▶ 0:16:46Chair Grassley: I told everyone here to be a 9:00 but since we cannot do that, I will start with some of the things we can do. We have eight nominations enlisted, today we will vote on daniel traynor for circuit judge U.S.
▶ 0:17:15Chair Grassley: Court of appeals eighth circuit and also voting on for district nominees, southern district of texas. Kasdan mitchell, northern district of texas. Michael martin, eastern district of michigan. Antonio pozos, eastern district from pennsylvania. We will hold off on the future consideration.
▶ 0:17:47Chair Grassley: I will call on senator durbin for his opening comments.
▶ 0:17:49Sen. Durbin: Thank you chairman grassley. Yesterday's hearing I cannot easily forget in this room. I asked a question of Mr. todd blanche about the opportunity he had to meet with victims of jeffrey epstein. I asked in the same question the night before in my office. So I thought it was an easy question.
▶ 0:18:16Sen. Durbin: Will you meet with those who are here today, the 10 or 12 survivors of jeffrey epstein. And he said no. He would not meet with them. I asked why. I could not understand if he thought they had a lawyer needed a lawyer but he would not meet with them. That is incredible. After the hearing I met them. I will never forget that meeting. You could imagine some of them are here today and one will testify before this panel.
▶ 0:18:48Sen. Durbin: Try to imagine if you will one of these young women saying to me jeffrey epstein abused me when I was 13 years old. 13 years old. Visualize in your own family a daughter or granddaughter 13 years of age who was a victim of this sexual predator. Should she at least have a moment with the attorney general to tell her story? Is that too much to be asking, apparently it was.
▶ 0:19:20Sen. Durbin: I don't believe a single member of the united states senate would vote for this nominee after meeting with the survivors. To think that you turn down the opportunity to even meet with them he went on to say president trump signed this law which required us to disclose the epstein file. The law was necessary because he wouldn't voluntarily disclose it.
▶ 0:19:43Sen. Durbin: Yes president trump signed the law after was discharged in the house of representatives because one person winning a new special election, it was an amazing political miracle that that law got past. It had to get pasts of the american people even get a chance to look at these files. Now these women and many more are looking -- willing to come forward and say don't stop with prosecuting two people, there are more people out there you should consider.
▶ 0:20:15Sen. Durbin: Yet the man who would be attorney general of the united states wouldn't listen to them. That is not right. That is just plain wrong as far as I'm concerned. Secondly, I guess I was born in a different era from this president and people around him. But I kind of understood going in that if you want to get rich this was the wrong job.
▶ 0:20:41Sen. Durbin: You're supposed to take this job to serve the public, make enough money to get by but not that rich. How did the president do in the first year of his second term? $1.4 billion added to his income from the cryptocurrency group. Why is that even relevant to this conversation? The president opposed the idea for years and switched his position and then Mr.
▶ 0:21:07Sen. Durbin: Blanche change the federal regulation for cryptocurrency. By the time he changed in the department of justice he had 160 thousand dollars cryptocurrency assets. He had to disclose that and send that to some other source. He sent it to his children.
▶ 0:21:38Sen. Durbin: To lessen the regulation of an industry which generates 1.4 billion dollar windfall for the president of the united states and money for the person was acting attorney general is just plain wrong. Just plain wrong. All the excuses in the world don't make a difference. I will tell you that one document that he signed.
▶ 0:22:00Sen. Durbin: Imagine if you will if you've ever heard of this, the president, his family and his businesses because of the documents side by it -- signed by todd blanche have no liability for any tax crimes they ever committed before the data of the document. No liability, every single one of us in this room has to obey the law, that is the basics in a democracy like ours. When it comes to tax crimes the same applies.
▶ 0:22:29Sen. Durbin: Now there is an exception in the eyes of todd blanche and that exception is the president of the united states, his family and his businesses. That is just plain wrong. This man should not be attorney general.
▶ 0:23:04Chair Grassley: I would like to enter into the record an article written by former attorney general bill barr. It urges the senate to confirm Mr. blanche. It talks the successes of Mr.
▶ 0:23:21Chair Grassley: Blanche who is already delivered leading -- well already leading the department of justice stating Mr.
▶ 0:23:36Chair Grassley: Blanche has necessary qualities for the job, he is a skilled and accomplished lawyer with extensive experience in the department as a prosecutor and deputy attorney general throughout his career he has shown the personal determination, discipline and thick skin this position demands. Without objection it will be entered into the record.
▶ 0:24:08Chair Grassley: I would like to also introduce a letter -- from the concerned women for america legislative action committee. The group represents hundreds of thousands of women nationwide. The letter praised Mr. blanche and stated "Mr.
▶ 0:24:30Chair Grassley: Blanche extensive experience, proven character and wise judgment make him an outstanding pick that the women I represent are proud to support."
▶ 0:25:05Chair Grassley: As I indicated to everybody in the audience, everybody was supposed to be here at 9:00 and everybody isn't here and we don't have a lot of time to waste. So I would ask the witness is if they would come to the table and I would like to introduce -- read your introductions.
▶ 0:25:36Chair Grassley: Ok. Please be seated and we won't be questioning you right away, but I would like to take this time here to introduce you first, a person when he was in the united states senate a person that I work closely with, john ashcroft -- you know he served as united
▶ 0:26:12Chair Grassley: States attorney general under george w. Bush. He led the justice department's antiterrorism efforts after 9/11 . Mr. ashcroft previously served for over two decades as missouri's attorney general, governor and then senator. He has since founded a consulting firm and serves as a distinguished professor at regent university. Mr.
▶ 0:26:40Chair Grassley: Ashcroft understands how to lead the justice department free from political influence, indeed senator schumer once praised Mr. ashcroft "fidelity's to the rule of law." I look forward to hearing his perspective on Mr. blanche's qualifications to lead the department. Next I would introduce jennifer bos.
▶ 0:27:13Chair Grassley: An angel mom, a title that no mother should ever have to bear. She suffered an unimaginable loss. Her daughter megan was discovered in a dumpster belonging to any legal immigrant. The man was arrested, but within 24 hours walked free.
▶ 0:27:38Chair Grassley: A sanctuary city and soft on crime policies of her own state failed to protect her daughter or deliver justice to the families. Ms. bos had no recourse until president trump learned of the case and ensured the man was detained by ice.
▶ 0:28:00Chair Grassley: Sadly, she knows firsthand how important it is to have the justice department that listens to victims, pursues justice and works to protect communities. Ms. bos I'm sorry for your loss and grateful for your testimony today. We also have jon adler president of the officers association foundation.
▶ 0:28:32Chair Grassley: A first responder at ground zero on 911 and has decades of experience in law enforcement for years he served as the chief firearms and tactical training instructor of the southern district of new york. While at that position he met and observed Mr. blanche -- diligent work firsthand. Mr. adler previously served as director of the bureau of justice assistance.
▶ 0:29:04Chair Grassley: Based on that experience and has decades in law enforcement, Mr. adler -- now advocates for officers in the field. I look forward to learning -- his experience and perspective on Mr. blanche's efforts to support law enforcement. Now senator durbin would you please introduce your guest.
▶ 0:29:28Sen. Durbin: Thank you Mr. chairman your request I am trying to accommodate the attendance issue which we both struggled with as chair and ranking member. One of my witnesses has not arrived yet. She was told it was later and would start then so I will introduce her and when she arrives she will be sworn in by you. The first minority witness is dani bensky.
▶ 0:30:00Sen. Durbin: I met her yesterday, she is a choreographer and dance educator. She is a survivor of abuse by convicted sex traffickers jeffrey epstein. She was trafficked when she was 17 years old. She will tell us how due to the carelessness of the justice department, graphic details of her abuse as well as her identity were released many times despite her efforts to redact her information.
▶ 0:30:30Sen. Durbin: She says "sean stop fighting till the world is safer." my second witness is elizabeth oyer. Thank you for being here. The justice department pardon attorney until march of 2025. She oversaw the part in office now run by the failed nominee and mac extremist ed martin.
▶ 0:31:03Sen. Durbin: Prior to her service of the justice department she was a public defender in maryland and litigation partner. She is a graduate of harvard law school and the illustrious georgetown university. She will tell us how her former office has devolved into a pay to play operation with mega donors jumping ahead of legitimate candidates often without a proper vetting. The height of corruption.
▶ 0:31:30Sen. Durbin: How do we know this, she was fired by Mr. blanche just days after he took office for refusing to restore gun ownership rights to one of the president's personal friends, convicted domestic abuser and actor mel gibson. Thank you Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:31:49Chair Grassley: We have one more member to get here. In the meantime I want to enter into the record nine letters supporting Mr. blanche's nomination from major law enforcement organizations combined, these organizations represent hundreds of thousands of law enforcement officers from around our country who work every day to uphold the rule of law. The letters all praise Mr.
▶ 0:32:20Chair Grassley: Blanche's qualifications to serve as attorney general in his collaboration with law enforcement americans to keep everybody safe. One letter states this. "we believe Mr.
▶ 0:32:36Chair Grassley: Blanche's leadership will help ensure that the department of justice remains focused on public safety, the rule of law and providing unwavering support for law enforcement professionals who risk their lives daily to protect our families and communities." without objection these will be entered into the record.
▶ 0:33:05Chair Grassley: Also I want to introduce into the record -- a letter supporting Mr. blanche's nomination from 23 state attorneys general. The letter praises the justice department's success under Mr.
▶ 0:33:21Chair Grassley: Blanche's leadership combating violent crime, enforcing immigration laws, ending race-based discrimination, prosecuting criminal enterprises and rooting out fraud against taxpayers.
▶ 0:33:38Chair Grassley: The letter goes on to state "at a time when americans expect their government to protect communities from violent crime, narcotics trafficking, human trafficking, terrorism and organized criminal activity, todd blanche has shown the ability to deliver real results.
▶ 0:34:01Chair Grassley: His record reflects a commitment to public safety, a vigorous enforcement of federal law and effective stewardship of the department of justice." without objection those letters will be entered into the record.
▶ 0:34:26Sen. Durbin: We are still waiting on one senator. This is a little out of sequence but trying to cooperate on a bipartisan basis. I'll say a word about daniel traynor nominated to be U.S. court of appeals for the eighth circuit. Prior to the confirmation, judge traynor showed his true colors when it came to maga issues.
▶ 0:34:54Sen. Durbin: After he was confirmed he had a chance to show whether he would be neutral arbiter on the bench. Unfortunately he has not demonstrated that. He has ruled in favor of the trump administration in all 28 cases on his docket involving challenges from immigrants who have been detained by ice under the administration's illegal mandatory detention policy.
▶ 0:35:20Sen. Durbin: That includes seven habeas corpus traynor volunteered to preside over following operation metro surge. Judge traynor is an ally -- outlier. In all -- in the cases on the mandatory detention policy at least 15,000 rulings against the trump administration. Including the vast majority of rulings by trump appointing judges.
▶ 0:35:48Sen. Durbin: And judge traynor's partisanship was apparent when he served as a signatory of a may 2020 four letter from federal judges to the president of columbia university. The signatory vowed not to hire anybody who attended columbia university beginning that year.
▶ 0:36:09Sen. Durbin: Traynor denied her recusal motion in a case by columbia law school initiative for a just society claiming he wasn't biased against columbia university. He just said he wouldn't hire anybody went to school there. While he was comfortable taking a position on this, judge traynor refused to answer questions at the hearing as to who won the 2020 election. For the record, joe biden did.
▶ 0:36:38Sen. Durbin: It is very clear judge traynor seeks to remain the good graces of the president at the cost of his own. I urge my colleagues to reject.
▶ 0:36:48Chair Grassley: I would like to introduce into the record a letter supporting Mr. blanche's nomination. This letter is from the american center for law and justice. The letter states "Mr. blanche has demonstrated the experience, judgment, leadership necessary to guide the department of justice at a time when the faithful administration of our laws is of paramount importance.
▶ 0:37:18Chair Grassley: His service as deputy attorney general most recently acting attorney general together with his distinguished career as both a federal prosecutor and defense attorney has given him a broad understanding of the responsibility and constitutional principles that must guide him. Without objection this will be entered into the record.
▶ 0:37:44Chair Grassley: Now we will have 77 former department of justice officials writing a letter in support of blanche. I will enter this in the record. I want to quote from the this letter. "todd blanche understands the mission is to deliver justice not to serve political interest and entrenched bureaucracies.
▶ 0:38:14Chair Grassley: He has shown the courage and institutional knowledge to restore focus on public safety, law enforcement support and rule of law. His career path from paralegal to prosecutor to second highest position in the department gives him a perspective few others possess and knows what works because he has done that at every level.
