▶ 0:21:59>> good afternoon and thank you all for being here. We have several bills on the agenda. Senator bennet, I know you are on a very tight timeframe and have an important piece of legislation you would like to discuss.
▶ 0:22:15Sen. Bennet: Thank you. I'm very grateful that you, the ranking member, and senator heinrich are here today. Thank you for allowing me to speak about an iconic colorado landscape and the resource protection act -- a bipartisan bill that senator hickenlooper, representative heard, and I have to protect an area with spectacular alpine wildfire --
▶ 0:22:47Sen. Bennet: Wildflowers and lush forest. The support family ranch and cutting edge scientific research and world-class outdoor recreation. They are critical headwaters of the colorado river, including some of the most important habitat in our state. They are a home for a number of at risk species.
▶ 0:23:07Sen. Bennet: Over a decade ago, I stood on the blanks of -- the banks of the slate river and promised the local community that if they could agree on a shared vision to protect this landscape, I would carry a bill to help make that vision a reality, and they did.
▶ 0:23:25Sen. Bennet: Ranchers, conservationists, sportsmen, snowmobilers, dirt bikers, mountain bikers, water users, and local election officials spent hours, months, many of them as volunteers, poring over maps and walking these lands together to find common ground. Since those initial conversations, we have worked with seven counties in western colorado, some led by democrats and some led by republicans.
▶ 0:23:54Sen. Bennet: Colorado's tribes, and the general public. These conversations reflect broad vision for the landscape. Bipartisan agreement on common sense solutions. And ultimately strong support for the natural resource protection act, or as we call it, the gorka act. It includes eight differently management designations, reflecting the unique values on this landscape. The legislation does not close any roads or trails.
▶ 0:24:24Sen. Bennet: It maintains existing uses of the land. Right now, colorado is reeling from fires across our state. I know my colleagues on this day us are incredibly sensitive to the challenges we are all facing in the western united states. The gold mountain and elk fires are burning on lands within and adjacent to this.
▶ 0:24:46Sen. Bennet: The coalition that developed this legislation anticipated the realities of hotter, drier conditions that are driving fires like those, and including measures to try to help look ahead to prepare for the future. Gort ensures federal land management can continue to fight fires with all the available tools. That includes provisions to continue hazardous waste reduction work.
▶ 0:25:11Sen. Bennet: As evidence of the broad coalition behind this legislation, I have brought over two dozen letters of support from local governments, tribes, public land users, and over 100 local businesses. I ask unanimous consent to enter these letters into the record.
▶ 0:25:28Sen. Barrasso: Without objection.
▶ 0:25:32Sen. Bennet: And I ask your support in advancing this legislation -- the broad bipartisan grassroots consensus that underlies gort should be a model, I think, for the type of legislation that we champion and pass in the senate. Thank you very much for your time. Mr. chairman, thank you for allowing me to kick off this important hearing.
▶ 0:25:52Sen. Barrasso: We appreciate your testimony and comments and thank you. We are grateful for your leadership, senator bennet. Thank all of you for being here. We have several bills on the agenda in addition to senator bennet's and look forward to hearing from the witnesses to discuss each of them. I want to thank a -- thanks senator cortez masto. She has been an incredible partner on this subcommittee.
▶ 0:26:18Sen. Barrasso: The first bill is my bill to amend the minimum leasing act. It allows for deferred payment of bonus bids. There has been no new leasing in the wyoming basin since 2012. This is a result of the past administration's regulatory attacks and a moratorium on coal mining. Coal companies have relied exclusively on mining current reserves. We are going to run out by 2049 or earlier.
▶ 0:26:47Sen. Barrasso: At the same time, the demand for electricity continues to rise at a dramatic rate. Reliable baseload power generated by coal can meet this demand. It is only possible if federal coal is economical. We have stopped malicious regulatory attacks on coal and are investing in new power plants and an export infrastructure. The working families tax cuts act slashed federal coal royalties to 7%. Still, new leasing lags behind.
▶ 0:27:17Sen. Barrasso: It is unfairly weighed down by an outdated and burdensome bidding process. To win a least sale, coal companies must submit sealed bonus bids that equal or exceed an unknown fair market value. Bids that come in less than this unknown magic number are rejected. That means companies must bid high to ensure success and outcompete other bidders, as well as above the minimum. Then they need to pay the bonus in the next several years.
▶ 0:27:48Sen. Barrasso: It takes at least that long to get a permit. So they pay the thing off before they even get a permit to mine. So this is before the police generates any revenue at all. Let me tell you how badly the last administration attacked coal production in the united states. In 2016, bonus bid payments to the treasury totaled over 340 million dollars. In 2025, bonus payments of just over $6,400. $343 million to $6,000.
