▶ 0:15:34Chair Scott: The U.S. special committee on aging one now come to order. Think about someone you love. I have a five-year granddaughter that turns six tomorrow. She is so excited. Someone who worked hard their entire career, who gave everything they could to set themselves up for retirement with the information available to them.
▶ 0:16:06Chair Scott: Is that enough? Does that happen differently, do they know a medicare advantage plan and the medicare supplement? Chances are they don't. It is not entirely their fault. First so many americans especially seniors, it is hard to find the information.
▶ 0:16:37Chair Scott: It might be biased when you do find it. We have done a poor job of ensuring people do know their options. I wonder how ai answer these questions. And it is having real consequences on our seniors' lives.
▶ 0:17:03Chair Scott: Housing, health care, transportation, food, the basics, they have all gone up in cost. Social security only replaces about 40% of pre-retirement income on average. The math is hard to come of the reality is stark. There is little room for error. Older americans are being forced to make some of the most consequential decisions of their entire lives.
▶ 0:17:31Chair Scott: When you retire and claim benefits, how do you evaluate insurance products? In our state, people are frustrated you buy a house and your property insurance or hoa fees keep growing up. When I was growing up, when you got your house paid off, there were almost no other costs.
▶ 0:17:58Chair Scott: The result becomes a guessing game where they hope for the best and prepare for the worst but you can't blame them. Too often, the resources to help people best prepare are buried on government websites, written in language for policy experts. When the fda doesn't recall, they just put it another website. That's all they do. You have no idea, it's fascinating, no idea. Who would think that would be a problem?
▶ 0:18:29Chair Scott: On top of all of that the scammers come calling. I get on a daily bases now and I deleted, somebody that has said I'm approved for new credit line. Every day it is a different number, every day. In 2024, fraud and scam cost older americans billions of dollars. They use tools like artificial intelligence, voice cloning.
▶ 0:18:58Chair Scott: They do their homework and know exactly what to say and how to say it. For all the work they are counting on one thing. Financial literacy is one of the most powerful used tools we have.
▶ 0:19:16Chair Scott: When seniors understand how their benefits were, they make better decisions, they know how to read a financial statement and recognize bad actors and are harder to deceive and they understand the difference between a legitimate investment and a pitch that is too good to be true. I got a letter from a canadian law firm that said they think somebody died that was related to me that had the last name scott.
▶ 0:19:43Chair Scott: They said they would split it with me and it was something like 8 million or 10 million or $12 million. It looked like a nice letterhead from a law firm and it looked like a legitimate law firm. Details, details. [laughter] when they understand the difference is too good to be true, they understand themselves. They know they are not navigating this alone.
▶ 0:20:15Chair Scott: It doesn't require more spending to be thrown at the problem. It requires a commitment to get that information into people's hands and it is what this committee set out to do and I'm proud to announce the upcoming release from both the ranking member in me, a new resource, guarding your nest egg, a financial resource guide for older adults.
▶ 0:20:38Chair Scott: They will cover the decisions that matter most in life, charitable giving, disaster preparedness, and planning for the unexpected and it provides clear guidelines about what a scam looks like, plain language tools you can actually use, available at aging.senate.gov because every older american deserves the tools to protect what they spend their lifetime building.
▶ 0:21:07Chair Scott: Clear information in a free to use, now I will turn it over to the ranking member who has been a pleasure to work with.
▶ 0:21:14Sen. Gillibrand: Thank you, chairman scott, I'm very excited about our report, I think it will be great and people will benefit from it and use it. Thanks to the witnesses, I appreciate your expertise. We can hopefully do good things for our seniors and help them. Wait a minute. Ok.
▶ 0:21:44Sen. Gillibrand: I thought april was a person's name, but it's not, it's a month. April is financial literacy month. Over 11,000 americans turn 65 every single day in longer lifespans translate to spending more years in retirement these aging demographics place a strain on or national, state,
▶ 0:22:15Sen. Gillibrand: And local budgets and our health care programs. Recently, the president shared that in his estimation "it is not possible to take care of medicaid and medicare." they can do it on a state basis. You can't do it annoyed federal level. End of quote.
▶ 0:22:35Sen. Gillibrand: Since 1965, when medicaid and medicare were signed into law for older americans and the disabled in people with limited resources, the american people have expected these programs to be there to help take care of them and their loved ones when they need them. The american people budget when they are saving for their own lives.
▶ 0:23:02Sen. Gillibrand: No matter the circumstance whether they are focused on wealth management or tax strategies, building an emergency savings fund or navigating health insurance premiums or skilled nursing costs in retirement, americans are doing the best they can to financially provide for themselves and their families. Cdc data shows that 44% of adults over 65 are diagnosed with a disability.
▶ 0:23:29Sen. Gillibrand: Many people struggle to see themselves in these health statistics or to develop a future plan for a special needs adult or a child. Despite individuals finding the time in their busy lives to build financial goals and striving to adopt a commitment to savings, the unexpected always happens.
▶ 0:23:51Sen. Gillibrand: Suddenly, you have an injury, a loss of a job, or a job, or death in the family and it could be the family's breadwinner, requiring financial stabilization, resilience, and a new path forward. The consumer pi -- financial protection bureau serves those who suffer financial shock and are victim -- victims of fraud and scams by providing resources and educational materials and we recognize more needs to be done
▶ 0:24:21Sen. Gillibrand: Strategically to coordinate across government to better protect older adults from financial abuse and elder abuse. I look forward to hearing from americans and how they can become better empowered to secure their own future through better financial competency and what resources exist.