▶ 0:38:43Chair Grassley: " without objection the letter from 77 former doj officials will be inserted. We have a letter -- first liberty institute -- the nation's largest legal organization dedicated solely to defending religious litter --
▶ 0:39:15Chair Grassley: Liberty, of the letter states "every attorney general faces difficult decisions that will inevitably generate disagreement. The proper question before the senate is not whether members agree with every future judgment, but whether the nominee possesses the character, experience, a legal ability and commitment to constitutional government necessary to faithfully discharge the office.
▶ 0:39:46Chair Grassley: Mr. blanche's career demonstrates those qualities." without objection I will be entered into the record. Is he here? Ok.
▶ 0:40:40Chair Grassley: We now turn to the nomination. >> he almost here.
▶ 0:40:47Chair Grassley: I have one other letter to enter into the record by jacob. He praises Mr. plante -- Mr. blanche's legal acumen and character stating "on more than one occasion, I witnessed Mr.
▶ 0:41:12Chair Grassley: Blanche's continue to provide first rate representation after learning that a client was facing severe financial hardship. Often taking on cases on a pro bono or substantially reduced fee basis, it was evident that to him, practicing law was not merely a profession but a calling rooted in fairness, dignity and compassion.
▶ 0:41:43Chair Grassley: These are precisely the qualities I believe our nation needs in its next attorney general. Firmness to the pursuit of justice joined with mercy and respect for every person. " we will now turn to the nomination of daniel traynor to be circuit judge U.S. circuit court of appeals, eighth circuit the clerk will call the role.
▶ 0:42:14Chair Grassley: >> five. >> Mr. tillis. >> aye. >> Mr. smith. >> Mr. durbin. No no. >> Mr. coons. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. booker. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. welch.
▶ 0:42:46Chair Grassley: >> no by proxy. >> chair grassley. >> aye.
▶ 0:42:56Chair Grassley: The nomination will be favorably reported. We will go to angela colmenero. The clerk will call the role. >> Mr. kennedy. >> aye. >> misses brett. >> aye. >> Mr. durbin.
▶ 0:43:27Chair Grassley: >> no. >> Mr. coons. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. booker. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. smith. >> no. >> the ayes are 11, the nays r 10.
▶ 0:43:53Chair Grassley: >> now we have kasdin mitchell, judge district court northern district of texas. The clerk will call the role. Mr. lee. >> aye. Mr. tillis. >> aye. Mr. schmitt. >> aye. Mr. durbin. >> no. >> Mr. whitehouse.
▶ 0:44:24Chair Grassley: >> no. >> Mr. booker. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. schiff. Chairman grassley. >> aye.
▶ 0:44:41Chair Grassley: Mitchell will be reported to the senate floor. Now we have the nomination of michael martin. District court eastern district of michigan. The clerk will call the role. >> Mr. cornyn. >> aye. >> Mr. kennedy. >> aye. >> Mrs. blackburn. >> aye.
▶ 0:45:13Chair Grassley: >> Mr. durbin. >> aye. >> Ms. klobuchar. No by proxy >>. >> Mr. booker. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. welch. No by proxy >> >> -- >> no by proxy.
▶ 0:45:40Chair Grassley: The nomination. >> the ayes are 14, the names a -- nays r seven. >> Mr. kennedy. Aye. >> Mr. smith.
▶ 0:46:10Chair Grassley: >> aye. >> Mr. durbin. >> aye. >> Mr. whitehouse. >> no. >> Mr. blumenthal. >> no by proxy. >> Mr. booker. >> no by proxy. >> chairman grassley. >> aye.
▶ 0:46:40Chair Grassley: >> on this vote, the ayes are 12, the nays r nine.
▶ 0:46:51Chair Grassley: We will. This ends our business meeting. Now I call the hearing to order. I would like to have the witnesses would you please stand and swear each and at every meeting.
▶ 0:47:24Chair Grassley: Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give before this committee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god. >> I do.
▶ 0:47:38Chair Grassley: They all answered affirmative. Ok. So welcome back senator ashcroft. Will you please begin your testimony and then we will go right down the list of people the way you are seated here.
▶ 0:48:13Mr. Ashcroft: I'm grateful to you please allow me a moment to extend my condolences to the committee. Friends and colleagues of senator lindsey graham. The vivid history of bringing out the best in people he worked with on both sides of the aisle. I enjoyed his friendship and to take this moment to say my condolences in sympathy.
▶ 0:48:40Mr. Ashcroft: Also to jennifer bos whose daughter was brutally murdered. Allow me to thank you for your serious consideration and attention to the constitutional responsibility of confirming high-ranking executive branch officials. It is an honor for me to participate with you today by my appearance.
▶ 0:49:01Mr. Ashcroft: Testifying and sharing my profoundest support for the nomination of the honorable todd blanche is attorney general of the united states is something for which I am deeply grateful. Justice is best served in the united states through a commitment to uphold the constitution and laws of this country. Integrity is an indispensable imperative for the rule of law, the rule of law as a best friend of the constitutional guarded liberty.
▶ 0:49:34Mr. Ashcroft: The highest quality administration of justice law enforcement must never be diluted nor contaminated by personal bias or political preferences. Todd blanche's record of upholding the constitution and enforcing the law or recommends him supremely to serve america as the 88th attorney general of these united states. I know of no person of a higher commitment to integrity. He has spoken the unvarnished truth to those he works for and to those he works with.
▶ 0:50:06Mr. Ashcroft: Todd's career stands out as an outstanding record of public service. A consistently well prepared, tough but fair prosecutor fundamentally focused on the constitution and understands that he has a profound responsibility in the justice department to seek justice not merely to prosecute.
▶ 0:50:28Mr. Ashcroft: 25 years ago during my opportunity to serve as attorney general, todd worked as an individual in the justice department. And in his law school years todd worked with the justice department in that respect upon graduation from law school he clerked for several judges, two of whom are now serving on the respective nationally focused and second circuit court of appeals.
▶ 0:50:57Mr. Ashcroft: So he had an understanding of the law from prosecutorial side and the side of the bench. Following his clerkships, todd became an assistant U.S. attorney as the U.S. attorney office for southern district of new york from year prosecutorial office of the united states. He spent roughly two years as the co-chief of the violent crimes unit supervising their nearly two dozen prosecutors.
▶ 0:51:26Mr. Ashcroft: Then served as the co-chief of the office is white plains division where he presided over a wide span of work. Public corruption, securities and bank and wire fraud, federal programs fraud, medicare fraud scheme and violent crime. Today is deputy attorney general and acting attorney general he energizes the 115,000 employees from across maine justice the fbi, dea, U.S. marshals service.
▶ 0:52:00Mr. Ashcroft: Atf and 93 U.S. attorney offices. That span the united states. He has conducted the department's daily operations of full-scale, demonstrating his readiness to manage the office in his own right. Todd therefore brings to the department of justice a relevant reservoir of experience coupled with sound judgment on an array of different issues that are all related to law enforcement and the administration of justice.
▶ 0:52:32Mr. Ashcroft: He understands that the rule of law exists to secure the safeguard god-given rights of freedom in america. In professional moments both private and public I have seen todd's of thoughtful decisive yet humble leadership, a careful and willing listener skilled at welcoming diverse viewpoints. Adept at synthesizing and harmonizing different voices in complex situations.
▶ 0:53:01Mr. Ashcroft: He is comfortable in being held to account and will require those in the department to be similarly accessible and accountable. Todd blanche's record represents a commitment to the rule of law and the constitution. Our 250th anniversary properly reminds us that liberty is the core value of america in fact it's a core value of human existence.
▶ 0:53:26Mr. Ashcroft: To safeguard this cultural value, america needs an attorney general exclusively devoted to the rule of law and who unfailingly will honor his oath to the constitution. Todd blanche is the right person for that responsibility. Mr. chairman and committee members, thank you for what I consider to be a privilege.
▶ 0:53:51Mr. Ashcroft: To appear before this committee and communicate to you my unreserved endorsement of todd blanche for attorney general of the united states. And I thank you for this opportunity.
▶ 0:54:01Chair Grassley: Thank you Mr. ashcroft. Ms. pence -- Ms. pinsky. -- Ms. bensky: -- Ms. bensky.
▶ 0:54:17Ms. Bensky: Thank you to the committee for hearing survivor voices. I would like to remind you who you are from today. At this time, I survivor sisters and family please rise. We may look like a grown adults when you see us now but we were children. Young girls at the time of our abuse. These are the photos of winter innocence, dreams and lives were stolen.
▶ 0:54:44Ms. Bensky: Please take these faces in as you think of us as your own family, daughters, nieces, sisters. Now look at our faces and remember the women and families of who the doj re-victimized. Thank you so much. I am a teacher. In my school if a student released a nude photo depicting a peer sexual assault and abuse they would almost certainly face expulsion. Yet this is what our department of justice did to victims.
▶ 0:55:16Ms. Bensky: Today, -- todd blanche has been at the helm of the release of nude images of survivors, the outing of jane doe's and the exposure of more than 100 victims identifying information and documents describing horrific acts of abuse including my own.
▶ 0:55:35Ms. Bensky: Instead of treating this release as its own violation and holding the man who led it accountable, you have a decision on whether you place him in the highest law enforcement position in this country. In december before the document release are attorney submitted 350 victims names to the department of justice. As victims names to be redacted. In that first release I found my name in two pieces.
▶ 0:56:06Ms. Bensky: In the next release my name appeared again but this time the redaction's were so far worse. The final display not only my name but my phone number, my former addresses, where I worked and other identifying information. When my name appeared in the third file release it became difficult to believe this was not intentional. Despite my lawyer repeatedly contacting the doj seeking protection, my information continued to be exposed.
▶ 0:56:35Ms. Bensky: And it is not just my name it is the identifying information these documents contain disturbing yet incomplete accounts of my abuse. Available not only for the entire world to see but my child, students and friends, my employers in colleagues and family. It was humiliating. Worse, my fbi 302 exposed a jane doe who had fought for decades to conceal her identity.
▶ 0:57:04Ms. Bensky: It has been absolutely devastating. Outing survivors causes real and irrevocable harm. While coping with our emotional distress and psychological trauma, we have also lost our privacy and confidentiality. Suffered reputational harm, lost jobs and now fear for our personal safety. We are not activists. We are crime victims. For us this has never been about politics.
▶ 0:57:35Ms. Bensky: It has been about getting justice for crimes committed against us. And the redaction's are not the only problem with todd blanche's nomination. He has never attempted to listen to us, survivors in this room repeatedly asked to meet with todd blanche through multiple channels and he never responded. Yesterday he said he would meet with us with our attorneys if they were present but let's be clear that was the first time that was ever communicated to us before yesterday.
▶ 0:58:05Ms. Bensky: He simply ignored us for the last eight months. He has been radio silent and the silence was deafening. Crime victims deserve better for the nation's highest level of law enforcement officials. We deserve to be heard directly not dismissed and ignored. There are enormous investigative leads and must be followed despite Mr. blanche's claim that there are none. Epstein and maxwell did not abuse women and children alone.
▶ 0:58:35Ms. Bensky: They did not build their operation alone. Others enabled these crimes, exploited victims and avoided accountability for decades. You do not have to take my word for it. Several weeks ago after examining the evidence, chairman james comber directed todd blanche to open investigations into two men connected to epstein.
▶ 0:58:56Ms. Bensky: The files are not merely a collection of embarrassing names and politically damaging associations, they are records connected to the sexual exploitation and trafficking of girls and young women. They contain information about how epstein's network worked, who assisted him and whether additional crimes can still be investigated.
▶ 0:59:21Ms. Bensky: The department of justice should pursue every credible lead and not just -- they should work tirelessly not just to shut down investigations. The survivors in this room know there are investigative leads because they are our stories. Mr. blanche knows it to yet he has chosen not to pursue them. His actions have destroyed survivors. According to public reporting Mr.
▶ 0:59:48Ms. Bensky: Blanche approximately nine hours meeting with elaine maxwell. He did not even spend nine minutes meeting with a survivor. Afterward, maxwell was transferred to what many describe as a summer camp prison. We learned all of this through the news. Imagine what that feels like as a survivor to sit there if you were exploited by elaine maxwell and you are hearing this for the first time. With no explanation outreach or transparency.
