▶ 0:16:12Chair Capito: Good morning, everyone. It is nice to see you, particularly you, director nesvik. Thank you for coming back. We appreciate having you here today. The trump administration's fiscal year fy 20 27 budget request for the fish and wildlife service reflects a return to a commonsense approach to carrying out the services mission, expanding access to public lands.
▶ 0:16:41Chair Capito: I am appreciative that under your leadership the service is showcasing natural refuges by expanding access for recreation. We know our hunters and anglers are avid conservationists and their work represents -- supports recreational tourism opportunities in local communities across the state, especially in my state of west virginia and I'm sure your home state of wyoming is the same.
▶ 0:17:11Chair Capito: A continued strong relationship between wildlife agencies and conservation partners is paramount. This collaboration led to the reintroduction of elk in west virginia after we lost our population in the mid-1800s. I'm glad to see the services prioritize state-led conservation efforts under this administration. Strong acts from congress also led to wins for our wildlife and conservation efforts.
▶ 0:17:42Chair Capito: The american conservations enhancement reauthorization act reauthorized important efforts such as the north american wetlands conservation act, national fish and wildlife service foundation establishment act, national fish habitat partnership, and chesapeake bay program, one I am particularly interested in.
▶ 0:18:01Chair Capito: It authorized funding for this service to address emerging wildlife diseases such as chronic wasting disease, protect livestock from predators and combat invasive species. I look forward to hearing about the service's efforts to implement the ace act and other laws passed by congress. The congress has the task of protecting endangered species and ensuring americans can experience the beauty of our nation for generations to come.
▶ 0:18:30Chair Capito: The service should carry out its mission without necessarily slowing down or halting projects as done under previous administrations. I've long spoken about the issues with the endangered species act and how it is implemented by the service. The experiences of public and private entities within the section seven consultation process in west virginia are prime examples of why esa reform is so important.
▶ 0:19:00Chair Capito: Several years ago my staff began holding monthly calls with the field office because of delays with the consultation processes for critical projects. As a result progress has been made and many of these projects have started moving forward. Under your leadership director nesvik there are fewer projects facing delays and that needs to be discussed on these calls. I'm appreciative of all that you and your team has done to facilitate that outcome.
▶ 0:19:29Chair Capito: We talked about that when we met last week. Under the trump administration the service is striving to better balance species protection and conservation with the economic development needs of all communities including returning the esa to it's intended purpose something I've long supported. Requesting additional funding for priority recovery activities in the agency's fy 27 budget request.
▶ 0:19:58Chair Capito: I was pleased to see the service is requesting an increase in funding for energy project reviews including the development and use of programmatic tools to automate esa compliance known as the information for planning and consultation systems or ipac. It has dramatically cut down the time frames for section seven consultations.
▶ 0:20:24Chair Capito: Recently, the service issued a final rule designating over one million acres of critical habitat for the bumblebee across six states including west virginia. Your team briefed my staff on the world and I appreciate how quickly your team provided this information. I appreciate the balance. The recent decision out of the D.C.
▶ 0:20:50Chair Capito: Court that invalidated the 2020 programmatic biological opinion issued by the service for the office of surface mining reclamation program. This decision will negatively affect coal production in the 24 states that have primacy, that includes my state. I'm extremely disappointed by this court decision and concerned about what it will mean for projects in my state moving forward. Director nesvik, thank you for being here.
▶ 0:21:19Chair Capito: I look forward to hearing how you intend to build on the progress you've made and your plans for the months ahead. Ranking member whitehouse, I recognize you for your opening statement.
▶ 0:21:29Sen. Whitehouse: Thank you, very much, madam chair. Mr. nesvik, welcome. The fish and wildlife service is our nation's oldest conservation agency dating back to 1871. It is the only agency whose primary responsibility is to conserve and protect america's wildlife. A big job for a small agency. Our conservation agencies have been staffed with the best.
▶ 0:22:00Sen. Whitehouse: Scientists with the decades of experience and expertise have flourished at the fish and wildlife service, ensuring that generations of americans can exist on the same planet as the california condor, the bald eagle, the monk seal, and others. These responsibilities are not to be taken lightly.
▶ 0:22:20Sen. Whitehouse: I am deeply disheartened by the antics over the past year compounded by the administration's proposed 20% funding cut for next year. There are reports that the fish and wildlife service has lost as much as a quarter of its staff.
▶ 0:22:41Sen. Whitehouse: The doggy boys chased out nearly 1800 employees, purging at least 530 biologists and over 100 regional senior staff. These people cannot be readily replaced. Experts with a deep institutional and species knowledge dedicated to protecting the wildlife of our country.
▶ 0:23:04Sen. Whitehouse: In response to questions for the record from your confirmation hearing you stated that you spent your career, I am quoting, working closely with scientists on wildlife issues and you, quoting again, deeply value their expertise, commitment, and contributions. I very much doubt the 530 staff biologists who left the agency felt deeply valued. The proposed funding cuts won't help.
▶ 0:23:32Sen. Whitehouse: Not cutting all funding for endangered species conservation, including iconic species such as elephants, rhinos, and great apes. Not cutting science support that provides assistance to local communities for wildlife and habitat conservation. Not cutting state and tribal grants which help fund a fish and wildlife before they require protection.
▶ 0:23:58Sen. Whitehouse: In your conservation -- confirmation hearing you spoke about cooperative federalism, but your budget goes out of its way to provide fewer resources to our states. Most managers at our nation's wildlife refuges report that they don't have the resources and staff to fulfill their missions. Democrats and republicans are eager to see the permitting process move faster. Fish and wildlife service staff often play key role in permitting.
▶ 0:24:29Sen. Whitehouse: How do we expedite permitting processes if staff and resources are not there? Nope also let fish and wildlife get wrapped up in the administration's fraudulent work on low cost, clean energy. This administration blockades clean energy on purpose to drive electric grids to more expensive fossil fuel units.
▶ 0:24:53Sen. Whitehouse: A massive wealth transfer, billions of dollars from family pocketbooks to trump's big fossil fuel donors. Payback with consumers' money. Your ipaq database helps determine if a project could protect a species. They have received bipartisan praise.
▶ 0:25:18Sen. Whitehouse: In july of last year you banned wind and solar projects from using the online ipac system. Who does that help? Developers can once again access the system but thanks to a court order. The pattern at doi remains, to abuse every process to stall clean energy projects.
▶ 0:25:46Sen. Whitehouse: This is especially irritating coming from you as the former director of the wyoming game and fish department. Wind power accounts for about 20% of wyoming's electricity generation. Surely in your time is the director you saw how helpful this database was for your state. In closing, I am reminded of this image.
