly: I'm excited to welcome my friend and the mayor of phoenix, kate gallego to the committee appeared she is only the second woman to be elected mayor of phoenix and is one of the youngest big city mayors in the best. She has a wealth of transportation policy experience that I know will be critical to this committee's discussion today.
▶ 0:40:38Senator Kelly: During the biden administration, she served as chair of the transforming transportation advisory committee and continues to serve as chair of climate mayors, a bipartisan network of nearly 350 mayors across the country who are leading cities to new sustainability goals.
▶ 0:40:56Senator Kelly: As a lead negotiator of the chips and science act, I worked closely with mayor gallegos actually in arizona and bring the title in semiconductor manufacturing company to phoenix. This critical investment is generating thousands of jobs and cementing our state as a global hub for microchip manufacturing.
▶ 0:41:21Senator Kelly: It is also part of the growth that is fueling the region that requires smart investments in transportation infrastructure to keep up. Mayor gallegos thank you for testifying today as we talk about the service transportation reauthorization. I know how valuable it will be to learn from your experience about what congress can do to meet the transportation needs of urban areas while ensuring the structure remains resilient in the face of climate change.
▶ 0:41:54Senator Kelly: I headed back to you.
▶ 0:41:59Chair Capito: Welcome, mayor and we look forward to your testimony. Thank you chairman, ranking member. Senator kelly, thank you for the wonderful introduction. I am grateful for the invitation to testify today on surface transportation reauthorization. I'm honored to share my perspective and offer insight. I've the great privilege of serving as mayor of the fifth largest city in the united states. Within than 1.7 million people call phoenix home, more than the population of 11 states.
▶ 0:42:29Chair Capito: We have a lot of people and a lot of roads, nearly 5000 miles. We own hundreds of bridges. Throughout my time as mayor and before that as a member of city council, improving the transportation infrastructure has been a top priority for me. I served as the chair of the association of governments and helped lead the transit authority.
▶ 0:42:51Chair Capito: I served as cochair of accelerator for america, which operates the national infrastructure advocacy coalition united for infrastructure. Madam chair, we were so grateful to you for keeping off our infrastructure week event this year. I chaired the U.S. dot transforming transformation to that used technology to improve service technology.
▶ 0:43:18Chair Capito: As well as how to best use ai and automation. I serve as chair of climate and worked with 350 of my colleagues towards making a safer and more resilient. The coalition had the honor of speaking with ranking member whitehouse. It was a perfect showcase of how it benefits levels of government. I am excited to speak with you today. The infrastructure and jobs act was revolutionary.
▶ 0:43:53Chair Capito: To increase and well states and tribes and local governments to continue. One thing I know it is top of mind for us is safety with an average of 30,000 crashes annually and an average of two crashes resulting in serious injuries every single day. Phoenix has ranked in the top three for overall traffic fatalities. That is not a point of pride.
▶ 0:44:20Chair Capito: As a mayor, the moments that stick with me the most in this chapter are the tragedies that involve children, both as a mom and local leader, there is nothing worth -- worse than seeing a child get hurt. One moment I will always carry with me is speaking with the father of a young woman who was killed due to a traffic accident. He gave me a picture of her and asked me to work hard to make sure it never happens again. I still have her photo.
▶ 0:44:47Chair Capito: As a result of the safe streets and roads for all program we have been able to address some safety issues on the roads that took his daughter's life. This grant allowed us to implement improving safety measures designed for pedestrians, transit riders and drivers. We also face rising temperatures. Just last week, we get when 18 degrees -- 118 degrees.
▶ 0:45:15Chair Capito: Our highway infrastructure is required to face this reality had on it has to be built to maintain differently. It must meet resilient care program such as protect and the healthy streets initiative with help cities to implement essential initiatives such as cool pavement. Infrastructure benefits our economy and national security.
▶ 0:45:35Chair Capito: When I was recruiting, the largest economic development deal, a semiconductor to come, spoke about investing in infrastructure to support their investment. That mattered. Now investing $165 billion in the city and the federal government has invested with us to support industry jobs.
▶ 0:46:00Chair Capito: The partnership means that we americans now make the most advanced chips in the world again in our country, important for national security. In the upcoming surface transportation reauthorization bill, I hope you will invest in others addition to states. Local governments own and operate more than half of the bridges in the majority of public transit systems.
▶ 0:46:28Chair Capito: Local leaders drive the same roads as constituents every day and we are well equipped to make key investments. It helped cities like mine tremendously and congress should invest in the programs to meet the needs of communities today but phoenix is a growing city whose best days are still ahead of it and with help with congress who has been a key partner of cities, america's infrastructure will be safer, more resilient, better maintained and more responsive
▶ 0:46:58Chair Capito: To the needs of each community. Thank you for your time. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:47:03Chair Capito: Thank you very much. I will kick it off with a general question to everybody on the panel. In each individual wait, you have talked about the importance of the surface transportation network and what reauthorization would mean in terms of economic and job growth.
▶ 0:47:24Chair Capito: I want to dig down on is at the predict ability, affordability, flexibility, what would you point to from your standpoint as governor and then we will go down the panel to how this will impact your economic growth and job creation abilities?
▶ 0:47:47Gov. Armstrong: Thank you, madam chair. All of the above it. We spend money inefficiently and we are required to do that because you go for a decade without any increase in funding and things turned to whatever. The more predict ability and foresight you can push on us, the less money we will spend is to build the same project.
▶ 0:48:14Gov. Armstrong: Would you say predictability would beget this done by september of 2026 so you can have the predictability for the next five or six years?
▶ 0:48:22Gov. Armstrong: Yes, that would be a big goal. Our perspective, each state is different but I don't think any community or state in the country has the amount of money they need to fix their roads and bridges. So they can prioritize projects and know which ones are permitted at the state and county level in the which ones they can start doing.
▶ 0:48:47Gov. Armstrong: The workforce shortage occurs so the earlier you can do that and the more flexibility you can like with senator kramer and his bill and we can move things around to where it is not just about picking winners and losers. It is we know which project is ready to go and we know which one will have to wait another construction cycle.
▶ 0:49:08Chair Capito: Mr. ramirez, how would this impact your ability to grow?
▶ 0:49:13Mr. Ramirez: I mentioned the supply chains. Having surface transportation to those is important. Another big one is facility is outside milwaukee and the main east-west corridor has been caught up in litigation for years. I have employees that spent hours a day stuck in traffic because we can't execute projects we have already agreed to do.
▶ 0:49:39Chair Capito: So that is still waiting to be completed?
▶ 0:49:42Mr. Ramirez: Yes, ma'am.
▶ 0:49:45Chair Capito: That is a major corridor for you. Mayor, do have a comment on how this will impact your ability to run the city?
▶ 0:49:55Mayor Gallego: We all share the goal for the american infrastructure being the best in the world. This committee has moved that forward but we have an enormous backlog. We appreciate the leadership starting early. Certainty helps us, same with the governor that the earlier we can hire the less it costs and the more we can do better. Phoenix is proud to be one of the homes of the mayo clinic.