▶ 1:00:18Ms. Bensky: And to add insult to injury the information todd blanche gathered in the white house situation room last summer to curb the political fallout from the epstein files was abhorrent. Instead of following investigative leads are government treated and continued to treat this as a political crisis that needs to be managed. In our in a every person deserves equal protections under the law.
▶ 1:00:44Ms. Bensky: Todd blanche has been unwilling to protect epstein survivors personal information and has been resistant to investigate the people who helped epstein and maxwell commit those crimes. We need an attorney general committed to ensuring that everyone who facilitated epstein's crimes is held accountable. I implore you please think carefully and think about the girls in these photos. Thank you.
▶ 1:01:20Ms. Bos: Thank you chairman grassley, ranking member durbin and members of the committee.
▶ 1:01:29Chair Grassley: Can you pull it real close to you. I think that's right.
▶ 1:01:36Ms. Bos: My name is jennifer bos I live in antioch illinois. I'm the mother of an angel named megan and I am here because my daughters tragic death has exposed crowd -- catastrophic failure in immigration enforcement and trafficking policies. The investigation at her death continues. One truth is painfully clear. Dangerous gaps in our systems allowed illegal alien to exploit our laws and my daughter paid the ultimate price.
▶ 1:02:08Ms. Bos: Losing megan and being forced to navigate multiple broken systems while drowning in grief taught me that policies carrying life or death consequences cannot remain political talking points. That's why I have tried despite the most intense heartache anyone can ever experience to speak locally and nationally about the court crisis that compounded our tragedy.
▶ 1:02:38Ms. Bos: Illegal immigration, sanctuary policies, of the fentanyl crisis and cashless bail. I am so grateful that the whole of this administration with todd blanche leading the doj has prioritized all four of these issues. I am asking the committee not to wait until another mother is sitting where I am. Confirmed todd blanche.
▶ 1:02:59Ms. Bos: He is a leader who will uphold the law, honor victims, confront dangerous criminal organizations and fight to give other american families the safety and lasting protection they came -- that came too late for mine. I could not save my daughter, but todd blanche as attorney general he might save yours. Because next time it could be your child. It could be your family. It could be you.
▶ 1:03:32Ms. Bos: This can happen to anyone. We must have leaders that are willing to act before the next life is taken. Leaders who are willing to confront the failures instead of explaining them away. Leaders like todd blanche. Megan was my firstborn. She was a loyal friend.
▶ 1:03:59Ms. Bos: She was bubbly, she loved to be silly. She was extraordinarily creative and she was blessed with a spirit that lit up the room. In february of 2025 megan disappeared. For 51 days our family lived in the most unbearable agony.
▶ 1:04:28Ms. Bos: Day after day I did everything I could think of to search for her . Instead of bringing megan home our search ended with the most unbearable truth a mother could face. We learned that megan's life had been cut short and her body was
▶ 1:04:59Ms. Bos: Concealed, stuffed upside down in a garbage can filled with bleach by an illegal alien who had no right to be here. Again and she was stuffed upside down in a garbage can for 51 days soaking in bleach.
▶ 1:05:31Ms. Bos: For seven weeks, this man walked past that garbage can on his way to the bakery he worked at every day under a fake name. And during those weeks I couldn't breathe or eat or sleep. We searched his neighborhood, we knocked on his door. We left megan -- flyers with megan's face on every surface we could find.
▶ 1:06:02Ms. Bos: And then I learned she was only a driveway distance away from us the whole time. Not only was she killed but her dignity was stolen in death.
▶ 1:06:27Ms. Bos: Had megan not been identified by the tattoos she loved, even the beautiful image of my daughter that I hold in my heart it would have been replaced forever by the unbearable image of what had been done to her. Megan's daughter was only five years old when this happened. Her life with megan, a right to know and make memories with her mom was stolen.
▶ 1:07:01Ms. Bos: This is megan's bracelet. A charm bracelet we started when she was five and it has every memory on here from growing up, every milestone every place we visit. Everything that was important to her. It is here, this is her story. These are the stories that she should be telling her daughter.
▶ 1:07:29Ms. Bos: I have two hope I can remember them all. There are so many. My husband and I we won't be retiring like we imagined of course because we have to pray we live long enough to raise her little girl into adulthood. And this is because our laws that we already have aren't enforced.
▶ 1:08:02Ms. Bos: This is why victims don't care about partisan victories, we care whether the dangerous criminals and drug traffickers and cartels are stopped before another loved one is buried and another family is left shattered.
▶ 1:08:20Ms. Bos: Right now, governors and local officials enact sanctuary protections cashless bail policies and identification laws that undermine federal enforcement and create dangerous public safety loopholes, a criminal that's released under a reckless local policy does not remain inside that city or state. He can cross into yours. Megan's perpetrator was released a day after he was arrested.
▶ 1:08:53Ms. Bos: Do you want to measure neighbor? Angel families have told how they have been entirely abandoned and ignored by the government. Our children and families were politically inconvenient. Some of these angel families have been -- I have tried asking for someone to listen to the stories and learn from what's happened to us. For more than 25 years.
▶ 1:09:25Ms. Bos: In this very room the last angel mom sat here was asked how come she was here and why did they have to sit through another hearing. That is beginning to change now under the current leadership of todd blanche. Angel families finally are feeling heard and respected and taken seriously.
▶ 1:09:55Ms. Bos: There is a renewed focus on prosecuting immigration crimes and the transnational criminal organizations, drug trafficking and the like. So much work that's done by ice and homeland security investigations goes unseen. It is not limited to detaining the individuals who escaped detection at the border. Their work is life protecting.
▶ 1:10:21Ms. Bos: From the time I talked with todd blanche I knew immediately he makes victims a priority. Under his direction the doj has engaged directly with the angel families and treated us not like political props, but as partners in preventing future tragedies and that's all we have ever asked for.
▶ 1:10:51Ms. Bos: Justice can bring our family home. So the justice we are seeking now is the assurance that their deaths won't be ignored. And they won't be in vain and preventable tragedies from these laws not being enforced won't be repeated. I 100% believe todd blanche will be the one who can deliver that justice.
▶ 1:11:20Ms. Bos: Saving lives of people who will never know it. Thank you.
▶ 1:11:31Ms. Oyer: Good morning chairman grassley, ranking member durbin and members of the committee. I am here as a former member -- former partner attorney. I had great hope the todd blanche would be an effective leader and a responsible steward of the department of justice. But he quickly proved me wrong. Two days after Mr.
▶ 1:11:58Ms. Oyer: Blanche was confirmed as deputy attorney general he fired me for my position as the department's career pardon attorney. I declined to rubberstamp a political favor for a friend of the president and it cost me my job. Mr. blanchard's office had asked me to recommend restoring the gun ownership rights of a convicted domestic abuser. I raised concerns about public safety. But Mr. blanche's staff pressured me to go along anyway.
▶ 1:12:28Ms. Oyer: I did not. Domestic violence is the leading type of homicide among women. When a domestic abuser is armed, his victim is five times more likely to be killed. But because this particular domestic abuser had a personal relationship with the president, Mr. blanche's staff asked me to set aside my concerns. When I wouldn't, Mr. blanche fired me within hours. He then took extraordinary measures to silence me.
▶ 1:12:59Ms. Oyer: He sent U.S. marshall to my home in an effort to prevent me from speaking to members of congress. I was shocked to hear Mr. blanche's testimony about this yesterday. What he said about my firing is provably false. His claim that it had nothing to do with the concerns I raised is contradicted by documents in evidence. His claim that he tried to call me before sending marshals to my home is flat-out false.
▶ 1:13:28Ms. Oyer: His claim that it is normal for doj to use armed law enforcement officers to deliver mail to the homes of its former employees is preposterous. The casual lies that Mr. blanche tells even while sitting in this chair testifying to this committee are emblematic of a much larger problem.
▶ 1:13:54Ms. Oyer: Courts across the country have said they can no longer trust the justice department to uphold the law and tell the truth. There are over 700 documented instances of doj violating judicial orders. There are nearly 100 cases in which judges appointed by both parties have found the doj presented false or misleading information in court.
▶ 1:14:21Ms. Oyer: Earlier this week a federal judge found Mr. blanche personally misled this congress about the department settlement agreement with president trump. To the american public it looks like Mr. blanche is running doj as donald trump's personal law firm. He is using law enforcement powers to pursue petty grudges harbored by the president.
▶ 1:14:48Ms. Oyer: These pointless vendettas are wasting our scarce resources and destroying doj's credibility. Blanche has repeatedly placed Mr. trump's entries -- interests ahead of the interests of the country. It protects the entire trump family and all of their businesses. From any investigation or audit, forever.
▶ 1:15:16Ms. Oyer: It gives away nearly $2 billion of our money for no reason at all. It is a windfall for the president and his allies at the expense of the american people. A court found that signing this agreement was a betrayal of Mr. blanche's duty to represent the interests of the united states. That is the most basic obligation of an attorney general. Mr. blanche said yesterday that the settlement fund is dead.
▶ 1:15:46Ms. Oyer: It is not. That is contract law 101. Mr. trump or his sons could seek to enforce it at any time. Mr. blanche gave bizarre excuses for not meeting with jeffrey epstein's victims. Yet he spent two days personally eliciting testimony from ghislaine maxwell, epstein's partner in crime.
▶ 1:16:12Ms. Oyer: After this imprisoned sex traffickers made statements claiming to exonerate the president, she was moved to a minimum security prison. That is a grievous breach of doj policy. It is an abuse of Mr. blanche's office. It is a terrible betrayal of epstein and maxwell's victims. Mr. blanche's callous approach to the epstein case matches his cavalier attitude toward rearming domestic abusers.
▶ 1:16:43Ms. Oyer: At the end of the, the priority of this doj is protecting powerful men, even when it comes at the expense of vulnerable women. What Mr. blanche is doing is dangerous. Earlier this week, two supreme court justices set here and testified about the terrifying threats that judges are facing in this country. Meanwhile, Mr.
▶ 1:17:06Ms. Oyer: Blanche is fueling those threats by attacking judges who rule against the administration and declaring a war against the courts. These are not partisan concerns. Americans across the political spectrum rely on doj to keep us safe and free. Mr. blanche has shown he is willing to put all of that at risk to serve a political agenda. I begged the members of this committee to think about what this is costing.
▶ 1:17:38Ms. Oyer: Please do not degrade our justice system further in promoting Mr. blanche. Thank you.
▶ 1:17:44Chair Grassley: Mr. adler?
▶ 1:17:49Mr. Adler: Good morning, distinguished members of the senate judiciary committee. My name is jon adler. I appear in my personal capacity to provide testimony in support of the honorable todd blanche to serve as U.S. attorney general. I respectfully offer my perspective as a former colleague and as a national law enforcement organization leader.
▶ 1:18:14Mr. Adler: My experience in law enforcement spans over 30 years, and I was honored to serve under 10 attorney general's as a federal law enforcement officer. With my service, I also served as the national president of the federal law enforcement officers association, two terms representing federal officers from 65 different agencies nationwide. As a volunteer law enforcement agent, I had the privilege of serving with the leaders of the largest national organizations, including the f.o.p. And others.
▶ 1:18:48Mr. Adler: I have dedicated my life into the safety of those who serve, supporting innovative approaches toward implementing officer and public safety, which are intertwined. As a career technical instructor, I emphasize proficiency and compassionate civility. Acting attorney general blanche exudes this. When I adjoined the attorney's office in 2001, I met an intelligent, motivated paralegal by the name of todd blanche.
▶ 1:19:19Mr. Adler: My first impression was that he moved like a football fullback, carrying the federal criminal statutes book under his arm as he charged through the doors. You could figure out why all of the prosecutors were friendly with Mr. blanche. They all wanted him on their trial teams. It was clear that paralegal blanche had a passion for prosecuting violent crimes. He became an assistant U.S. attorney and his amazing work ethic and passion in combating violent crime were unparalleled.
▶ 1:19:50Mr. Adler: A usa blanche exuded the speak softly but carry overwhelming evidence. It was no surprise to anyone at the office that he ultimately became the co-chief of the violent crimes unit. It was clear he was fully committed to litigating violent crime cases in furtherance of public safety. For context, I want to emphasize the acting attorney general began his paralegal prosecutorial career in an office predominately represented by a usa's with different political views.
▶ 1:20:21Mr. Adler: What impressed me during my 16 years with the U.S. attorney's office was the unified commitment to the rule of law, irrespective of political affiliation. I am absolutely convinced that if confirmed as attorney general, acting attorney general blanche will carry forward that spirit and unwavering commitment to the rule of law. During the terrorist attacks on september 11, 2001, the U.S. attorney's office was located in the hot zone in new york city.