▶ 0:24:42Sen. Gillibrand: I welcome your views on how we tackle persistent gaps for the underserved and women who are responsible frequently for caregiving and providing for multigenerational households. Thank you.
▶ 0:24:55Chair Scott: Thank you, ranking member. I would like to welcome our witnesses. Our first witness is christine kieffer, senior director and interim head of finra's office of investor education. Finra is a frontline watchdog for america's investment markets , enforcing the rules that protect investors and making sure people selling financial products meet the standards required to do so.
▶ 0:25:24Chair Scott: It's investor education mission where they work on developing their tools, resources, and programs that help older americans understand their financial options and protect themselves, thank you for being here and please begin your testimony.
▶ 0:25:37Ms. Kieffer: Good afternoon, chairman scott, rick and weber gillibrand, and members of the community. I serve as interim head of investor education at finra. I'm honored to be here to offer insights on the role of financial literacy and empowering seniors and preventing fraud. Finra is a self-regulatory organization whose mission is to protect investors and preserve market integrity.
▶ 0:26:02Ms. Kieffer: The member firms and associated professionals we oversee are deeply committed to the issues being discussed today. For older americans, financial literacy is not a luxury, it is an essential set of skills needed for building wealth, protecting savings, and preserving autonomy. A devastating loss at the hands of a scammer can undo a lifetime of work and severely impact mental and physical health. Today, I would like to emphasize three points.
▶ 0:26:33Ms. Kieffer: Financial literacy is protective. It is only part of the solution and success requires a team effort. First, financial literacy is a critical buffer against the predictable and unpredictable challenges of aging. Individuals with higher financial literacy are more likely to have emergency savings, are better able to manage unexpected costs, and are less susceptible to scams.
▶ 0:27:01Ms. Kieffer: Financial literacy matters not only an older age, but as we age. To support evidence-based programming, we understand financial literacy gaps. Financial literacy alone cannot provide adequate protection against scams at scale. It must be coupled with awareness of specific scams and a fluency and persuasion or persuasion literacy.
▶ 0:27:34Ms. Kieffer: Collectively, these skills help individuals defend against emotional manipulation and safeguard their assets. To maintain effectiveness, scam prevention messaging must be widely disseminated and frequently and we must employ other terms such as enforcement and regulatory action to protect americans. Third, tackling financial fraud requires a collaborative approach.
▶ 0:28:00Ms. Kieffer: Cyber security and fraud threats are often sophisticated operations orchestrated by organized criminals across the globe, demanding a unified response. Finra does its part to protect, defend, and respond to these threats by working with a network of collaborators, developing and distributing fraud prevention resources and training consumers and professionals, including our member firms, law enforcement, federal and state regulators, social workers, and mental
▶ 0:28:30Ms. Kieffer: Health professionals. Member firms are on the frontlines of investment protections was a regulator we are continuously improving our response to evolving threats. Early last year we launched a series of initiatives to modernize our regulatory approach including expanding fraud prevention activities making enhancements to our rules that assist firms in safeguarding the accounts of older and vulnerable adults.
▶ 0:29:01Ms. Kieffer: In march of this year, we launched the financial intelligence fusion center which is a secure forum where firms can receive and share timely, actionable cybersecurity and fraud threat intelligence to protect customers and businesses. Even in that short time, we have seen the fusion centers speed the delivery to our member firms. Our collaboration extends the congress. We hosted a fraud prevention and response training for constituent facing staff last year.
▶ 0:29:32Ms. Kieffer: One office contacted us after the training to request assistance in the precipice -- helping a constituent in the precipice of being victimized. Encouraged by this feedback in may, we will be expanding the program with the launch of the frontline responders program, a training that will equip offices with the expertise to identify and report fraud and find
▶ 0:30:04Ms. Kieffer: Additional support. Finra has long been committed to protecting senior investors when combating financial fraud. We look forward to lending our support to your efforts.
▶ 0:30:13Chair Scott: Thank you. Our next witness, sam kunjukunju , vice president of consumer education at the american bankers association foundation, representing banks of every size around the country, helping americans build financial literacy. He understand something that doesn't get set enough, banks are often the first institution to notice when something has gone wrong for a senior customer.
▶ 0:30:44Chair Scott: Whether it is a wire transfer, an unusual withdrawal, banks are often the first to notice. Thanks for being here, please begin your testimony.
▶ 0:30:56Mr. Kunjukunju: Thank you for the opportunity to testify at today's hearing. As you mentioned I am at the subsidiary of the american bankers association. America is aging, by 2030, 1 in five people will be age 65 or older.
▶ 0:31:27Mr. Kunjukunju: Elder financial exploitation is rising. Between 2024 and 2025, the fbi observed in nearly 60% increase in reported financial losses and a 37% increase in complaints among older people. The ftc estimates losses might have been as high as 81 point $5 billion in 2024 alone among older adults.
▶ 0:31:52Mr. Kunjukunju: Given this reality, they work on a four prong strategy to protect older adults. Firstly, educating consumers, training bankers, cultivating partnerships with law enforcement and adult protective services and leveraging technology. In 2016, the foundation launched the safe banking for seniors program to equip bankers with tools to educate older adults.
▶ 0:32:22Mr. Kunjukunju: We provide bankers with presentation slides, videos, handouts to deliver community workshops. The program supports older adults and their families by strengthening financial caregiving and managing money. The coverage topics such as avoiding scams, preventing identity theft, digital safety matters, choosing a financial caregiver, understanding powers of attorney and retiring with limited resources.