▶ 0:50:20Mayor Gallego: They are in north phoenix, an area that has infrastructure challenge including a major floodplain, huge bridge where if we can get that built, it would expedite the ability to expand. They have come up with incredible research that has reduced the risk of cancer, heart disease and more. All country benefits from the innovation that is happening there. They need investments in infrastructure to expand and do that work. It is literally life-saving.
▶ 0:50:49Mayor Gallego: Work we are going to faint matters so much.
▶ 0:50:53Chair Capito: You lead me into my next question. This is one of my pet projects and that is bridges. Our nations bridges, I didn't speak for my state personally, we have a lot of bridges and we have some that are considered, you can still use them but another 5-10 years it is questionable whether you will be able to use them.
▶ 0:51:17Chair Capito: And they are so expensive to repair and fix and inconvenience as Mr. ramirez was saying. Governor, does having a set aside for bridges help you or would you rather have the flexibility to decide if you are going to use that for bridges or not?
▶ 0:51:36Gov. Armstrong: The state of north dakota homes simply hundred bridges, 48 hundred total in the state of work put dakota. If you had a set aside, and that with the federal government gave us it would not be enough. I would say we have to do a better job at our level.
▶ 0:51:56Gov. Armstrong: We don't have mountains but you wouldn't build infrastructure for bridges in north dakota in 2025 to same way you did it in 1925. So we can help make a better case to the federal government by saying we are prioritizing these things and this is how we are going to do it. I wouldn't be opposed to a set aside for bridges.
▶ 0:52:17Chair Capito: There is one and has been one and I am committed to that. I would say your point on whether you would rebuild in 2025 as you built in 1925 leads me to my next senator because that is a resiliency portion of the bill that I think is exceedingly important. It saves money and lives and is much safer. Senator whitehouse.
▶ 0:52:40Sen. Whitehouse: Thank you, chairman. Welcome, mayor. I perceiving here. What are the particular challenges that 118 theory blood -- degree weather presents to your transportation system? Can you even wait for a bus in that kind of weather?
▶ 0:53:01Mayor Gallego: Our weather can be dangerous. We had 31 straight days of 110. Workplace safety matters and I appreciate that you both emphasize how important that is. We hope the surface transportation reauthorization makes contracts go forward.
▶ 0:53:23Mayor Gallego: We on the men and women building america and we have to make sure they are structured so that safety is part of the areas we incentivize the most because construction in 118 can be dangerous. We don't want them saying you can't take breaks for water and shade and ability to cool yourself don't matters so much to our community. Similar to north dakota, the way we build bridges today is not the way we built in 1925.
▶ 0:53:53Mayor Gallego: We didn't have the challenge of 31 straight days of 110. Like the flexibility to use payment and construction techniques that make sense for our climate that can deal with the expanding and contracting. We are so grateful that congress appropriated money for bridges. Right now, how it is structured, that money goes primarily to the states and as the governor mentioned, they don't maintain every bridge.
▶ 0:54:23Mayor Gallego: Phoenix maintains bridges directly so we would love to be eligible for the money did we have bridges that things are falling off of right now and want to make sure they are safe and we keep our constituents ready. We want to at least in phoenix want to use building materials that tend to be lighter in color so they don't maintain the dark heat. We just hit 97 as the overnight low.
▶ 0:54:51Mayor Gallego: We used to cool off more at night and building materials matter in that.
▶ 0:54:56Sen. Whitehouse: When I visited phoenix some time ago, I met with the city emergency management and law enforcement people who pointed out that they were having staffing issues in the heat because responding persons to a regular car wreck could require more people because the heat effect on the first responders could be such that they need to beat actually
▶ 0:55:27Sen. Whitehouse: Switched out on a pretty regular schedule, state responding to a fire, for instance. And you need to people there to help cool them down so that the payroll load for the same task had gone up considerably because of the dangers of trying to work, particularly with protective gear on in the environment. Is that still the case?
▶ 0:55:50Mayor Gallego: That is still a challenge for us. We now need to have mobile cooling units on-site at fires so that our firefighters can cycle in and out. Like west virginia, we are home to beautiful mountains. Phoenix is part of the largest urban mountain part of any city, but when the firefighters have to do multiple rescues in a day, it is dangerous.
▶ 0:56:13Mayor Gallego: I have called firefighters who have been hospitalized doing these rescues because it is so hot and often they will have to carry the weight of human beings . We try to pre-position ice throughout the city to cool bodies. It is a real challenge and vulnerable populations are impacted the most by the heat.
▶ 0:56:32Sen. Whitehouse: Mr. ramirez, you mention in your testimony clean school buses, something dear to my heart because in addition to everything else, the school buses have kids in them and they go around neighborhoods and they have fairly standard routes, so they are pretty easy to put a charging schedule on and they don't spew particles and exhaust into neighborhoods.
▶ 0:57:05Sen. Whitehouse: How would we best in a highway bill tried to gather into our decisions benefits that are instantly in the program up for instance kids waiting for the school bus to pick them up, having clean air to breathe at the school bus stop instead of schoolbus exhaust to breathe?
▶ 0:57:32Mr. Ramirez: Anytime you do major investment co. Have to look at the positives and negatives. Our business is making components for automotive applications including school buses. Almost every new product we manufacture has something to do with emissions and efficiency. That is true and the combustion engine side.
▶ 0:57:54Mr. Ramirez: If we can improve every combustion engine by 5%, it has a huge impact on the environment are kids and cities are dealing with just as much as making electric vehicles goat further for every charge.
▶ 0:58:05Sen. Whitehouse: D think the pope -- pollution fee would be feasible?
▶ 0:58:10Mr. Ramirez: I don't know if I have a right way to do it. Considering the environment -- environmental impact is important.
▶ 0:58:18Chair Capito: Senator cramer.
▶ 0:58:23Sen. Cramer: Thank you all, this is been interesting. You've done a great job of answering my questions so I won't repeat them. I will say my first two questions would've been the importance and flexibility within the formula to do the things that are important in a city or state and I appreciate all of that is what we haven't talked about yet is adequate funding, where do we get the revenue from.
▶ 0:58:53Sen. Cramer: It is interesting because as you all know the pain to use this system is what the highway system is built on except it is completely dependent on people who pay gas attacks, largely. And yet not all vehicles utilize gas and even the ones that do utilize less.
▶ 0:59:16Sen. Cramer: And yet this become such a major political struggle, not so much on us but out there because it is so misunderstood. I would like the governor and mayor to talk about any ideas you might have about how we approach whether it is electric vehicles, hybrids and having some sort of a way for them to pay to use the system in a way that is not offensive to everybody.
▶ 0:59:48Sen. Cramer: I will start with the governor.