▶ 0:26:15Sen. Whitehouse: Displaying the biomass of mammals on earth. Humans, sheep, cattle, buffalo, goats, pigs, wild animals. 5% of the earth's biomass. 95% of earth's mammals are humans, livestock, and pets.
▶ 0:26:45Sen. Whitehouse: In your 5% of memo biomass on earth is still wild. -- minimal biomass honor this to well. We are living through a crash, often called the sixth mass extinction. This mass extinction is unique because it is being driven primarily by human activity, climate change, deforestation, habitat destruction, pollution, overexploitation, and more.
▶ 0:27:11Sen. Whitehouse: We need to do better by what wildlife remains. That is your job at the fish and wildlife service. Zeroing out wildlife conservation funding for imperiled and iconic species does not help.
▶ 0:27:30Sen. Whitehouse: Invoking the god squad to remove endangered species act protections from, for instance, the rices whale, o which 50 are left to promote more oil and gas development does not help. Mr. nesvik, generations will look back to understand why species on your watch went the way of the dodo.
▶ 0:27:57Sen. Whitehouse: How much of god's creation must be a sacrifice to the fossil fuel industry? Right now, it is not a good look. Thank you, chairman.
▶ 0:28:09Chair Capito: Thank you, senator whitehouse. This morning we are joined by the honorable brian nesvik, director of the U.S. fish and wildlife service. I look forward to hearing from director nesvik about the service's proposed budget for fiscal year 2027 and the implementation of current programs through the end of the year. Thank you for being here. Before we move forward I will administer the oath to receive your sworn testimony.
▶ 0:28:38Chair Capito: If you would please stand and raise your right hand and answer the following questions. Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give this committee is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth so help you god? Thank you. Let the record show that the witness answered in the affirmative. So, we will now proceed. Director nesvik, you are recognized for your opening statement.
▶ 0:29:02Mr. Nesvik: Good morning, chairman capital, ranking member whitehouse, members of the committee I am brian nesvik. It is good be back with this committee again. I appreciate the opportunity to testify on president trump's fy 20 seven budget request for the fish and wildlife service.
▶ 0:29:21Mr. Nesvik: The budget requests 1.3 billion dollars for the service in fy 27 presenting new opportunities for a future driven by innovation, dedicated to optimizing sustainable use of our natural resources and reflects our commitment to delivering efficient and superior service to the american people. In line with president trump's leadership, the service' is reflects a proactive approach to unleashing american energy dominance through effective and efficient implementation of the endangered species act.
▶ 0:29:49Mr. Nesvik: The fy 27 budget proposes an increase of 5.1 million dollars for esa section seven consultations for energy projects. With this funding, the service will be able to accelerate the review of priority energy projects, and we anticipate being able to reduce consultation time frames from 30 to 14 days. The budget reflects a commitment to the recovery of listed species, requesting a two point $6 million increase for work to support the development of recovery plans, five-year status reviews, and rulemakings.
▶ 0:30:18Mr. Nesvik: At this funding level we expect to be able to finalize 15 down listing rules in 2027. We are requesting a 19.7 billion dollar increase for prior recovery activities including implementation of a new multiyear recovery initiative. This effort would catalyze activities outlined in recovery plans for priority species. The budget also includes a request for resources and authority to integrate the national marine fisheries service officer protected resources into the service.
▶ 0:30:50Mr. Nesvik: The unification will streamline permitting activities and ensure consistent implementation of the endangered species act and marine mammal protection act. The fy 27 budget aligns with presidential and territorial priorities to enhance america's access to public lands and foster outdoor recreation. In may the service announced the largest expansion of hunting and fishing opportunities in the agency's history.
▶ 0:31:15Mr. Nesvik: The proposal would open or expand 1450 new hunting or fishing opportunities across 32 states. The proposed expansion reflects the trump administration's commitment to american hunters and anglers, supporting rural economies, and fostering community engagement. It supports effective implementation of these new opportunities. It also includes an increase of 2.5 million dollars for visitor services at wildlife refuges.
▶ 0:31:42Mr. Nesvik: This funding will allow us to better support gateway communities and facilitate high-quality recreational opportunities through an increased access. This investment emphasizes the role of hunting and fishing activities as the backbone of the north american model of wildlife conservation. To provide safety and security for the visiting public, the budget request to say 3 million dollars increase for refuge law enforcement.
▶ 0:32:05Mr. Nesvik: The service's federal wildlife officers are charged with protecting refuge resources but also to combat drug trafficking, dress border security, and aid and other security challenges. The service's infrastructure projects also help millions of visitors to experience our national treasures and to support american jobs. This budget allocates roughly $113 million for refugee system maintenance and $40 million for new construction projects.
▶ 0:32:30Mr. Nesvik: This request reflects the service's ongoing efforts to prioritize safety and accessibility while addressing important maintenance needs. The president's fy 27 budget also proposes reauthorizing president trump's great american outdoors act legacy restoration fund. Reauthorization of gaoa will allow efficient message to address priority deferred maintenance needs.
▶ 0:32:57Mr. Nesvik: Infrastructure investments under a reauthorized will enhance operational efficiency and improve recreational access and service delivery, reduced liabilities associated with deferred maintenance, and help to ensure the facilities on public lands meet the needs of visitors and communities.
▶ 0:33:13Mr. Nesvik: In conclusion the budget is intended to enable the service to deliver superior service to the american people come to look towards innovation not regulation, improve application of the endangered species act, embrace our state and tribal wildlife partners, and improve our national wildlife refuge system. Thank you for the opportunity to testify and I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:33:33Chair Capito: Thank you. I will start off with the questions. I would like to go do something I alluded to. The U.S. district court of columbia vacating the biological opinion that governs consultations under the endangered species act for coal mining activities in states that have primacy. This is very problematic for my state in particular.
▶ 0:34:04Chair Capito: As you know we have experienced considerable delays with the esa during the previous administration. Drive your commitment to work with the office of surface mining state regulators including west virginia's epa on the mining industry on a path forward that allows esa consultations to take place in an efficient manner to avoid unnecessary delays in the permitting process after this court decision?
▶ 0:34:34Chair Capito: If you have any other thoughts on this as well?
▶ 0:34:36Mr. Nesvik: As you mentioned, this is a recent development, pretty recent court decision. We are aware that in the department of interior and have already begun looking at what the options may be in order to ensure this doesn't disrupt our abilities to issue those permits that previously stay primacy was able to address.
▶ 0:34:58Mr. Nesvik: I don't have specific options identified here today, but please know we are working on those. Myself as well as senior officials in the department are very well aware.
▶ 0:35:10Chair Capito: We will look forward to working with that in keeping close communication. In my opening statement I mentioned the successful bipartisan reauthorization of the ace act. We haven't had a chance to really talk about the implementation at this committee level. Can you provide us with an update on the implementation including what is working well and any challenges that you may have encountered?
