▶ 0:17:32Chair Scott: Good morning. We will call this hearing to order. We want to begin by welcoming each of our nominees. Thank you for your willingness to serve our remarkable country. Public service is obviously not easy. It takes sacrifice, patience, and commitment to the american people. The roles before us today will have a significant impact. They matter for families trying to make ends meet. They matter for taxpayers who deserve accountability. They matter for a financial serving their communities.
▶ 0:18:03Chair Scott: And they matter for the strength of our economy. This hearing is about getting all five leaders in place so president trump's agenda can move forward. These agencies can focus on the people they are supposed to serve. The american people elected president donald j. Trump to bring down costs, restore accountability, and put common sense back at the center of democracy appeared to do that, he needs his team in place.
▶ 0:18:31Chair Scott: Agencies cannot operate at their best without steady, clear leadership and people ready to serve. Dr. phelan, your nomination that year the council of economic advisers comes at a very important time. Families in south carolina and across the country are focused on the same kitchen table questions. Can I afford my mortgage or my rent? Can I finally get a good paying job?
▶ 0:19:01Chair Scott: Can my small business continue to grow? Will my children have better opportunities than I had? Those are not abstract economic questions. They are real life questions for families throughout south carolina and our country. Economic leadership matters because policy choices affect costs, investment, wages, and opportunity.
▶ 0:19:25Chair Scott: I look forward to hearing how your decades of experience and sound judgment will help the president advance an agenda that strengthens the economy and makes life more affordable. Mr. crews, your nomination to the national credit union administration also matters for everyday americans. Credit unions help families, workers, and small businesses saved by a car, and handle unexpected costs that life throws your way.
▶ 0:19:51Chair Scott: When the credit union system is strong and competitive americans have more choices, better access to affordable financial services. The ncua needs a leader that understands safety and soundness, but also knows that unnecessary regulatory burdens can raise costs and limit access. Your experience in both congress and the administration give you a strong understanding of how policy decisions affect credit unions and members in the communities they serve.
▶ 0:20:22Chair Scott: I look forward to hearing how you will support a safe, sound, competitive credit union system that works for everyday americans. Mr. ledbetter, your nomination to serve as the inspector general at the department of hud comes at a time when housing affordability is one of the greatest challenges facing our families. Taxpayers deserve accountability. Families waiting for help deserve competence. Hud programs must work for people they are intended to serve.
▶ 0:20:51Chair Scott: Strong oversight helps make sure taxpayer dollars actually reach the families they were meant to help. I look forward to hearing about how, if confirmed, you would use your 30 years of experience in federal and military law enforcement to protect taxpayers and root out waste.
▶ 0:21:11Chair Scott: Every single dollar lost to waste or mismanagement is a dollar that cannot be used to preserve affordable housing, assist renters, support homeownership, or address housing supply shortages. Together, these nominees represent an opportunity to strengthen economic policy, expand access to affordable financial services, protect taxpayers, and restore trust in important public institutions.
▶ 0:21:39Chair Scott: At the heart of this committee's work is a simple belief. Every family deserves a fair shot at building a better life. That requires qualified leaders, sound judgment, and a government focused on people not politics. These nominees should be judged on their qualifications, experience, and commitment to serving the american people, not simply on who nominated them.
▶ 0:22:08Chair Scott: I look forward to your testimony and to working with my colleagues to move qualified nominees forward. Senator warren is now recognized for her opening statement.
▶ 0:22:20Sen. Warren: Thank you, Mr. chairman. American families are facing an affordability crisis. They are being squeezed by rising costs and this administration's response has been a one-two punch of indifference and gas lighting disguised as economic policy. Grocery prices just had their biggest hike in years. Gas prices are up 40% just since the start of the year.
▶ 0:22:51Sen. Warren: One third of american households report struggling to pay their utility bills. And more and more americans are falling behind on their credit card debt. Meanwhile, president is building his $600 million gilded ballroom with half of it being paid for by american taxpayers.
▶ 0:23:13Sen. Warren: When asked about the rising costs from his illegal war with iran, trump said "I don't think about americans' financial situation." let that sink in.
▶ 0:23:28Sen. Warren: The man who started a war that has driven inflation the higher and higher levels and made families pay $43 billion more just on gasoline in the last three months told americans that their financial pain isn't even on his radar. But I guess we shouldn't be surprised.
▶ 0:23:52Sen. Warren: Trump has made clear that he is spending this presidency making himself and his buddies vastly richer and letting the american people pay the price. When congress actually did something to lower costs trump stood in the way. This week the senate and house passed our 21st century road to housing act with overwhelming bipartisan support.
▶ 0:24:19Sen. Warren: Legislation that will help us build more housing, bring down costs, and for the first time ever stop private equity from snapping up homes that families are trying to buy. We should have been here today celebrating. -- celebrating its becoming law yesterday. Instead, president trump refused to sign it.
▶ 0:24:42Sen. Warren: It is the latest -- of a president who doesn't think about families, doesn't care about lowering costs, and in his own words "loves the inflation." today, this committee has another slate of president trump's nominees. Nominees who will be expected to defend, implement, and try to excuse trump's willingness to turn his back on americans' financial worries. Starting with Dr.
▶ 0:25:09Sen. Warren: Phelan, the nominee to chair the council of economic advisers which advises the president on economic policy. Earlier this week we held a hearing on affordability. That is a word that president trump last week dismissed as "a fake word made up by the democrats." as a ca chair, Dr.
▶ 0:25:29Sen. Warren: Phelan would be responsible for advising the president on every tool the white house has as -- has at its disposal to bring down costs. To do that job he must first be willing to tell the truth. Trump's tariffs and reckless war with iran are driving up costs for american families.
▶ 0:25:56Sen. Warren: A chair who won't say that plainly is not an economic advisor. He is just a mouthpiece. If Mr. phelan cannot be honest about the problem he will have no credible plan to fix it. Mr. crews has been nominated to chair the national credit union administration.
▶ 0:26:17Sen. Warren: Credit unions need a stable and thoughtful regulator, especially a smaller financial institutions work to remain competitive in the face of ai and cryptocurrencies. Undermining the board's independence now at this moment of transition puts the members that credit unions serve at greater risk. Yeah, when we met, Mr.
▶ 0:26:40Sen. Warren: Crews was so beholden to trump's lackeys that he was unwilling to even acknowledge the law or merits of having a full bipartisan board at the ncua to support its work. Mr. ledbetter, you have been nominated to be the inspector general at the department of housing and urban development.
▶ 0:27:03Sen. Warren: Now, I appreciate your stated commitment to inspector general independence, but this administration has demonstrated a shocking willingness to browbeat and fire ig's whose sin is they follow the law. Independence on paper means nothing if it collapses under trump's pressure.
▶ 0:27:29Sen. Warren: The acting hud ig is already engaging in politically-driven efforts to punish blue cities while failing to hold hud accountable for illegally dismantling civil rights enforcement. And all this happens right in the middle of a housing crisis. This committee should not simply wave through nominees who will be on the front lines of implementing trump's disastrous policies.