▶ 0:59:50Gov. Armstrong: I think that you kind of hit it. I will start with the gas attacks part of it. We had a built in the state legislature to raise the gas tax that didn't pass. I think if you are going to raise any tax, use tax, I get concerned about vehicles miles driven.
▶ 1:00:14Gov. Armstrong: I have written 500 briefs on the fourth amendment throughout the course of my life and I don't know exactly. North dakota drives a lot and we are in the top 10. He would negatively impact states like mine but the real conversation about -- I will back up. If you can deploy the money faster, that would allow us to do things faster and that is what I think is the easiest for adequate funding because we don't need as much.
▶ 1:00:44Gov. Armstrong: If we have more flexibility and we can do it quicker, we shouldn't do that. I think it is a real conversation. Every car, combustion or otherwise is driving more on the 18.3 cents that is being taken in. As you get more and more and other vehicles on the road, there is going to be a disparity.
▶ 1:01:07Sen. Cramer: I know some have a fee that is applicable to all vehicles. Is that a way to get to it?
▶ 1:01:13Gov. Armstrong: At the state level, I think that is appropriate. Whatever vehicle that ends up on the road is going to utilize that road and is going to require maintenance and upkeep and all of those things and you can incentivize. There are a lot of political reasons that different people incentivize things.
▶ 1:01:32Gov. Armstrong: We were just talking about school buses in I hope that we actually have schools getting out early and running schools and there are driving 200 to 400 miles a day on that single schoolbus.
▶ 1:01:48Sen. Cramer: Maybe you could address the same thing. With this large dependence on federal funding, it doesn't seem right to mean that certain categories of vehicles are not considered their fair share of the cost and maintaining of the roads.
▶ 1:02:05Mayor Gallego: It is important that we fund it. The leak has produced seven principles around this item. We would like to make sure it is adequate funding. Want to protect privacy, any new solution, technology needs to be ready to go on day one could this is so essential. We have to get it right. I will show the principles in my written testimony but they are a good guide for how we can improve in this area.
▶ 1:02:33Sen. Cramer: On the area of permitting or maybe just reform in general, do any of you have solid closing recommendations for ensuring infrastructure projects do get permitted and move faster while also maintaining a high level of environmental protection?
▶ 1:02:56Mr. Ramirez: This is a really complicated topic. We need deadlines in the regulatory process and we need limited expedited judicial review. If we do that, we will get infrastructure dollars from being approved and allocated and being invested in new projects.
▶ 1:03:17Sen. Cramer: , would you go for that?
▶ 1:03:22Gov. Armstrong: A lot of the fights that are associated with reform don't apply to roads. Try getting a bridge permit. We are not building new ones could we are replacing existing ones but every one of our constituents wants this kind of infrastructure and you don't get into some of the ideological fights that exist in transportation or pipelines in those things.
▶ 1:03:47Sen. Cramer: Thank you all.
▶ 1:03:49Sen. Padilla: Thank you, madam chair. Thank you to all three of you. Mayor, good to see you again. I wanted to recognize that phoenix recently hosted yet another super bowl, which didn't just put the city of phoenix in the international spotlight but places a significant demand on the city infrastructure.
▶ 1:04:12Sen. Padilla: I am asking this question because in the next three years, california will host a couple of super bowl as well as the world cup and the 2020 summer olympics pay based on your experience, what can the federal government do to better support cities as they prepare for the transportation challenges of posting a large companies or events?
▶ 1:04:33Mayor Gallego: Our super bowl was successful because of a partnership with the federal government. We were able to use the new start program to expand the transit system, often with major sporting events, everyone stays until the last minute. That means they are all leaving at once. The transit system was very important for moving people. We were able to in partnership with the federal government expand the tarmac at the sky harbor airport.
▶ 1:05:01Mayor Gallego: We had much more traffic when we were hosting at major event. I didn't want to note that people with private planes apparently left at high rates after the super bowl halftime show which was not obvious to me what happened. New buses were important because we had to dramatically expand our fleet. I should note in past olympics, phoenix has helped other host immunities by lending buses and all working together we can help make sure it is a great experience.
▶ 1:05:33Mayor Gallego: Our country is in the international spotlight and it is in our best interest to make sure that works well. Not in this jurisdiction for the safety dollars you sent a very important we are in a world where every city is investing in vehicle barriers in trying to learned -- learn what happened and that was done in partnership with the federal government.
▶ 1:05:56Sen. Padilla: Back to the super bowl experience, are there any specific flexibilities that could have been additionally helpful for the city that we should consider we craft the next bill?
▶ 1:06:11Mayor Gallego: We would again, because we often build systems for the average transportation users and these events cause such a huge spike, we would love that the federal government understand the variety and look at funding for peak levels because you will hit an all-time peak in every mode of transportation in southern california and we ought to consider that in our planning so that is a way we may need to modernize.
▶ 1:06:41Mayor Gallego: It is important that security dollars in transportation dollars go hand in hand. Our transportation system does have vulnerabilities so we need to plan ahead. We saw during the paris olympics one of the most dangerous safety threats was to the training system so we are to learn from that and plan ahead.
▶ 1:06:59Sen. Padilla: I was there when that happened. Thank you for that. I may have some follow-up on that topic as well as the heat stress and effects and some of the initiatives. I wanted to associate myself with that as a concern and a need.
▶ 1:07:18Mayor Gallego: Thank you for your leadership on that. It will save lives.
▶ 1:07:24Sen. Padilla: Also the current fires out west. In my time remaining, I want to ask the question of Mr. ramirez. The bipartisan infrastructure law provided $2.25 billion for infrastructure development program to strengthen the ports and freight systems. And they are part of a broader effort to expand capacity and keep goods it will be more efficiently and reliably across the country.
▶ 1:07:55Sen. Padilla: You mention in your testimony that supply chain issues are a primary business challenge for nearly one third of manufacturers. Can you talk about the need for continued investment in court if the structure in the efforts to keep goods moving efficiently?
▶ 1:08:13Mr. Ramirez: Husco is global and we have suppliers around the world. We import components from the rest of the world into the U.S. facilities and export products that we make in our U.S. facilities around the world. Certainly ports are naturally critical part of the supply chain infrastructure that we have to deal with. It has been an issue with congestion over the years.
▶ 1:08:39Sen. Padilla: Any questions not just to changes and additions to the port components of transportation legislation?
▶ 1:08:46Mr. Ramirez: Continued investment in technology and how we load and unload can make a huge difference for the ports.
▶ 1:08:54Sen. Padilla: Modern nation and new -- modernization and new source of feel like hydrogen.
▶ 1:09:03Sen. Husted: Thank you, chairman and thank you to offer being here today. I represent the state of ohio. We call ourselves the heart of it all, because we make everything. We have agriculture, manufacturing a lot of things. I will read for a moment that in a recent cnbc ratings of the best states to dupe business, we were number five and got number one rated in infrastructure.