▶ 0:35:34Mr. Nesvik: Certainly. First of all, specifically with the national fish habitat partnerships we have 20 different partnerships. This is a great opportunity to deliver conservation on the ground, habitat work, and increase public access.
▶ 0:35:56Mr. Nesvik: We have these issues with wildlife conflict identified in the ace act and were able to take steps to help livestock producers having degradation problems. That work is underway. We identified we send our delivering that in the field now. Certainly along the lines of wildlife disease we have worked with our state partners to look at ways, new and innovative ways, to address wildlife diseases, as you mentioned.
▶ 0:36:26Mr. Nesvik: I don't have any concerns with implementation and know that it is ongoing.
▶ 0:36:33Chair Capito: Great. I want to ask about the ipac project planning tool. We had testimony in previous meetings -- it is coming, it will happen, and it was getting delayed, and had great promise to make the permitting process or the consultation process more efficient.
▶ 0:37:00Chair Capito: Can you describe the success of the ipac planning tool and how additional funding in the budget will help that? I would give you a chance. I know the ranking member manchin and was cut out of the best ranking member mentioned something was cut out of the ipac process. If you could mention that as well.
▶ 0:37:25Mr. Nesvik: Ipac has been a game changer, as you alluded to. Our partners who use ipac are very interested in seeing it continued. There are opportunities to enhance it and make it more efficient and usable.
▶ 0:37:44Mr. Nesvik: In west virginia 80% of the projects and additionally submitted through ipac are approved immediately. With improvements to ipac we believe we can cut down permitting timelines by half. There is interest within the department. As you indicated there are lots of support for moving forward with ipac. I believe we can do better, particularly by focusing on it, on these improvements.
▶ 0:38:14Mr. Nesvik: You know, specific to the ranking member's questions regarding clean energy projects, I think folks are aware this administration directed a review process for all energy projects and part of that review process included initially a prohibition from those particular energy proponents from being able to spend their energy projects.
▶ 0:38:45Mr. Nesvik: Those reviews are unknowing and I don't have much more on that.
▶ 0:38:50Chair Capito: Ok. I will go ahead and turn to the ranking member.
▶ 0:38:57Sen. Whitehouse: Well, let's stay on that subject for a moment. I think you are now required to provide that data to solar and wind projects by court order. That is stabilized, correct?
▶ 0:39:11Mr. Nesvik: Correct.
▶ 0:39:12Sen. Whitehouse: You indicated in your testimony to us you intended to reduce informal endangered species act consultation time frames from 30 to 14 days informal esa consultation time frames from 135 to 30 days? Is that goal applicable also to clean energy projects?
▶ 0:39:37Mr. Nesvik: So, the current direction that we provided regarding clean energy projects has not changed with the exception of changes we made in response to the court decision that you referenced. At a time when those projects were moved through ipac it would apply the same.
▶ 0:39:59Sen. Whitehouse: To be clear, if you are successful in reducing the informal consultation time frame to 14 days and the formal consultation time to 30 days that would apply equally to wind and solar projects? They would also receive the benefit of those time reductions?
▶ 0:40:23Mr. Nesvik: Yes, senator. Any projects admitted through ipac working its way through this process would, would have the same timelines under ipac.
▶ 0:40:36Sen. Whitehouse: Thank you. When we first spoke in your conservation hearings I pointed out you are from the great, mighty american west. There hasn't been ocean there for millions of years. I am a coastal state. I was interested in what oceans expertise who would make sure that the service provided.
▶ 0:40:57Sen. Whitehouse: Now, your fy 20 seven budget actually moves things from noaa so there is more demand for coastal expertise. How are you doing on that and how many of the 530 biologists who fled were ones who had oceans and coastal competence?
▶ 0:41:20Mr. Nesvik: Thank you for the question. Certainly if this merger, this integration was to come to fruition there is existing expertise within noaa that would potentially be available. The details of that potential are not worked out yet, but certainly we would leverage expertise that currently relies within it.
▶ 0:41:49Mr. Nesvik: In the fish and wildlife service we have several highly qualified biologists that understand marine biology, marine animal protection, and we have biologists that work on this now.
▶ 0:42:02Sen. Whitehouse: I would ask you for the record to specify that if you don't mind. Lastly, I co-lead every year a senate appropriations letter supporting the state and tribal wildlife grants. You would not be surprised to learn that that letter enjoys immense bipartisan support?
▶ 0:42:31Sen. Whitehouse: In your time as the wyoming game commissioner, did you pursue and receive the his state and tribal grants?
▶ 0:42:39Mr. Nesvik: Yes, senator. We did apply and routinely utilize those grants.
▶ 0:42:44Sen. Whitehouse: So, explain to me the logic of zeroing out those grants in your budget proposal.
▶ 0:42:53Mr. Nesvik: It is a reality -- I guess the impetus is we had to make some very hard decisions to reduce spending in line with the president's priority to ensure his commitment can come to fruition to reduce government spending. We are at a point and we need to do our part as the fish and wildlife service to reduce spending. We made a hard decisions.
▶ 0:43:15Mr. Nesvik: There were areas we had to focus on cutting and we have to rely heavier on our state, tribal partners, other private partners, nongovernmental organizations, conservation groups, other folks to help in these areas because our physical reality indicates we cannot continue to spend at the current level we already are.
▶ 0:43:34Sen. Whitehouse: I would say that our physical reality also includes billionaires who do not pay any taxes. There ought to be ways to solve our physical problem without taking it out on what little remains of the planet's wildlife. Thank you very much, madam chair.
▶ 0:43:53Chair Capito: Senator ricketts. [inaudible]
▶ 0:44:05Sen. Ricketts: Thank you very much, madam chair. Director nesvik, thank you for your leadership at fish and wildlife and thank you for being here. Thank you also for opening up the grazing access to a valentine national wildlife refuge following the devastating wildfires that we had in nebraska.
▶ 0:44:24Sen. Ricketts: It has been something where we had the most fire damage in the state's history, over one million acres were burned and everything we can do to help out our ranger's recovery is greatly appreciated. So, thank you for that. It was great to talk to you yesterday to hear your perspectives on what the agency can do to improve esa implementation.
▶ 0:44:48Sen. Ricketts: The fish and wildlife service reinstated several of the first trump administration's rulemakings that improved esa implementation. Thank you for improving transparency, reducing regulatory overreach, and providing clear definitions for those impacted by esa regulations. As the chairman of the water, fisheries, wildlife subcommittee I hosted a hearing on esa and found that a greater focus on species recovery and transparency is critical to reforming a law that has too often failed to meet its conservation objectives.
