▶ 0:19:40>> united states>> senate foreign relations committee will come to order. It was not orderly to begin with, it is orderly now thanks to our crew. We welcome here as always our secretary of state, marco rubio, distinguished alumni of this committee and I know he's always glad to come back here and visit with us. We haven't had this kind of excitement, I know you think this is the way it is but it is not.
▶ 0:20:09In any event, we are glad to have you. The secretary has four hearings in these two days. We negotiated a hard stop at 12:30. We will use the usual way we do things.
▶ 0:20:30I will make an opening statement and yield to senator shaheen and then turn the floor over to senator rubio and then we will do a five minute round of questions based on arrival time. With that, it is good to see you here again.
▶ 0:20:54You are not on the hill often, a lot has changed since the last time you testified last year. The department has undergone a major reorganization that they could operate more efficiently and more in line with america's interests as we discussed before you even took the job, that is being executed.
▶ 0:21:17At long last, foreign governments are being encouraged and when necessary push to live up to their responsibilities to respond to the needs of their own citizens. America will stand up and provide lifesaving assistance. We are not this.
▶ 0:21:38The apartment -- department is trading new ways to break the cycle of dependence with a renewed emphasis on trade and help the american people and lift up countries around the world. This is american generosity, ingenuity in action. The administration is holding you organizations to account and the long side will make sure american values aren't leaking.
▶ 0:22:10You make securing the western hemisphere a top priority and successfully reduced illegal immigration at the southern border to the lowest level in half a century. You have helped curb the trafficking of illegal fentanyl and saved countless lives. The unfair trade practices, expanding around the world and post some of the greatest threats in modern history.
▶ 0:22:43In the same time making sure they are targeted and we appreciate that. The administration is making sure taxpayer dollars don't go to those who are able but unwilling to pay. The concerted effort by you, our allies have increased the defense spending and committed to reach the 5% by 2035. This is a major change from the way you and I used to deal with this.
▶ 0:23:13Together we need to create a next-generation nato that is stronger, more operable and takes advantage of the potential of american and european economies. We must coordinate with our european partners as they take greater responsibility for supporting ukraine and work with our partners.
▶ 0:23:36They have prioritized efforts to end conflicts in africa which undermined decades of investment in economic growth and global health security. The latest outbreak is now affecting the entire region highlights how conflict and humanitarian crisis threaten health and security of the american people. I know the department is working hard and I look forward to hearing how they support this efforts.
▶ 0:24:06The administration has taken decisive action to protect american citizens from the threat posed on nuclear capabilities and ambitions on behalf of the american people, thank you for your hard work on that. We know how difficult it is. Change is hard but also necessary. Your efforts will help us solve meet the challenges.
▶ 0:24:32I look forward to discussing how the budget will further those efforts. We will turn that over to the distinguished ranking member. >> good morning, secretary rubio. You were a senator. You sat on this committee. You sat on the intelligence committee. You know as well as anyone that affective american foreign policy requires a strong partnership of congress.
▶ 0:25:03Allies need to know our commitments could stand the test of time and that only happens if congress is brought into the discussion. Congress cannot be a partner if it is kept in the dark. I have a long list of unanswered request sitting on your department's desk and I would like to ask these letters be submitted for the record. I have requested a briefing on changes to U.S.
▶ 0:25:31Foreign posture in europe. After 33 days we have no response. We have requested a briefing from the iran war on displacement. After 90 days we still have no response. We have asked for a briefing on ukraine on a number of issues. After 180 days we still have no response. We have asked for a briefing on lifting sanctions.
▶ 0:26:00After 225 days we still have no response. We have asked for a briefing for the U.S. agency on global media. No response after 344 days. The remaining visa program termination, we have followed up five times over 435 days and gotten no response.
▶ 0:26:24In january when you were before this committee I asked if you would report to this committee once an audit system was in place. You said and I quote absolutely. We are still waiting. When you do notify congress it is to inform us of decisions you have already made. That is not consultation as you well know.
▶ 0:26:51Congress has been clear on a bipartisan basis we do not want to see the ground to china. They are cutting funding to the endo pacific. The same pattern extends to global health. Usaid supported the prevention activities for years.
▶ 0:27:16We can see in this poster even elon musk admitted one of the things we accidentally canceled very briefly was ebola prevention. Those programs were dismantled. Today we have to screen for ebola at dulles airport rather than uganda more than 7000 miles away.
▶ 0:27:43You are asking for a 44% reduction that includes eliminating funding to the world health organization, it includes eliminating all disease specific funds in the middle of an ebola crisis affecting americans. No one from your department could explain why this is a good idea. You send congress one notification saying you needed $19 billion to close out.
▶ 0:28:12You sense another saying you need some of that money to respond to disease outbreak. Congress has asked for an exclamation and we still have not received one. The same pattern extends to our alliances. I just returned from a bipartisan delegation to the arctic. We are on the verge of losing the very alliances we have built for decades. Nowhere is that clear them with russia.
▶ 0:28:41In 2017 you wrote as a senator that vladimir putin will never be a trusted ally or a reliable constructive partner. Since taking office you, the president, the vice president, not one of you has been to ukraine. Your envoy talk to putin on a regular basis. The president has given him the red carpet treatment on american soil. You won't come up here in brief congress on any of it.
▶ 0:29:13The decisions congress has made have been systematically undermined. Congress passes support for ukraine, the administration has slow walked it. Instead of sanctioning russia today issued oil licenses that have sent billions to moscow. Russia has conducted five times more drone strikes on ukraine. More U.S.
▶ 0:29:42Businesses are being directed at any point in this conflict. Russia is providing targeted intelligence and our facilities and personnel in the middle east while we are helping them fund this war. When I talk to my constituents they asked for economic relief at home, not regime change.
▶ 0:30:08Instead you sent congress a war powers notification saying we are not in active hostilities with iran. They were bombing U.S. embassies across the middle east. That was not consultation it was an attempt to avoid this committee in this congress about this war. Congress has asked basic questions about the war.
▶ 0:30:47Congress deserves to know why and americans deserve to know why. You would not have stood for this kind of stonewalling by the administration when you were a senator. You certainly shouldn't stand for it as secretary or national security advisor.
▶ 0:31:04Chair Risch: We will proceed to a round of five-minute questions. We talked about that. Why don't you go ahead.
▶ 0:31:19Sec. Rubio: I have it in writing, do you want me to read it?
▶ 0:31:24Chair Risch: Give it your best shot.
▶ 0:31:27Sec. Rubio: I want to remind everybody our foreign policy is one that is solely focused on the national interest of the united states of america in defense of our security and also our economic security and our future. We believe america should lead the world and I believe we are and have a very good start about that. American leadership should be on behalf of the american interest.
▶ 0:31:57Sec. Rubio: Over a period of time we lost focus on that. The reality is our foreign policy first and foremost must be what is in the national interest of the united states of america. It oftentimes requires us to make pragmatic decisions sometimes on foreign policy they are not between a good choice and bad choice. We are trying to figure out which one of these choices is the one that is best for the united states. That plays out every single day.
▶ 0:32:29Sec. Rubio: We remain the sole global superpower, the most powerful country on earth. We have the most formidable and powerful military known to man. Our dollar remains the reserve currency of the world used extensively throughout the world to transact all sorts of business. All this means very little if that powers not use to the people who built it. The people who it is meant to protect. United states government is not a charity.
▶ 0:32:59Sec. Rubio: We are not here to play social worker. We are here to win on behalf of the american people. To win for the things that are important for our future. The state department carries out the foreign policy of the united states and helps the american people.
▶ 0:33:21Sec. Rubio: It has guided every decision made since january, 2025 in area this committee and many of its members say has long been neglected and not paid attention to. We now have a coalition of friendly countries who have aligned work on not just the issues of security but economic prosperity that go hand in hand.
▶ 0:33:46Sec. Rubio: Other than nicaragua, cuba obviously venezuela presented some challenge. Of course, brazil is in the midst of an election cycle and to some extent the current government of columbia. Generally speaking it is a region filled with american allies, american leaders, american direction. We have to operationalize that after 20 years of neglect after china and other global powers have intruded in our atmosphere.
▶ 0:34:25Sec. Rubio: These are important achievements. In any transition there will be bumps in the road. Largely speaking we talk about how those programs that existed were failing us. The old model had to be replaced. They are being brought in the strategic direction of the state department. We are also seeking outcomes. It's not just how much money you spend it's whether you are getting outcomes.
▶ 0:34:55Sec. Rubio: It is being united with our strategic view in mind. We are able to provide specifically to those most in need and those places around the world most important to the national interest of the united states will remain our guiding principle in our reforms. We can get into a lot of these details in our questions. The bottom line is all of this and more is a reflection of this belief I outlined at the outset.
▶ 0:35:26Sec. Rubio: Foreign policy cannot be separated from economic policy, border policy, any of these others critical to our national interest. A country that cannot build ships or control immigration or have vital resources cannot defend its people, its interest, way of life. Our foreign policy continues to be reoriented around the foundations of national strength. This is another step in that direction.
▶ 0:35:58Sec. Rubio: As we don't anticipate for the first time in modern history congress will take up our budget and pass it. We think it will go along some substantial reforms. I look forward to your questions. At least that's what it says. I look forward to probably half of your questions. Thank you.
▶ 0:36:21Chair Risch: We will now do a round of questions based on the order of attendance. I will start and say thank you for the work you have done. All of us have worked on this for years and know how frustrating it is. The difficulty to work with this regime who have sponsored terrorism and kidnapping. Thank you for doing something.
▶ 0:36:52Chair Risch: I know you are doing all you can to ensure this comes to a close sooner rather than later.
▶ 0:37:02Sec. Rubio: I have not been before this committee since I believe february, I have appeared on multiple occasions here in my role as national security advisor in secretary of state. Gang of eight, gang of 16. We have talked about this topic with some of you in these settings.
▶ 0:37:28Sec. Rubio: Iran's desire to build a nuclear weapon was going to be built behind the conventional shield. They were going to build so many missiles, drones, conventional weapons including a navy that at that point there is nothing they could do about it.
▶ 0:37:47Sec. Rubio: They were going to build a conventional shield and say to the world if you come into anything about our nuclear program we will overwhelm you with missiles, drones, with our navy and you will not win. You will not do anything about it. Which is why the president chose to act. Operation epic fury, some of you did not like it, some of you did.
▶ 0:38:16Sec. Rubio: It dramatically reduces the defense industrial base of iran, the ability to build these missiles substantially degraded. A substantial percentage, I'm not a general and I'm not here to speak. A substantial degradation to a number of launches we have. They are easy to make. This is a global challenge. It is playing out every single day around the world.
▶ 0:38:44Sec. Rubio: The mexican cartels are using uav against each other. This is a pervasive problem around the world. The economics are something we have to solve four. Today there is no iranian, there's a bunch of boston whalers with machine guns on them. There is no iranian navy. It will within a number of years be prime fishing spots.
▶ 0:39:16Sec. Rubio: My whole point is the iranian conventional shield has been substantially eroded. The aftermath of that, two things happen. We agreed to stop. Part of that agreement as they would reopen the straight. At which point the president decided appropriately that we cannot have a world in which only iranian ships get through the straight.
▶ 0:39:45Sec. Rubio: We will shut down the straight for them if they do it for everybody. By the way through the seizure of sanction ships in the end of pacific as well. The cost to iran every single day is in the hundreds of millions of dollars that they are not generating as a result of that. We are in talks. They are very different. They are requiring the use.
▶ 0:40:15Sec. Rubio: There is the prospect before us which could happen today, tomorrow, next week that for the first time they have agreed to negotiate aspects of the nuclear program that just a year ago they are refusing to even mention. That is not a guarantee that it will ultimately lead to the deal.
▶ 0:40:40Sec. Rubio: We were able to engage them in a process that truly test the proposition and how far they are willing to go. Complicating it their internal regime is somewhat fractured. We could go into more depth in your follow-up questions. We are hopeful the straight would reopen, enter into a period of negotiations.
▶ 0:41:12Sec. Rubio: If it doesn't work out obviously we still have a problem with respect to the nuclear ambitions. But they won't have is the conventional shield to hide behind any longer.
▶ 0:41:24Chair Risch: I will ask one more question. There will be more questions obviously on that topic. I know you just got back from china not long ago, could you give us a quick update on the state of U.S.-china relations?
▶ 0:41:40Sec. Rubio: The two largest economies in the world, to most powerful militaries, the chinese government and U.S. government have to speak. We have to have some measure of communication if for nothing else we have to de-escalate. They are obviously very significant irritants. Some of these are long-term problems that we will have to address.
▶ 0:42:06Sec. Rubio: What we are trying to do is manage a period of strategic stability while recognizing that we will have struggles. Not just years but perhaps for decades. I think as much as anything else we have to recognize the united states and china have to be able to have points of dialogue and speak to one another. If for no other reason to have a communication channel. It was abundantly clear where we don't have strong agreement.
▶ 0:42:37Sec. Rubio: There are areas in which long-term we will have some real challenges. The united states and I would argue the world cannot depend on one country for 90% of anything, especially 90% of things that are critical from our weapon systems to our pharmaceuticals. One sole source I be cut off at any time is leverage or punishment and a time of conflict.
▶ 0:43:08Sec. Rubio: We are actively searching and are implementing these to diversify where we get critical minerals, supply chains, obviously the chinese would like to retain. This will be a long-term issue. Work on that continues even while we are engaged in the ability to dialogue. It is responsible. We truly have no choice.
▶ 0:43:35Sec. Rubio: I would argue to the benefit of the world that these countries speak to one another. I think your comments about the supply chain and critical minerals, these are things that are relatively new to us. They underscore that and they will have that even more. Everybody knows we are as a nation.