▶ 1:09:33Sen. Husted: I have been involved in those issues, over the years and one of the reasons we are rated number one was because we invested the money and we asked people to sacrifice by paying a little bit more so that we could have quality infrastructure to make roads safer, to make sure the infrastructure it serves our manufacturing capacity and those things matter a lot. And different states take different approaches.
▶ 1:10:02Sen. Husted: Some states have very hot weather that affects their roads and some have freezing and thawing, and we know the salt and all of those things on the roads and it really impacts the things we do. I am just interested in advice from each of your perspective on as we think about our highly infrastructure and what we are doing for roads and bridges and new technologies and adoptions.
▶ 1:10:32Sen. Husted: What advice do you have for us as we consider how to fund those things and regulate those things going forward. I will start with you, governor armstrong.
▶ 1:10:42Gov. Armstrong: My advice to my colleagues went I was here and will always be as a governor who deals with it, set metrics and let us get there. Set reasonable, realistic metrics. Don't prescribe how we make those metrics. In that it exists in everything, but particularly here in the way they do in arizona and north dakota will be different. We have bridge needs and they do.
▶ 1:11:09Gov. Armstrong: We don't have 118 degree heat, we have 60 below wind chill. And a lot of different issues here so I appreciate when we start talking about resiliency and we talk about all of these things come up the hair on the back of my neck goes up because I think it is just going to make it slower and slower and slower. If you can set metrics that are reasonably attainable and don't slow down the process, we will meet them. We know how to do it. We don't want to rebuild it.
▶ 1:11:38Gov. Armstrong: We don't want to have to fix it good that would be the difference or request.
▶ 1:11:45Sen. Husted: We talk about the philosophy of the users of infrastructure paying for we talked about the velocity of the users infrastructure paying for infrastructure. We can't get projects done, nothing is more frustrating than at. Hearing about infrastructure spending but not seeing the projects get completed to meet comes back to permitting and regulatory reform so we can shorten the time between allocating dollars and getting the project completed.
▶ 1:12:17Sen. Husted: Time is money, inflationary costs. He thought you had enough money. I know there are highway at funding in ohio and without we had enough money when we passed the last gas attacks but then the whole inflationary thing happened over the course of time and now that money is not adequate to the task. The longer it takes the last value your money has read mayor
▶ 1:12:44Gallego: We all know we have the most innovative country -- money has.
▶ 1:12:48Mayor Gallego: We all know that we have the most innovative country. I spoke earlier about how we have a backlog of maintenance on bridges paid for us, we are always going to put dollars to safety first.
▶ 1:13:02Mayor Gallego: We have to make sure the roadways are safe but because of some of the discretionary grants we have been able to receive, we are looking at technologies that speed freight traffic and that is good news for america it went manufacturers can get the goods where they are going more quickly.
▶ 1:13:19Mayor Gallego: That is dollars in their pockets and american jobs and the incredible innovation that comes out of the discretionary grants will put our country and a great place to continue to lead the way.
▶ 1:13:32Sen. Husted: I'm going to run out of time. I like the idea of setting the metrics and it is a solid approach to doing this and everything we can do to save you time it would be helpful. Any other thoughts, governor?
▶ 1:13:47Gov. Armstrong: I will reiterate what Mr. ramirez said. None of this works without streamlining permitting. Don't have to start -- stop infrastructure everywhere just in one spot. If there is a road from ohio and north dakota come they can stop in minnesota, north dakota, ohio.
▶ 1:14:12Sen. Husted: Thank you.
▶ 1:14:15Chair Capito: Senator blunt rochester.
▶ 1:14:18Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you, madam chair, and thank you to the panelists. I've heard from folks open down my state about their priorities for the next transportation reauthorization bill, and your perspectives and this hearing is really very helpful as we craft it.
▶ 1:14:40Sen. Blunt Rochester: My colleagues have heard me mention the reconnecting communities program before, and this program addresses physical barriers and connects people to jobs, essential services, and economic opportunities while correcting historic injustices and harms to communities due to past infrastructure decisions. Our goal is to make the best decisions for all of us.
▶ 1:15:05Sen. Blunt Rochester: I was grateful to get this into this -- this program into the bipartisan infrastructure laundering my time in the house. Mayor gallego, the city of phoenix received one of the last rounds of rcp planning awards. Can you tell us a little bit about the canal street project and why the funding is essential?
▶ 1:15:26Mayor Gallego: Thank you. Phoenix is grateful for your leadership on this project. It makes so much sense for us. And maybe a surprise to some people, phoenix has more miles of canals than venice. The canal system was really important for delivering water infrastructure to farms in phoenix's early days, but it has become an important transportation corridor. Unfortunately, there is major conflict now with rail.
▶ 1:15:53Mayor Gallego: There is not a safe way across the rail in one part of the grand canal. It also has a real challenge with the freeway. Unfortunately when you don't get people a safe way to cross, they still cross. And so the reconnecting communities grant really helps us to make sure we can do that in a way that keeps our residents safe when you have a major crash, including fatalities along rail. It shuts down the rail system. We are so grateful to have that support.
▶ 1:16:22Mayor Gallego: These projects are normatively complicated, -- enormous the complicated, and we couldn't deliver it without federal partnership.
▶ 1:16:31Sen. Blunt Rochester: Can you talk about what will happen if we fail to reauthorize the reconnecting communities program? With the city of phoenix be able to deliver on this project?
▶ 1:16:38Mayor Gallego: Unfortunately, this project is enormously complex, and we really need the federal partnership. I should take the time to say thank you, because these investments allow us to save lives. I get to meet the people who live along the way and you don't have to worry about their kids running across our rail anymore. You don't always get to, so on their behalf, thank you.
▶ 1:17:01Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you for sharing that. I think there are members on both sides of the dais who have multiple projects that will benefit, including in my home state, the top of my state wilmington all the way down to our rural counties in georgetown, delaware. It is vitally important. We want to continue this. I will be introducing legislation to get this done, and I urge my colleagues to join me in expanding the reconnecting communities program in the next transportation bill.
▶ 1:17:31Sen. Blunt Rochester: I would like to shift gears a little bit to digital infrastructure. Mayor, you also spoke a little bit about encouraging smart technology and ai, and I would love to ask you and the governor how could increased investment in digital infrastructure, things like radar-based detection systems at intersections, live travel advisories, contribute to safety and mobility on our roads alongside traditional physical infrastructure?
▶ 1:18:03Gov. Armstrong: Just -- I think piggybacking a little bit of what the mayor said on safety, our legislature raised our speed limit and raise our fines, but that is probably not the safest part of the bill. We are doing digital speed limits and requirements when we have adverse weather, which is snow, icy roads. We can do that in real time now.
▶ 1:18:29Gov. Armstrong: I think if you are about mileage and costs we are looking at running our entire state fleet through an ai program busy how we buy cars, where we parked cars, are we driving them too much, are we not driving them enough. There israel opportunities to do a lot of these things. -- there is real opportunities due to a lot of these things.