▶ 0:28:21Sen. Barrasso: My bill would change that decline. It allows bonus bid payment schedules to account for a needlessly burdensome permitting process by allowing companies to pay their bonus bids over 10 years instead of five. That means that new leases can generate revenue that offsets the cost. Companies will still pay the full value of their bids, and they can simply defer some costs later when they're mine actually has some revenue. That makes more financial sense in the 2026 economy.
▶ 0:28:50Sen. Barrasso: So I reject the idea that we need five years to permit a new mine. This committee is currently working to reform the permitting process. In the meantime, this is a crucial step to incentivize mining again and will unlock needed wyoming energy. The other bill I'm pleased to see on the agenda is the close the gap act. It has to do with broadband applications. This bill directs federal land management agencies to develop regulations to streamline the process for broadband applications.
▶ 0:29:21Sen. Barrasso: It also removes barriers to approving existing communications infrastructure. The burdensome and outdated permitting process is causing unnecessary delays in connecting folks across rural areas. The national telecommunications and information administration is beginning to distribute funding to states for broadband, equity, access, and deployment projects.
▶ 0:29:45Sen. Barrasso: It is vital that the permitting process does not hinder the buildout of critical communications infrastructure. My bill is a solution to these challenges and I thank senator lummis and senator curtis for supporting it. I would also like to thank the witnesses for coming today. I look forward to hearing from each of your testimony.
▶ 0:30:08Sen. Cortez Masto: Thank you for working with me always on this subcommittee and our committee as well. I also want to thank ranking member heinrich of the full committee for agreeing to hold today's legislative hearing. There are 15 bills today we are going to be hearing. I would like to talk about a couple of them. One is s 4200, an important piece of legislation for douglas county in nevada. It is the douglas county economic development act.
▶ 0:30:38Sen. Cortez Masto: This is a critical bill for the constituents of douglas county in my home state of nevada. I introduced this bill, working with douglas county, to improve the management of the person valley floodplain, to enhance stormwater management in an area that has seen repeated devastating floods, to promote conservation, to improve public lands management, to protect important sites, and to expend limited yet focused economic development opportunities in douglas county, nevada.
▶ 0:31:08Sen. Cortez Masto: The bill is a culmination of extensive collaboration between local officials stretching back to 2009, with the earliest bill being introduced in 2013. This bill includes the support of nevada's entire delegation, including congressman mark m a day -- amadei in the house. Nevada land management needs -- bringing people together, identifying land uses, and making compromises.
▶ 0:31:36Sen. Cortez Masto: It includes support from local government, the local business community, conservationists including friends of nevada wilderness, and the washout tribe of nevada and california. The bible specifically does the following. It conveys 67 acres to the state of nevada to be managed within the lake tahoe nevada state park. It conveys 7700 77 acres to the county for local flood control management and recreation.
▶ 0:32:03Sen. Cortez Masto: It directs the sale of 31 acres whose revenue will help fund flood control projects and the purchase of conservation easements to protect the valley floodplain, conveys nearly 2700 acres of important cultural sites to the washout tribe, and designates nearly 12,400 acres of wilderness that helps preserve prime habitat for bistate sage grouse populations while releasing a thousand 65 acres from the existing
▶ 0:32:34Sen. Cortez Masto: Wilderness study area. Again, Mr. chairman, this is how we work in nevada. This compromise -- coalitions of people coming together. For that reason, I would like to enter into the hearing record letters of support from the friends of nevada wilderness and the washout tribe in nevada and california. I also want to make a few remarks about the geothermal bills on the agenda today.
▶ 0:32:59Sen. Cortez Masto: I often speak about the commitment to and all of the above approach when it comes to energy. In nevada, geothermal energy has the potential to be a crucial part of that approach. It already is showing that. Upon consideration today is my bill for national deployment, and I thank senator risch for code leaving it with me.
▶ 0:33:22Sen. Cortez Masto: This would approve coordination between blm offices and shorten permitting timelines by establishing a geothermal permitting task force led by an ombudsman, whose role will be to find solutions on federal lands. But also on the agenda is congressman jeff hurd's geothermal energy advancement act.
▶ 0:33:44Sen. Cortez Masto: It is a bipartisan package of six bills that advance out of the house unanimously and contains my ombudsman bill as well as the steam act that I am pleased to be leading with senator murkowski, which expedites geothermal permitting within previously studied areas and give us permitting that is already enjoyed by oil and gas projects.
▶ 0:34:11Sen. Cortez Masto: The package is also included in the freedom act, a permitting reform build -- bill recently introduced. I'm very pleased that today's agenda includes pieces of legislation to advance geothermal deployment.
▶ 0:34:25Sen. Cortez Masto: I hope we will be able to take an even deeper and more thorough look at other pending geothermal legislation that falls under the jurisdiction of this committee, including the bill that senator murkowski and I have introduced, which is the next generation geothermal research and development act that creates an rn to the roadmap for innovative geothermal technologies within the department of energy. I look forward to working with my colleagues to further advance this legislation and I thank you again for this hearing.