▶ 0:44:16Sec. Rubio: Sadly I think we are seeing in real time that is not true today. There are more than 1000 cases, as we know one of the entities that is a critical global health tool particularly during eight disease outbreak distributing the ebola vaccine and has committed $40 billion to develop the vaccine from the current
▶ 0:44:47Sec. Rubio: Vaccine. How are you making sure secretary kennedy has been sitting on those funds for months now so they can help develop a vaccine to help address the ebola outbreak.
▶ 0:45:05Sec. Rubio: The president asked that we allow secretary kennedy to play a lead role. You wanted them to conduct reforms. The state department will be reengaged. We will not listen to the points of view. The made the decision of re-engaging on this issue.
▶ 0:45:34Sec. Rubio: Respecting what hhs was, we want to get this issue resolved in that outcome that is susceptible. It is an issue. I have allowed them to play a leading role in what we would do next. We will reengage and drive this to an outcome.
▶ 0:46:04Sec. Rubio: >> congress has appropriated global health to help fund the global health security.
▶ 0:46:13Sec. Rubio: We can talk about that, the compacts of countries all over the world. We have a new agreement with the u.n. That we are very happy with , we have been able to attract those from around the world to contribute to it. We intend to get this result as an important part of our matrix.
▶ 0:46:44Sen. Shaheen: I hope you will share with this committee as soon as this resolved. I want to go to general licenses . President trump gave russia a lifeline. The administration should have known the iran war will make russian oil more desirable they decided to remove the stigma and given extra windfall of cash.
▶ 0:47:20Sen. Shaheen: Can you let us know whether you believe or whether you will support extending those licenses , that license when it comes back up in june?
▶ 0:47:31Sec. Rubio: Two things have happened. What is actually the U.S. production, U.S. playing a role in the global energy supply is the largest amount of exports from the united states we have ever seen. Our energy dominance is really coming into play. The underlying policy remains. What has changed his these types of extensions.
▶ 0:48:04Sec. Rubio: There is a contagion potential that at some point we could do strategic reserves, we can do some of the other things we have done to alleviate global supply. This is not so much for us, our economy is not in need of it. There are other economies benefiting from this.
▶ 0:48:26Sen. Shaheen: It certainly benefited china and russia's economy. They also benefit from russian oil. My question for you is can you commit not to extend the general license when it expires. It depends on circumstances at the time we would like to end it as soon I you can.
▶ 0:48:54Sen. Shaheen: These were time-limited waivers with the purpose of opening up more global supply.
▶ 0:49:02Sen. Shaheen: I want to get a final question in. The closure has deep in the humanitarian food and secure countries such as south sudan. They target those who are most in need. It is very concerning that the selection process, it is led by the department today includes only two priority countries.
▶ 0:49:37Sen. Shaheen: The democratic republic of congo and haiti. Why aren't we adding countries that are facing acute insecurity. Why are we not helping countries who are helping -- facing acute famine in some cases. These are all countries that have humanitarian crisis.
▶ 0:50:09Sec. Rubio: We have spent hundreds of millions of dollars with the cease-fire. We continue to do so. It is a massive amount of money for various means.
▶ 0:50:34Sec. Rubio: The problem in sudan has largely not been our unwillingness to provide some -- funds we provide flexibility to what we have been able to do. It has been distribution. The ability to get that. These conversations we are having, one of the things we try to identify is four safe spots where people could receive humanitarian care assistance, where we could have the outside groups, ngo, they have the ability to go in without having
▶ 0:51:07Sec. Rubio: Trucks hijacked or blown up or workers killed. That has been the fundamental challenge. To allocate money to something we can't distribute, I could tell you this has been very frustrating. We had a donor conference in berlin.
▶ 0:51:32Sen. Shaheen: I am out of time and it does not explain why we are providing food for countries that don't -- are not insecure. I appreciate the challenges in sudan. We have those challenges many cases. Because we dismantled the distribution network we have exacerbated those challenges in countries around the world and we are not providing the help based on humanitarian needs and that is my concern. Thank you.
▶ 0:52:02Sen. Ricketts: Thank you very much. Thank you for being here. Communist china is trying to win the ai race. They will use it to dominate our military if they could do that and so many other ways. A world where communist china is dominant, ai is very bad for the united states and the entire world. That's why it's critical that we cannot lose this race.
▶ 0:52:33Sen. Ricketts: Semi conductor supply chains, manufacturing sme are critical to winning this competition. It is one area beijing is spending billions of dollars to be able to produce chips in china and they have failed to produce those high-end chips so far. President trump understands this better than anyone.
▶ 0:52:59Sen. Ricketts: There were the first to utilize controls to slow down communist china's advanced chipmaking industry. He allies and partners have control the sme to china. They have not been as restrictive as U.S. controls. We allow foreign countries to backfill the foreign market. Secretary rubio, do you agree export controls are critical to maintaining our technological advantage over communist china.
▶ 0:53:34Sec. Rubio: It is most critical of the areas that are broader and allow that. I think jacob has done a great job with the state department. Signed up all these countries around the world, we are up to 13 or 14.
▶ 0:53:51Sec. Rubio: In which we could create this global consortium for all of the elements of the ai supply not just the innovation, it is not just the critical elements necessary, we will produce these chips. It's safe to say the united states right now is a global leader on ai. It's also wise to say that lead has to be sustained.
▶ 0:54:19Sec. Rubio: It will be a real challenge in sustaining it. We will have to stay focused on it. I do think we have global alliances that view it the way we do. It's not just about leading the technology in the ai, it's about leaving the standards that will govern how ai is used. This is what I think the senate should think about. Ai will have very positive impacts.
▶ 0:54:50Sec. Rubio: It will also have some detriments. There will be white collar in this country that will be impacted. We have to start thinking simply about the impact but the societal pressures that will make not just in the united states but all over the world. It will make the worker more efficient and more valuable. Those jobs will have to be replaced by new jobs and new skills.
▶ 0:55:21Sec. Rubio: That is a political issue. Over time could destabilize societies all over the world. We have to start thinking about ai in those terms as well.
▶ 0:55:35Sen. Ricketts: Should they have to follow the manufacturing going to communist china?
▶ 0:55:40Sec. Rubio: That is our hope, that we could create a coalition. They are running through the same problems that we run into. Companies ultimately want to sell to the markets. China is a large market. Creating unanimity or consensus behind that thinking.
▶ 0:56:05Sen. Ricketts: That's why and I introduced the match act to level the playing field with providing the state department of the allies to align those controls. They could ensure foreign companies could not sell the technologies that we have restricted. I hope you will support that.
▶ 0:56:28Sen. Ricketts: One other thing I want to hit before my time runs out is I was the cosponsor of the bill for national security and counterterrorism. It would help counter traffickers around the developing world such as africa. The state department however has lost its foundation and I encourage you to work expeditiously to implement it.
▶ 0:56:57Sen. Ricketts: It is something we are talking about to be very helpful to making sure we are not only helping the environment, helping animals, it is bad for terrorists. I kept it within my time.
▶ 0:57:10Chair Risch: Good job. Can you do it as well?
▶ 0:57:14Sen. Merkley: I will do it my best. Despite the appearances that exist in the republicans and democrats prior to this administration on iran's nuclear program the theory was basically the same that we will impose significant harm on the iranian economy in order to force them to the table to negotiate. What is happening now is fundamentally different.
▶ 0:57:44Sen. Merkley: This war and the administration's decision has now held the entire world economy and the U.S. economy hostage to the ability to negotiate an agreement with iran. This is why the country is seized by the question of whether there will be an agreement? Apparently until there is an agreement the strait of hormuz remains closed.
▶ 0:58:12Sen. Merkley: There is a cost to the iranian economy but now there is a devastating cost to the U.S. economy. It has been indecipherable the information coming from the administration over the past several weeks that we get signals a deal is imminent. The president saying he is bored and doesn't care whether we get a deal.
▶ 0:58:37Sen. Merkley: I think it's really important for us to understand what the bottom lines are, what you are asking for. What commitments you need iran to make in order for you to release the blockade. Give us a little insight into what your bottom lines are and what is going to get the strait of hormuz reopened.
▶ 0:59:07Sen. Merkley: This is the only question that matters now and every day we get wildly different signals from the president as to whether he is even engaged in this question and whether it will reopen.
▶ 0:59:19Sec. Rubio: I think your question gets right to the heart of the matter. The only reason there is a blockade is because they are fired -- firing on commercial ships. The blockade is only against iranian ships. If no one ships are going to get out, I ran ships will knock get out either.
▶ 0:59:48Sec. Rubio: They don't get to close the straight and say passive toll but there ships get to go out. That is the reason there is a blockade. There would not have been a blockade if they did what they said they would do. Let me just focus for a moment. There is in a country on earth other than iran who is in favor of what iran is doing. The chinese are against it, russians, everyone.
▶ 1:00:18Sec. Rubio: Condition number one is they have to reopen the straight. That means the following. Ships could sail through international waters without being fired upon, without paying a toll.
▶ 1:00:34Sen. Murphy: It is closed because of our decision to invade iran. This is a consequence of our military action. We all know why it is closed. We knew ahead of time it would be their response. The question is how will we get it reopened? You will drive a bargain that is so tough and hard that it remains closed. How will we get it open?
▶ 1:01:01Sec. Rubio: That is a predicate to anything else happening. If iran wants to move its oil again they will have to reopen. If they refuse to do so we have other options available to us.
▶ 1:01:20Sen. Murphy: We need it reopened tomorrow.
▶ 1:01:22Sec. Rubio: They need to announce they will no longer fire on commercial ships because in many cases ships just won't move. They have to announce very clearly it is now open, we are not charging a toll, we will help remove what they put in there and we will not be fired on.
▶ 1:01:45Sen. Murphy: The president says they have to make commitments on their nuclear program, what commitments do they need to make in order for the strait to be opened?
▶ 1:01:56Sec. Rubio: That is the predicate that opens the door to phase two. They have to open the door to discussions on the highly enriched uranium that is deep in the mountains somewhere. They have to agree upon negotiating severe and long-term limitations and/or cancellation of enrichment.
▶ 1:02:20Sen. Murphy: In the second phase of negotiations?
▶ 1:02:24Sec. Rubio: I don't think you could work those out in five days. That would be over a 30, 60, 90 day period. They have to commit to the willingness to do that. We will dispose of the enriched uranium. The question is what is the mechanism by which we do so?
▶ 1:02:43Sen. Murphy: In order to get to that second phase are you in order to release sanctions or frozen money that the united states is withholding?
▶ 1:02:53Sec. Rubio: Any sanctions relief, sanctions come there is international sanctions, executive sanctions. Some we could release and some we cannot. It has to be in return for the reason why they are put in place in the first place. It is their nuclear program. Iran is being sanctioned because they have highly enriched uranium. They are being sanctioned because of nuclear activities.
▶ 1:03:24Sec. Rubio: It will be associated with their commitment and compliance.
▶ 1:03:27Sen. Murphy: Just in exchange for reopening?
▶ 1:03:30Sec. Rubio: That has not been offered. Sev ohanian -- se
▶ 1:03:47Hagerty: Than. We want to start with the philippines. The geographic center of the end of pacific region. It is a long critical sea lanes were tremendous amounts of the world trade. A strong alliance with the philippines clearly with security interests. It supports navigation. It also helps deliver regional stability along the south china sea in the face of a very aggressive posture the chinese have adopted.
▶ 1:04:19Hagerty: I want to recognize my colleagues who have worked with me to put in place the enhanced resilience act. It is $1 billion of loans per year. I would like to get your comments, your vision on the role of the philippines in the united states alliance.
▶ 1:04:49Hagerty: On a personal level, a couple of good points here. We have entered into an agreement with them. That will now serve as a 4000 acre. We will be able to do our activities together, developing ai, high-tech, helping diversify their economy. The ability to operate.
▶ 1:05:21Hagerty: We have done this multiple times over the last year. We have seen in recent days, made a clear note this decision came up during the first meeting with the chinese and come up again now very recently to diplomatic near scarborough. The buildup of infrastructure that appears to be exerting territorial claims.
▶ 1:05:55Hagerty: This is one of those irritants in the long term. The philippines is a critical partner over the last couple of years our relationship dramatically improved jointly on a number of topics and interests.
▶ 1:06:15Sen. Hagerty: They work very hard to get that back for america and I see that is a tremendous opportunity for economic ties.
▶ 1:06:27Sec. Rubio: There is some desire this year to reach a code of conduct understanding in the end of pacific. Many of you, a bad code of conduct agreement is worse than no code of conduct agreement.
▶ 1:06:53Sec. Rubio: They are agreeing to a code of conduct in the region that could be detrimental and would set a precedent. We would love to see one. A bad one is worse than none at all.
▶ 1:07:16Sen. Hagerty: Could I turn to another area of concern and that is areas taken against allies against U.S. investments in the country. I would like to point to the example of the situation where a U.S. company put billions of dollars in investment into the yucatán peninsula only to be confiscated by the mexican government.
▶ 1:07:47Sen. Hagerty: They retroactively try justifying this taking is an interactive move. Sadly we had to fight previous -- hard and it will take more bipartisan effort to push back on any government effort to try to confiscate american corporate property. The effect of basically reducing the incentive.
▶ 1:08:20Sen. Hagerty: I think this hurts the mission later on.
▶ 1:08:25Sec. Rubio: We do every day and one of the great benefits of our organization is and has empowered the regional bureaus. Use after you aside economic bureaus from the missions in the field. We now empowered the regional bureaus and emphases to play a leading role in economic diplomacy.
▶ 1:08:53Sec. Rubio: Every engagement I have with a foreign leader have some sort of economic involvement do it. I would say more than 50% of the engagements now have to deal with economic matters. Either finding creative opportunities, they have these areas, the embassies will take an active role to identify american companies. The second is what you just pointed to.