▶ 1:18:51Gov. Armstrong: Knowing what your traffic flow is in knowing where is it, doesn't mean like in a verbal state like north -- rural state like north dakota and on these because you can prioritize how you are spending money.
▶ 1:19:03Mayor Gallego: We have been lucky to receive federal support for advanced signals. Signal technology is so important to the city of phoenix. We can give our firefighters signal priority so they get where they are going more quickly. If you are experiencing a stroke, the amount of time on your brain does not receive blood is really important. Seconds matter. Giving firefighters a little bit of an advantage matter so much.
▶ 1:19:27Mayor Gallego: We also have a real challenge with, unfortunately, pedestrian fatalities and red light running. There is technology today that we are going to be able to install things to the infrastructure and jobs that infrastructure and jobs thact that can stop a signal if someone is in the intersection and save a life. I had a very important boss who was killed in one of these accidents. And I hope my work as mayor of phoenix will mean that fewer people will have to go through that. But your investment in this technology helps us save lives.
▶ 1:19:57Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you, madam mayor. I will be pushing for digital infrastructure formula funding and holy that will save more lives. I yield back, adam schiff.
▶ 1:20:06Chair Capito: Thank you. --I yield back, madam chair.
▶ 1:20:11Chair Capito: Thank you, senator boozman.
▶ 1:20:16Sen. Boozman: Kevin armstrong, and arkansas 43% of our residents live in rural areas, and we ranked third for rural pavements in poor condition. Some federal programs can make it harder for states to target those basic rural road needs.
▶ 1:20:37Sen. Boozman: From your perspective, how can congress better structure funding programs to give states more flexibility to invest where it is most needed, especially for rural safety and road conditions?
▶ 1:20:48Gov. Armstrong: The one thing I've learned about all of this is that funds are fungible. The more you are doing in the specialty programs, the less likelihood that places like rural arkansas and rural north dakota -- it is not whether or not they qualify. They will not comply. We are not interested in the other side of it.
▶ 1:21:13Gov. Armstrong: I would say that the more flexibility you give on a real basis for recognizing it is not always population based, it is economy-based, economies of scale based. One thing is recognizing that rural infrastructure is more expensive per mile than urban infrastructure in a lot of ways. It is hard to deliver whatever service it is to that last mile.
▶ 1:21:44Gov. Armstrong: Oftentimes that last mile is producing a ton of economic activity that the world needs. Farm equipment is getting heavier, trucks are getting bigger, economies of scale in that industry are going up. Making sure we are not -- all of these things are worthy to debate and discuss, not at the expense of places that are producing things that just don't have -- we don't have barriers to connecting communities other than 100 miles.
▶ 1:22:14Sen. Boozman: Along the same line, governor, you are well aware that the programs that bring delays and extra costs because of burdensome applications and uncertain timelines. However, some major projects and a verbal highway upgrades are critical freight corridor doors are too expensive for states in which you just alluded to. That is why large competitive grant programs are so big when used well.
▶ 1:22:45Sen. Boozman: What are your thoughts on the effectiveness of the need to cut red tape and make sure federal dollars get on the ground faster?
▶ 1:22:55Gov. Armstrong: We appreciate the grant programs as much as we can get them, yes. The quicker you can deploy the money -- I don't know if you will find a governor that will get block grants as -- but not at the expense of formula funding. The more flexibility we are given and that is better. We've utilized the grant programs -- we care about ports, too, north dakota. We care about them a lot.
▶ 1:23:25Gov. Armstrong: Our products get there and we need them to get there. At the same time we need to have a more reasonable and reliable cost analysis for the next construction season so we can better spend the dollars you sent to us.
▶ 1:23:39Sen. Boozman: Mr. ramirez, you know firsthand that strong infrastructure is critical to manufacturing competitiveness. Rural areas it is a significant share of the nation's manufacturing and farming output. Population decline and drinking tax bases make it harder to modernize roads and bridges.
▶ 1:24:02Sen. Boozman: What investments were policy reforms would help manufacturers in rural states remain efficient and connected to the national and global markets?
▶ 1:24:11Mr. Ramirez: Thank you, senator, great question, and it's true, most things don't get manufactured in big cities. Most manufacturers across the country -- I feel like a broken record, but I think the key is around permitting reform. Not just getting dollars allocated, but projects completed.
▶ 1:24:31Sen. Boozman: Thank you, madam chair.
▶ 1:24:33Chair Capito: Senator sullivan.
▶ 1:24:36Sen. Sullivan: Thank you, madame chair welcome, witnesses. You will see a theme on permitting reform. This committee has a long real positive history of producing significant bipartisan infrastructure. I am really hopeful that we can -- the chairman and ranking members leadership, we can do that again with this highway bill. But the key has got to be permitting reform.
▶ 1:25:05Sen. Sullivan: Even my friends on the other side of the aisle, who, let's face it, oftentimes resist it because you've got far left radical environmental groups who love the fact that it takes 10 years, because you can't build anything -- they do, that's a fact, I see it in my state all the time. Governor, let me start with you. My state, alaska's resource rich, infrastructure poor.
▶ 1:25:31Sen. Sullivan: We have less road miles than connecticut and we have one on dish we are 120 times -- we are 120 times bigger than connecticut and have more natural resources than connecticut.
▶ 1:25:46Sen. Sullivan: How can we ensure that a highway bill for the whole country takes into account places like my state or your state that have huge resource potential but not nearly the number of roads that we need, that the rest of the east coast has? 82% of the communities in alaska are not even connected by a road. How do we make progress in that regard?
▶ 1:26:12Gov. Armstrong: I think the first and most important answer is equitable formula that gives states maximum flexibility on how to spend their money. Secondly, I think there is two ways infrastructure gets beat up, how heavy is it -- those are the two ways infrastructure gets beaten up. The things you're doing in alaska are pretty heavy. And they're pretty important.
▶ 1:26:41Gov. Armstrong: And so recognizing that you factor those things in, but eventually I think -- I think the answer -- the simple portion, the implication is hard, but the simple portion is having an equitable formula that gives states the maximum amount of flexibility and certainty.
▶ 1:26:57Sen. Sullivan: Mr. ramirez, let me go to permitting reform. It is such an important issue. The supreme court and the infrastructure coalition v. Eagle county was a great course correction, saying, look, this is a procedural, not a substantive law. You don't need 10,000 pages in 10 years. We had a gold mine in alaska.
▶ 1:27:26Sen. Sullivan: The kensington mine is now employing 450 people in southeast alaska. It is producing gold for america. It took 20 years to permit. We had a big infrastructure development project on the peninsula, a road that took 36 years to permit. I think it was a world record on nepa slowness.
▶ 1:27:54Sen. Sullivan: I think even my colleagues on the other side of the aisle who have always blocked permitting reform -- that is the dark, deep secret here. You have my democrat colleagues, "hey, we want permitting reform," but you go to them with common sense approaches and they don't do it because the far left groups tell them not to. But I think even my democrat colleagues now want to see this because they see everything, renewables, any project is blocked by this real bad implementation.
