An oversight hearing to examine the Federal Bureau of Investigation

DOJ and Judicial Nomination VotesSenate Judiciary · September 16, 2025 · 119th Congress

Transcript

Highlights

▶ 0:14:26Chair Grassley: Welcome, Mr. patel and all of the people here to observe. This is our annual fbi oversight hearing.

▶ 0:14:40Chair Grassley: We meet today in the aftermath of the political assassination of charlie kirk, a school shooting, and the senseless murder of ukrainian refugees and also to remember several weeks ago the killings in minnesota. Charlie kirk was a man of god, faith, family and country.

▶ 0:15:06Chair Grassley: I pray for his wife erica, children, the whole family, god bless you carly -- god less you charlie kirk. I've asked director patel for an update today on this manner as we proceed with the hearing, director patel, I would like to note that you have agreed to 110 minute round of questioning.

▶ 0:15:33Chair Grassley: It is more time than your predecessor agreed to when director wray testified here, he left early and went on a family vacation and he wanted me to think it was business he had to conduct. You have been acquainted with the bureaucracy you must reform and hold accountable, and that is no simple task.

▶ 0:16:04Chair Grassley: You began the important work of returning the fbi to its law enforcement mission. According to the fbi, since january 20 of this year, the fbi has been involved in the arrest of more than 23,000 violent criminals.

▶ 0:16:28Chair Grassley: This year, the fbi assisted in the arrest of more than 15 hundred child predators and 300 human traffickers. And this year the fbi helped rescue more than 4000 children from predators. Fbi teams nationwide are working beside immigration and customs enforcement.

▶ 0:16:55Chair Grassley: This teamwork has resulted in the arrest and removal of a historic number of violent criminal aliens, gang members and child sex offenders. Those are overwhelming better records than at least two of your past predecessors. During the wray era, the bureau allocated resources from child clients to january 6 work.

▶ 0:17:28Chair Grassley: You have removed agents from headquarters to better assign -- align with their law enforcement mission. Under your leadership, the fbi has apprehended several most wanted fugitives and secured the extradition of senior leaders of the central american gangs like ms 13.

▶ 0:17:59Chair Grassley: It is well understood that your predecessor left you in fbi infected with politics. I'm going to provide examples of that today, including making public new whistleblower records. At your nomination hearing, I made public records that whistleblowers provide me about arctic frost.

▶ 0:18:27Chair Grassley: That was the case open and approved by anti-trump fbi agent . It then became jack smith's elector case against trump. It shows that arctic frost with much broader than just an electoral matter.

▶ 0:18:54Chair Grassley: The case was expanded to republican organizations. Some examples of the group that wray fbi sought to place under political investigation included the republican national committee, republican attorney general's association and various trump political groups. In total, 92 republican targets

▶ 0:19:26Including Rep. King: Groups and republican links individuals were placed under investigative scope of arctic frost. And that political list was one of charlie kirk's group, turning point usa. In other words, arctic cross wasn't just a case to politically investigate trump.

▶ 0:19:51Including Rep. King: It was the vehicle by which partisan fbi agents and department of justice prosecutors could achieve their partisan ends and improperly investigate the entire republican political apparatus.

▶ 0:20:13Including Rep. King: So today, senator johnson and I are making these records public for the entire country to see, and I hope a lot of people are interested in is seeing what governments can do when various agencies have a political agenda . My investigative work has also expose the political way in which peter navarro was investigated and prosecuted.

▶ 0:20:40Including Rep. King: When the agent found out that biden's doj would prosecute navarro, he said wow, great. That is a quote unquote. So I have obtained an auto -- audio recording of a special agent and special agent sebastian.

▶ 0:21:09Including Rep. King: Gardiner's delivery of a subpoena to navarro. I am making that audio public today. In a court document file by the department justice, navarro's interaction with the fbi was unfairly described as quote unquote, the word combative. That intervention with navarro was just the justification to later aggressively arrest him.

▶ 0:21:42Including Rep. King: Then we get to the clinton annex in the durham annex. The clinton and showed that the coney fbi had evidence necessary to complete the clinton investigation, the one about hurt Ms. hanley of emails and classified information, but the fbi never did its job because it never reviewed the evidence at that time.

▶ 0:22:09Including Rep. King: The durham annex showed that the clinton campaign had a plan to falsely tightrope to russia, yet the coney fbi failed to investigate that information. Instead, the coney fbi used the discredited clinton campaign funded steel dossier to advance crossfire hurricane against trump.

▶ 0:22:37Including Rep. King: Director patel, thanks in large part to you, both annexes were finally declassified. That maybe history but history to make sure we don't repeat the history of the past. And the people ought to be concerned when the weaponization of government is used in this way, whether it is done by republicans or democrats.

▶ 0:23:05Including Rep. King: Last congress, I made public in fbi document called "10 23" that alleged a bribery scheme with the biden family. Today, the fbi has never answered congress whether they investigated the text messages, the audio files and the financial records referenced in that 1023.

▶ 0:23:33Including Rep. King: Whistleblowers have provided my office with two additional fbi 1023 documents. These documents memorialize statements from fbi sources. These two new 1023 documents are from separate fbi confidential human sources during different years.

▶ 0:23:58Including Rep. King: So in total, we now have three different fbi confidential human sources providing information about the biden family and potential criminal conduct. Today, senator johnson and I are releasing these records. Let me say this for the partisan media, the people that are supposed to be policeman of our republican form of government.

▶ 0:24:30Including Rep. King: We aren't saying the allegations are true, we want to know what the fbi did to fully investigate their veracity or lack thereof and what they concluded. Let's put this matter to rest one way or the other. Starting with my chairmanship, I give one example after another at -- of disgraceful partisan weaponization by federal law enforcement.

▶ 0:25:02Including Rep. King: Since the trump administration took power, many fbi agent's have been removed. The removal included agents and prosecutors who became partisan weapons that lost their way and I made records public to prove it. Many of my whistleblowers were aggressively retaliated against by some agents who were subsequently fired.

▶ 0:25:30Including Rep. King: One fbi whistleblower said of these terminations "ensuring that they no longer work at the fbi isn't retribution, it's responsible leadership." that brings me into my final and favorite topic, whistleblowers.

▶ 0:25:53Including Rep. King: In august, 10 of my fbi whistleblowers secured compensation because of your leadership, director patel. It included a mix of reinstatement to the fbi, reinstatement of and monetary compensation.

▶ 0:26:22Including Rep. King: At the beginning of this month, another of my fbi whistleblowers got their job back. All told across government agencies, almost 20 whistleblowers have received fixes to their retaliation.

▶ 0:26:40Including Rep. King: Today, you will get a lot of grief from some members of this committee, but in the short amount of time you've been director, you have corrected whistleblower retaliation, increased transparency within any other fbi director I have seen, whether that fbi director was appointed by republicans or democrats, and I have been around here more than anybody else on this committee. I yield.

▶ 0:27:11Including Rep. King: >> thanks for harry -- holding this oversight hearing during the history of the bureau of investigation. I held for hearings within fbi director wray when I was chairman.

▶ 0:27:30Including Rep. King: As a reminder to the republicans who say that biden weaponize the fbi, he retained director wray, a lifelong republican who was president trump's nominee for the office. After his second election come in an unprecedented move, he forced out wray and nominated director patel. He came to the fbi with a political mission and he spelled it out in writing in detail.

▶ 0:28:03Including Rep. King: He wrote, government gangsters, the rot at the core of the fbi is not just for scandalous, it is an existential threat to our republican form of government. With the power of his office and the blessings of the president he attacked the ethic with a vengeance. Mr.

▶ 0:28:23Including Rep. King: Patel had falsely claimed the fbi "was planning january 6 or a year." he even went so far as to produce a song by the january 6 rioters who violently assaulted police officers in the cap cap police officers in the capcapit.

▶ 0:28:50Including Rep. King: Former director molar patel called an utter swamp creature. Former trump officials who served with Mr. patel warned us he would weaponize the fbi to protect the president's allies and target his critics and indeed, director patel has inflicted untold damage on the fbi, putting our national security and public safety at risk.

▶ 0:29:16Including Rep. King: Since january 20, the trump administration has engaged in an unprecedented purge of fbi officials could as we heard from highly credible whistleblowers, Mr. patel was involved in directing the purge even before he was confirmed, despite his sworn testimony to this committee. It began with terminations of -- and forced retirement of about six nonpartisan career officials who run all six branches of the fbi. The executive assistant directors.

▶ 0:29:46Including Rep. King: Since then, at least 18 of the 53 special agents in charge of field offices have been removed along with many other senior officials. Individual agents have been targeted for termination simply due to the work they were assigning such as january 6 investigation.

▶ 0:30:07Including Rep. King: According the to the former acting director driscoll and a lawsuit filed last week, director patel made it very plan telling driscoll personally "his own job dependent on the removal of agents who worked on the cases against the president." and even the he knew the nature of the summary findings were likely illegal.

▶ 0:30:30Including Rep. King: At the same time director patel has installed mag eight loyalists any key positions, including danby gino -- dan bond gino -- dan bongino.

▶ 0:30:55Including Rep. King: He has required loyalty test and make dozens do polygraphs and whether they made it negative comments about him personally. As is often the case in the trump administration, the rules apply to thee and not to me.

▶ 0:31:17Including Rep. King: As we have heard key members of the team have disqualified alerts on their initial polygraph exam. How did they survive? They survived because a personal waiver by the director or the attorney general to remain employed by the bureau. Understand the context. Political operatives in key positions given the routine polygraph exam failed and had to received waivers to continue their positions.

▶ 0:31:49Including Rep. King: They were lucky to keep their political appointments. But the 5000 career civil servants the director has forced out of the ranks were not offered that same courtesy. 5000. This max exodus has created cybersecurity, connor sturgeon's -- counter intelligence.

▶ 0:32:12Including Rep. King: My office has shown that the cuts will buy it -- me by half despite the ever increasing threats by foreign actors. It is exacerbated by director patel's misuse of fbi personal resources to focus on other priorities of this administration.

▶ 0:32:35Including Rep. King: According to reports, for 25 largest fbi field offices have been ordered to divert 45% of their agents from their primary missions to work on the mass deportation of immigrants. Just as concerning as director patel's plan to hire fewer qualified agents, by removing the college degree requirement and reducing the new agent training at quantico from 18 weeks to just eight, so we have a brain drain and a significant

▶ 0:33:07Including Rep. King: Watering down of the training. Quite a record, Mr. patel. As others have worn, fast tracking and improperly train people into national security jeopardizes the bureau's ability to effectively protect america. Director patel himself had no training or life experience for this position. The results of that incompetence is staggered -- staggering.

▶ 0:33:35Including Rep. King: After attorney general bondi said the epstein client list was "sitting on my desk or now to review," director patel diverted more than 1000 fbi personnel from critical missions to work on 20 four hour shifts reviewing over 100,000 pages of epstein-related records.

▶ 0:34:00Including Rep. King: These personnel were instructed to flag any records in which president trump was named but that review ended in an unsigned memorandum from doj and fbi stating simply there is no incriminating client list sherry director patel still has not responded to my letter from two months ago asking about his role in this cover-up.

▶ 0:34:22Including Rep. King: And the day of the horrific shooting of charlie kirk at utah valley, director patel sparked mass confusion by incorrectly claiming that the shooter was in custody which he had to walk back with another social media post. Mr. patel was so anxious to take credit for finding Mr. kirk's assassin that he violated one of the basics of effective law enforcement come at critical stages of an investigation, shut up and let the professionals do their job.

▶ 0:34:56Including Rep. King: Director patel forced out a counterterrorism expert was 20 years experience who would've led this high-profile investigation. The men and women who serve at the fbi in the american people deserve a director who has the ability and character to restore the bureau to its place as the preeminent law enforcement agency. I want to close on a personal note. I came of age in the 1960's.

▶ 0:35:24Including Rep. King: We experienced a number of horrific assassinations including president john kennedy , senator robert kennedy and Dr. martin luther king. We are going through a similar period of political violence in all of us in his public life on both sides of the aisle have a responsibility to bring down the temperature and work to unite the american people.

▶ 0:35:49Including Rep. King: Let's be clear, republicans are not nazis and democrats are not people. Democrats are not responsible for the murder of charlie kirk and republicans are not responsible for the murder of melissa hortman. Political opponents are not our enemies, we are all americans and we should be working together to keep the american people safe and protect the constitutional rights.

▶ 0:36:14Thank You Chair Grassley: , Mr. chairman.

▶ 0:36:16Chair Grassley: Would you please stand so I can swear you in. Do you affirm that the testimony are about to give before this committee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god?

▶ 0:36:29Dir. Patel: I do.

▶ 0:36:32Chair Grassley: Please be seated and you can give your statement.

▶ 0:36:35Dir. Patel: Good morning Mr. chairman, senator durbin. It is good to be with you today I want to provide a briefing into the tragic assassination of charlie kirk. It is important at this at the I is as transparent as possible without jeopardizing investigations. Charlie kirk was shot at 12:23 p.m. On september 10. I think this timeline is critically important.

▶ 0:37:03Dir. Patel: Less than a date later the fbi under my direction released the first set of images of the suspect that we cap should do to our analysis on the ground. Later that evening, while conducting extensive interviews and cell analysis and find out evidence response teams and collecting evidence in a lifetime and flying it back to laboratories for immediate analysis, we were able to extract video from the campus feed and it might direction at

▶ 0:37:34Dir. Patel: 8:00 p.m. In partnership and promised to working with the public to bring this fugitive do justice, we released a never before seen video of the suspect. He also released new enhanced photos of the suspect.

▶ 0:37:50Dir. Patel: A few hours later, that suspect was in custody, pursuant to the interrogation of the suspect's own father who stated, "when I saw that video that you released, I recognized it was my son, and I confronted him and he was handed over to a lawful law enforcement agencies." that is the fbi working with the public as a promise to be transparent and provide critical information in the manhunt for the suspect or suspects involved in charlie's assassination. We received over 11,000 tips in the first 24 hours alone.

▶ 0:38:22Dir. Patel: We received 16,000 submissions to our digital and tip lines. That is a large number of material to go through. I want to thank president trump and attorney general pam bondi for their unwavering support in putting resources to this and all investigations. I want to especially thank our colleagues in utah, governors, dps and the sheriff's. State and local partnership has been the cornerstone since I took over at the fbi and it was no different here.

▶ 0:38:49Dir. Patel: Our teams in salt lake city across the country, lab technicians in quantico who raced to complete the evidence analysis of the public could have the answers they need, these people worked through the night without sleep for days on end. They are to be commended and not to be attacked. And many more people I don't have time to think today. I want to thank the american people especially.

▶ 0:39:13Dir. Patel: The mission of the fbi is for them and with them and by and with and through them and it is that mission in the east coast that I brought to this investigation in so many others and that is why that suspect is in custody. We cannot do our job without the american public and credible reporting in the media and that is why he is in custody today about to face charges. Last time I appeared before this committee was in january for my confirmation.

▶ 0:39:38Dir. Patel: I told you then that if confirmed I would provide into everything I can to provide a safe and secure america. I promise to provide the courageous men and women in the fbi and resources to crush out crime and defend the homeland and to full transparency to over south and account -- oversight and accountability so we could restore trust in the fbi. That is what I have done good we have arrested 23,000 violent criminals.

▶ 0:40:05Dir. Patel: That is more than twice for the same time period from last year alone, 23 thousand, more than twice from the same time period from last year. With taken over 6000 illegal -- and identified 47 child victims, within 4700 child victims have been found by this fbi, a 35% increase from the same time period last year.

▶ 0:40:34Dir. Patel: 1500 child predators have been arrested, a five percent increase from the same time last year. 300 human traffickers have been arrested, that is a 10% increase from the same time period last year. Over 350 members of foreign terrorist organizations have been arrested and we have 40 two ongoing cases. That is a 250 percent increase from the same time last year.

▶ 0:41:02Dir. Patel: Those are just some of the things the fbi is it differently and better because we are leading the mission to crush violent crime. We have also arrested for top 10 fugitives from the fbi's top 10 most wanted list. To put that in perspective, that is the same amount I have captured in seven months than my predecessor did during the entirety of the biden administration. Those are real results and the credit goes to the men and women of the fbi.

▶ 0:41:31Dir. Patel: We have been able to achieve these results because appleyard recognizes violent crime doesn't just happen in washington, D.C. when my first decision as director is to get the professional staff into the field I have done that with great speed. Everyone of your districts and states have received special operators to the tune of almost a thousand.

▶ 0:41:55Dir. Patel: We did that because crime had unacceptably exploded across the country. In fact, one of the stats that the american people should thank the fbi the most for is we are on track to have the lowest murder rate in modern american history, lowest murder rate by at double digit percentages. A major factor in the drop of this violent crime is the flagship operation summer heat.

▶ 0:42:27Dir. Patel: We used this initiative at the direction of the president and attorney general surging resources to major cities across america, conduct and intelligence-based operations to target the worst of the worst, to target the gangs and transnational organizations in the drug trafficking cartels. We have taken them out city by city. There is a lot of work to be done but we are off to a great start.

▶ 0:42:54Dir. Patel: Just ask the citizens of seattle, charlotte, chicago and some other places, specifically in new orleans in nashville alone, there has been an increase in violent crime arrests by average of 250% for each of those cities. There's been a drastic reduction in crime across the board in major cities across the country thanks to the men and women of the fbi. How are we doing that? We are attacking the drug epidemic.

▶ 0:43:22Dir. Patel: With seized a thousand kilograms of math -- meth and cocaine and fentanyl of the streets. 1600 kilograms of fentanyl, a 25% increase from the same time last year. To put things in perspective, that is an offense known to kill one third of the american populace.

▶ 0:43:47Dir. Patel: We are also going after the companies that manufacture the precursors overseas in places like mainland china and they're cutting agents. This month in cincinnati, we announced gronk -- groundbreaking charges aimed at the individuals and businesses responsible for flooding the opioids in the precursors and cutting agents into the streets of america.

▶ 0:44:08Dir. Patel: For the first time I can remember, we are charging the businesses and enterprises not just in america but in china and seizing their necessity to make money by seizing their cryptocurrency wallets. We are having a new field mission and we are committed to keeping our nation safe from terrorism, cyber checks and foreign adversaries.

▶ 0:44:34Dir. Patel: Whether stopping threats by terrorist organizations or by sponsor nationstates, this year we have made 60 counterintelligence arrests, 60 counterintelligence arrests, a 30% increase from the same time period from last year. I'm proud one weekend share successes when we caught a naval officer spying for china.

▶ 0:45:09Dir. Patel: A lot of the good work they do will not be able to be discussed good we are attacking malware infrastructure, delivering a new partnership with the private public sector and with the companies who are attacked by these foreign adversaries and nation actors and individual enterprises from around the world. We are combating ransomware and cyber threats the fish and aces -- the nation faces.

▶ 0:45:39Dir. Patel: We are also arresting people such as one who was suspected of supporting isis and sending money. We are going after the new form of modern terrorism, 76 for crimes that involve harming our children and by going after them online and causing self-mutilation, suicide, sexual abuse and steering them in the wrong direction.

▶ 0:46:06Dir. Patel: Currently we have 3500 international terrorism investigations. Specifically we have in this country 1700 domestic terrorism investigations, a large chunk are nihilistic violent crime. The fbi has seen a 300% increase in cases opened this year alone versus the same time last year.

▶ 0:46:32Dir. Patel: In the last couple of months the fbi secured a guilty plea for man in tennessee who attacked an energy facility with drones and explosive and secured eight cartel leader. The folks in sacramento collaborated with partners to secure a guilty plea for the leader of a transnational investigation. The bureau's job is not done. I am committed to this transparency. Mr. chairman, you alluded to our work with congress.

▶ 0:47:04Dir. Patel: In the seven months I have been fbi director, we have produced 33,000 pages to the united states congress, 33,000 pages. My predecessor in his seven-year term issued 13,000 pages to congress and his predecessor issued 3000 pages in his four years. We are going to keep going. I'm dedicated to restoring the trust that the public has needs and the integrity at the fbi and it is being done everyday at the men and women of the fbi.

▶ 0:47:35Dir. Patel: I know there is a lot of talk about epstein. I am here to testify that the original sin in the epstein case was the way it was initially brought by Mr. acosta. It involved a very limited search warrants and didn't take as much investigatory material as it would have seized. It was limited to small time periods to include 2002-2005 in 1997 to 2001. Mr.

▶ 0:48:05Dir. Patel: Acosta ought epstein to complete a nonprosecution agreement which then the court issued mandates and protective orders legally prohibiting anyone from ever seeing that material ever again without the permission of the court. A nonprosecution agreement also barred future prosecutions for those involved at that time of those individuals.

▶ 0:48:26Dir. Patel: Still, this administration at the direction of president trump has done more to turn over the credible information that we are legally able to do so and we will continue to work with congress on that end. Thank you for your support for our mission to working to jointly deliver transparency and congressional oversight to the united states. I want to close with the president's initiative here in washington, D.C. is an example of what we are doing around the country.

▶ 0:48:56Dir. Patel: I think the next city is memphis. 21,000 arrests in D.C., huge decrease in violent crime, 60% decrease in gun crimes in washington, D.C. in the last month, 70 4% decrease in carjackings in washington, D.C. in the last month, 53 percent decrease in homicides in washington, D.C. in the last month. The drugs are disappearing.

▶ 0:49:20Dir. Patel: People are freely walking around the state and we are restoring the nation's capitol to its glory. Perhaps most notably for investigations, and washington itself it was the intelligence the fbi gathered through our sourced network in D.C. that help us identify the suspects in the horrific murder of the D.C. intern.

▶ 0:49:46Dir. Patel: We were proud to be a part of that investigation and proud to put the resource to bear at the fbi. In closing, Mr. chairman and ranking member and members of the committee, I am honored to be the ninth director of the fbi. I am not going anywhere. If you want to criticize my 16 years of service, please bring it on.

▶ 0:50:13Chair Grassley: I have observed whether it is republican or democrat's want a yes or no answer that the witness and the senators talking over each other, so I thought what I would do it this time rather than have that happen is if there is something you don't get a chance to answer because of the demeter of a republican or democrat

▶ 0:50:43Chair Grassley: Senator -- the demeanor of a republican or democrat senator, I will give you a chance to fill in that you didn't get a chance to say afterwards. Since 2019, I have sought greater transparency about jeffrey epstein and the government handling of the matter. I have continued to investigate during this congress.

▶ 0:51:15Chair Grassley: Director patel, was jeffrey epstein working for the intelligence in which governments?

▶ 0:51:27Dir. Patel: I can only speak for the fbi and he was not a source for the fbi.

▶ 0:51:33Chair Grassley: Would you release all that epstein related matters to my office?

▶ 0:51:40Dir. Patel: I will give all that I can under the court orders.

▶ 0:51:46Chair Grassley: It seemed to me I accept her answer but the broader intelligence community ought to answer these questions as well. Victims deserve an answer.

▶ 0:52:04Chair Grassley: Regarding the initial fbi 1023 document that I made public last congress, that document mentioned text messages, audio recordings, and financial records that allegedly approved a bribery scheme with the biden family and foreign interests. Regarding those records, did the wray fbi make any effort to determine whether they existed.

▶ 0:52:35Chair Grassley: Did the wray make any effort to obtain those records?

▶ 0:52:39Dir. Patel: Not to my knowledge, Mr. chairman.

▶ 0:52:42Chair Grassley: Since the matter has not been fully investigated, the fbi has an obligation to the public to do exactly that and figure out why it wasn't investigated. Next question, I've done a lot of oversight relating to sexual misconduct by the fbi agents, in fact I believe this is something I discussed with wray in one of his appearances before the committee.

▶ 0:53:09Chair Grassley: According to the fbi inspection division, it opened nearly 300 investigations based on sexual misconduct referrals between 2017 and 2020 for 2017 and 2020 4, according to whistleblowers the wray fbi dropped the ball. One accusation of sexual misconduct's too many, of course.

▶ 0:53:36Chair Grassley: Are you committed to reviewing the bureau policy to ensure responsible responses to credible allegations of misconduct that they are swift and adequately protecting victims?

▶ 0:53:48Dir. Patel: Yes, Mr. chairman.

▶ 0:53:51Chair Grassley: During child crimes and sexual misconduct related investigations, are any private sector companies less than cooperative with you and what the improvements in information sharing need to be made to catch those criminals?

▶ 0:54:09Dir. Patel: Mr. chairman, we can always do better with private sector companies. I've reached out to the leaders of most of them asking them to provide more material so we can be responsive and take legal action and protect the youth of this country. I'm happy to discuss possible legislation we can do to allow for these companies to continue.

▶ 0:54:28Chair Grassley: Say it may be one inch up on that microphone. I think you are close enough but just a little lower. When you raise your at it is difficult to hear. Director patel, since 2021 I raise concerns about the biden administration's failure to properly vet afghan evacuees.

▶ 0:54:53Chair Grassley: Director gabbard informed my office that as of august 2022, 1600 evacuees located in the united states had ties to terrorism and other derogatory information. That is why I and many others have opposed bills giving blanket approval.

▶ 0:55:14Chair Grassley: Are you aware of what steps your predecessor took to investigate these evacuees, and what steps have you taken to investigate them, and what, if any, national security concern still exist?

▶ 0:55:26Dir. Patel: I cannot speak to the steps my predecessor took but I will make sure we do a sweeping review and get back to you on that. As for the afghan refugees and evacuees, during my tenure, we are going to the databases to make sure that no known or suspected terrorists enter this country to harm our nation.

▶ 0:55:51Dir. Patel: And my result as fbi director, one of my first acts we undertook was a manhunt of where the bombers and leaders in a crime spree that killed 13 brave americans. And within two weeks, we caught were the leaders and brought them to justice here in two weeks from pakistan. So my commitment to you in all matters is complete and without order.