▶ 1:09:24Sec. Rubio: The point we make with everyone we interact with is you can't attract american investment when you have a history of taking and in some cases it is a local official, you can say I'm the sheriff or on the local police officer. Workers won't show up to work tomorrow. It has become a leading part of diplomacy.
▶ 1:09:57Sen. Hagerty: That's where you are. You got some work done on a bipartisan basis. Thank you.
▶ 1:10:07Sen. King: You won't be surprised I'm going to ask you about the western hemisphere. You and I traded the gavel when you are on this committee. That was good, productive work. The operation to strike boats in the pacific and the caribbean.
▶ 1:10:32Sen. King: Have you been involved in the secretary of state or national security advisor about the targeting to decide which boats we should strike?
▶ 1:10:42Sec. Rubio: Not because I have avoided it, those are largely legal decisions.
▶ 1:10:53Sen. Kaine: Are you aware of what the targeting criteria are?
▶ 1:10:56Sec. Rubio: Every strike has the legal officer on the deck. This is done by the department of war.
▶ 1:11:04Sen. Kaine: I'm not -- I know what the targeting criteria are. It has all been classified. I'm not allowed to discuss the targeting criteria. I don't think I'm prohibited from describing things that aren't targeted criteria. I will give you an obvious example. Everyone on the boat is right here. That is not a targeting criteria.
▶ 1:11:36Sen. Kaine: Everybody on the boat is right-handed, that is not a targeted criteria. Here's one that is not so obvious. There is evidence of narcotics on the boat. That is not a targeting criteria. I have been briefed most recently in the last couple of weeks. Have the targeting criteria change?
▶ 1:12:06Sen. Kaine: I cannot describe it here. The presence of narcotics on the boat has never been a targeting criteria. Would you have any ability to explain and the administration could have picked that is a targeting criteria. They chose items that were targets that authorize the use of U.S. military but they have not used presence on the boat as one of the targeting criteria.
▶ 1:12:35Sen. Kaine: I wouldn't get -- I would suggest my calling colleagues to go look at the files, they are consistent with what I just said about something that is not on the list. Why would the administration not include the presence of narcotics on the boat as a targeting criteria?
▶ 1:12:56Sec. Rubio: I can't discuss the specifics. I could tell you one thing, the starting criteria is not single source.
▶ 1:13:07Sen. Kaine: There are three elements to the targeting criteria.
▶ 1:13:10Sec. Rubio: They have to have true lengths. I could tell you they do walk away from strikes. I am not aware of every strike. It's not reported on a regular basis. There have been strikes they have walked away from because it has not met the criteria.
▶ 1:13:29Sen. Hagerty: Especially since the administration says this is against narco traffickers, how odd it is that the presence of narcotics is not one of the targeting criteria's. I want to encourage my colleagues, take a look at the strike files, you will be as surprised as I am.
▶ 1:13:55Sen. Hagerty: Again in your dual role, the administration's operations, we could agree with it or not. The administration presented a legal opinion from the doj that we could review. Absolute resolve. The administration present today legal rationale.
▶ 1:14:24Sen. Hagerty: 92 days into a war against iran in the administration will not let congress of the olc to justify the war. Intel committee members, armed services committee members, rank-and-file members. The administration will not make it available to us. You can imagine we are the oversight committee, you are asking for a budget in the armed services committee asking for 1,000,000,000,005 an increase of 40% over last year. But won't let us see a legal agreement.
▶ 1:14:53Sen. Hagerty: You know what kind of thinking if you showed us the legal rationale for two wars and you won't show it for the third, is there something in the rationale is there a dissenting opinion that says it's not legal. Are there conditions like you can strike civilian infrastructure like schools and bridges. Are there factual assertions like it will be over in two days or iran will never close the strait of hormuz.
▶ 1:15:21Sen. Hagerty: By not sharing the legal opinion with the oversight branch, you give us the opinion that there is something in there you don't want us to see. Could you use your influence as the president's chief national security advisor to get the administration to share the iran war legal opinion with congress?
▶ 1:15:42Sec. Rubio: Obviously the department of state does not develop the legal opinion.
▶ 1:15:49Sen. Kaine: You are the chief.
▶ 1:15:50Sec. Rubio: Why is the office of legal counsel provided.
▶ 1:15:56Sen. Kaine: Will use use your influence.
▶ 1:15:58Sec. Rubio: I can inquire as to why it's not available. I don't think there's a reason why -- I I am not aware, in fact my understanding is they have provided documentation to the committee.
▶ 1:16:11Sen. Kaine: And you wouldn't accept that.
▶ 1:16:15Sec. Rubio: It's certainly an they provided the legal rationale for the strike. You're asking for the written opinion.
▶ 1:16:22Sen. Kaine: Which they provided in southern spear and absolute.
▶ 1:16:28Chair Risch: Sen. lee:. .
▶ 1:16:35Sen. Lee: Thank you for being here secretary. Bald is beautiful and we can help that. But thank you for all of your efforts. You are a very effective spokesperson for president trump in the administration for the united states and we are grateful for that. I was wondering if you could talk to us about the fractured iranian regime and how that might be making negotiations more difficult?
▶ 1:17:01Sen. Lee: One of the things I wondered are whether the diplomatic iranian channels on crosswise at odds with her working hand in glove with the irgc which is itself causing a lot of the cease-fire violations or is it all sort of coordinated chaos to try and undermine and tip the scales in favor of iran in the negotiations?
▶ 1:17:25Sec. Rubio: That's a great question. Let me try to give this answer in a way that's not boring and wonky. Because it's been a shift. The original supreme leader who is there is no longer with us, his son takes over no one hears from them. By all reports open source reporting he was severely injured in the same strike and so forth.
▶ 1:17:47Sen. Lee: Are you confident he is still alive by the way?
▶ 1:17:50Sec. Rubio: We have not heard from them publicly or seen them publicly I would imagine given what's happened to multiple leaders in the system being very public is not something that's recommended for them internally. But that said I think there are indications out there that he is engaged at some level. Although all indications of in the writing and intermediaries.
▶ 1:18:15Sec. Rubio: You have the supreme leader understand at the end of the day the supreme leader there really is no analogy to it in our system or anybody else's. There's a theological office. The head of the islamic -- republic in the sense of the ultimate decision-maker. And every major decision has to be run by them. They are advised by counsel.
▶ 1:18:41Sec. Rubio: It's not -- there is an council of irgc and other elements of the regime that surround that supreme leader. And ultimately that counsel has to sign off on anything. Then there are the people you see on tv who's out there every single day the speaker who's been playing a pretty prominent role. They are the ones they've sent to negotiations and so forth.
▶ 1:19:05Sec. Rubio: It is our view of the system as we understand it as has been expressed to us by the intermediaries and iran directly that what iraq she and calabar take from us they have to bring back to this council. And ultimately a guidance from them. That process often takes three to five days to get a response. Some of it is logistical. They are operating probably using couriers and things of this nature.
▶ 1:19:31Sec. Rubio: Part of it is internal fissures on what they should agree to or not. The second point that needs to be in this regard is there is evidence that there are communications issues within the regime as well. For example, it is pretty clear at the outset of hostilities in the conflict they had delegated decision-making to the field commanders and so oftentimes field commanders had delegated authority to act on let's see a pre-operational plan they put in place.
▶ 1:20:02Sec. Rubio: So unlike our system or perhaps you know the president of the secretary of war is directly making decisions with the chairman of the joint chiefs, in there's system a lot of decision-making at a tactical level and which ships to hit and so forth are being made at the commander level.
▶ 1:20:17Sen. Lee: At the outside it looked like fire ready aim.
▶ 1:20:21Sec. Rubio: It was a design in terms of regime survival. Operating in case there was decapitation strikes. Let's go back to the essence of the negotiations. What complicated them is your ultimately negotiating with people who have to negotiate within the system. See what they are allowed to give. What is abundantly clear is iran is facing severe internal. All the problems iran had before this conflict not only are still there but they are worse.
▶ 1:20:51Sec. Rubio: All the things led to protests are worse than they were before. There is definitely elements within that regime but understand it and their other elements that are more immune to it and perhaps more resistant. So what we are working to is in many cases is delays in getting responses to people and this is why you see reporting about the next few days because internally it takes time to get responses. Some what upwards of five to six days.
▶ 1:21:17Sen. Lee: You have to believe that using that to their advantage where the salesman has to go talk to his manager, can wait and think about it.
▶ 1:21:24Sec. Rubio: Even more complicated.
▶ 1:21:28Sen. Lee: I think we could benefit, from hearing about the need to zero out funding for a couple of entities including the national democracy and you'd view it -- U.S. adf.
▶ 1:21:42Sec. Rubio: They have served a purpose in the past and obviously at the end of the day these programs have had especially the national democracy has had support in congress in the past and I was here for 16 years and I understand you will pass an appropriations bill and the corporations bill will have things in it. That's just the way it is. We understand and we will make it work.
▶ 1:22:07Sec. Rubio: We are concerned and have been concerned that organizations have lost their purpose and at the end of the day we have a lot of resources. The U.S. is the richest country in the world. The largest government budget in the world but we don't have unlimited resources. We still have to be able to strategically spend our money in the state department a lot of people say that's massive. The state department is not that big. A majority of employees are local hires.
▶ 1:22:33Sec. Rubio: We have service officers career service. But compared to some of these other agencies we are not that large. Yet we have a global footprint. I would say beyond the department we are the only ones present almost everywhere on the planet. We have limited resources and we have to be able to allocate those resources in ways that are driven by the coalition of advancing our national security and oftentimes it will need the things we paid for in the past we cannot continue to fund.
▶ 1:23:04Sec. Rubio: Because there are other things they might be good but there might be something else it's more important and better. Other cases we may spend money on a purpose but we want to be driven not just by how much money we are spending on something. We also want outcomes for it. We want to show outcomes. That's been the goal behind these compact with the 32 countries. But it's not we are not to try to solve the disease problem this year we are trying to build a local capacity so five years they will need aid anymore because their local systems can handle it.
▶ 1:23:35Sec. Rubio: But nonetheless it's been very well received.
▶ 1:23:38Chair Risch: Senator merkley.
▶ 1:23:42Sen. Merkley: Thank you Mr. secretary. As senator shaheen you've expressed no one died as a result of the shutdown of a id. And I did ask you last time you were here about that and I won't repeat all of that but I want to know the folks who study this in schools of public health.
▶ 1:24:10Sen. Merkley: The boston university school of public health estimate that over 500,000 children have died from that sudden shutdown. I wanted to put a note on that. If you were to walk across this country you would see one dead child for roughly every 30 feet. That's the level of carnage. I know you disagree with that but many experts who were in this field that is there estimate.
▶ 1:24:33Sen. Merkley: I hope you will ponder that as we strive to rebuild our programs to malaria and tuberculosis, aids, hiv nutrition and infectious disease like ebola. I want to turn to taiwan, an area you and I worked on quite a bit. When you were here including the taiwan reinforcement act and the transnational repression policy and trade-offs certification act.
▶ 1:25:03Sen. Merkley: I'm very concerned about the president's comments on his recent trip. He noted that the arms sales to taiwan are "a very good negotiating chip." when he was asked by how much he talked about arms sales with china he said we discussed arms sales "in great detail." the six assurances include arms sales to taiwan would never be a negotiating chip.
▶ 1:25:31Sen. Merkley: My concern is the president now has kind of accentuated the arms sales by not putting the stamp of approval on completing the arms sale that congress has already funded.
▶ 1:25:49Sen. Merkley: And that this sets a stage for china to very much proceed to pursue more aggressively their effort to incorporate taiwan into the broader framework of china including extinguishing taiwan's democracy. So I would like to hear your thoughts. Hopefully there is a path that will be accentuate our support for taiwan's democracy.
▶ 1:26:16Sec. Rubio: Let me first say on taiwan and I think I made this point myself either on the trip to china or after we returned. There will be no change to U.S. policy towards taiwan. I think obviously the chinese side would like to see a change in verbiage but no changes been made in that regard. The second point is I believe in december of this year we did approve an arms sales of $11 billion. I think it's a sink farm sale. A huge sale to taiwan.
▶ 1:26:47Sec. Rubio: I think it is more than the totality of the four years under the biden administration and I would recall there were six years under the obama administration where there were no sales to taiwan. There was a second pending sale which I think is the one you are referring to and that remains under review. And -- we just did one in december so I don't think and I'm not saying you're saying this but I don't think it's fair to say the U.S.
▶ 1:27:11Sec. Rubio: Is not providing we just had a massive arms sales and it was so big and so noticeable that the chinese became very aggressive about some of the incursions they had to take as a result and as I said it was more in one sale than we did in the entirety of the biden administration if I'm correct and I think I am on that. So, but the most important thing to understand is we want to see the status quo resume. That's our policy that's what we said. That's what we continue to say.
▶ 1:27:41Sec. Rubio: That is a very delegate relationship to balance. But our policy on taiwan does not change.
▶ 1:27:50Sen. Merkley: Another issue you and I worked on was the project. It's been the most effective strategy were seeing the products produced by slave labor will not be admitted into the united states. And we have turned down a lot of product from china but they've shipped off in the candidate would be far more effective policy if mexico, canada and europe were to join us. Is that something you can pursue in your role?
▶ 1:28:17Sec. Rubio: It is and as you said its enforcement challenge. The initial enforcement is easier because is more straightforward. It makes it harder because it requires more paperwork, a due diligence and frankly in many cases obscured. There is clearly a humanitarian aspect and humane aspect to forced labor. Separate but related there is an economic aspect.
▶ 1:28:42Sec. Rubio: It is also unfair competition for companies to have to compete against someone who has free labor basically compelled forced labor. So we made the party on two fronts not just as this immoral and horrific but it is also enormously economic disadvantage not just for us but for companies all over the world. As you can imagine, depending on the country some are more willing to lean in on these issues than others.