▶ 0:34:55Sen. Barrasso: Senator heinrich is ready to make his statement. Please come and find your names at the table and please take your seats. Thank you. Senator heinrich?
▶ 0:35:08Sen. Heinrich: Thank you for organizing this legislative hearing. I am really excited to have this opportunity to highlight a bill of mine that has been many years in the making, an example of homegrown -- a homegrown legislative product and a representation of a partnership built from common ground. In this case, the common ground is protection for the ka del rio plateau.
▶ 0:35:38Sen. Heinrich: It is one of the southwest's most culturally significant landscapes. It holds deep importance for land grants, for communities, for livestock permittees. It is vital to a number of tribal communities. I cannot emphasize enough the level of traditional and cultural value that is held within this landscape.
▶ 0:36:01Sen. Heinrich: Yet threats such as desecration of petroglyphs, illegal bumping -- dumping, and the selloff of public lands continue to endanger this plateau. These threats have united local governments, tribes, traditional historic communities, and community organizations of all stripes to preserve the shared yet distinct heritages. As a result, we have the protection act.
▶ 0:36:26Sen. Heinrich: This bill will create two new stewardship areas, a new special management area of over 67 thousand acres of U.S. forest service land, and a new national conservation area on over 17,000 acres of bureau land management land.
▶ 0:36:44Sen. Heinrich: It will permit traditional uses -- herb and mineral gathering, hunting, and livestock grazing, and will conserve an important wildlife corridor and preserve one of the most historically intact sections of el camino real. It gives the land an opportunity to heal in this brittle area, and taken together, these measures will protect the caja for generations to come.
▶ 0:37:11Sen. Heinrich: This begins a new chapter in the stewardship of this land, one that includes opportunities for tribes, traditional historic communities, to have a voice in land management plans. This bill recognizes that stewardship works best when it is shared.
▶ 0:37:25Sen. Heinrich: I would like to thank everyone who worked with my office in developing this proposal, and I would like to submit a number of letters and resolutions in support from pueblos, groups, land grants, and others, to show the immense coalition that has rallied behind this effort and I would ask unanimous consent for that. I would like to end my statement today with a similar sentiment to one I have shared in the past.
▶ 0:37:51Sen. Heinrich: This hearing and next week's national parks legislative hearing will add to our growing list of land-based conservation bills ready for markup. Many of these bills have the same level of community support and input as my bill on the agenda today. Yet those voices of support are going unheard. With only six months left in this congress, it is my hope we will see conservation bills considered in future business meetings so we can get them marked up, past, and finally signed into law.
▶ 0:38:21Sen. Heinrich: I look forward to working with both of you as well as with chairman lee. Thank you.
▶ 0:38:29Sen. Barrasso: We are going to turn to our witnesses today. Need a baker is the acting director of the eastern states and the bureau of land management. Mr. john crockett is here, the deputy chief of state, private and tribal forestry, the U.S. forest service. Thank you for being here. Katie sweeney is the executive vice president and chief operating officer of the national mining association.
▶ 0:38:56Sen. Barrasso: And miss jennifer davidson is the county manager of douglas county, nevada. Appreciate all of you being here. Perhaps we could start with you. >> thank. Subcommittee, thank you very much for allowing me the opportunity today to speak on behalf of the bills before you, representing the bureau of land management.
▶ 0:39:21Sen. Barrasso: I have worked for the bureau of limit management for nearly 20 years and I have had the privilege and honor of enjoying the entire time I have worked there. The blm manages approximately 245 million acres of public lands, mostly in the 12 western united states, and 700 million acres of self -- subsurface minerals throughout the country.
▶ 0:39:43Sen. Barrasso: The federal land policy management act sets forward the blm mission of multiple use, which directs that public lands be managed for a broad range of uses such as energy development, livestock grazing, hunting, fishing, and recreation. Under the administration, the blm is managing the public lands as national assets, capable of growing the economy, helping balance the budget, and generating revenue for american taxpayers were protecting our public lands.
▶ 0:40:13Sen. Barrasso: Many of the bills on today's agenda further the administration's priorities, particularly those promoting energy and mineral development and providing support for local communities. With respect to energy and minerals, hr 7831 would extend blm authorization to collect oil and gas permit processing fees for 10 years. The fees are essential to supporting permitting services and maintaining timely and defensible permit reviews.
▶ 0:40:42Sen. Barrasso: The blm strongly supports hr 783 one as it advances oil and gas exploration and production to meet the energy needs of our nation. S4 410 incentivizes oil production by quail operations -- coal operations on federal lands.
▶ 0:41:03Sen. Barrasso: It would allow bonus bids for coal leases to be paid in 10 installments rather than five, supporting the administration's work to revitalize american coal and strengthen america's energy security. Hr 4090 would require that the secretary determine the impacts of the U.S. reliance on imported minerals, supporting mining efficiencies.