▶ 0:56:16Chair Grassley: Through my and other investigations we found that the biden administration lost files -- thousands of undocumented children. We never heard a peep from senators wanting to help find them, even after I invited them to do so.

▶ 0:56:34Chair Grassley: In september 2025, the health and human services announced the creation of an inner agency crime coordinator to find these and other missing children. That interagency group reportedly includes your agency.

▶ 0:56:55Chair Grassley: What resources and personnel have the fbi assigned to this new interagency effort, and what steps has the fbi taken to assist in locating missing children that the incompetent biden administration lost?

▶ 0:57:08Dir. Patel: Protecting our youth is maybe the top priority for the fbi. As it specifically relates to your question, as I stated, we have searched resources across the nation to the field office to locate children who have been trafficked, victims of sexual abuse and we have located 4700 children in the seven months since I have been fbi director.

▶ 0:57:35Dir. Patel: That is a 35% increase from the same time period from last year and we are not stopping and we are committed to doing that on our tribal lands as well and we are fine victims of child abuse victims in every county in district and we are not going to stop.

▶ 0:57:51Chair Grassley: I am releasing documents with sender johnson with arctic frost and it shows the scope expanded to include 92 republican organizations. From evidence I have seen, it looks to meet like another political hit job against republicans. What steps is the fbi taking to ensure improperly predicated investigations and weaponization's like this don't happen again?

▶ 0:58:18Dir. Patel: The simple answer is the fbi will only bring cases that are based in fact and law and have a legal basis to do so. Anyone that does otherwise will not be employed at the fbi. We are doing a prospective and retrospective analysis of victims who may have weaponize the department and agency. As I committed to you during my conversations with you and in my confirmation hearings, the fbi will not be weaponized on either side of the aisle anymore.

▶ 0:58:45Chair Grassley: I raised concerns about the fbi use of restricted access and prohibited access systems. According to the fbi, when search teams that exist in a prohibited access status cases are searched and the particular

▶ 0:59:17Chair Grassley: Search will receive a false negative search response. Clearly this is not only affects fbi agents, it impacts requests and court cases and the biden administration used it to work oversight. How are you ensuring that restricted access and prohibitive access files are produced to congress during court cases and have you identified any biting family records that are restricted and?

▶ 0:59:48Chair Grassley: Prohibited status? -- and prohibited status?

▶ 0:59:54Dir. Patel: Everything we can legally provide to congress we will. We restructured how the prohibitive cases are labeled and provided access to more people in the chain of command so more people have knowledge of what the restricted and prohibitive cases are including myself and the deputy.

▶ 1:00:13Chair Grassley: Do you commit to providing any records available?

▶ 1:00:17Dir. Patel: I do, sir.

▶ 1:00:19Chair Grassley: You publicly it said your team "found a room that comey and others hid from the world and the hoover building full of documents and computer hard drives no one had ever seen or heard of." that is a quote from you. I received a whistleblower report that it contains some information outside of fbi record-keeping.

▶ 1:00:48Chair Grassley: I also have informed during a whistleblower disclosure that the room included materials related to special consular molar, former -- special inspector mueller and others. Has the fbi analyzed those improperly recorded the documents in the records are clearly responsive to my colleagues congressional

▶ 1:01:19Chair Grassley: Requests? What steps have you taken to ensure all responsive records are produced to congress? That has to be my last question.

▶ 1:01:27Dir. Patel: Leadership is supposed to pursuant to the records act correctly store the records that are information management division. In this room we found a plethora of hard drives, computers, hard documents, soft documents that were not so recorded, a voluminous amount of information. We are continuously processing that information.

▶ 1:01:53Dir. Patel: So we subscribe to the records act and commit that those records will be kept permanently at the fbi. We are reviewing those materials and a lot of those are related to ongoing investigations. And we are on a rolling basis providing congress the documents we can and will continue to do so.

▶ 1:02:10Chair Grassley: Thank you very much.

▶ 1:02:14Sen. Durbin: In addition to the perch of nonpartisan career fbi official reports, reports indicate that dozens of officials have been subjected to polygraph exams to test their loyalty.

▶ 1:02:32Sen. Durbin: My understanding is approximately 40 officials have been asked to sit for a polygraph during your administration and several have been asked whether they have ever made negative comments about you fbi agents pledged loyalty to the united states do not you personally. What is the basis for requiring polygraphs in the workforce and asking them if they made negative comments about you?

▶ 1:02:56Dir. Patel: I don't know what reports you are referring to, ranking member and I reject any reporting that has false information in it so I am not going to respond to that. As far as polygraphs go, they have always been utilized at the fbi to track down those who leak sensitive information and have unauthorized disclosures to the media and we will continue to use them to make sure the integrity of the fbi.

▶ 1:03:21Sen. Durbin: Did any on your advisory team or who serve in positions on the seventh floor received disqualifying alerts on the polygraphs?

▶ 1:03:30Dir. Patel: Senator, I am not going to get into the personnel discussions that were had on a polygraph. Those are private discussions and many relate to ongoing investigations.

▶ 1:03:41Sen. Durbin: Did you are bondi given him waiver so they could stay employed?

▶ 1:03:51Dir. Patel: I will have to get back to you.

▶ 1:03:54Sen. Durbin: You don't remember that?

▶ 1:03:57Dir. Patel: I am happy to talk about the good work the men and women are doing including the lowest crime rate. She hardly seen a 30% reduction. The inter-agency departments and the men and women of the chicago pd have never been more empowered.

▶ 1:04:21Dir. Patel: Have you seen my testimony where I always lead with the interagency partnerships with state and local law enforcement is the pillar of what I am doing. On the seventh floor for the first time in fbi history I haven't installed police officers and sheriffs on my seventh floor to report to us every day what's going around the country on the street level because that is a priority of the fbi and is the only way we are going to work. I don't take credit for anything but I will defend the men and women of the fbi and the cops that help us get it done.

▶ 1:04:49Sen. Durbin: Director patel did with ever make a complaint with cam bondi that they were pulling up records?

▶ 1:05:00Dir. Patel: I'm not familiar with that whistleblower.

▶ 1:05:06Sen. Durbin: Are you familiar there was a whistleblower?

▶ 1:05:08Dir. Patel: I'm not familiar with the whistleblower.

▶ 1:05:13Sen. Durbin: She also push them to review 100,000 esteemed related records on an arbitrarily short deadline in march. The fbi was directed to flag any documents that mentioned president trump. Nothing came of that until july until a an unsigned memorandum was releasing there was no client list. Why was the july 7 memorandum unsigned?

▶ 1:05:38Dir. Patel: Would you have preferred I use the auto pen? The memorandum had the insignia of the department of justice and the federal bureau of investigation and in our effort to secure transparency for the american people because of three prior administrations had not done so, we conducted an exhaustive search with everything for the epstein cases and produce what was legally permissible to release including subpoenas.

▶ 1:06:06Sen. Durbin: Did you personally direct that so you would sign such a -- of the epstein records for any reference to president trump?

▶ 1:06:15Dir. Patel: Again, you're citing reporting that I think is baseless. We conducted an investigation of the epstein case files pursuant to the direction of the president and administration to provide all credible information and are working with congress pursuant to a subpoena to turn over all the documents we can.

▶ 1:06:36Sen. Durbin: Who was responsible for drafting the conclusions?

▶ 1:06:38Dir. Patel: Many individuals at the department of justice.

▶ 1:06:42Sen. Durbin: There was no lead person?

▶ 1:06:45Dir. Patel: The attorney general leads the department and in the fbi.

▶ 1:06:50Sen. Durbin: So the attorney general responsible for that?

▶ 1:06:54Dir. Patel: The attorney general leads the department of justice.

▶ 1:06:57Sen. Durbin: Much like you, dan bongino made stamp -- substantiated statements. He called the placement of pipe bombs outside of dnc and rnc on january 6 an inside job and went on to say it was a set up.

▶ 1:07:26Sen. Durbin: I have zero doubt and whoever goes into the fbi, you better get an answer. What is the evidence to suggest the pipe bombs placed outside of the dnc and rnc on january 6 for an inside job?

▶ 1:07:46Dir. Patel: So many on this are jettisoned.

▶ 1:07:52Sen. Durbin: Can you answer the question?

▶ 1:07:55Dir. Patel: You -- I am going to answer the question. The pipe bomb investigation is ongoing and I will not discuss the details of the pipe bomb investigation. He was a secret service agent for 15 years and a police officer for five. I served in multiple administrations for 16 years. We were also private citizens and are now back in government service.

▶ 1:08:17Dir. Patel: We had the ability to set aside our personal beliefs to deliver justice for this country and we are doing it day in and day out and I find it disgusting that everyone and anyone who jettisoned our 31 years of combined experience at the home of the fbi delivering historic results at a store expense for the american people.

▶ 1:08:34Sen. Durbin: So you have no evidence?

▶ 1:08:37Dir. Patel: I have a lot of evidence and I will give it to you when I can.

▶ 1:08:41Sen. Durbin: There is a new york times story about chris meyer. I understand he was your personal pilot at least for some period of time. He has quite a record in self pity flew over at three to 50 hours as an air force pilot on three aircraft -- he has quite a record.

▶ 1:09:01Sen. Durbin: He flew over 350 hours as an air force pilot and was in the invasion in iraq, participated in firefights and followed up with deployment as a reservist to afghanistan working interrogated taliban officials. It seems you've terminated them. Why?

▶ 1:09:24Dir. Patel: I am not going to get into personal decisions we made.

▶ 1:09:28Sen. Durbin: So you're not accountable for decisions of those who served admirably and terminate them without cause?

▶ 1:09:36Dir. Patel: That is a one-sided story. Anyone terminated failed to meet the needs and uphold their constitutional duties. You are giving a one-sided story and it is disgraceful. The men and women of the fbi's are. Now you're attacking the leaders that are brave. They are doing the job that this country needs. We will continue to do it.

▶ 1:10:05Sen. Durbin: It is disgraceful when they served our country so well were terminated apparently because of that rants of a podcaster.

▶ 1:10:15Dir. Patel: That is your opinion. It is not a fact.

▶ 1:10:19Sen. Durbin: Let me ask you to explain the situation in baltimore, if you will or did you read the story about the termination of the project in baltimore? The 764 group, both were agents investigated. Are you familiar with that?

▶ 1:10:39Dir. Patel: No, sir.

▶ 1:10:42Sen. Durbin: I will not go into detail but apparently this group, 764, nihilistic violent extremists group seeks to blackmail children to perform vile acts and it was terminated by you. Respond in writing as to the circumstances of that termination.

▶ 1:11:08Dir. Patel: Sure, our operations against them has been historically high and he waited taken down many including 76 force who were harming children and causing them to be mutilated.

▶ 1:11:20Sen. Durbin: Can you explain why you are eliminating the requirements for a college degree for your agents?

▶ 1:11:25Dir. Patel: I appreciate the opportunity to address that. You said we are reducing the training requirements at quantico. We are not, we are expanding them. You are referring to a crossover program because I believe the men and women at the dea and secret service who once worked at the fbi should deserve that opportunity and a shortened program which we provided. We are also keeping the 18 weeks as traditionally held at the fbi good we are not reducing any requirements.

▶ 1:11:55Dir. Patel: We are increasing those we bring in.

▶ 1:11:57Sen. Durbin: Did you change qualifications for college degrees?

▶ 1:12:01Dir. Patel: We are aligned police officers who have served for a number of years to come into the fbi who did not get the college degree to apply to be federal agents because we feel they have a street-level experience we need to conduct this mission.

▶ 1:12:14Sen. Durbin: I yield, Mr. chairman.

▶ 1:12:17Chair Grassley: I have to respond to the business about you not treating in properly, because I served under the previous administration when democrats willingly turned a blind eye to the biden administration retaliation against my whistleblowers. They didn't get due process when their careers and lives were appended. I -- upended.

▶ 1:12:51Chair Grassley: They were removed from their positions. They were reportedly had revoked securely -- security clearance.

▶ 1:13:10Chair Grassley: It was said that some leaderships were responsible for what happened to me and my family, ensuring they no longer work at the fbi isn't retribution, it is responsible leadership. Another whistleblower that is a registered democrat said they spoke out against abuses and security clearances processes committed by fbi senior leaders, particularly veltri and perkins.

▶ 1:13:41Chair Grassley: In their security c1 I'm going to put some more examples like this in the record so I don't take up more time from colleagues. Dr. welcome to the committee, the number sort of speak for themselves. You've done a lot in a small amount of time. All those folks out there making this happen, thank them for me.

▶ 1:14:06Chair Grassley: As to how to be an fbi agent, you made a decision that local law enforcement folks, people who served in law enforcement without a college degree grable to apply, is that correct?

▶ 1:14:17Mr. Patel: Yes sir. >> makes sense to me. Experience out in the field might be as valuable as a college degree later in life. Venezuela. We are blowing boats out of the water in the caribbean because they are connected to international narco terrorist groups, is that correct?

▶ 1:14:41Mr. Patel: Yes, that mission is being led by the department of defense. >> what legal authority to we have to do that?

▶ 1:14:49Mr. Patel: I would defer those questions to the attorney general. >> fair enough. Do you believe that madero runs a narco terrorism state in venezuela?

▶ 1:15:00Mr. Patel: I believe based on the intelligence and prosecutions and investigations we are currently running, a large portion of the cocaine that exits south america, its origination point is venezuela and using shipment points to haiti, they are using the navigable waterways in the caribbean to the in-state delivery which is the united states of america and we will hunt down every single one of those narco traffickers.

▶ 1:15:24Mr. Patel: >> that is an indictment of an turo -- madero as an individual for being involved with that.

▶ 1:15:32Mr. Patel: I think you are referring to the dea indictment. >> the point is, would it be fair to say that venezuela is a good candidate to be labeled as a state sponsor of terrorism under U.S. law?

▶ 1:15:43Mr. Patel: From my perch, we will provide the intelligence necessary for anyone who meets the threshold to be a state sponsor of terrorism. >> I think they are, so we will be going down the road. China. On a scale of one to 10, one being nothing, 10 being rate, how is china helping with the fentanyl problem in the united states?

▶ 1:16:06Mr. Patel: Under this administration we taken I've highlighted in the cincinnati case the precursors are the problem. The fentanyl is the in-state that kills american citizens. >> the precursors are made in china.

▶ 1:16:19Mr. Patel: In china. For the first time in a decade I had a counter -- call it my counterpart to attack the precursor chemical companies and have those labels -- >> is it too early to reap the success?

▶ 1:16:33Dir. Patel: We've indicted multiple businesses and cut off the transshipment point of those precursors. They switch. Once we got in the track about the delivery routes to the mexican drug cartels directly they started going to india. We called the indian authorities, they shut down those ship and points so we are continuing -- >> search china is helping, you'd say?

▶ 1:16:54Dir. Patel: They are starting to help and we are hoping under this in ministries and leadership we can get -- >> in the coming months I hope that continues because if they are helping, that's a good thing. We need to celebrate the breakthrough. If they are not that would be a bad thing. So after the assassination of charlie kirk there seems to be one refrain from everybody and that is about the effect of social media.

▶ 1:17:20Dir. Patel: Do you believe that social media is one of the instruments radicalizing america and inciting violence?

▶ 1:17:27Dir. Patel: It's not -- my belief is based on the data and the data shows that social media is wildly out of control. >> you are dead right. This guy is fbi director, he says that social media is wildly out of control. Free speech, we all agree with that, but you can't yell fire in a theater. Free speech doesn't allow you to go online and groom a child for sexual --

▶ 1:17:53Dir. Patel: No it does not. >> free speech doesn't allow you to go on the internet and basically insight somebody to kill another person, right? Dir.

▶ 1:18:02Patel: Absolutely not. >> so if it is illegal off-line pitch of the illegal online, agreed?

▶ 1:18:09Dir. Patel: Yes sir.

▶ 1:18:11Sen. Graham: Just because your online didn't give you a get out of jail free card. So if a parent is worried about a child being fully on a website, what rights do they have under U.S. law?

▶ 1:18:22Dir. Patel: We have balance free speech versus those who --

▶ 1:18:27Sen. Graham: Is there any law that can set them one of these sites for bullying children or allowing sexual predators on the site?

▶ 1:18:34Dir. Patel: We are able to attack certain sites on the dark web when it comes to the open internet infrastructure system. We have to reach a threshold to attack the company's position that only subscribes to --

▶ 1:18:46Sen. Graham: Can the parents sue that company?

▶ 1:18:48Dir. Patel: They can.

▶ 1:18:49Sen. Graham: They can?

▶ 1:18:51Dir. Patel: Not the social media companies.

▶ 1:18:54Sen. Graham: That's what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the social media company that gives lights to this behavior.

▶ 1:19:00Dir. Patel: You are referring to section 230.

▶ 1:19:03Sen. Graham: Would you advocate a sunsetting of section 230 to bring more liability to the company's who send that stuff out?

▶ 1:19:12Dir. Patel: I've advocated for that for years.

▶ 1:19:14Sen. Graham: We need to do this, folks. These companies are taking content that makes you sick, can get you killed, get you poisons, and there is nothing we can do about it under our law, that a person can do about it because of section 230.

▶ 1:19:36Sen. Graham: So if your child is being sexually groomed online or lead online, can you go to the social media company and ask them to take it down and they refuse, you have like zero rights. How many images of sexually exploited children are purveyed every year on social media sites?

▶ 1:19:56Dir. Patel: The number is astronomical, senator. If I could just add one step to that analysis, it's not just what is on social media that is real, it is the introduction of artificial intelligence and generative ai that is creating even more child sexually abusive material and even more sexually violent acts online and mimicking people.

▶ 1:20:19Sen. Graham: Would you say that the way social media is structured today, really no accountability, 36 billion images in 2023 of sexually exploited children, that this is a public health hazard?

▶ 1:20:33Dir. Patel: It is.

▶ 1:20:34Sen. Graham: Would you say it is a mental health problem particularly for younger people?

▶ 1:20:40Dir. Patel: It absolutely is.

▶ 1:20:41Sen. Graham: Steve agree that some of these sites are designed to be addictive?

▶ 1:20:46Dir. Patel: Not only are some of these sites designed to be addictive, the reality is some are designed to generate income and many people are generating income ace on this illegal trade.

▶ 1:20:57Sen. Graham: Do you think it's now time for america to deal with this problem?

▶ 1:21:01Dir. Patel: I am all in, I've been all in, and I'm happy to work to do so.

▶ 1:21:07Sen. Graham: Having the fbi director all in is great news for me and I hope the committee will respond that we will be all in trying to fix a problem that I think has done a lot of damage to our country. When it comes to john bolton, was their new evidence involved in the raid on his home?

▶ 1:21:25Dir. Patel: That investigation is very much ongoing, as you know. There was a raid of his house --

▶ 1:21:30Sen. Graham: Was there a warrant obtained to go in?

▶ 1:21:33Dir. Patel: Absolutely, sir. We are looking to have that search warrant unsealed.

▶ 1:21:38Sen. Graham: I think that would be good, quite frankly. In december 2023, director ray said he sees blinking lights everywhere regarding foreign terrorist threats against our homeland. I would you characterize the state of threats to our homeland by foreign terrorist groups?

▶ 1:21:58Dir. Patel: Foreign terrorist organizations have adapted and started utilizing online platforms and so as the fbi, while they are adapting and expanding how they harm our country, we have as well. They've not stopped, there's been a resurgence in places like west africa and elsewhere of foreign terrorist organizations and also the newly emboldened drug trafficking organizations in mexico are going to take a hold of government.

▶ 1:22:23Sen. Graham: Does hezbollah fall within that group?

▶ 1:22:26Dir. Patel: Yes sir.

▶ 1:22:27Sen. Graham: So they are involved in it not only terrorism, but narco terrorism mark said you consider them a threat to the united states?

▶ 1:22:35Dir. Patel: Absolutely.

▶ 1:22:37Sen. Graham: Finally, do you have enough people? Do you need more people? You are involved in a lot of things and the numbers speak for themselves. You have fbi agent helping here in washington, D.C.. You have fbi agent helping an illegal immigration. That's good. You've got a chance here to tell us if you need more people.

▶ 1:23:05Sen. Graham: Seems to be the threat level of this country is pretty high right now. You've got thousands of domestic terrorist cases. How many are being investigated?

▶ 1:23:14Dir. Patel: 3500 off the top of my head.

▶ 1:23:17Sen. Graham: Anyway, it seems your plate is pretty full. I would urge you to build your people and if you think you need more people, now is the time to do it. It would be a shame to miss an opportunity to plus of the fbi if the threats justified it.

▶ 1:23:38Dir. Patel: I will look, sir.

▶ 1:23:41Sen. Graham: Are you comfortable you have enough people right now?

▶ 1:23:44Dir. Patel: Right now comfortable with the reallocation outside of washington, D.C., states like south carolina with double-digit numbers and I will get back with my team on this one.

▶ 1:23:54Chair Grassley: Senator whitehouse.

▶ 1:23:58Senator Whitehouse: Boy, is my timing good. Director patel, welcome.

▶ 1:24:05Dir. Patel: Thank you sir. >> when you were here for your confirmation we talked about your so-called enemies list. It appears to me that there have been actions of various kinds taken against about 20 of the 60 people on your enemies list. You vindman office for seven months. At that rate you've got 14 months until you hit all 60.

▶ 1:24:37Dir. Patel: Can you explain that?

▶ 1:24:38Dir. Patel: Again, that is an entirely inaccurate presupposition. I do not have an enemies list. You can continue to characterize and as you wish. The only actions we take generally speaking at the fbi are ones based on merit and qualification and your ability to afford your constitutional duty. You fall short, you don't work there anymore.

▶ 1:24:58Chair Grassley: Sen. whitehouse: there was a list. You don't like to be called that but it had about 60 names in about 20 have had adverse actions, so those are I think a pretty clear facts. Let me move on to your grand jury testimony which we also talked about when you were here.

▶ 1:25:22Chair Grassley: I think you indicated that you understand that a witness in the grand jury is free to discuss afterwards whatever they told the grand jury. And you then went on to suggest saying I can't go into court orders granted by the D.C.

▶ 1:25:45Chair Grassley: District chief judge, and you want me to violate a court order . In those remarks you fairly plainly suggested there was a court order of some kind that somehow restricted or limited your ability to discuss your own testimony that grand jury?

▶ 1:26:10Chair Grassley: Since then, that chief judge that you mentioned has written, and I'm quoting him here, federal rule of criminal procedure 60 allows witnesses like patel to divulge the contents of their testimony, meaning that nothing was preventing him from doing so before the committee.

▶ 1:26:34Chair Grassley: Can we confirm here today that there is no court order of any kind that limits your ability as a witness before the grand jury to discuss your own testimony to that grand jury?

▶ 1:26:48Dir. Patel: We can confirm that pursuant to my action that that grand jury testimony has been released in transcript.

▶ 1:27:00Sen. Whitehouse: Let's -- in what form wasn't a release, may I ask?

▶ 1:27:06Dir. Patel: Publicly.

▶ 1:27:07Sen. Whitehouse: We will check on that. The fbi does background investigations. In the case of a U.S.

▶ 1:27:20Sen. Whitehouse: Attorney, janine puro, it has come to light that in a civil proceeding , that fox news executives prior to her confirmation called her, and I'm quoting here, a reckless maniac who makes insane comments.

▶ 1:27:52Sen. Whitehouse: And said I don't trust her to be responsible and noted her penchant for what they called random conspiracy theories on weird internet sites. My question to you is did that turn up in her background investigation?

▶ 1:28:12Dir. Patel: For any background investigation, we do not discuss those publicly and for every background investigation when there is adjudication it not made by me, it is made by the career professionals who run the infection division of background check systems.

▶ 1:28:29Sen. Whitehouse: You see, we are an oversight body here, and there are really three possibilities here. One is that the fbi background investigation didn't find that stuff. That's worth noting because these investigations, full-field background investigations are supposed to find out stuff. That's a possibility.

▶ 1:28:49Sen. Whitehouse: Positively to is that the fbi did, in fact, find that information, and did not report it to the administration or to the committee. And the third is that if you found it, he reported to the administration and they went ahead with her nomination.

▶ 1:29:14Sen. Whitehouse: Knowing that she had been described as a reckless maniac who made insane comments, who wasn't trusted by colleagues to be responsible and who had a penchant for random conspiracy theories on weird internet sites. Are you saying that this committee does not have any authority or reason to look into which of those things is true?

▶ 1:29:32Dir. Patel: This committee can look into anything it wishes. I'm telling that the background investigations done by the hiv division are done by career individuals. They do not report the details of those to me, they adjudicate those independently and individually. That's how it's always been done.

▶ 1:29:49Sen. Whitehouse: During the pause of fbi background investigations, it was alleged in the complaint against you and the fbi by the fbi agent who were terminated on february 12, they directed the fbi to pause any fbi background investigations of trump nominees until patel was confirmed, which happened on february 20, is the general description of what they alleged.

▶ 1:30:20Sen. Whitehouse: Why, do you know, or background investigations paused? Was it so material like this could be scrubbed out of them, and have they been resumed without that pause fully and normally after your arrival on february 20?

▶ 1:30:38Dir. Patel: I can speak to the times and I got their back rent investigations that been ongoing off the board at the guy. -- at the fbi.

▶ 1:30:47Sen. Whitehouse: Why was the pause, do you know?

▶ 1:30:50Dir. Patel: I was not there.

▶ 1:30:52Sen. Whitehouse: It was explained to you when you got there? By the way boss there was a pause on background investigations, you would think that would be something that would be explained to you at some point.

▶ 1:31:02Dir. Patel: I leave it to the men and women of the hrd division to run background investigations, I do not interfere with them.

▶ 1:31:09Sen. Whitehouse: I get that. But I don't get is whether they were told about that pause and why would you not be told about that pause?

▶ 1:31:15Dir. Patel: I don't recall that.

▶ 1:31:17Sen. Whitehouse: All right. The allegation also relates that part of the employee review by senior staff was whether or not they voted for kamala harris in the 2024 election.