▶ 1:20:49Mr. Adler: While you often hear the acting attorney general speak of the extraordinary bravery of first responders who ran into harm's way, he exuded that charge forward spirit during the challenging days following 9/11. I have profound respect for his service above self, and it has only grown. Moving forward to his tenure as the acting attorney general, his outreach and engagement to law enforcement nationwide has been extraordinary. The same could be said 24/7.
▶ 1:21:20Mr. Adler: In speaking with my fellow law enforcement organization leaders, it is clear they have great respect for the acting attorney general and appreciate his commitment to backing the blue. He has demonstrated a strong commitment to officer safety and ensuring that all law enforcement officers have the same protection of the law. According to the fbi's recent annual report, 90,000 law enforcement officers were assaulted, a 10 year high.
▶ 1:21:51Mr. Adler: The attorney general has made it clear he will support the prosecution of anyone who assaults a law enforcement officer. Civility does not work when it is one-sided. He has earned the respect and admiration of officers nationwide. Acting attorney general blanche has distinguished himself during the substantial time he spent with all the national law enforcement organizations.
▶ 1:22:13Mr. Adler: In particular, the time he spent with the concerns of survivors of heroes killed in the line of duty. Much like his powerful support for our angel families, he has supported surviving family members. I have no doubt he will continue that for all americans. As the father of a beautiful teenage daughter, I worry about her safety every day.
▶ 1:22:41Mr. Adler: I expect our government leaders to do everything they can to support a safe and just quality of life for all our children. That should be a priority. I sleep well knowing that my daughter is safe and a priority for acting attorney general blanche and his team. Under his leadership and with the dedication of law enforcement officers, violent crime continues to be driven down. We need acting attorney general blanche to be confirmed as our chief law enforcement officer.
▶ 1:23:11Mr. Adler: Throughout my law enforcement career, I continued to wear and a pendant that has john 15:13 inscribed. Greater love hath no greater ambition than to lay down a life for a friend. I have no doubt that acting attorney general blanche will exude that spirit of the scripture and do everything he can to protect the safety of all americans by following the rule of law.
▶ 1:23:36Mr. Adler: I ask respectfully that the committee set aside political differences and vote to confirm acting attorney general blanche as the next attorney general. Thank you.
▶ 1:23:48Chair Grassley: Ms. bos, first of all, thank you for your courage coming forward. You know how important it is to have effective leadership in pursuing justice. I think you answered my question in your last two minutes of your testimony, but I would like to give you an opportunity to say it once again, how you feel about Mr.
▶ 1:24:12Chair Grassley: Blanche and the prospects of his continued leadership at the justice department.
▶ 1:24:20Ms. Bos: Thank you, chairman. I feel like we have already seen what has come out of the justice department as far as the prosecutions of the drug trafficking, the cartels.
▶ 1:24:40Ms. Bos: He is following up the hard work of the men and women that are our ice agents, cbp, and that is making a difference.
▶ 1:24:53Chair Grassley: Thank you very much. Ms. oyer,, you know the biden administration was the most active pardoning administration in american history. 4000 total acts of clemency.
▶ 1:25:12Chair Grassley: I think you were the pardon attorney, january 17, 2025, when president biden granted more commutations in a single day than any prior president had over their entire presidency. Is that right?
▶ 1:25:29Ms. Oyer: I was a pardon attorney on that date.
▶ 1:25:32Chair Grassley: Where you also the pardon attorney on december 23, 2024, when biden commuted 37 inmates on federal death row?
▶ 1:25:48Ms. Oyer: Yes, I was.
▶ 1:25:50Chair Grassley: So I want to bring up some of these commutations. Thomas sanders. He killed a 12-year-old girl, alexis. He shot alexis four times. He slit her throat after the girl had witnessed him to murder her mother. Did you object to president biden' is commuting his sentence.
▶ 1:26:17Ms. Oyer: Sir, I am not able to discuss the recommendations I made to the president in the past.
▶ 1:26:24Chair Grassley: Can you speak -- did you turn your microphone on?
▶ 1:26:30Ms. Oyer: I believe it is on, sir.
▶ 1:26:33Chair Grassley: You were the pardoning attorney. You did not object to the recommendation.
▶ 1:26:39Ms. Oyer: Sir, I am not able to discuss the recommendations I provided to the president on clemency matters, which are considered to be covered by executive privilege.
▶ 1:26:52Chair Grassley: I want you to know that I have read evidence that you made this recommendation. So are you telling me the evidence I read, that I am wrong ? Did you make the recommendation? You are telling me you cannot talk about it.
▶ 1:27:07Ms. Oyer: Just like Mr. blanche explained yesterday, I am not free to discuss the recommendations are provided to the white house, because they are covered by executive privilege.
▶ 1:27:17Chair Grassley: You can't even tell me if you contacted the victim's family? You can't say yes or no to that?
▶ 1:27:24Ms. Oyer: Sir, I cannot talk about the discussions I had in the white house. They would have to waive the executive privilege. I would be happy to come back and speak with members of this committee.
▶ 1:27:38Chair Grassley: What I'm going to do is I'm going to tell you what I know. So let's go to the case of a vela torres, who stabbed to death eight-year-old laura hobbs and night-year-old crystal, who were riding their bicycles. He had also sexually assaulted at least one of them.
▶ 1:28:08Chair Grassley: Four years later, he strangled to death a 20-year-old naval officer in the barracks. So you cannot talk about this, but I have read evidence that you made this recommendation, and you cannot even tell me yes or no with you made that recommendation.
▶ 1:28:26Ms. Oyer: Sir, what I can tell you is that president biden did commute the sentences of 37 individuals who were on death row to sentences of life in prison, and all of those individuals will remain incarcerated for the rest of their lives, most likely in maximum-security prisons.
▶ 1:28:44Chair Grassley: The fact is they were taken off death row. Then we have the case of someone who shot up a church in south carolina. That made national history for a long period of time. He murdered nine african-americans in a racially motivated attack. And you are telling me you cannot talk about that. But I have read evidence that you made this recommendation.
▶ 1:29:17Chair Grassley: And since you cannot comment on it, I'm just going to have to tell you that you made that recommendation. Robert bowers murdered people in the pittsburgh tree of synagogue in the deadliest attack on a local jewish community in american history. And you tell me you cannot talk about the commutation of robert bowers, but I want to tell you that I have read evidence that you made this recommendation.
▶ 1:29:51Chair Grassley: And also dzhokhar tsarnaev have -- planted bombs at the boston marathon, killing three and injuring hundreds, in an act of terrorism. And you are telling me you cannot talk about that, but I want you to know that I have read evidence that you made this recommendation. And it seemed pretty -- I'm going to give you a chance to react to it.
▶ 1:30:16Chair Grassley: It seemed pretty obvious that you were fired because the current justice department leadership disagreed with how you handled the pardons last administration. Do you want to respond?
▶ 1:30:27Ms. Oyer: Regarding these cases, these are absolutely horrific cases, and every individual, as you mentioned, will remain incarcerated for the rest of their lives, mostly in a maximum prison facility. As far as the reasons for my firing, I have been in litigation with the justice department for over a year about my firing, which was plainly illegal. Mr.
▶ 1:30:52Ms. Oyer: Blanche's comments in this room yesterday to the first time I have ever heard the explanation that I was fired because of recommendations I made to the prior administration about how to accomplish their clemency objectives. Mr. blanche's justice department submitted a pleading to the protection board that stated that the facts about my firing were not in dispute.
▶ 1:31:14Ms. Oyer: The facts as I have been saying for one year plus are that I was fired within hours of declining to make a recommendation that I believed was very dangerous. Mr. blanche's statement yesterday that it was for another reason materialized out of thin air and has never been stated before.
▶ 1:31:34Chair Grassley: Mr. ashcroft, you served with distinction during your tenure as attorney general. You know what it takes to do the job. You do it well. Mr. blanche's leadership of the justice department during this administration -- you believe he would serve as an effective and capable attorney general?
▶ 1:31:54Mr. Ashcroft: I believe the history tells a story here. Without question, todd blanche has a history of involvement in the justice department, pursuing the rule of law, that extended from his time as an assistant in the office when I was attorney general 25 years ago, to recent times, when his aggressive approach in fighting crime has
▶ 1:32:27Mr. Ashcroft: Actually been part of the effort that has driven down violent crime across the country, and particularly in cases where the department was welcome to assist and work with local officials. In my home jurisdiction of missouri, they had operation spring cleanup, and the number of very important prosecutions were begun at that time.
▶ 1:32:51Mr. Ashcroft: I think it is a credit to him and I have no doubt that his commitment to maintaining the safety and security of americans and their rights will be pursued in pursuit of the rule of law and within the bounds of the constitution of the united states, which is the framing that I think every american expects -- the constitution and rule of law of the united states will be followed and defended.
▶ 1:33:21Sen. Durbin: Ms. bos, it breaks my heart to hear the story of you and your daughter. I want to say my heart goes out to you and to your husband, carrying on for her. That is the greatest tribute you can give her, I am sure. I am sorry you went through this terrible tragedy. Ms.
▶ 1:33:51Sen. Durbin: Fenske -- bensky, it is hard to imagine this government cap publishing your personal information. Did anyone notify them of this breach of privacy?
▶ 1:34:02Ms. Bensky: We notify them immediately, even before the document release happened, after the clemency act passed. My lawyer teamed up with other lawyers and basically every batch that came forward, all the way through I believe april. In the january batch, I was exposed.
▶ 1:34:31Sen. Durbin: Did this happen to any of the others who are present here?
▶ 1:34:36Ms. Bensky: All of them, yes. There were hundreds of victims that were outed. I do want to speak to just the damages, the threats. We had lots of jobs, loss of confidentiality, privacy. But there is another piece here, and it is that this idea of withholding information -- we are trying to get justice. We have always been trying to seek justice.
▶ 1:35:07Ms. Bensky: You see the new mexico ag has attempted five times to get the files from todd blanche and from this doj, and it is obstruction. They are obstructing. For us, of course, there were so many damages. There are so many things we are mourning the loss of, including who we were as these young girls. But to still see it be obstructed after 30 years -- and this is five administrations.
▶ 1:35:38Ms. Bensky: We are not saying this is just this administration. We have been at this fight for 30 years. We just really hope that there is a huge impact as far as just releasing information and making sure it is followed up on.
▶ 1:35:53Sen. Durbin: I don't understand how this attorney general can find 48 hours to visit with glenn maxwell, who is been prosecuted for sex trafficking, and cannot find 30 minutes to meet with survivors of that sexual predator.
▶ 1:36:12Ms. Bensky: It is not for lack of trying. We have tried in every way we know how to try. I would say I think many of us in this room would be interested in meeting with him today, if we could.
▶ 1:36:26Sen. Durbin: Many members of the committee will remember when we had the olympic athletes in here who had been sexually abused, and the head of the fbi set through their entire testimony to show his concern for what had happened to them, and he worked with the federal bureau of investigation head. That was the right thing to do for both sides. Why in the world would Mr. blanche at this point say he does not have the time?
▶ 1:36:56Sen. Durbin: I could not understand his argument yesterday. He could not see you because you had a lawyer or he could not see you because you did not have a lawyer?
▶ 1:37:04Ms. Bensky: He said because we had a lawyer. As a career prosecutor -- you have heard a lot. And that is great. But I think as a career prosecutor, he should be salivating by this case, right? This case is gold for somebody that wants to prosecute. There are 6 million files. There are thousands of victims. And yet all we have seen is one perpetrator that died in prison.
▶ 1:37:32Ms. Bensky: The other perpetrator is now in a minimum-security penitentiary. And todd blanche has done zero investigations when he has been told by the members of the house --
▶ 1:37:44Sen. Durbin: I don't think his name should be called on the floor of the senate until he meets with you. That is not too much to ask. Set aside two hours, four hours, whatever it takes. There is clearly an effort by this committee to get all the information. But to snub you at this point -- there is something else going on. Someone told me once in politics there is always a good reason, and there is always a real reason.
▶ 1:38:12Sen. Durbin: What is the real reason why todd blanche does not want to meet with the survivors of jeffrey epstein?
▶ 1:38:18Ms. Bensky: It appears from the outside reputational harm. That is what is at the core. He prioritizes the reputation of the administration over survivors of sexual abuse and of sex trafficking survivors in this country.
▶ 1:38:35Sen. Durbin: I hope the message goes out to all senators on both sides of the table.