▶ 0:32:52Mr. Kunjukunju: More than 2000 banks have participated in the program. We partner with eight other agencies to produce and faux graphics -- infographics focusing on scams and we run national awareness campaigns like banks never ask that and practice safe checks we work
▶ 0:33:23Mr. Kunjukunju: With bankers to recognize, respond to and support elder financial expectation. We developed an online course about financial expectation prevention and created an elder fraud prevention summit to train bankers on protecting older customers.
▶ 0:33:44Mr. Kunjukunju: Additionally, we recognize that strong coordination with law enforcement and adult protective services is essential, working with the national adult protective services association to help share trends, improve communication, and partner together. Lastly, aba helps banks explore innovative software solutions to the aba partner network. To strengthen fraud prevention networks.
▶ 0:34:13Mr. Kunjukunju: These tools help banks detect suspicious activity, streamline reporting and provide customers with more accessible banking experiences. Banks across the nation recognize that protecting older adults requires a diverse set of strategies from large institutions to small community banks, banks are hosting fraud prevention workshops, online bank training, financial wellness seminars, and outreach with community organizations.
▶ 0:34:42Mr. Kunjukunju: While the banking industry is investing significantly and protecting older people, the scale of today's scams requires a strategic, coordinated, national response. America needs a nationwide education campaign bringing together federal agencies, nonprofits, as well as the private sector to expose common scam tactics such as impersonation, manufactured urgency, demands for sigrid c, and pressure to act quickly.
▶ 0:35:11Mr. Kunjukunju: At the same time, congress should consider legislative solutions that empower banks to delay transactions when they suspect elder financial exploitation. A clear federal standard with an appropriate safe armor -- safe harbor would help protect older adults.
▶ 0:35:30Mr. Kunjukunju: The banking industry is committed to helping protect older adults through education, partnerships, and responsible innovation with a unified national awareness campaign and clear authority to pause transactions when suspecting exploitation we can better prevent fraud and help older people preserve the financial security they have worked a lifetime to build. Thank you for the opportunity to testify at today's hearing, I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:35:56Chair Scott: Thank you, sam. I would like to introduce carly roszkowski, vice president of financial resilience programming at aarp, leading efforts to help seniors build real financial resilience, that holds up one costs rise, scammers call, or life throws something unexpected at you in retirement.
▶ 0:36:18Chair Scott: Aarp reaches older adults in every district in this country and she breaks the data and ask -- brings the data and experience to speak to it seniors are actually facing.
▶ 0:36:29Ms. Roszkowski: Thank you, chairman scott, wrecking member gillibrand, and members of the committee for inviting me to testify on this hearing. My name is carly roszkowski and I'm the vice president of financial resilience programming at aarp. We deeply appreciate your attention to the important role financial literacy plays in building a more secure retirement.
▶ 0:36:53Ms. Roszkowski: Financial literacy is foundational to economic security, it can help americans save to afford housing and health care, avoid debt and fraud, make informed retirement decisions and remain independent. But financial literacy is not something that can be one and done, it must happen across one's life, especially as we age, when financial decisions become complex and the consequences are more severe.
▶ 0:37:20Ms. Roszkowski: We live in a new world where the retirement system has shifted risk from companies to workers. Individuals, not companies, must manage saving, investing, and turning those savings into lifelong income. Folks have to decide on investment strategies to decide when and how to climb security and balance that with living costs and unknown lifespans.
▶ 0:37:49Ms. Roszkowski: To make things worse, these decisions often occur during major life transitions, retirement time caregiving, widowhood, job loss, or health challenges. When people are least equipped to absorb complexity or recover from the stakes. Today, 64% of adults worry they won't have enough money to retire and nearly one in five non-retirees have no retirement savings at all. Millions of retirees have returned to work, primarily because they need the income.
▶ 0:38:22Ms. Roszkowski: Rising costs and lack of guaranteed income means the trend will likely continue. Work has become a bridge to financial security later in life but the bridge is strongest when people understand the financial trade-offs involved and have access to clear, trusted information. Financial literacy is also a critical defense against fraud.
▶ 0:38:47Ms. Roszkowski: Older adults are disproportionately targeted by increasingly sophisticated scams that exploit technology, urgency, and trust. Fraud is no longer limited to suspicious phone calls, it involves email, text messages, social media, and artificial intelligence. Without ongoing accessible financial education, even experienced consumers can be vulnerable.
▶ 0:39:14Ms. Roszkowski: That's why financial literacy for older americans must move far beyond basic lessons on saving our budgeting. It must include guidance on managing retirement income, coordinating social security and health costs, understanding accumulation, navigating digital financial tools, and recognizing and responding to fraud. It must reflect a people actually experience finances later in life, not just early in their careers. Equally important, financial education must be delivered in ways that work for older adults.
▶ 0:39:47Ms. Roszkowski: A one-size-fits-all approach is not effective. People vary widely in their comfort with technology, learning styles, and access to information. Programs are most effective when they use trusted messengers, plain language, and real-world examples. At aarp, we see that when older adults have access to relevant, trustworthy financial information, outcomes improve.
▶ 0:40:12Ms. Roszkowski: People are better able to avoid scams, manage dead, stretch their savings and maintain independence longer. Financial literacy is not just an individual benefit, it reduces public costs and strengthens families and communities.
▶ 0:40:27Ms. Roszkowski: In closing, the realities of longer lives for some, rising costs, and retirement system that places increasing responsibility on individuals demand a renewed focus on financial literacy that is practical, ongoing, and actionable.