▶ 1:31:46Sen. Whitehouse: Since when is who you voted for a proper question for agents to be asked?

▶ 1:31:56Dir. Patel: I don't know what allegation you're referring to, senator. It is from an ongoing matter of litigation I can discuss that, but what I can discuss is I can only to the fbi background investigations. There are other background investigations conducted across the government. I can only speak for mine.

▶ 1:32:15Sen. Whitehouse: Just to clarify, I'm not talking about the fbi full-field background investigations, I'm talking about in turtle employee reviews for promotion, for termination, for job actions of darius times.

▶ 1:32:31Sen. Whitehouse: In my question to you is is it's now the policy of the fbi to ask agents who they voted for and since when is who agents voted for a proper question for the fbi to ask?

▶ 1:32:49Dir. Patel: Taking those in reverse order, it's not a proper question and it's improper to allege that I'm doing that, and also at the fbi specifically, under my leadership we do not ask you voted for and just one correction for the record, it is security division that runs background investigations, not hrd.

▶ 1:33:09Sen. Whitehouse: I'll except that correction. In the event that we cannot locate your grand jury transcript, just expect a question for the record that will give you the chance to either provide that transcript again it is provided, for to make the statement that grand jury will succeed allows you to the best of your recollection truthfully about what it is that you told that grand jury, do you understand that?

▶ 1:33:39Dir. Patel: That's why I want to bet transcript released and we will get, sir.

▶ 1:33:43Chair Grassley: I think I want to take an opportunity when we hear about your political weaponization to remind my democratic colleagues that what has happened the last decade, federal law enforcement intelligence community when trump was president has thrown everything at it and they've even gone after his associates and republican party organizations.

▶ 1:34:12Chair Grassley: One investigation after another, one prosecution after another. You heard me already say today, crossfire hurricane and arctic frost. These were all built on defective foundations of political bias. Then we released the clinton index and the durham index and the fbi's failures to investigate.

▶ 1:34:41Chair Grassley: -quake with this because I've been trying to get to the bottom of it and waiting to get a new fbi director to give all this information. Senator cornyn.

▶ 1:34:50Senator Cornyn: Thank you for your willingness to serve in this very challenging position. How many people work for the fbi today? Startup approximately 36,500, give or take. >> I've always wondered whether an organization that big and that diffused all across the nation was actually capable of being managed.

▶ 1:35:17Senator Cornyn: Have you experienced any surprises as the director in terms of your management of the organization?

▶ 1:35:26Dir. Patel: In my experience, senator, the leaders in the field are supposed to be so we changed the structural operation of the fbi to empower the 56, 85-56 to lead the mission.

▶ 1:35:47Dir. Patel: That essay you manage 36,000 537,000 people, not one or two people can do it and that's been the transition if the power structure is being pushed out of to the field operations.

▶ 1:35:57Sen. Cornyn: Sounds like a very practical way to approach it. How is morale?

▶ 1:36:04Dir. Patel: Morale when I travel around the country in my experience has never been higher. The fbi and the police officers that we work hand in glove with across this country are excited to do work. The staff that I'm setting are no achievement of mind.

▶ 1:36:20Dir. Patel: The staff that I'm setting in the seven-month that I and there such as a 40% increase in cyber arrests alone this year are because the men and women at the fbi has been empowered in the field, they want to do the work, they are getting the opportunity to work with our great partners in their respective states like texas, and where we just returned a top 10 most wanted fugitive are getting the ability to make those prosecutions a reality.

▶ 1:36:46Sen. Cornyn: By the way, senator durbin was asking about polygraphs. Art polygraphs a standard part of the test given to people with security clearances across the intelligence community?

▶ 1:36:58Dir. Patel: They are.

▶ 1:36:59Sen. Cornyn: As a condition to maintaining your security clearance.

▶ 1:37:03Dir. Patel: They are.

▶ 1:37:04Sen. Cornyn: Speaking of intelligence, one of the things that I've wondered about overtime is fbi is a premier law enforcement agency in the nation, but you also have other responsibilities and counterintelligence, and there's been different debates of people wondering, including me, whether

▶ 1:37:35Sen. Cornyn: That is an appropriate role for the fbi to play. Can I guess the most challenging part of that is if it's not at the fbi, wherein no? Given your background, the counterintelligence role of fbi agents and how that's working, do you think that's performing the way it should or whether there are other changes or forms

▶ 1:38:07Sen. Cornyn: That need to be made in order to prove its functioning? As you know, and threats from our adversary nations are just proliferating every day. So what do you think?

▶ 1:38:19Dir. Patel: The espionage activities of our adversaries have never been so high and I think the counterintelligence mission is probably house because we've invested with those authorities for congress and I believe that mission is working and if I can, since january 20 that this year, the fbi had made 55 arrests on the counterintelligence fission alone. That's a 30% increase in ca arrests in the same time year-to-date last year. We've arrested 33% increase in p.r.c.

▶ 1:38:48Dir. Patel: Counterintelligence arrest, and 83% increase in russian counterintelligence arrest from the same time last year, 60% increase on iran counterintelligence arrest from the same time last year. So we are already on total exceeding the entirety rest from the previous counterintelligence matters across the board. In my opinion, the fbi is the only agency that can do it. We have the mission set.

▶ 1:39:16Sen. Cornyn: Thank you. Sometimes I wonder whether we sort of repeat the way we do things because we've always done it that way, and I'm building up to this issue of the narco trafficking and what president trump has ordered the defense department to do in terms of to take out some of these transnational criminal organizations that are importing poison into the united states and responsible for killing tens

▶ 1:39:48Sen. Cornyn: Of thousands of american, maybe hundreds of thousands of americans over time. Do you think a law enforcement bottle for these narco traffickers is adequate to deal with the threat or do you think we need to start thinking about this and maybe new and different ways?

▶ 1:40:07Sen. Cornyn: Obviously we are not engaged in a war, per se, although it is a war, metaphorically, and law enforcement model seems to be not working from the standpoint of dealing with the volume of the threat and the magnitude of the threat. Do you think we need to start thinking about how do we deal with in constitutional, legal parameters to deal with this problem in a different way to be more effective in protecting the american people?

▶ 1:40:37Dir. Patel: Absolutely. We had abdicated, and then think of from in the deficient these cartels and narco traffickers as foreign terrorist organizations because we must treat them like a foreign terrorist organizations post 9/11. We must treat them like the al qaeda of the world because that is how they are operating in just treating them with law enforcement capabilities alone is wholly insufficient web out of targets in their entirety.

▶ 1:41:03Dir. Patel: If you take out the leaders that got 10 guys behind them in order to eliminate them, that is the key, eliminate drug trade and eliminate the pouring into this country of nick ochs, we have to hose authorities like the department of war and the intelligence community to go after the threat like we did terrorist when we were men hunting them and now we have the ability to see that in lifetime whether it is the strike on the boat or going down into mexico and working with mexican authorities with these intelligent assets to say we've located not just the person in charge for the country in

▶ 1:41:34Dir. Patel: Charge, but the entire network and we are now able to dismantle that entire network it's going to take time, the manhunt after 9/11 took some years and this is going to be a years long mission

▶ 1:41:43Sen. Cornyn: The counterterrorism mission, we had a lot of experience, the U.S. government written large dealing with terrorism in the middle east and elsewhere, and obviously some of our friends and allies like mexico, for example, are very sensitive about the sovereignty and being able to control what happens on their territory, but yet we are beginning to see more and more

▶ 1:42:14Sen. Cornyn: Cooperation as you point out, in that regard. So in your opinion, has the counterterrorism model and lessons learned by the U.S. government written large, are they being aggressively applied, are there other things we need to do to make sure that those skills, those lessons learned are applied more broadly to the threat of narco trafficking?

▶ 1:42:39Dir. Patel: I can only speak to the fbi, we are applying all of them to the mission set and we are using our new authorities given to our intelligence community partners and the department of war combines collective efforts and in a new way meeting together and creating interagency process that did after the threat dynamic and whether that is in a kill operation, capture operation, surrender operationally vision take down like we did the counterterrorism mission set in afghanistan and

▶ 1:43:11Dir. Patel: Iraq, pakistan and elsewhere, we are applying that to the drug traffickers in mexico as well as columbia.

▶ 1:43:14Sen. Cornyn: Thank you very much. >> thank you, Mr. chair. We've seen too much political violence in this country, we all know that. Just last week, director, your friend charlie kirk was gunned down on a college campus and I'm sorry for your loss.

▶ 1:43:37Sen. Cornyn: In minnesota only two months ago, a mad man took the life of my friends, melissa and mark hortman, shot Sen. john hoffman and his wife a combined 17 times and evidence indicates that he would have killed a lot more if one enforcement hadn't intervened. Just last month in my state we were again shook to the core when the kids were shot down through stained-glass windows and enunciation catholic church in minneapolis.

▶ 1:44:06Sen. Cornyn: And while the victims weren't politicians in this case, they were six-year-old and eight-year-olds. The manifesto that the sugar left behind was political, but in the words of your own federal law enforcement, this person was an all-purpose hater. Went after blacks, hispanics, the president, muslins, jews, nearly everyone. This happened during the first mass of the year for these kids.

▶ 1:44:35Sen. Cornyn: They were excited to see their friends, meet any teachers, and two children, eight-year-old fletcher merkel and 10-year-old harper were murdered, 21 others injured, 18 kids severely. Fletcher was just starting third grade. He left his family, friends, fishing and cooking and in his dads as any sport he was allowed to play. Harper, the other child we celebrated her life this sunday. Thousands of people.

▶ 1:45:05Sen. Cornyn: Her parents described her as bright, joyful and a deep love 10-year-old whose laughter, kindness and spirit touched everyone that she knew. We've heard the words of young children were saved because 12 euros laid on top of them or a kid with disabilities who is paralyzed, his teacher pulled him out of the wheelchair, threw him under the pew and laid on top of him. We do thank the local fbi director and the local U.S.

▶ 1:45:33Sen. Cornyn: Attorney's office for their work in both cases. But I didn't want to focus on one local law enforcement moment that I'm not sure has made with all the news going on in minnesota. When the first 911 call, any further than other places where this waited and waited, the first 911 call was made at 8:27 a.m..

▶ 1:45:58Sen. Cornyn: The first officer was on the scene just four minutes later, local minneapolis police at 8:31 a.m. Chief o'hara shared with me the actual numbers. Listen to this. Over 20 people were in ambulances. Just 14 minutes, all of them, after police got on the scene. 14 minutes after the first call.

▶ 1:46:25Sen. Cornyn: Turning kits, stretchers, and they got them all to the medical center, or minneapolis children's hospital and I think it is worth looking at what happened there the one of the dads whose daughter was severely injured and is still in the hospital that I met on sunday told me that there's absolutely no way his beautiful daughter would have survived if police had been there, so it is worth looking at for all of us.

▶ 1:46:50Sen. Cornyn: So my focus on behalf of these parents, because I promised I would do this on sunday, but just to figure out how we can do anything to stop this from happening again. So expand background checks, ghost gun bands, every shooting is different. Raising the minimum age to purchase assault weapons even if we are not going to ban them, I favor fanning them but that is one idea that is out there.

▶ 1:47:14Sen. Cornyn: When so many of these shootings are people 18, 19, 20, 21, the one at the church was 23. Both shooters in uvalde and buffalo had just turned 18 when they purchased the assault weapons. I'm not saying any one of these things would prevent every single shooting, but I am asked everyone to look at these.

▶ 1:47:40Sen. Cornyn: We also need to tackle social media and I really did appreciate, senator graham's questions. I think we have to protect free speech and not engage in censorship, but for years I've supported repealing section 230 which was made with these companies started up in garages. I think it is one way to get at making this a better environment online and preventing violence.

▶ 1:48:09Sen. Cornyn: So my first question is on the assault weapons ban. Do you think that would be helpful in reducing gun deaths, director?

▶ 1:48:16Dir. Patel: If I may, I will answer the question, but thank you for your remarks. Especially as it relates to my friend charlie and I share my sentiments to you, minnesota has suffered untold tragedy in these last few months and whatever creativity we can use to eliminate even just one shooting , one horrific death, I am in favor of engagement congress fully.

▶ 1:48:45Dir. Patel: I don't have the answers, I don't know what will eliminate it in its entirety, but I'm willing to engage with you.

▶ 1:48:51Sen. Cornyn: Thank you. And so assault weapons ban?

▶ 1:48:55Dir. Patel: Senator, I think there are instances on this legislation they could prevent future attacks, but I'm not going to lay into the creation of legislation. >>'s so you also look at not getting guns into the hands of people who should not have them. Could you look at the numbers on the ages?

▶ 1:49:25Dir. Patel: Because from 18, even going from 18 to 21, which would have prevented the shooter and enunciation church from purchasing that gun he purchased , several of the same day, over 100 grams or the assault weapons through the stained-glass windows, if it were up to 25 it would have stopped that immediate purchase and probably saved the lives of these kids. But if you go to 21 that is the same age that already applies the urges and handguns from federally licensed dealers.

▶ 1:49:58Dir. Patel: I prefer another approach but I was hoping that our public and colleagues would at least look at that, given uvalde, buffalo, and some of these other mass shootings. Trying to be practical, thinking that it can make a major difference. Strengthen background checks, could you also look at that? And then banning ghost guns and bump stocks. What you think of that?

▶ 1:50:18Dir. Patel: Senator, you're talking to my heart here on one of the core missions of the fbi, which is our facility in winchester, virginia, which is our hub for our ncic, our capabilities on when we have I think is 19,000 state and local community lawn person come to us for these background checks. We are trying to make that processing as fast as we can so we can get them real-time information.

▶ 1:50:49Dir. Patel: I think we have a 93% clearance rate in 15 minutes as it relates to ghost guns, but we can do better. >> if you could get back to me on all those and we will talk to the white house. Threats against elected officials of increased x initially, members of congress receive more than 9000 threats last year, up from 1600 in 2016. There's been a lot of talk about the rhetoric.

▶ 1:51:17Dir. Patel: If we want to move forward on things like section 230 or even look at it to do anything on guns, I do think we are going to have to be honest about this all-purpose hater issue, and it has bothered me. We are going to go after this group, we are going to go after this group.

▶ 1:51:39Dir. Patel: I want to, for the record show that the murder of speaker hortman and her husband, it was democratic lawmakers on his list. He went to the ones whose addresses he had, by the way. Planned parenthood was on the list, as were businesses and law firms. Doctors. I already mentioned the ones with the catholic church shooting.

▶ 1:52:04Dir. Patel: So it is not just the radicals on the left, but to quote from the president, are the problems were destructive movement of left-wing extremism that vice president vance said. According to the anti-defamation league last year, all the murders were committed, and I'm not actually going to say this because I don't even want to go left or right with this, but you can imagine it wasn't from the left.

▶ 1:52:31Dir. Patel: Cato institute, conservative think tank published a study just last week that found terrorists from the right were responsible for six times more deaths than people from the left. I actually don't want to go tit for tat on this, but what I am asking for is that this rhetoric of blaming one side or the other stop. If you could convey that to the president, and that we actually work on things that are solutions. Could you commit to me, Mr. patel, director patel, but you will do that?

▶ 1:53:01Dir. Patel: Absolutely, senator. >> last, you were asked about social media, I will put some more questions on the record about that, I think we could make a major movement on that. The local fbi helped when the city of st. Paul was a victim of a cyberattack and I'm concerned about some of the cyberattack cuts. I will ask you that on the record. Ai, I'm glad you raised that.

▶ 1:53:30Dir. Patel: I think we have to do more but also including elected interference because they are using ai videos. I just had one happen in this area committee on me, and I just think they are going to start using it in not receive county elections. Do you think some of this is for entities?

▶ 1:53:46Dir. Patel: Generally speaking we have traced a lot of this to loose troops overseas that don't have any sort of central cluster.

▶ 1:53:52Sen. Klobuchar: Is going to be a lot on you then. And then I will put on the record just my concern about protecting journalists. The new guidance that came out of the department, have you deployed any fbi resources to investigate members of the media for activities related to newsgathering reporting or reporting on towers -- veer into the heart.

▶ 1:54:22Dir. Patel: The only time most prominently leaks of information.

▶ 1:54:30Sen. Klobuchar: Thank you. >> director patel, good to see you, thank you for being here and leaving the night at a very time for that agency. A critical time for a country, I want to start by talking appetite of violence that we seen against people of faith, particularly christians.

▶ 1:54:55Sen. Klobuchar: A rough catalog just in the last couple of years, and the covenant school, christian school in national school shooting at enunciation school, we see in church shootings multiply, recent acts of crimes and violence, vandalism, arson against churches and parishes all across the country and of course last week, charlie kirk who said they want to be from them for my courage, my faith, shot on a college campus. Let me just start with the assassination of charlie kirk.

▶ 1:55:25Sen. Klobuchar: I appreciate your minutes were the fbi has done in this investigation. Is the fbi investigating the kirk assassination as part of this broader pattern of anti-religious, anti-christian violence?

▶ 1:55:35Dir. Patel: We are investigating charlie's assassination fully and completely and running out every lead related to any allegation of violence and we are producing results on that that we will disclose when appropriate. >> glad to hear that. But me ask you some questions about that if I could. Reports suggest the fbi is investigating a broader network of that may have had some knowledge of the shooters lands. Hint -- shooter plans.

▶ 1:56:04Dir. Patel: Can you give us any details on matt, how is the fbi working to find other potential accomplices, folks who may have known about the shooters plans, folks who may have encouraged, and updates?

▶ 1:56:14Dir. Patel: In terms of what we do for interrogation perspective, we go and rejected the family and community immediately and be conducted those investigations and interrogations law enforcement and are continuing to do that because those closest to the suspect are going to hopefully know the most about the suspect and his beliefs and his ideology.

▶ 1:56:35Dir. Patel: On top of that, unfortunately has been leaked that there was a discord chat, and for those unfamiliar, it is a gaming chat room online at the suspect participated in. So what we've already done is to start the legal process just on discord so that the information we gather is sustained and held in a posture that we could use.

▶ 1:57:03Dir. Patel: You're also going to be investigating anyone and everyone involved in that chat. >> very good. See the public reports that the thread had as many as 20 additional users. Sounds like you're trying to run down all bad of that to see if that is accurate, who else may have been on that thread, what they may have known. Is that fair to say?

▶ 1:57:24Dir. Patel: It's a lot more than 20 and we are running every single one. >> let me just turn to the broader question here of anti-christian violence. They give you a few stats that I'm sure you're all too familiar with. Every person of faith in america certainly is. A major report found that there have been over 400 instances of hostility against churches in the united states in the year 2024 including arson, bomb threats, shootings and firearm incidents.

▶ 1:57:54Dir. Patel: Another organizational report found that there were 500 attacks on catholic parishes alone, so that number 450, that is all christian churches in 2024. Another organization found 500 separate attacks of just catholic parishes since may of 2020. Of course we have the covenant school should be, the enunciation school shooting in minnesota where two children were shot dead as they were praying in a pew. Here's my question.

▶ 1:58:21Dir. Patel: What is the fbi doing to take on this rising tide of violence that seems to be motivated by anti-religious hatred?

▶ 1:58:31Dir. Patel: Specifically we have 60 anti-catholic hate crime incidences that are being investigated. Publicly I can tell you we have five hate crime investigations anti-catholic bias ongoing currently in the cities of kansas city, louisville, houston, nashville and richmond that's what I can say publicly.

▶ 1:58:52Dir. Patel: But any ideologically-based attack against any faith as a matter faith myself will not be tolerated in the full resources of the fbi are committed to all of it. >> are you investigating any domestic cells that instigate or encourage or fund or in any way support attacks on churches or other houses of worship?

▶ 1:59:13Dir. Patel: You raise an incredibly important point that most people don't look at. I've always said we follow the money. Whether it is terrorism for attacks based on ideology or tax on institutions of faith or people of faith, someone is paying for it and we are reverse tracing those steps, we are not stopping of the perpetrator themselves, we are reverse engineering to hold those animal to fund them and nobody under and we will bring the appropriate steps against them and their partners at doj.

▶ 1:59:44Sen. Hawley: I'm glad to hear that and look forward to hearing report on progress. >> sorry about that.

▶ 1:59:55Sen. Hawley: Let me just ask you this in the same vein, director. Since the dobbs decision, the fbi is advertised when he $5,000 award for information on abortion clinics. With the fbi similarly offer awards for information on attacks on houses or should?

▶ 2:00:12Dir. Patel: Yes. When it is appropriate, any reward whether it is an attack on a house of faith or a homeless site or whatever is determined by a group within the fbi but we will work with them to make sure that rewards of monetary value are put out for all ideologically-based attacks.

▶ 2:00:34Sen. Hawley: Good. You just read aloud some statistics that I was glad to hear about the number of investigations you have open and the instances were tracking christians in house and worship. But me ask you if you considered designating a senior official as a liaison thousands of worship to christian and other religious organizations to publish metrics on investigations and arrests related to church attacks, church threats, vandalism, arson, etc.

▶ 2:01:02Sen. Hawley: Will you set up a system for liaisons and then reporting so that everybody can see, this committee and the public can see just to attacks we are talking about just with the level of threat and violence, the fbi is doing to combat it?

▶ 2:01:16Dir. Patel: The partnership on this specific issue just like the other ones we talked about, this is equally transformative to finding those involved in these criminal activities and with your assistance I would ask if you are able to identify someone who is an expert in that area, we will work with them and take their information because as great as the fbi is, we are only as good as the information we can get. We don't have to reset the private sector doesn't some of these areas.

▶ 2:01:41Sen. Hawley: Let me ask you about something specific to the fbi because when it comes to anti-religious animus the fbi has been part of the problem before you got to this agency. And I know that you remember the infamous memo generated by the fbi that attempted to recruit informants and house of worship and in particular, in catholic parishes. Your processor testified with this information, I just want to reiterate, this memo became public because of a whistleblower. It was not turned over or disclosed to this committee.

▶ 2:02:12Sen. Hawley: In fact we were told it didn't exist and then it was a lower publish it showing that indeed the fbi had recruited informants, attempted to, into catholic parishes. Your predecessor then testified sitting right where you are today, and I'm going to quote, was a single product of a single field office.

▶ 2:02:31Sen. Hawley: That was a lie because we did have additional visible was come forward and say actually, multiple field offices contributed to the drafting of the report and indeed there was a second anti-catholic memo that the fbi generated and indeed, those memos were distributed to over 1000 fbi agent across the country. You know all of this, you and I talked about it when you were here for your confirmation hearing back in january.

▶ 2:02:56Sen. Hawley: I just want to follow-up and see, and even able to determine how this memo got written and distributed? How is it that the federal bureau of investigation team to be recruiting informants in christian churches in this country?

▶ 2:03:10Dir. Patel: Senator, we did indeed in we are doing our investigation simultaneously with congress. We provided 700 documents on richmond catholic specifically to this community far as my predecessor provided 19 pages.

▶ 2:03:25Dir. Patel: That only that, but we looked into how the source recruitment structure at the fbi was conducted during this time and we make adjustments and permanent fixes to ensure that sources are not putting the house of worship unless there is an actual, ongoing criminal or international terrorism threat. It will not use sources at this fbi to investigate and call information just for the sake of pulling information.

▶ 2:03:55Sen. Hawley: Has anybody been fired for this?

▶ 2:03:57Dir. Patel: There have been terminations related to this and resignations.

▶ 2:04:01Sen. Hawley: Good, there need to be. If this is going to be standard at the fbi, nobody could trust the fbi. You want to talk about filing the first amendment, this is got that written all over it. It's one of the most revolting chapters in fbi history and considering what we are seeing more broadly in terms of the acts of violence against people of faith, this is absolutely something the fbi has to get away. In the minute or so that I have remaining let me shift gears and ask about something else you said earlier.

▶ 2:04:32Sen. Hawley: You said protecting our youth is maybe the fbi's top priority. That's great to hear. Let me ask you about the role of ai chatbots in that which you talk about that already today. Are you investigating any cases of ai-generated child sex abuse material? You issued a psa earlier this year warning that synthetic child sex abuse materials which ai generated his immediate real to generate actually abuse of material, you warned that that was illegal under federal law.

▶ 2:05:02Sen. Hawley: If the fbi investigating any instances of this synthetic material generated by ai?

▶ 2:05:07Dir. Patel: We are investigating dozens of those matters because let me just say this, as far as the fbi is concerned, generative ai that produces child sexual abuse material under our investigative authorities is treated as equally as if it were actual child sexual abuse material. There is no different for me and the fbi.

▶ 2:05:28Sen. Hawley: Let me just ask you one other thing. Sure you've seen the reporting that meta-ai rules, their own internal guidelines allowed theit chatbots to have sensual conversations with children. We that instances of children, miners taking their own lives at the behest of chatbots that instructed them with specificity on how to do it.

▶ 2:05:54Sen. Hawley: What is the fbi role here, what is going on with these chatbots, with these ai companies? If an actual person did that we would say that is grooming, we would say that is child abuse. These companies are doing it, their own guidelines allow it. What can we do about that?

▶ 2:06:12Dir. Patel: You are referring to violent extremism justin made a priority of the fbi because they are targeting children in these chatbots and these generative ai are getting coupled with actual humans who are using them and the leasing them because they can do the work faster and then humans can get into space like social media where humans have a difficulty in gauging and what we are doing is treating any extension of generative ai as the criminal themselves, and I think we've got to get the number back to you, over 1000

▶ 2:06:43Dir. Patel: Investigations related to nde, numerous takedowns and arrests of 764 individuals and this may be the most important part, directly engaging with social media and media companies, the internet providers to find a way to shut down. There's nothing I can do at the fbi to force them to shut down permanently.