▶ 1:28:21Sen. Sullivan: Nepa had a good goal at the beginning, but it's been totally abused and hijacked by groups that don't want to build -- and certainly don't want to build in my state. What are the real key elements -- by the way, we got some nepa reform in the budget reconciliation bill. I really want to thank the chairman for staying on that. It's pretty good, actually. But what would you say are the key elements that I hope my democrat colleagues can get behind on nepa reform that everybody in the country wants?
▶ 1:28:51Sen. Sullivan: Every democrat governor, every democrat mayor. I'm sure the mayor here wants it. It's nuts that it takes 10 years on average to permit a bridge. No wonder why china is kicking out but on so many of these things. What would you think are the key elements of nepa permitting reform we need for this bill?
▶ 1:29:12Mr. Ramirez: You, senator. I would offer to principles. What is going upfront to have a regulatory process that has deadlines because they can't go on forever.
▶ 1:29:25Sen. Sullivan: Both at the agency level and the court level.
▶ 1:29:29Mr. Ramirez: The second part. Deadlines for the regulatory agencies and having the expedited review process so it cannot be tied up in litigation forever. You apply those principles across the regulatory system.
▶ 1:29:42Sen. Sullivan: Very common sense. I hope my colleagues on the other side of the aisle embrace those because they are common sense. The whole darn country wants them. Let's not let some far left groups who always hate nepa reform drive the agenda for america. No one wants 10 years to permit a bridge, 20 years to permit a gold mine. That is what nepa has done to our country. Thank you, madame joe.
▶ 1:30:06Chair Capito: Senator kelly.
▶ 1:30:09Sen. Kelly: Mayor gallego, thank you for being here. As you know better than anybody, phoenix is an urban heat island experiencing higher temperatures than the surrounding rural areas due to the lack of vegetation and the use of asphalt and concrete that absorb a lot of the heat.
▶ 1:30:35Sen. Kelly: An estimated 45% of metro phoenix residents live in an area where the urban heat island effect raises temperatures by about 8 degrees or more. This is why I worked to include the healthy streets program, which I think you mentioned in your opening remarks. We put that in the bipartisan infrastructure law, which would fund an initiative such as school pavement projects that mitigate the effects of the extreme heat.
▶ 1:31:04Sen. Kelly: Bicycle -- why is it critical to fund programs that help vulnerable cities like phoenix be more resilient to the effects of extreme heat?
▶ 1:31:13Mayor Gallego: Thank you for your leadership on that program. We are at the point where we have to adapt cities to harder environments. Phoenix talks to cities all around the country including in the northern most parts of our country about he challenges. This is a national problem and we appreciate you coming up with the national solution. The heat can be deadly. We are losing more americans to heat than any other type of natural disaster. Our infrastructure funding has not caught up with that reality at ayet.
▶ 1:31:44Mayor Gallego: Even the coldest states in the country have had a terrible heat waves with incredible loss of life. We know the solutions. Building material changes, design changes that can save lives. Your program will help cities, rural communities, tribes get the funding to make those changes, many of which require us to design infrastructure very different way.
▶ 1:32:06Sen. Kelly: I had a roundtable back in phoenix on a stream he just last week -- on extreme heat or just last week, and the number of deaths nationwide from extreme heat exceed every other natural disaster combined. It is a real problem that -- and it is also associated with a thing we are going to talk about next year. A little bit about energy. It's our grid.
▶ 1:32:33Sen. Kelly: The grid goes down in phoenix, the estimates that somewhere maybe up to half of the residents of the city will wind up in an emergency room if it happens during a certain time of year in the summer when the heat is the highest. I want to talk about mentioning electricity. Data centers, chip manufacturing, other industrial expansion in phoenix is putting pressure on our infrastructure.
▶ 1:33:05Sen. Kelly: As our population grows to fuel this technology boom, how does our electrical and transportation infrastructure needed to respond? And this is transportation, maybe you should focus on that.
▶ 1:33:22Mayor Gallego: We are seeing a huge boom in data center and advanced manufacturing just in the phoenix metro. The data centers have requested 32 gigawatts of new electricity. The amount of damage -- the impact of would have on a street with all of these construction -- these are huge construction sites. We have it in many cases up against residential, so very high impact and you are seeing a lot of truck traffic.
▶ 1:33:56Mayor Gallego: Water is a different impact. The amount of infrastructure investment is something we need to talk about. Data centers are very vulnerable to heat. The cooling impact --
▶ 1:34:06Sen. Kelly: And to put the 32 gigawatts into perspective, the current srp in aps, two utilities, provide 16 for the entire county right now. So the requested over a number of years -- I think it is five to 10 years -- exceeds what is currently --
▶ 1:34:27Mayor Gallego: We are not talking about enough as a country what does it mean if in a few short years we are asking utilities to completely replicate themselves. I'm so grateful you are paying attention to the infrastructure side about it, because the amount of traffic in areas that have not seen traffic, we should talk about hazardous materials on our streets. They will be going places they haven't, and it may be time to have new conversations about that. The data centers.
▶ 1:34:57Mayor Gallego: There is a conversation in arizona and other states about small modular reactors. That would put nuclear material in areas that have not seen a nuclear material before. Phoenix is the fifth largest city in the country. Our transportation department needs your support to navigate that, as to our firefighters and others who will need new types of training, if we are going to see this change. We have to look at how it impacts our street network.
▶ 1:35:22Mayor Gallego: There might be some time where we also reduce regulation, particularly around semiconductors. There is hazardous material and regulation we might update to make it a little bit easier to do business. But it really is time to look at the types of material that would be traveling on streets that have never seen it before and how we have the appropriate regulatory system from the federal government for these issues.
▶ 1:35:46Sen. Kelly: Thank you, mayor. Thank you for being here.
▶ 1:35:48Chair Capito: Senator ricketts.
▶ 1:35:50Sen. Ricketts: Thank you, chairman captio, thank you for your dedication to a transportation reauthorization bill. Hearings like this are invaluable as we were to address legislation that will address key infrastructure issue. Thank you, chairman capito and ranking member whitehouse, for holding today's hearing, and thank you for the witnesses.
▶ 1:36:18Sen. Ricketts: Governor armstrong, welcome to washington. I have talked before this committee about flexibility in the next reauthorization, and I'm looking for ways to be able to ride that flexibility through the infrastructure supply chain. You are from an agricultural state, as I am. Agricultural products are a large part of the infrastructure advantage we have. It is especially true in nebraska.
▶ 1:36:44Sen. Ricketts: One of the things I found as governor is it was the road, not the people who drove on the road. We have $9.9 billion in exports every year. I'm sure north dakota has got a lot of agricultural exports as well. Transporting these goods is vital for both of our states and the country's economic growth. That is why I introduced the variance act with my colleague senator schiff.