▶ 0:40:45Ms. Roszkowski: By investing in trusted education, decision support tools, and policies that reflect how people work and retired today, we can help ensure every american has knowledge and confidence to achieve financial security, independence, and dignity as they age. We urge you to ensure older adults needs are a priority.
▶ 0:41:12Ms. Roszkowski: Thank you for your leadership and commitment to protecting older americans. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:41:17Chair Scott: Thank you and now I recognize wrecking member jell-o brand to introduce our last witness.
▶ 0:41:22Sen. Gillibrand: Thank you Mr. chairman. I want to introduce our next witness, scott kahan, a certified financial planner educated and lifelong new yorker. In 1986, Mr.
▶ 0:41:36Sen. Gillibrand: Kahan founded the financial asset management corporation which operates in westchester county and new york city and serves as president and senior financial planner and provides pro bono financial planning for those in need, regularly organizes college planning seminars and is responsible for the establishment of certificate planning at nyu, notably, he spearheaded financial planning
▶ 0:42:06Sen. Gillibrand: Services for affected 9/11 families, it is your time to speak.
▶ 0:42:16Mr. Kahan: Chairman scott, ranking member gillibrand and members of the committee, I'm a certified financial planner professional and I have worked directly with individuals and families to build financial security and peace of mind. We appreciate the committees focus on empowering seniors during financial literacy month.
▶ 0:42:41Mr. Kahan: Through my personal and professional life I've learned that it improves outcomes, research shows that individuals who work with a cfp professional were more likely to have emergency savings, feel financially secure and confident about their future. Financial planning is not a luxury, it's a lifeline and it needs to come from a cfp professional. Today seniors face complex financial decisions.
▶ 0:43:09Mr. Kahan: Navigating medicare, managing retirement income and planning, senior serving targeted by increasingly sophisticated fraud , advances in ai have made scams more convincing than ever and it can be hard to tell what is real. When seniors are victimized by fraud, the impact is often devastating. Seniors frequently do not have time or income to recover.
▶ 0:43:37Mr. Kahan: Money lost to fraud is money they planned to use in retirement and the harm is immediate and under the current tax law, victims often face a tax law. Financial fraud is not just a setback for many seniors, it is permanent. We should empower seniors with tools to protect themselves in an increasingly complex financial landscape. Financial security supports independence, family stability, and dignity in later life.
▶ 0:44:08Mr. Kahan: Financial literacy can make a real difference. Cfp professionals help individuals cut through complexity, recognize that information, and make decisions grounded in their best interest. We were callista clear across budgeting, investing, insurance, taxes, and retirement planning.
▶ 0:44:29Mr. Kahan: We are financial first responders and often spot early warning signs of fraud or financial exploitation and can help intervene before damage becomes irreversible. The financial picture in this country makes this work even more urgent. Many americans are financially vulnerable long before fraud enters the picture. A large portion of households lack even modest emergency savings. For seniors on a fixed income, a senior -- single unexpected event can trigger long-lasting financial harm.
▶ 0:45:00Mr. Kahan: I've seen this repeatedly in my own work and own life. As a newly minted senior citizen who recently navigated medicare and ss cfp professional with 40 years of experience, it still challenged me. Imagine facing that system along without the benefit of a cfp professional.
▶ 0:45:18Mr. Kahan: I've lived to the reality of the sandwich generation, when parents retired earlier than the resources allowed, I supported them for much of their retirement while raising my own children and saving for their retirement. Many families are quietly carrying the same burden. Too often, people seek help only when they are already in crisis, but crisis is the worst time to make complex and financial decisions.
▶ 0:45:50Mr. Kahan: Financial planning should be viewed as preventative care you shouldn't have to be wealthy to benefit from financial planning. Many cfp's provide pro bono financial services. After 9/11, I provided free financial planning to people in new york.
▶ 0:46:18Mr. Kahan: Our organization provides funding for community organizations to provide pro bono financial planning along with financial literacy to underserved populations and seniors in crisis. I know the board has called upon congress to expand access to tax incentives for middle income americans.
▶ 0:46:45Mr. Kahan: Financial literacy and access to trusted financial planning helps seniors avoid fraud and protect their futures. I urge the committee and congress to expand access to this protection. Thank you.
▶ 0:46:57Chair Scott: Thank each of you for being here. Now we will start with questions. >> thank you, chairman scott. I want to focus on how seniors are being exploited through scams and the nature of what is happening too many seniors being targeted by criminals because what I think is especially sinister is they pray on their generosity, their compassion and
▶ 0:47:27Chair Scott: Their kindness. You see that particularly with ai driven technologies they can impersonate the voice of a child, a grandchild. They can find new and inventive ways of scamming our seniors.
▶ 0:47:54Chair Scott: Frankly, I think the criminals that do this, there is a special place in hell for them because it is so awful what they do to these senior citizens who are preyed upon. I've introduced legislation preventing deepfake scams, that would establish a task force on work with financial institutions on how we can use and avoid the abuse of ai, how we can use it for good and use it to protect
▶ 0:48:26Chair Scott: Seniors from potential risks. Let me start and I wasn't here for the pronunciation of your name, but I'm going to go with the way it has it phonetically spelled, Mr. -- sam kunjukunju. What are banks doing and what can they do proactively to protect seniors from these ai driven scams?
▶ 0:48:53Mr. Kunjukunju: I want to thank you for your question because this is something that bankers are dealing with on a regular basis. It is an everyday situation looking at this issue. When it comes to banks, we are making sure that they are trained and one of the major indications of something that is wrong and a change in a person's behavior, whether that might be something along the lines of their demeanor is changing, maybe they are stressed out,
▶ 0:49:23Mr. Kunjukunju: Maybe they are suddenly disheveled, that is one of the steps. The second thing is to look at if there are any changes. There is something going on differently that seems to be indicative of some sort of exploitation or fraud. The third is is there some sort of change having to do with the transaction, are they wiring money abroad when they never wired money anywhere? That is one way to identify issues.