▶ 0:27:59Sen. Warren: Americans are paying higher and higher prices while they watch the trump administration spend their tax dollars on goldleaf instead of lowering costs. Americans deserve nominees who won't just bow down to president trump but will stand up for a people in this country -- stand up for working people in this country.
▶ 0:28:23Chair Scott: I will now swear in the nominees. Will you stand and raise your right hand? Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth so help you god? Thank you. You agree to appear and testify before any duly constituted committee of the senate? Thank you. You may sit down. Your written statement will be made part of the record in their entirety.
▶ 0:28:51Chair Scott: Each of you will have five minutes to share with us your thoughts. We will start with Dr. phelan. You are now recognized.
▶ 0:28:58Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator scott, for your very kind introduction. Ranking member warren, distinguished members of the committee, it is my great honor to be before you today as president trump's nominee to be the chairman of the council of economic advisers. I consider myself privileged to have had the opportunity to meet many of you through this process, and to receive your valuable input regarding this important position. The council of economic advisers matters because the american economy matters.
▶ 0:29:28Dr. Phelan: The economy isn't about numbers. It is people's lives. My promise to you is that if am entrusted with this position, I won't allow the vital role of the council to be poorly performed due to any lack of effort on my part. I thank president trump for nominating me. But I also wish to thank my wonderful wife of 38 years, liz, and our five children, maire, celia, madeleine, joseph, and lucy, now all outstanding adults who make us both very proud.
▶ 0:29:57Dr. Phelan: Liz's love, support, and, frankly, patience with me while raising our children, has made whatever professional accomplishments I have had possible. My late father and mother would be, respectively, aged 99 and 96 today, and thus it would be unreasonable for me to regret they did not live to experience this great honor with me. I nevertheless do regret it.
▶ 0:30:21Dr. Phelan: They raised six baby boomers in a time of great societal upheaval, the youngest being me, and were very proud and, frankly, boastful about all of us. I owe them for the cherished and continuing support I get from my sister and brothers. Looking back at my life so far, I can do nothing but wonder at my undeserved good fortune.
▶ 0:30:43Dr. Phelan: At my undergraduate university, duke, I had the great pleasure of the attention of fantastic professors who taught and mentored me, while also annually seeing michael jordan, james worthy, and ralph sampson regularly crush our hopes in basketball. In graduate school at chicago, I not only met my wife, but also was taught by six nobel prize winners and was mentored by a man, robert townsend, now at mit, who treated me better than I could ever repay forward to my own students.
▶ 0:31:14Dr. Phelan: As a professor and researcher at the university of wisconsin, northwestern university, the federal reserve bank of minneapolis, and the university of minnesota, I have been both colleague and friend to some of the greatest minds in economics. I can only hope and pretend some rubbed off on me. In reviewing your decision regarding my nomination, I owe you my approach to both the council and specific position of chairman.
▶ 0:31:40Dr. Phelan: I see the role of the council, in any administration, republican or democratic, as being a voice of sober facts and analysis. Politics is not a bad word. It is essential to the governing of a free society. But there needs to be a place at the table, at least internally, for non-political analysis. In the creation of the council, our lawmakers quite deliberately created the council of economic advisers, not the council of economic policymakers. It is imperative the chair of the council understands this.
▶ 0:32:10Dr. Phelan: I do. Regarding the role of the chairman specifically, I see it as facilitating and coordinating such economic analysis within the cea itself, and working with those outside the cea -- members of the administration, agencies , departments, congress, and the public -- to advance our common goal of an economy which enables genuine human flourishing. I have not yet outlined my specific areas of interest and concern, my goals as an individual for economic policy. I have them.
▶ 0:32:40Dr. Phelan: I care very much about financial stability. I care very much of about generational issues -- leaving, in the words of the preamble to the constitution, our posterity a better country than the one we inherited ourselves. I care very much about making the economy one where every individual believes, with justification, that he or she is getting a fair shake. And I will work, when appropriate, to further these individual goals of mine. But these will not be my main focus, because this position is not about me or my individual goals.
▶ 0:33:11Dr. Phelan: My relentless focus will be that the council of economic advisers accomplishes its mission of helping the elected government of this great republic through its well-defined and appropriate role, using words from the legislation which created the council, "to develop and recommend to the president national economic policies to foster and promote free competitive enterprise, including small and larger businesses, to avoid economic fluctuations or to diminish the effects thereof, and to maintain full employment, production, and purchasing power."
▶ 0:33:42Dr. Phelan: Thank you, and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:33:45Chair Scott: Thank you, sir. Mr. crews, the floor is yours.
▶ 0:33:52Mr. Crews: Chairman scott, ranking member warren, committee members, I am honored to have my nomination considered by you today. I would like to thank you and your staff for taking the time to meet with me and discuss my nomination. As a former senate staffer I understand how valuable your time is and how many competing demands there are in your schedules. I'm honored to be nominated to be a board member of the national credit union administration by president trump. I appreciate the trust and support that the president has placed in me.
▶ 0:34:21Mr. Crews: I also appreciate support I have received -- thank you. I also appreciate support I have received from treasury secretary bessent and my many colleagues at the treasury department. Most importantly, I need to thank my family for their love and support. My amazing wife and kids, jean, jack and josie, as well as my mom and dad, meg and jack. My decade and a half of government service has focused almost exclusively on financial services.
▶ 0:34:50Mr. Crews: In that time, I have been fortunate enough to spend almost 10 years either working on the banking committee or working for members of the banking committee. Working on important bipartisan legislation like the economic growth, regulatory relief, and consumer protection act, better known as s. 2155, the otto warmbier brink act, and the cares act are highlights of my time working with the committee.
▶ 0:35:13Mr. Crews: I am proud of the bipartisan work I have been able to do throughout my government service, and my work on financial regulatory policy has left me with a deep appreciation for the importance of tailoring laws and regulations. If confirmed, I look forward to working with credit unions to ensure the safety and soundness of the credit union system while also recognizing the uniqueness of their cooperative nature and unique size. I am lucky to have worked for an extraordinary group of bosses like senator toomey, larry kudlow, majority leader scalise, and secretary bessent.
▶ 0:35:43Mr. Crews: I seek to emulate their dedication and diligence every day on the job. If confirmed, I will endeavor to lead ncua as they might -- that is, I will be thoughtful and steady in my leadership. I will listen to stakeholders in the credit union movement and in the agency to ensure all views are heard as I execute the agency's strategic agenda.
▶ 0:36:04Mr. Crews: If confirmed, my primary focus at ncua will always be the same day -- will always be safety soundness, and resilience , of the credit union system. To that end, I have several policy priorities that I hope to pursue. First, ncua must be efficient, effective, and risk-based in its supervision. The overwhelming majority of credit unions are quite small. They need and deserve a regulator that respects their limited resources.
▶ 0:36:27Mr. Crews: An efficient, risk-based approach to supervision has the added benefit of allowing ncua to deploy its limited resources to where they are needed most. Second, ncua must be ready for technological innovation within the credit union system. The current ncua chairman, kyle hayuptman, has prioritized technological innovation at ncua and within the credit union system. I hope to build and expand on his work.