▶ 1:37:10Sen. Ricketts: This would allow a 10% variance for vehicles transporting dry bulk goods. You cannot necessarily keep corn and soybeans over every axle. It gives flexibility and increased efficiency and safety and cost effectiveness as well. This is one that I hope in many ways we can get the ep committeew to go forward on.
▶ 1:37:38Sen. Ricketts: Governor armstrong, where have you expensed regulatory roadblocks, and how can congress address these things in the next reauthorization?
▶ 1:37:46Gov. Armstrong: I will deal with when we haven't talked about yet, which is rail. The thing with rail is we are trying to get our friends on the coast to get our products to port. Eventually you run into bottlenecks. Sometimes it is a state line with different political ideologies. Sometimes it is just a place in which you cannot get it in the ground.
▶ 1:38:12Gov. Armstrong: We can build a front and in your infrastructure and north dakota has done a great job of that. Eventually we can only build our infrastructure out enough that it could get through montana, idaho, washington, to the port. Understanding that the ability to do those things only works in north dakota if it works all the way to where it is going.
▶ 1:38:37Gov. Armstrong: The more you create that -- senator ricketts, you will understand this -- I want as much competition in the marketplace for my ag producers as humanly possible. Another one, we should hold our frenemies accountable for the empty shipping containers floating around the world on a daily basis. That is one thing that is not always front of mine, but it affects the transportation site and cost side of our producers getting things to markets.
▶ 1:39:06Sen. Ricketts: Just on that issue, have you found you have trouble getting continues to north dakota?
▶ 1:39:13Gov. Armstrong: Yes, either trouble and supply or trouble in cost.
▶ 1:39:17Sen. Ricketts: Thank you you for the feedback on that. I know that working with this union pacific is headquartered in nebraska. They have had issues transporting coal regulations blocking that. Go state rules are blocking just the pass-through -- local state rules are blocking just the pass-through.
▶ 1:39:43Gov. Armstrong: For all the expenses of the interstate commerce clause -- I don't have a port and north dakota.
▶ 1:39:50Sen. Ricketts: Point well taken. Thank you, governor. Mr. ramirez, you are the president and ceo of a manufacturing company. I'm sure you have run into various issues as well. One of the problems we have had in nebraska, the project can be all the way through the permitting process, including endangered species consultations, but if the status of the species changes before the final nepa approval, the whole thing is gonna start all over again.
▶ 1:40:18Sen. Ricketts: You mentioned a couple of issues to senator sullivan with regard to bigger-picture things, making sure we have timelines to put limits on litigation. Are there other specific things like what I just described that would be great reforms to think about as we go through a permitting process reform?
▶ 1:40:38Mr. Ramirez: The concept of categorical exclusions is another one brought up earlier. Particular types of infrastructure having certain types of environmental reviews, that strikes me as a commonsense way to expedite the process without giving up the robustness citizens expect for citizens expect f.
▶ 1:40:56Sen. Ricketts: Thank you very much.
▶ 1:40:58Chair Capito: Senator alsobrooks.
▶ 1:41:02Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you to chair capito and ranking member white house for holding hearing, and thank you to the witnesses for joining us. Surface transportation is a vital part of everyday life, connecting people to jobs and essential services will decades of underinvestment have left much of our country's infrastructure in poor condition , leading to traffic congestion and safety concerns.
▶ 1:41:26Sen. Alsobrooks: The bipartisan infrastructure law sought to address these issues by providing unprecedented investments to create a more reliable, sustainable, and equitable transportation network while creating jobs. For maryland, which is my state, this meant dedicated funding targeted to repair thousands of miles of deteriorating roads and structurally deficit bridges.
▶ 1:41:49Sen. Alsobrooks: This piece of legislation also provided over $1.7 billion for public transit, helping to modernize buses, trains, and rail lines, and providing funding to programs that seek to improve transportation, equity, and safety.
▶ 1:42:04Sen. Alsobrooks: As the ranking member of the epw subcommittee on transportation infrastructure and a member of the banking committee, I look forward to working with my colleagues to ensure that the next authorization provides long-term predictable investments that repair our aging infrastructure, improve safety, and support economic development. My first question is for governor armstrong. Welcome, governor.
▶ 1:42:27Sen. Alsobrooks: Many rural counties, including those in maryland, face unique challenges when it comes to roadway safety, like long stretches of unlit roads, limited emergency response, and aging infrastructure. I wonder whether you believe that current federal safety programs provide states with sufficient flexibility to effectively address these unique risks.
▶ 1:42:48Gov. Armstrong: I'll like it better if yours and senator cramer's bill passes.
▶ 1:43:01Sen. Alsobrooks: Yes, exactly.
▶ 1:43:03Gov. Armstrong: The different things that exist -- I said this regarding bridges. We have to do a better job of building out safety corridors as well. Recognizing that delivering and it is really difficult if there is four feet of snow -- recognizing that delivering services to rural areas is really difficult and it is really difficult if there was is four feet of snow on the ground.
▶ 1:43:31Gov. Armstrong: One of the things that is unique to a place like north dakota is you have a bad winter and late fog and all of a sudden I have a county problem and dot problem that nobody knew about until may 1. If you are restricted in how you utilize the money available to you, you are legitimately fixing things that would go 25 spots down the priority area because you are not allowed to use the money.
▶ 1:43:55Sen. Alsobrooks: I totally get it. I was a former county executive of my county, and I understand so well what you described. Next I have a question for mayor gallego. The federal highway administration's protect program is a critical new funding source for states and cities working to strengthen the reliance of their infrastructure -- resilience, I'm sorry, of infrastructure.
▶ 1:44:21Sen. Alsobrooks: Marilyn has used this funding to strengthen at-risk and evacuation routes. I wonder if you could talk about how you tackle the broader challenge of infrastructure resilience with heat and climate--related risks.
▶ 1:44:39Mayor Gallego: Thank you so much. We are thrilled to have someone who understands local government advocating for the protect program. We have hit record after record in terms of heat, and air infrastructure was not built without in mind. Was not built with that in mind. The protect program, just as it helps you with sealevel rise, helps us with infrastructure that may literally melt because of the heat.
▶ 1:45:03Mayor Gallego: It allows us to invest in more advanced building materials that are more heat-resilient and don't maintain the heat as much. We are going to need to redesign our network for hottera environment. Protect gives us the chance to try innovation.
▶ 1:45:20Mayor Gallego: I would very much like phoenix to be the lead in developing the technologies for transportation future about heat resilience, which I think will become more important to the community, an protect allows us to be innovative, take risks, and do things we have not done before, as well as deploy solutions we have proven work.
▶ 1:45:38Sen. Alsobrooks: You know, next I would like to go back to governor armstrong. The federal highway administration's emergency relief program is a vital federal tool for storing damaged infrastructure and ensuring safety after disasters like the bridge collapsed, and as you know firsthand, marilyn had the ke --maryland had the key bridge collapse. I wonder if north dakota has benefited from this program.