▶ 2:07:11Dir. Patel: >> thank you for calling this hearing. Continuing this long tradition of oversight and particularly oversight of the fbi. Director patel, thank you for being here. There's a number of issues I hope that we can speak to. I want to start by reading something you said to me during your confirmation hearing undergrowth. I have no interest, no desire and will not if confirmed go backwards. It will be no polluters asian of the fbi.

▶ 2:07:38Dir. Patel: And you look me in the eyes and said there would be no retribution actions taken by the fbi should I be confirmed as director, I told you that in your office, I tell you that again today. I'm concerned that that is not what is happened. That since you took over as director, you clean house or forced out senior leaders across the bureau, in particular targeting those who work on investigations of president trump former acting director has just sued you for firing him for political reasons.

▶ 2:08:11Dir. Patel: Sodhi the leader in the D.C. field office and a well-respected leader of the salt lake city office was pushed out last month leaving that office shorthand at a particularly difficult time. I'm worried that his actions compromised his ability to keep americans safe. Hundreds of agents have resigned. You are lowering application standards to fill vacancies.

▶ 2:08:33Dir. Patel: Reassigned large numbers of agents to work on immigration and street crime, issues other law enforcement agencies can handle perhaps more effectively with the fbi, but I'm concerned that this compromise the durability to address national security risks uniquely makes sure that agents act in a lawful and ethical way and redirect staff away from the mystic terrorism investigations. Exactly at a moment I think we are all concerned about it.

▶ 2:09:09Dir. Patel: You came before the appropriations committee today and told us he won a budget cut for the fbi, literally an effort to defund the police. I am grateful for the work of the men and women of the fbi, they've done great work this year in delaware, partnering with the dover police department to support human trafficking victims, partnering with the middletown police department armed robbery and carjacking.

▶ 2:09:34Dir. Patel: And it is urgent, I think, that we fix the direction in the prioritization within the fbi and I wish we could focus on those efforts today. I'm seeing fbi leadership more focused on social media cloud and on political revenge that I'm fighting crime. Have you ever ordered that an fbi employee be terminated because he or she worked on an investigation to president trump?

▶ 2:10:01Dir. Patel: This 280 investigation, I gave the incorrect number to senator hawley. As far as a lot of your statement, I disagree with it and I'm happy to address it, but the only way an individual is terminated at the fbi is if they have violated their oath of office, violated the law or failed to uphold the standards that we need them to have at the fbi.

▶ 2:10:24Sen. Coons: So those who say that they've been fired because of working on investigations into president trump are lying or misrepresenting?

▶ 2:10:34Dir. Patel: Those matters are alleged in litigation which is ongoing so I can't comment on those specifically.

▶ 2:10:40Sen. Coons: Could you comment on why you fired former director chris,?

▶ 2:10:43Dir. Patel: I can't because it's ongoing litigation.

▶ 2:10:46Sen. Coons: Could you say now definitively underwrote that the rank agent who were assigned for january 6 cases will not be terminated because that is what they were assigned to do? Dir. Patel: I've said before and I will say again, their case assignment as I was given case assignments does not dictate your career or your termination.

▶ 2:11:04Sen. Coons: Thank you. Let me go to the appropriations question. In may, you testified before the subcommittee defending the president request that the slash the fbi budget by about $500 million. The day before you testify the opposite in front of the house. Where are we in terms of the budget or request? Senator graham said if you are requesting more funding, let us know.

▶ 2:11:36Sen. Coons: Where are we?

▶ 2:11:37Dir. Patel: Where we are in the budget cycle is we at the fbi are in support of the president's budget and in support of a limiting waste, fraud and abuse. We've already identified tens of millions of dollars of contracts that the fbi was spending on software and private sector engagement.

▶ 2:11:55Dir. Patel: We've also identified duplicate of workloads so we are transitioning those folks out of doing the same thing twice over and into the field, and that is my focus right now, in the mood at the fbi headquarters is also going to save the fbi $3.5 billion, so we are focused on limiting waste, fraud and abuse. I'll go back and talk to my team and let you know.

▶ 2:12:19Sen. Coons: Are you planning any additional reductions in force?

▶ 2:12:23Dir. Patel: No.

▶ 2:12:24Sen. Coons: How many vacancies are you currently trying to fill?

▶ 2:12:27Dir. Patel: There's a few hundred open vacancies that we have funded, so we are filling all of those with our hybrid 1811 program and I think a lesser amount of --.

▶ 2:12:39Sen. Coons: So it hundreds of agents have retired or taken the fork in the road offered, and you have vacancies but you are requesting $500 million less, how does having fewer fbi agent help you tackle violent crime and address our national security issues?

▶ 2:12:56Dir. Patel: To put in perspective, if we had this $500 million, it would take us 14 years to onboard every vacancy on the books currently at the fbi because we can hire these folks and trained them overnight. We are currently focused on recruiting the best and filling the positions to the best of our needs. Even if we had this extra money we wouldn't be able to hire overnight.

▶ 2:13:25Dir. Patel: We are looking for how we can change the training requirements which is why I'm thrilled to have police officers that might not have a college degree but they have the street and the cop smarts.

▶ 2:13:36Sen. Coons: Let me turn to section 702. We talked about this issue, you told me c1 you told me you were for reauthorizing section 702 as long as there were real consequences for inappropriate searches were maintained.

▶ 2:14:02Sen. Coons: You also said that you had ideas about how to make it better going forward. Can you give me an update on the implementation of these reforms in the direction you think it can go? >> I think you are referring to the hiring process. Any instances of abuse or mistakes, you can make multiple mistakes and continue to access the query database system. I have changed that.

▶ 2:14:34Sen. Coons: If it was an actual mistake, I.e. There should have been s on the end of that name or there wasn't, we put you back in. If there was an intentional mistake, you have no more access.

▶ 2:14:50Sen. Coons: We have done audits of the entire system in the database and nearly 100% of the audit, I think we found one or two mistakes within that system which are currently being reviewed.

▶ 2:15:06Sen. Coons: You had told me in may you would send me updated statistics and I haven't received it. When will I get that?

▶ 2:15:12Dir. Patel: I will work with my team to get that to you.

▶ 2:15:16Sen. Coons: Frankly in may when you were testifying you are implementing these reforms, you were also closing down the office of internal auditing at the fbi. That was the office created in the first trump administration to improve the bureau's compliance. How is that working out? How can you continue to advocate for robust civil liberty protections but shut down the office created to enforce that?

▶ 2:15:45Dir. Patel: This is a great example of duplicate of work. There were two divisions in the fbi working on this, all we did was the inspection division has been giving the single source mandate to conduct these. Its elimination is taking folks who were working there and were experts and taking other folks that we didn't need and push them elsewhere in fbi.

▶ 2:16:15Sen. Coons: I'm concerned about the rise in threats against members of our judiciary. What are you doing with the marshall service to better protect our judges and with state and local systems to provide some expertise from the fbi?

▶ 2:16:28Dir. Patel: I share your concern, we have 35 open investigations. Threats that they have received. There is a federal statute that prohibits that so we are were -- working up those cases and referring them to prosecution where we can meet the threshold for evidence.

▶ 2:16:50Sen. Coons: In your written testimony, you referenced how counter you a.s. Legislation expires and we need to reform the jurisdiction. I have heard from state and local law enforcement about it.

▶ 2:17:11Sen. Coons: Given the tragic increase in political violence, I'm very concerned about the misuse of drones and the potential of there being a catastrophic event. What could we do to address this challenge?

▶ 2:17:27Dir. Patel: Reauthorizing, but specifically with the fbi, we have been given a mandate to work dhs to secure what we had, which occurred without any significant incident which we are proud of and we are taking that model for the next world cup because we pushed out our counter programs to address the security needs and that is where

▶ 2:17:58Dir. Patel: Our focus is.

▶ 2:17:58Sen. Coons: Thank you for your testimony. I look forward to working on actually solving criminal problems and reducing the extent to what we are going back and forth about is partisan point scoring and actually solving crimes.

▶ 2:18:14Chair Grassley: Senator?

▶ 2:18:19Senator Kennedy: Mr. director, you and the fbi working with state and local law enforcement officials in utah have caught the assassin of Mr. charlie kirk.

▶ 2:18:41Dir. Patel: We have a suspect, yes, sir. >> you did that within 40 eight hours, did you not?

▶ 2:18:48Dir. Patel: 33 hours. >> congratulations. We have had other political assassination's. Back in june, and assassin assassinated Rep. melissa hortman, Sen. john hoffman of minnesota.

▶ 2:19:22Dir. Patel: You and state and local law officials copy assassin in 40 eight hours, did you not?

▶ 2:19:26Dir. Patel: I believe that timeline is correct.

▶ 2:19:29Sen. Kennedy: Congratulations. Sometimes we miss the forest for the trees, good work. Did Mr. kirks assassin act alone?

▶ 2:19:48Dir. Patel: As I've said since the beginning, it is very much an ongoing investigation and I can't speak to the state charges, that is for the state to address on their own, but we are providing them the same investigatory findings of the department and as I noted to senator cornyn or senator hawley, there are a number of individuals currently being investigated and irrigated and a number yet to be investigated and interrogated specific to that chat room so we are very

▶ 2:20:19Dir. Patel: Much in our ongoing posture investigation.

▶ 2:20:20Sen. Kennedy: So others could have been involved?

▶ 2:20:23Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 2:20:28Sen. Kennedy: I asked you this last time you were here, you remember Mr. peter strzok and Ms. lisa page?

▶ 2:20:39Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 2:20:41Sen. Kennedy: Peter strzok was in fbi agent, lisa page was an fbi lawyer. They were both very aggressive anti-trump political activists who allow their political opinions to affect their work at the fbi. Is that a fair statement?

▶ 2:20:59Dir. Patel: I believe the text messages and the testimony secured speak for themselves.

▶ 2:21:06Dir. Patel: In fact -- senator

▶ 2:21:10Kennedy: In fact, they were having an extramarital or a fair. Paige texted peter strzok, trump is not ever going to be president, right? Mr. strutt replied, no, no he won't. We will stop it. Ms. page resigned from the fbi. Mr. strutt was fired.

▶ 2:21:38Kennedy: They promptly sued the federal government and fbi and justice department for releasing their emails. Which revealed all of this. The fbi settled that lawsuit for $1.2 million. They gave Mr. strzok $1.2 million cash. They gave Ms. page $800,000.

▶ 2:22:08Kennedy: Who at the fbi made that decision to give the money?

▶ 2:22:10Dir. Patel: That settlement was reached in the biden administration when my predecessor was the director.

▶ 2:22:16Sen. Kennedy: Who? Are you saying chris wray did?

▶ 2:22:20Dir. Patel: The only people that can decide that settlement are the attorney general in conjunction with the director and the administration.

▶ 2:22:27Sen. Kennedy: So you are telling me that attorney general garland in director ray decided to give them the money?

▶ 2:22:33Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 2:22:36Sen. Kennedy: Now, when you took over the fbi, did you find instances of where under the biden administration the fbi had weaponized the agency to push --

▶ 2:23:01Dir. Patel: Sorry, the last part?

▶ 2:23:04Sen. Kennedy: Did you find instances of where the biden administration had politicized the fbi? To prosecute its political agenda?

▶ 2:23:16Dir. Patel: I won't speak for other people. Having been a target of that weaponization, having been a staffer on the house intelligence committee and having the justice department weaponize against me for leading the investigation of russia-gate , I know what that feels like and that's why is the fbi director I'm committed to not letting that happen again and I'm committed to fully investigating what was done and that matter is still ongoing.

▶ 2:23:41Sen. Kennedy: I will tell you the answer is yes.

▶ 2:23:44Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 2:23:45Sen. Kennedy: You are firing these people?

▶ 2:23:48Dir. Patel: Anyone who politicized is their job at the fbi will not work at the fbi.

▶ 2:23:53Sen. Kennedy: You heard some of my colleagues either implicitly or otherwise suggest that you have politicized the fbi. To prosecute the political beliefs of president trump. Is that true?

▶ 2:24:10Dir. Patel: I don't know how that can be true when the stats that I cited conclude the 23,000 arrests, 6000 weapons seized, 1600 gang and criminal enterprises, 4700 children found and rescued, more fentanyl seized then could kill one third of america.

▶ 2:24:32Sen. Kennedy: Have you fired people because they voted for vice president harris?

▶ 2:24:37Dir. Patel: I don't ask people who they vote for and neither does the fbi.

▶ 2:24:41Sen. Kennedy: You have given people polygraphs, have you not?

▶ 2:24:44Dir. Patel: Many people.

▶ 2:24:45Sen. Kennedy: The fbi does that all the time.

▶ 2:24:48Dir. Patel: Yes, sir. Decades.

▶ 2:24:52Sen. Kennedy: I want to ask you about the epstein files. Have you seen the epstein files?

▶ 2:24:59Dir. Patel: I have not reviewed the entirety of it myself. A good amount.

▶ 2:25:06Sen. Kennedy: Um, would it be fair to say that Mr. epstein trafficked young women including in some instances minors? For sex to himself?

▶ 2:25:24Dir. Patel: That was specifically the allegations in the 2018 indictment in the southern district of new york.

▶ 2:25:31Sen. Kennedy: Who else did he trafficked these young women to?

▶ 2:25:35Dir. Patel: In terms of what the investigation, again going back to 2008, Mr. acosta who limited the investigation and the search warrants and the parameters of the investigation, the only thing we are able to speak to publicly because he was given a nonprofit agreement by Mr. acosta is the first time period from 1997 through 2001, and then when the trump administration reopened it --

▶ 2:26:04Sen. Kennedy: I'm going to run out of time. You have seen most of the files. Who if anyone did epstein traffic these young women to besides himself?

▶ 2:26:16Dir. Patel: Himself, there is no credible information, none, if there were I would bring the case yesterday, that he traffic to other individuals. The information we have is limited.

▶ 2:26:29Sen. Kennedy: The answer is no one?

▶ 2:26:33Dir. Patel: In the information we have.

▶ 2:26:37Sen. Kennedy: In the file?

▶ 2:26:38Dir. Patel: In the case file.

▶ 2:26:40Sen. Kennedy: President trump has deferred to the fbi and the doj with respect to the epstein files, he said it is your call about releasing them. I understand the department and the agency have decided to release them in cooperation with the house committee. Is that correct?

▶ 2:26:59Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 2:27:00Sen. Kennedy: You are releasing them a little bit at a time, is that correct?

▶ 2:27:05Dir. Patel: We are releasing as much as we can, but we are limited by three different court orders and the department went back to each of those judges to waive those court orders or have them lifted and each of those judges declined.

▶ 2:27:19Sen. Kennedy: Will you release as many as you can?

▶ 2:27:22Dir. Patel: We will release everything we are legally permitted to do so. We are continuing to work on the subpoena requests with the house. We have substantially complied with it but we will release everything we are permitted to do so.

▶ 2:27:39Sen. Kennedy: I strongly encourage you to do so. This issue is not going away and I think the central question for the american people is this, they know that epstein trafficked young women for sex to himself. They want to know who if anyone else he trafficked these young women two. And that is a very fair question. I want to know the answer.

▶ 2:28:11Sen. Kennedy: I think you were going to have to do more to satisfy the american people, sir. The understandable curiosity in that regard.

▶ 2:28:20Dir. Patel: Mr. chairman, may I respond to that? I agree, senator. What we have done, just to remind folks, the epstein case files existed in the two prior administrations. The obama and the biden administration and they didn't release anything. Then president trump in the first administration renewed charges against epstein.

▶ 2:28:43Dir. Patel: I know it is a little complicated to understand but what exists in the epstein case files was a direct result of the limited search warrants from 2006 and 2000 seven which hamstrung future investigations because of the nonprosecution agreement and multiple administrations had the opportunity to look at the entirety of that case file and recommend prosecutions against anyone trafficked and anyone who

▶ 2:29:14Dir. Patel: Participated in the trafficking and the only person to bring charges was the prior administration against Mr. epstein. Now I'm not saying others were not trafficked and others were not involved, what I'm telling you is that based on the information we have that we have continuously and publicly asked for the public to come forward with more information if there is, but based on credible information, we have released all credible information and the information the department of justice and the fbi never releases his information on

▶ 2:29:45Dir. Patel: Investigations that are not credible. We don't release the names of victims who aren't credible. We don't release the names of victims who were credible. That is by law. The information we are releasing now is historic and it is also to the maximum capacity that the law allows. I know that is not going to satisfy many, many people.

▶ 2:30:06Dir. Patel: If they wanted it done right then the investigation from its origination should have been done right and he should not have been given a get out of jail free card to do jail on the weekends for 12 hours a day and he should have been investigated fully for the entirety of his crime and criminal enterprise, not just from 1997 through 2001.

▶ 2:30:25Chair Grassley: Senator blumenthal.

▶ 2:30:28Senator Blumenthal: Rector patel, thank you for being here today. You will recall well at your confirmation hearing before this committee I raised the prospect of politically motivated retaliation and you promised me as you did other members of this committee quote every fbi employee will be held to the absolute same standard and no one will be terminated for case

▶ 2:31:01Senator Blumenthal: Assignments. You went on to tell me "all fbi employees will be protected against political retribution." you assured one of my colleagues that you would honor the internal review process. I'm not going to mince words. You lied to me. In the short time you have been fbi director, you presided over a rash of retaliatory firings. Three fbi agents have recently sued you.

▶ 2:31:33Senator Blumenthal: They are fbi agents with 60 years between them of distinguished service. Rescuing hostages, saving kids from predators, dismantling drug cartels. And there allegations, their civil allegations are a searing indictment of your tenure as fbi director. But it is not just those three.

▶ 2:32:02Senator Blumenthal: The fbi agent association has said that your actions "distract agents from their work, foster fear that their assignments could cost them their careers, either now or under the next administration, and increase the risk of criminal and national security threats by undermining unity and morale within the bureau." this association as you know is voluntary and represents 14,000

▶ 2:32:33Senator Blumenthal: Members, 90% of all the active agents, these are your employees. Saying that your performance has been unqualified and unfit. And there is mounting evidence that these retaliatory firings were the result of direction from the white house. There have been instances in the past, in the history of the bureau, of political interference.

▶ 2:33:04Senator Blumenthal: And political direction from the directors office, but not the kind of institutional interference we are seeing from the white house right now. I'm going to ask you, has anyone from the white house contacted you about personnel decisions?

▶ 2:33:25Dir. Patel: I completely disagree with your entire premise that I've lied or misleading the fbi. If I were, the results I announced today by the men and women of the fbi and the historic records we are doing would not be possible, the men and women of the fbi are responding to our leadership and this administrations priorities.

▶ 2:33:47Dir. Patel: The only way people get terminated at the fbi is if they failed to meet the muster of their jobs and duties and you accusing me of lying is something I don't take lightly but I'm not going to get into a tit for tat with you.

▶ 2:33:57Sen. Blumenthal: Let me just ask you to answer my question. Has anyone from the white house contacted you about personnel decisions?

▶ 2:34:05Dir. Patel: Generally speaking we always discuss with the white house during the budget process how many personnel we need, who we need wear.

▶ 2:34:14Sen. Blumenthal: The answer is yes.

▶ 2:34:16Dir. Patel: For budgetary purposes.

▶ 2:34:19Sen. Blumenthal: -- fire people or agents because they participated investigations of the president?

▶ 2:34:26Dir. Patel: I don't receive directions to do that. I make the decisions.

▶ 2:34:29Sen. Blumenthal: Has anyone asked you to do it? The best information is yes you have taken suggestions and directions from the white house in firing qualified agents.

▶ 2:34:40Dir. Patel: Any termination at the fbi was a decision I made based on the evidence I have as the director of the fbi and I'm not going to shy away from it and as you stated, those are allegations and that is an ongoing litigation. They will have their day in court and so will we.

▶ 2:34:57Sen. Blumenthal: The allegations are not just in that lawsuit, director patel. I think your testimony confirms that in fact you have taken direction from the white house. In those firings.

▶ 2:35:08Dir. Patel: It literally does not.

▶ 2:35:10Sen. Blumenthal: You have acknowledge that they have been in contact with you about personnel decisions.

▶ 2:35:18Dir. Patel: Do not put words in my mouth. The white house like any administration contacts its agents these and of the budgeting process and where mission priorities are and personnel. If they didn't do that, they would be abdicating the duty to law enforcement. I will always work with my partners in the chain of command to ensure this fbi is delivering the results we are delivering to include the lowest murder rate in modern U.S. history, the most fentanyl seizures in modern U.S.

▶ 2:35:47Dir. Patel: History, the most lives saved and children found. That is a working fbi, that is not a failing fbi.

▶ 2:35:52Sen. Blumenthal: Let's move on to a related area. In white house discussions, have you been asked or directed by the white house or others to engage in a crackdown on political groups or organizations, nonprofits after the murder of charlie kirk?

▶ 2:36:23Dir. Patel: Political organizations? No. I've been asked by my chain of command to properly root out criminal activity wherever it is in whatever investigation we are conducting.

▶ 2:36:37Sen. Blumenthal: Have those distinctions about whom you going to target then based on directions from the white house?

▶ 2:36:44Dir. Patel: Nobody gives me a list on who to target, my targeting list is from the men and women at the fbi.

▶ 2:36:50Sen. Blumenthal: Have you talked about investigating certain groups, nonprofits, or foundations or institutions?

▶ 2:36:56Dir. Patel: Whatever those investigations are they are ongoing and I will not get into them.

▶ 2:37:00Sen. Blumenthal: Have you used polygraphs to determine loyalty of agents?

▶ 2:37:06Dir. Patel: No.

▶ 2:37:08Sen. Blumenthal: Have you committed that you will respect the first amendment rights of agents?

▶ 2:37:17Dir. Patel: I have wildly committed to respecting the first amendment rights of agents , but at the fbi you have to balance your first amendment rights with your mission.

▶ 2:37:26Dir. Patel: Have you imposed any sort of loyalty test in the course of using polygraphs or in any of the other personnel decisions?

▶ 2:37:36Dir. Patel: Polygraphs have been utilized at the fbi for decades and they will continue to be utilized in the fashion by the professionals that administer them.

▶ 2:37:45Sen. Blumenthal: Have you asked under the polygraph test about individuals' loyalty or about their voting records or any kind of past statement?

▶ 2:37:55Dir. Patel: Just to make it abundantly clear, I don't tell the professionals how to conduct polygraphs or what questions to ask, they make those decisions. And I never ask anyone who they voted for.

▶ 2:38:08Sen. Blumenthal: Have you investigated donors to a political party simply because they are donors?

▶ 2:38:15Dir. Patel: Simply based on that fact alone? No.

▶ 2:38:19Sen. Blumenthal: Have you investigated donors for another reason?

▶ 2:38:22Dir. Patel: Many donors may be involved in criminal enterprises and activities and those individuals will be investigated.

▶ 2:38:29Sen. Blumenthal: Can you commit to make public the epstein files that so far have not been released? If this committee is able to review them on a classified basis.

▶ 2:38:46Dir. Patel: I think this is an important distinction. The epstein case file is not classified to my understanding. So we are providing what we legally can. We are going to give congress what we are legally permitted to do so to the maximum extent of the law.

▶ 2:39:03Sen. Blumenthal: Will you enable the chairman and the ranking member to review them on a classified basis?

▶ 2:39:10Dir. Patel: That doesn't make any sense. If the material in the epstein file is not classified there is no basis for classified --

▶ 2:39:19Sen. Blumenthal: But it would protect the confidentiality of them.

▶ 2:39:23Dir. Patel: If anyone in this room can get the multiple district court judges to lift their protective orders and ceiling, we will happily provide you more information.

▶ 2:39:35Sen. Blumenthal: Are you in favor of merging the dea and the atf?

▶ 2:39:38Dir. Patel: That's not something for me to comment on.

▶ 2:39:42Sen. Blumenthal: Well, those agencies work with you, don't they?

▶ 2:39:45Dir. Patel: With me, not for me.

▶ 2:39:47Sen. Blumenthal: Argue in favor of orienting the fbi toward a national police function as opposed to the enforcement of federal law?

▶ 2:39:57Dir. Patel: The fbi does enforce federal law across the country, that is what we do.

▶ 2:40:03Sen. Blumenthal: But isn't it a fact that you have told the leadership of the fbi that you view it as moving toward a local and state police function?

▶ 2:40:14Dir. Patel: No, we are prioritizing working with our local and state partners and they will tell you that that has never happened with this much engagement in the history they have been serving as local law or some and officers. I believe local cops are the best intelligent source and understanding of their communities and I have folded in my fbi agents under their direction to get that job done.

▶ 2:40:38Sen. Blumenthal: Thank, Mr. chairman.

▶ 2:40:40Chair Grassley: For the fourth time today I want to remind people that my oversight has made clear that director ray's fbi was politicized. I have policed a trove of records to prove it. Not only today but in past days.

▶ 2:41:04Chair Grassley: I've also said some fbi personnel who have been fired retaliated against my whistleblowers and I don't remember my democratic colleagues defending my whistleblowers.

▶ 2:41:23Senator Schmitt: Before I get into the thrust of my comments and questions, director, I want to thank you. In our meetings prior to your confirmation and during her confirmation, we talked about your desire to get more agents into the field out of washington and take on violent crime. You have fulfilled that. I know it is not only an isolated event, but we certainly appreciate you honoring your commitment to do that.

▶ 2:42:01Senator Schmitt: It is obviously no secret that this hearing takes place in the wake of a horrific american tragedy, the assassination of charlie kirk. For those of us on him, I know you did too, still sort of difficult to put into words what a tragic loss that is not only for our family -- his family, but for our country and free speech and for a believe that we can have a free exchange of ideas and he was literally shot in the throat in an attempt to

▶ 2:42:32Senator Schmitt: Silence him and take his life. You have this task of this investigation, there has been an arrest. But I think that we face an even larger crisis that law enforcement alone can't tackle alone. It is a crisis that has culminated in the assassination of charlie. But it doesn't end there, I think it is every bit present right now and the challenge is greater then I quite frankly would have imagined.