▶ 0:36:55Mr. Crews: Response advancements, such as stable coins -- ai, or otherwise -- improve member experiences and provide new pathways to reach the underserved. Finally, I hope to support de novo chartering of credit unions. I understand that it is incredibly challenging to create a new credit union or bank, but de novos are a priority for the administration and they are a priority for me. New credit unions are a sign of health within the credit union system, and they often reach new, underserved communities. We need to do more to support new market entrants.
▶ 0:37:25Mr. Crews: When credit unions and their members are thriving, the american dream is thriving. In 2025, almost 28% of credit union lending was for auto loans. Another 57% of loans were for mortgages and real estate. A first car or a first home are quintessential milestones in the american dream. For many americans, these milestones are possible because of their local credit union.
▶ 0:37:47Mr. Crews: If confirmed, I look forward to working with congress, my counterparts in the administration, and the with the staff at ncua to support the safe and sound operations of a credit union system that delivers on its members' financial needs. Thank you again for considering my nomination. I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:38:08Chair Scott: Mr. ledbetter, the floor is yours.
▶ 0:38:13Mr. Ledbetter: Chairman scott, ranking member warren, and distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today as you consider my nomination to serve as the inspector general for the U.S. department of housing and urban development. I am deeply honored by the trust placed in me by president trump. I am also honored to be here today with my wife, reka, who has been steadfast in her support of me throughout my career and throughout this confirmation process.
▶ 0:38:41Mr. Ledbetter: If confirmed, I look forward to working with this committee and all members of congress to ensure robust, independent oversight of hud and its program participants. I have served my country as a soldier and a public servant for 36 years. More than 30 of those years have been dedicated to federal law enforcement across six presidential administrations from both political parties. In my career, I have never wavered from the foundational commitment to objectively apply facts and law, completely independent of political considerations.
▶ 0:39:11Mr. Ledbetter: Should I be confirmed for this position, I commit to doing the same as the inspector general. The inspector general community was my professional home for most of my law enforcement career. Serving as both a special agent and as a leader with the department of defense office of inspector general, I directed complex, multi-jurisdictional investigations in partnership with nearly every major federal law enforcement agency, and many other offices of inspector general.
▶ 0:39:42Mr. Ledbetter: I have personally conducted or supervised work returning more than $100 million to the federal government. Highlighting the breadth of my experience, I was honored to serve during my career on the fbi joint terrorism task force, a homeland security investigations task force, and the international contract corruption task force in baghdad, iraq. My law enforcement career is not limited, however, to the department of defense office of inspector general.
▶ 0:40:10Mr. Ledbetter: It started it as a soldier and -- started as a soldier and special agent with the U.S. army criminal investigation division, a role I continued in the U.S. army reserve. I ultimately reached the rank of chief warrant officer 5, the most senior rank available to a special agent in the U.S. army. With several tours of active-duty service, I gained significant executive experience by commanding the largest army cid detachment in history and leading personnel that provide d global security for the secretary of defense and other senior pentagon officials.
▶ 0:40:40Mr. Ledbetter: If confirmed by the U.S. senate, I will bring decades of investigative and leadership experience to hud and look forward to working with the professional staff of hud oig. I understand first-hand the importance of timely, thorough, objective, and independent oversight work that prevents and detects fraud, waste, and abuse, protects whistleblowers, and promotes efficiency, effectiveness, and economy.
▶ 0:41:04Mr. Ledbetter: Should I be confirmed, I am committed to delivering this work and the unvarnished truth to the secretary and congress, ensuring that both are fully and currently informed. My career has equipped me with the investigative expertise, management acumen, and moral courage necessary to safeguard taxpayer dollars and the integrity of hud's mission. I am honored by your consideration today. Thank you, and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:41:32Chair Scott: I will start our round of questions. We each get five minutes to ask questions. Dr. phelan, one of the questions I have is about the correlation between the regulatory burdens that a government places on the american people and the impact it has on inflation. My assumption is under president trump we have seen relaxing of the regulatory burdens ultimately as a good thing.
▶ 0:42:01Chair Scott: Someone said the cost of those burdens could be as high as $2100 per family of four in regulatory costs passed down. Your thoughts on the correlation to the regulatory burden and inflation?
▶ 0:42:14Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. Thank you for meeting me in your office. Regulatory burdens matter. The cea, which I would be honored to if confirmed, has a crew of excellent phd economists. One came out recently on simply the cost of the regulatory burden when it comes to housing can be $7,100 per house.
▶ 0:42:45Dr. Phelan: In general -- what you need is an economy that creates new businesses. That creates new opportunities. And having to go through red tape is quantitatively a significant burden to doing so. It can separate an economy like ours versus an economy in other countries.
▶ 0:43:10Dr. Phelan: One of the things I like to say is the most innovative companies in the world -- in the world -- nvidia, spacex, tesla, apple -- these are all american. That points to a severe advantage that the united states has, and it can be made better through deregulation, as this administration is doing.
▶ 0:43:38Chair Scott: The much celebrated, at least by members of the senate, housing bill that we passed actually reinforces the notion there is a way for us to impact positively affordability. I believe senator rounds has a bill on nipa reform to build more houses faster without the hurdles, 100 thousand dollar hurdles you just suggested. How we have long-term impact on the housing market.
▶ 0:44:08Chair Scott: I will ask a second question, the time that you and I spent in my office. We talked a little about artificial intelligence and you made a couple of comments that I thought was helpful. Let me preface with this. The average person in our country is rightfully concerned about a technology they know so little about. We know about search engines. We know about two or three companies.
▶ 0:44:37Chair Scott: But we have a lot to still learn about the impact, positive or negative, of artificial intelligence on this country. I think ultimately it can have a positive impact. Without any question. When you think about job disruption, electricity costs, the impact on rural parts of our country, many americans throughout south carolina where they are building a $9 billion data center in charleston metropolitan area and another in
▶ 0:45:07Chair Scott: The upper part of the state, many americans are very concerned about the initial impact from a job perspective as well as some of the undue burdens that can be placed on them as opposed to the ai companies. Any thoughts on how we have seen the transformation in our economy over the last one hundred years or so based on technology?
▶ 0:45:33Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I remember our conversation about that. Whenever something comes up I as an academic look back at history. The history of technological innovation -- we used to have 80% of the people working on the farm in this country just to get the rest of us from dying from caloric deprivation. Now it is 1% to 2%. That was due to productivity gains.
▶ 0:46:03Dr. Phelan: There used to be entire job classifications associated with connecting a phone from one person to another. This ability -- ai ic as -- ai I see as a very promising technology but it falls in what we have seen before and technological improvements we have seen before that allow us to have the economy we have.
▶ 0:46:29Chair Scott: Thank you. I no longer suffer from caloric deprivation. Appreciate the comment. Senator warren.
▶ 0:46:39Sen. Moran: Dr. phelan, if you are confirmed, your job would be to advise president trump on economic policy. The council of economic advisers is "charged with offering the president objective economic advice." not political advice. Objective economic advice. Let's go through a few objective facts. Americans are spending more on everything from fast food to groceries.