▶ 1:46:09Sen. Alsobrooks: If you could talk quickly about it.
▶ 1:46:10Gov. Armstrong: We utilize -- I say this tongue-in-cheek -- what other people call climate change, we usually call tuesday. We can have 100-degree swings in october in the same town.
▶ 1:46:25Gov. Armstrong: We have utilized it -- the last time I remember was the 2011 flood when our capital city flooded, and utilizing the fund -- capital city of the state of north dakota, we have bridges, highways, county roads that without the federal government's help, we would not have been able to recover that resource
▶ 1:46:45Was Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you so much.
▶ 1:46:46Chair Capito: Senator markey, I will give you a second, but you are up.
▶ 1:46:51Sen. Markey: How debate about the surface transportation bill must begin with the question, what do americans want out of their surface transportation system. And I think it is fair to say they wanted to be safe. They want it to be affordable. And they want a system that is not further exacerbate the climate crisis. Let's evaluate how we are performing in these categories.
▶ 1:47:20Sen. Markey: On the topic of safety, our transportation system is a disaster. 40,000 people are dying every year on our roads, and this is no accident. Many of our roads are designed only for fast-moving cars, not for pedestrians, cyclists, or public transit, all of which are safer modes of travel, with the right infrastructure in place. So that's a failure.
▶ 1:47:49Sen. Markey: Let's examine transportation affordability. On this front, too, we are feeling. The department of transportation estimates it costs americans $12,000 a year to own and operate one automobile bit $12,000 a year. Many communities are left without other viable transportation options, requiring family to travel by way of car for almost every trip, increasing their costs. That is a failure.
▶ 1:48:20Sen. Markey: And then of course when it comes to sustainability, our system is performing poorly. The transportation sector is the largest contributor to greenhouse gases in our country. We have a system that invests more money and expanding highways than it does in building sustainable infrastructure. That is a failure.
▶ 1:48:47Sen. Markey: Our communities feel these failures every day in higher costs, worse air quality, a deteriorating climate, and the loss of loved ones in car crashes. So, mayor gallego, do you agree that local communities most directly feel the pain of our failing transportation system? We would just love to get your expert view on that issue.
▶ 1:49:12Mayor Gallego: Thank you. We are faced with the climate crisis right now in phoenix. We had a month straight above 110 last year. We had 118 this month. Your constituents might put mittens on their children in the winter. We do it in the summer because of people buckle can burn your hand. -- a seat belt buckle can burn your hand.
▶ 1:49:41Mayor Gallego: 118 is hot enough, it is too hard for some hard for so have to address this and designed a transportation system that is resilient, have the right building materials for roads, make sure the transit hubs are safe we appreciate your leadership on this.
▶ 1:49:59Sen. Markey: And we are seeing as well in new england the. The gulf of maine, we call it boston harbor, is the second fastest warming body of water in the world. We are seeing it. It is setting up conditions for a catastrophic storm. Absolute disaster. We are seeing it. No one can escape this. I agree with your testimony.
▶ 1:50:26Sen. Markey: And that is why I am soon going to be reintroducing my green streets act, which would reimagine how we prioritize transportation infrastructure investments. The bill would require states to invest in infrastructure like walking and biking and public transit that will reduce emissions, bring down costs, and prevent more loss of life.
▶ 1:50:50Sen. Markey: The bill would also require states to maintain their facilities in a state of good repair before expanding highways further. Well-maintained roads are safer and better for emissions and they mean fewer potholes, flat tires, broken axles for american travelers. The green streets act is a climate bill, but it is also a safety and it is also an affordability bill as well.
▶ 1:51:18Sen. Markey: Research indicates a 20% reduction in the number of miles traveled by car in this country would reduce vehicle fuel and maintenance costs for the average american family by roughly $2000 annually. More importantly, the same reduction in miles traveled by car would save 180,000 lives by the year 2050 in our country. If there is anything more american than an automobile, it is consumer choice.
▶ 1:51:46Sen. Markey: American families deserve a publicly funded transportation system that affords them a choice to travel safely, affordably, and sustainably. I look forward to working with my colleagues on this committee, with you, madam mayor, with all concerned citizens in our country to ensure that the next surface transportation bill addresses these issues. Thank you, madam chair.
▶ 1:52:11Chair Capito: Well, thank you. I think we are coming to the end of our hearing. I appreciate everybody's -- your testimony. I think there is a lot of similarities in what everybody's saying from the different standpoints of where you are. Permitting is something that senator whitehouse and inr staffs talk about almost -- and I and our staffs talk about almost daily, and this is at the heart of efficiency of how dollars can go farther than they can put with that, I have no more comment.
▶ 1:52:42Chair Capito: Do you have a comment?
▶ 1:52:43Sen. Whitehouse: Just to emphasize the comment I repeatedly make, which is that any bipartisan bill that does either surface transportation or permitting reform is going to have things in it that one side likes more than the other side likes. The nature of compromise on large pieces of legislation.
▶ 1:53:08Sen. Whitehouse: It is essential to going forward -- essential to going forward is some level of trust that the implementer of the legislation will be an honest implementer. If we continue to live through this selective refusal to release appropriated, obligated funds, if we're going to have to deal with and implementer that will favor only the fossil fuel projects but not the clean energy projects, that is a huge
▶ 1:53:38Sen. Whitehouse: Deterrent to getting this done. I'm not saying anything new here, it is obvious to anybody who has ever been involved in a negotiation where the implementer has to be trusted to make it work. We are not at that place yet by any stretch but I would nevertheless instruct my team to go forward and get big bills done, and we can get through that gate when we need to.
▶ 1:53:59Sen. Whitehouse: But I don't want anybody to be cut by surprise later on when we come to that gate and we don't see an implementer we can trust and things come to a halt that is unexpected or surprises anybody. We are going forward in good faith. The chairman has been very good to work with. I think we can have some confidence that we can do the big things.
▶ 1:54:21Sen. Whitehouse: But at the end of the day there will be a gate we have to get through, and that gate will be no more monkeying around with faithful execution of the laws for partisan or special-interest purposes, simple as that. Thank you.
▶ 1:54:36Chair Capito: Thank you, senator whitehouse. I can't resist, but the irony of what you just said describes the pain I felt over the last four years, because the way we run the highway bill, the way the implementation and the guidance that went through went far afield from what the intent of the bill was. But we can argue about that and I understand what you are saying. I think you are right. But I think you are right only because we have lived through this over the last four years.
▶ 1:55:06Chair Capito: With no further questions, I would like to ask a witness and all my colleagues for your participation today. Senators who wish to submit written questions for that I could have until 5:00 p.m. On wednesday, july 30, to do so. The witnesses' responses are due back to the committee no later than 5:00 on wednesday, august 18. With that the hearing is adjourned, thank you all very much. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap.org]