▶ 1:29:10Sec. Rubio: I think yesterday late last week the foreign minister of china was visiting canada where they sort of announced or at least put out the prospect of how canada can export more to china next year. What we don't know and I'm not blaming canada I'm saying in general they do this all over the world there is state associated with it and I would imagine china put tremendous about of pressure on countries around the world not to comply with restrictions like the ones we put.
▶ 1:29:40Sec. Rubio: We got canada and mexico to agree given our current trade arrangements make it far more effective. Today we have not been successful in convincing them they should do that because among other things I think they fear retribution. We certainly will continue to raise it.
▶ 1:29:56Chair Risch: Senator crapo -- senator barrasso.
▶ 1:30:01Sen. Barrasso: You up and up talking about leadership and american interests and later this month the g7 will be meeting in france and let -- next month nato will be meeting in turkey. Just overview what are the priorities going into those meetings?
▶ 1:30:16Sec. Rubio: The g7?
▶ 1:30:19Sen. Barrasso: G7 and nato.
▶ 1:30:23Sec. Rubio: The g7 forum this year is largely been focused on visa because of the straits. I went to the ministers meeting in march a lot of the conversations were about the straits and the one point we made and it's interesting because a lot of the countries involved even though it's not a military forum per se but u.k. In france are members of it. They've put together this initiative. Which they say they will send minesweepers and escort ships but they will do so once hostilities have ended. Kind of a catch 22.
▶ 1:30:54Sec. Rubio: Why do you need naval escorts if no one is shooting at the ships. That said I don't diminish the utility effort because I would imagine the first few ships to go through will like to be escorted. That's good to be a key feature of that conversation. I think there is a shared interest in these countries on rare earth minerals and supply chains generally. I think there is a growing global consensus.
▶ 1:31:16Sec. Rubio: And we had a great maybe a few of you attended we had a great ministerial here earlier this year on rare earths and supply chains. That brought in dozens of countries and all the g7 countries were represented. I think that will be a feature here is how do we diversify the global supply chain on anything from rare earths to pharmaceuticals. So I think that point will be quite dominant.
▶ 1:31:43Sec. Rubio: Given the makeup of losing the g7 the russia ukraine conflict always comes up because it obviously directly impacts three or four of those members around the continent. So we will also, and I don't recall exactly who the french provided but in addition to the g7 bill always invite two or three countries to attend. I believe ukraine has been invited if I'm not mistaken. There's usually couple of the countries they will invite that are not members.
▶ 1:32:08Sec. Rubio: I think those issues will dominate if any of where we are with the straits and supply chains has been a key focus. I think there's been an interest and I think canada deserves credit for this, the canadians have taken the lead and we have been supportive of this and highlighting places like haiti and as a result of these g7 meetings we have a number of countries in the g7 including japan step up and contribute to the effort there.
▶ 1:32:39Sen. Barrasso: Is an article in the hill and I ask unanimous consent to put this in the record it says sweden is now america's most valuable tech ally. Talking about working together with other countries. It goes on to say this last week sweden joined nato and signed the bilateral court -- defense cooperation agreement in march.
▶ 1:32:58Sen. Barrasso: Sweden became the first european member of the european member states to sign the pact delegation washington's flagship initiative to secure global ain semiconductor supply chains. Now the technology prosperity deal. How wonder how you've accomplished so much and is this a model for U.S. relationships going forward?
▶ 1:33:18Sec. Rubio: Sweden and finland to equal extend is they were not members of nato for many years. They had a self-sufficiency in their defenses. Now that they've joined they've added to the equation. We are not here to beat up on specific countries generally speaking the countries you added were countries that needed nato. Sweden and finland have actually contributed because they brought their own defense and advanced technologies. They've been a great partner and extraordinary partner.
▶ 1:33:49Sec. Rubio: With the nato foreign ministers meeting in sweden and it was phenomenal. I think sweden is a great ally in the country we continue to find synergy in cooperation with especially on the field of technology but also on defense. They have their own defense industrial base which is impressive. I wish every country and had that. >> the number of travels we found out is to go around europe most countries will say they have been too dependent on the U.S.
▶ 1:34:17Sec. Rubio: For military and russia for energy and china for materials. This administration has made these nations step up to do what they need to do in terms of putting the money forward on defense so I want to know whether the next concrete steps in terms of making some of the pledges of moving from 2% to 5%. Making sure they deploy the military capabilities. >> some countries are on track to do that. Others are not. Let me speak in general terms. There's a real challenge.
▶ 1:34:48Sec. Rubio: They will increase the defense budget or capability. It has to be on defense that's the first one. You can say pensions for former soldiers and sailors is part of your 5%. That can happen.
▶ 1:35:02Sec. Rubio: The bigger challenge to much of europe faces many countries in nato face is their economies are not growing and in order to spend more money on defense they will have to raise taxes or cut social programs and part of the reality of nato whether we like to hear it or not is many of the countries in europe but have these robust safety nets because they didn't have to spend it on defense because nato and the U.S. were providing it for them. They will have to deal with that reality. The second point and this is not an anti-nato stance. But it is the reality.
▶ 1:35:34Sec. Rubio: The U.S. has global obligations. At the same time I'm in nato I have to speak to the indo specific -- indo pacific countries about our foreign policy. We are involved in the middle east. We have counterterrorism issues with regards to africa. We have growing mill to mill cooperation in our western hemisphere especially taking on these transnational terrorist organizations and the like. We don't have unlimited military resources but we have a very large budget. They are not unlimited.
▶ 1:36:03Sec. Rubio: We have to be able to allocate resources and personnel in ways that make sense. So I think that's the reality that we have shirked our nato partnership and have been consulting every step along the way. But these countries will have to step up at a minimum they have to conventionally defend their own sovereign national territory.
▶ 1:36:24Chair Risch: Senator van hollen.
▶ 1:36:28Sen. Van Hollen: . Welcome Mr. secretary. This is your first public hearing since president trump and israeli prime minister netanyahu launched an illegal war against iran. Netanyahu said he has been waiting 40 years to do this. It turns out he finally found a president who was both stupid and reckless enough to join him.
▶ 1:36:55Sen. Van Hollen: The war has killed 14 american service members, wounded hundreds more and killed thousands of civilians. It's driving up the price of gas, food and much more. Trump obviously doesn't care. He called high gas prices peanuts and said I don't think about american's financial situation. That's from the president of the united states. And all for what? The president told us 91 days ago we had won the war in iran.
▶ 1:37:24Sen. Van Hollen: Last year he told the country iran's key enrichment facilities have been completely and totally obliterated. Was that false? Let's face it Mr. secretary. Trump foreign policy has become a dumpster fire. This is the same president who is more interested in flattering vladimir putin then ukrainian sovereignty. A president who lifted restrictions on the transfer of sophisticated U.S.
▶ 1:37:52Sen. Van Hollen: Chips to china but came back from his trip there with nothing but what he tweeted about the other day. This president brought on elon musk to bring a chainsaw to a id. We have also seen corrupt crypto deals with the uae royal family that enrich the trump family the expense of our national security.
▶ 1:38:16Sen. Van Hollen: Senior administration engage in extrajudicial killings in the caribbean, hijacked venezuelan oil, threatened to invade greenland and weakened the nato alliance. A reagan appointed judge said that you and former secretary noem abused your powers seeking to deport students for protesting the destruction of gaza.
▶ 1:38:38Sen. Van Hollen: A reagan appointed judge said you did that "primarily on account of the first amendment protected political speech." speaking of gaza, the so-called peace has seemed to run aground. Meanwhile, while senator rubio once proclaimed the U.S.
▶ 1:38:54Sen. Van Hollen: Must "work to ensure refugees avoid torture and persecution are provided safe environments to live and thrive in." now a secretary of state in this administration you have capped refugees at a record low of 17500 and white south africans have comprised roughly 99 percent of those slots Mr. secretary.
▶ 1:39:25Sen. Van Hollen: A race to base refugee system. The president preventing political refugees from entering the united states even as you impose the oil blockade on that regime. With the stated goal is to change the government there but the only real change is humanitarian crisis. And in that regard Mr.
▶ 1:39:48Sen. Van Hollen: Secretary I have a question for you regarding the designation of cuba as a state sponsor of terrorism. On the very first week of this administration you reinstated the administration reinstated that. And in a recent january 26 eeo, you made statements suggesting connections to hezbollah and hamas.
▶ 1:40:16Sen. Van Hollen: The previous administration did a thorough review in the intelligence community concluded there was no evidence cuba was engaged in ongoing state-sponsored terrorism. Did you find new evidence to support that conclusion?
▶ 1:40:28Sec. Rubio: First of all let me say you made this long statement of which I disagree we won't have time to address every point that you made. So let's stick to cuba specifically because at the question you asked. Cuba has sponsor terrorism for example virtually every left-wing radical violent -- terrorist group in the western hemisphere has in some point relied on support from cuba. The eln, farc dissidents.
▶ 1:40:55Sec. Rubio: We also know for example cuba continues to host a pretty substantial collection of intelligence sites on behalf of the chinese and russians. You look at the region and you look at these leftist marxist terrorist organizations all of whom.
▶ 1:41:08Sen. Lee: Mr. secretary -- Sen.
▶ 1:41:13Van Hollen: By question related to new evidence to support that conclusion. I can tell you.
▶ 1:41:18Sec. Rubio: Why would I need new evidence?
▶ 1:41:21Sen. Van Hollen: Your claiming their state sponsor of terrorism. So their ongoing we involved in that. My final question to you remains to the complex. There are united states working with israel to take away the kingdom of jordan's custodianship over the mosque complex in east jerusalem. Can you confirm.
▶ 1:41:43Sec. Rubio: I'm not even aware of those reports.
▶ 1:41:46Sen. Van Hollen: There been sec.
▶ 1:41:49Rubio: Several media reports.
▶ 1:41:50Sec. Rubio: Will you know the media is always accurate.
▶ 1:41:52Sen. Van Hollen: They're not and that's why I'm asking.
▶ 1:41:56Sec. Rubio: We have a great relationship with jordan. So I've just never heard that before. You should -- I don't know what article. Is it a credible website?
▶ 1:42:07Sen. Van Hollen: I'm glad to hear you say there is no truth to that.
▶ 1:42:15Chair Risch: Senator daines was here. Apologies.
▶ 1:42:22Sen. Daines: Thank you. One of the underreported successes for your diplomacy in this administration is what's happened to the peace agreement a landmark agreement between armenia and azerbaijan. Mr.
▶ 1:42:41Sen. Daines: Secretary you were just in the region most recently, a major step forward for a region long beset by conflict nearly 40 years and through your leadership and president trump's leadership, you brought true peace to a area of the world sandwiched in between russia and iran.
▶ 1:43:03Sen. Daines: It was creative thinking then let the establishment of the trump route for international peace and prosperity as a solution to some of the stickier issues in that negotiation. The program promises to be a boon not only for armenia and azerbaijan, but also different countries. As brezinski once said that central asia is the wine bottle and azerbaijan is the cork.
▶ 1:43:33Sen. Daines: You uncork the wine bottle suddenly the oil and gas and critical minerals flowing back towards the west instead to russia china and iran. Mr. secretary can you tell us a little bit about how you plan to implement the framework agreements and deliver major economic benefit to the U.S. in a very historically troubled region.
▶ 1:43:57Sec. Rubio: Actually as you said I was there last week what is it tuesday. We signed the trip agreement between the U.S. and armenia in this as you described as a corridor. I know it's the anchor of the peace agreement with armenia and azerbaijan. But it is much more than just the anchor of the peace agreement. It really has the opportunity to revolutionize armenia's strategic location and become a center hub for trade in the region.
▶ 1:44:26Sec. Rubio: It solves the issue of access that azerbaijan cared about. But it does much more than that. It has the ability to transform the armenian economy and a powerful way. For a long time our relations with armenia were quite stagnant and in many cases I would argue almost nonexistent. It has also re-invigorated that relationship between our two countries and allowed us to explore opportunities in other fields. We are involved in that very heavily.
▶ 1:44:54Sec. Rubio: We just signed the agreement and that will allow us to drive and hopefully incentivize U.S. private sector investment in the corridor to the benefit of american companies and interest. But also to the benefit of armenia azerbaijan and other regional countries. I would also argue just to point out and I don't mean this again I think this is pretty well understood the russians are less than happy about our engagement there.
▶ 1:45:19Sec. Rubio: I think there is evidence that would like to the current president loses election as a result of this growing -- relationship of the united states. We are not there to infringe on armenian psalm and terry. We not ask them to be friends of the countries we are asking to have relationship with them on a relationship not just on peace but that's the beginning. If the economic opportunities that it provides. There are american companies and workers that benefit from it the armenian people be the ultimate beneficiaries of this corridor
▶ 1:45:50Sen. Daines: We were there and the presidents came to signed agreement with president trump leadership. Shiite muslim country azerbaijan and armenia were the oldest christian countries in the world came together to sign the peace agreement was truly a breakthrough. It is an underreported story in my opinion. And this is a critical geopolitical problem that has been definitely remedied.
▶ 1:46:19Sec. Rubio: The key will be execution. You can have the agreements in place now to make sure we are focused on driving and ensuring that to the extent the american companies can contribute the infrastructure and railways to everything that needs to happen in order for that corridor to open. And then the spinoff effect as well. We don't need to dominate we are not asking for american monopoly economically but we want our companies to get a fair shake. Partnering with armenian companies till it becomes mutually beneficial.
▶ 1:46:50Sen. Daines: One important final point. Spending a lot of time working with friends in central asia. Things are progressing well thanks to your engagement and encouragement of president trump and we are seeing a lot of fruit from last year.
▶ 1:47:10Sen. Daines: That being said, there are still major hurdle to strengthen our ties with the key irritants to our friends in azerbaijan and in central asia the jackson-vanick should trade restrictions. These are relic restrictions. Senator murphy and I are the repeal. It's a long past due that we get this change. Mr.