▶ 0:49:52Mr. Kunjukunju: We are educated consumers annoyed couple of key things. Make sure you talk to people in your trusted circle before you make any financial decision. Phone numbers can be spoofed, caller id can be spoofed. Don't trust that information always hang up on somebody, call back.
▶ 0:50:11Mr. Kunjukunju: If there is some set of urgency or concerns about something that might be popping up, reach back to that person on a known number or if it is an organization on the back of a bank card, a legitimate number on those lines. >> great advice for family members. What can you do, what kind of recommendations do you have for family members about their concern about their elderly family members?
▶ 0:50:38Mr. Kunjukunju: I would say families need to be involved in money decisions. Oftentimes if there is loneliness or social isolation, that makes an individual much more honorable. If we become much more socialized with the idea of being involved, we want to check out and see what is going on, having these discussions, these can be important and valuable.
▶ 0:51:04Mr. Kunjukunju: In addition, banks and securities firms have introduced trusted contact opportunities so if something is off or seems a ride, a bank or financial institution can reach out to a trusted contact to get in touch with someone of something looks off. If families and customers can identify with that is, that provides a great opportunity to get in touch and have some of those conversations.
▶ 0:51:28Mr. Kunjukunju: >> quickly, what are some of the emerging scams, what are some of the things you see that people out to be aware of today?
▶ 0:51:37Mr. Kunjukunju: I would say the top three are investment oriented scams, tech-support, as well as romance scams. These are three particular scams the fbi identified as the top scams for losses among older adults. That said, crypto currency oriented scams have been highlighted in about 20% of all complaints in 2025 alone. >> great, thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:52:04Chair Scott: Senator gillibrand? >> I will just jump straight in here but thank you for letting me jump in. I didn't catch, you know, the fullness of that answer one of the scam side, but I would love to keep that conversation going in terms of just in terms of what comes next year.
▶ 0:52:28Chair Scott: I'm trying to think through this in terms of what to expect going forward a couple years, we know how much technology has been striking it up here so we are living through this moment of this technological change. A lot of that is exciting but it is dramatically increasing risks . Ms.
▶ 0:52:56Chair Scott: Kieffer, you talked about some of this more broadly, but could you share more about some of the fast-growing types of scams targeting older americans right now and how you see them evolve in the last couple of years, what to expect next? I know that was some of what was talked about, but keep going.
▶ 0:53:14Ms. Kieffer: Thank you for the question, senator. What we are seeing today is the emerging of scam typologies. What might start as a relationship or a friendship morphs into an investment scam. Sometimes it is a trading strategy suggestion, sometimes it might be a pump and dump scheme, old-school pump and dump turned into a relationship scam.
▶ 0:53:51Ms. Kieffer: We see recovery operations whereafter the first scam has taken all they can from a victim , we see a follow on scam implemented by the same perpetrators that are coming for either additional funds. Sometimes requesting key locks or they take money from a family friend. In finra's purview, we see a lot of the investment scam infrastructure and we see it morphing in those ways I just suggested.
▶ 0:54:16Sen. Kim: So to stick with you here, so I recently introduced with some of my colleagues the senior security act and we are looking at other ways that would create a senior investor task force within the sec to strengthen some of the safeguards but as we think about these next apps, do you have thoughts on what we should be taken away in terms of what and how federal regulators can't continue to coordinate on this issue to develop the best
▶ 0:54:48Sen. Kim: Strategies for seniors to protect them from scams and be better educated on the technology of the positive use as well.
▶ 0:54:56Ms. Kieffer: The positive use of technology is one that we need to analyze and an area to study because we need to get ahead of the scams. Once the money is out the door, it is very difficult to recover.
▶ 0:55:11Ms. Kieffer: To the extent we can be working with public-private partnerships that encourage the use of the same, transformative technologies to prevent the pictures from ever reaching the individual, we would be well served and that would be the beginning. It does take all of us working together in the different corners that we serve, using the different jurisdictions that we have to make a difference.
▶ 0:55:36Sen. Kim: I wanted to bring you in on this, Ms. roszkowski. As we do education in my state of new jersey and inform about fraud prevention, I think some of the biggest challenge we have is not just the quality of information or the approach, but the capacity, the scale.
▶ 0:56:00Sen. Kim: When we have such an enormity of people trying to reach my office, it feels like sometimes is this even making a difference because of the sheer number of seniors that we are still not able to connect with? I wanted to ask you, what are some of the better strategies and the tactics we should be thinking about to actually be able to scale this type of education we know is so important, but how do we do that in a way that meets the moment?
▶ 0:56:27Ms. Roszkowski: Thank you for that question, fraud is growing at an alarming pace. You talked about investment, ai, job scams. Aarp educates consumers through our fraud watch network and works with fraud and scam victims through our free helpline. It is a free resource open to all and it ensures victims are all treated fairly and works with families.
▶ 0:56:56Ms. Roszkowski: We are very grateful for your support and leadership on the guard asked, as well as the tax relief for victims of crime, scams, and disasters act. We need to educate in different channels and in different spaces , being in every state, aarp has the ability to be one of the ground in local communities educating on of the scams that might be more local and we have the power to educate and create
▶ 0:57:27Ms. Roszkowski: Awareness across the nation with the scams and getting ahead of those scams and continuing to educate in a financial literacy component when we talk about financial implications, but also through all of our other channels.