▶ 2:43:04Senator Schmitt: Seeing some of the comments that have taken place after the assassination. It is something as a country I think we have to reckon with. It is something deeper, much deeper than a rejection of law and order or the norms of civil society. We have entered a very dangerous time I think in our country. That should be clear to everyone.

▶ 2:43:29Senator Schmitt: Political violence is a sign of a deep and corrosive sickness in any society, but in america today, the problem is not just political violence in the abstract. It is a specific kind of political violence, which is overwhelmingly driven by a specific set of actors and groups. None of this emerged out of thin air.

▶ 2:43:55Senator Schmitt: Over the past week leaders from across the political spectrum have come out and forcefully condemned charlie's murder and political violence more broadly. For that we are all very grateful, we should be grateful. There have been calls to unite and come together in the wake of charlie's murder and I want to do that. I do. Someday, I pray we can be united as a country again and go forward together as one people and under one flag, but we are not united.

▶ 2:44:27Senator Schmitt: Upstream from the dehumanization and demonizing political violence and rhetoric tearing apart our country is a divide on how we view america and americans. Is america good, is america people, is there something inherently special about western civilization or is this 2000 year project rotten to the core? If it is something we are fighting for, how do we do it? With words and ideas like charlie did?

▶ 2:44:58Senator Schmitt: Or with firebombs and assassin bullets? Political violence is always wrong, period, full stop, it doesn't matter which name or ideology, but in america today political violence is not a problem that falls equally along both sides. We have to be honest about this. We must reject an attempt to paint it as some kind of random phenomenon with no particular ideology.

▶ 2:45:25Senator Schmitt: A kind of spontaneous insanity which takes place outside of any broader social context and has no pattern at all. That is wrong. So free speech yes, political violence no, but we have to be honest about what is happening. Already we are hearing people talk about charlie's assassination in those terms.

▶ 2:45:46Senator Schmitt: We are told we can't possibly know what drove a killer to plan and carry out a murder on the -- of the most prominent conservative activist in america. That's a lie, we do know. The facts are plain and clear and we have to speak truth in this moment or there is no other side of the mountain. The vast majority of americans are against political violence. But there is a vocal, active minority that encourages and celebrates it.

▶ 2:46:16Senator Schmitt: That minority is overwhelmingly on the left. Just last week a poll found that a quarter, a full 25% of those people who describe themselves as very liberal say it can be justified for citizens to use violence to achieve lytic ogles. Less than 3% of very conservative americans say the same. That is too many, that is 3% too many. But we are lying if we think this is a both sides thing.

▶ 2:46:47Senator Schmitt: It is not. We have to confront it. You are going to have an important job of rooting out these terrorists. This is an ideology that runs very deep. The numbers are virtually identical to the ones I noted when it comes to whether or not it is ok to celebrate the deaths of people we disagree with.

▶ 2:47:08Senator Schmitt: While large majorities in both parties were opposed to celebrating political violence, democrats overall were nearly twice as likely as republicans to believe it is usually or always acceptable to celebrate the death of a public figure they oppose. What in the hell is going on? Earlier this year, a poll found that more than 55% of people on the left believe that it would be at least somewhat justified to murder donald trump.

▶ 2:47:43Senator Schmitt: These are not just some abstractions on a page. These are our fellow citizens. How can we come together with people who believe these things? We have all seen the flood of posts on social media over the past week, not just a fringe view, but thousands of people gleefully celebrating a father of two young children getting gunned down in broad daylight. I wish I wouldn't have seen that video, I wish my kids would not have seen that video.

▶ 2:48:14Senator Schmitt: Blue sky, the left-wing alternative to x, was so overwhelmed with the posts that the platform was forced to issue a statement to users to stop glorifying the murder. It wasn't just random social media trolls. It was journalists. Elite college professors. Even politicians. All but saying charlie's assassination was justified because of what he thought, because of what he said.

▶ 2:48:44Senator Schmitt: We saw the flood of hitch pieces. The most powerful media outlets dishonestly attacking and villain icing charlie in the most visible -- vicious possible terms. How can you ask us to unite under that? There can be no unity between good and evil. Somebody has to win this thing. As a country, we have to absolutely reject it. And don't tell me it is both sides. It didn't happen in a vacuum.

▶ 2:49:16Senator Schmitt: Over the past decade we have seen an explosion of political violence, not just one off lone wolf attacks, but organized, systemic political violence. It is not organic. It is the offspring of a dark and clandestine system funded in part with our own tax dollars with a large network of foundations, ngos, activist organizations, and front groups. This system lurks behind every radical leftist movement in our nation today.

▶ 2:49:47Senator Schmitt: The george soros empire has financed a vast ecosystem of radicals working together, dropping off bricks at riots, to unleash a tidal wave of violent anarchy us on our street. And an army of research and experts and propagandists who down lay the political violence. I don't have a ton of time.

▶ 2:50:16Senator Schmitt: And I would point out we have heard years of the left, their loudest voices calling anyone on the right extremist, extremist maga republicans, fascists, nazis, an existential threat to democracy. Don't give me this both sides bullshit!

▶ 2:50:47Senator Schmitt: Were the perpetrators asking from a left or right wing political violence? The man who tried to kill republican congressmen at the congressional baseball practice nearly killing house majority steve scalise? Left or right wing violence?

▶ 2:50:58Dir. Patel: I believe it was left-wing ideology.

▶ 2:51:01Sen. Schmitt: Burned down cities during the summer of love in the george floyd riots?

▶ 2:51:07Dir. Patel: I will rely on you on these. I don't have off the top of my head.

▶ 2:51:12Sen. Schmitt: Ok, left-wing. The christmas parade massacre. Left-wing. The lee zeldin stabbing attempt. Left-wing. The covenant school shooting in nashville. Left-wing. The butler, pennsylvania assassination attempt, left-wing. The trump international west palm beach assassination attempt, left-wing.the abundant life christian school shooting, left-wing.

▶ 2:51:39Sen. Schmitt: The united care ceo murder, left-wing. Tesla's keyed, burned, left-wing. The ice facilities firebombs, left-wing. The minnesota catholic school shooting, left-wing. The antiwhite scarlet -- charlotte left-wing. The utah news firebombing, left-wing. Another culmination of this vile trend, the left-wing assassination of charlie kirk.

▶ 2:52:07Sen. Schmitt: Don't give me this both sides, if we want to get to unity, let's be honest. Free speech yes, political violence, no, but let's be honest.

▶ 2:52:15Chair Grassley: Senator?

▶ 2:52:18Senator Hirono: Director patel, just like the rest of the federal government, there have been significant personnel changes at the fbi since president trump took office. I want to better understand the scope of the turnover at the fbi.

▶ 2:52:43Senator Hirono: Since january 2025, how many fbi employees have retired, resigned or been other separated from employment? I need a number.

▶ 2:52:52Dir. Patel: We will get you a number.

▶ 2:52:53Sen. Hirono: You don't have it?

▶ 2:52:56Dir. Patel: Not off the top of my head.

▶ 2:52:58Sen. Hirono: Would it surprise you to know it is probably like 5000?

▶ 2:53:02Dir. Patel: I don't think that is accurate.

▶ 2:53:05Sen. Hirono: How many special agents or analysts have left or been fired from the fbi since january 25?

▶ 2:53:11Dir. Patel: We will get you the numbers and anyone that retires is of their own volition and anyone terminated that the fbi is done so because they have failed to meet the standards and uphold their loyalty and oath to the constitution.

▶ 2:53:25Sen. Hirono: How many executive assistant directors, assistant directors, or special agents in charge have left or been fired from the fbi since january 20, 2025?

▶ 2:53:38Dir. Patel: Again, people leaving on of their own accord --

▶ 2:53:44Sen. Hirono: With the question I'm getting to the leadership of the fbi and you don't have that answer. Next question, which field office division or directorate has lost the most personnel since january 20, 2025? Do you have that answer?

▶ 2:54:02Dir. Patel: Yes, actually every single field office in the country including hawaii has received a plus up of fbi agent's because we are pushing them out to the field.

▶ 2:54:13Sen. Hirono: Ok, so you are telling me that no field office division or directorate has lost any personnel since january 20, 2025? That is your answer?

▶ 2:54:26Dir. Patel: In hawaii, there has been a plus up, and every single state we have allocated a plus up for field offices across the country so the fbi can continue the historic achievements it has done in the last seven months. When you are talking about firings you are looking for a media hit and a fundraising clip and I'm not going to give it to you.

▶ 2:54:46Sen. Hirono: It doesn't matter on what basis they left, I just want to know how many have left and I think your testimony is nobody has left.

▶ 2:54:56Dir. Patel: Nope, that is not my testimony. You asked and I answered and you didn't get the answer you wanted for your clip and I told you I would get you the numbers but you can basking it.

▶ 2:55:07Sen. Hirono: Which field office division or directorate has gained the most personnel since january 20, 2025? You noted there have been plus ups. Which offices have received it?

▶ 2:55:21Dir. Patel: The greatest allocation that I believe was given to california and then florida.

▶ 2:55:29Sen. Hirono: Where are those offices?

▶ 2:55:32Dir. Patel: California and florida.

▶ 2:55:37Sen. Hirono: You often refer to fbi agents as cops. All of us, democrats and republicans support the police officers who keep our communities safe but weller states, cities, counties, and towns all employ police officers to protect our community is, congress has empowered and equipped the fbi to take on missions that local police cannot, especially taking on terrorists, hackers, and spies.

▶ 2:56:06Sen. Hirono: I would like to assess how well the fbi is able to handle it specialized missions under your leadership. The fbi is the nation's lead federal law enforcement agency for investigating and preventing acts of domestic and international terrorism and yet the executive assistant directors in charge of the fbi's national security and intelligence branches were both forced out at the beginning of the year. Who replaced them in those positions?

▶ 2:56:36Dir. Patel: Excellent qualified personnel to lead the mission of arresting 23,000 violent minerals this year alone.

▶ 2:56:44Sen. Hirono: Do you have the names of the people who took the places?

▶ 2:56:47Dir. Patel: I'm not going to give you any name so you can attack them.

▶ 2:56:51Sen. Hirono: Why not?

▶ 2:56:53Dir. Patel: So you can attack them. The people sitting in those seeds are extremely qualified.

▶ 2:56:58Sen. Hirono: You are not going to tell me the names of personnel?

▶ 2:57:04Dir. Patel: We had a reduction of the state of -- violence in the state of hawaii.

▶ 2:57:07Sen. Hirono: Earlier this year, fbi counterterrorist agents and investigators were reassigned to assist with immigration enforcement. Reportedly, these counterterrorism experts were returned to the jobs they were trained for in late january after iran threatened to retaliate for our strikes on their nuclear facilities. Have the experts remained in the jobs they trained for since that time?

▶ 2:57:34Dir. Patel: Fbi agent's primary responsibility is exactly what they are assigned to do.

▶ 2:57:40Sen. Hirono: Have they been returned to their positions?

▶ 2:57:43Dir. Patel: If you are not going to answer, why don't you just do your soliloquy?

▶ 2:57:48Sen. Hirono: It is just a yes or no. I'm not asking for soliloquy. Are they still in those jobs?

▶ 2:57:53Dir. Patel: They never left.

▶ 2:57:56Sen. Hirono: What was that?

▶ 2:58:00Dir. Patel: They never left their primary job. It is a surge of resources working with the interagency to combat violent crime.

▶ 2:58:10Sen. Hirono: That is your testimony. The fbi is also the lead federal agency for investigating cyber attacks and cyber intrusions. Both by foreign nationstates and by nonstate hacker groups. Since president trump's inauguration, the is a guy -- the executive assistant director in charge of the criminal and cyber branch and the head of the fbi cyber division have both left the fbi.

▶ 2:58:39Sen. Hirono: What are the names of the people who replaced them in those positions?

▶ 2:58:42Dir. Patel: The cyber branch is one of the most impressive at the fbi. 400 nine arrests, 169 convictions. A 42% increase from the same time last year. So any suggestion that the fbi cyber division is not operating at full capacity and better than ever before, the leadership of the branches impacting the changes necessary to attack the cyber ransomware networks.

▶ 2:59:08Sen. Hirono: I want to know who has those positions since the people who originally were there.

▶ 2:59:14Dir. Patel: Supremely qualified individuals.

▶ 2:59:16Sen. Hirono: Who are they?

▶ 2:59:18Dir. Patel: Supremely qualified individuals.

▶ 2:59:21Sen. Hirono: One are the names?

▶ 2:59:22Dir. Patel: You are not getting them.

▶ 2:59:24Sen. Hirono: You don't know. Special agent to investigate cyber crime were also reassigned for immigration enforcement. Have those expert investigators returned to their duties?

▶ 2:59:36Dir. Patel: All agents remain on their primary duties well surging to the homeland security task forces the country.

▶ 2:59:46Sen. Hirono: Are you?

▶ 2:59:48Dir. Patel: Mi what?

▶ 2:59:50Sen. Hirono: I'm not getting to yes or no answers, I'm getting all these explanations.

▶ 2:59:58Dir. Patel: No, you are getting what the fbi women and men do. You don't want that. The only people terminated that the fbi will be those who violate their oath of office and failed to meet the high standards of the fbi.

▶ 3:00:11Sen. Hirono: Director patel, the fbi is meant to be the tip of the spear in combating terrorism against the united states from foreign and domestic sources. It is also our lead agency targeting hackers. But instead of a specialized role fighting these terrorists, hackers, and spies, you have the fbi playing the role of local police and helping with immigration enforcement.

▶ 3:00:41Sen. Hirono: I'm going to move on to my, you have been asked some questions about changes to your hiring standard and they included college degrees and possibly the age, but one question I had is that you are now requiring applicants to be able to do a certain kind of pull-ups?

▶ 3:01:14Sen. Hirono: Which a lot of women cannot because of physiological differences. Are you requiring these kinds of pull-ups?

▶ 3:01:22Dir. Patel: We are requiring a physical program at quantico because fbi agent's carrying guns in the field have to chase down bad guys into really hard work. The physical fitness standards --

▶ 3:01:35Sen. Hirono: Are you requiring these kinds of pull-ups?

▶ 3:01:39Dir. Patel: We are requiring everybody to pass the 18-11 standards. If you want to chase down the bad guy, you better be able to do a pull-up.

▶ 3:01:49Sen. Hirono: The reason I ask is there are concerns about whether or not being able to do these kinds of harsh pull-ups is really required of fbi agent's?

▶ 3:01:59Dir. Patel: Doing one pull-up is not harsh and there are always medical exemptions.

▶ 3:02:04Sen. Hirono: I'm gravely concerned by the state of the fbi under your concern and you are willing to take a cut of almost half $1 billion for your agency. You are losing decades of expertise, leading to early retirements, firings, and reassignments to immigration enforcement or conducting local police work. Thousands of already left.

▶ 3:02:32Sen. Hirono: For as long as you remain as the head of the fbi, I fear the number of departures will continue to grow. Mr. patel, before the vote on your nomination of this committee, I noted that your most significant qualification, this is not something I noted, but also others, your most significant qualification was your 100% loyalty to president trump.

▶ 3:02:59Sen. Hirono: I fear that that continues to be the motivating factor in your position as fbi director. Thank you.

▶ 3:03:04Dir. Patel: May I, Mr. chairman?

▶ 3:03:07Chair Grassley: Mr. patel?

▶ 3:03:09Dir. Patel: That is an entire falsehood. You can delete my 16 years of government service to multiple administrations. I was a public defender, and national security prosecutor, a house intelligent staffer, a chief of staff to the department of defense and the secretary of defense. I led the counterterrorism missions for the white house. Those are some of the jobs I held in my 16 year career. There is no loyalty then or now to the constitution.

▶ 3:03:40Chair Grassley: Senator britt?

▶ 3:03:40Senator Britt: I want to thank senator hirono, acknowledging there are physical differences between men and women. Talking about that women wouldn't be able to do as many pull-ups and I think she was making a face that there should be different standards. There is a thing called title ix and this is why we continue to say we should have biological men in men's sports and biological women in women's sports. I look forward to utilizing that to talk to all of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle.

▶ 3:04:10Senator Britt: I think maybe they will stand with us to protect women's sports. Director patel, thank you for being here, thank you for making your commitment to making sure america is safe again. Thank you for doing that coast-to-coast and within our cities. I look forward to talking about your historic gains, but I would be remiss if I didn't begin my questioning with you about the horrific events we have seen over the last week.

▶ 3:04:42Senator Britt: Obviously our heartbreaks not only for erika and charlie's two children and for parents and families, but for america and those of us who knew him, you being chief among those. My sincere condolences.

▶ 3:04:59Senator Britt: Thank you for the steps that you and the fbi have taken to make sure we have someone in custody but if you look over the last since last summer alone, we had two assassination attempts on the president, we have had an arson attack on governor shapiro in pennsylvania, you have the murder of the state representatives in minnesota. Along with the shooting of state Sen. john hoffman and his wife.

▶ 3:05:25Senator Britt: Several antisemitic attacks, several attacks on christians noted by senator hawley. We had the killing of two israeli embassy staffers in D.C. the june firebombing in colorado, we could go on and on and we saw a culmination as senator schmitt said with the brutal assassination of charlie kirk last week. I appreciate you committing to senator hawley and senator kennedy talking about making sure that all that are involved are held accountable.

▶ 3:05:55Senator Britt: I think that is critically important. I think america needs that transparency. I want to review the words of vice president vance, he said, if we want to stop political violence like what happened to charlie kirk, we have to be honest about the people celebrating it and the people who are financing it.

▶ 3:06:16Senator Britt: My question to you is in light of charlie's murder and all of the things we have been talking about today, what steps is the fbi taking tomorrow grasa crackdown on those who promote, encourage, finance, fund these types of engagements and this type of political violence?

▶ 3:06:35Dir. Patel: Thank you, senator for your kind words. In terms of how we crackdown on the root cause of this violence if we put aside the ideological motivations and how they got there, the monetary issue is a real issue we work with our partners at the treasury department to trace where the money came from, how these individuals paid for the training they received or the platforms they were using.

▶ 3:07:05Dir. Patel: And how these individuals collectively got together in whatever groups they were on on whatever social media sites they were on to utilize clique bait to make money for their ideology. To trace ideology, we are utilizing in charlie's investigation and others, lawful ross s and serving orders on any entity related in any way financially to any of these criminal acts of violence. We will hold them accountable.

▶ 3:07:35Sen. Britt: Excellent, I would love to stay abreast of that and we must follow the money. Someone is funding this. There are people here unfortunately american citizens that may be engaged in that. You believe some of this may be coming from overseas?

▶ 3:07:54Dir. Patel: Yes.

▶ 3:07:55Sen. Britt: Let's get to the bottom of it and make it stop. I want to ask about the dos decision. We know it was leaked in may. We found nothing in january of 2023. I find that absolutely mind-boggling. That we can figure out who leaked that opinion. We know what was done in an attempts to undermine the process and then the intimidation of the justices occurred after that.

▶ 3:08:25Sen. Britt: Tell me what you can do as fbi director to hold someone accountable.

▶ 3:08:38Dir. Patel: I can't speak what the marshals -- two of the marshals did, but the fbi has taken over the investigation.

▶ 3:08:43Sen. Britt: Do you commit to getting to the bottom of it?

▶ 3:08:47Dir. Patel: We are you to lose -- we are utilizing the full resources of the fbi.

▶ 3:08:53Sen. Britt: We need answers. I want to talk about child sexual exploitation. Thank you, thank you, thank you for protecting our youth and making that your top priority. We know that is our greatest treasure here. Finally we have an fbi director putting that at the top of his list. Can you tell me the steps and the different initiatives? I've heard you talk about a couple of them.

▶ 3:09:25Sen. Britt: Can you tell me what they are doing? Tell me what you're doing about sextortion. If you are looking at what is happening, whether people are snapping photos and what is happening online, I have had a number of parents sitting in front of me and telling me terrible, heartbreaking stories about children taking their own life because of the blackmail.

▶ 3:09:53Sen. Britt: I want to know what steps you are taking to get to the bottom of that. If this were happening in a storefront, Mr. director, that store would be shut down no matter where it was coast-to-coast yet we continue to allow these things to happen and we have to have a more targeted approach when we look at this. What are you doing to protect children in specifically sextortion?

▶ 3:10:15Dir. Patel: In our initiative for violent crimes against children initiative, those are producing the results I told you about, 1500 child predators arrested, 40 700 children identified and saved.

▶ 3:10:39Dir. Patel: Specifically on the six torsion question, that is a problem we are seeing explode on generative ai and private sector and social media companies and what we are doing is engaging and this data should cause great pause, they have seen a 1300 when he 5% increase in generative ai leading to sextortion and child sexual abuse. That cannot be countermanded by the fbi alone.

▶ 3:11:08Dir. Patel: We have embedded people and we are in great partnership with them. What we need to do is we arrested 400 individuals in may, these individuals have prioritized this.

▶ 3:11:22Sen. Britt: Wow, thank you.

▶ 3:11:27Dir. Patel: They are doing multiple missions at the same time and we won't stop doing two things at once. We need help from social media companies and the private sector and internet service providers that allow this generative ai to be hosted on their platforms. We have got to get a resolution on that.

▶ 3:11:45Sen. Britt: We are definitely committed to working on that, see you let us know what tools you need and we have several ideas we look forward to pushing forward. In my remaining two minutes, I want to talk to you about your historic results when it comes to crime, in particular we have seen here in D.C. just a total transformation. You mentioned earlier, 60% down in gun crime.

▶ 3:12:18Sen. Britt: We have a success story and we appreciate president trump's leadership. They are and montgomery, it is a coordinated effort with montgomery pd. And are sheriffs. They have seen a 30% drop it is actually producing results.

▶ 3:12:50Sen. Britt: It is the type of interagency connectivity that will lead us to safer cities and streets. I know that you are committed to that and committed to working with your partners. You have elevated sheriffs and police officers. I'm grateful to the men and women in uniform who have made this happen. How is the fbi working to collaborate in these types of ways? To make sure we have even greater success stories to tell.

▶ 3:13:22Dir. Patel: We bring 4000 students through. For training every year. We will bring them through the redstone arsenal. I mean sheriffs, police chiefs, cops, intel analysts. That is how we will train local law enforcement in the future.

▶ 3:13:53Dir. Patel: I encourage everyone to go down and take a look because if you want to see where the fbi is going and how it is going to train the future, it is happening at want to co-and redstone.

▶ 3:14:02Sen. Britt: We are very proud of it.

▶ 3:14:04Chair Grassley: C1

▶ 3:14:11Sen. Booker: I asked whether you had any knowledge or discussions about removing fbi officials, and installing political personnel before you were confirmed to that position. And I wonder did you then understand or have conversations with the white house with the intentions to do so?

▶ 3:14:29Dir. Patel: Before I was confirmed? Did I have discussions with the white house to remove fbi personnel? No.

▶ 3:14:38Sen. Booker: So you are saying you had no discussions with the right house before you were in the position about the removal of any personnel from the agency?

▶ 3:14:48Dir. Patel: As I was preparing for my confirmation hearing, I had numerous discussions involving the type of people that would be employed, and that those that were failing to meet the market that the fbi would no longer be employed --

▶ 3:15:00Sen. Booker: I'm sure -- I'm assuming that mark had to do with loyalty to the trump administration?

▶ 3:15:05Dir. Patel: You are wrong.

▶ 3:15:06Sen. Booker: I would like to revisit another subject. You did testify before the grand jury that president trump had declassified the documents at issue mar-a-lago classified documents case, is that correct?

▶ 3:15:22Dir. Patel: I don't have the grand jury transcript. Whatever it says is the best evidence.

▶ 3:15:26Sen. Booker: That's lisa to senator whitehouse, that it was publicly released. It has not been. In july, a court denied a news outlet's bid to get that transcript. But the court said quite clearly that you are free to discuss your grand jury test stuff -- testimony. I ask you again, did you testify before the grand jury that president trump declassified the documents at issue in the mar-a-lago classified document case?

▶ 3:15:55Dir. Patel: That is why I took your invitation to work with the department to have that transcript released. The transcript is the best evidence of what I said then.

▶ 3:16:07Sen. Booker: You are saying right now this committee can have access to what you said before the grand jury?

▶ 3:16:11Dir. Patel: Two whatever was released. To my understanding --

▶ 3:16:15Sen. Booker: You and I both understand the law. Let me finish. I understand under rule six of the federal rules and procedure, grand jury witness, in this case you, is not barred from sharing their grand jury testimony. This is an oversight hearing. This is germane to your integrity and credibility. You know right now whether or not you testified that president trump declassified the documents at issue.

▶ 3:16:47Sen. Booker: Why are you refusing to answer that simple yes or no question right now?

▶ 3:16:53Dir. Patel: Because the premise of your question is inaccurate.

▶ 3:16:56Sen. Booker: There is no premise to my question. But trying to get an order of what is truth or not.

▶ 3:17:04Dir. Patel: How do you know what was asked of the grand jury if you weren't there?

▶ 3:17:06Sen. Booker: Distro patel, this is -- Mr. patel, this is a mockery.

▶ 3:17:11Dir. Patel: It is a simple question.

▶ 3:17:12Sen. Booker: During your nomination hearing, you promised that "all fbi employees will be protected against political retribution." when I asked you are you aware of any plans or discussions to punish in any way, you set under oath you are not aware of any plans to punish fbi agent's associated with criminal investigations of donald trump.

▶ 3:17:40Sen. Booker: I don't believe you were truthful. Firing fbi employees based solely on the cases that they are investigated is illegal and you know that. A new lawsuit that has been discussed numerous times filed by three fbi officials alleges that you carried out donald trump's campaign of retribution against fbi employees for " failure to demonstrate sufficient political loyalty." one of those plaintiffs has been discussed today, brian driscoll.