▶ 0:41:29Sen. Barrasso: We welcome efforts to ensure the united states maintains its position as a global leader in energy and mineral development. Additionally, several geothermal bills before the committee offer valuable tools to streamline the development of this important energy source. Taken together, the bills would require annual competitive release sales, ensure timely decisions on drilling applications, remove duplicative permitting, and expand categorical exclusions.
▶ 0:41:58Sen. Barrasso: They would also direct the development of a geothermal gold book and establish the ombudsman position and a task force to further promote development. The blm supports these bills as the rear foot reinforce efforts to strengthen program capacity for geothermal permitting. Ok, with respect to public access to high-speed internet, the close the gap act will help ensure that communities have access to affordable and reliable high-speed internet.
▶ 0:42:26Sen. Barrasso: It expedites the review and approval of broadband applications on federal lands. The blm supports this as it aligns with the administration's priorities to cut red tape and accelerate approvals for infrastructure projects.
▶ 0:42:41Sen. Barrasso: Finally, while the blm supports several things proposed in the bills on today's agenda, we do not support the special designations and withdrawals, as they conflict with the administration's energy and mineral security directives.
▶ 0:42:56Sen. Barrasso: As 4200 conveys nearly nine thousand acres of federal lands in douglas county, nevada, designates the burbank canyons wilderness, and takes nearly 2500 acres of federal lands into trust for the benefit of the washer tribe of nevada and california. The blm supports the land and trust conveyances proposed in as 4200. It does not support the wilderness designation.
▶ 0:43:22Sen. Barrasso: Similarly, the bureau does not support s4 458, which establishes the national conservation area and withdraws over 100,000 acres from energy and mineral development. Lastly, s 1791 establishes multiple designations on over 700,000 acres of federal land, including over 200,000 acres of blm land managed in colorado and include several mineral withdrawals.
▶ 0:43:49Sen. Barrasso: The blm opposes this as it would create unnecessary limitations on potential energy and mineral development and limit hazardous fuels management. Finally, the department of the interior also submitted a statement for the record on the offshore bills on the agenda, which thankfully as a blm staffer I have no jurisdiction over. Thank you very much. Thank you again for the opportunity to testify and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:44:16Sen. Barrasso: Thank you for being here today. >> thank you for having me here to present the views of the U.S. department of agriculture on six bills that are under consideration pertaining to the forest service. My name is john crockett and I am a deputy chief in the U.S. forest service here in our national headquarters and I have over 28 years of experience of career service to the agency. I will provide a brief summary on the bills on today's agenda.
▶ 0:44:49Sen. Barrasso: I have submitted my full written statement for the record. I will defer to the department of interior for its views on those elements of the bill that would affect federal lands under its jurisdiction. Hr 4090, the critical minerals dominance act, would codify several of the positions in an executive order.
▶ 0:45:13Sen. Barrasso: These provisions include requirements for the secretary of interior, in consultation with the secretary of agriculture, to review and evaluate a range of policies and actions related to mining and mineral exploration on federal lands. The close the gap act would require federal agencies to issue regulations intended to streamline the process for broadband applications on federal lands.
▶ 0:45:40Sen. Barrasso: The usda appreciates congressional efforts to reduce the regulatory burden and streamline the permitting process. Both hr 4090 and as 4561 would support the implementation of executive order 1451 four, unleashing federal energy, and would align with actions under this administration to alleviate regulatory burden and streamline the permitting process. The department supports both of these bills.
▶ 0:46:08Sen. Barrasso: Hr 655, the watershed development act, seeks to simplify administrative requirements in oregon to operate its municipal reservoir. The watershed includes a dam, a portion of which is on mount hood national forest land. Conveying this land would eliminate the city's need for a special use permit and the associated work for the city and the forest service staff. The department supports hr 655.
▶ 0:46:41Sen. Barrasso: As 4200 -- s 4200 contains multiple provisions related to the conveyance, disposal, and transfer of lands in the national forest in the lake tahoe basin, as well as provisions related to the issuance of a special use permit on lands managed by the forest service. The department supports the intent of the act to provide economic development for douglas county.
▶ 0:47:10Sen. Barrasso: We would appreciate the opportunity to work with the bill's sponsor and the committee to provide technical assistance and legislative maps related to several sections of the bill to ensure accuracy and support implementation in the provisions.
▶ 0:47:25Sen. Barrasso: Finally, in regards to two of the bills on today's agenda, 1791, the outdoor resource protection act, and 4458, the provisions of the bills specific to the forest service include significant and restrictive management designations that are contrary to the administration's priority on timber production and energy and mineral dominance.