▶ 1:47:35Sen. Daines: Secretary is removing these restrictions and priority for you and the department and removing them have a significant impact on our relations with central asia?
▶ 1:47:43Sec. Rubio: It's a detriment we would like to see them removed. I think you should talk to the chairman of the ranking member. You can >> tell. It's finance.
▶ 1:47:54Sec. Rubio: You don't have jurisdiction? Well that's good. It's not my job.
▶ 1:48:01Sen. Daines: Will work on you without Mr. secretary. It would be.
▶ 1:48:08Chair Risch: Let me say I have sulli concur with the secretary and senator daines with you. I've talked to the president about this is you know and I have actually talked to the chairman of the finance committee relatively well. We actually have a plan for going forward. But you are absolutely right.
▶ 1:48:38Chair Risch: There's it is in the queue. With that, let us go to senator coons.
▶ 1:48:45Sen. Coons: Thank you Mr. chairman, national security adviser good to see you again. I know from our service here together but you agree that china is the greatest national security threat that we face. In one of the key reasons is the repeated threats to take control of taiwan by force if necessary. Taiwan we both know is not just some faraway island it produces 90% of the semiconductor chips critical to everything from f-35's two iphones.
▶ 1:49:14Sen. Coons: And it's geography makes it indispensable to global commerce and military power. Do you agree with that?
▶ 1:49:19Sec. Rubio: Taiwan? Yes it's not just strategically important for where it's located it's also the message it sends to the world if something were to happen to it.
▶ 1:49:28Sen. Coons: That's why for decades with leadership from the senate and bipartisan way we provided arms to deter the prc's potential military aggression. You introduced the taiwan peace through strength act of 2023. In january congress preapproved a 14 billion dollar arms packet for taiwan. It's been six months and we haven't received a notification. Have you advised president trump to review.
▶ 1:49:53Sec. Rubio: We just did 11 billion in december which is I think the largest sale in history. It was more than the cumulative amount under the biden administration and I recall during six years of the obama administration it was zero go to taiwan. So in some way would argue we are trying to make that.
▶ 1:50:11Sen. Coons: Why hold off on that now?
▶ 1:50:14Sec. Rubio: It's under review. I think it's been noted but hasn't been approved yet. It's under review at the white house.
▶ 1:50:22Sen. Coons: My concern is president trump has said publicly that arms sales to type a or a great negotiating chip and my concern at a time when the prc has been far more aggressive than they were in the previous year's centerline crossing certain navigation of australia, aiding iran and russia in their war goals and aims and frankly literally helping iranians target U.S. service members.
▶ 1:50:49Sen. Coons: I respect the importance of having an open negotiation and relationship with the prc, but in the meetings you were in in beijing to the president offer to condition arms sales to taiwan in order to placate xi jinping?
▶ 1:51:01Sec. Rubio: Well look I'm docket up say with the president's words were. That specific question you just asked that's not the context in which the president has raised this in the past. When the president says it's great negotiating point he saying it's because -- china as you can imagine this is a top priority causally talking about taiwan arms sales. That in no way is what is holding up our decision-making the white house's decision-making.
▶ 1:51:31Sec. Rubio: It's only the president wanted to decide on the timing of when and how that is executed on. The money is available and as I said we are coming off the heels of a very large sale in december of last year so -- there are a variety of reasons why these things don't happen immediately.
▶ 1:51:46Sen. Coons: There more reason than ever for the administration with congressional support to continue providing robust military capacity to taiwan given that the prc is more and more regionally aggressive. You also introduced and passed legislation in 23 prohibiting any president from unilaterally withdrawing from nato. I assume this was because he recognized that our alliances are a key advantage.
▶ 1:52:15Sen. Coons: Against russia, china and other adversaries. Do you still consider article five and unconditional commitment?
▶ 1:52:22Sec. Rubio: Let me address that holistically. First of all you are right I have throughout my entire career in the senate and through much of my time now and this administration been a supporter of nato. I see its utility. The key and I'm just being honest with you what I talk about this. What are the key arguments I would use on behalf of nato is the fact that it allows rights we can use a contingency operation in a time of conflict. We just have had.
▶ 1:52:53Sec. Rubio: So, when you have countries in this alliance because of the end of the day we are providing basically the defense backbone of an entire continent. These are not full -- poor countries for these are rich countries. And the utility of nato for us is that it provides these basing rights. Now we are living in a world in which some of these countries I point to spain as an example. Openly bragged about how they denied us the use of those bases.
▶ 1:53:17Sec. Rubio: So if the core rationale for us if if what we get out of nato is the ability to use bases and then we have members of the alliance basically denying the use of those bases in a contingency it calls into question the entire thing.
▶ 1:53:31Sen. Coons: I have one more question I want to get into. Is it not true that some of the challenges in our relations have only come after president trump threatened to seize territory from a trusted and reliable partner. I think he publicly said both. Use tariffs to coerce denmark into giving greenland.
▶ 1:53:55Sec. Rubio: Just to tell you look if you go back and study the history of it, nato tensions and debates in the 1970's it was the reverse it with the administration tried to stay in nato and congress trying to get us out. I happen to see a speech they were playing it after he passed away on c-span, jesse jackson of the 1988 democratic convention calling for the U.S. to get out of nato.
▶ 1:54:19These Sen. Coons: Debates over nato.
▶ 1:54:21Sen. Coons: Joe biden didn't support that position then and I don't support that position.
▶ 1:54:23Sec. Rubio: My point is these debates about nato have been going on for a long time.
▶ 1:54:27Sen. Coons: There's about 1100 vetted afghan allies being held in campus cilia and that includes 400 children and one hundred 50 family members of currently serving active-duty U.S. service members. They have been stranded there for a year and a half and there is talk of sending them either back to afghanistan into the waiting arms of the taliban or to a war-torn and ebola infected countries.
▶ 1:54:57Sen. Coons: These are people who they or their immediate family member served alongside U.S. soldiers at great risk. Can you commit to working with me and others in this body to support the relocation of these individuals to the united states ? Especially those who are family members currently serving for U.S. soldiers.
▶ 1:55:13Sec. Rubio: Yeah I can -- we are under an executive order after the national guard attack with what happened last year so we can admit any afghans at this point. That said, you just pointed to them being sent back to afghanistan. We've worked on this and we will work with you is we have talked to multiple countries. I don't know of a single country that will take 1000 people but we talked multiple countries by taking several hundred and allowing them to move to a safe location.
▶ 1:55:41Sec. Rubio: As you know we are operating under not just those restrictions but broader restrictions about immigration to the united states after 20, 25 million people entered illegally over four years leading up to this administration. But I will work with you to find the right places for them to go. We want that to happen.
▶ 1:55:55Sen. Coons: The president raise the refugee cap exclusively allow afrikaners to our nation. I would welcome a chance to work with you to find countries for these afghans and I frankly think we need to be brief -- reviewing a refugee policy.
▶ 1:56:13Sen. Coons: The refugees who came in are the most vetted and often the highest contributing as you know my childhood church hosted a south vietnamese family and received the five of them become great americans entrepreneurs contributors, it is refugees from overseas weather from cuba, venezuela, vietnam or afghanistan who've long contributed to the united states. Secretary, thank you.
▶ 1:56:36Chair Risch: Senator long. Several long the boats blowing up in the caribbean and pacific as drug boats. It's interesting the three secret criteria we are using doesn't include whether they have drugs on board.
▶ 1:56:55Chair Risch: I would like to add the statistic from the coast guard say when we interject alleged drug boats in the way we've always done it about one and four do not have drugs. So we see something suspicious about the boat we stop them and they don't have drugs on board. I would also like to add drugs is not a criteria for blowing up boats but neither his arms. So in order to blow them up we don't have to say they are armed or have drugs.
▶ 1:57:25Chair Risch: I did a lot of people have questions. I am glad to hear that the administration negotiations are willing to trade sanctions relief for removal of enriched uranium. I have said for a long time and argue for a long time that sanctions in themselves rarely if ever are of any value. I have yet to see any chinese behavior that's changed because of sanctions.
▶ 1:57:53Chair Risch: I get to see any russian behavior change because of sanctions. I really get to see any iranian behavior because of sanctions. However, sanctions have some leveraging ability to exact change if you remove them. So the removal might actually have some so I support the administration in this. There are many who have been vocal on the airwaves saying we can never negotiate with them because they're terrible people.
▶ 1:58:21Chair Risch: We don't negotiate with friendly people in a time of war you have to negotiate with an adversary. So I do commend and supported the idea of this. The other thing is it's very viable you can say the trade sanctions and as soon as we hit the 440 kilograms of enriched uranium. It has to be dug I guess some of it from under a mountain of rubble but at the same time very verifiable.
▶ 1:58:50Chair Risch: When I would argue and advise is really why not offer everything. Virtually all of the sanctions if you can wait if that's what you want get the rich uranium out and a promise that the rabid hawks will argue well were knocking to negotiate with terrorists, and won't negotiate with bad people. Then they will continue to have it raining amended rich uranium.
▶ 1:59:20Chair Risch: I do think the argument that there has been a military solution to this is largely proven by the fact even though militarily we have obliterated their military all of that is true, it's as fred e clay wrote in every war must end. Military victory does not always translate or lead to political resolution. With the things you want done. What we really want done is no more enriched uranium.
▶ 1:59:50Chair Risch: But I would say that as we are looking at trade sanctions you say there's something you can do and some that are congressional. I would bring in the leaders in the congress who can give up those and hopefully get their voice saying yes.
▶ 2:00:05Chair Risch: If you give up a few middling ones that won't change things in the white house says you still have all these congressional sanctions, if you're on the other side of that equation you might say giving up the one thing we think is leverage enriched uranium for a little bit of sanctions relief so I would say really go all in on it. You don't have to wait and prove it you have to prove it in the future.
▶ 2:00:33Chair Risch: I think that is a good step forward. It is important for people to have discussion of what diplomacy is and that it doesn't always and bad. Frankly I'm glad to hear the administration is negotiating and I wish you luck and would love to hear your response.
▶ 2:00:49Sec. Rubio: The presence may clear the priorities iran can never have a nuclear weapon. What do they need, the ability to enrich which has been substantially destroyed but always be rebuilt over time and the second is the ability and and highly enriched uranium 60% that could quickly be enriched to 90% weapons grade. The second when you make is about sanctions so so that's the goal here. And the sanctions, first of all there's a combination of sanctions.
▶ 2:01:17Sec. Rubio: Sanctions that blocked direct activities and that's problematic beyond the nuclear program because they use this to fund and sponsor terrorism like hezbollah throughout the region. And then there's the frozen assets which are related to sanctions. These are rainy assets that have been frozen. So what I would argue and again I don't want to get ahead of myself. But if you get into a situation in which the reason why there are sanctions is because a nuclear program.
▶ 2:01:45Sec. Rubio: So if they comply with what we are demanding on the nuclear side, zero enrichment, get rid of the uranium. If they're complying with these things I think that's the place where frozen assets can be discussed. The more they give the more they get. Ultimately we will still face other challenges related to iran separate from the nuclear program like what they use their money on which is to sponsor hezbollah and hamas. To sponsor terrorism around the world. On the nuclear question which was the presence focused on now, no nuclear weapon program.
▶ 2:02:16Sec. Rubio: The sanctions directly related to the nuclear program the more they give theoretically the more they should be able to get. What they won't get as a down payment. They won't get a signing bonus. And -- I would also point out that negotiations on nuclear matters are highly complex highly technical and so it will take some time to work through that. Sanctions are as well multifaceted. You and sanctions, U.S. sanctions. So there's a lot to unravel.
▶ 2:02:51Sen. Paul: Benefit from the idea of treating sanctions relief. If you don't ever trade them if you just have them on the hook that I think there's little value and change behavior.
▶ 2:03:04Sen. Booker: Thank you very much. You and I talked about africa and raise concerns about a lot of the cuts. We are seeing globally and increase in tuberculosis, an increase in malaria cases. We are seeing a continued ongoing on the continent hiv crisis. The U.S. has pulled back from a lot of its investments in those areas now with a crisis of ebola we see the challenges as a result of surveillance early detection and the like.
▶ 2:03:35Sen. Booker: I am very concerned about what the administration strategy is from a were clearly seeing here that what goes on on the continent of africa directly affects our public health as well.
▶ 2:03:44Sec. Rubio: First of all I don't agree with that assessment. First of all it is not about cutting back the response is not just how much money it's what results you're to get. Let's talk about ebola for a second. The outbreak in ebola was in a war-torn -- isolated rural area of the drc. That's where that began. Our response has been very quick, very rapid.
▶ 2:04:05Sen. Paul: You're saying you did not cut early detection?
▶ 2:04:09Sec. Rubio: I'm saying the cut is not due to that. You're saying the cuts.
▶ 2:04:15Sen. Booker: I would really like to have my questions answered so very quickly the cut early detection when it comes to infectious diseases on the continent factually this is not an opinion. We made those cuts. We cut early warning systems on the continent.
▶ 2:04:33Sec. Rubio: It had nothing to do the ebola outbreak.
▶ 2:04:36Sen. Booker: I don't need to tell you secretary rubio but we are living in a place where the infectious disease crisis anywhere. The united states has made major reductions in these areas. And put us more at risk. You're talking about this there's other things that undercuts we made and you see it factually even the state department personnel I've talked to are saying we are less prepared for an ebola outbreak than we were before.
▶ 2:05:06Sen. Booker: My worry is specifically in a budget hearing is this budget makes deeper cuts than the kind that can make -- prevent the next outbreak. Or as we seen with covid have us more prepared.
▶ 2:05:17Sec. Rubio: I don't agree with that assessment and I don't know who told you that of the state department.
▶ 2:05:22Sen. Booker: My time is limited. You mate -- no, Mr. secretary we
▶ 2:05:30Can Even Agree Sec. Rubio: On the facts.