▶ 0:57:44Sen. Kim: Thank you for that, and I will yield back, chairman.
▶ 0:57:48Chair Scott: Senator? >> thank you, senator scott, thank you ranking member padilla this is an issue near and dear to my heart and it always has been. I grew up with a mother who spent her entire professional career dedicated to making sure low income seniors were not taken advantage of.
▶ 0:58:13Chair Scott: Certainly, my perspective on some of this and what we can be doing to be more fiercely guarded and protective of our seniors probably formed at an early age and carried on through my adult years but as attorney general because I watched and heard so many times that our seniors were being taken advantage of, I started the first ever senior protection team with overlaying all different agencies, all different forms of investigators
▶ 0:58:49Chair Scott: In florida, obviously of florida is a senior state we saw so many seniors with the evolution of new technology, really good technology that was being manipulated by criminals to take advantage of seniors, we wanted to educate them anywhere from the crypto space to the atm's to
▶ 0:59:19Chair Scott: Internet scams and relate this team of investigators and prosecutors may be the dollar amount wasn't a lot even though it was a large amount of someone's life savings or we would determine cumulative patterns where it would have been threshold amounts. After we did that, we had other states coming to us asking how we could do the same things.
▶ 0:59:45Chair Scott: What I really would love to see maurice more federal coordination of the state technologically and legally trained investigators, prosecutors, civil attorneys to specifically address fraud on seniors using technology, really any fraud using technology to overlay the resources we have in the federal government and explore ways to do that.
▶ 1:00:09Chair Scott: Specifically as it relates to seniors, I've noticed, more recently we have seen the scams go was far as courtrooms set up with actual judges and lawyers and prosecutors and they will get people in these zoom hearings and trick them into thinking they are in some sort of legal proceeding and the next step is they then go to banks or financial institutions and try to withdraw money and send by y
▶ 1:00:40Chair Scott: Or some other place to satisfy some court that or obligation that they have been tricked into believing they owe. A lot of the banks are under pressure with the evolution of these types of scams to examine how they can be good-faith players when they realize something may be amiss.
▶ 1:01:00Chair Scott: And certainly we never want to facilitate the meritless holding of assets or money I'm very interested in what some states are trying to do with the bankers and their initiatives, many states have passed I guess what is called hold laws.
▶ 1:01:25Chair Scott: More recently in florida, they passed a protection of specified adult statute, and I'm just wondering and I guess I will direct this question to Mr. kunjukunju. What can we learn from states who protect seniors who have fallen for these technologically advanced scams?
▶ 1:01:56Chair Scott: Have we seen those types of statutes be effective, are the majority of states using this and how has the federal government played into some of those protective efforts?
▶ 1:02:07Mr. Kunjukunju: Sure, it is something we are interested in as well. There are about 27 states around the country that have passed one of these laws. A lot of the origin from this has been proliferating as a result of the security side. In 2018, there were two rules associated with this. One was 21-65. The other was finra rule 4512.
▶ 1:02:37Mr. Kunjukunju: One has to do with the hold and delay laws on the security side and the second has to do with the trusted contact. They're a couple of years where we have seen this happen on the security side when it comes to looking at financial institutions, but we have seen a lot more progress given that we have 27 states around the country that have passed these laws on the stateside for depositary institutions.
▶ 1:03:01Mr. Kunjukunju: One of the major things that comes into play with this is we have to make sure we appropriately educate people that this is possible. One an older adult walks into the branch and has the conversation and is not under the impression that they know they are in the middle of a scam, but if a banker thinks they are in the middle of a scam and a banker starts to ask them questions, initially the older adult may be a little bit put off.
▶ 1:03:29Mr. Kunjukunju: Secondly, if the bank says we are going to investigate this for a couple of days, that's going to lead to some complications. We have to get ahead of all of that to make sure people understand this is for their benefit. Secondly, so they are making sure that this is something that is legal and allowed, so the customer doesn't just leave and say, I'm going to go to another bank and go through the whole process because that is what is really key here.
▶ 1:03:56Mr. Kunjukunju: To your other point, senator moody, what you have done in florida has been amazing. I think you may want to look into what has worked in texas as well. They started the financial intelligence centers and that his financial crimes and intelligent centers on that has been really beneficial to tackle white-collar crimes.
▶ 1:04:16Sen. Moody: Thank you so much.
▶ 1:04:18Chair Scott: Thank you. Ranking member gillibrand.
▶ 1:04:23Senator Gillibrand: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Banking and financial planning processes have shifted heavily to digital platforms, requiring increasing digital literacy skills to navigate the systems. Most older adults use financial technology for basic tasks such as checking bank accounts, but are not engaged in more sophisticated tools that facilitate investment loan applications or advanced planning.
▶ 1:04:54Senator Gillibrand: 64% of older adults report they do not feel technology is designed with them in mind regarding it as a barrier rather than a tool for financial planning. Mr. kahan, have you encountered clients facing difficulties with financial planning while planning for retirement? What types of tools or reports would help seniors navigating this digital landscape?
▶ 1:05:18Mr. Kahan: Thank you for the question. We find seniors often have problems with technology. We sometimes see things that they have done because they have read it on line, they clicked the or something. From a basic standpoint, we try to educate clients.
▶ 1:05:43Mr. Kahan: Most of the scams started the computer level from emails where they are clicking something, so we encourage them to have virus protection. Understanding how to read in email if it is real or not. People click on social security or google thumb -- google something about social security and they are brought to many different sites. If it doesn't and in .gov, it is not necessarily a legitimate site and they may be trying to sell you something.