▶ 0:47:50Sen. Barrasso: Both bills would mandate legislative requirements and restrictions for management of the grand mesa and gunnison national forests in colorado and the santa fe national forest in new mexico that have respectively taken significant steps at the local level to incorporate the views and opinions on a wide range of stakeholders on their forest planning efforts.
▶ 0:48:12Sen. Barrasso: These designations are paired with permanent withdrawals that will prevent the exploration and development opportunities, and therefore the department opposes these bills. In closing, thank you again for the opportunity to appear before the committee. I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:48:26Sen. Barrasso: Thanks for being here, Mr. crockett. >> good afternoon, chair barrasso, ranking member cortez masto, and members of the subcommittee. I appreciate being here in support of two bills that address critical issues facing this nation.
▶ 0:48:44Sen. Barrasso: S 4410, to facilitate affordable and reliable energy, and hr 4090 two secure mineral supply chains. Both leverage our abundant national resource base to benefit society. Chair barrasso, your bonus payments bill is a straightforward approach to make the mining of federal coal more attractive without sacrificing revenues federal and state governments.
▶ 0:49:13Sen. Barrasso: It simply shifts the timing of the payment of the bonus fee paid by successful police applicants, on top of all other rents, fees, taxes, and loyalties that are involved, and rather than spend -- spreading the payment over five years, as his current practice, the legislation provides companies with 10 years, a time frame more commensurate to what the company -- when the company would likely have the components needed to begin operations and start
▶ 0:49:44Sen. Barrasso: Seeing a return on investment. It will incentivize new production, resulting in a fresh influx of revenue to state coffers, a revenue source that has dried up over the last 15 years due to actual and de facto moratoriums on coal leasing. It has the added benefit of providing more predictable and stable revenues over time, helpful to states like wyoming that dedicate the funding to schools and systems that need better budgeting certainty.
▶ 0:50:16Sen. Barrasso: Carla -- coal is a key piece of cost, america's most abundant energy resource. At current consumption rates, the U.S. is more than 250 years of remaining coal reserves, much of which is federally owned and managed. The U.S.
▶ 0:50:34Sen. Barrasso: Power demand is expected to dramatically increase by approximately 75% by 2050, driven by the use of artificial intelligence, electrification, construction of data centers, and uptake of ev's. According to the national energy agency, for data centers alone, global electricity consumption is expected to more than double by 20 30. The nation needs far more electricity, and it needs it fast.
▶ 0:51:04Sen. Barrasso: The nma also strongly supports 4090, the critical mineral dominance act, which passed the house with bipartisan support. This legislation builds on presidential executive orders and presents a comprehensive and multifaceted approach to securing our mineral supply chains. The supply chains are highly concentrated in china and are increasingly vulnerable to manipulation and disruption.
▶ 0:51:36Sen. Barrasso: According to the U.S. geological survey mineral commodity surveys in 2026, the U.S. continued to be 100% import reliant for 16 minerals, and reliant on imports for more than half of the U.S. consumption of 54 non-fuel mineral commodities. Our economic and national security in the ability to innovate are absolutely reliant on access to minerals. Both the ability to get them out of the ground and to process them into final products.
▶ 0:52:08Sen. Barrasso: By adopting policies included in hr 40 90, with its focus on understanding import reliant's trend, increasing permitting certainty, boosting byproduct production, and improving geologic mapping, we can successfully the risk and decouple our mineral supply from foreign adversaries.
▶ 0:52:29Sen. Barrasso: We have significant advantages here in the united states, a vast general endowment, a highly skilled workforce, world-leading safety, labor, and environmental standards, existing infrastructure, and renewed administration and congressional focus and support. Permitting efficiencies are paramount.
▶ 0:52:48Sen. Barrasso: Today, it takes an average of 29 years to bring a new mine online in america, the longest of almost all nations, driving increased import reliant and making it more difficult for domestic producers to compete locally. Adversaries like china are already exploiting this vulnerability as they dominate the sourcing, processing, and supply of global mineral markets.
▶ 0:53:13Sen. Barrasso: The mining industry looks forward to working with this subcommittee to advance these important bills, as well as other critical legislation under the committee's purview, including the bipartisan mining regulatory clarity act. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today and I look forward to answering any questions. >> chairman barrasso, ranking members, and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to testify today.
▶ 0:53:43Sen. Barrasso: My name is senator davidson and I am the county manager for douglas county, nevada. I think senator cortez masto or her leadership on this bill, senator rosen for her steadfast support, and congressman emma day for his support in the house. I am here in strong support of senate bill 4200. Douglas county is home to the state's first town and its first ranches, but most of the land in our county is federally owned.
▶ 0:54:10Sen. Barrasso: For decades, that has constrained our ability to manage lands for stormwater and flood protection and access lands for recreation. Our goals through this bill are clear. Advance flood control and stormwater management, preserve open space, enhance recreation, protect the rural character and quality of life, safeguard the plug -- floodplain, and honor the rich cultural heritage of a region, in partnership with the washoe tribe of nevada -- nevada and california. For me, this is personal.