▶ 0:45:17Sen. Ricketts: Since the esa was enacted in 1973 only 57 of the more than 1700 listed species have been delisted. That is roughly 3% of the species ever listed as endangered or threatened have been recovered. That does not sound like a very successful recovery metric to meet and really encourages us to take a look at the programs and see what we can do to improve the rate of recovery among species. The pallet sturgeon is one of those species in the missouri river.
▶ 0:45:47Sen. Ricketts: It has been the focus of long-standing efforts to be able to achieve recovery efforts under the esa since it was listed as endangered in 1990. Since 1994, researchers have carried out a propagation program that has released millions of pallet sturgeon and 100 50 pallet sturgeon into the missouri river. These propagation efforts continue with the establishment of the missouri river recovery program by the U.S. army corps of engineers in 2006.
▶ 0:46:14Sen. Ricketts: Under section seven of the esa the core is required to consult with fish and wildlife service pier the recovery plan it sets numerous -- numeric standards for down listing the pallet sturgeon. We want to have 5000 genetically diverse adult fish sustained for over two generations. 20 or 30 years. Currently the data estimates the pallet sturgeon is 2517 fish as of october 2020 four.
▶ 0:46:42Sen. Ricketts: After more than 30 years of attempting this we have made it about halfway there. I will note that about two thirds of the fish I mentioned are actually from the propagation efforts. However, we can see we are not making a ton of progress. Director nesvik, what steps can U.S. fish and wildlife service take to better align the recovery and delisting network for the pallet sturgeon and other species with a more realistic and achievable benchmark, to be able to get this done?
▶ 0:47:10Mr. Nesvik: Well, thank you. Certainly appreciate the question, senator. First, I would highlight that on the endangered species list, you alluded to this, there are species that are imperiled and need help and investment with recovery and there are species that are on the list that are recovered but simply have not had the investment to be able to remove them from the list. What that does is it diverts resources.
▶ 0:47:38Mr. Nesvik: Every species on the list requires some level of support and investment from the federal government. Delisting species that are recovered but just need to be pushed over the line for the regulatory process creates an opportunity to then use those resources for that species on the list that generally need help.
▶ 0:47:57Mr. Nesvik: The other thing that I think it's important with regards to -- specifically -- I don't know the biology, history, background with pallet sturgeon, but I would say one of our focus is is, and if these esa regulations are finalized, a provision will enable us to use basically the same criteria that you use, the five factor analysis that we use to list the species will also be used to determine if a species should be delisted. The same exact process for both.
▶ 0:48:27Mr. Nesvik: I think that is something that will help us with the species I described. That have reached recovery, but simply haven't had the investment to get them through the regulatory process to get them delisted.
▶ 0:48:38Sen. Ricketts: I'm about out of time but I want to wrap up on other things quickly. On special status assessments for species, what I encourage you to do is to have a lot of transparency with regards to that so the public and know ahead of time as you are going through this, whether it is the data, the modeling, the analytical methods you are using so the public to know what is going on.
▶ 0:49:02Sen. Ricketts: And then I also encourage you to make sure that you are doing the best that you can to encourage, to educate land owners what they are responsible for with regard to endangered species as well. I will give you an example. When I was the governor of nebraska there was a renter who was talking to me about -- he was going to re-up his crp land. You have to do it every seven years. What had been put in was he had to protect the habitat of the swift fox. He had never seen a swift fox.
▶ 0:49:30Sen. Ricketts: He went to his fsa office and said, what do I need to do to be able to comply with this new rule that you want me to sign up for in my crp agreement? They could not answer him. So, he declined to sign up for the crp land because he is like, I'm not going to agree in a contract, written contract, to protect the habitat of an animal I haven't seen on my property and you cannot even tell me what I have to do to protect it.
▶ 0:49:55Sen. Ricketts: We need to be able to make sure we are giving landowners the information they need, with the responsibilities are if they are going to sign these agreements so we can continue to have these programs. I would encourage you whatever you can do to be able to help encourage that, that would help landowners be responsible and also protect them against being sued for things they may not have any control over or obligations they may not have understood they had. So, thank you.
▶ 0:50:23Chair Capito: Senator husted.
▶ 0:50:27Sen. Husted: Thank you, jim and capital. Director. Thank you for your many years of service to protecting wildlife and our natural places. I know we have members of this committee from the east coast, the west coast, the gulf coast, I represent the north coast, the great lakes. As the only member of the committee that represents a great lakes state I will focus my thoughts on the great lakes.
▶ 0:50:58Sen. Husted: They have been -- the great lakes have been vulnerable and resilient over the time period we have been studying them. When they became open for global commercial trade in 1959, though, we have seen threats from invasive species.
▶ 0:51:18Sen. Husted: From different things that were brought in and ballast water and the like ranging from sea lamprey, zebra mussels, that have had various impacts on the great lakes. The sea lamprey being the most devastating of them all.
▶ 0:51:37Sen. Husted: But there was a coordinated response from wildlife experts and biologists to address that issue and those coordinated efforts have kept the lamprey under control, but we must always remain vigilant in making sure that stays true. The great lakes are a commercial venue. They are where people get fresh water. It is also the home of recreational and commercial fishing, huge economic impact for all of the great lakes states.
▶ 0:52:07Sen. Husted: I bring this up regarding invasive species, because the great threat that is out there for the great lakes is the invasive carp, which I know you know about. The president has spoken about the issue.
▶ 0:52:25Sen. Husted: I also see in the budget that there is a cut of $17 million for programs that are part of the strategic response for the asian invasion act, for the asian carp.
▶ 0:52:41Sen. Husted: Please, explain to me, if you would, your awareness of this, the efforts being made to make sure the invasive carp does not find its way into the great lakes from the many tributaries where it could occur, and give us some perspective on your -- on what is being done and your commitment. I want to know what your commitment is to making sure that this does not become a problem for the great lakes.
▶ 0:53:09Mr. Nesvik: Certainly. Appreciate the question, senator. I know that you are focused on your constituents in the great lakes. I would say this is one of my largest conservation concerns, the cancer of invasive species. Whether they are aquatic or terrestrial. I have spent a significant amount of my time in this profession working on dealing with trying to figure out to solve the problem.
▶ 0:53:38Mr. Nesvik: I think the future of solving the problem lies in places we haven't gone before using innovation and technology, using genomics, looking at opportunities for private investment to help us figure out how to use -- you have probably heard of the idea of using introducing different species for dealing with these problems, basically sterile fish is over tom you eliminate an invasive
▶ 0:54:09Mr. Nesvik: Population. -- sterile fish, so over time you eliminate an invasive population. We have been able to provide significant support through our -- we have an invasive species task force within the fish and wildlife service that we have been able to use to provide expertise and also help. This year -- I don't remember the number.