▶ 0:47:09Sen. Moran: Prices are rising faster than paychex. Trump' is one big, beautiful bill rips away health care coverage for 15 million people in order to pay for tax cuts for billionaires and a giant corporations. And it adds $4.7 trillion to the national debt. That is why we need someone who will tell the truth about the economy and not say whatever it is the president wants them to say.
▶ 0:47:39Sen. Moran: You have a phd in economics from a prestigious university. You have been a professor for nearly 30 years. You have taught thousands of students by this point. On paper you look like someone who should be able to provide objective advice. So, I have some questions. Quite frankly, I hope they are really easy questions for you.
▶ 0:48:03Sen. Moran: President trump promised to bring prices down on "day one." is headline inflation higher today than it was in february 2025?
▶ 0:48:14Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. Headline inflation now is certainly lower then it was during the biden administration.
▶ 0:48:29Sen. Moran: Come on. Let's not play this game. You heard my question. President trump was sworn in in january 2025 under the promise he would lower costs on day one. The question I'm asking is, is inflation, headline inflation today higher than it was in february 2020 five? It is a fact question.
▶ 0:48:51Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. There is a reason economists tend to focus on core inflation. That is because food and energy is quite volatile. Core inflation is lower than when the president took office.
▶ 0:49:05Sen. Warren: Can you give me the answer on headline inflation? I don't want to know how fast you can dance. I want to know if you can answer simple, factual questions. That is all I'm looking for here.
▶ 0:49:18Dr. Phelan: Thank you, ranking member. I don't know exactly what headline inflation was on january --
▶ 0:49:25Sen. Warren: 2.8%. So, is headline inflation higher today than it was in february 2025?
▶ 0:49:36Dr. Phelan: Headline inflation now, the last one year over year was 4.2%.
▶ 0:49:43Sen. Warren: Is 4.2% higher than 2.8%.
▶ 0:49:51Dr. Phelan: Ranking member, yes it is.
▶ 0:49:51Sen. Warren: Wow, was that so hard? You're going to be the guy called on to give real facts. Let me try another one. Dr. phelan, is annual inflation higher than wage growth today?
▶ 0:50:07Dr. Phelan: Thank you, ranking number. There has been, since president trump office, weekly inflation-adjusted earnings are higher now than they were the day president took office.
▶ 0:50:22Sen. Warren: The question I asked you is, is inflation higher than wage growth right now? In other words, even if families are getting raises on average are they falling behind because of inflation?
▶ 0:50:36Dr. Phelan: Thank you, ranking member. I do think it is important to have an appropriate timeframe --
▶ 0:50:43Sen. Warren: Now. That is your timeframe.
▶ 0:50:47Dr. Phelan: When president took
▶ 0:50:49Office -- Sen. Warren: I just want facts. Today our families getting ahead or falling behind? You have one word to answer that. What is your word?
▶ 0:51:01Dr. Phelan: My word is at
▶ 0:51:03Sen. Warren: Your word is at? Inflation is 4.2%, right? What is the annual wage growth right now? It is a fact question.
▶ 0:51:18Dr. Phelan: I do not have that in front of me right now.
▶ 0:51:22Sen. Warren: 3.4 percent. Is 4.2% higher than 3.4%?
▶ 0:51:28Dr. Phelan: I will repeat what I said. Real wage growth in this administration is positive.
▶ 0:51:37Sen. Warren: It is right now families are falling behind. I got to say, I can keep this one up. Fact after fact. You have now made clear what your position is. That is, you cannot even do basic facts. I didn't even get to the hard questions about what this means. I just want to start with what the facts are. These are facts that come out of the trump administration. They are there for anybody to see.
▶ 0:52:04Sen. Warren: And you can't bring yourself, as the person who sits there and says I want to be the head of the council of economic advisers -- I'm sorry, to give objective economic advice and you can't say inflation is running higher than wages right now? >> we are going to have to keep it on behalf of the chairman to five minutes.
▶ 0:52:28Sen. Warren: I think this person has disqualified themselves in five minutes. >> on behalf of the chairman I will call on myself next. Dr. phelan, I know we have been talking a little and the ranking member is talking point to point. I'm curious. Most people in south dakota care deeply about how much money they have to spend. A lot of what that depends on is not only how much they have in wage growth. They talk about how much money they have after taxes.
▶ 0:52:59Sen. Warren: Can we talk a little about the importance of the big picture in terms of what happens when you put into effect also the working families tax cut program, which republicans have passed and is now in law coming up on the one-year anniversary? We are talking about, at least in south dakota, a $3750 real cash reduction in taxes and a per family basis.
▶ 0:53:29Sen. Warren: In fact, we're talking about almost 6300 dollars average for an american family in terms of additional money in their pocket after you take into account the working families tax cuts reduction and with the federal government is taking from families. Isn't it true what most americans -- at least with people in south dakota -- care about is how much money they have to spend on daily expenses and so forth?
▶ 0:53:58Sen. Warren: Can you talk a little about that and how people feel about that and how economists look at that?
▶ 0:54:03Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. Thank you for meeting me in your office. The working family tax cut act I see is incredibly important accomplishment of this body because it took away what would have been either the largest or one of the largest tax increases on almost everybody in the economy. The 2017 tax cut act had major portions of it that would have expired.
▶ 0:54:34Dr. Phelan: I saw the -- both the potential expiration of tax cuts on individuals and many of the major reforms are how we tax corporations and so forth. They were absolutely needed in 2017. As a sort of damocles over the economy, we have seen a boon in investment. Consumer spending has been very strong.
▶ 0:55:00Dr. Phelan: Part of that -- which, by the way, is a way of households showing confidence in their future. All of this I saw as being made possible by not forcing through or by inaction having implemented one of the largest tax increases we would see.
▶ 0:55:25Sen. Rounds: I think we are really talking about for most americans how much money they have in their pockets to spend. You have to take into account not only their real wage increases, but you have to take into account the amount that we are not taking from them in terms of additional taxes. That gives them more money to spend. I am curious.
▶ 0:55:46Sen. Rounds: We have been talking, and I appreciated our conversation, we talked about e-15 and the impact of voluntary e-15 nationwide availability of basically liquid fuels with the 15% ethanol embedded in it on a voluntary basis and what the impact would be on gas prices. Once again, bringing gas prices down.
▶ 0:56:10Sen. Rounds: I noted this morning we have had during the time in which the president correctly went in and addressed the issue of a possible nuclear-armed iran, he did that because as commander-in-chief that is his responsibility, and those are tough decisions to make. During that same time he also prepare the people. He said we are not going to be in it for long, but during that time period fuel prices, oil prices went up.
▶ 0:56:39Sen. Rounds: I noted this morning west texas crude is below $70 a gallon. $70 a barrel. $69 and some odd cents right now. Can you talk about the impact on inflation as we move forward as we talk about the reduction in the price of a barrel of crude, and it takes time for that to come into the economy, can you share how you look at that as an economist and what that does for prices for the average american?
▶ 0:57:11Dr. Phelan: I did look at the price of west texas crude this morning. It is 9% below when president trump took office if I did my math correctly. June inflation -- june is not finished yet but is almost finished -- if gas prices stay where they were it will have a significant impact on headline inflation for june. That is just arithmetic.