▶ 1:38:39Ms. Bensky: We have been saying we are not political. I have spoken with a lot of offices on both sides and every single conversation -- we had a great conversation with josh hawley's office. It was amazing. And when we had those conversations, it felt like you see us as human beings. We have survivors on both sides of the aisle. We are not here to be political. These are just our stories.
▶ 1:39:08Ms. Bensky: 17-year-old me, I promise, not political. We have these very real interactions in your offices. We hope you can put politics aside. It was something beautiful we saw during the epstein files transparency act. There was a moment when marjorie taylor green sat beside Ms. stansberry, and that will be in my memory forever. The cross party lines for something really important. I hope you can do that.
▶ 1:39:36Sen. Hawley: For everybody who is here, all of the victims, thank you for being here. Thank you for standing up and telling your stories. Ms. bos, thank you for being here and telling us about your daughter. I'm sorry for what all of you have done. I want to thank you and honor what you are doing. Ms. lawyer, you were president biden' as party attorney, correct? You made clemency recommendations to the white house whether or not to pardon inmates. Is that correct?
▶ 1:40:04Ms. Oyer: My job was to make policy recommendations.
▶ 1:40:09Sen. Hawley: In that capacity, you recommended that joe biden grant clemency to all 40 federal death row inmates, all of them. Clear them out. Correct?
▶ 1:40:18Ms. Oyer: As I told chairman grassley, I am not free to discuss.
▶ 1:40:24Sen. Hawley: I mean, we have the memo. Your memo of november 4, 2020 four, says, and I quote, disparity and undue severity of sentence, which are present in many if not all of these cases, have been recognized as grounds for clemency. He went on to recommend in that memo and a series of other memos that are public record that the president of the united states grant clemency to murderers, rapists, and the most horrible offenders. Clear death row out.
▶ 1:40:54Sen. Hawley: I am amazed you have been called today. I am absolutely amazed by it. Let's talk about the people you recommended. You talk about honoring victims. The people who you recommended that clemency and live at the expense and sufferance of taxpayers for the rest of their lives. Let's start with dylan roof. Dylan was a neo-nazi who murdered nine african-american worshipers at a bible study in charleston, south carolina. Do you remember this case? I would hope you did. Here is his victims. Want to look at them?
▶ 1:41:25Sen. Hawley: There they are. Nine of them. At a bible study. In a church. Killed in cold blood. The doj knew from day one that he had decided to attack african americans because of their race. He further decided to attack african-american worshipers and a black church in order to make his attack more notorious. More notorious.
▶ 1:41:52Sen. Hawley: And yet you recommended that he be granted clemency, live at the expense of taxpayers for the rest of his life, substitute your judgment for the american judicial system. Do you stand by that recommendation today?
▶ 1:42:02Ms. Oyer: I'm not going to comment. I will tell you that Mr. roof is going to die in prison.
▶ 1:42:09Sen. Hawley: He is going to live in prison for a very long time because of your recommendations. Here is what you said in your memo. You said that actually roof is not a compelling candidate for clemency, but you recommended it anyway because he suffered from anxiety, right? He suffered from anxiety. Did it ever occur to you that maybe the families of his victims might suffer a little bit of anxiety because he marched into their church and murdered them in cold blood because he was an incredible racism wanted to get on tv?
▶ 1:42:41Sen. Hawley: Do you regret it? Do you regret it? Let's talk about robert bowers, a man who regularly spewed such vile hatred of jews it is unlike anything I have ever seen. He barked into a pittsburgh synagogue and shot everybody he could find, killing 11 innocent people who were there to worship. A federal jury in pittsburgh unanimously recommended the death sentence after finding him guilty on 63 counts.
▶ 1:43:11Sen. Hawley: Here they are. There are his victims. Take a good look. You recommended clemency for this person who went in and killed these people just because they are jews. The other guy killed people just because they are black. This guy killed people just because they are jews. A jury recommended that he be sentenced to death. You substituted your judgment for there is and now he is going to live. Are you proud of that?
▶ 1:43:38Ms. Oyer: What I am proud of is the fact that I took my job as pardon attorney extremely seriously.
▶ 1:43:46Sen. Hawley: You did not take the victim seriously. And then there is a vela torres, who was not just a murderer. He was a serial killer and a rapist. Here is who he assaulted and killed. He sexually assaulted and killed eight-year-old laura hobbs and nine-year-old krystal tobias in a chicago suburb in 2005. And then four years after that, he committed another murder.
▶ 1:44:15Sen. Hawley: He slaughtered a fellow servicemember, a navy petty officer. She was in the barracks. That is what he did. And you recommended clemency for this individual. And now he will live his life at the expense of taxpayers because you substituted your judgment for that of the american judicial system, jury, judges, the whole lot. And yet you are here to tell us that you are somehow a victim. I don't think so. I think your judgment is astoundingly terrible.
▶ 1:44:46Sen. Hawley: I am amazed that this side of the aisle has called you. I asked my friends on this side of the aisle -- do you agree with this? Is this what you want? Do you want these people to be pardoned and live at the expense of taxpayers for their whole life? You want to excuse the murders of african-american churchgoers? You want to excuse the murders of jews in their synagogue? You want to excuse the murders of these children? That is what she did. And now she is online hawking products to try to make money of it.
▶ 1:45:17Sen. Hawley: You have your own website where you put your face on baseball caps and mugs. Are you trying to make money on this? This is unbelievable. And yet you say you are a victim? These are the victims. And you helped victimize them. And what you are doing is wrong. I hope every member on this side of the aisle will repudiate what you have done, what you stand for.
▶ 1:45:40Ms. Oyer: Sir, I would submit that the questions directed at me were rhetorical.
▶ 1:45:47Sen. Hawley: I asked you to respond and you said you would not. So I read to you what you had said. I quoted verbatim. I'm happy to keep doing it. I would ask the chairman that this report, the federal death penalty report, be entered into the record. It contains information regarding her recommendations and the trial record. I ask it to be entered in the record.
▶ 1:46:12Chair Grassley: Ms. oyer, take a minute to respond if you want to.
▶ 1:46:18Ms. Oyer: Thank you, chairman grassley. Under president biden, just like under president trump, I had a job to do, which was to make recommendations to the president about how to best accomplish their clemency objectives. I put the utmost effort into doing that in a way that was consistent with the interests of the justice system and all of its stakeholders, which includes crime victims as well as defendants, as well as family members, as well as judges, as well as prosecutors.
▶ 1:46:50Ms. Oyer: All criminal justice system stakeholders. The process I presided over was one that was beyond reproach. What is happening now with clemency is an absolute disgrace, and I'm sorry that I cannot answer the questions about the specific recommendations in this public setting, but I would be glad to meet with any members of this committee who have concerns privately to discuss, to the extent that I can --
▶ 1:47:12Sen. Hawley: Why don't you meet with the victim's families? >> thank you, chairman. Mr. ashcroft, welcome back to the senate. You knew jim comey?
▶ 1:47:31Mr. Ashcroft: Yes indeed, I did.
▶ 1:47:35Sen. Whitehouse: You trusted him?
▶ 1:47:36Mr. Ashcroft: He was the deputy attorney general as well as the U.S. attorney for the southern district of new york.
▶ 1:47:43Sen. Whitehouse: You trusted him with the top job?
▶ 1:47:46Mr. Ashcroft: I asked him to help administer justice at the department of justice.
▶ 1:47:52Sen. Whitehouse: You respected him?
▶ 1:47:52Mr. Ashcroft: Yes, I did.
▶ 1:47:57Sen. Whitehouse: Can you vouch for this department's prosecution of him for lying to congress, or for the process that was performed?
▶ 1:48:08Mr. Ashcroft: I am not in a position -- I don't know all the facts. I'm not in a position to comment on pending investigations or prosecutions.
▶ 1:48:19Sen. Whitehouse: Can you vouch for this department's prosecution of him for posting a picture of the numbers 8647, or the process that led to that?
▶ 1:48:32Mr. Ashcroft: My response would have to be the same as it is for any prosecution. I am not part of the department now. I am not fully informed of its factual basis or the consider is -- considerations it has made in bringing prosecutions.
▶ 1:48:49Sen. Whitehouse: What are your views today of Mr. comey's character and merits?
▶ 1:48:55Mr. Ashcroft: I am not going to start to discuss the character and merits of individuals, especially those who are standing in a position of responding to charges from the justice department.
▶ 1:49:14Mr. Ashcroft: I can respond to what I believed during the time I served as attorney general and when he served with me, and his service to me and I believe the united states at that time is commendable and honorable.
▶ 1:49:28Sen. Whitehouse: What is opr and the department of justice?
▶ 1:49:32Mr. Ashcroft: I believe it is the office of professional responsibility.
▶ 1:49:37Sen. Whitehouse: What is its role?
▶ 1:49:38Mr. Ashcroft: It's role is to encourage individuals in the department to act in compliance and in conformity with the rules of ethics and responsibility.
▶ 1:49:55Sen. Whitehouse: And did you respect the role of the office of professional responsibility when you were attorney general?
▶ 1:50:02Sen. -- Mr. Ashcroft: I certainly did. I hope they would advise me to keep me out of trouble.
▶ 1:50:09Sen. Whitehouse: If the office of professional responsibility was functionally disabled by an administration in the department of justice, what message would that send to prosecutors?
▶ 1:50:23Mr. Ashcroft: I'm not in a position to comment on a hypothetical disabling. When you say functionally disabled, I think that requires an assumption of what functionally disabled means. I personally -- it is a hypothetical and I am unable to respond.
▶ 1:50:48Sen. Whitehouse: You do agree that opr has an important goal and is important to the department of justice and the performance of its duties?
▶ 1:50:56Mr. Ashcroft: I certainly respected the department's operation, including opr, at the time of my duty to serve as attorney general of the united states.
▶ 1:51:10Sen. Whitehouse: While you were attorney general, where there procedures that took place when judicial findings of prosecutorial misconduct or dishonesty occurred?
▶ 1:51:23Mr. Ashcroft: I have to say I don't remember charges of prosecutorial misconduct that I dealt with.
▶ 1:51:33Sen. Whitehouse: They were pretty scarce until now. It was pretty unusual to have judges say that arguments were made in bad faith, that arguments were made as pretexts, that arguments were disingenuous, that arguments were shoddy or terrible, that the department was sacrificing its credibility, that the department was disrespecting orders of the court, that the department had lied or was engaged in shams, that there was
▶ 1:52:07Sen. Whitehouse: Willful and intentional noncompliance or disregard of court orders. That department lawyers were contemptuous and arguments were unconscionable. To me, those are red flag words. I was a U.S. attorney. If my federal court had used those words about my line attorneys, there would have been some follow-up. I expect that in your department, if those kinds of words were used, there would at least be some preliminary follow-up.
▶ 1:52:37Sen. Whitehouse: If it were serious, there might be a review by the office of professional responsibility. Does that sound like what likely would have happened during your day?
▶ 1:52:47Mr. Ashcroft: I was only admonished at one time I remember by a court for having commented on evidence. I thought it was pretty good evidence, and I think I just said pretty good evidence at that time. At that time, I decided that I need to be more careful about my remarks. My remarks were safeguarded and carefully made.
▶ 1:53:12Mr. Ashcroft: And frankly, I might add, more carefully made than the remarks of some of the judicial officers who, while very concerned about the, seem to be willing to themselves engage in political considerations which I did not think were appropriate for the judiciary. So maybe there is a problem that is broader than we would otherwise recognize.
▶ 1:53:37Sen. Whitehouse: You have changed the topic a little bit to your own comments and response to that, which is fine. I appreciate that you said that. My question had to do with when criticisms like that are leveled against department lawyers. There is ordinarily some kind of a process of review that takes place. They are not just brushed off. That is correct, is it not?
▶ 1:54:09Sen. Whitehouse: Mr. ashcroft the office agrees to safeguard against things that are not professionally done, in a way that discredits the department. Public confidence in the department is very important. In the rule of law, guided by the constitution, is at the foundation of our liberty. I take that seriously. I believed that with all my heart when I served.
▶ 1:54:32Sen. Whitehouse: Thank you, sir.
▶ 1:54:37Sen. Smith: I want to thank all the victims who are here for your courage to come forward. This is not easy to do, to relive everything. Thank you for being here and telling your stories. Ms. oyer, you were biden's pardon attorney. I want to make sure I am clear. Your testimony here today is that you were fired because she would not recommend restoring mel gibson's gun rights.
▶ 1:55:02Ms. Oyer: I was fired just hours after I declined to make that recommendation.