▶ 0:54:33Mr. Nesvik: Several folks we have hired to deliver lampreycide for dealing with sea lamprey. We have had multiple discussions with private industry to figure out in the white house --
▶ 0:54:48Sen. Husted: When you talk about trying to prevent them from reproducing with sterile fish, you're talking about -- not the great lakes, you're talking about downstream in the tributaries. Tell me what is going on there.
▶ 0:55:01Mr. Nesvik: All of the states, too. The states are investing. This past year we have provided grants for those states to continue to do that work with regards to carp. Additionally, looking forward, there is a lot of discussion going on about trying to figure out what the solutions are here with carp. It is probably doing some things we have not done before.
▶ 0:55:23Sen. Husted: Again, quickly, what would those be?
▶ 0:55:27Mr. Nesvik: Genomics is one example. Using genetics to be able to figure out how to create a way for the system to take care of the problem itself, centrally. There is still the removal. Efforts now are focused on commercial entities and private entities -- noncommercial entities that are harvesting and killing invasive carp. That is a band-aid. The long-term solution is bigger than that.
▶ 0:55:54Sen. Husted: Well, thank you, chairman capital. I want to reiterate the importance of this. It would be devastating to the great lakes if this invasive carp was allowed to enter the great lakes system.
▶ 0:56:11Sen. Husted: Please come you and your team -- please, you and your team, let us know what to do to support you but please, make it a priority, do all you can, and be innovative to make sure it is a problem we will hopefully never have to contend with in the great lakes. Thank you.
▶ 0:56:29Chair Capito: Senator schiff.
▶ 0:56:32Sen. Schiff: Thank, cheer. Director nesvik, it I sent a letter with 19 of my colleague steven secretary burgum raising concerns about the staffing crisis at fish and wildlife. Some estimates suggest the agency has lost 26% of its staff . I asked for your plan to address this crisis to ensure that your agency and the refuge system have enough staff to protect wildlife and other refuges.
▶ 0:57:00Sen. Schiff: As you are required to do by statute. To date I have not received any response, which highlights my concern. So, let me ask you to start out. You got the letter from fully 1/5 of the senate asking about the staffing crisis. When can we expect a response?
▶ 0:57:17Mr. Nesvik: Well, senator, thank you for the question. I cannot commit to you on a timely when you will receive a response, but I can tell you that this has been aligning our workforce with available resources and with our core mission and what we are required by law to do. Has been a large part of our work related to our workforce and how we are going to -- how we are going to produce the outcomes for the american people that they expect and require in the future.
▶ 0:57:43Sen. Schiff: Director, it has been half a year since we asked you how you're going to do with the staffing shortages. It is not too much to ask, indeed, if we are going to take our oversight responsibility seriously, we need to insist on answers to very basic questions about how you can meet your statutory obligation after losing a quarter of your staff.
▶ 0:58:11Sen. Schiff: We will follow-up with your office on this to make sure we get an answer. Last summer we learned about 9% of wildlife refuges have been classified as shuttered, meaning they have no on the ground management. What percentage of the refuges are now shuttered without on the ground management?
▶ 0:58:33Sen. Schiff: Also, I think on the same day that I sent my letter to you in december you said you were going to look refuges that no longer aligned with the mission, but you've offered no information about what that mission is or how you are undertaking this nationwide review. Let me ask you what percentage of these refuges are now shuttered and how are you determining whether refuges in line with the mission?
▶ 0:59:00Mr. Nesvik: First of all, senator, I completely acknowledge the fact that we do have refuges where we don't have staff working on the refuges. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are shuttered or closed to public use. We, this refuge review that has been very important to me, very important to the service is getting close to being wrapped up to where we can talk publicly about what the findings of that are.
▶ 0:59:25Mr. Nesvik: It is really focused on putting more -- realigning to put more boots on the ground in the field doing the work on the ground for refuges across the country. It is looking at finding efficiencies. It is looking at dealing with deferred maintenance backlogs. Again, I think reauthorization is such an important part of that. We are also looking at ways to be more efficient with the resources we have. There is a lot of technology and a lot of opportunities.
▶ 0:59:55Mr. Nesvik: We have 160 different partners groups that are standing at the door waiting to go and help us with our needs. There is opportunities to do it in a different way and focus more on the outcomes than the inputs.
▶ 1:00:06Sen. Schiff: I would suggest, director, if you had about a quarter of your workforce lost it is going to be very difficult to put more boots on the ground in these refuges, as you are suggesting. Let me move to a different topic . In march, senator ricketts and I held a hearing in the fisheries, wildlife, subcommittee to improve recovery efforts for species listed as threatened or endangered under the esa.
▶ 1:00:32Sen. Schiff: I was pleased, given the strong feelings on both sides of the aisle about the esa, that we were able to have a reasonable, bipartisan discussion. I think senator ricketts had a great hearing. You agree with landowners that have implemented positive conservation practices should be afforded regulatory flexibility such under 4d rules in exchange for helping population numbers rebound and meeting specific conservation milestones?
▶ 1:01:04Sen. Schiff: Wouldn't this kind of regulatory flexibility be appropriate?
▶ 1:01:08Mr. Nesvik: Senator, insured, absolutely. There is also section 10 of the esa that I have heard loud and clear from landowners they are frustrated with because it is difficult to maneuver their way through obtaining the right permits that address exactly what you are saying. You do good things, we are going to make sure you are not negatively impacted for doing good things with listed species. We are focused.
▶ 1:01:33Mr. Nesvik: We have an effort to look at section 10, both the major outcomes of section 10 to make it more streamlined, better, easier for landowners to use without a significant amount of cost for landowners to be able to participate in those programs.
▶ 1:01:47Sen. Schiff: Thank you, madam chair.
▶ 1:01:52Chair Capito: Senator lummis.
▶ 1:01:54Sen. Lummis: Thank you welcome, Mr. nesvik. How much time and money does the U.S. fish and wildlife service spend defending itself in court?
▶ 1:02:05Mr. Nesvik: That is a great question, senator, that I don't have an answer to. But I will tell you it is significant.
▶ 1:02:12Sen. Lummis: It comes out of your budget when you have to defend yourself in court?
▶ 1:02:18Mr. Nesvik: Yes, he comes out of the department of interior's funding. It would come if it wasn't being used to do with litigation, it could be applied to other things like recovery of species.
▶ 1:02:29Sen. Lummis: Cell, litigation against your decisions -- if so, litigation against your decisions -- especially if they are by an environmental group. An example. The grizzly bear was twice delisted and determined to be recovered by the U.S. fish and wildlife service. That predates your time here. The courts determined that that decision needed to be vacated.