▶ 2:05:33Sec. Rubio: Again you look at.
▶ 2:05:34Sen. Booker: It's not accurately cut early detection?
▶ 2:05:38Sec. Rubio: Those have been repurposed in different arrangements as an example.
▶ 2:05:42Sen. Booker: I would like for the record because we won't cover it in my short time. If you are telling me we are asking -- I would like to see the fact.
▶ 2:05:51Sec. Rubio: When these reforms are finalized we will be better prepared. We are responding today faster not just a humanitarian crisis but outbreak than we were before. We are responding with just within 72 hours able to move funds to task which you weren't able to do with the old system. We are building the capacity.
▶ 2:06:09Sen. Booker: May I please reclaim my time to shift gears. The strait of hormuz I was listening to the conversation with my colleagues. We now have the street closed for months and you explained that we are going to see an opening of the straight and ultimately the exchange we will get for that is after the fact we will release certain sanctions is that correct?
▶ 2:06:32Sec. Rubio: No that's not what I said. -- if they open the straight we will lift the blockade. The streets and the blockade are interrelated.
▶ 2:06:41Sen. Booker: So for the nuclear program in exchange for getting rid of the material out of country I imagine, we would really sanctions is that correct?
▶ 2:06:52Sec. Rubio: It's not just that it's also their enrichment activity. They would have to have very severe significant concessions on what they intend.
▶ 2:07:00Sen. Booker: And already with the relief of sanctions allowing iranians to sell oil to the chinese estimates have been between 10 and $15 million they got from that relaxing of sanctions. How much money might we see in a deal on the relaxing of sanctions for getting rid of the highly enriched uranium?
▶ 2:07:22Sec. Rubio: The sanctions we are on iran were boats on the water. That was already out on the market place. Sold at market rates. But the sanctions covered and to the extent we been able to enforce that we have the revenues of those sales. The iranian oil was on so it can be sold but the revenue would have to flow back which are sanctions were able to go after. We seized at least six vessels in the indo pacific that iranian sanction oil.
▶ 2:07:51Sec. Rubio: So that wasn't necessarily a trade they didn't get $50 billion directly as a result. They are now losing hundreds of millions of dollars a day in revenue because of the blockade and the blockade exists because of what they're doing in the straits.
▶ 2:08:05Sen. Booker: The conclusion I have in my time is expired is the strait of hormuz was open before this unjustified war. We are now scrambling to try and find a way to get it back open again. Not only is causing economic havoc to our country and residents around the nation trying to make ends meet. But you see on top of that the iranians finding ways to leverage that as we allowed them to do with the chinese were tens of billions of dollars.
▶ 2:08:36Sen. Booker: So my point is before we even get to a nuclear exchange grade this regime is getting money to rebuild and purchase more drones cause more havoc and this is before we are even trying to get back.
▶ 2:08:48Sec. Rubio: I don't understand how they're getting -- what revenue?
▶ 2:08:52Sen. Booker: What is the revenue from the chinese which is factually documented. And the revenue you're proposing we see -- they receive by releasing a highly enriched uranium as well as making a commitment about their enrichment capacity. And that was exact deal that you guys vilified with the president and you vilified president obama from having. We have a worse situation.
▶ 2:09:22Sen. Booker: We an adversary and enemy who is causing havoc in the region and is funding proxies of terrorists, has discovered thanks to you all, the power of shutting down the strait of hormuz. Clearly we all knew that a long time ago that's why this war should have never happened. You paid our adversary in a stronger negotiating position.
▶ 2:09:46Sen. Booker: Where the strongest nation on the planet earth and we are in a stalemate with iran and now we are begging to get back into a deal that you all trashed in the first place. Clearly this is.
▶ 2:09:57Chair Risch: Senator booker your time is out.
▶ 2:10:00Sec. Rubio: They go to the heart of the matter no one's begging for anything here. The iranians may be begging because their economy is losing hundreds of millions of dollars a day. Understand iran at street protests going on before all of this started. All of those factors economic factors of iran are far worse today than they were six months ago when those protests were happening. They have hyperinflation there currency is the value they are struggling to make payroll for government workers.
▶ 2:10:28Sec. Rubio: Iran is in a serious situation and if it was up to the political class there and there said everyone there is radical in some way but if it was up to the people who wear the suits and you see on tv they would probably make a deal tomorrow. The issue they are facing is the supreme leader the irgc core are more immune to those pressures until they'd be convinced otherwise. That's the direction they're moving in because the reality -- I do know where you getting this perception that iran is stronger. Iran has no navy left, they lost a substantial percentage of their advanced industrial base.
▶ 2:10:59Sec. Rubio: They've lost a substantial number of their missile launchers and the economy is far worse today and I mean far worse than it was six to nine months ago and they are looking at hundreds of billions of dollars in construction costs to get to where they were.
▶ 2:11:11Sen. Booker: You keep telling us how we are winning this war.
▶ 2:11:14Sec. Rubio: The war is over.
▶ 2:11:16Sen. Booker: The war is not over and get the american people see how we are losing at the pump with their costs and get this thing still hasn't been resolved. Every day he tweets out we've obliterated them and annihilated them, yet we still find ourselves spending billions of dollars a week.
▶ 2:11:33Chair Risch: Senator booker you have gone way over. Thank you senator booker. Senator scott.
▶ 2:11:42Sen. Scott: Secretary rubio, first off you think it's important americans that the iranian regime does not nuclear weapons and the ability to destroy.
▶ 2:11:49Sec. Rubio: It's important to the world. The whole world I mean, this question about the straight is great example. It gives them leverage imagine what nuclear weapons would do. At that point they wouldn't have to announce that were controlling they were just say we control the straits there's nothing you can do about it. You will have to pay us a toll for use international waterway from now on and you can do anything to us military because we will blow you up with a nuclear weapon. That's the leverage.
▶ 2:12:19Sec. Rubio: If they ever got a nuclear weapon not only would they have that and control the straits they would be able to act with impunity because we wouldn't be able to touch them. We would be able to do anything about it.
▶ 2:12:29Sen. Scott: Let's talk about latin america which support to a lot of people in our state. Thanks for what you've done with venezuela and cuba. -- let's do venezuela first. I think everyone I know is appreciative of what happened. And I know you have three step process to get to -- democracy there, you talk about where you are. I know -- we try to get delcy rodriguez to do the right thing. The prisoner still not released.
▶ 2:13:00Sen. Scott: So can you talk about the process?
▶ 2:13:02Sec. Rubio: I remind everybody what's today the second? Been five months. I don't seem like it was 10 years ago but it's been five months. I think venezuela is in a better place today and the trajectory that it was five months ago. Is it where it needs to be? The answer is of course no. Ultimately in order to truly transition they have to have multiparty free and fair elections but the conditions for free and fair elections of the following.
▶ 2:13:28Sec. Rubio: You have to have a free and open media and well you see independent journalists for the first time are activated again that has to exist. Political parties have to be given space and time to work this. The electoral -- the the national electoral council has to be reformed. It has members in it that will actually work. You have to have certain conditions in place. I'm not saying it's five years from now but five months. Here's what I can tell you for the first time certainly since 20 whatever.
▶ 2:13:58Sec. Rubio: The pre-chavez era maybe ever since the pre-chavez -- post chavez era, but oil from the country is not being stolen. The oil wealth is going directly to big government workers covered by medical equipment that is a significant advance that's not a permanent situation but a very valuable one today. You've seen reforms and for example the infamous prison has been closed.
▶ 2:14:24Sec. Rubio: We still have 400 something who we determined to be political prisoners we have many others that have been released including many high-profile ones. Using a reform a systemic reform of individuals in government. Replaced by new people. Some we don't know well, others we know a little bit about but certainly better than the people before. You see the level of cooperation on a couple of topics that I can even discuss in a setting like this but more than happy to talk to you about any of you about in the appropriate setting. I think that's positive.
▶ 2:14:55Sec. Rubio: By the way, you've seen the retrieval the U.S. with the full cooperation of the venezuelans went in and retrieved highly enriched uranium. They had highly enriched uranium from an old reactor program not because of nuclear weapons or anything they wanted out of their country and we were able to go in and retrieve that along with technician and went in. We have a functioning embassy.
▶ 2:15:18Sec. Rubio: We have direct flights for the first time and venezuelans are able to go back and not just visit relatives but to engage in the economic life of the country. All of that is to say it's been five months there is a lot more to go. This is not -- but what I will say is the venezuela that's there now does not pose a threat to the united states that it posed five months ago when it was an open base of operation for iranian operatives, for intelligence and others.
▶ 2:15:48Sec. Rubio: We use it as a base of operation against national interest. But we have a lot of work to do we are nowhere near done.
▶ 2:15:54Sen. Scott: Same thing about cuba.
▶ 2:15:57Sec. Rubio: The misnomer about pupil or the misunderstanding, cuba is not controlled by the government is controlled by a military, virtually owns anything on the tourist sector, avail the gas stations, they own everything. They generate about 70% of cuba's gdp. And they are sitting on between 14 and $17 billion in assets.
▶ 2:16:26Sec. Rubio: See you have people literally starving. A power grid that has not been maintained in 10 years you have this military company sitting on these assets. And not a penny of the money the military holding company translates over the public trust. So the fundamental challenges cuba needs to be in order for it to not be continued to be a failed state which poses a threat to the united states, they need systemic and serious reform.
▶ 2:16:50Sec. Rubio: We need to have economic reforms and the question is can they possibly reform given the people who are in charge of their government. I think the answers they can. I really don't believe this system is capable of reform. Unless new people take over or a new mindset takes over. We've engage in conversations with them and offered them what I think needs to happen for the economy to recover. That's the last point I will make. Raising this issue of the oil blockade.
▶ 2:17:19Sec. Rubio: Cuba was having blackouts well before january 3. They were having blackouts for years and they were having them for two reasons. Number one no one will give you free oil except the duro. What's changed as they are no longer getting free oil from venezuela and number two the main reason why they have energy blackouts is they didn't invest a single dollar back into plants. Back into improving their plants and they could've bought this a equipment from any company in the world but they didn't invested.
▶ 2:17:46Sec. Rubio: Instead they invested into failed tourist hotels that sit empty because there's no tourism. So cuba is a little more complicated than venezuela.
▶ 2:17:53Sen. Scott: Thanks for what you're doing.
▶ 2:18:00Sen. Duckworth: I trust you're familiar with then send, commander and future secretary of defense whose famous quote about the importance of funding our foreign policy apparatus. In 2013 in response to a question from the chairman of sask general matters pointed out if you don't find -- fund the state department fully that I need to buy more ammunition ultimately.
▶ 2:18:28Sen. Duckworth: Unfortunately despite his service in the first trumpet administration, the second time around you seem to have taken the message is a blueprint rather than a warning. The budget you're presenting today cuts the state department by about one third after you previously tried to enact steep cuts last year many of which on a bipartisan basis.
▶ 2:18:49Sen. Duckworth: Time and again this in administration uses military as a first tool of choice and new crises and conflicts abroad as well as for american people back here at home. And now you try to justify a budget request that further undermines implement -- the apparatus. The tools of aggression not only for preventing crises before they begin those responsible for negotiating our way out of more choice in iran. Based on how this may last year.
▶ 2:19:25Sen. Duckworth: You are learning to using force before alleviating price points for the war. I'm very concerned that that in turn increase the risk of our adversaries jumping to use force first increasing risk to american citizens around the world. We saw that instant with the military option the caribbean with nicolas maduro and I were still engaging the middle east or president trump is blowing a shocking amount of money and feeling troubled his solemn duty to not just to put service members at risk only for the most serious national risks.
▶ 2:19:59Sen. Duckworth: Mr. secretary you wear the hat of national security advisor. We both had that as secretary of state do you agree this administration has spent more on trump's war in iran than you are requesting today for this entire state department budget?
▶ 2:20:13Sec. Rubio: The department of war would have to speak to you about money and what they calculate on cost. I just I can give you an accurate answer on that.
▶ 2:20:20Sen. Duckworth: I would think you would have some some insight because you are national security advisor.
▶ 2:20:30Sec. Rubio: I see sector hegseth and others have conducted in their oversight committees. I just can't -- I don't want to give you an answer that's not accurate.
▶ 2:20:41Sen. Duckworth: The cost a present drums illegal war of choice -- choice in iran are likely to blow past $35. And surpass your fy 2027 budget request. For the state department and related programs. That's an astonishing figure. Worth repeating. In 14 weeks, 14 weeks present trouble blowing through as much if not more money in iran than he thinks congress should spend on U.S.
▶ 2:21:09Sen. Duckworth: Diplomacy for the entirety of the next fiscal year. This administration's disordered priorities have revealed a stark lesson for allies and partners. It will make them less secure as bill be caught in the crossfire. Mr. secretary do you agree under operation epic fury are allies and partners in the region have expressed concern about their security and the threats that follow from this administration's uncoordinated actions?
▶ 2:21:37Sec. Rubio: I think they've been very cooperative. Some aggressively like the uae as an example. Kuwait's been fantastic. No country likes to have their oil and energy infrastructure hit but it's a reminder of them the threat iran poses. It's reminded them that despite the friendly talk you've seen in the past how dangerous iran is to their own interests. Other billions of dollars iran has spent despite sanctions iran found the money to build drones and rockets.
▶ 2:22:05Sec. Rubio: Luckily we've taken them out but they still have some and the ability.
▶ 2:22:08Sen. Duckworth: It's on the allies expressing concerns because there's been public reporting in early may that saudi arabia and uae denied a flight over the plan for the strait of hormuz and are still not supportive of this plan in the street is worse off today than it was before trump initiated this war. It doesn't even touch on the wider global lessons for allies and partners.