▶ 0:54:40Sen. Barrasso: I have served douglas county for nearly 20 years. In my tenure, we have experienced five 100 year flooding events. In flood years, I am five hundred years old. Flooding is our reality. The most pressing driver for this legislation is flood protection. Last september, a four foot wall of water trapped residents, closed highway 300 95, and damaged 14 homes.
▶ 0:55:06Sen. Barrasso: Although the rain did not fall on the residence there, the storm fell on public land to the east and funneled down the creek. It's force was sharply increased by the connor fire, which had burned 26% of the 14,000 acre basin. In 2014 and again in 2015, back to back flash floods drove mud and to be -- and debris through the riverhead.
▶ 0:55:32Sen. Barrasso: In 2023, a march rain and snow event combined alluvial and river flooding, innovated public infrastructure. Homes built in these areas were often not in the floodplain at the time they were constructed, and many are still insured -- still not insured against the flash flooding that now reaches them. The county consolidated years of brain studies into a comprehensive stormwater master plan.
▶ 0:55:57Sen. Barrasso: We identified and ranked over 100 million dollars in flood control projects that would directly benefit these neighborhoods and others. The major barrier is accessing the land to build them. This conveys land so that we can manage the storm water from the pine nut mountains carried into our communities. Today, the federal government lacks the staff and resources to build this infrastructure itself.
▶ 0:56:22Sen. Barrasso: The county has actively pursued administrative solutions to access the land and improved blm's regulation and public purchases act. The leasing process works acre by acre and would take years, even decades that we do not have. That is precisely why congressional action is critical. This bill lets us act now under our own adopted local plan, protecting lives and property. S 4200 also lets us manage land use responsibly.
▶ 0:56:51Sen. Barrasso: For 150 years, open ranch land the carson river has served as a natural safety net, saving hundreds of millions of dollars by spreading flood water over pasture instead of through our towns. This bill will help conserve this land. Douglas county limits building permits and manages growth so it does not conflict with our zoning and stormwater plans.
▶ 0:57:14Sen. Barrasso: For this reason, any federal land identified for disposal under the carson resource management plan must be jointly selected before it can be sold or developed in our county. The bill also strengthens our economy and quality of life. We can improve access to parks, trailheads, and campgrounds, and maintain them when the forest service cannot. Many of these recreation areas have been closed for years for lack of federal resources.
▶ 0:57:42Sen. Barrasso: Every acre we received carries a reversion clause. If used for anything but a public purpose, it returns to the united states. The bill honors our partnership with the washoe tribe of nevada and california for sacred -- keeping sacred sites including dance hill to protect cultural resources and protect the tribe's economic vitality.
▶ 0:58:04Sen. Barrasso: The legislation balances access, designating the kenyan wilderness area and protecting habitat for the grouse while keeping existing roads open for outdoor recreation. Members of the subcommittee, this bill solves problems that grow more urgent with every year. Douglas county has done the work. We have built the consensus. We need congress to finish the job. I respectfully urge swift passage of the douglas county bill. Thank you and I welcome questions.
▶ 0:58:32Sen. Barrasso: Swift passage after 500 years of waiting. We hope to move past her -- faster than that. Thank you for your testimony. Thank you all for being here. For members that are here, I will start by talking about the bill that I have. If a coal company wins a least sale, and you are familiar with this, it usually takes at least five years of delay before it receives even a permit to start. You cannot make money during that time.
▶ 0:59:03Sen. Barrasso: You have to be paying right away once you win the bid. So the change we are proposing -- this bill allows companies to pay over an extended time. They still pay. It extends it over time. You still pay the full value of the bid. Now it is just going to make more financial sense, it seems.
▶ 0:59:26Sen. Barrasso: If we assume this bill is passed on the blm announces sales from new leases, but that how -- would that affect the revenue and coal leasing in general? >> I definitely think it incentivizes new interest in federal coal leasing. I think you will see more companies expressing interest in bidding.
▶ 0:59:53Sen. Barrasso: Having that allocated over 10 years provides more certainty. It gives them time to get into production and make a return on their investment. So it is not all sunk upfront costs. So it makes more business sense and provides that kind of budgeting certainty that companies require.
▶ 1:00:16Sen. Barrasso: I'm trying to figure out how you come up with the number of how much to bid. Is it a secret number that is confidential that the blm comes up with? Coal companies don't know what that is. The public in general does not learn what the value of that is. They come up with a number and you have to submit a sealed bid. If you are the highest bidder, what did I not know? But you have one that.
▶ 1:00:43Sen. Barrasso: And we are talking about, I understand, hundreds of millions of dollars. We are not talking just a little incremental difference. If any bid is lower than the secret number they have come up with, you just lose, and you can't bid on that again. You have to wait for another sale at a later time. You work with other companies.