▶ 1:55:07Sen. Smith: You cannot think of another reason?
▶ 1:55:08Ms. Oyer: That is the only expo nation I'm aware of. The justice department actually put in a pleading about the facts of my firing that they are not in dispute.
▶ 1:55:24Sen. Smith: On november 4, 20 24, you authored a 73 page memorandum recommending the commutation of all 40 federal death sentences.
▶ 1:55:33Ms. Oyer: As I have told --
▶ 1:55:37Sen. Smith: Don't play the game with me. They have waived executive privilege. I have the report. It is dated april 24, 2026. Your memo is quoted in here. It is public knowledge. The idea that you would come here -- you know that already. You would come here and disparage somebody else and not be willing to answer questions about how you commuted the sentences of murderers is ridiculous. I cannot believe you are here to do that.
▶ 1:56:04Ms. Oyer: I do not have the authority to commit sentences. I'm not sure which memo you are referring to.
▶ 1:56:12Sen. Smith: The november 2470 three page memo. Do you deny authoring it? It is ridiculous. I cannot believe -- you did. Everybody in america and in the world can pull it up. It is a ridiculous -- it quotes your letter. It quotes your letter. Just admit it. Just admit you authored it. Everybody knows who authored it.
▶ 1:56:40Sen. Smith: I'm not going to waste anymore time on your convenient little game you are playing. You also authored and recommended the commutation of the boston marathon bomber, the tree of life synagogue, and dillon roof. We all know this. How many pages of the 73 pages did you dedicate to victims? How many pages were dedicated to victims? I can tell you three. Three pages. Three pages were dedicated to the victims.
▶ 1:57:10Sen. Smith: So I also happen to have -- I made a special access request last year under the presidential records act for documents from the biden white house on the use of pardons and commutations. I want to show you a couple. Here is one. It is dated december 3, 2024, and it is an internal memo on the commutation of the 37 death sentences you were involved with. The memorandum states that the white house worked with reporters to ensure positive coverage.
▶ 1:57:40Sen. Smith: It says the white house gave advocates and elected officials resources and key messaging to amplify the news. You personally recommended commuting all 40 death sentence cases. An even broader action then biden took. That included dillon roof, the boston marathon bombing, the tree of life synagogue shooter. Did you know?
▶ 1:58:05Ms. Oyer: Sir, I have no idea what document you are referring to. I was not an employee of the white house.
▶ 1:58:16Sen. Schmitt: I will take it as a no. The used your ridiculous recommendation as a veneer of legitimacy.
▶ 1:58:25Ms. Oyer: I was called here to talk about Mr. blanche's nomination for attorney general.
▶ 1:58:31Sen. Schmitt: The reality is your credibility is gone. You cannot come here and do the political bidding of the biden administration and then, when you were called out on that by being fired -- you know what I really think? I think you thought you came here and -- you are selling merch, by the way. Do we have the hoodies that are up for sale? I think you came here thinking that you were going to be ordained the high priestess of the resistance. That is what I think.
▶ 1:59:02Sen. Schmitt: That is why you are denying simple facts that you authored the memo commuting the sentences. Everyone knows that. We have documents now from the white house that they used that memo as a p.r. Stunt. You have no credibility to talk about todd blanche. You have none. You have come here. You have denied basic facts. You recommended the commutation of murderers. You gave no quarter at all or any time to the victims of these brutal murders.
▶ 1:59:34Sen. Schmitt: I cannot believe you have been called here by the other side. But I am glad you have had an opportunity to expose your hypocrisy. Thank you.
▶ 1:59:46Sen. Hirono: I think all the witnesses for being here. As a continuation of a confirmation process for Mr. blanche, we are here to determine whether or not Mr. blanche, who continues to be president trump's lawyer, and all that that implies, should be the attorney general of the united states of america, who is supposed to be defending the constitution, not the president.
▶ 2:00:19Sen. Hirono: Thank you so much for being here , and for all the other epstein victims. Mr. blanche was asked whether he would meet with you. We knew that he had refused to meet with the victims of the epstein crimes. He offered yesterday some excuses about it not being appropriate for him to meet with the victims directly. Why, I do not know.
▶ 2:00:50Sen. Hirono: He offered up a staff person. I understand that a staff person from his office contacted you and others and offered to meet with your counsel. Is that correct? Not with you directly.
▶ 2:01:06Ms. Bensky: I am not aware of a staff are reaching out. I can ask. No, we have not heard from staff.
▶ 2:01:17Sen. Hirono: Let's get that clarified. Did I misunderstand that yesterday when he said I have a staff person here and we can get this done today, that they have not contacted you?
▶ 2:01:28Ms. Bensky: They have not contacted us.
▶ 2:01:32Sen. Hirono: He also said it would not be appropriate for him to meet directly with you. So not only is his staff -- they have not contacted you as he indicated yesterday. That this could all happen yesterday. He continues to make excuses, as far as I can tell, for not meeting with you, in spite of the fact that he met four hours with Ms. maxwell. Why is it so important?
▶ 2:02:01Sen. Hirono: Tell us -- why is it so important for you and the other victims of epstein crimes to meet with -- with Mr. blanche?
▶ 2:02:10Ms. Bensky: Thank you for the question. I think that if a victim comes and reports a crime to the fbi, what is the first thing they do? They follow up. Law & order: svu taught me that when I was 15 years old. The doj has never followed up in 30 years with any of us. There is a lot in the files right now that we should be investigating and looking into.
▶ 2:02:37Ms. Bensky: And to my knowledge -- they can answer this, but we have never been approached by anybody on the prosecutorial side of things. I do think that sitting down and telling our stories and explaining the people that were in the room -- we were witnesses of crimes. We had crimes committed to us directly. We do have a lot of information.
▶ 2:03:04Ms. Bensky: You would think that somebody would take that lead that is already -- we already went to the fbi. We would not have 302's if we had not gone to the fbi. It is already there. The following up of those 302's. And then once that are supposed to be handled by the department of justice -- why are we meeting with prosecutors? This case was never handled correctly from the beginning.
▶ 2:03:30Sen. Hirono: He also made excuses as to why personal information was not redacted, and exposing -- including you.
▶ 2:03:41Ms. Bensky: Something that stood out yesterday is he said immediately that when he learned, that they were taken down and that they fix them and within 24 hours they were put back up. That is entirely not true. There is still survivor information even today. My information just came down in april.
▶ 2:04:07Sen. Hirono: Would you say Mr. blanche exhibits a rather dismissive attitude toward all of you and the epstein crimes?
▶ 2:04:14Ms. Bensky: 1000%.
▶ 2:04:20Sen. Hirono: Trump's doj under todd blanche has urged career prosecutors for personal reasons for refusing to prioritize president trump's interests over their constitutional oath. Todd blanche has fired more than 1200 former career doj employees who worked for both republican and democratic administrations.
▶ 2:04:44Sen. Hirono: This does not even include all of the doj attorneys who resigned because they did not want to be part of a kind of doj that todd blanche is creating, which is basically not a department of justice, but a department of retribution and corruption, in my view. What risks does this pose to our country, for the kind of doj that todd blanche is running?
▶ 2:05:15Ms. Oyer: Sunder, one of doj's greatest strengths historically has been its nonpolitical career workforce of people who are experts in their subject matter. We need people who have specialization and things like national security, prosecuting child explication, and all manner of sophisticated crimes involving cryptocurrency. Mr. blanche has decimated the expertise of the career workforce.
▶ 2:05:42Ms. Oyer: The justice department has lost over a quarter of its attorneys under his leadership and has not been able to replace them. Certainly not with experienced, knowledgeable, nonpolitical people.
▶ 2:05:54Sen. Hirono: I think the doj is very much losing its credibility. As Mr. ashcroft mentioned, credibility and trust in doj is incredibly important. The rule of law is important. We have a president who does not believe the rule of law applies to him. And his attorney, Mr. blanche, is helping him, the president, proceed with his basically anti-rule of law agenda. I thank everyone for testifying today. Thank you.
▶ 2:06:24Sen. Booker: I want to start off by saying Ms. oyer that I hold you in the highest esteem and respect, especially what you are doing now as a private citizen. You use your platform to educate people about the law. It is technical, yet accessible. The badgering you just endured should be completely unacceptable.
▶ 2:06:44Sen. Booker: You were asked to comment on things that you did not have before you, and the treatment was outrageous. The idea that as a private citizen you cannot sell things is insulting to me when you have kash patel, or sitting fbi director, selling merch on his site, when you have a president of the united states hawking the bible.
▶ 2:07:12Sen. Booker: And yet you as a private citizen who has a platform to inform people about the law -- how dare we make such an accusation when the mockery of justice, the exploitation and the drifting off of their offices, has never received criticism from that side of the aisle. And yet they want to demean you as a private citizen for engaging in commerce. That is ridiculous.
▶ 2:07:40Sen. Booker: In addition to the fact that you were a career public servant for your entire life, you were a public defender, underpaid, overworked, not for a year, not for five years, but for years. The dignity and the service you have brought, no matter whether we disagree with your politics or not, should merit the praise of every single senator here. So I apologize for what you endured.
▶ 2:08:11Sen. Booker: I thank you for the service you have given to this country. And on matters of horrible killings, horrific acts, these are complicated matters. I will submit this for the record. People who were victims, families, survivors, who wrote letters to the president of the united states asking not to have the death penalty put there. I understand there is differing views.
▶ 2:08:37Sen. Booker: But you were putting those complicated decisions -- to write memos for the president to make decisions. I am sorry. What I witnessed -- I came late to the hearing -- was just unacceptable. As somebody that follows you, that reposts your content, I am grateful that you are here. I did not hear that on the microphone. What did you say? Senators enjoy praise.
▶ 2:09:06Ms. Oyer: Thank you, sir.
▶ 2:09:11Sen. Booker: I appreciate it. Serving as a pardon attorney -- you were a federal public defender with the client's interview prisons. Was it customary to transfer a bureau prisoner from a low security prison to a minimum security camp? Was that standard practice?
▶ 2:09:28Ms. Oyer: That was unheard of.
▶ 2:09:31Sen. Booker: It is against bop policy. What role does the deputy attorney general usually play in that process?
▶ 2:09:38Ms. Oyer: Usually, the deputy attorney general would have no role in transferring.
▶ 2:09:46Sen. Booker: No role whatsoever. Yet todd blanche went directly -- are you aware of any person serving time for child sex trafficking, like ghislaine maxwell, being transferred from a low security prison facility to eight minimums security camp?
▶ 2:10:03Ms. Oyer: I have never heard of that. It would be an egregious violation of department of justice rules.
▶ 2:10:09Sen. Booker: How do you feel knowing that deputy attorney todd branch -- todd blanche went to meet with her for two days and then gave her a cushy transfer, while he would not meet with you and then lied to this committee yesterday, saying he was barred by the law, which a first year law student could know the difference of -- how did that make you feel?
▶ 2:10:32Ms. Bensky: It is devastating for survivors and I would like to add to that that any farmer, a victim and survivor who testified in ghislaine maxwell's hearing, wrote a letter to todd blanche immediately after that and requested a meeting with him regarding the transfer. She has never heard anything back at all.
▶ 2:10:53Sen. Booker: It is insulting to heap upon survivors the indignities that he has by not even meeting with them, as he transferred a sex offender to a cushy camp, against bop policies. It sounds like she got a sweetheart deal while he released your personal information, your address, phone numbers, images.
▶ 2:11:19Sen. Booker: And yet he seems to be favoring the victimizer and not the survivors. I am out of time. It is honorable to see Mr. ashcroft here, sir. I know you. I know your record. We have disagreed on policies, but I also know you would never -- when you were reviewing a merger, you would never go out to dinner with the parties of that merger.
▶ 2:11:44Sen. Booker: It would be unacceptable for a person that is supervising a matter to attend a social event with those people before your lawyers. It is about ethics. It is about the appearance of impropriety. It is about following the law. This nominee has not followed the ethics laws, has not avoided the appearance of impropriety's. Has broken a bipartisan law passed by congress.
▶ 2:12:14Sen. Booker: Has demeaned and degraded survivors of sexual violence, and has shielded the president by some kind of deal we know nothing about that allowed for a transfer to some cushy camp. That has never been done before with sex offenders. This man should not be in this office. I cannot believe we are going through this farce when his record alone should make him disqualified not simply for being the attorney general, but for being employed by the federal government.
▶ 2:12:43Chair Grassley: Senator welch?