▶ 1:02:56Sen. Lummis: So, a lot of time and money was spent preparing to defend the U.S. fish and wildlife service's determination, and then the courts vacated and we were back to where we are now. So, litigation is taking money away from species recovery. Is that true?
▶ 1:03:18Mr. Nesvik: It is absolutely true. It is also a burden on the state wildlife agencies that have spent north of $50 million just on that species now to recover it. The biology indicates that that species is recovered, but we have not been able to get it delisted. That goes back to the question I addressed with senator ricketts, that when we get the species that are recovered biologically off of the list we can invest those resources in species that actually need the work.
▶ 1:03:47Sen. Lummis: I was interested in senator ricketts' questions about the swift fox. We used it to have a whole lot of swift fox on our ranch in wyoming. The U.S. fish and wildlife service used to come in and trap them with our permission and take them to places where they needed to increase the population. So, sometimes with these species it is just a matter of concentrations of species someplace and less in another.
▶ 1:04:19Sen. Lummis: Clearly, nebraska was one of those places where there was a depletion of swift fox. I am glad we could help with that. There was a previous question while I was here about your core mission and aligning the agency's work with that mission. Can you talk a little bit about how you are going about trying to align both human resources and financial resources with the core missions of the agency?
▶ 1:04:49Mr. Nesvik: Absolutely. First and foremost one of the things I have made a priority for fish and wildlife service in the way that we go about our job every day as we have to remember every morning when we wake up who we work for. And a superior service to the american people is a top priority. We are working hard in our work with the refuge system to figure out how to run the refuge system better and make it better for the american people. The wildlife refuge system is part of our core mission. I have talked a lot about the endangered species act.
▶ 1:05:18Mr. Nesvik: That is part of our core mission. We are working hard on things like migratory bird conservation. That is a core mission. The law requires that the service along with the states manages migratory waterfowl, for example. The operational, daily costs to do permitting for legally-required permits that americans need in order to do the things that they do every day, whether they are private land owners trying to ranch or energy companies trying to achieve our energy dominance priority.
▶ 1:05:48Sen. Lummis: Well, I wish you well because I think that is an important alignment. It doesn't happen overnight. It takes a lot of work. I want to switch a little too invasive species and give you an example. On my ranch in platte county, wyoming we had a wildfire. And then cheat grass comes in and takes over.
▶ 1:06:16Sen. Lummis: The local weed and pest control district and conservation district had some biologics that we could spray out of helicopters to try to prevent the spread of cheat grass. But we had to very carefully -- we were paying for it. The rangers were pitching in to pay for this.
▶ 1:06:40Sen. Lummis: But we had to make sure that we never sprayed on the adjacent federal lands, because they didn't want the biologic treatment on federal land. In this area they are all peppered, federal land, state land, private land, they are interspersed.
▶ 1:07:03Sen. Lummis: What are you doing to try to implement collective federalism where if there is an effort by a state wildlife agency, wyoming came and fish or whoever to either deal with an invasive species or new scientific data generated by the state game and fish to provide you with additional data to help inform your decisions about threatened and endangered species.
▶ 1:07:32Sen. Lummis: Is there progress being made to implement collective federalism so states and locals who have boots on the ground experience can help inform the debate for the U.S. fish and wildlife service?
▶ 1:07:43Mr. Nesvik: Great question. You are right, there is a significant amount of frustration, particularly with the issue you bring up. I suspect it was with the use of -- most likely. We have taken some monumental steps to improve that situation.
▶ 1:08:05Mr. Nesvik: As an example in the case that you bring up, the law requires review for anything like cheatgrass spraying on federal land. It was an approved use on forest service lands but it was not done on -- lands. You could provide this treatment to a cancer on the list on one piece of federal land but you have to stop at the border.
▶ 1:08:35Mr. Nesvik: Our new nepa regulations eliminate that. You can use another agency's nepa as long as it is legal and it includes exclusions that allow a programmatic look across a larger group of lands where you know that the answer at the end it's going to be, yes, we want to do this, it is important for habitat restoration, but the process is taking so long. So we have made some significant progress on that issue.
▶ 1:09:04Sen. Lummis: Thank you, director. Appreciate you being here.
▶ 1:09:12Chair Capito: Senator alsobrooks.
▶ 1:09:12Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you, chair capito, ranking member whitehouse folding today's hearing and also, good morning to director nesvik. Thank you for joining us. For nearly 90 years the pittman robertson wildlife restoration sports fish restoration programs have been among the most successful conservation partnerships in our nations history.
▶ 1:09:35Sen. Alsobrooks: Rather than relying on taxpayer dollars these programs are funded by taxes paid by hunters, anglers, recreational shooters and boaters had returned to the states for wildlife conservation, fisheries, management, and boating access. For maryland alone these fund roughly $14 million that come to our state and the state built its conservation budget and annual work plan around the expectation that the service will distribute these funds in a timely and predictable manner.
▶ 1:10:07Sen. Alsobrooks: Uncertainty about the availability or timing of these funds can disrupt habitat restoration projects, fishery management, activities, and public access improvements. Can you commit that the fish and wildlife service will continue to distribute wildlife and sport fish restoration funds on schedule and without administrative delay so that states like my state, maryland, can effectively plan and execute their conservation programs?
▶ 1:10:34Mr. Nesvik: Senator, first of all I am not aware of any delays. -- any delays we have had specific to the wildlife sports fisheries you speak of with pittman roberts. Those will go to the states under the formula you described. I know this well from working in a state before, it is very important to the states and we are committed to continuing up funding as we are directed by the law.
▶ 1:11:01Sen. Alsobrooks: If there are delays in maryland, for example, would you commit to working with us to make sure we get those distributions?
▶ 1:11:10Mr. Nesvik: Absolutely.
▶ 1:11:12Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you. I wonder if it has any staffing or administrative challenges that might affect future distributions?
▶ 1:11:20Mr. Nesvik: With regards to the delivery of pittman roberts, I don't expect any issues with -- there have been changes -- not specific to your question on grant delivery, it has not been lost to the fish and wildlife service when a certain group of employees was moved from one
▶ 1:11:51Mr. Nesvik: Particular bureau or into the department. There continues to be resources to continue to do that important work.
▶ 1:11:57Sen. Alsobrooks: I want to ask you, current fish and wildlife service policy provides compensatory hunting days for states that prohibit sunday hunting for migratory game birds. However, these extinct framework does not provide sufficient flexibility for states to adopt species specific sunday hunting policies while preserving those compensatory days.
▶ 1:12:22Sen. Alsobrooks: Instead, it effectively enforces an all or nothing approach, limiting states' ability to tailor hunting regulations to local needs and stakeholder input. In maryland, the sunday hunting policy has historically been considered on a species by species basis balancing the needs of communities.