▶ 3:18:10Sen. Booker: We know 20 years of distinguished service to the fbi before you terminated him. Special agent in charge of fbi's newer office where he operated with distinction. You terminated him via a letter dated october 8, 2025. In that letter, you said you were firing him pursuant to article two of the constitution. You are not the president of the united states. I'm wondering, under what authority you are allowed to terminate him?

▶ 3:18:43Dir. Patel: That matter is under litigation and I'm not able to discuss it.

▶ 3:18:45Sen. Booker: Will discuss this. Did you have discussions with stephen miller about firing this particular person or about his continuance in the fbi?

▶ 3:18:55Dir. Patel: Not that I recall.

▶ 3:18:59Sen. Booker: How often do you speak to stephen miller?

▶ 3:19:00Dir. Patel: Frequently on our homeland security taskforces.

▶ 3:19:05Sen. Booker: You frequently speak to stephen miller on subjects other than homeland security taskforces issues, correct?

▶ 3:19:14Dir. Patel: I frequently talk to Mr. miller about homeland security taskforces.

▶ 3:19:16Sen. Booker: Has stephen miller ever given you his opinions on how to run your agency?

▶ 3:19:21Dir. Patel: Mr. miller's interagency, that is what we talk about.

▶ 3:19:27Sen. Booker: You frequently discuss your job and responsibility with stephen miller and pam bondi I imagine?

▶ 3:19:35Dir. Patel: Absolutely, she is the attorney general.

▶ 3:19:38Sen. Booker: Understood. Donald trump promised to make us all safer. You have pushed out senior fbi agent's with decades of knowledge and experience. This is the first time in fbi history when the director or deputy director have any experience with the fbi. You shifted the agency's priority primary -- pursuing the trump agenda. According to I.c.e.

▶ 3:20:00Sen. Booker: Data, the cato institute found 20% of all agents have been diverted from their work to do -- to assist I.c.e. Immigration enforcement. 20%. Part of this operation is the work of mass law enforcement who jump out of cars, snatch people of streets in churches, schools and their jobs and hospitals.

▶ 3:20:25Sen. Booker: Have there been any fbi agent who investigate crimes against children that have been assigned to immigration enforcement? Yes or no?

▶ 3:20:33Dir. Patel: The premise of what you say is --

▶ 3:20:38Sen. Booker: Has any fbi agent --

▶ 3:20:42Dir. Patel: You don't get to say america is not safer. America is safer because of the work of the fbi.

▶ 3:20:48Sen. Booker: You are making that --

▶ 3:20:53Dir. Patel: We have 6000 weapons and --

▶ 3:20:54Sen. Booker: Fbi agent who investigate human trafficking have been reassigned to immigration enforcement. You are not denying fbi agents who on the task force that fight against russian oligarchs have not been reassigned, public correction squad reassigned, people who defend us -- defend children reassigned. You are not denying that.

▶ 3:21:14Dir. Patel: Fbi agent still get reassigned.

▶ 3:21:16Sen. Booker: Attack my colleagues premises of questions as a way to not answer the questions. Let me end with this. I believe you have made our country weaker and less safe. I believe we are more vulnerable to a major event, and I pray to god it doesn't happen. You have a gutted the bureau of institutional knowledge and expertise. You fired or pushed out seasoned fbi officials, many with more than 20 years of experience. And we are working on cases that were critical.

▶ 3:21:47Sen. Booker: You have been purging thousands of serious law enforcement officials who spent their careers keeping us safe, only to lower hiring standards in order to find anyone to replace them. And shockingly, you admitted in this hearing to senator coons that it would take 14 years to fill the vacancies that your agency, many are the result of your purge. 20% of fbi agent's are doing low-level immigration enforcement instead of their mission-critical work.

▶ 3:22:15Sen. Booker: You have disbanded an entire task force that stop election interference, foreign influence, public corruption. Who benefits from this? Corrupt people benefit from it. Criminals benefit from it. Vladimir putin benefits from it. It makes me wonder who you are looking out for. It makes me think we can't trust you as a nation. You swear to release the epstein files, but now you are withholding the epstein files. You claim that you have a suspect in a serious assassination.

▶ 3:22:45Sen. Booker: Oops, then you don't have a suspect. You have nothing about plans to remove fbi agents, yet you are directly involved in those plans. In the words of many fbi official, you are overseeing "generational destruction" the nation's premier law enforcement agency. In eight months, you have us alter institutional integrity of the fbi. I know fbi field agents. I have worked with them in newark.

▶ 3:23:13Sen. Booker: No matter how truly bad you are, you can't undermine the legacy of agents who fight every day to keep us safe, but you can tarnish the integrity of the agency and undermine the agency's capacity. I believe you are failing as a leader. And your failure does have serious implications. For the safety and security of americans and our families. We are more vulnerable to domestic and foreign attack because of your failures of leadership. I don't thing you are fit to lead the bureau. Here's the thing, Mr.

▶ 3:23:42Sen. Booker: Patel, I don't you are going to be around long. I think this might be your last oversight hearing. As much as you supplicate yourself to the will of donald trump, and not the constitution of the united states of america, donald trump has shown us in his first term and in this term he is not loyal to people like you. He will cut you loose. This may be the last time I have a hearing with you because I don't think you are long for your job. But I'm going to tell you this. I pray for you. I pray for you.

▶ 3:24:12Sen. Booker: That you can step up and defend your oath, defend the constitution and do a much better job of defending this country. Thank you, Mr. chair.

▶ 3:24:21Chair Grassley: Do you want to say anything?

▶ 3:24:24Dir. Patel: Yes, sir. That rant of false information does not bring this country together. If you want to work on bringing this country -- it's my time, not yours.

▶ 3:24:37Sen. Booker: My god! If you want to talk about fighting for this country, I follow you on your social media posts.

▶ 3:24:44Dir. Patel: It is my time.

▶ 3:24:47Sen. Booker: You can cry all you want --

▶ 3:24:53Dir. Patel: Your time is over.

▶ 3:24:54Sen. Booker: Sir, you don't tell me my time is over. You can't lecture me. I am not afraid of you.

▶ 3:25:10Chair Grassley: Senator booker, I announced the beginning of this meeting that this back-and-forth talking over each other doesn't work, and I said if that happened, I asked patel not to respond, and I was going to give you some time after the senator's time was up to respond. He has the privilege to do that. Uninterrupted.

▶ 3:25:40Sen. Booker: You never once criticized him for not getting our questions answered. He has been rude and disrespectful to senator after senator.

▶ 3:25:45Chair Grassley: I didn't stop the senator either. Go ahead, patel.

▶ 3:25:53Dir. Patel: If the fbi under my senate -- my leadership were failing this country, why do we have 23,000 violent felons arrested alone? 200 -- a double increase from that time last year. Why have we found us -- why have we 300 human traffickers in jail? Why have we found and identified 4700 children?

▶ 3:26:20Dir. Patel: Why have we seen 1600 kilograms of fentanyl, enough to kill a third of the american public, a 25% increase alone from last year? 88,000 kilograms of cocaine seized. 700 kilograms of meth seized. But is just on our current -- criminal operations. How is it possible we are taking eight kilograms off the street and preventing 607,000 people this year alone a failure of the fbi and my leadership? How is it we have counterintelligence arrest.

▶ 3:26:51Dir. Patel: Already exceeding the numbers from the entirety of last year. 30% increase of p.r.c., 60% in the ci space as it relates to iran. We have not even talked about the southern border or northern border.

▶ 3:27:02Chair Grassley: Before senator cruz -- I feel like a broken record today. All of this interest in fbi termination, get my colleague showed no intent -- no interest in when my whistleblower suffered retaliation over the past year, particularly the past four years.

▶ 3:27:21Chair Grassley: One whistleblower has alleged brian driscoll's insubordination , whether an agent is on a hot button case or not, they ought to be held accountable for misconduct and weaponization. Senator cruz.

▶ 3:27:39Sen. Cruz: Thank you, Mr. chairman. I have to say, it used to be that two seat theater, you had to go to the kennedy center. Now apparently you need only go to the senate judiciary committee. And c are senate democrats berating the fbi which, ok, it is not partisan politics is not new in the united states congress.

▶ 3:28:05Sen. Cruz: What is remarkable is what senator booker was parading director patel about. He was operating him for failing to do his job. But rather he was furious for director patel for successfully doing his job.

▶ 3:28:22Sen. Cruz: For four years, the democrats under joe biden had an open border that undermined the safety of every single american, they allowed 12 million illegal aliens to invade this country, and every single day americans were murdered, women were raped, children were assaulted by violent criminals that democrats released. Director patel, I found senator booker's questioning really bizarre.

▶ 3:28:48Sen. Cruz: He asked you, have you reassigned fbi agent's from human trafficking to immigration issues? Director patel, are the mexican cartels that are bringing people illegally into this country and engaged in human trafficking?

▶ 3:29:05Dir. Patel: Yes, sir.

▶ 3:29:06Sen. Cruz: What the hell does it mean to reassign someone from human trafficking to immigration? The greatest human trafficking in the world has been over the last four years at our southern border. It is modern-day slavery that the democrats still defend.

▶ 3:29:26Sen. Cruz: They still defend those open borders, do you reassigned fbi agent from protecting children to immigration? How many children have you found but were victimized by the open borders of the previous administration?

▶ 3:29:43Dir. Patel: 4700.

▶ 3:29:45Sen. Cruz: And yet oddly, I don't hear a democrat here saying, gosh, thanks for protecting those kids.

▶ 3:29:54Dir. Patel: 35% increase year to date last year.

▶ 3:29:59Sen. Cruz: I want to shift topics. I want to shift topics to what happened last week. Charlie kirk was assassinated. He was assassinated because of his political views.

▶ 3:30:17Sen. Cruz: We are living in a time of enormous division and tragically, hatred, and hatred that manifested in people that we saw last week. The fbi working in concert with state and local law enforcement apprehended what appears to be in all likelihood, the murderer. And you did so in just 33 hours.

▶ 3:30:43Sen. Cruz: I want to start by congratulating you and the fbi agents and state and local law enforcement for successfully apprehending the murderer in less than a day and a half. In the wake of that is -- that assassination, we have seen far too many people on the left celebrating the assassination.

▶ 3:31:09Sen. Cruz: We have seen democrats, we have seen activists cheering it on. We have seen tragically teachers in high schools, elementary schools, university professors, cheering on the murder of charlie kirk. You and I both knew charlie well. He was a good friend and extraordinary man. And I will say there is a great deal of discussion about what to do about it.

▶ 3:31:41Sen. Cruz: Under our constitution, under the bill of rights, the first amendment, speech is protected. That is true even for vile speech. Someone can stand up and say the most painful thing, and it is protected by the first amendment. Even though their speech is bigoted and horrible and racist, the first amendment protects it.

▶ 3:32:09Sen. Cruz: Conduct is not protected by the first amendment. Particularly conduct that is violent. Violent conduct that is harassing others, that is, in this case, murdering others is most assuredly not protected by the first amendment. So I would encourage you and the fbi to focus on conduct.

▶ 3:32:33Sen. Cruz: Speech can direct -- speech can guide you to those engaged in conduct and I will say one question that I have, and I recognize this is an ongoing investigation. I don't want you to say anything that would compromise the investigation. What can you tell us at this point about what evidence there exists of other individuals who may have had prior knowledge of this assassin's plans to murder charlie kirk on september 10?

▶ 3:33:04Dir. Patel: Generally speaking, we have interviewed numerous people, family members and friends, including our partners to provide us with a detailed history of the knowledge he may have had prior to it. We are still mapping out, the investigation is ongoing, we are also speaking to and going to interview numerous individuals online who are part of a chat group that was involved in this heinous assassination.

▶ 3:33:35Dir. Patel: We are also going to work with our state and local partners out in utah to find out what community organizations, if any, participated or had any foreknowledge of this information. It is very much ongoing. I remind everyone it has not even been a week since charlie's tragic death.

▶ 3:33:49Sen. Cruz: Is it accurate, it has been widely reported, that the assassin's roommate was a transgender man who was transitioning to be female, and it has also been reported they had -- they may have been romantic partners?

▶ 3:34:04Dir. Patel: Yes, senator.

▶ 3:34:10Sen. Cruz: And I assume the fbi is investigating, it has also been reported that there were transgender chat rooms that may have had some awareness of the plan to commit this murder, is that accurate as well?

▶ 3:34:25Dir. Patel: I'm sorry, can you repeat the question?

▶ 3:34:30Sen. Cruz: It has been reported there were chat rooms of transgender activists that indicated to some degree that a potentially foreknowledge of this murder.

▶ 3:34:38Dir. Patel: We are still developing that.

▶ 3:34:46Sen. Cruz: Do you have any information that the bullet casing that had antifa and lgbt wording on them, do you have any indication of the source of those engravings. And what inspire them?

▶ 3:35:00Dir. Patel: As to the actual source, we are still developing that.

▶ 3:35:02Sen. Cruz: I want to encourage in the course of this investigation, absolutely go after anyone who aided and abetted. That I want to more broadly encourage you, follow the money. The violence we are seeing is not purely organic.

▶ 3:35:24Sen. Cruz: There is, I believe, significant money that is spreading, dissension spreading violence and antifa. Do you believe antifa is a terrorist organization?

▶ 3:35:40Dir. Patel: I believe antifa is associated with a lot of violence in this country. As to its designation, I will leave that to the appropriate authorities.

▶ 3:35:46Sen. Cruz: I would encourage the administration to call it an terrorist organization, committing acts of violence all over the country. The shell casings have multiple references that antifa has popularized. I have introduced legislation called the stop funders act. It would had rioting to the list of predicate offenses under that.

▶ 3:36:15Sen. Cruz: I believe the money should be tracked and prosecuted under it, and both the antifa and black lives matter riots of a couple years ago, and the pro-open border riots in los angeles and other cities of this past year, I believe there was significant money behind those riots. I'm not the only person who noticed at the anti-semitic protests and violent protests on college campuses that many of the tents all matched.

▶ 3:36:46Sen. Cruz: I would ask, would it aid your ability to prosecute these matters if congress passed into law the stop funders act and of rioting was added to the list of predicate offenses?

▶ 3:36:58Dir. Patel: Yes.

▶ 3:37:00Sen. Cruz: Talk to me about the efforts of the fbi to go after the funders of the anti-semitic protests on college campuses, the pro-open border protests in cities, and potential lgbt violence. Talk to me about the efforts to go after the money of those who are funding and promoting violence.

▶ 3:37:23Dir. Patel: As I've always said, money doesn't lie. We have been following the money. That's what we are doing, issuing lawful process to organizations involved with criminal activity because the money has to come from somewhere. Extensive investigations ongoing into numerous organizations that are related to violent criminal activity.

▶ 3:37:46Sen. Cruz: Cutting off the money will make america much safer and that is the core job of the fbi, and I thank you for doing your job.

▶ 3:37:49Chair Grassley: Senator padilla.

▶ 3:37:53Sen. Perdue: You think you, Mr. chairman. Glad to be at this committee and take our responsibility seriously to conduct oversight of the fbi, one of the most critical law enforcement agencies in the country. As senator klobuchar and others on this committee have reminded us, the last several months have provided far too many reminders of the political violence crisis in america today, and the gun

▶ 3:38:23Sen. Perdue: Violence crisis in america today, including the shooting last week. Director patel, this committee takes it seriously, it's oversight role for recognizing the fbi's important role in protecting the public from gun violence while respecting constitutional rights. If you recall, this was a significant subject area of questioning during your confirmation hearing.

▶ 3:38:54Sen. Perdue: It plays a central role in enforcing federal firearm laws, ensuring accuracy of background checks and monitoring machine-gun conversion devices in lost or stolen firearms. , during your confirmation hearing you planted the f -- you said the fbi would enforce laws fully and fairly. Consistent with the second amendment. Yet we continue to see a sharp rise in lost and stolen firearms reported by federal licensees.

▶ 3:39:26Sen. Perdue: Can you point to any measurable enforcement results, prosecutions or task force expansion since he became director?

▶ 3:39:35Dir. Patel: I will get those to you, senator.

▶ 3:39:36Sen. Padilla: Any that you can share today?

▶ 3:39:38Dir. Patel: No, I will get a full list to you.

▶ 3:39:41Sen. Padilla: You came unprepared today to respond to questions which you knew were important back to your confirmation hearing? The bureau has worried about the public safety threat posed by machine-gun conversion devices. Can you reference what resources you are dedicating to this threat?

▶ 3:40:04Dir. Patel: Absolutely, senator. Part of tracking ghost guns, as you alluded to, is having a sustainable database which is allocating more resources so that ff l's can track and trace firearms that are stolen and make sure they don't get into the population. That is one of my primary concerns that we don't want stolen weapons.

▶ 3:40:27Sen. Padilla: The numbers continue to go up as part of that federal license. Let me get to my next question. You've stated you had not reviewed a federal law that improves reporting to the national criminal background check system. Eight months into your job, what concrete steps have you taken to ensure that the records are complete, accurate and timely?

▶ 3:40:44Dir. Patel: That is a great question that we have dedicated a lot of resources to. The system has been trying to get to 100% within 15 minutes. We are currently at 93%.

▶ 3:41:09Sen. Padilla: Do you think additional resources would be helpful in getting to 100% or do you argue less resources are necessary to get from 93 to 100?

▶ 3:41:12Dir. Patel: I think we have to work on how fast our actual infrastructure processes these things.

▶ 3:41:16Sen. Padilla: On to a question about resources. The fbi's core mission is to counterterrorism, espionage and major criminal threats. Politically motivated investigation because me concerns that other critical missions are being neglected.

▶ 3:41:39Sen. Padilla: One example, in march of this year, you created a tesla related task force, and diverted personnel from the domestic terrorism operations section to work on that task force. What risk analysis justified that decision and do you consider domestic violence terrorism to be a lower priority?

▶ 3:41:57Dir. Patel: Any form of terrorism, domestic or international, is the highest priority at the fbi.

▶ 3:42:02Sen. Padilla: But you put resources away from those missions.

▶ 3:42:10Dir. Patel: They did not divert resources away when cars were exploding and people were being set on fire. I directed resources to address it.

▶ 3:42:14Sen. Padilla: I will suggest in your follow-up, and we can make this more explicit in our questions for the record, that you provide accurate information about the diversion of resources. Because when I understand you authorized large-scale agent reassignments from counterintelligence, and cybercrime, two notches immigration cases but others, it has impact other priorities like nationstate threats.

▶ 3:42:46Sen. Padilla: Safeguarding our elections is a core responsibility. We need confidence that elections of fruit -- security work is driven by facts and free from political influence. Do you agree with the attorney general's decision to disband the fbi foreign influence task force?

▶ 3:43:03Dir. Patel: The disbanding of that task force did not in any way reallocate or take away resources from that critical mission.

▶ 3:43:15Sen. Padilla: How are you mitigating the risk of foreign actors interfering in U.S. elections?

▶ 3:43:17Dir. Patel: As I have highlighted through our cyber programs, which have seen a 60% increase in arrests for cyber threat actors looking to not just harm our critical infrastructure system, but interfere in our elections, we have had multiple arrests of individuals who are interfering in that process.

▶ 3:43:36Sen. Padilla: Did it seek statewide voter lists and driver license data?

▶ 3:43:43Dir. Patel: I can't speak for the department of justice.

▶ 3:43:44Sen. Padilla: You are a member of the department of justice. You play a role in those requests.

▶ 3:43:52Dir. Patel: Whatever requests that we had pursuant to the department of direction we are provided.

▶ 3:43:54Sen. Padilla: So you can speak on those actions?

▶ 3:43:57Dir. Patel: For the fbi.

▶ 3:44:00Sen. Padilla: So you can speak to those actions.

▶ 3:44:02Dir. Patel: Fully fbi.

▶ 3:44:03Sen. Padilla: What role did you play in those requests?

▶ 3:44:10Dir. Patel: Whatever request we get from the department, I don't have those details in front of me.

▶ 3:44:12Sen. Padilla: There are not many details in front of you on a lot of questions. I do hope there are substantive and accurate responses to our questions in writing. In my time left, I want to call out a couple of observations. The director before us has tried to explain, I want to say explain, tried to explain how he doesn't need another $500 million to do the job.

▶ 3:44:42Sen. Padilla: In specifically, -- and specifically, even if the fbi did have an additional $500 million, it would take years, he referenced 14 years, to fill the vacancies. But in the meantime, rely on partnership with local law enforcement to fulfill the mission of the bureau.

▶ 3:45:05Sen. Padilla: As we have discussed in other hearings and other committees, by the way, given this immigration mass deportation agenda of the administration, the pi is not the only one leaning on local law enforcement to do the job. I.c.e. Has made it clear that they are doing the same other law enforcement agencies within dhs is doing.

▶ 3:45:32Sen. Padilla: So much so that I.c.e.'s recruitment, they are not only not advocating for cuts, or requesting additional dollars and have issues of policy with them, but if I.c.e.'s plan to do the job is not just hiring significantly, they don't seem to have that a concern that the fbi does. Both I.c.e. And the fbi are citing partnerships with local law enforcement, partnership and engagement is great.

▶ 3:46:04Sen. Padilla: But having come from local law enforcement at the outset of my public service career, I also know capacity and resources at the local level are strained. Particularly in times like this. When I.c.e.

▶ 3:46:17Sen. Padilla: Is going on a hiring spree, and have local law enforcement agencies worried about their ability to recruit and retain local law enforcement officers, and not losing them to the federal government, then our reliance on those local law enforcement agencies is a perilous strategy to take and could under my local law enforcement ability to address crime at the local level.

▶ 3:46:45Sen. Padilla: Whether it is white-collar crime, violent crime, etc., etc., etc.. I will also suggest this. One of the most significant things in addition to partnering with local law enforcement is they have the best -- they are the best intelligent source, is that correct?

▶ 3:47:08Dir. Patel: Four on the ground.

▶ 3:47:10Sen. Padilla: Yet, when local law enforcement is put in a perilous position of being in a role with this mass deportation agenda, which is consistently overreached, has been found to violate the constitution and has undermined public confidence in law enforcement. Not just by immigrants, by the way, but especially immigrants.

▶ 3:47:41Sen. Padilla: When immigrants are victims of crime and are afraid to come forward because they don't know what law enforcement is going to do with their information or not, when immigrants legal or undocumented our witness -- witnesses to crime and are afraid to come forward with that information because they do not know what is going to happen with their information, that undermines the credibility with the community and undermines the intelligence that you say are the best source of intelligence

▶ 3:48:11Sen. Padilla: When it comes to law enforcement. It's shaky, it's worrisome, and in my opinion, overall, you are failing to live up to the role and responsibility that you have been confirmed to. And I associate myself to everything senator booker said earlier.

▶ 3:48:31Chair Grassley: Before we go, without objection, I want to introduce him into the record a recently declassified document thanks to director patel. The document is director ray fbi and gnosis -- analysis, or never suffered consequences for advancing the only trump-russian narrative, and attempting to cover up involvement in the hoax

▶ 3:49:03Chair Grassley: With false statements. Yet time and again, the american justice system has been weaponized against president trump and his associates, such as peter navarro, with reckless abandon. The doj's inaction on a criminal referral despite the obvious incriminating evidence provided in the fbi's own analysis undermines public trust and the rule of law, thanks to director ray's utter failure.

▶ 3:49:33Chair Grassley: >> thank you, Mr. chairman. Director patel, thank you ever so much for being with us today. I want to thank you for your commitment to fight violent crime in memphis. When you first came to meet with me before your hearing here, I gave you the steps on memphis tennessee and their crime rates.

▶ 3:50:00Chair Grassley: And then you committed then and again at your confirmation to help us, you have been true to your word. We are very, very grateful. Operation viper has been such a success. The 500 arrests are important. These are gang members and gang leaders out of memphis, tennessee. There are over 100 gangs in memphis.

▶ 3:50:27Chair Grassley: The impact of these arrests, the impact of 100 indictments of these gang members. And now we have a U.S. attorney's office that will actually prosecute violent crimes. And actually take up and prosecute federal gun crimes. This is helping to make memphis safe again.

▶ 3:50:53Chair Grassley: And yesterday, the white house, to have the president announce the second phase of this with bringing in the guard. And we have got atf and dea and the U.S.

▶ 3:51:09Chair Grassley: Marshals and homeland security, and the work that you and general bondi and the president have done is so appreciated by the people of memphis, shelby county, west tennessee. And I am ever so grateful for the work you have done.

▶ 3:51:30Chair Grassley: One of the things, as we talk about memphis and what a vibrant and wonderful historic city is, it's important to realize memphis is one of the logistics hubs in our country. You have a I-40, which goes east coast to west coast. You have the port of memphis. You have fedex. You have all five class a railroads that are there.

▶ 3:52:01Chair Grassley: As well as so many companies that are important to memphis. I have found it so interesting that some of my colleagues want to complain about agents being taken out of the D.C. office, and actually put to work in the field. Because they have been needed in the field. And you can look at the stats from operation viper and see the difference that they have made.

▶ 3:52:34Chair Grassley: And we so appreciate that. I do want to drill down just a little bit on the issue of cargo theft. Which ties into the logistics hub in memphis. We have got a lot of companies that go through there. Imc is a big logistics company. People in memphis know what it takes to keep america moving.

▶ 3:53:03Chair Grassley: What a lot of people may not realize is that many of these criminal gangs have been focused on cargo theft. This is how they pay for their activities. In addition to the carjackings and home robberies, and a smash and grabs, and some of the human and sex trafficking, they have gotten into cargo theft. And cargo theft in memphis has increased over 5000%.

▶ 3:53:36Chair Grassley: 5000%. That's what you saw. With the biden administration who would not drill down on this. Having these agents out in the field, having an interagency approach, is something that is going to help us with getting our hands around this cargo theft.

▶ 3:54:02Chair Grassley: So talk for just a minute about what your team has done there and the importance of having that interagency approach.