▶ 2:12:48Sen. Welch: First of all, Ms. bos, thank you so much. I fully support your advocacy that the department focus on victims as a priority. I also want to focus on the cap steam victims and allowing me to meet with you yesterday.
▶ 2:13:11Sen. Welch: I am so uplifted by your support for one another and all you have done to ennoble the rights of victims and the strength of victims after recovery. Thank you very much. Mr. ashcroft, I wanted to first of all say we seem to have a problem in missouri with attorney general's not being able to keep their job. They go to the U.S. senate. We have started a trend with Mr. hawley.
▶ 2:13:39Mr. Ashcroft: In all difference, it should be remembered that an important member of the senate, jack danforth, previously served as attorney general of missouri. So myself excluded, it has been a privilege to be in a line of individuals I believe have made significant valuable service to this nation.
▶ 2:14:02Sen. Welch: Thank you, and I agree with that. First of all, I want to express to you how much I have admired your career. I think that being attorney general is probably the most difficult cabinet position. One of the things that is required is giving advice to the president.
▶ 2:14:30Sen. Welch: In march of 2004 when you were recovering from an illness and Mr. comey was the acting attorney general and the president's counsel came to your hospital room and wanted you to sign off on a security law that Mr. comey thought was not legal. You said that was Mr. comey's decision. Is that right?
▶ 2:15:00Mr. Ashcroft: I believe the written reports -- there have been other things and I have no reason to contest what they said. I was in bed with a morphine pump. I was in -- what do they call this, intensive care?
▶ 2:15:25Sen. Welch: The bottom line is that the president wisely, to permit him to proceed -- it was the opinion of Mr. comey at that time that that was not legal. This raises the heart of what is so challenging for the attorney general. The president is the executive and you serve in his cabinet, but there are times when the attorney general has to say no.
▶ 2:15:57Sen. Welch: Correct?
▶ 2:16:00Mr. Ashcroft: No attorney is a good attorney if they don't tell their the truth. It's it important that they trust the attorney. I believe that the attorney general this morning to the constitution of the united states.
▶ 2:16:16Sen Welch: Not to an individual?
▶ 2:16:23Mr. Ashcroft: He answers to the president, he is sworn to the constitution.
▶ 2:16:29Sen Welch: That's exactly right. In the enron case, my understanding is that because of the appearance of potential conflict, you recuse yourself from that. Is that correct?
▶ 2:16:44Mr. Ashcroft: I wish I remember the things that you say are favorable about what I done. [laughter]
▶ 2:16:50Sen Welch: But what you did, Mr. ashcroft, is what needs to be done. You said it, it's the constitution who is your client and the american people who are ultimately your client. You have to give advice to the president. That's my question about Mr. blanche. It's not his confidence for that he has an ongoing relationship.
▶ 2:17:18Sen Welch: What can you imagine serving as attorney general and having president bush come to you and say, by the way, who paid you $9 million before you got to be there, and criminal actions, it's astonishing. Right? Then he said -- I got an idea. We're going to sue the federal government for $10 billion and you are going to represent the irs.
▶ 2:17:46Sen Welch: Then why don't you work out a settlement where there's a 1.7 billion dollar fund that I control, wouldn't you see anything odd about that?
▶ 2:18:02Mr. Ashcroft: I didn't have that situation. I didn't have a president who had been the subject of illegal criminal disclosure activities.
▶ 2:18:17Senator Welch: I want to get you your judgment.
▶ 2:18:18Mr. Ashcroft: I took a big challenge of an oath and I want to give my answer, I'm your answer, though I respect your question.
▶ 2:18:28Sen Welch: What I'm asking is you have incredible credibility, incredible character.
▶ 2:18:35Mr. Ashcroft: That's almost like senate speak. Unbelievable believability. I was in this body myself and I sat on that side of the dais.
▶ 2:18:47Senator Welch: He would not have that reputation if you were a senator.
▶ 2:18:50Mr. Ashcroft: Yes, I would. I was honest as a senator. I confess my faults from both eras.
▶ 2:19:02Senator Welch: I'm going to finish, thank you for your indulgence, but when you saw the appearance of a conflict, you did not continue representing the government and the enron case. Number two, when it came to the president's demand on something of vital concern to the president, national security law, surveillance law, where it was the opinion of your department and whoever serves as
▶ 2:19:36Senator Welch: Attorney general, Mr. blanche does not share that.
▶ 2:19:39Mr. Ashcroft: Thank you for that respect. I hope that when I grow up I live to do things right.
▶ 2:19:45Chair Grassley: Senator tillis?
▶ 2:19:51Senator Tillis: Mr. ashcraft, all witnesses, thank you for being here. I told the chairman or the chairman's staff that I have one question, but like john kennedy it has two parts. My first question, Mr. ashcroft, yesterday I mentioned that I am disturbed with the political physics going on today. If you think about the obama administration, they had vindictive prosecutions.
▶ 2:20:21Senator Tillis: President trump came in, more or less matched up on it. Biden comes in and goes a little bit further. When we are doing 8640 seven and indictments and active investigations for that? That's a reason to bring Mr. comey into a per walk because he arranged shells on the beach?
▶ 2:20:43Senator Tillis: Seems to me like there is a continuing, you know, this exceptional nation, americans, we always want to do better, get bigger and higher the next time. Am I wrong or am I perceiving a continued escalation of prosecutions that, some of which really because the way they are being adjudicated as not successful, it seems to me that we are like shooting, it's shoot, ready, aim on some prosecutions.
▶ 2:21:11Senator Tillis: And I'm not only talking about the current trump administration. I'm going back to the obama era. Do you agree with me that there seems to be a trend that with each administration we seem to be upping it of late?
▶ 2:21:22Mr. Ashcroft: I'm not sure I could quantify any disenchantment. I believe that partisanship --
▶ 2:21:36Sen. Tillis: That's ok, I promised to yield back some time . My point, I'm not an attorney, not a prosecutor, not a law enforcement officer. I do with facts and empirical data pretty well. I guarantee I can give you a list of cases and investigations , a list of vindictive audits.
▶ 2:21:58Sen. Tillis: And every year it's like from 2008 2012 to 2016 to 2020 and 2024, one party is going to actually have to be an adult in the room and stop it. Our members here near to stop having situational ethics where they are only opposed to it when the other party is in power. But that was not my question. Yesterday, before the hearing, and Mr.
▶ 2:22:26Sen. Tillis: Blanche, I have a positive predisposition to it, just because everybody knows. I haven't made a final decision. Mr. blanche said quickly yesterday that he would meet with the victims, the epstein victims today if it could be arranged. Well, right now the markup, if you all don't know the procedure here after this hearing is done today, next week we will hold it over in the earliest possible markup will be in two weeks and because it seemed to me that Mr.
▶ 2:22:58Sen. Tillis: Blanche was willing to say that he would meet with them and counsel -- I understand the restriction the council has to be present, I expect that meeting to occur before I'm willing to vote out of this committee. I'm trying to get to yes, but this is an important part of getting to yes. There should not be any reason why, based on what Mr. blanche said yesterday, that if he said he would do it today he could certainly do it over the next two weeks. Mr.
▶ 2:23:26Sen. Tillis: Chair, thank you, I yield back.
▶ 2:23:29Chair Grassley: Talking about what you said, what advice, how political the attorney general's office is, I remember that holder said he was a wingmen for president obama.
▶ 2:23:40Sen. Tillis: That's exactly right, Mr. chair. Anyone who comes up here in steps on their pulpit and suddenly I can go back and see of record the absolute silence of democrats when biden and obama did the same thing? I would love to see a democrat who has taken the position I have with an administration that shares my jersey because it's the only way this nonsense stops.
▶ 2:24:04Chair Grassley: Senator schiff?
▶ 2:24:09Senator Schiff: Mr. adler, thank you for being here and for your many years of service. Likewise, thank you for your courage at the justice department. Ms. bos, I'm heartbroken for your loss. Ms. bensky, thank you for your willingness to speak out into all the epstein victims here, I'm glad the attorney general finally acknowledged he could meet with you. I was perplexed when he said that he was somehow prohibited.
▶ 2:24:42Senator Schiff: That's not the law. Mr. ashcroft, thank you for your service. I wanted to ask you about some remarks the attorney general made when he said that he thought the president -- he was asked about the president targeting his political opponents and enemies for prosecution. I don't subscribe to the but I think is a false equivalence. We've never seen a resident behave this way.
▶ 2:25:09Senator Schiff: Where he openly and privately calls on the attorney general to prosecute his enemies. I wanted to ask you about that, Mr. ashcroft. Mr. blanche has said that he believes the president has the right in the duty to use the justice department to go after his enemies. Do you subscribe to that view?
▶ 2:25:32Mr. Ashcroft: Thank you, senator. I believe the attorney general of the united states has the right and responsibility to enforce the law uniformly and if the law has been broken by the president's enemies, he has a duty. They don't become exempt from following the law merely by their enmity to the president of the united states.
▶ 2:25:54Mr. Ashcroft: As a matter of fact, the people who break the law are in entity with the people of the united states whose expression of what is the law has been developed in this body and the congress of the united states. We used to call people that broke the law public enemies. So, my view is that whether a person has been a political supporter or not of the president of the united states is not the determining factor regarding prosecution.
▶ 2:26:21Mr. Ashcroft: It's whether a person has violated the law and in enforcing the law, the attorney general is carrying out the will expressed in the congress.
▶ 2:26:30Sen. Schiff: You realize, having set here, my time is limited. That really isn't my question. My question is do you think it's appropriate for the president to call on the attorney general to prosecute one of his enemies and, acting on that, request the attorney general to do so?
▶ 2:26:51Mr. Ashcroft: The president of the united states is the executive branch of the united states whose charge it is to enforce the laws of the united states. When the president of the united states asks the laws to be enforced, I don't see it as consistent with duties and responsibilities.
▶ 2:27:11Mr. Ashcroft: If the laws were be -- were to be enforced differentially, which scares me, as many laws as we have, someone said that to run a police state, you only need one policeman, but if you have enough laws you can go find something wrong with anybody you want. I believe the president's job is to have an administration that calls for the enforcement of the laws of the united states without regard to the political preferences of the people who are perpetrators were accused individuals.
▶ 2:27:40Sen. Schiff: I'm not sure I understand your answer except you seem to accept the premise that it is ok now for a president to call the attorney general and ask him to prosecute his enemies. You don't seem to have a problem with that. If you do, please say so.
▶ 2:27:56Mr. Ashcroft: I believe the president needs to be an advocate of strong law enforcement. That includes his enemies. If an enemy of the president goes out and conducts a violent crime, there's nothing wrong with involving the attorney general to do something about the violent crime.
▶ 2:28:17Sen. Schiff: And if the presidents enemy takes a photo of seashells, do you think it's appropriate to prosecute them? If senators make a video stating the plane law and constitution, that you can disobey any legal order, you think it's ok for the president or a or others to call on them to be prosecuted? I don't think so. I don't think so. He would have done that is attorney general.
▶ 2:28:45Sen. Schiff: I hope you wouldn't, if you would have you were not the attorney general I thought you were. I don't think it's appropriate for this or any other attorney general and notwithstanding the false equivalence I hear expressed from my colleagues in this committee, I don't remember any democratic president calling the attorney general in saying -- you need to prosecute him, you need prosecute her, you need to prosecute them, you need to go after this organization. We have never seen that before or anything like it. Anything like it.
▶ 2:29:17Sen. Schiff: Generic statements of "oh they'll do it," it simply not the case and by making that argument it further erodes the well of independence that I'm sure you remember after watergate, when because of the abuses of president nixon there was an effort to make the justice department independent from the white house.
▶ 2:29:38Sen. Schiff: Not completely in the sense that the president couldn't set general priorities, emphasizing these cases were these cases, whether it's immigration or drug cases. That was always appropriate. But what has never been appropriate, particularly so after watergate, was for the attorney general of the united states to break the wall and call in his attorney general to prosecute his enemies and I would say that even without any basis to do so.
▶ 2:30:09Sen. Schiff: This justice department has been willing to do so it has gone before grand jury's and we have never seen the likes of this either in these high-profile cases where the grand juror's in some cases to a person have refused an indictment. How often did you have that happen to you, Mr. chairman? Mr. attorney general, how often did you seek indictment as a prosecutor and have not a single grand juror vote to indict? Did that ever happened to you?
▶ 2:30:36Mr. Ashcroft: I don't know, I just don't know.
▶ 2:30:40Sen. Schiff: Thank you.
▶ 2:30:41Chair Grassley: Senator greg?