▶ 2:22:34Sen. Duckworth: A dialog where I heard from folks across the indo pacific and in southeast asia being hit hard by the costs that are devastating communities. Frankly this administration insists on using military force as a first resort and set of a last resort. No matter the deadly concepts. Your budget request here would perpetuate that trend and undermine fulfilling secretary of state duties. I yield back.
▶ 2:22:58Sec. Rubio: I didn't get answer any of that.
▶ 2:23:00Sen. Duckworth: I didn't ask a question.
▶ 2:23:02Sec. Rubio: Can answer anyway? She made a bunch of boys to get answer them. Let me tell you, maybe you weren't here we were just talking about it we did a peace deal with azerbaijan and armenia. We signed the trip agreement yesterday or last week we signed it. That was diplomacy.
▶ 2:23:21Sen. Duckworth: That's great but the administration still blowing through. The entire budget.
▶ 2:23:27Chair Risch: Senator duckworth -- a let senator rubio reply to the statements that you made request. But we want we have a hard stop at 12:30.
▶ 2:23:38Sec. Rubio: But she said a lot of stuff I get to answer it. The second is india pakistan we ended that war. Thailand cambodia that's diplomacy. We've been very engaged. As I sit here now speaking to you I've got the lebanese government and israeli government meeting of the state
▶ 2:23:56Department Started A: 30 this morning for the fourth time after engaging last week. So we are carrying out. We are carrying out diplomacy all over the world constantly and very successfully. They'll let me make one more point that you raise about the budget request. We understand how this process works. We we, omb produces timelines for every agency to put forward a budget. We say this is the money we been allocated and how we will spend it.
▶ 2:24:24Department Started A: There's a congressional process which I'm sure you're aware of and in my time here I don't ever recall us once ever taking the president's budget and pass it into law. I'm not walking away from the budget we can make it work if that's the budget. But I have a sense a suspicion that we are going to have to work with you, that we will have to. That we will have to -- that we will have to work with you on the budget request that meets your priorities. That's how it works. You guys are the appropriators. We have to work within the confines.
▶ 2:24:54Department Started A: We will tell you what we care about and how we spend the money and ultimately you will provide us a spending bill and we will work through those parameters but we have given you what and we can make it work. You're obvious he can have changes here but this stuff about diplomacy and the money spent on the war. Diplomacy always cost less money we don't buy missiles, rockets large airplanes and aircraft carriers that we been very effective and I give you list after list of places.
▶ 2:25:21Department Started A: We have had an impact in either de-escalating crisis before they started or ending active wars and I'm proud of the work we've done. Some of which hasn't even been publicly discussed in some places because they weren't high-profile. And by last point we remain engaged in areas that may not be at the core of our national interest but are related to our national interest. You think about sudan for a moment. This has been a very frustrating situation put together but we help a donor conference they got pledges for that resolve.
▶ 2:25:50Department Started A: We put a lot of time and energy in a situation that unfortunately has turned into a proxy in the middle east because the uae and saudi's on opposite sides. In libya where a work has still divided but for the first time ever have a joint budget the first time ever are cooperating on energy deals that will be beneficial to the people of libya so I just don't think it's fair to say we are not actively involved in diplomacy. Because we are and we have been to great success.
▶ 2:26:16Chair Risch: Senator curtis.
▶ 2:26:20Sen. Curtis: Thank you for resetting the clock. Mr. secretary thank you for being here. And always truly impressed with your ability to navigate around the globe so articulately and explain positions like you previously chaired the subcommittee. One of the focuses is on taiwan and their relationship in the western hemisphere.
▶ 2:26:44Sen. Curtis: We had our first subcommittee hearing on taiwan's allies in the western hemisphere and as you well know honduras switched away from taiwan in 2020 three in exchange for promises from china no surprise those promises have not been fulfilled. In the current president and his campaign talked about returning back to taiwan and restoring that relationship with with taiwan.
▶ 2:27:09Sen. Curtis: In your budget you have $245 million for the countering prc influence fund. I would like to note senator van hollen I have a bill that would carve off a portion of that specifically for taiwan and countering p.r.c. Influence they. So, I guess my question is what can the U.S. to potentially with that fund countering p.r.c.
▶ 2:27:36Sen. Curtis: Influence for taiwan kickstarting that relationship while being in a joint set of economic priorities for taiwan in the western hemisphere.
▶ 2:27:57Sec. Rubio: Well first of all the reason these countries switch recognition primarily was because the chinese would go in and they would say if you switch recognition we will provide you this loan and in some cases there were even cases of bribery in cases of this nature. We will provide you with free this and free that we will build to an auditorium abridge a port. And they haven't cap many of those promises. The first thing is to point to the fact. In many cases these are not provided. The other angle is if it's loans their debt traps which his argument we made all over the world.
▶ 2:28:21Sec. Rubio: The broader goal of the fund is not just simply taiwan related although that's why -- that is an action we take as a result of the leverage that was established. More broader, in many cases these countries are trying to develop telecommunication system. They're trying to build roads and develop whatever it may be. And frankly the only countries who show up are chinese companies and they show up with lower costs of financing mechanism etc. Etc..
▶ 2:28:50Sec. Rubio: Now there's a track record for these projects. A track record of flooding the country with chinese workers. I think part of this fund is designed to create alternatives to that to these countries alternatives to the chinese and other foreign maligned influence that might be occurring in their country. Part of that is attracting U.S. commercial ventures to do it.
▶ 2:29:12Sec. Rubio: But part of it is providing the resources to these countries to go out and do this without being subject to or vulnerable to these leverage tactics used against them.
▶ 2:29:21Sen. Curtis: Let me switch to china for a minute. Budget notes the foreign service institute where state language training takes place and I'm hoping that came through the language capacity.
▶ 2:29:39Sen. Curtis: In the senate we picked up the weaker policy act, part of the bill especially I'm supportive of his supporting the language training for officers and that we have foreign service officers in asia and china that can speak that language.
▶ 2:29:59Sen. Curtis: I think it's absolutely vital they're able to understand the people their own language given your previous experience on this bill and the departments focus on the ccp impression do you still support this provision and can you speak how important this is?
▶ 2:30:17Sec. Rubio: It is not a widespread language around the world. It's valuable and important part of the world. I thing we want to see the language efficiency. That's generally been a challenge over a time period in one of the goals was to drive language more effectively and more quickly for different service offices. Obviously proficiency in certain languages is difficult to take. Some are harder to learn than others.
▶ 2:30:49Sec. Rubio: Especially if the base of the language just to give an example it's easy to learn italian if you speak spanish. It's much harder to learn mandarin or the weaker language for that matter. It is a priority for us and it's one by the way in our recruitment tools one of things we look for is whether potential candidates already bring an existing second or third language which is a huge benefit.
▶ 2:31:13Sen. Curtis: Very quickly can you clarify this opportunity the president speaking about hezbollah. Did you want to clarify for people what happened.
▶ 2:31:25Sec. Rubio: We we received communications the lebanese government on behalf of hezbollah sunday about that they would restrain from attacking territory of israel did not take strikes in beirut. And so it came from hezbollah but through lebanese authorities.
▶ 2:31:46Sen. Curtis: Thank you for being here today.
▶ 2:31:50Chair Risch: Senator rosen.
▶ 2:31:53Sen. Rosen: Thank you. Secretary rubio, I applaud the administration for facilitating a cease-fire last year between israel and gaza that will keep israel safe and prevent further hamas attack's and help palestinian civilians but I have serious questions about transparency and the funding for the so-called board of peace in light of recent reporting that suggests donor funds have been deposited into a private j.p.
▶ 2:32:25Sen. Rosen: Morgan account with no independent transparency mechanisms in place. As a member of the board of p's executive board and secretary of state, you should be in a position to provide us with some answers that you as a former senator know is our role try to get answers. But team's been asking for contact with the board of peace to do our due diligence but be received no response. Can you tell me who my team should be reaching out to?
▶ 2:32:50Sec. Rubio: I can now because it's finally hired some staff. Working out of the institute of peace building so for some time it was just a very lean operation.
▶ 2:33:01Sen. Curtis: Do you have a name.
▶ 2:33:04Sec. Rubio: I think they just hired staff.
▶ 2:33:10Sen. Rosen: I have a few other questions can tell me how much money is in the world bank administered board of peace fund?
▶ 2:33:15Sen. Rosen: I don't have that.
▶ 2:33:19Sen. Rosen: Can tell me how much 20's and the j.p. Morgan account?
▶ 2:33:23Sec. Rubio: Those are not government accounts.
▶ 2:33:26Sen. Rosen: Who has oversight?
▶ 2:33:29Sec. Rubio: That's -- that's the key here. Ultimately will be done especially comes U.S. dollar will be done by you in congress. We have not committed those funds yet although we made a pledge until they stood at the board of peace.
▶ 2:33:41Sen. Rosen: So congress will have oversight ability on the U.S. dollars. Can the money in the j.p. Morgan account be used to proffer the president or his family or anyone? And you said you just hired some folks deet -- only full-time personnel do you expect?
▶ 2:33:59Sec. Rubio: I think they started at five for they want to get 15 or 20.
▶ 2:34:04Sen. Rosen: Was the 50 million in U.S. taxpayer money your department wants to give to the board of peace is that can be used to cover this?
▶ 2:34:12Sec. Rubio: We ended up not doing that as a result of the way it was constructed. It's not built out as an international non-governmental organization.
▶ 2:34:22Sen. Rosen: We will follow you -- follow up with you on that one. During your conversation at budget hearings you committed to me you would support women and girls programming in the state department. Under your leadership you've terminated dozens of ward supporting women and girls who you've shuttered the office of global and women's issue.
▶ 2:34:43Sen. Rosen: You fire the entire staff and said regional bureaus will not be responsible for programs to support women and girls but my staff has asked every single regional bureau if they have a plan to do this and not a single bureau can provide me with an answer and so secretary rubio I'm so disappointed. I want to believe you did not lied to us or lied to me. So I will give you an opportunity to explain how women's issues have been integrated. To have an outline of a plan for that.
▶ 2:35:11Sec. Rubio: That's not accurate. Some regional bureaus of a larger mandate on those issues. In europe it's probably less intense.
▶ 2:35:19Sen. Rosen: Who on your team can we reach out to. They are telling us they don't know.
▶ 2:35:24Sec. Rubio: The regional bureaus tell you they don't know? Not only in terms of that portfolio but most of our embassies in these places.
▶ 2:35:34Sen. Rosen: Can I call you have a conversation because somehow.
▶ 2:35:38Sec. Rubio: We simply felt -- there's a different route in the women's issues for example in africa versus what you're facing.
▶ 2:35:47Sen. Rosen: Can name a program you stood up since that office was closed.
▶ 2:35:52Sec. Rubio: Almost everyone of our programs we do now or humanitarian response to crises. Our food programs we distributed. All of them have a women's component to them primarily because in these societies women of the first one affected.
▶ 2:36:08Sec. Rubio: Each of these bureaus has more than one case.
▶ 2:36:12Sen. Rosen: There is an international women program you in the first lady have champion. Will you commit to maintaining that? The women of courage program. You and the first lady have champion that.
▶ 2:36:26Sec. Rubio: We had an award ceremony last year I don't know what scheduled for this year.
▶ 2:36:30Sen. Rosen: With the remainder of my time I would like to remind the american people as the secretary of state your main duty is america's chip -- chief diplomat is to maintain a relationship with foreign nations. This is why am shocked to see you were at a party with president trump in miami instead set of accompanying vice president vance to pakistan for negotiations.
▶ 2:36:51Sec. Rubio: What party was that.
▶ 2:36:54Sen. Rosen: It was probably reported and there are photos there.
▶ 2:36:58Sec. Rubio: You're to say that I'm an answer that question. That's a statement.
▶ 2:37:02Sen. Rosen: After I finish my paragraph he can finish an answer. Steve witkoff and jared kushner both of whom were never confirmed by this body to be america's diplomats accompanied the vice president to negotiations even iran's foreign minister was there and yet you were not. I feel that is embarrassing for us and for you. Mr. secretary congress represents the american people. We have the power who represents america abroad.
▶ 2:37:33Sen. Rosen: We confirmed you to be our secretary of state. We confirmed you to be in the negotiations that are happening. It is unthinkable to me that you are not -- you are missing high-stakes negotiations were not involved. Thank you.
▶ 2:37:46Chair Risch: Your time is up senator rosen.
▶ 2:37:50Sec. Rubio: You are 100% accurate and 100 percent wrong. The vice president of the united states was there and he wasn't confirmed by the senate he was that she was elected by the american people. A second line to the presence united states pretty was present. Mr. witkoff is a presence envoy for negotiations on peace deals. Mr. kushner is a private citizen and advisor on functions. They were the team was sent to pakistan. I was not at a party. Where was was next to the president.
▶ 2:38:16Sec. Rubio: In the midst of those negotiations I was in communications with them and in fact I think there's been reporting for that evening on how multiple occasions I went into a back room I came back out and spoke to the president and was constantly updating him on that evening I spoke to Mr. kushner in our negotiating team Mr. witkoff on at least six occasions going twice on a secure line from a phone we had access to. You don't know what you're talking about.
▶ 2:38:38Chair Risch: Senator rosen he has the floor.
▶ 2:38:42Sec. Rubio: I know your staff are they cute statement for your tiktok but it's not true it's not accurate. In the midst of high-stakes negotiations so I could immediately inform him about events occurring halfway around the world. I was where I needed to be at that moment as we are very capable team on the ground in pakistan led by the vice president. Led by the vice president of the united states.
▶ 2:39:05Chair Risch: Thank you. Senator cornyn.
▶ 2:39:09Sen. Cornyn: Secretary rubio I've heard some of my colleagues here on this committee suggest that the U.S. started a war with the iranian regime 92 days ago. I happen to believe the iranian regime started a war against the west and israel and has -- been at war with us since 1979. What's your view?