▶ 1:01:06Sen. Barrasso: How do you approve specifically the determination of fair market value and how you could make more intelligent decisions and the government could make more revenue. Is there something you would recommend?
▶ 1:01:17Ms. Sweeney: There is definitely room for improvement. I think the situation is very complicated by the fact that you have these coal moratoriums, so we don't have comparable leases sales anymore. So we have to really understand the new realities of the coal markets. Costs, prices -- all of those will feed into that fair market value number.
▶ 1:01:46Ms. Sweeney: But we don't have the data anymore because we have not had any police sales for so long. So I think there is room for industry and congress and the federal government, working together, to find some solutions on what those inputs would be. Not that every company needs to know exactly what to bid, because of course we want to protect the integrity of the process.
▶ 1:02:14Ms. Sweeney: But there has to be, I think, some more concrete understanding of the components that go into the fair market value determination.
▶ 1:02:25Sen. Barrasso: You have been watching that with interest. Anything you want to comment on? Let me ask you a question if not.
▶ 1:02:38Ms. Baker: The bureau of land management does support this bill. We agree that the spreading count of the cost for the companies over a decade as opposed to five years will help incentivize additional competition in the market and hopefully bring more folks into the business.
▶ 1:02:56Sen. Barrasso: How do you come up with a fair market value? If there have not been sales in a long time, it is hard to know what a fair market price is.
▶ 1:03:04Ms. Baker: Establishing fair market value is not my area of expertise. I have observed it, but I don't have any specific position on that. We could certainly pull some information on our current process.
▶ 1:03:20Sen. Barrasso: I think it would be helpful for all of us to understand how it works. Do you agree that rural states are going to face serious challenges in meeting the four-year equity access and deployment buildup timeframe unless we really have some significant permitting?
▶ 1:03:38Ms. Baker: Yes, sir. It is my understanding that with a lot of the broadband permitting under the requirements that the bureau of land management does not see the application until year three of the four-year process. That means there is only one year left to process the permits. We have discussed permitting delays. That can create a significant burden for rural communities.
▶ 1:04:05Sen. Cortez Masto: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Ms. davidson, getting back to senate bill 4200, the douglas county land this bill -- clearly, part of the urgent driver to advance the bill is the flood protection, correct? Why is that essential? >> thank you, senator cortez masto, for your question. Our community is in a bowl.
▶ 1:04:35Sen. Cortez Masto: The carson river runs through it. We are surrounded on all sides by public land. The stars we are confronted with, the changing weather patterns and severity of those storms, are complicated often by burn scars, repeated wildfire events on public lambs.
▶ 1:04:53Sen. Cortez Masto: The solution needs to be as far upstream to maximum benefit to help us best leverage the limited funding we have available as a community to install these drainage retention basins to contain as much of the water as possible.
▶ 1:05:10Sen. Cortez Masto: And for the county to be able to do that and be more flexible and expedient to the urgency of the weather problem, correct? Let me ask you this. In nevada and particularly in douglas county -- we have seen this throughout the lands bills in nevada. Quite often, people don't realize -- everybody wants to be part of the management of the land.
▶ 1:05:37Sen. Cortez Masto: Particularly as we are talking about douglas county, there is 50,000 people that live there, but 60% of the land is managed by the federal government. It has been a challenge for many counties and many rural governments to deal with. Can you talk about way bringing together -- you talked about this a little bit.
▶ 1:05:58Sen. Cortez Masto: The washoe tribe, the outdoor recreation enthusiasts, members of the community -- why is it important to bring them all together to get their support on this particular bill?
▶ 1:06:08Ms. Davidson: Thank you for the question, senator. I am very proud to be speaking on behalf of my community. We feel very strongly and passionately about where we live. Douglas county is a special place because of the stakeholder groups you mentioned. We began the stakeholder process back in 2009.
▶ 1:06:30Ms. Davidson: Before we even propose this legislation, we worked for three years engaging with diverse stakeholder groups, individuals and groups, to make sure that this bill enjoyed broad, robust support across all of our entities in douglas county. It does that. It was important for it to do so because our residents feel passionately about public land.
▶ 1:06:53Ms. Davidson: They would have been, frankly, offended, if we had proposed anything that was not part of their vision, was not supportive of our community master planning process. And we knew in order to get it right, we needed to engage with the stakeholders first. The washoe tribe especially on their pieces. The significance of those pieces. We wanted to make sure we were solving as many problems as we could with this legislation without creating more.
▶ 1:07:22Sen. Cortez Masto: We were in our home states just a week ago and I was in douglas county. It is absolutely beautiful. We were looking at some of the flood control issues. The management by the municipalities there, and what is essential for the people that were there. It is beautiful country. People don't realize it. But the quality of life is important for everybody who lives there, and that is what you are trying to manage as you bring the stakeholders together in these lands bills. A key piece of that is the wilderness designation.