▶ 2:30:45Senator Greg: Thank you Mr. chairman. Appreciate you all being here today and before I start, I want to say thank you to attorney general ashcroft for being here today in your service to our country as attorney general in and thank you for your kind words about senator graham, really appreciate it.
▶ 2:31:16Senator Greg: Ms. bos, thank you for sharing your story. Reliving the worst day in your life and being willing to tell your story, really appreciate it. I am sorry for your loss. We are going to talk -- for a second about needing to meet with survivors.
▶ 2:31:46Senator Greg: Let me ask you a question, do you think that when someone is killed at the hands of an illegal alien that their representation in congress, senator, congressman, should meet with that family? >> absolutely, course.
▶ 2:32:10Senator Britt: My understanding is that many of these connecticut meetings with their senators, have you heard that? >> absolutely. Happens all the time. As a matter of fact, the lovely and kind words from senator durbin, I am his constituent but this is the first time I've spoken to him.
▶ 2:32:31Sen. Britt: I hope, and I'm sure , I heard the ranking member yesterday talk about the need for the attorney general to meet with victims, which I support, and I am certainly hopeful that he will, and others, will meet with you.
▶ 2:32:52Ms. Bos: Yes.
▶ 2:32:54Sen. Britt: So. These names need to be said. I think that the accountability we have in this room for other people, we should be able to have it for this body as well and I hopefully hope you get your face-to-face meeting that you deserve.
▶ 2:33:13Ms. Bos: I would hope so. We have had several laws introduced, legislation introduced in the last session that have been completely ignored. There hasn't been any way to really get in and talk to anybody. Especially those who are opposed to those legislations for whatever reason.
▶ 2:33:35Sen. Britt: Thank you so much for elevating your voice. Ms. bensky, and I sang that right?
▶ 2:33:44Ms. Bensky: Ms. bensky:
▶ 2:33:48Ms. Bensky: Ms. bensky.
▶ 2:33:48Sen. Britt: Gosh, sorry. I'm so sorry for everything you've been through and thank you for your courage for being here today and being able to elevate your voice. I completely support your quest to be able to be heard. Obviously, for victims to be protected and for us to pursue every, every lead possible. I do believe that after my conversations with the assistant attorney general that he is going to pursue those.
▶ 2:34:16Sen. Britt: Let me ask you this, did you, in the previous administration did you ever have the opportunity to sit down with the then attorney general, merrick garland? >> we did not. But there were active investigations going on because of the ghislaine maxwell hearing.
▶ 2:34:34Sen. Britt: Did you ever had a face to him?
▶ 2:34:37Ms. Bensky: No.
▶ 2:34:38Sen. Britt: Did you request one?
▶ 2:34:41Ms. Bensky: This was before a time when I was comfortable coming forward. It was just this last september when a group of us felt as though we had met each other and a huge part of this has been finding that collective voice of the sisterhood in the understanding that we were not isolated in these experiences.
▶ 2:34:59Sen. Britt: Absolutely. Let me ask you this, was there ever, I know that my colleague, senator blackburn, really wanted to make sure that you all had the opportunity to tell your story. Are you aware of any senate hearings that were held under the previous administration that tried to bring a light to this?
▶ 2:35:20Ms. Bensky: I'm not, we just came forward in september.
▶ 2:35:25Sen. Britt: Well, thank you for coming forward so much. Ms. oyer, obviously -- are you cutting people off right on time today?
▶ 2:35:37Chair Grassley: What?
▶ 2:35:39Sen. Britt: Are you cutting people off or are people going way over?
▶ 2:35:44Chair Grassley: I've been too liberal, go ahead and ask one more question.
▶ 2:35:50Sen. Britt: Sir, I appreciate it. After you were fired from doj, you had an independent media company substack platform and you had the lawyer aura brand name and the hoodies that said hardwired to stand up to bullies.
▶ 2:36:10Sen. Britt: I'm wondering, you know, it's my understanding that as a attorney in the biden administration who recommended actual commutations for daniel troyer and ricardo sanchez junior, sentenced to death in 2009 after executing a family of four on the side of the highway. Is that true?
▶ 2:36:30Ms. Oyer: I think you are not in the room and several of your colleagues asked me about that.
▶ 2:36:35Sen. Britt: But it's my turn to ask.
▶ 2:36:37Ms. Oyer: I'm not able to talk about the clemency advice I provided to the white house.
▶ 2:36:44Sen. Britt: The victims included a four-year-old and a three-year-old who died while cradled in the arms of their mother who was trying to shield them. Those two little boys were shot 10 times in their mother was shot 11 times in their father was shot five times. So, I appreciate the grace I'm getting to go over, but that to me doesn't sound like you stand up to bullies, sounds to me like you stand with them. Thank you.
▶ 2:37:10Chair Grassley: Senator blumenthal?
▶ 2:37:15Sent: Thanks, Mr. chairman. Thank you for being here. This day of the hearings often gets less attention. It's very important to us and you are performing a very important service. I particularly want to thank Ms. bensky and Ms. bos for sharing your stories and reliving a lot of the pain that you have been through.
▶ 2:37:48Sent: Ms. bensky, I don't know if you were here yesterday I asked the acting attorney general to apologize. I would be interested in your reaction his response.
▶ 2:38:02Ms. Bensky: It was the most we've gotten from him. It was a moment where there was a touch of humanity, to say a bit. We understand that there was failure here, he's been on record multiple times saying mulch -- nothing was mishandled.
▶ 2:38:21Ms. Bensky: As a survivor who literally saw new images of friends and had my own information exposed all over the place, to say it hadn't been mishandled, that was egregious. Anyone from here to mars can see that your government should be sending out new photos of you. Obviously. Thank you.
▶ 2:38:48Sen. Blumenthal: Thank you. Very well said. Let me ask you a general question. You don't have to give me an exhaustive answer today. I know that there are others in the room, but what should we demand of the department of justice to make things right, to make things better?
▶ 2:39:13Ms. Bensky: We've always just been looking for accountability and for this case to be handled correctly. Even from the very start of this case, we have not seen it handled the way anybody would normally prosecute something. So, we are looking to get to the bottom of why our perpetrators were never -- never held to account.
▶ 2:39:36Ms. Bensky: How does the largest sex trafficking ring in this country exist when only two people have been found even remotely, I mean have seen is dead. Maxwell is the only one who's been held to any kind of account and she's in a lower security penitentiary at this point. So, we, I think that we are owed answers and justice.
▶ 2:39:58Ms. Bensky: We get that question a lot, what does justice look like and yes, the culture shift is a part of it, but really having your government stand up for you and for what's right, you know, there is a chilling effect it sends to survivors everywhere when their government is outing their personal information. Other survivors are not going to want to come forward. We need to make sure we are getting all of the information with these cases.
▶ 2:40:28Ms. Bensky: I think we really just hope the government will take it seriously and start investigations.
▶ 2:40:33Sen. Blumenthal: Accountability.
▶ 2:40:34Ms. Bensky: Accountability always.
▶ 2:40:43Sen. Blumenthal: It's difficult when it's vulnerable people.
▶ 2:40:48Ms. Bensky: It's been the case for all sex trafficking cases, really, about how the powerful consistently exploit the vulnerable. That is what we see a lot. I mean, I have a six-year-old son and I teach him that accountability matters every single day and I hold him to account. Why can we not hold our government to account?
▶ 2:41:08Sen. Blumenthal: Well, I will just say that your voice and face has been a very powerful antidote to the wealth and power being brought to bear here and I hope that this forum will encourage you and others to come forward as you have done so courageously.
▶ 2:41:29Ms. Bensky: Thank you so much. I also want to mention that virginia giuffre has been monumental in this and it would be unfair not to name her, her deposition has been the key to quite a few things. If you start her deposition you can start investigating.
▶ 2:41:49Senator Blumenthal: Thank you. I want to ask you about the pardon I mentioned yesterday. I asked todd blanche about it. David chantilly, sentenced to seven years for a multimillion dollar fraud scheme that involved a seven year sentence and he served 12 days of it before he was pardoned.
▶ 2:42:18Senator Blumenthal: He boasted to his fellow inmates that he was going to pay 2.5 million dollars to someone to get them out. Father frank mann told one of his parishioners that he had spoken to president trump to get david gentilly out of prison. These are facts that have been publicly reported.
▶ 2:42:44Senator Blumenthal: The investigation into the potential impropriety of this pardon was shut down, allegedly, by high officials in the department of justice, talking to the U.S. attorney in the southern district of new york. I know you are not familiar with these facts, I am not going to ask you if you believe that that reporting is true. Mr. blanche never denied it.
▶ 2:43:13Senator Blumenthal: He basically said, well, it was a leak. Sometimes leaks actually involve truthful information. But the point that I think is lost here is that the pardon involved $16 million in forfeiture to innocent victims, many of them retirees, who were depending on that money to survive. And he will no longer be required to do restitution.
▶ 2:43:45Senator Blumenthal: So, his ill-gotten gains, some of which he may have used it to pay for his clemency, so to speak, are not going to go back to the people who were cheated. His victims. As a result of that pardon. And clemency.
▶ 2:44:07Senator Blumenthal: So, I guess my question to you, with this introduction, is essentially -- are victims and survivors often re-victimized by pardons that are unjust or unfair to them?
▶ 2:44:26Senator Blumenthal: And shouldn't we have them given a voice, recognizing that the constitution gives the president unlimited authority and it's one of those powers that is unchecked, really. Isn't there a need to give the victims of voice in this process?
▶ 2:44:44Ms. Oyer: Yes, senator. The millions of dollars that Mr. gentilly soul from his investors are a drop in the bucket of restitution that victims have been deprived of as a result of president trump's pardons. He has forgiven over $1 billion in restitution as victims of fraud and taxpayers who committed white-collar crimes and have served in many sentencd repaid none of their money.
▶ 2:45:12Ms. Oyer: That is not consistent with the regulations that the justice department has in place for evaluating applications for pardons. The justice department historically has looked dizzy people have repaid their debts before recommending clemency but this president is using clemency in a strategic transactional way to forgive huge amounts of debt owed to taxpayers and crime victims. >> I would like to make a couple of points.
▶ 2:45:42Ms. Oyer: First, I understand the senator from alabama mentioned while I stepped out, this -- anxious to meet with you because I know it was a hardship for you to make this journey here to testify. I don't want you to have to wait to see me. I want to meet with you now. We can talk as soon as this meeting adjourned if it is ok with you. If it fits in your schedule.
▶ 2:46:18Ms. Oyer: I'm glad the senator from new jersey said what he did about you. I believe the fact of the matter is most of the things that were brought up to date in this hearing about your activity related to the decision by the biden administration as they were leaving office to turn death penalty convictions into life imprisonment instead. Is that correct? >> that is right, sir.
▶ 2:46:49Sen. Durbin: I will say this, you don't have to comment on this, I believe that reflects president joe biden's opposition to the death penalty. I shared that opposition. There are people in the audience would agree with me and some who vehemently disagree with me. But a market divided on this issue.
▶ 2:47:12Sen. Durbin: I did not have this position my entire political career but for the end of it, I have come to the conclusion that no longer wants to tinker with the machinery of death. The fact of the matter is, there are clear cases where one could argue the death penalty and there are cases which we have found were wrongly decided, people faced death penalty or worse until evidence and other things were discovered at the end. That is my position.
▶ 2:47:42Sen. Durbin: That was Mr. biden's position. That is why the cases you brought up today are so serious and I believe you're doing her job as a pardon attorney to advise him as to his decision. But is it not to the final decision on this position of these inmates was the decision of the president of united states? >> that is absolutely correct, senator.
▶ 2:48:07Sen. Durbin: So if you want to take exception to joe biden and his position, be my guest. But to blame you for those I think goes beyond your responsibility as pardon attorney. I will just say under the controversy behind this issue but I feel that is what led him to his conclusion. Thank you for bringing your friends with you today. It is great to see.
▶ 2:48:33Sen. Durbin: I hope what you heard from senator tillis is a promising possibility that he said he would not -- I hope I'm saying this correctly, he would not vote to confirm this nomination until there has been an actual meeting.
▶ 2:48:49Sen. Durbin: That would be a dramatic progress for us to reach that point because you have the courage to stand up not only you, but your friends, we have achieved that I believe, I hope that is the fact. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 2:49:06Chair Grassley: Take you to all of the witnesses for being here today and for traveling from long distances, some of you had to go. We are grateful you did it. For all the members of this committee, written questions to these witnesses here are due on wednesday, july 22 this year at 5:00 p.m. The hearing is adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap.org]