▶ 0:57:43Sen. Rounds: It is still coming, but it is coming fairly quickly?
▶ 0:57:49Dr. Phelan: Under the assumption gas prices stay where they are now for the next seven days.
▶ 0:57:54Sen. Rounds: My time is expiring but you mentioned the chairman giving me credit earlier for changes in the nepa regulations that will make it less expensive I believe long-term for housing. I want to share it was a bipartisan effort with senator smith as well from minnesota that we did this together. I think that is something that will stand the test of time and help bring down the price of housing as well. Thank you, Mr. chairman, I will yield back.
▶ 0:58:22Chair Scott: Senator cortez masto.
▶ 0:58:23Sen. Cortez Masto: I will defer to my colleague.
▶ 0:58:27Sen. Reed: Thank you, Mr. chairman. You mentioned the generational issues we are facing. One of them is a credible reconcentration of wealth in the 1% of americans, something that was -- something we saw in the gilded age and we made progress of changes to fix that for working people. 32% of the total wealth is now controlled by 1% of the people.
▶ 0:58:56Sen. Reed: That is a new record according to the federal reserve. In consumer spending is being driven by that group of people, usually on expensive automobiles, houses, etc. Last year president trump added to their benefits with about a 250,000 per year tax cut for these people. You have been talking about the working tax cut of several thousand dollars, which has already been eclipsed by the tariffs on the war with iran.
▶ 0:59:27Sen. Reed: How do we reorient our policy so that working americans start to share in this wealth that is being generated and frankly captured by very few people?
▶ 0:59:40Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. Thank you for our conversation in your office. I enjoyed it immensely. Right now I think america is the best place in the world to be a participant in the economy at any level. We have had -- we are the envy of the world in terms of job growth, wage growth, standard of living growth.
▶ 1:00:09Sen. Reed: Why is roughly 70% of the population so concerned about their economic future, about affordability, and the startling fact that a huge majority of people saying they believe their children will not enjoy the same kind of life they did?
▶ 1:00:30Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. In general one of the reasons I mentioned earlier about consumption growth being very strong was economists tend to discount survey data, because -- I like to look at what people do versus what they say.
▶ 1:00:56Dr. Phelan: When someone decides to spend, that is a vote with their own dollars that they believe in their future. And consumer spending has been quite strong.
▶ 1:01:09Sen. Reed: As I said, most of that is being led by the wealthiest americans. Most working americans in my state and south dakota come across the country, are struggling with very high gas prices, high grocery prices, with the sense of one paycheck to one paycheck. And the administration I don't think is responding effectively.
▶ 1:01:35Sen. Reed: Let me quickly say, if you are asked as the chairman of the council of economic advisers whether the president should veto the road bill, what would your advice be?
▶ 1:01:47Dr. Phelan: Thank you. I firmly believe the most important word in the council of economic advisers is the last one. Advisers. I would advise on economic issues as mandated by the jobs act, which created the job that I am being asked -- being considered for by this body. I have no expertise on political questions. Like I said, I do not consider politics --
▶ 1:02:14Sen. Reed: I want you to address this as an economic question. With the benefits of this legislation attribute to more affordability for housing? This is just an economic issue.
▶ 1:02:29Dr. Phelan: If the president asked of the economic council to produce a report on what would be the effect of this law I would happy to be provide accurate numbers.
▶ 1:02:35Sen. Reed: Thank you very much even though you won't respond. I don't want to feel like you gentlemen are completely ignored. Mr. ledbetter, thank you for your service to the united states army. I learned never to mess with a w 5. I would like you to commit to enforcing the fact that many times had is not putting money out. They are delaying it deliberately.
▶ 1:03:04Sen. Reed: And I think with a political motivation. As inspector general I would hope you will ensure the money is distributed on time to the proper target.
▶ 1:03:12Mr. Ledbetter: Good morning, sir. I wanted to say thank you for taking the time to meet with me during this. As we discussed in your office, I don't have the specifics on the program you mentioned. However, I do commit to reviewing any matters that you or your staff may be of concern to you at any time. If there is an issue out there that needs my attention and it is important to you I will commit to meeting with you and discussing it.
▶ 1:03:43Sen. Reed: Mr. crews, welcome and good luck.
▶ 1:03:45Chair Scott: Senator moreno, the floor is yours. [indiscernible]
▶ 1:04:01Sen. Moreno: I just want to make sure we got that on the record. In terms of inflation, Dr. phelan, what would be the effect on inflation and gas prices if iran dropped a nuclear bomb on a european city?
▶ 1:04:16Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator moreno. Thank you for meeting with me. That is the kind of question that I firmly believe that one of the main advantages of economists is the ability to put a number on something. That is not something that one does lightly. If I were asked that question by your office, by anybody else's office, there is a great crew of phd economists at the council.
▶ 1:04:44Dr. Phelan: I would ask you, how quickly do you need an answer?
▶ 1:04:47Sen. Moreno: Someone as unsophisticated as a former car dealer would say that it would be extraordinarily high and catastrophic and we would not be talking about for a dollar per gallon gas. It would be a depression-generating massive explosion. 80% inflation versus 18%. It would be extraordinarily bad, as they say in the movies. Very, very, very bad. Right.
▶ 1:05:15Dr. Phelan: I do believe the effect would be --
▶ 1:05:19Sen. Moreno: I'm not allowed to use different language than that because of the chairman. I would just say it will be very bad. You are welcome. It is fair to say that it would be fairly obvious if the president took action against iran to prevent them from having a nuclear weapon they would actually use that you're going to see a spike in gas prices. But now that we've gotten a path to peace that those gas prices have come down very, very quickly that we are able to go back to where we were last year.
▶ 1:05:50Sen. Moreno: Which is dramatically lower inflation than we had under biden, is that accurate?
▶ 1:05:56Dr. Phelan: The price level at the end of the biden administration was approximately 21% higher than the price level at the beginning of the biden administration. We are inflation on an annualized basis is significantly lower than that pace.
▶ 1:06:12Sen. Moreno: 5%, does that sound right?
▶ 1:06:15Dr. Phelan: 5% more or less during the buying and administration. The trump administration is lower than that.
▶ 1:06:22Sen. Moreno: So we have brought down the price. We had a big egg conversation the other day. Some people buy nine dollar eggs. The good news is they were on sale at wegmans for $1.49. We are not allowed to promote businesses so that is not a commercial for wegmans, but $1.49 for a dozen eggs is a pretty good deal.
▶ 1:06:44Sen. Moreno: The massive stimulus that led to historical levels of fraud under the biden administration, did that help lower inflation or raise inflation?
▶ 1:06:53Dr. Phelan: --
▶ 1:06:56Sen. Moreno: Generally speaking as an economist.
▶ 1:07:01Dr. Phelan: Generally speaking the rule for economics is -- this is an oversimplification. Inflation is caused by too much money chasing too few goods.
▶ 1:07:13Sen. Moreno: There for a second. At a time during covid when there was a supply shock also, where supply was way down because of these ridiculous rules about social distancing and everything else that was a total disaster -- you had the supply shock and then stimulus. Would it have surprised you that we saw up to 9% inflation that destroyed working americans? Flat wage growth and 9% inflation? What does that do to a working family?