▶ 1:06:14Mr. Kahan: Hover over in emailed to see where that is really coming from because it is not necessarily coming from where you think it is. Understanding the choice of social security, medicare, and looking at how they can identify the fraud that is coming in because it is not just about retirement planning.
▶ 1:06:32Mr. Kahan: It is about really understanding what they are reading, which had many times is very confusing because as clients of aged, some of the most difficult decisions are tied to choosing when to take social security, medicare, if you are still working, what are the options for medicare and when they start to go online, they start to really click on various websites and some of them are fine and a lot of them are fraudulent and we have had stories of clients where they wind up getting scammed for
▶ 1:07:03Mr. Kahan: Something and then they are embarrassed to talk about it and that is a big problem because they don't want to tell their family members about ed, they don't want to tell their spouse or partner about it, but we will see it. Many times. Or they will finally open up and have a family member contact us to say they were scammed and what can we do about it so it is a matter of educating the clients about how to use the technology. Some of them can, some of them will not be able to.
▶ 1:07:34Mr. Kahan: It is ok to bring a family member in order trusted advisor to help them go through to see what is legitimate and what is not because too often we see people scammed at every level. They are getting phone calls, they are getting texts, we tell people sometimes when you answer your phone, don't say her name because they voice record it and they can use that to maybe hack into one of your other accounts and they don't even realize that, so it is a matter of trying to educate them the best way about where the scams are
▶ 1:08:04Mr. Kahan: And how technology is useful, but you have to be able to use it properly.
▶ 1:08:09Sen. Gillibrand: Right. Ms. roszkowski, american workers and retirees are facing retiring -- soaring inflation and costs. They are seeing costs for groceries go up, health care, utilities, housing. Earlier this year, aarp declared retirement is on pause, high costs push older americans back to work.
▶ 1:08:36Sen. Gillibrand: What are your members sharing as their top concern in these day today issues that they are dealing with for their own retirement?
▶ 1:08:46Ms. Roszkowski: That's a very good question. They are concerned about affording everyday costs. They are concerned about groceries, they are concerned about gas, they are concerned about health care. They are concerned that they will outlive their retirement savings.
▶ 1:09:04Ms. Roszkowski: Our research shows that not only 7% of un-retirees are going back into the workforce, up from the 2025 survey, it also shows that 28% of retired people are unfortunately, they think they have retired too early. They have concerns that they will outlive their savings. Some people are living longer and it is hard to plan for.
▶ 1:09:30Ms. Roszkowski: We are feeling at not only with everyday costs, but also long-term care, health care, and women 50 and older say that everyday costs is their number one concern.
▶ 1:09:45Sen. Gillibrand: Ms. kieffer, with your work at finra, one of the most common challenges older adults face, where are the biggest knowledge gaps?
▶ 1:10:01Ms. Kieffer: The switch from accumulation to decumulation. Older adults are facing new decisions, new products, potentially a new risk profile that they have not come back to revisit in some time. So, just understanding and in this uncertain time period of longevity that we all grapple with.
▶ 1:10:29Ms. Kieffer: So coming to terms with these new product opportunities, new decisions that need to be made, and switching the mindset to a decumulation phase can be very difficult. Some might choose to work with a financial professional in that capacity. Maybe they didn't prior and they would like to at this time.
▶ 1:10:54Ms. Kieffer: Whenever anyone is choosing to work with a financial professional, if someone comes to them directly or they go directly to someone, they should always check out the background of that professional before they sign up on any lines or even have follow-up meetings. They should use broker check to see if the person is registered. Are they registered to sell securities, are there registered for investment in vice?
▶ 1:11:22Ms. Kieffer: The svc's investment disclosure database provide similar information where investors can understand what the registration is, the services that are offered, and they should ask about fees. For some, navigating these challenges is supported by these challenges and others need to really take the time to educate and learn about these products and to the extent that we as educators can be out there sharing information not just
▶ 1:11:53Ms. Kieffer: About scams and frauds, but about financial decision-making, investor insights articles that finra puts out. Some I would call 911, they are emergency issues, and some I would call 411, they are educational resources where we understand what the product is, what are the considerations so they can make those informed decisions appropriate to their life?
▶ 1:12:20Sen. Gillibrand: Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:12:21Chair Scott: Ms. kieffer, studies consistently show that financial literacy declines with age even among people who are financially sophisticated earlier in life. Is the financial industry doing enough to account for that reality and how it delivers advice to order customers?
▶ 1:12:39Ms. Kieffer: Thank you for the question. While I can't comment to what the industry specifically is doing in this area, I do know that finra members are committed to investor protection and are regularly sharing investor information and working with their clients to understand the different products that they are offering and being offered.
▶ 1:13:03Ms. Kieffer: We always stand behind if you don't understand the product, you need to double think whether that product is for you. That is a premise of all of our investor education.
▶ 1:13:15Chair Scott: Thanks. Say senior walks into a bank branch and asks to wire $50,000 to someone they met online three weeks ago. What specific training to frontline bank employees received today to recognize that situation as potential fraud?
▶ 1:13:34Mr. Kunjukunju: Thank you so much for that question because that is very much along the lines of things that happen. Banks provide the trading -- training. We focus on those three areas looking at the changes in demeanor, changes in transaction, changes in accounts to try to determine what might be going on. In this type of situation they will be looking back at their training to understand, what is different here? Is there some sort of change?