▶ 1:07:52Sen. Cortez Masto: I don't believe you would have put that in there but for the need you are hearing in the community about the wilderness designation and a need to preserve the prime habitat for the sage grass populations. Ms. baker, you talked about support for the land and trust conveyances, but no to the wilderness. Can you address why no to the wilderness?
▶ 1:08:20Ms. Baker: The department of land management does not support the wilderness designation because of the restricted use it places on the lands that we manage, preventing potential mineral development, preventing various means of public access, etc..
▶ 1:08:40Sen. Cortez Masto: I don't want to pick you against one another, but as someone who is there every day, living in that county and working to manage the lands for everyone, do you have a response to that? How would you address that concern that is brought up by the blm?
▶ 1:08:55Ms. Davidson: Thank you for the question. We do believe that this wilderness does protect public access, so the roads through the wilderness area have been developed, and it was already a wilderness study area. We don't believe it is going to have a significant impact, otherwise our residents would have very strongly opposed this.
▶ 1:09:20Sen. Cortez Masto: I can affirm and attest to that. The residents would have come out in douglas county. Mr. chairman, thank you. >> Mr. crockett, in your opposition to s 4458, you cited timber production and mineral production in your opposition. Have you personally been to the caja del rio?
▶ 1:09:49Sen. Cortez Masto: Do you know how much mineral potential there is? >> I have not been. I have not done the analysis. Sen. hackett
▶ 1:10:07Sen. Heinrich: : there are no developments in the area and it does not take more than a few minutes to realize the forest cover on the forest service lambs is primarily juniper, which gets to be about nine feet tall, and has no commercial production, and a client which is a noncommercial species.
▶ 1:10:34Sen. Heinrich: I think probably the last time a ponderosa pine was actually harvested commercially on the plateau would have been before either of us were in our current positions. I think it is important that the facts line up here. What we have heard today is a continual opposition to any level of conservation, but support for all the development pieces.
▶ 1:11:02Sen. Heinrich: And we don't have timber to develop here. We do have these other species and they are important for firewood. We have predicted that in this legislation. It is also important to be able to do fire treatments on this plateau, and we have preserved the ability for the forest service to do that. I think it is important to recognize what senator cortez masto said, which is this is a balance.
▶ 1:11:29Sen. Heinrich: If you look at the interests that came out to speak about these things at the local level, if you look at what the county said, if you consulted with the tribes, if you engaged the agricultural interests, I think you would come to a very different conclusion about these pieces of legislation. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:11:50Sen. Barrasso: I understand senator murkowski is on her way back and has a couple questions. Anything else either of you have as questions?
▶ 1:12:00Sen. Cortez Masto: , no, but I will and I appreciate you being here, and the shout out for the clarity act. I would hope that my colleagues would be open to helping us address this issue which is important as we are looking to our needs for minerals in the future, whether they are mining minerals, critical minerals, rare earth minerals -- the key is to make sure we still have
▶ 1:12:31Sen. Cortez Masto: The ability to extract those minerals. The mining clarity act, which is a piece of legislation both senator risch and I feel strongly about -- we are willing to work with the ranking member and anybody else who has issues with it, so that we can put it into a final work product and move it as quickly as possible. So I thank you for bringing it up. >> and we appreciate your leadership on it. Thank you.
▶ 1:12:59Sen. Barrasso: Awaiting senator murkowski, is there anything any of you would like to add to what was said while you were here? >> yeah, I will weigh in on a perspective that you shared, senator heinrich's. I appreciate the feedback around what the local needs are.
▶ 1:13:18Sen. Barrasso: What I will add to your comments is we do appreciate the values that are identified at the local level, and I do know that through the forest service and through the blm and through the pueblo -- they had signed a conservatorship agreement in 2024 for the management of the caja.
▶ 1:13:38Sen. Barrasso: In those activities for managing the illegal dumping and restrictions that we put in place for overnight camping to minimize use and increase law enforcement presence that is there -- those are the things we are actually emphasizing. I know I am representing the perspectives of this administration on not taking land and putting it under special designation, but I will re-emphasize the importance of those decisions that are being made at the local level.
▶ 1:14:08Sen. Barrasso: And thank you for that, Mr. crockett. I welcome those kinds of stewardship agreements, and would also point out that the blow -- pueblo in several places very much support this legislation.
▶ 1:14:29Sen. Barrasso: In fact, the all pueblo council of governors, which supports a group, also supports this legislation.
▶ 1:14:41Sen. Barrasso: Senator murkowski has been detained with crushing senate business. As a result, she will be able to submit her questions for the record, as will other members. They will do that by tomorrow. We would ask that you respond to c1 thank you so much of a myth here. There is no further discussion. His hearing is adjourned. -- this hearing is adjourned.
▶ 1:15:27Sen. Barrasso: [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap.org]