▶ 3:54:11Dir. Patel: Absolutely, senator. Operation viper under operation summer heat, and in multiple cities across the country, we have surging resources based on crime. Memphis had the highest per capita homicide rate in the country. That was something I acceptable. What we did is what we cause phase zero operation. We went into some of the cities quietly to collect the intelligence that was necessary to start these operations, to start seizing these firearms.

▶ 3:54:42Dir. Patel: We seized over 115 firearms off the street, to start kicking narcotics off the street and infiltrate the gang network. The criminal street gang network that is providing these guns and drugs to the public in these communities, allowing for these shootings. What the fbi is great at is partnering with our local authorities in places like memphis and miami and chicago. So many other cities across the country. To start the work. You can't do the work on a dartboard basis.

▶ 3:55:14Dir. Patel: You need ground-level intelligence that's what we do working with state and local law enforcement. The result is over 100 indictments federally in this 3, 4 month surge. Now we are going to go in there with more resources to finish it.

▶ 3:55:29Sen. Blackburn: And we are grateful for that. I think it is so important for my colleagues, what we have seen in memphis. You mentioned something very important. Your agents go in and they go in quietly. There was no press conference, there was no fanfare. You went in there to work. Very importantly, you gathered the intel.

▶ 3:55:51Sen. Blackburn: Who are these gang leaders, where are they, figuring out who was doing what, and then setting up the process to apprehend these individuals. And it requires infiltrating those networks. And having that data to work from, so that you are working in partnership.

▶ 3:56:19Sen. Blackburn: As I have talked with elected leaders in shelby county and memphis, as we have talked with those in law enforcement, they have been so grateful to have the support in this additional education that comes. Because local police are learning from your agents. When they are learning how to treat these gangs and infiltrate these networks.

▶ 3:56:48Sen. Blackburn: We know phase two of this operation is going to kick off. The guard is going to be there to support the memphis police department, to help them catch up. Because they still have a lot of people on their board, they know who they are, what they are doing, and they want to apprehend them and bring them forward.

▶ 3:57:16Sen. Blackburn: Talk a little bit about how phase two is going to continue to work to support the law enforcement efforts in memphis.

▶ 3:57:26Dir. Patel: Just like what happened here in washington, D.C., it takes a whole of government interagency approach. We are working with the attorney general, the atf, U.S. marshal, department of homeland security. Each one of those agencies has specialized capabilities. When we search together to work off of the ground-level intelligence, you see what happened in washington, D.C. and that is the next phase of it. You are able to utilize the national guard to set up order perimeter operations.

▶ 3:57:58Dir. Patel: When you go to an area, you have the secure workforce to go in there and stay in their. The key is sustained criminal investigations. And sustained prosecutions that clear memphis, like we did washington permanently, and leave behind a blueprint for what local law enforcement can do with our federal partners to sustain that. We don't want to go backwards. That's critical. We are in the next step, sustaining it will be the last one.

▶ 3:58:22Sen. Blackburn: And we certainly appreciate that. I do want to touch on operation restore justice. Senator britt mentioned some of this very briefly. I know that you end a g bondi have done a tremendous amount of work in protecting children. I appreciate that. We passed my report act last year. The president, president biden signed it.

▶ 3:58:50Sen. Blackburn: This does require social media to report so that we can have these perpetrators followed up with and apprehended. That's a good start. We are still trying to get the kids online safety act passed. That has been a bipartisan effort. We have looked with disdain at what is happened with discord -- what has happened with discord and charlie kirk's alleged killer.

▶ 3:59:18Sen. Blackburn: Talk for a moment about what else congress ought to do in order to give you all the toolbox you need to apprehend these predators and pedophiles.

▶ 3:59:28Dir. Patel: I think we need to go after the monetary backbone of this infrastructure like we discussed earlier. I think we also need to make parents across the country aware of how invasive some of the social media sites are. And how much criminal enterprise is going on and how easily these kids can be sucked into it. Also, the only way in my opinion to do that as senator klobuchar and I believe senator graham stated is we need to work on section 230.

▶ 3:59:59Dir. Patel: It has been too long since we have addressed it. Nobody is being held accountable. They are making money, and our youth is dying. That's unacceptable.

▶ 4:00:09Sen. Blackburn: We have that reform bill p thank you, Mr. chairman.

▶ 4:00:10Chair Grassley: Senator welch. Subtle welch. Thank you very much I just want to say what I think all of us the leave and that is political violence that is so afflicting our country, it doesn't matter whether it is from the right or the left. All of us have an obligation to fiercely advocate for our point of view. All of us have an obligation to respect people with whom we disagree.

▶ 4:00:36Chair Grassley: The folks we disagree with our opponents but they are not our enemies. I hope all of us keep that in mind and do the best we can to set that example. I want to congratulate the fbi, I want to congratulate the utah state and local law enforcement for the very good work that it did in apprehending the violent

▶ 4:01:06Chair Grassley: Assailant of charlie kirk. That is a terrible, terrible tragedy. Director patel, one point you made an announcement that the suspect was in custody we got our man. It turned out that was not true. In fact, I think that was about 27 hours before the person now in custody was apprehended. Why did you make that statement?

▶ 4:01:28Dir. Patel: I appreciate you letting me address this. What the fbi does is not just locate and find suspects. We also participate in eliminating subjects. What we had at the time was a subject in custody in relation to this investigation. In my commitment to you, worked with the public to help identify subjects and suspects, I put that information out. When we interviewed him, I put out the results of that.

▶ 4:01:56Dir. Patel: Could I have been more careful in my verbiage and included a subject instead of subject? Sure.

▶ 4:02:03Sen. Welch: I don't quite get that. Because if we have our man, but would suggest to the public that everybody can rest and relax, and not then continue providing information to local law enforcement. So that was a mistake.

▶ 4:02:18Dir. Patel: I don't see it as a mistake. I see it as working with the public to identify there was a subject.

▶ 4:02:24Sen. Welch: If you put out a statement that says we have got our man, and in fact it turns out you didn't have your man, that is not a mistake?

▶ 4:02:32Dir. Patel: That's not what I said.

▶ 4:02:36Sen. Welch: I will go on. That's my understanding. The second thing that is really important in the fbi, but important in every agency, is that the folks who are doing good work get supported for the work they are doing. A number of highly successful fbi agent have been let go. I want to ask you a little bit about that. You know who brian driscoll is, right?

▶ 4:03:03Dir. Patel: Yes.

▶ 4:03:05Sen. Welch: My understanding is he served at the fbi for over 18 years. You agree?

▶ 4:03:10Dir. Patel: I believe that is accurate.

▶ 4:03:14Sen. Welch: Special agent charge of the newark office. He was commander of the fbi's hostage rescue team. That is a very prestigious and responsible position.

▶ 4:03:22Dir. Patel: It is.

▶ 4:03:24Sen. Welch: Section chief of the critical incident, you have to be pretty good to get that high responsibility. He oversaw 55 squad teens come and they are the elite of the elite. They go in to the danger situations, right?

▶ 4:03:50Sen. Welch: He got a medal of valor for his participation in a raid on isis terrorist, who had kidnapped american citizens.

▶ 4:04:00Dir. Patel: Yeah, I know.

▶ 4:04:02Sen. Welch: You are in agreement?

▶ 4:04:04Dir. Patel: I know that family, yes.

▶ 4:04:06Sen. Welch: He got kurt myers, someone who barricaded himself after he killed four people and wounded two. Driscoll was part of the team that went in there and took that guy out. Right?

▶ 4:04:22Dir. Patel: I don't have all the details but I will take your word for it.

▶ 4:04:26Sen. Welch: And he got into trouble when there was a demanded list of fbi agent who investigated january 6. And was apprehensive that what did happen ultimately would happen. And that is those folks would get fired.

▶ 4:04:53Sen. Welch: Do you agree with me that a boss who stands up for his subordinates, when they did the job that was asked of them as a standup person, and somebody to be admired.

▶ 4:05:04Dir. Patel: Generally speaking, yes, sir.

▶ 4:05:06Sen. Welch: But driscoll got fired, right?

▶ 4:05:10Dir. Patel: That matter is under litigation and the matter you referenced occurred before I was director.

▶ 4:05:15Sen. Welch: Let's keep it fairly narrow. He is fired.

▶ 4:05:19Dir. Patel: Yes, he was terminated.

▶ 4:05:21Sen. Welch: And there is some but -- somebody who communicates to him that he's terminated.

▶ 4:05:26Dir. Patel: That's my job.

▶ 4:05:30Sen. Welch: So you communicated to him that he was fired.

▶ 4:05:31Dir. Patel: I did.

▶ 4:05:31Sen. Welch: I have a hard time with us. That record suggests to me this person is worthy of consideration for the presidential medal of freedom, and he got fired.

▶ 4:05:42Dir. Patel: But there is also a record of other information that was available and now that this matter has been under litigation, we will get that out in due course.

▶ 4:05:52Sen. Welch: So you have got "other information" that you see as a valid basis to fire somebody who, from what I can tell, had an absolutely outstanding record in who crossed the threshold of getting in trouble because he was standing up for agents serving under him who did work that was assigned to them happen to be -- related to the generous

▶ 4:06:23Sen. Welch: Operating --january 6 uprising. Let me ask you another question. When you were here, you were rightly critical, not here actually, I guess it was on cash's corner. You were critical on the way the previous fbi director used the fbi jet. You said you wanted to ground chris wray's private jet he uses to hop around the country.

▶ 4:06:54Sen. Welch: Let me ask you this. On the weekend, according to flight tracker data, on the weekend of march 7, an fbi plane flew over -- flu round from D.C. to las vegas. You attended a ufc flight with mel gibson. I will show you that. Is that you and is that true?

▶ 4:07:13Dir. Patel: You want to know the difference? I live in las vegas, I didn't leave a congressional hearing early to dodge questions.

▶ 4:07:24Sen. Welch: Then on april 5, you attended a hockey game in new york city. You don't live there, right?

▶ 4:07:26Dir. Patel: No, I don't.

▶ 4:07:29Sen. Welch: Every day fbi agent's who are assigned in washington don't get to fly home on a private jet.

▶ 4:07:35Dir. Patel: Do you know why I have to use a private jet? Because congress made it mandatory.

▶ 4:07:38Sen. Welch: In an -- we did not make it mandatory that you go to ufc games with mel gibson.

▶ 4:07:44Dir. Patel: Are you telling me I can't go home?

▶ 4:07:47Sen. Welch: You have to use some judgment here.

▶ 4:07:53Dir. Patel: When I'm at home, I can't do what I'm doing when I go home?

▶ 4:07:54Sen. Welch: Let me keep going. I'm glad you go home. I love to go home. But I don't go home on a private jet. On april --

▶ 4:08:03Dir. Patel: You are not mandated to do so.

▶ 4:08:07Sen. Welch: You attended a hockey game with wayne gretzky and the fbi jet took you to and from new york city where you don't live.

▶ 4:08:12Dir. Patel: That's correct.

▶ 4:08:14Sen. Welch: On april 12, on the following weekend, you attended a ufc fight in miami. Also on the fbi jet.

▶ 4:08:22Dir. Patel: That's correct.

▶ 4:08:24Sen. Welch: So what is the cost to the taxpayer for those three flights?

▶ 4:08:29Dir. Patel: I pay the commercial equivalent per the law. Just so you know, when you are comparing the two prior directors --

▶ 4:08:41Sen. Welch: I asked what the cost was and you don't know, I take it.

▶ 4:08:43Dir. Patel: And what I have done with the use of the private jet is use andrews air force base versus reagan national as what the other directors have done to save taxpayer dollars.

▶ 4:08:57Sen. Welch: You flew home from las vegas, nobody else in the fbi who gets -- they have to pay their own way if they want to go home. Right?

▶ 4:09:04Dir. Patel: That's not accurate.

▶ 4:09:08Sen. Welch: Are you telling me that fbi agents who may live in charlotte, they get paid by the fbi.

▶ 4:09:17Dir. Patel: Sometimes they do, yes.

▶ 4:09:22Sen. Welch: Another thing I want to say is this. Our local law enforcement has been stiffed. About $500 million in grants have been taken out of the budget. Those really help us in burlington. They help us in rutland. They really are important. Why in the world would be -- would we be cutting those grants when we need that local law enforcement, in part, to partner with you?

▶ 4:09:52Dir. Patel: I think you are speaking to the department of justice grants which I don't adjudicate. But also vermont like every other state has been seized a plus up of fbi personnel.

▶ 4:09:59Sen. Welch: That's not what we are seeing. My understanding is there is an effort to get another plane for the fbi that would cost $72 million. Is that right?

▶ 4:10:13Dir. Patel: That is inaccurate. The fbi, because the jet, as you call it, is not my jet, we use it for operational needs. We use it for --

▶ 4:10:25Sen. Welch: That is the one you fly in, right?

▶ 4:10:26Dir. Patel: We have multiple fixed wing assets and one is on a wildly expensive lease that I deem a waste of money. I'm looking for a replacement in which the government can procure assets permanently.

▶ 4:10:37Sen. Welch: I would welcome you submitting to this committee the information about the jets that are under consideration and according to our research, the specifications that are included in this request. It would result in any expenditure between 72 million and $80 million.

▶ 4:11:01Dir. Patel: That is inaccurate but I will get you the right numbers.

▶ 4:11:05Sen. Welch: I welcome getting that specific information. Thank you. I yield back.

▶ 4:11:17Chair Grassley: I can get closer. The fbi director of 2013, something like when I became ranking member in the middle of congress, or I was ranking member, comey needed an excuse to come to des moines ido -- idaho for a family reunion.

▶ 4:11:45Chair Grassley: You wanted to meet with me, and wanted to meet in idaho, I think nothing more than an excuse to say he did something official on that trip. I can't accuse him of that because I don't know, but I can't recall that we discussed anything very serious to that had to be meeting him in cedar rapids at the airport before he went to the reunion.

▶ 4:12:11Chair Grassley: And then two or three years ago, wray was sitting where you were and we had two republicans who wanted to have a second round of questioning, and it would have taken 10 minutes, and he refused to because he got on this airplane, as you are talking about, going to the adirondacks.

▶ 4:12:31Chair Grassley: I find it interesting that my democratic colleagues seem to bring up your use of the justice department planes, yet my democratic colleagues did not seem too interested about my oversight of wray's use of the plane. I did not hear a peep. My democratic colleagues need to be consistent.

▶ 4:12:51Dir. Patel: Can I just add, Mr. chairman, wen yu complaint -- compare the flight logs and work travel compared to personal travel, over one third of their travel was personal on those same jets that I'm being accused of improperly utilizing. My mark is far less than that. Also, both of those directors also both used dulles reagan, which has additional costs.

▶ 4:13:22Dir. Patel: We fly to andrews because it is cheaper and saves taxpayer dollars. Those are things we are doing to make sure we are good stewards of tax payer dollars. Any acquisition of an airline for the fbi will meet the needs of the demands of the foreign operations and hostage rescue operations.

▶ 4:13:39Chair Grassley: Senator moody. You're very patient.

▶ 4:13:49Sen. Moody: You are very patient. I'm new to the senate. We thank you. A lot of what we are talking about today, and you have been questioned about was uncovered because of our chairman and his service to this committee and I want to thank him because he uncovered a lot especially during the last administration when many of our off their mission and I believe we would

▶ 4:14:19Sen. Moody: Not have this much information as we do, if it was not for our esteemed chairman. I would like to thank him. Being the newest member of the judiciary, I'm so grateful to be here because sometimes I'm wondering if some of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle don't know what they are talking about or if they are ill intentioned and purposely trying to gaslight not just the american public but other people and law enforcement and agencies you are working with.

▶ 4:14:50Sen. Moody: As a former attorney general, former federal prosecutor, former judge, as the wife of a law enforcement officer for federal and state over the course of his career, I would like to clarify a few things and give you the opportunity to highlight some.

▶ 4:15:07Sen. Moody: Of the things the fbi is doing two of the things I third -- I heard thrown out there, and some of my colleagues would breeze in in time to rail on you and spout misinformation, and narratives that have no grounding in reality to criminal justice, and then breezed out as soon as they were done.

▶ 4:15:30Sen. Moody: I think it does the american public more good when the oversight function of congress allows for you to comment in a way that makes sense and is grounded in reality. Let's first talk about the reason why we are having to reassign not just in the fbi but in other criminal justice agencies federal agents to accomplish different things as has been done historically throughout our country.

▶ 4:16:02Sen. Moody: When we get into office we have to examine and triage threats facing this nation, threats facing americans and allocate resources accordingly. I guess you are to be judged negatively because you are trying to reallocate resources of the fbi to fix what the democratic administration prior to this under bite broke -- bik -- biden broke.

▶ 4:16:33Sen. Moody: Let's talk about the reassignment of federal agents and why that would be necessary. Would you say the majority of assignments have been made because we are facing unprecedented levels of violence, both because of the unvented surge of anywhere from 11 million to 12 million people across our border in the last four years and because of the woke, weak, insane policies pushed into states and cities

▶ 4:17:04Sen. Moody: Around this nation by the left?

▶ 4:17:05Dir. Patel: Absolutely.

▶ 4:17:07Sen. Moody: I hear you being grilled because you have rightfully pushed resources where they needed to go to protect the american public and I have heard you question that you are in some way, and I will use their words which I don't believe is grounded in reality, that you are going to lean on local and state agents to do the job of the fbi.

▶ 4:17:36Sen. Moody: Might it be recharacterized more accurately in that you are partnering with local and state agencies in these areas especially where these policies democrats support wholeheartedly, in fact, they frustrate our efforts to beef up our laws with good criminal justice policies at every turn and then come in here and get on you -- by the way you have been here seven months.

▶ 4:18:08Sen. Moody: I know in seven months you did not break it, they broke it over for years. Isn't it more accurate to say you are using the federal government and its agents and resources to supplement and amplify law enforcement efforts are -- in cities were democrat policies broke them?

▶ 4:18:30Dir. Patel: It has been an integral part to use local and state partnerships. We cannot do the work without partnering with state and local authorities in every single state and county in this country and why we pushed out to the field is simple mathematics while the fbi had a bloated bureaucracy in washington, D.C.

▶ 4:18:53Dir. Patel: Nearly 1/3 of their workforce worked in the capital region but 1/3 of the crime does not happen here. So I moved out field agents, intel analysts, program managers. By the way that is what they want to do, go out in the field and do the work. No one will be punished for that, or for wanting to stay in headquarters. But we needed reallocation of assets and that is what we did.

▶ 4:19:21Sen. Moody: In your experience before and now in office, have you found that many of these non-profits have done work to undermined -- undermine the security and safety of cities?

▶ 4:19:40Dir. Patel: Those are ongoing and hopefully we can report results soon.

▶ 4:19:44Sen. Moody: I don't mean those that aided and abetted criminal activities that should be pursued to the fullest extent of the law, and I hope we follow the money trail as some of my colleagues have suggested. I also want to get your opinion about the nonprofits that are working to push, get elected and then push criminal justice policies that have made our cities and states less safe

▶ 4:20:17Sen. Moody: Including all the things they espouse make cities stronger, no cash bail, try not to charge crimes, don't call people offenders or felons or rapists or drug traffickers. I could go on and on.

▶ 4:20:46Sen. Moody: But the just is, don't charge, or charge as minimally as you can, don't put people on parole or probation following incarceration. Diversion should be the rule. I could go on and on and we are seeing these play out in cities across our nation.

▶ 4:21:12Sen. Moody: I believe it is important to see how we can do things better in our criminal justice system but some of these groups have hijacked that good intentioned by so many and used it as a way to subvert the stability of this country.

▶ 4:21:36Sen. Moody: I firmly believe when the money is traced you will find it is not only going not just a policies but also to pushing and promoting criminal acts and I believe and support does not just come from infrastructure within the U.S. because I believe undermining our cities and this nation is something foreign adversaries will get behind and it will show they are behind.

▶ 4:22:08Sen. Moody: Is the fbi trying in its reallocation of resources to make up and help in these areas were local law enforcement is trying its best but fighting an uphill battle against mayors, city council and governors that promote, support and pass laws and policies that follow these weak, insane policies?

▶ 4:22:31Dir. Patel: We go into every community where crime rates are high. Crime rates are coming down across the country because the fbi is going in and doing good police work. We are not going to be dictated to by mayors or governors. We have federal law enforcement capabilities to our citizenry and are executing those every single day including rural communities and tribal lands.

▶ 4:22:53Sen. Moody: You are, correct me if I'm wrong, welcomed and supported, and enthusiastically praised by the cops that are there, because they want those communities safer.

▶ 4:23:06Dir. Patel: I think the police speak for themselves and we will let them do that at their own leisure.

▶ 4:23:11Sen. Moody: When other gas lighting I heard was that at a time when we are trying to help them because they are having vacancy rates and can't retain police and you are causing that, is it a fact that police across this country because they have been defunded, are not so ordered, have groups continuously combating when they are trying to make the community safer -- I know this because

▶ 4:23:42Sen. Moody: When I was attorney general they wanted to come to florida and I welcomed them with open arms. We are increasing our rates in florida, sometimes to the detriment of other cities and states because they can't keep them. They tried to make it sound like it was your fault that we have vacancies in these police ranks around the nation when in fact aren't you trying to help bolster their ranks and help them because they have mayors and prosecutors and city councils and governors that won't help them?

▶ 4:24:10Dir. Patel: That is what we did in D.C., memphis, chicago, miami, st. Louis and other cities.

▶ 4:24:18Sen. Moody: I'm grateful you're doing this and I commend you for the numbers I'm seeing going after violent crime, helping make sure we are getting the criminals that came here on vetted from other nations out of the country that you are allocating resources to those efforts and we appreciate you being here today and make sure we are talking truth and not misinformation to the american people.

▶ 4:24:47Chair Grassley: Before senator schiff I want to introduce into the record the declassified clinton annex, a classified report about the clinton email investigation, the annex shows the fbi had evidence necessary to conduct quote thorough and complete investigation and of quote but the comey fbi failed

▶ 4:25:21Chair Grassley: To review the evidence at the time. After nearly a decade in the shadows this information has come to light, thanks to director patel.

▶ 4:25:31Sen. Schiff: Mr. patel, during confirmation you made several important commitments. You told senator coons there will be no politicization at the fbi, no attribute of actions taken by any fbi should I be confirmed as director.

▶ 4:25:49Sen. Schiff: Let me ask you specifically, did you ever take any action to terminate or discipline an fbi agent or employee in whole or in part as retribution for being part of an investigation of donald trump or january 6?

▶ 4:26:04Dir. Patel: No.

▶ 4:26:06Sen. Schiff: You also assured senator blumenthal, all fbi employees would be protected against political retribution. So you're testifying today that you played no role in the firing of even a single fbi agent for political retribution?

▶ 4:26:24Dir. Patel: None for political retribution.

▶ 4:26:28Sen. Schiff: If any fbi agent said you did they would be lying, that is your testimony?

▶ 4:26:32Dir. Patel: I'm only speaking to my actions. Everyone is allowed to make their own allegations.

▶ 4:26:38Sen. Schiff: These are allegations against you.

▶ 4:26:41Dir. Patel: If senior fbi --

▶ 4:26:45Sen. Schiff: If senior fbi agents said you were firing them because of political retribution, because of the cases they were assigned you would say they would be lying?

▶ 4:26:51Dir. Patel: Anyone who was fired was for failing to meet standards come uphold the constitutional oath and failed mission.

▶ 4:26:59Sen. Schiff: By meet the standards do you mean meet the standards of protecting the president under any circumstance?

▶ 4:27:04Dir. Patel: No.

▶ 4:27:06Sen. Schiff: You also guaranteed senator blumenthal that every fbi employee would be held the same standard, no one terminated for case assignments. Are you testifying today never terminated anyone at the fbi in whole or in part because of a prior case assignment?

▶ 4:27:26Dir. Patel: No one at the fbi is terminated for case assignments alone.

▶ 4:27:30Sen. Schiff: I'm asking about you, Mr. patel. Did you in whole or part terminate anyone at the fbi because they worked on the trump investigation or because they worked on january 6?

▶ 4:27:43Dir. Patel: No one at the fbi has been terminated for case assignments alone.

▶ 4:27:49Sen. Schiff: Does that mean they were terminated in part because they were assigned to a january 6 case or the mar-a-lago case? You're being very precise here, saying alone that means they were fired in part because they were assigned those cases, is that your testimony?

▶ 4:28:07Dir. Patel: Absolutely not but if you want to keep putting words in my mouth.

▶ 4:28:11Sen. Schiff: Let's strip away the word "alone." did you terminate or participate in any discipline of any fbi employee in whole or in part because of their work on an investigation of donald trump, or january 6, yes or no?

▶ 4:28:28Dir. Patel: Any terminations at the fbi by employees --

▶ 4:28:31Sen. Schiff: I'm asking you a question.

▶ 4:28:34Dir. Patel: You don't like the answer because it is the truth.

▶ 4:28:37Sen. Schiff: Let me be precise and I asked for yes or no, did you ever terminate or discipline and fbi employee in whole or in part because they had been assigned or worked on an investigation of donald trump or junri six?

▶ 4:28:56Dir. Patel: They are only terminated if they failed uphold oath of office -- [crosstalk] I don't have to answer your question yes or no because you are setting up a trap.

▶ 4:29:07Sen. Schiff: Unless it is true that you fired people.

▶ 4:29:13Dir. Patel: They failed uphold the standards the fbi requires them to uphold.

▶ 4:29:18Sen. Schiff: Did you tell anybody of the fbi that all fbi employees who they identified who have worked on cases against president trump would be removed from their jobs? Did you tell that to someone at the fbi?

▶ 4:29:35Dir. Patel: That I would remove someone for case assignments?

▶ 4:29:39Sen. Schiff: The people identified as working on cases against trump would be removed from their jobs?

▶ 4:29:46Dir. Patel: People are not removed from case assignments and I would never tell anyone--

▶ 4:29:57Sen. Schiff: Did you tell that fbi employees identified as having worked on cases against trump would be removed from their jobs, did you tell someone that?