▶ 1:12:44Sen. Alsobrooks: Greater flexibility within the federal framework would allow the state to make incremental policy decisions without affecting overall conservation objectives where the total number of hunting days. The trump administration has repeatedly emphasized empowering states and reducing one-size-fits-all federal requirements, allowing additional flexibility in the compensatory days of framework. This would be consistent with that goal.
▶ 1:13:11Sen. Alsobrooks: If allowing species specific sunday hunting would not increase the number of hunting days or undermine conservation objectives, why does the current compensatory days framework continue to require an all or nothing approach?
▶ 1:13:26Mr. Nesvik: Great question, senator. Actually, I have heard from some of your constituents recently about this. I actually didn't even know it was an issue until recently. I know it is important to your constituents. I am committed to working with you, your staff, and the states to figure out how we tackle this thing. I don't have a great solution today, but you are right. Working with our state wildlife agency partners is a very high priority.
▶ 1:13:53Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you. The trump administration's fy 2020 seven budget proposes a limiting state and tribal wildlife grants, and this is a program specifically designed to help states conserve at risk species before they require federal protection under the endangered species act. These grants support habitat management and research, scientific research, wildlife surveys, conservation planning.
▶ 1:14:19Sen. Alsobrooks: In maryland this funding has supported efforts like habitat restoration in the chesapeake bay watershed. Has the service analyzed whether eliminating the program could ultimately increase federal costs five resulting in more species needing protection and recovery under the endangered species act?
▶ 1:14:39Mr. Nesvik: The grants you mentioned were part of what I discussed earlier about the hard decisions we had to make to right-size our spending with our fiscal reality and aligning available resources with our core mission. That was one of those hard decisions that was made.
▶ 1:14:59Mr. Nesvik: You know, we're very focused on continuing to work with the states to figure out how co-management, how private partnerships, how nongovernmental organizations, how others can help us with the lift when the federal government's committed to reducing our federal spending.
▶ 1:15:15Sen. Alsobrooks: Thank you.
▶ 1:15:17Chair Capito: Thank you. Senator padilla.
▶ 1:15:20Sen. Padilla: Good to see you again. I recall the -- at your confirmation hearing last year. Your previous role as director of wyoming's game and fish department, you were a stakeholder to identify and conserve wildlife migration corridors. We talked about this during the hearing process.
▶ 1:15:48Sen. Padilla: Under the first trump administration, then-secretary issued an order 3362, which directs the department of interior to work in partnership with western states to improve the quality of big game winter range and migration corridor habitats on federal lands.
▶ 1:16:08Sen. Padilla: Through that order, the department of interior has provided millions of dollars in funding for priority projects, for data analysis, and for mapping assistance for western states wildlife agencies. Over the last two congresses, I've been able to work with two congressmen on the wildlife movement through partnerships act, which would codify the great work done through the order and expand its scope to cover all 50 states.
▶ 1:16:36Sen. Padilla: So director, can you highlight why the work done through this order is so important to conserve habitat and protecting migration corridors, and would you support codifying this program?
▶ 1:16:47Mr. Nesvik: Great question, senator, something that, as you mentioned, I worked on extensively in the past. The really important parts of the migration corridor work that's been done under this secretarial order and also under the leadership of many of the state agencies in the west is that these efforts have all been focused on voluntary work that doesn't require federal designations, like a federally designated migration corridor.
▶ 1:17:13Mr. Nesvik: Those were things that were hard lines in the sand that nobody ever wanted to cross, had to remain voluntary, had to keep that regulatory directive kind of approach out of it. And because of that, because it was state led, and states were able to look at their data for their particular state and say this is where we have issues with wildlife movement, they developed a plan. And that was the basis for how the executive order was implemented. That's why it was so successful, and that's why it's survived three administrations now.
▶ 1:17:46Mr. Nesvik: So certainly, there's opportunities to continue that work
▶ 1:17:52Sen. Padilla: Again, the premise of the question, because it's been so successful, it's never been codified and number two, expand on it, just the warn states, but all 50 states, each one of them being unique, not just in terms of needs but also in terms of capacity and capability. Some states, some agencies within some states are better fund and had staffed.
▶ 1:18:15Sen. Padilla: And others, well, that's collaboratively maximize our collective experience and expertise. I want to bring up one or topic. As you're probably aware, this last month, both inspectors working for the tahoe regional planning agency stopped to vote with live attached golden mussels at one of the lake's water craft inspection stations.
▶ 1:18:41Sen. Padilla: The discovery highlighted the importance of proactive prevention to stop the spread of aquatic invasive species. If we don't stop the golden mussels soon, it could have devastating impacts not just on lake tahoe's ecosystem and the clarity of the water, but also on the $5 billion annual recreation and tourism-based economy, and that's just lake tahoe.
▶ 1:19:06Sen. Padilla: The he wills are rapidly spreading and could -- the mussels are rapidly spreading and could cost hundreds of millions of dollars a year to treat and remove. Director, what action is the U.S. fish & wildlife service taking to partner with state and local agencies to respond to the rapidly spreading threat of golden mussels in california?
▶ 1:19:29Mr. Nesvik: Senator, certainly for many administrations now, over the last at least 15 years, we've been partners with the states on inspection stations, on decontamination units, on providing states' financial assistance with dealing with these aquatic invasive species, as well as other invasive species. I don't anticipate that's been a priority, and it continues to be a priority, and I don't anticipate that our partnerships with the states are going to change.
▶ 1:19:57Mr. Nesvik: You definitely have a constituency that is very passionate, because I have seen hundreds of your constituents fly all the way to washington, D.C. to meet with me and talk about things like this. In fact, just as recently as yesterday, I had 20 or 30 water-related n.g.o.'s in my office. So yeah, you highlight a real problem. It's a problem in other parts of the crypt it's a problem not only in the west, but across the entire country.
▶ 1:20:24Sen. Padilla: The volume is any indicator, let me reiterate, this is a break glass moment. This isn't just typical lobbying advocacy, keep us in the funding plan. The discovery of this golden mussel and its rapid spread is a crisis moment. There's ongoing support. This is a break glass moment. Thank you.
▶ 1:20:48Chair Capito: Thank you. Senator blunt rochester?
▶ 1:20:51Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you, chair capito, and ranking member whitehouse, as well as you, Mr. director. Thank you so much for being here. Delaware, we're known to be small, but we are also home to a remarkable diversity of wildlife and habitat. On the screen potentially, but definitely in my hand is a picture of a 9-year-old from milton. His name is quinton.
▶ 1:21:19Sen. Blunt Rochester: In delaware, there's his picture. Quinton loves to go birding. In april, he participated in a bird-a-thon, where he raised money for restoring and conserve the bay shore habitat in delaware, which the red knot calls home during the long, long-distance migration. The red knot is listed as a threatened species, and quinton is doing his part to protect them.