▶ 1:07:42Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. No, I was not surprised.
▶ 1:07:47Sen. Moreno: You didn't have to get a phd to figure that out, did you?
▶ 1:07:53Dr. Phelan: I did.
▶ 1:07:55Sen. Moreno: It could have been so much easier. There are great community colleges in ohio. I went to the library and they have a book called supply and demand for dummies. It is fantastic. The last one is regulations. If the government goes in and creates massive amounts of regulations to make it difficult for businesses to operate, does that make them be able to have lower prices or higher prices?
▶ 1:08:20Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I think this is a good comparison is the united states versus europe which prides itself as being a leader in regulation. If you look at what companies -- there is a reason why spacex, apple, microsoft, amazon -- they were all created in the united states and in europe you have louis vuitton. Created in the 1800s.
▶ 1:08:45Senator Moreno: We are happy we have a lower regulatory environment. How much has deposit flight existed for credit unions because of stable coins? What billions of dollars have left credit unions as a result of stable points? I want to write that number down. Would it be zero? So, no deposit flight.
▶ 1:09:16Mr. Crews: Last year, deposits grew at credit unions.
▶ 1:09:21Sen. Moreno: What did you say?
▶ 1:09:23Mr. Crews: The deposit base grew.
▶ 1:09:27Sen. Moreno: But stable coins were going to destroy the deposit base in americans. We will allow that question for the record.
▶ 1:09:36Chair Scott: Thank you, sir. Senator ccm.
▶ 1:09:46Sen. Cortez Masto: . I appreciate you all coming to talk with me. Individually. Welcome to your family members. Let me start with the topic of discussion that seems to be today, and rightfully so, housing. I am concerned, as we have all seen and talked about, we have a bipartisan, bicameral housing bill that will make a difference in the lives of so many americans across the country, including nevada, and it was not signed yesterday. People need housing.
▶ 1:10:16Sen. Cortez Masto: People need housing in this country. I can't stress that enough. It means so much to so many. It is more than a roof over your head. Let me ask a couple of questions here. I am concerned that in the president's budget he eliminated federal funding for programs like home and the housing trust fund. His administration, the omb refuses to disburse funds that congress has already allocated.
▶ 1:10:43Sen. Cortez Masto: Yesterday, as we seen, he refused to sign the bipartisan bicameral housing bill. If confirmed, let me ask you, Mr. phelan, -- Dr. phelan, excuse me. Would you recommend he signed the housing bill?
▶ 1:10:58Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I very much enjoyed our conversation. I do not believe it's appropriate for the chairman of the council of economic advisers, which I would do if confirmed, to say I recommend signing this or not signing that. I would not do that for any bill. What I would do is, if asked, provide advantages or disadvantages to this law being passed or not.
▶ 1:11:24Sen. Cortez Masto: What if you were asked about funding being appropriated for housing that is not being released? Would you weigh in on that?
▶ 1:11:35Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I would weigh in on the economic effects of releasing or not releasing. Again, I would not make any --
▶ 1:11:57Sen. Cortez Masto: Based on your analysis and your background, do you think housing is an issue in this country? Affordable housing?
▶ 1:12:00Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I believe across every decade across every country housing is important, because in most places it is about 30% of one's expenditures. Yes, housing is important today because housing is important always.
▶ 1:12:11Sen. Cortez Masto: Mr. ledbetter, would you monitor and report to congress any hud leadership delays in disbursing congressionally appropriated funds to grantees?
▶ 1:12:22Mr. Ledbetter: Thank you for the question and your time in meeting with me during this process. Regarding that, not specifically familiar with that policy, however I would commit to reporting any violations that would fall under the ig by the agency.
▶ 1:12:40Sen. Cortez Masto: If the agency fails to follow the law you would report to the agency?
▶ 1:12:47Mr. Ledbetter: That is part of the role of the ig.
▶ 1:12:50Sen. Cortez Masto: Dr. phelan, travel and tourism are a trillion dollar industry to the united states. What conversation are you going to have with the administration, if any, with respect to tourism and travel that actually has dipped under this administration because of his policies? We are seeing the impact clearly not only across the country but in nevada where las vegas is. We are down 7.8%. This is the first time we have a deficit.
▶ 1:13:20Sen. Cortez Masto: Nearly $14 billion deficit in travel trade since 2025 and it is because of this administration's policies. They are bad policies. How would you address that with him?
▶ 1:13:31Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I would essentially come if the council were asked, what is the economic impact of any changes in tourism spending, we would -- I would either answer directly or help guide someone else at the council to give a quantitative answer to that question.
▶ 1:13:53Sen. Cortez Masto: Let me ask you this. Do you think that an individual is represented, their way of thinking is represented by the tweets they have put out?
▶ 1:14:05Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I'm not sure exactly what the question --
▶ 1:14:11Sen. Cortez Masto: Should we consider the tweets you have put out in how you will manage the day-to-day operations of the office? Do they reflect your positions were not?
▶ 1:14:23Dr. Phelan: I consider the role that I am being nominated for --
▶ 1:14:28Sen. Cortez Masto: Should I discount your tweets or do I take into consideration what you have put out there, that you have personally said, that that is how you feel and that is how you will run this office? Or are those not -- that is not the case. Please tell me. Do you accept all the tweets you have put out as how you feel --
▶ 1:14:53Dr. Phelan: My x profile is the product of being a university professor for 36 years. The role of the chairman of the council of economic advisers is different from that role.
▶ 1:15:06Sen. Cortez Masto: So, your tweets have nothing to consider with respect to how you are going to run the office and how you feel day-to-day? And I know my time is running out. Mr. chairman, I appreciate it.
▶ 1:15:17Chair Scott: All right, senator ricketts.
▶ 1:15:24Sen. Ricketts: Thank you very much, Mr. chairman. Dr. phelan, Mr. crews, and Mr. ledbetter, thank you for your willingness to serve. Communist china is the greatest threat to the american way of life. They have made it very clear that they will use every lever to expand their interest and underline U.S.
▶ 1:15:53Sen. Ricketts: National security. Confronting this threat requires a company answer strategy that strengthens safety of our financial system, secures assets, and encloses loopholes that communist china seeks to exploit. The council of economic advisers exists to give the president rigorous economic analysis. That should put the communist china threat front and center. The economic report of the president is the council's signature product. Dr.
▶ 1:16:22Sen. Ricketts: Phelan, when confirmed, how will you specifically prioritize the economic tools at our disposal to confront the communist china threat when advising the president?
▶ 1:16:32Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator, and thank you for meeting me. I greatly enjoyed our conversation. As I have said, I tend to look at things in a historical perspective. I like to point out that you can't -- there were people that will identify cars based on a picture of a single little headlight and they will never say that is a 1942 bjork because there are no 1942 bjork.
▶ 1:17:05Dr. Phelan: You were a manufacturing superpower and when the war came we became -- every car factory became a tank factory or airplane factory. It does worry me that china is a manufacturing powerhouse in a troubling way. And so, this administration's policies to reassure manufacturing -- which is showing up in the data -- manufacturing is booming in this country. Manufacturing output is booming in this country.