▶ 1:14:05Mr. Kunjukunju: In this particular scenario, there is absolutely a change of the person has never wired money abroad. It will be looking at information about whether this person has even used this amount of money ever to do anything along those lines. The third piece of this is really to understand wire they sending this money?
▶ 1:14:25Mr. Kunjukunju: Do your point about the question that has to do with the nature of this they will be asking pointed questions of how this has developed, how did you meet them, have you ever met them online? Those are the types of things they will be asking. Beyond that it depends on state law. They might have the ability to delay it, investigate further or they may reach out to services or law enforcement to get involved and address the situation. Or reach out to a trusted contact.
▶ 1:14:53Chair Scott: Thank you. Roszkowski Ms. social security claiming decisions are the most consequential financial choices in older american will ever make. Often without professional guidance. Aarp has done extensive work on this issue. What does your data show you about how many americans are leaving money on the table by claiming too early in what it -- and what it would take to change that?
▶ 1:15:19Ms. Roszkowski: Thank you for the question. Most of the people I talk to say they will retire at 65. Americans do not know enough about social security and the money they leave on the table if they claim at a certain age. Denny don't know their full retirement age, nor do they know it is approximately 8% per year they leave on the table if they choose to claim social security before age 70. We are supporting bills such as the cleaning age clarity act.
▶ 1:15:50Ms. Roszkowski: Thank you for your support without. This isn't a one-size-fits-all decision. That is why it is critical to be educating along one's lifespan. Things may change from one year to the next. Social security is a one-time decision that can impact someone's full retirement, which may last 30 years, as well as their family. It is continuing to educate.
▶ 1:16:14Ms. Roszkowski: We know americans don't know enough about the implications of claiming too early, as well as the money they are leaving on the table.
▶ 1:16:20Chair Scott: Thank you. The judiciary's standard requires advisors to comply in their clients's best interest. Not everyone is held to that standard. How does a senior who has no background in finance know whether the -- is legally required to put their interest first?
▶ 1:16:43Mr. Kahan: The first thing we tell people, seniors, they should be looking at a safety professional. There is approximately 107,000 cfp professionals. I don't know how many hundreds of thousands of so-called financial advisors. The cfp professionals have to follow a fiduciary standard, which is putting the clients best interests first. People should be asking when they are meeting with someone full disclosure, there are so many different compensation models out there.
▶ 1:17:12Mr. Kahan: There is commission, fees and commission, not to say one is better than the other. Everybody has to figure out what works for them. But full disclosure, there is nothing wrong with asking somebody you are sitting across from as a planner or advisor, what are you making? What are your commissions? What are your fees? Fees are pretty apparent, commissions are not always. It doesn't mean there is something wrong with that but there should be no reason to not have full disclosure.
▶ 1:17:42Mr. Kahan: That way they can make a decision based on compensation of this is what you are doing for me, how much is it going to cost me? Because that is really the first step in understanding what the costs are. Looking at a fiduciary, putting the clients best interests first is the most important thing. Because it is about ethics and trusted relationships. People share with us things they don't share among each other. We will have spouses come in and have conversations they have never had before.
▶ 1:18:11Mr. Kahan: Sometimes they are surprised at what the other one is saying. We are there to help mediate sometimes. In reality, it is to figure out what the best interests for them are and have that trusted relationship.
▶ 1:18:21Chair Scott: Thank you. Ms. kieffer, it exists so any american lung -- can look up whether their financial advisor has a history of misconduct. Most seniors have never heard of it. How many older americans are handing their retirement savings to someone with a disciplinary record symbol because nobody told them to check?
▶ 1:18:42Ms. Kieffer: Thank you for the question. Finra is committed to sharing the resource broker check and we work with a number of partners to make sure americans are aware of this tool. We have run public awareness campaigns, we work with our broker-dealers to make sure the information is out there, so the investors know to check.
▶ 1:19:12Ms. Kieffer: Many years ago, we ran a campaign called before you invest, ask and check, that was designed to drive traffic and understanding this opportunity. The vast majority of brokers that are registered and inside of broker tech do not have disciplinary record. But it is absolutely the information that an investor should know to ask the questions they need to ask.
▶ 1:19:38Chair Scott: Thank you. Anything else?
▶ 1:19:41Sen. Gillibrand: Thank you all for your testimony.
▶ 1:19:46Chair Scott: I would like to thank everyone -- does anybody have anything else they would like to add? I would like to thank everyone for being here today and participating. This has been the conversation this committee wants to have. Here is what I keep thinking about, the challenges we talked about today are real. The gap between the information many seniors have and what they need is real. Scammers overseas running script designed to steal a lifetime of savings from someone's grandparent is very real.
▶ 1:20:11Chair Scott: The confusion about medicare enrollment windows and social security timing decisions that costs people thousands of dollars they can never get back israel. Have spent decades old and programs that are supposed to help seniors and bury them on government websites that no one can find or navigate. We have watched fraud explode while not doing anything about it. My colleagues and I are here on this committee to have legislative -- legislation and make sure congress ask when it is needed. This committee will keep pushing.
▶ 1:20:42Chair Scott: We are going to keep shining the light on the gaps on financial education. We will keep them in works for older americans. Every seen here in this country deserves to enjoy the retirement they spent their life filled in with dignity, independence and the knowledge they need to protect it. I want to remind seniors and families watching that the committee operates a fraud hotline for anyone who believes they may have been targeted or victimized. The number is 1-855-303-9470.
▶ 1:21:11Chair Scott: If any senators have additional statements, the hearing record will be open until next wednesday at 5:00 p.m. I want to thank everybody for being here.