▶ 1:21:47Sen. Blunt Rochester: Unfortunately, I heard, as I was coming into the hearing, that you had to make tough decisions, and the current administration, it's my understanding in the proposed budget, would eliminate funding for the state and tribal wildlife grants program, which helps states like mine preserve and conserve conservation activities. And also for threatened and endanger the species, like the red knot. Mr.
▶ 1:22:16Sen. Blunt Rochester: Director, it appears, as I said from the budget, that this popular program is being cut, is that correct?
▶ 1:22:24Mr. Nesvik: Yes, senator, that's our proposal. That's in the president's current proposed budget.
▶ 1:22:28Sen. Blunt Rochester: I guess one of the questions I would have is, how you would and could explain to states where there might be other places to get revenue to do this kind of critical conservation activity. I mean, I was thinking maybe you put this program in another pot somewhere, because it really is vital.
▶ 1:22:51Sen. Blunt Rochester: Could you talk a little bit about what you would say to our state and local governments to be able to support such a program?
▶ 1:23:00Mr. Nesvik: Certainly. I think this is a time when looking for places like we may not have looked before, like additional -- states have the same issue as we do in the federal government. They have to take a look at how much money they take in and spend when that's lopsided, they have to make adjustments. What I tell states is this is a time when there's not going to be as much federal money, because our priority is to reduce government spending. You're going to have to look to nongovernmental organizations.
▶ 1:23:29Mr. Nesvik: You have to look at your own priorities within your own budget. And I agree, these are hard decisions. But they have to be made.
▶ 1:23:37Sen. Blunt Rochester: I think sometimes people think programs like this are nice to do. It's not just a nice to do. You know, in delaware, not only do we have the red knot, but we're home to horseshoe crabs. The horseshoe crab has existed for 400 million years, which is why it is actually our state marine animal. It's known as a living fossil.
▶ 1:24:01Sen. Blunt Rochester: And they are critical, not just to the ecosystem, it's not just a fun thing to do, but they have blue blood in them, and this blood is used actually in biomedical and pharmaceutical industries to test bacteria contamination. So it is also about our safety, our economy, our culture.
▶ 1:24:22Sen. Blunt Rochester: I just recently surveyed them at a park, and I want to ask that you reconsider looking at that state and tribal wildlife grants program, because it is not just a nice thing, it's a necessary thing, and I know in your state of wyoming, you used it yourself, so I know you can relate. I want to turn to another important conservation resource.
▶ 1:24:48Sen. Blunt Rochester: Congress provided $26 million through the infrastructure investment jobs act to the bipartisan delaware river basin restoration program to support the watershed for my state and the entire region, and it's my understanding that for fiscal year 2026, funding has not yet been obligated. What is the status of those funds, and more specifically, when should delaware communities, watershed communities expect the dollars to be available for projects on the ground?
▶ 1:25:19Mr. Nesvik: Thank you, senator. I don't know specifically about that particular project, but all grant spending was delivered through an elevated review process in the department of interior to ensure that the money that we were spending, american taxpayer dollars that we were spending was a good use of the money and aligned with the administration. I suspect that the particular project or grant you're talking about is in that elevated review process.
▶ 1:25:48Sen. Blunt Rochester: Could you give us, after this hearing, give us a sense or update on that funding, as well as the national contestal wetland grant for my state's milford neck preserve? They also had not received confirmation of when they will be receiving funding. So if you could get back to me on those two items, I would greatly appreciate it.
▶ 1:26:12Mr. Nesvik: We will do that.
▶ 1:26:15Sen. Blunt Rochester: Thank you, and I yield back.
▶ 1:26:17Chair Capito: Thank you. Well, I think that pretty much draws to a conclusion. I have no further questions. Our members are pretty much attendant that are going to come, so I'd like to thank you, Mr. director.
▶ 1:26:29Mr. Nesvik: A word? Thank you, chairman. With senator blunt rochester here, I just wanted to emphasize her comments about the red knot and the horseshoe crab. I've been to delaware bay for the arrival of the red knot, which flies to delaware bay in order to feed on horseshoe crab eggs. It's a cafeteria for the red knot.
▶ 1:26:52Mr. Nesvik: And they are these amazing, awkward, multimillion year old creatures, kind of bumbling around on the shore, where they come to breed with one another. But the remarkable thing is actually the travel of the red knot, which flies to delaware bay from brazil. Straight shot. It is such a herculean, physical effort that the little red knot actually has to physically morph during the voyage. I flew to the cop.
▶ 1:27:25Mr. Nesvik: I flew in an airplane. And I flew from miami. And that was a pretty darn long trip. And here's this little bird that goes from brazil, not to miami, but all the way up to delaware bay, and the continued existence of the red knot depends on its ability to stop in delaware bay and feed up for its further transition to arctic lands, to its own breeding grounds.
▶ 1:27:54Mr. Nesvik: And if the things that mankind is doing on our planet start moving those schedules around, so that when the red knot shows up in delaware, there is not the feast and cafeteria of horseshoe crab eggs for them, then they will starve.
▶ 1:28:15Mr. Nesvik: So it's just a small story of the heroic nature of some of these small creatures that we pay very, very little attention to, and particularly in congress, where everything dials back to money and valuation and monetization.
▶ 1:28:38Mr. Nesvik: You know, it's impossible to put a price on having a planet in which there is a little bird that will fly from brazil to delaware and has the instinct to know when those horseshoes are going to be out and their eggs are going to be available. We lose that, and you cannot put a price on it. So we tend to ignore it here in congress, because we cannot put a price on it.
▶ 1:29:02Mr. Nesvik: But the flip side, if we cannot put a price on it, is that these kind of things matter to our human experience, to see that others of god's creatures do these remarkable things, as I think an appropriate way of humbling us a little bit. So I'm really, really pleased, senator alsobrooks brought up this remarkable thing that's taking place in her home state, right down on delaware bay.
▶ 1:29:29Chair Capito: Now I have to chatgpt a red knot. [laughter] I don't think we have any of those in the mountains of west virginia. I know we don't have any horseshoe crabs. Anyway, thank you for being with us this afternoon and all of my colleagues for participation in today's hearing. Senators who wish to submit written questions for the record have until 5:00 p.m. On wednesday, june 24, to do so.
▶ 1:29:55Chair Capito: The witnesses' response to those questions are due back to the committee no later than 5:00 p.m. On wednesday, july 8, and will be submitted for the record. With that, this hearing is adjourned, and thank you very much, Mr. nesvik.
▶ 1:30:07Mr. Nesvik: Thank you.