▶ 1:17:36Dr. Phelan: Is vital.
▶ 1:17:38Sen. Ricketts: So, how also you going to confront the threat to communist china? I agree with you, the manufacturing aspect is a big one. What are other aspects that concern you and how will you advise the president?
▶ 1:17:53Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. In general there is a rivalry that encompasses many issues. As I have said, as chair of the council there is an entire crew of excellent phd economists that have studied supply, that have studied pharmaceuticals. That have studied many of minerals.
▶ 1:18:19Dr. Phelan: Many of the aspects that are in part the entire issue of strategic competition with china. My job would be to make sure that continues and continues at a high level.
▶ 1:18:38Sen. Ricketts: Great. Communist china is our largest threat abroad. Our strength here at home is in our small towns and our farms and ranches. In our main street in nebraska. Smaller banks and credit unions are the background of our communities and the right farm equipment, the mortgage that helps a young family own a home, but knew [indiscernible] have slowed to a trickle.
▶ 1:19:09Sen. Ricketts: In 2025 the ncua charted three new federal credit unions in all major metro areas. When small-town credit unions close their doors there is rarely ever a new one forming to take its place. My rural depositories study act directs the ncua and the fcc to identify how we can help rural depositories grow.
▶ 1:19:36Sen. Ricketts: I want to thank senator warnock, who has partnered with me on this bill to serve rural america. What are your primary drivers for the trends we are seeing in new credit union formation?
▶ 1:19:48Mr. Crews: Thank you for the question, and thanks for taking the time to meet with me this month. I agree it is a serious concern, the downward trend in financial institutions. Especially in rural america. As I mentioned, it would be a priority of mine to find ways to support that the novo chartering of new credit unions.
▶ 1:20:14Mr. Crews: In my opinion we have seen a downward trend for the last two decades. Some of that is competitive, but much of it is a regulatory response that has in an effort to weed out too big to fail has created another problem, which is too small to succeed.
▶ 1:20:33Mr. Crews: But the top of my list when it comes to being an effective regulator is thinking through how we can tailor our regulations to support the success of our smallest institutions, and in particular our rural institutions.
▶ 1:20:46Sen. Ricketts: Amount of time, but thank you very much and I'm looking forward to hearing what your ideas are. Thank you very much, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:20:54Chair Scott: Senator smith.
▶ 1:20:57Sen. Smith: Welcome, everyone, to the committee. Mr. cruz, I'm going to start with you. I appreciated senator ricketts asking about credit unions, which are really important in my home state as well. My question is this. You think the ncua should have a full leadership board?
▶ 1:21:19Mr. Crews: Thank you for the question, senator smith. I'm honored to be nominated to serve at the ncua. If confirmed I will be lucky to go there. As I understand it the current makeup of the board is the subject of litigation, and so I can't comment on that negation except to say that I absolutely will respect the outcome of any court --
▶ 1:21:44Sen. Smith: Doesn't the law prescribed who should be on the board? It prescribes a three-person board and politically balanced. That is just a question of fact, isn't it?
▶ 1:21:57Mr. Crews: Thank you, senator. Yes, the law does prescribe the board makeup, but the current board makeup is the subject of litigation.
▶ 1:22:07Sen. Smith: Well, ok. That is disappointing. I think even though we may have partisan differences we can at least agree that it is good to have these boards have the makeup that was described and was agreed to by congress and the wholesale refusal of the administration to appoint democrats as well as republicans to these boards undermines the
▶ 1:22:37Sen. Smith: Credibility of the boards. It undermines your credibility on the board if you are the only one there. You know, I think that this is a place where there is sort of injecting politics into issues that should not be political and should be something that should be pretty easy to answer. So, I think I got your answer, though. Mr. phelan, Dr. phelan, it is nice to see you again.
▶ 1:23:10Sen. Smith: I wanted to just -- we talked about a lot of stuff, including the state of the economy in minnesota, and I wanted to just pursue a bit more your views on tariffs and the impact they are having on rising prices in this country. My question is pretty basic. How will you advise the president on tariffs and their impact on the economy? Thank you, senator -- Dr.
▶ 1:23:37Phelan: Thank you, senator. I enjoyed meeting you in your office. One of the questions is, are tariffs causing inflation? I believe an excellent study by a researcher at the minneapolis fed for the last decades at least until recently, having been nominated, two of my former colleagues there have done an excellent study of just, are the goods we would expect to go up in price because of tariffs
▶ 1:24:07Phelan: Going up? Things like automobiles, that are subject to tariffs? They did that systematically across all goods and what they found is it is simply not the case that there is a good correlation between tariff-affected goods going up in price and what actually went up in price.
▶ 1:24:24Sen. Smith: Is a your perspective that tariffs are not contributing to inflation?
▶ 1:24:28Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I do believe that tariffs generally cause prices of some goods to go up relative to other goods. But not the price level to go up as a whole. That is mostly, I believe during this body five weeks ago, or maybe seven weeks ago kevin warsh said inflation is on us. That is a fed thing.
▶ 1:24:54Sen. Smith: I was looking at some fed data that showed the tariffs implemented through november 2025 raised the pce by 3.1%. That would argue that tariffs are conceiving to price increases. If you are a minnesotan and prices are going up the distinction between whether prices went up once or whether they are going up over and over again is a meaningless distinction because you are paying more and you are paying more because of this tax on imports.
▶ 1:25:26Sen. Smith: Would you agree at least that tariffs are having a negative impact on the farm economy in minnesota? Where lack of access to markets, skyrocketing costs for inputs have been a real drag on farm income?
▶ 1:25:41Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. My general impression is there is a robust economic discussion going on right now.
▶ 1:25:48Sen. Smith: And you are an academic, so maybe you could tell me what you think about this discussion?
▶ 1:25:53Dr. Phelan: At this point it is too early to tell exactly what the effects of tariffs are.
▶ 1:25:59Sen. Smith: My time is up, but I would argue that minnesotans would say it is too late because they have already experienced the impacts of these tariff increases in ways that are making it harder for them, particularly farmers. Thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:26:15Chair Scott: Senator britt.
▶ 1:26:17Sen. Britt: Think you, Mr. chair. Thank you all for being here. Congratulations on your nominations. Mr. crews, you have served in several roles, from treasury to the banking committee, to the house of representatives, to the white house.
▶ 1:26:36Sen. Britt: As financial services continue to evolve and credit unions are adopting new technologies to make sure they are meeting their customers' needs, expanding their digital offerings and serving increasingly diverse communities in different places, how are you going to make sure you keep them safe? Sure you are giving them the up-to-date technology and we are doing it in a way that it remains safe and sound and well-positioned for the future?
▶ 1:27:08Mr. Crews: Senator, thank you for the question. You are right to holly this issue. Consumers expect and need new and innovative financial services products, including new technology. When it comes to credit unions many of them are uniquely small and have limited resources, and because of that they often work together to access some of these services.