▶ 2:39:31Sec. Rubio: You go back to 1979 and the taking of hostages and build it out from there. I don't know the numbers it's incalculable. Thousands of people around the world including many americans have been killed because of direct iranian action. All the ied's, roadside bombs but maimed and killed soldiers were all the mastermind work of the irgc for decades.
▶ 2:39:55Sec. Rubio: The irgc sponsored terrorist attacks all over the planet in fact they were involved for example in the bombing of the jewish center in argentina tonight 93 to 1994. Consistently. We now have people convicted, convicted in the united states of america one was arrested yesterday iranian agents plotting the assassination of american political leaders including the president of the united states. They have been waging nonstop not to mention their massive sponsorship of hamas, hezbollah and all the activities those groups undertake.
▶ 2:40:25Sec. Rubio: You're absolutely right that the iranian system has been waging war on the west but why is anybody in the united states in specific for over three decades but why is anyone surprised they openly chant openly chant death to america death to israel. They openly say israel is a little satan but we are the big satan. At some point when people say this repeatedly you look at the rhetoric and their actions back it up it's a very dangerous regime.
▶ 2:40:49Sec. Rubio: The notion they would ever possess nuclear weapons that people are willing to conduct those kinds of terrorist attacks would ever possess a nuclear weapon is unbearable and unacceptable. And it's lucky to happen under president trump.
▶ 2:41:03Sen. Cornyn: Since the iranian nuclear program started and basically blocked the iaea and other civilian inspections would require the monitored use of enriched uranium we had president's democrat and republican say that an iranian nuclear weapon was unacceptable. It took president trump to actually do something about it.
▶ 2:41:32Sen. Cornyn: -- it is shocking to me to hear some of our colleagues suggest that there was not an imminent threat from an iranian nuclear weapon. You and I both sat on the senate intelligence committee talking about the details. But we knew they continue to enrich to the point where they produce a nuclear weapon within a specified time.
▶ 2:41:55Sen. Cornyn: There was some debate on how long that breakout would take but the idea that an iranian nuclear program did not present an imminent threat to the united states to me is just ludicrous. And I think it defies all evidence to the contrary but do you think if they had acquired a nuclear weapon that that would change the ability of the U.S. and our allies like israel to deal with this nuclear armed iran.
▶ 2:42:21Sec. Rubio: I think if they acquired a nuclear weapon given the theological nature of the decision-making, but but just as problematic is at that point their options are what you could do about it are quite limited in their ability to hold the world hostage.
▶ 2:42:37Sen. Cornyn: Like north korea for example.
▶ 2:42:41Sec. Rubio: But worse. They would be better funded they would decide the had the dutch they own the strait of hormuz forever. They would be able to act with impunity. They would sponsor hezbollah, they would hyper scale their efforts of global terrorism and completely try to drive us out of the region and ultimately destroy the state of israel. They have a nuclear weapon that would threaten to blow people up.
▶ 2:43:08Sen. Cornyn: Notwithstanding the importance of denying them a nuclear weapon, I do applaud the president's attempt to try and use some diplomacy here and work to deny them access to the enriched uranium and other weapons that they use against israel and the west. But tell me why do you think anything the uranian regime agrees to that they will comply with?
▶ 2:43:37Sen. Cornyn: What evidence is there that they will agree to anything that they ultimately will stick with.
▶ 2:43:42Sec. Rubio: That's why any deal you have to enter with a clearly verifiable steps. Simply putting something -- simply putting something on a piece of paper is not satisfactory. You have to commit to doing it and give it. That's our view of it. Any concessions that are made and I don't even call them concessions per say but any arrangements made with iran have to, not after the agree to certain things but do certain things. I don't think this talked about enough.
▶ 2:44:11Sec. Rubio: If what iran wants his nuclear energy for their country there mechanisms. Their countries all over the world that that are -- that have nuclear energy but they don't enrich. This early don't enriched a 60%. They don't do it hidden in about an buried somewhere. With what they want is nuclear energy they can have it. There are mechanisms for it. The problem is not the one nuclear energy. It's that everything they do is consistent with the activities of a nation that seeks to develop nuclear weapons.
▶ 2:44:40Chair Risch: Thank you. Senator schatz.
▶ 2:44:47Sen. Schatz: We will walk the list that we talked about a couple weeks ago on a conference call. I want you to sort of answer the china watchers who saw that visit to china and saw that nvidia's now can the cell eye says our highest technology but it's better than what china has and that's why people are worried.
▶ 2:45:12Sen. Schatz: And that it's pretty plain that the president violated one of the six assurances. I understand that the ambassador and you and others have sort of followed up to kind of smooth the edges but it is pretty clear he says we discussed arm sales in great detail. It depends on china, it's a very good negotiating chip for us.
▶ 2:45:38Sen. Schatz: So what do you say to china watchers who say they have some pretty good deliverables and we did not get much.
▶ 2:45:55I Sec. Rubio: Don't see -- the trip, additional boeing aircraft benefits the chinese as well that helps our companies and the agricultural concessions. The trip was largely about the fact the two largest most powerful countries in the world have to have direct interaction with one another and this was an opportunity to do it. Xi will recep get by visiting the U.S. later this -- later next year. Maybe in response to one of the questions but I think two things are clear. One is we are entering a period of strategic stability it in benefits both countries.
▶ 2:46:25I Sec. Rubio: A largely stabilizing event in the indo pacific. But there are clear differences in priorities, clear irritants that relationship that is long-standing and long-term. So critical minerals dependencies, things of this nature. So it's one of those relationships it's going to require deft diplomacy and ensure decision-making.
▶ 2:46:45Sen. Schatz: This is why I like our engagement. That makes sense to me but it seems to be of the main objective is to touch gloves and initiate conversation then why give away any of the things they are already seeking in exchange for nothing. You're basically saying it's better to talk about two. I agree with that.
▶ 2:47:15Sen. Schatz: But I don't understand what they're selling at second-best chips. At least complicate. We will stay in the asia-pacific region. The marshals the philippines south korea says the energy crisis is a warlike situation. Been around a long time on this committee.
▶ 2:47:41Sen. Schatz: It is always the case something in the middle east undermines our ability to project power in the asia-pacific region. It's not just a question of opportunity costs and potential challenges. Now they are talking about allies in the asia-pacific region. Taking it on the chin. What do we say that. Just hang in there?
▶ 2:48:05Sec. Rubio: A couple points and is one of the steps were taken and one of the steps we've taken around the world. Whether it's popular. For a limited. Of time. Though they don't enjoy the revenue of it.
▶ 2:48:32Sec. Rubio: And that's while the strait of hormuz provides 20% of the world olson -- oil supply it's probably 80 to 90% of the supply of the indo pacific. One of things will come out as a result of that. Is more diversification including from the united states potentially japan and other countries in the region. But the project timeline.
▶ 2:48:56Sec. Rubio: That's like cold comfort if you're running a country and your gasoline and fertilizer and all the input prices skyrocketed because of president trump's decision to go to war with the country clear across the world.
▶ 2:49:12Sec. Rubio: I understand your point and all these questions we are getting these about us. I don't think it's fair because ultimately the people who close the strait of hormuz are iran and their doing so in violation of every international body you can imagine. Everyone is against them. We have I think a record number 140 cosponsors of the um on this resolution that hasn't come up for a vote yet to condemn what they are doing.
▶ 2:49:34Sen. Schatz: Nobody's defending what they are doing. We are saying this was not just predictable it was predicted. This is what everybody said, expert in foreign policy you could literally put in to an llm and say what will happen if we take kinetic action against iran in the first thing that would pop out as they will probably close the strait of hormuz.
▶ 2:49:58Sen. Schatz: So it is shocking to me the degree to which this administration expresses shock at the thing that everybody said was going to happen and up happening.
▶ 2:50:06Sec. Rubio: The reverse of that is so the alternative is to say that we have to go ahead and let iran develop a nuclear weapon or they'll close the streets for mous. I mean at some point you have to take action on the situation. Understanding there will be a reaction but it cannot be iran will always have the ability to threaten the straits. You don't need much sophistication to threaten commercial vessels. You know dropping mines by the way it's not just around the can do it.
▶ 2:50:33Sec. Rubio: The hoput the hopuuthis can do it in the red sea. It's a fundamental challenge. Do we just have to let iran go ahead and develop a nuclear weapon because of their threat to close the straits of hormuz? That is an untenable situation. I will see him tomorrow so don't worry.
▶ 2:50:56Chair Risch: We, I know your spouse have a hard stop at 12: 30. Senator cruz has been patient. One more bite of the apple.
▶ 2:51:12Sen. Cruz: I will say Mr. secretary since you left the senate I've been obliged to give it to the meetings as you left me is the only cuban american left behind. So, by. Let me start by saying with president trump's decision to strike iran was the most consequential decision it is second term as president.
▶ 2:51:34Sen. Cruz: And I want to commend you and the president and the entire administration of the extraordinary success we have seen in less than 40 days, the united states has utterly and completely destroyed the military and nuclear infrastructure the iranian regime spent nearly 50 years building. Every day that passes increases american leverage, iran is weaker, poorer and more isolated than it's been in decades.
▶ 2:52:02Sen. Cruz: The president has laid out four red lines for any resolution of this military conflict. Number one that there be zero enrichment by iran. Number two that they hand over all of their enriched uranium. Number three, that they stop funding terrorist worldwide. And number four that they open the strait of hormuz. I agree with all four of those.
▶ 2:52:27Sen. Cruz: Do you agree with those red lines and how achievable do you believe they are in the coming weeks and months.
▶ 2:52:35Sec. Rubio: You stated the core positions the president has taken accurately in the entire administration. That's where we take our directors from the president and personally during my time in the senate it's been consistent with my thinking. I would only reverse in the following order. The straits of hormuz would have to come first. What they're doing is unlawful and illegal. That has to open immediately in exchange for anything else.
▶ 2:53:02Sec. Rubio: We have a blockade on a iranian oil and the reason why we have a blockade on a radiant is because they close the straits. If they open it, under say will be her saying it's your doctor to threaten commercial vessels of civilians and create ecological disaster. It's unlawful, it's illegal and outrageous. Every country in the world condemns it. They ever that we lift the blockade. Then we go to the second phase which is the nuclear question.
▶ 2:53:30Sec. Rubio: On enrichment they don't need to enrich. If what they want is a nuclear energy program that can have one without enrichment. Someone had a few questions saying were working on a similar jcpoa. Jcpoa would've expired this year and allowed them to keep all the enriched uranium equipment they need. Clearly that equipment can get them to 60 to 90% because they've done that. As a result of it. So we would have to do without question. And deal with the highly enriched uranium.
▶ 2:53:59Sec. Rubio: The only reason to have 60% enriched uranium is to turn it to 90% enriched uranium. So those remained about the sponsor of terrorism absolutely. To the point where I would argue it's one of the interesting things that's happening. It's one of the most erotic situations of the world. The lebanese government of the israeli government can do a peace deal tomorrow. Israel has no territorial claims in lebanon. Hezbollah is because the overthrow of the current lebanese government.
▶ 2:54:29Sec. Rubio: The impediment in lebanon is the fact hezbollah has abetted itself into the country and is the reason for all the suffering that's happening right now and all the suffering that historically happen. Entirely funded entirely controlled by iran. There is no hezbollah without a rod. There is no hezbollah without a rod. There might be a political movement with ideology but they don't have a bunch of rockets. Without a rod. They are complete and total proxy of iran. I want to come back to has belied a moment.
▶ 2:55:00Sec. Rubio: Focusing for a second on a rod itself. For some time I have urged the administration and urged israel to arm protesters in iran. I don't think it is fair to expect the iranian people to stand up, protesters stand up with roxie and soldiers with machine guns. Are we arming the protesters and should we? I'm not aware of any program to arm civilians in iran.
▶ 2:55:28Sec. Rubio: There may be other countries doing it or other elements but certainly not the U.S. government. Let's let's go back to hezbollah. You spoke with the lebanese president over the weekend. You know the state department sent out an email to journalists shortly after your call in which the state department spokesperson said "iran wants to prolong the conflict in lebanon so it can claim credit for saving the day."
▶ 2:55:58Sec. Rubio: That didn't strike me as accurate. I don't think iran wants to keep the conflict going in lebanon. I think they desperately want israel to stop killing hezbollah. Do you agree with that?
▶ 2:56:09Sec. Rubio: The point they're trying to make is we doing the lebanon israeli talks as separate and distinct from iran. What they want to do is put it all together. There is a government of lebanon. That's who we are dealing with. Hezbollah is not there equal in terms of who we will be dealing with or who needs to be in charge. The point we're trying to make is that's what iran is trying to stifle.
▶ 2:56:34Sec. Rubio: Stymie any effort in which israel lebanon work together and prolong it so if an agreement is reached in the future they can claim credit for having forced it through leverage. And that's why you see for example has agreed to a cease-fire about a week ago and immediately violated it within hours.
▶ 2:56:53Sen. Cruz: You would agree every has blood tariffs the idf kills makes america safer.
▶ 2:57:00Sec. Rubio: The question is how do you do what the demilitarized and defanged of hezbollah while strengthening legitimate government of lebanon. That's been the challenge for a long time and that remains a challenge now. The capabilities are not where they need to be. But there are also elements that are not where they need to be because they have facilitated some cases to cooperate with hezbollah.
▶ 2:57:29Sec. Rubio: I put you back to two things that have happened in the last few months. The lebanese government expelled the iranian ambassador because of hezbollah. Iranian ambassador says I'm not leaving. That's number one. The second thing just a week ago hezbollah openly called for the overthrow of the lebanese government. No one here should be under any. Hezbollah is an enemy of lebanon and of the lebanese people.
▶ 2:57:58Chair Risch: Thank you senator cruz. Secretary rubio you've been very generous with your time. For the information members remain open until the close of business tomorrow june 3. With that the committee is adjourned.