▶ 4:30:07Dir. Patel: I would never tell someone at the fbi they are being removed for basically their case assignments.

▶ 4:30:14Sen. Schiff: So anyone that said that would be lying?

▶ 4:30:16Dir. Patel: Anyone can say whatever they want.

▶ 4:30:19Sen. Schiff: But you're saying they are lying?

▶ 4:30:21Dir. Patel: I'm telling you what I said.

▶ 4:30:25Sen. Schiff: You're saying Mr. driscoll and others are liars?

▶ 4:30:28Dir. Patel: I'm not going to address the complaint.

▶ 4:30:30Sen. Schiff: Have you ever told anyone at the fbi that the fbi tried to put the president in jail and he has not forgotten it and your job depended on the removal of agents who worked on cases against the president?

▶ 4:30:41Dir. Patel: No.

▶ 4:30:43Sen. Schiff: Did you ever tell anyone that you knew these summary firings were undertaking were illegal, likely illegal, and that you would be sued and later deposed?

▶ 4:30:55Dir. Patel: No firings were done for anything other than justified because. -- cause. No firings at the fbi were ever done in my tenure --[crosstalk]

▶ 4:31:10Sen. Schiff: Let me move on to the epstein files. You said you are the most transparent fbi director in history so I will put you to the test. In 2024 you were asked by glenn beck about epstein's black book. You said he asked who has jeffrey epstein's black book and you said black book, fbi.

▶ 4:31:41Sen. Schiff: He said but who? And you said, oh, that is under the direct control of the director of the fbi. Was that true?

▶ 4:31:50Dir. Patel: I will rely on you quoting it accurately because it was years ago.

▶ 4:31:55Sen. Schiff: What you represented to Mr. beck and the president's supporters, were you lying? Was it true epstein's black book was in the possession of the fbi director?

▶ 4:32:07Dir. Patel: It was.

▶ 4:32:09Sen. Schiff: Now that you are fbi director you have possession of the black book?

▶ 4:32:13Dir. Patel: That index has been released.

▶ 4:32:15Sen. Schiff: So you have jeffrey epstein's black book?

▶ 4:32:18Dir. Patel: What is known as jeffrey epstein's black book has been released by us.

▶ 4:32:22Sen. Schiff: Let me follow up on senator kennedy's question because he asked you, and I will be precise, most of the files, who if anyone did epstein traffic these young women to beside himself? You said there is no credible information, none. If there were I would bring the case yesterday that he trafficked to other individuals.

▶ 4:32:52Sen. Schiff: The information we have is limited and senator kennedy said, the answer is no one and you said, for the information we have.

▶ 4:32:58Sen. Schiff: Is it your testimony today that, in all the epstein files, that jeffrey epstein trafficked no one to anyone but himself? Is that your testimony?

▶ 4:33:11Dir. Patel: I never said jeffrey epstein did not traffic anyone else.

▶ 4:33:17Sen. Schiff: Did he traffic any young woman to someone other than himself?

▶ 4:33:22Dir. Patel: I said the information that three administrations have had access to may determinations there are no investigative leads that were credible to prosecute, investigate any others.

▶ 4:33:34Sen. Schiff: Your testimony today -- dir. Patel: you just read it and I set it 10 minutes ago so let the record reflect my testimony.

▶ 4:33:44Sen. Schiff: There are victims like virginia who have testified otherwise who have said otherwise and you are telling the american people that the epstein list has a single name and it is epstein? That is what we are to believe?

▶ 4:34:01Dir. Patel: That is not what I'm saying. That is what you are saying.

▶ 4:34:05Sen. Schiff: Let me ask you this, when todd blanche went to interview ghislaine maxwell she said, did I think these guys were coming for that? I don't. There is no way this cast of characters, extraordinary and some are in your cabinet, who you value as your coworkers and you know would be with them if he was a creep or because they wanted sexual favors.

▶ 4:34:33Sen. Schiff: A man wants sexual favors they would find out they did not have to come to epstein for that. The next question, todd blanche's, the president's former criminal defense lawyer said, it is not who in the cabinet, who you are referring to, the question is when is the last time you thought you were with Mr. epstein?

▶ 4:34:53Sen. Schiff: Let me ask you who are the cabinet members which ghislaine maxwell is referring to that were part of this cast of characters associated with Mr. epstein?

▶ 4:35:06Dir. Patel: The deputy attorney general took the aggressive step no one else did and interviewed Ms. maxwell for two days and we release the entirety of that transcript. I do not have the transcript in front of me. The american people can read the entirety of that.

▶ 4:35:22Sen. Schiff: One last question because you will not tell us the cabinet members associated with Mr. epstein. Let me ask you one last question. That is, right after she gives this testimony in front of an fbi agent among others, she is transferred to a minimum security prison not suitable for a sex offender like herself. Who made that decision and why?

▶ 4:35:49Dir. Patel: The bureau of prisons.

▶ 4:35:52Sen. Schiff: The bureau of decisions?

▶ 4:35:54Dir. Patel: Prisons.

▶ 4:35:55Sen. Schiff: The bureau of prisons decided on their own without consultation with blanche or anyone else that they would suddenly, after this interview, completely unrelated to this interview, unrelated to anything she said, move her to a prison unsuitable for a sex offender? You want the american people to believe that? Do you think they are stupid?

▶ 4:36:18Dir. Patel: No, I think they believe the truth that I am not in the weeds on the everyday movement of inmates. I'm protecting this country, providing historic reform and combating the weaponization of intelligence by the likes of you and we have countless lee proven you to be a liarg in russiaate, in january 6, you're the biggest fraud to sit in the U.S. senate, you are a disgrace to this institution and an utter coward.

▶ 4:36:47Sen. Schiff: I'm not surprised that

▶ 4:36:56Dir. Patel: --dir. Patel: you continue to live from your perch and put on a show so you can raise money for your charade. You are a. -- dir. Patel: take it to the bank that the fbi is protecting this country and the state .citizens of california we have historic reform but all you care about is a child sex predator prosecuted by a prior administration and the obama justice department and the biden justice department did squat. What did trump do?

▶ 4:37:27Dir. Patel: Bring new charges courageously. What have we done? You set on the most transparent fbi director in history. 33,000 pages of information to you. I challenge you to say anything credibly. Run the cameras where you want to go now.

▶ 4:37:41Chair Grassley: You be quiet. Before I go to senator tillis, without objection, entering into the record the durham annex, a declassified appendix to john durham's report about crossfire [indiscernible] it contains information exposing a reported clinton campaign plan

▶ 4:38:14Chair Grassley: To falsely tie president trump to russia. For years I fought to assemble and publicize all the facts heretofore unknown surrounding durham's investigation, crossfire hurricane, and related matters. The durham annex was declassified in large part because of director patel. Senator tillis?

▶ 4:38:39Sen. Tillis: Thank you Mr. chairman and director patel. I admired the way you have tried to keep your composure over the course of this. Reminds me of an old far side comic which said the floggings will continue until morale improves. The last one, don't take the bait. They will use that discussion between you and senator schiff to raise money. Just sit down in the quiet confidence you are doing a good job.

▶ 4:39:11Sen. Tillis: In less than 30 seconds give me your resume again on why you are qualified for this position.

▶ 4:39:14Dir. Patel: Thank you, senator. Served as a public defender and national security prosecutor and tried over 60,000 trials, was lead investigator on the house intelligence committee and counterterrorism expert, unfolding of the russiagate investigation, served as the head of counterterrorism for the presidential white house, direct 80 -- deputy director overseeing 17 intelligence agencies, served as chief of staff to the

▶ 4:39:45Dir. Patel: Department of defense and secretary of defense overseeing a $2 trillion equity flow and defending the homeland and providing for our no fail mission.

▶ 4:39:53Sen. Tillis: We could drill down in details because I have studied that record and you should be proud of it. I did that for the benefit of the liberal media they keep referring to you as a podcaster. I appreciate you giving me that resume. It is a good body of work which is why a supported your nomination. Really quickly, on the events of last week, the sad death and assassination of Mr.

▶ 4:40:21Sen. Tillis: Kirk, I seem to recall that the first person of interest was reported to say I shot him, now shoot me, or something to that effect. Would that have -- your job is to calm the tensions. There were people running all over the building, afraid.

▶ 4:40:44Sen. Tillis: Could it be that because you were in possession of some of that information that may be you did mischaracterize as getting our man, that that led up to that if those facts were correct?

▶ 4:40:54Dir. Patel: What led me to that is to eliminate subjects but also we were in a period within 24 hours where we did not know who the shooter was.

▶ 4:41:04Sen. Tillis: That is why I asked because these people are forgetting this man reported to say I shot him now shoot me, they are forgetting he brought in an attorney and said he fabricated the claim to draw attention away from the actual shooter. He went on to get multiple charges for possessing child pornography and sexual abuse material on his phone.

▶ 4:41:31Sen. Tillis: It seems to me in the moment maybe you should have used different words, but I can imagine the amount of time we have spent on that subject in the hearing today. I think it is because they are really worried they are another punchline to an old joke. Your work, it is working in practice, but not in their theory. They have not heard you so it is working in practice but not in theory.

▶ 4:42:03Sen. Tillis: They have not heard you say multiple times that you lost out fbi resources in every state. They have not heard you when you said year-over-year comparisons for results. I don't care how many people you have at hq as long as you keep producing those results and they are good. They need to be sustained.

▶ 4:42:24Sen. Tillis: I am a little concerned about the deployment of national guard troops to dangerous cities but you keep on mentioning something I will go back to in terms of joint task forms. He did a great job explaining why you should save money and go out and fly out of an airport versus an easy trip across the potomac. I love those responses and I will repeat them here.

▶ 4:42:58Sen. Tillis: I'm worried that if we move in too quickly -- I was speaker of the house in north carolina and I would consider it a personal failure on the part of state leadership if they call in the federal resources to do their job beyond what they do every day, promoting joint task forces. I've seen atf, dea, fbi.

▶ 4:43:27Sen. Tillis: I've been in briefing rooms at 3:00 in the morning to do 55 no-knock warrants on bad people. You do that every day and thank god you are. Looks like we should plus it up in a few cities. I would rather use the money to deploy national guard to continue to leverage what you are already doing well. I compliment you because I have to believe it is a lot of joint task forces that increase the apprehension and charging rates. So thank you for them.

▶ 4:43:55Sen. Tillis: Do you agree that if we are going to have a sustained impact on crime, whether memphis or any other city, that we have to enable, empower and support the men and women on the ground there every day?

▶ 4:44:09Dir. Patel: 100%.

▶ 4:44:11Sen. Tillis: Your cost-benefit mind needs to go, if I'm about to deploy this many national guardsmen to a city, what does that cost and look like if we compile that into ongoing joint task force which are working well in north carolina. I will move on. The safer communities act, can I get your commitment to get an update?

▶ 4:44:41Sen. Tillis: Maybe we could take a trip to west virginia to see how we are doing an extraordinary job of mixed background checks. People are getting them in record time but we are taking a few guns away from people that probably should not buy. You agree with that characterization?

▶ 4:44:58Dir. Patel: I welcome you out to see it is working.

▶ 4:45:01Sen. Tillis: We had people on my side of the aisle saying it would be awful, resulted in mass confiscation of guns. They were wrong, this bill is making a difference. I also want to talk about behavioral health and other components in granting. I know in north carolina things are going well. The tragic events in north carolina and charlotte, the stabbing. I spoke with one of the family members yesterday.

▶ 4:45:36Sen. Tillis: I think we have to recognize that we have magistrates that have a revolving door policy and they should be held accountable if they are releasing dangerous people but I also think some of the problem is we don't have lace to send people, particularly with respect to behavioral health.

▶ 4:45:59Sen. Tillis: Every law enforcement officer I have ever spoken with says, I have law-enforcement officers in an emergency room because I don't have a place with a bed I can send them to, I don't have a behavioral health facility. We have to provide more ways to detain people that are a risk for themselves and the community. I believe the safer communities act is a good framework for them.

▶ 4:46:25Sen. Tillis: Section 702 will come up in april next year for renewal. You believe it should be eliminated and not reauthorized?

▶ 4:46:33Dir. Patel: No, sir.

▶ 4:46:35Sen. Tillis: Can I get your commitment to review some of the controls in place so hopefully we won't have drama leading up to april? We can actually come here and get consensus on why you have the checks and balances in place, and why we should remove any chance we should run into that cliff narrative next year? Can I get your commitment?

▶ 4:46:58Dir. Patel: You have it.

▶ 4:46:59Sen. Tillis: I want to talk briefly -- the chair is giving me a gavel but I promise not to go over one or two minutes. That is why it chose to be last to have this discussion and get to some facts versus agendas and click be --bait. Tell me a little about the rationale behind the change in stance on recruiting. I also understand there may be a reduction in the academy timeline.

▶ 4:47:30Sen. Tillis: Give me some thinking about where you are on recruiting, retention, training?

▶ 4:47:33Dir. Patel: Recruitment is through the roof, we doubled up month over month our applicants, the federal agents to analysts. Recruitment is going wonderful. What we have to do is figure out how to get crate of because the bftc timeline is an 18 to 20 week program and what we have done to address openings for the 1811 bric agents we opened it up and said do you want to come over?

▶ 4:48:01Dir. Patel: You went through, you were cops or military officers. So we created a shortened bridge programs of six weeks at quantico. If you want to come over and be an fbi agent you can do so. There are transfers all the time, we just made it easier. We are also recruiting police officers that do not have a college degree, but in my opinion that does not disqualify them.

▶ 4:48:24Dir. Patel: It is a rigorous application process,, just one item but we are changing timelines based on the needs of the country but not jeopardizing quality.

▶ 4:48:32Sen. Tillis: I'm glad you mentioned that. I heard someone saying you were hiring someone without a college degree. Most of them have had basic law enforcement training, although certifications. You're talking to someone who did not achieve my four year degree until I was 37. I would like to think I brought some things to the table.

▶ 4:48:58Sen. Tillis: The comment is inappropriate for somebody considering this, to think they are a lesser person because they don't have a piece of paper. I wanted to get back -- the last thing I will talk about, I will follow up with questions for the record. Thank you for being consistently responsive to any inquiries I've made to you.

▶ 4:49:24Sen. Tillis: On the kirk shooting, I do believe that senator schmitt's numbers are right. There seems to be a disproportionate number of voices on the left that are celebrating the assassination of a ceo or celebrating the assassination of someone, and Mr.

▶ 4:49:48Sen. Tillis: Kirk's case, that I disagreed with half of his positions, but felt he was a good voice engaging young people and that is a start, as long as we can do it civilly. Also I went back online because I hammered on this committee multiple times I found on pinterest, even today you could order a t-shirt that says acab 13.12 which translates to "all cops are bastards."

▶ 4:50:19Sen. Tillis: Or you can getan f the cops shirt at the same location on pinterest. There is clearly a problem with the voices of the left. I'm not saying -- they need to tamp it down. Within 24 hours of Mr. kirk's shooting we had the guy that does the podcast for the war room and another guy who denied the sandy hook shootings say we are at war.

▶ 4:50:51Sen. Tillis: How on earth, and I do believe it is a smaller number, but a number with influence, how on earth are we de-escalating the situation with tensions as high as they were last week with going out and saying we are at war? I'm not asking you to respond to this question, I'm just saying there are people out here on our side of the aisle that need to look in the mirror. Even if you agree it is a lower number, bad is bad no matter how many numbers they are.

▶ 4:51:22Sen. Tillis: That kind of rhetoric and mobilization makes your job more difficult and puts us in a position where we are not being as productive as you want the fbi and state and local law enforcement to be. I'm finished. I want to thank you for your service, your concise answers, and I'm thoroughly impressed with the fact you have sat in that chair for over four hours without a break.

▶ 4:51:47Sen. Tillis: With that, on behalf of the chair, I want to thank you for being here today. Also -- are we leaving the record open? The record will be open for one week so you may have questions for the record. Mr. patel, thank you for being here. >> the meeting is adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap.org]

Title

FBI Director Patel testifies on Charlie Kirk assassination and bureau reforms

Purpose

The Senate Judiciary Committee held its annual FBI oversight hearing with Director Kash Patel, convening in the immediate aftermath of the assassination of activist Charlie Kirk. Chairman Grassley opened by releasing new whistleblower records related to the "Arctic Frost" investigation and by praising Patel's reforms, while the hearing became a broader clash over Patel's handling of Kirk's murder investigation, mass personnel removals at the FBI, the Epstein files, and allegations of political retaliation. Begins at▶ 0:14:26

Who spoke

• Chair Chuck Grassley (R-IA)▶ 0:14:26: Opened by honoring Charlie Kirk and citing 23,000 violent-criminal arrests since January 20▶ 0:16:04; released new "Arctic Frost" and 1023 whistleblower documents alleging FBI scrutiny of 92 Republican organizations▶ 0:18:27▶ 0:23:33; later questioned Patel on Epstein, the 1023 Biden-family bribery allegations, and the "hidden room" of unrecorded FBI documents▶ 0:51:15▶ 0:52:04▶ 1:00:19.

• Sen. Dick Durbin (D-IL), Ranking Member▶ 0:27:11: Contrasted Patel's promises with Director Wray's retention by Biden▶ 0:27:30; pressed on polygraph loyalty tests, the unsigned Epstein memo, and the firing of veteran agents including a former Air Force pilot▶ 1:02:14▶ 1:05:13▶ 1:09:01.

• Dir. Kash Patel, FBI Director▶ 0:36:29: Sworn in and gave an opening statement detailing the 33-hour manhunt for Kirk's shooter▶ 0:36:35▶ 0:37:50; cited 23,000 violent-crime arrests, 1,600 kg of fentanyl seized, and 33,000 pages produced to Congress▶ 0:40:05▶ 0:43:22▶ 0:47:04; repeatedly denied firing anyone for political retaliation▶ 3:26:28.

• Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC)▶ 1:18:11: Pressed Patel on Section 230 liability for child sexual exploitation material online, got Patel's agreement to advocate sunsetting it▶ 1:19:00; asked about Venezuela as a narco-terror state and Hezbollah▶ 1:14:41▶ 1:22:23.

• Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse (D-RI)▶ 1:23:58: Challenged Patel on his "enemies list," noting roughly 20 of 60 named people had faced adverse action▶ 1:24:37; questioned background-check timing for U.S. Attorney Jeanine Pirro▶ 1:27:20.

• Sen. John Cornyn (R-TX)▶ 1:34:50: Asked about FBI management of 36,500 employees and morale▶ 1:35:17; discussed the counterintelligence mission and treating narco-traffickers as foreign terrorist organizations▶ 1:37:35.

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-MN)▶ 1:43:37: Described the Minneapolis church shooting and Hortman assassination▶ 1:44:06; pressed Patel on assault weapons bans, background checks, and AI election interference▶ 1:48:09▶ 1:53:30.

• Sen. Josh Hawley (R-MO)▶ 1:54:30: Focused on anti-Christian violence, citing 400+ church-hostility incidents in 2024▶ 1:57:54; pressed Patel on the FBI's prior "radical traditionalist Catholic" informant memo and confirmed terminations occurred over it▶ 2:02:12▶ 2:03:57; asked about AI-generated child sexual abuse material▶ 2:05:02.

• Sen. Chris Coons (D-DE)▶ 2:07:11: Cited Patel's confirmation promise of no retribution firings▶ 2:07:38; pressed on the $500 million requested FBI budget cut and closure of the internal audit office▶ 2:11:36▶ 2:15:45.

• Sen. John Kennedy (R-LA)▶ 2:18:19: Congratulated the 33-hour Kirk-suspect apprehension▶ 2:18:48; pressed Patel on whether Epstein trafficked victims to anyone besides himself, getting an answer limited to "credible information" on file▶ 2:24:52▶ 2:26:16.

• Sen. Richard Blumenthal (D-CT)▶ 2:30:28: Accused Patel of lying about no-retaliation promises, citing a lawsuit by three fired agents and an FBI Agents Association statement representing 90% of active agents▶ 2:31:33▶ 2:32:02.

• Sen. Sheldon "Kennedy" [Sen. Hirono continuation] — *(see below)*

• Sen. Chris Murphy [not present] — *(none identified)*

• Sen. Chris Van Hollen [not present]

• Sen. Mazie Hirono (D-HI)▶ 2:52:18: Pressed repeatedly for specific personnel-turnover numbers and names of replacement officials, which Patel declined to give▶ 2:52:52▶ 2:56:53; questioned new physical fitness pull-up standards' effect on women applicants▶ 3:01:14.

• Sen. Katie Britt (R-AL)▶ 3:03:40: Asked what steps FBI is taking to trace financing behind political violence▶ 3:06:16; questioned Patel on sextortion and child exploitation initiatives▶ 3:09:25.

• Sen. Cory Booker (D-NJ)▶ 3:14:11: Accused Patel of lying under oath about retaliatory firings, citing the termination of Special Agent Brian Driscoll▶ 3:18:10; a heated exchange followed over interrupting Patel's response time▶ 3:24:21▶ 3:25:10.

• Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX)▶ 3:27:39: Criticized Democrats for "berating" the FBI over successfully doing its job▶ 3:28:05; asked about Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization and funding behind campus protests▶ 3:35:24▶ 3:37:23.

• Sen. Alex Padilla (D-CA)▶ 3:37:53: Questioned FBI enforcement results on lost/stolen firearms and machine-gun conversion devices▶ 3:38:54; pressed on the disbanded Foreign Influence Task Force▶ 3:43:03.

• Sen. Marsha Blackburn (R-TN)▶ 3:49:33: Highlighted "Operation Viper" in Memphis, citing over 500 gang arrests and a 5,000% rise in cargo theft▶ 3:53:36; discussed Section 230 reform for child predators▶ 3:59:18.

• Sen. Peter Welch (D-VT)▶ 4:00:10: Challenged Patel's premature "suspect in custody" announcement during the Kirk manhunt▶ 4:01:06; questioned Patel's personal use of FBI jets for a UFC fight and hockey games▶ 4:06:54▶ 4:08:14.

• Sen. Ashley Moody (R-FL)▶ 4:13:49: Framed FBI resource reallocation as compensating for "woke" local policies▶ 4:16:33; asked about nonprofits allegedly undermining city safety▶ 4:19:40.

• Sen. Adam Schiff (D-CA)▶ 4:25:31: Pressed Patel on whether any firings were retaliatory for Trump-related casework, receiving repeated denials▶ 4:26:04▶ 4:27:26; questioned Epstein's "black book" and Ghislaine Maxwell's prison transfer, ending in a heated personal exchange▶ 4:31:41▶ 4:35:49.

• Sen. Thom Tillis (R-NC)▶ 4:38:39: Reviewed Patel's résumé and government service record▶ 4:39:11; asked about Section 702 reauthorization and FBI recruiting/training changes▶ 4:46:25▶ 4:47:33; closed the hearing thanking Patel for over four hours of testimony▶ 4:51:47.

• Sen. Eric Schmitt (R-MO)▶ 2:41:23: Delivered an extended statement arguing political violence in America is disproportionately driven by left-wing actors, citing polling data and a list of incidents▶ 2:46:16▶ 2:51:39.

Key moments

• Grassley and Sen. Ron Johnson released new "Arctic Frost" whistleblower records alleging the investigation's scope expanded to 92 Republican organizations, including Turning Point USA▶ 0:18:54▶ 0:57:51.

• Patel testified the Kirk shooting suspect was identified within 33 hours after his father recognized him from released video and turned him in▶ 0:37:50▶ 2:18:41.

• Sen. Welch challenged Patel's early public claim that the assassination suspect was "in custody," which proved false roughly 27 hours before the actual arrest; Patel called it not a mistake but "working with the public"▶ 4:01:06▶ 4:01:56▶ 4:02:18.

• Kennedy and Schiff pressed Patel on whether Epstein trafficked women to anyone besides himself; Patel said "there is no credible information, none" in the case file, prompting Schiff to challenge whether the FBI is telling the public the "list has a single name"▶ 2:26:16▶ 4:33:11.

• Blumenthal cited an FBI Agents Association statement, representing 90% of active agents, saying Patel's actions "foster fear" and "increase the risk of...national security threats"▶ 2:32:02.

• Booker and Schiff pressed Patel on the firing of Special Agent Brian Driscoll — an 18-year veteran and former Hostage Rescue Team commander — which Patel would not discuss due to ongoing litigation▶ 3:18:10▶ 4:05:06.

• Welch confronted Patel over FBI-jet travel to a UFC fight in Las Vegas, a hockey game in New York, and a UFC fight in Miami; Patel said he pays the "commercial equivalent" and flies from Andrews to save money▶ 4:06:54▶ 4:08:14▶ 4:13:22.

• Sen. Schmitt argued political violence is disproportionately left-driven, citing a poll finding 25% of "very liberal" respondents said violence for political goals could be justified versus under 3% of "very conservative" respondents▶ 2:46:16.

• Hawley confirmed FBI terminations and resignations occurred over a prior memo recruiting informants inside Catholic parishes, calling it "one of the most revolting chapters in FBI history"▶ 2:03:57▶ 2:04:01.

• Hirono repeatedly asked for numbers of FBI personnel departures and names of replacement officials; Patel declined to provide names, saying "so you can attack them"▶ 2:56:51▶ 2:56:53.

• Cruz and Patel discussed reported evidence that the Kirk shooting suspect's roommate was transgender and possibly a romantic partner, and bullet casings bearing "Antifa" and LGBT-related engravings, which Patel said remained under investigation▶ 3:34:04▶ 3:34:46.

Metadata

Committee	Senate Judiciary
Chamber / Congress	Senate · 119th Congress
Date	September 16, 2025
Type	Meeting
Witnesses	(none listed in event metadata)
Video	senate-isvp
Transcript	1,050 caption blocks · 37,020 words · 4:52:27 runtime
Event	Congress.gov 337421