▶ 1:27:36Mr. Crews: From my perspective at ncua, we need to support their efforts to adapt with the economy, grow with the economy and adapt with technological animation. But that is a risk factor. Cyber risk is a serious threat. At my current job I think treasury --
▶ 1:27:56Sen. Britt: How do you balance that? How do you balance allowing them to modernize and encourage that innovation, but also maintain a strong supervision and protection they are? Particularly shared insurance fund?
▶ 1:28:11Mr. Crews: We need to have an open door and be engaging with them day in, day out to understand what they see their customers asking for and implement those products. I think this month under chairman hoffman the ncua released a cyber threat report and I would like to work and build on that work to continue to inform credit unions of where we see risk.
▶ 1:28:34Mr. Crews: But we really need to engage in an open process to understand what their consumers want and how we can make sure that they can provide it.
▶ 1:28:44Sen. Britt: I hope you will balance and make sure you are taking a look at this and cyber threat that is there. Also the fraud happening in so many spaces that I don't think people are being vigilant enough to end. I encourage you to work diligently in those agreements to get consumers what they need, but also protect them in the process. Mr.
▶ 1:29:05Sen. Britt: Ledbetter, hud administers billions of dollars in -- across housing assistance and community development, homelessness programs. I certainly believe in being able to help people get back on their feet and find their pathway to the american dream. What we have seen, though, has been a lot of load in certain areas. Within efficiencies.
▶ 1:29:32Sen. Britt: Look, if you are confirmed as inspector general what would your priorities be for ensuring these taxpayer dollars people worked really hard for are being used wisely and efficiently? That we are rooting out where there is waste, fraud, and abuse so the people that need help, we have the resources to be able to do that?
▶ 1:29:53Mr. Ledbetter: Both, senator, thank you for the question. I'm not there yet, but from my experience in the ig world, and I have read the semiannual report to congress on the areas they are involved with right now and I have met with the end sister and -- this distant inspector general's. From what I can tell obviously they have got a lot of work out there but they are making headway.
▶ 1:30:20Mr. Ledbetter: If confirmed I would look forward to first meeting with the professional staff that hud and learning the people and programs and continuing the good work they have been doing and then once I accomplish the first 90 to 180 days if there is room for improvement, those are --
▶ 1:30:40Sen. Britt: Will you commit that you will follow that leading it to the bottom of it? We need to help people. We need to do it in a way that is sustainable.
▶ 1:30:50Mr. Ledbetter: Absolutely.
▶ 1:30:51Sen. Britt: Mr. phelan, families across alabama and our country -- and I have heard my colleagues talk to you about this -- continue to site affordability as obviously one of the top concerns, whether that is housing or whether that is childcare or groceries or energy costs. What are the most important factors driving affordability challenges today in your opinion?
▶ 1:31:17Sen. Britt: And what policies do you believe can expand economic opportunity for citizens and improve standard of living for people in the state of alabama?
▶ 1:31:30Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. I believe the best policy for affordability is a good job. And a good job with good wages and good benefits. And I would work toward making it for policies or advocate for policies or advise policies which make that most likely to happen.
▶ 1:31:49Sen. Britt: Thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:31:51Chair Scott: Senator hagerty.
▶ 1:31:56Sen. Hagerty: Thank you, Mr. chair, and congratulations to all of the nominees here today. Dr. phelan, I would like to start with you. If anything about the global economy and the stress we see on the global economy, including the conflict with iran, you look at the U.S. economy and it has been remarkably resilient. As I think about it, domestic energy production continues to pick up.
▶ 1:32:24Sen. Hagerty: Capital investment in america rose by innovation, and also the remarkable incentives for capital investment that were in the working families tax-cut act we passed last year. As I see energy prices begin to come down that seems to me to take some inflationary pressure off the economy. I would like to get your perspective on how the U.S. economy looks, will be looking in the future, and am I right to be as optimistic as I am?
▶ 1:32:52Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. Thank you for meeting in your office. I'm optimistic about the american economy. You mentioned the word resilience. People have quantitatively looked at the size of the current oil shock we had to the reaction market prices and when I was a teenager I drove people's cars for the gas station to wait in line. The shock we got in 1979 was small.
▶ 1:33:23Dr. Phelan: The resilience of the american economy. We are an oil-exporting nation due to our ability. I believe we are now one of the top toward the top oil-producing nations in the world. That was not true in the past. That is an amazing accomplishment. Partially due to the fact that assuring in sensible regulation, so, yes, part of that is we are seeing a boom in manufacturing.
▶ 1:33:55Dr. Phelan: We are seeing a boom in exports. The kind of imports we have are changing. We are no longer importing chiefly consumer goods. We are importing equipment for factories, which, again, I mentioned in my opening statement. What I really care about is leaving an economy that is better for our children than the one that was left for us. Investment is the future. Consumption is now.
▶ 1:34:23Dr. Phelan: That is what makes me optimistic like it makes you optimistic.
▶ 1:34:27Sen. Hagerty: Let's turn to homeownership for a moment. If you think about it, the average age for a homebuyer in the 1990's was 28 years old. Today that has moved up to 40. Homeownership has become increasingly difficult for americans and I agree with the president. The number one issue for homeownership is interest rates and that is the medically impactful terms of affordability of housing. If I think about what we can do as legislators, I think we should be focusing on something else. We can address via legislation.
▶ 1:35:00Sen. Hagerty: That is, overregulation. I would like to get your thoughts on the impact of the cost, the cumulative effect of the fees, the mandates, the permitting timelines and all of these things that step into the increased cost. The regulatory cost of the housing supply and the constraints it has on the housing supply in america.
▶ 1:35:20Dr. Phelan: Thank you, senator. This study happened before I showed up. The -- but there is a cea study that as much as $100,000 per house is due to unnecessary regulation.
▶ 1:35:33Sen. Hagerty: I call that the bureaucrat tax.
▶ 1:35:37Dr. Phelan: Economists will find a way of modeling anything as a tax. But it is. And one of the things that concerns me about this country, although I am generally optimistic, as we have had productivity growth in industry after industry, but the construction industry. Construction we have not had productivity growth either public or private construction such as housing. That is a concern.
▶ 1:36:07Sen. Hagerty: The supply situation is something I think we can address. I have introduced the freedom to build act here. That has put in place incentives that would motivate locales to step up permitting reform, innovation, so we can see the regulatory regime, if you will, to be much more streamlined and much more effective and we will spend more time on this committee focusing on that. Mr.
▶ 1:36:33Sen. Hagerty: Crews, I would like to turn to you to say for the benefit of staff that are here, it is wonderful to see a former senate staffer come back to serve again. Credit unions play a vital role in my state and across the country and I want to commend you and say that I appreciate the fact that you are here before us today, knowing you serve as an inspiration to many people sitting behind me here. Thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:36:57Chair Scott: Thank you. Well said. That concludes the question and answer portion of this committee. I would like to thank our witnesses for being with us today. For the senators, all follow-on questions for the record must be submitted by noon, wednesday, july 1. Witnesses, please respond by 5:00 p.m. On wednesday, july 8, to the written questions you received in order to facilitate this committee probably processing your nominations.
▶ 1:37:26Chair Scott: With that, the hearing is adjourned.